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Long gone are the days when organizations would use traditional phones to host business communication. Even though the solution lasted for a good period, the dawn of digitization has paved the way for a whole new system. Something that is popularly known to be a virtual phone system.
Unlike traditional business telephony, the present-day VoIP phone system adopts the IP to route calls between communicating parties. Put simply, VoIP or voice over internet protocol is a yet new technology that helps organizations to use internet connectivity to make and receive calls.
These follow the packet switching technology where the voice is transferred in the form of data packets from the sender to the receiver. It is the reliability offered by the technology that makes it one of the leading forms of communication today.
In case you plan to switch from traditional telephony to the one using computer networks, there are two of its kind. The first being an on-premise VoIP system and the other is a hosted VoIP system. Depending upon your business needs and the features offered, you can move ahead towards adopting either of them.
To ease the situation, here we have highlighted the differences between them so that you can make a wise decision.
As the name suggests, the on-premise VoIP system is one where the hardware and software needed to run the system are physically installed in the office premises. Meaning that the entire setup is needed to be deployed within the office space to initiate VoIP communication.
Hosted VoIP
Quite the contrary, a hosted VoIP system is one where the infrastructure is hosted on a third-party server and all you need to do is remotely access the system to initiate communication. No physical hardware installation needed when opting for a hosted solution.
What this implies is that the system would run on the cloud platform and all the maintenance and monitoring are done by the service providers.
While each of these has its own share of benefits, it is the hosted VoIP system that tends to attract more buyers as compared to the on-premise solution.
Five Reason Hosted VoIP is better than On-premise VoIP?
Reduced Cost
One of the prominent reasons why hosted VoIP is advantageous as compared to the on-premise system is the cost linked with the same. Since hosted solutions do not require additional installation of any hardware or software, the total cost of setup is dramatically less. Research by Tech.co suggests that organizations migrating to hosted VoIP solutions tend to reduce the overall cost by 40%.
It is pretty obvious that the on-premise system mandates the need for dedicated hardware that would initiate communication. This adds to the cost incurred in setting up the VoIP infrastructure and for organizations that have just started on their journey, this might be overhead.
Eliminate the need for monitoring and maintenance
Another reason why you should invest in a hosted VoIP phone system is the fact that it doesn’t require you to enter into maintenance and monitoring needs. With hosted solutions, it is the service provider who owns the job of regularly updating the software and keeping a check on the operations. All you need to do is indicate the features you wish to add within your system and the service provider will take care of the rest. From installation to integration, deployment, and management, everything is monitored by him.
On the other hand, an on-premise virtual phone system requires you to take everything in your hands. Right from the procurement stage to the installation and post-integration maintenance, everything needs to be done manually. In case you do not possess the technical knowledge, you might have to hire an expert to do the same, adding to the expenses. So, why not opt for hosted solutions?
Hosted business solutions are extremely flexible and tend to offer the needed extent of scalability to its users. Imagine that your business has outgrown the capacity offered at the time of purchase. You would now need more space and better connectivity.
With an in-house phone system, scaling is a tough job and again, it requires a certain level of expertise to pull it off. On the other hand, hosted solutions have business offerings where the entrepreneur can scale the resources as and when needed, without having the need to hire an expert or seek advice. In fact, certain business models are designed to promote scalability allowing leaders to continue their operations, without being interrupted.
It is pretty clear by now that a hosted virtual phone system is better than the in-house alternative. Acknowledging the need to optimize business costs without compromising on the quality to service rendered, a hosted solution tends to lead the charts, keeping all apprised. In case, you are still not sure, consult with an expert and see how things turn up for your business.
Hey there - my friends call me Ricky and this is my first blog. I am passionate about change and growth, but cover a variety of topics. I am also a crazy sports fan. American Football is my sport of choice, but I love watching and playing all kinds of sports. Read More…
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"While Stephenson describes in almost obsessive detail the technological and social challenges of developing a space community that will be sustainable for centuries -- explanations of Delta-v and orbital mechanics go on for pages -- he also introduces a cast of complex and conflicted characters." - Gary K. Wolfe, Chicago Tribune
"Seveneves is a superhuman achievement, dense, eloquent, exhaustive, exhilarating, powerful, utterly readable, and ultimately uplifting. Stephenson imagines the worst that can happen, and insists that we can make the best of it. Its the end of the world as we know it, and he feels fine." - James Lovegrove, Financial Times
"A breakneck 565-page tech-action-disaster story of tremendous force and focus is followed by what amounts to a 300-page epilogue, set 5,000 years later, that is built on the idea that character traits can be genetically engineered. (...) This last part cannot match the global-emergency propulsion of what went before." - Steven Poole, The Guardian
"Seveneves is as hard as "hard science fiction" gets: cool bits of science and speculation about the future of technology, space and culture, with a plot and dialogue bolted on to make it more enjoyable to follow. That said, Stephenson's speculation is fascinating. (...) Stephenson's point, though, isn't to offer a dramatically satisfying work as much as it is to propel the reader through a vivid demonstration of the necessity of nerddom." - Douglas Wolk, The Los Angeles Times
"Its an intriguing premise, one that could conceivably go in any number of interesting directions. (...) But for the first 600 pages or so, what he mainly seems interested in are the most literal kinds of ramifications, setting up his initial conditions and then meticulously working out the particulars of his invented premise. (...) Some readers might wonder when he will get to the good stuff, but for many, this techsposition is the good stuff. Stephenson builds worlds quickly, standing up the frame of his structure, then slowly layers in detail. This is thought experiment as extreme sport" - Charles YU, The New York Times Book Review
"Seveneves will please fans of hard science fiction, but this witty, epic tale is also sure to win over readers new to Stephensons work." - Nancy Hightower, The Washington Post
Please note that these ratings solely represent the complete review's biased interpretation and subjective opinion of the actual reviews and do not claim to accurately reflect or represent the views of the reviewers. Similarly the illustrative quotes chosen here are merely those the complete review subjectively believes represent the tenor and judgment of the review as a whole. We acknowledge (and remind and warn you) that they may, in fact, be entirely unrepresentative of the actual reviews by any other measure.
"The moon blew up without warning and for no apparent reason" is a pretty good opening line for a book, a premise of considerable promise. It's not nearly as spectacular as it initially sounds, however -- or so it seems:
In movies, when a planet blows up, it turns into a fireball; and ceases to exist. This is not what happened to the moon. The Agent (as people came to call the mysterious force that did it) released a very large amount of energy, to be sure, but not nearly enough to turn all of the moon's substance into fire.
At the beginning of Seveneves the moon doesn't so much seem to blow as break up -- shattered into seven large pieces, and many much smaller ones. These remain, for the most part, in a sort of cluster -- and, realistically, continue in the lunar orbit. But as scientists soon realize, the process will continue: the big and small pieces will continue smashing into each other, the moon will continue to break up. All well and good up there, but some pieces are going to fall to earth, too. The scenario is soon clear: there will be a 'White Sky' -- a white cloud of moon-fragments filling the sky -- and then a 'Hard Rain', "a meteorite bombardment such as the Earth has not seen since the primordial age". And so:
The entire surface of the Earth is going to be sterilized. Glaciers will boil. The only way to survive is to get away from the atmosphere. Go underground, or go into space.
Going into space -- or rather expanding the very limited presence already out there, in the form of the International Space Station ('Izzy') -- seems the more viable option, and is the one Stephenson focuses on. (You have to figure a lot of folks must have immediately started and continued digging for all they were worth, but such efforts only rate passing mentions.) .
Set in the near future -- most of the technology Stephenson describes is, more or less, currently available, and in the novel people are still using Facebook, so Seveneves obviously begins very close to present-day -- Stephenson does have Izzy conveniently bolted to an asteroid, Amalthea, which is about the size of a soccer field, a bit of solid ground to work with (and good protection from some of the nastier things flying around space, a constant source of concern) rather than still flying all by its lonesome, making for just a bit more to build on than is presently available.
Stephenson gives earthlings two years to plan ahead: give or take a matter of days, that's almost exactly how long it will take for the Hard Rain to hit, and wipe out seven billion people (another indication that the book is set nowabouts, since the earth population is already in that range). The first part of the book -- just under a third of it -- covers the first year after the moon has broken apart, with much of it set on the soon rapidly expanding space-colony, the distributed swarm of so-called arklets, along with a much-enlarged Izzy (and attached asteroid), that forms the 'Cloud Ark' where humanity -- in the form of not much more than a thousand humans, as well as a lot of genetic material and vast amounts of data -- is to live on (until, they hope, earth might be inhabitable again).
More interested in the technological issues and challenges, Stephenson goes into considerable detail in describing how many of these are addressed during this preparation-phase -- enjoyable and quite well presented 'hard' (and basic) science fiction.
Among the many people with very specialized expertise there's also billionaire Sean Probst, a leading space entrepreneur who has enough remaining clout and influence to get himself launched to Izzy -- and then proceeds to head out on an expedition to collect and -- so the plan -- return to Izzy with a chunk of comet-ice, vital raw material needed to get the Cloud Ark into a safer orbit; with expected travel time of two years, it looks to be a close call whether he can get back in time.
Stephenson does roam around earth a bit, too, but most of the glimpses are fairly narrow. Mankind decides on a 'Casting of Lots', with each nation allowed to select candidates for a chance to be sent up and saved -- twenty-thousand or so candidates in total, from which a couple of thousand (they hope) will make the one-way trip. In describing one such ceremonial handover of the selected, Stephenson opts for tiny Bhutan of all places -- a nice contrast, what with the majestic natural backdrop and quasi-spiritual atmosphere (and an actual king), but very quiet and very out of the way and hardly representative. Stephenson gets around to some social disorder, especially as the end of days approaches, but on the whole earth remains remarkably calm, and most seem to more or less just go about their daily business; even with what limited explanations Stephenson offers, that seems extremely unlikely (and widespread complete social breakdown seems very likely).
From the end of the first part -- exactly one year, halfway between the time humanity learnt earth-life was soon going to be over and it actually being over -- Stephenson jumps ahead nearly a year to start the second part. It's day 700, and there's not much time left. What they've built is impressive but necessarily also jerry-rigged, well-stocked but also, soon, pretty much all the supplies they can count on, since none more will be delivered from earth.
Stephenson doesn't come up with a major twist at this point -- the world comes to an end, more or less on schedule -- and suddenly the human population is very small indeed, and all clustered together in a rather inhospitable environment. Along the way, he's established several of the characters who have played significant roles up in space, some from day one (they were already on Izzy), and some who came aboard later. One significant twist is the last-minute arrival of someone who definitely doesn't belong, a presence whose presence involved breaking all the rules; not surprisingly this figure become the main antagonist to the in-space establishment, and messes pretty much everything up -- a rather simplistic fall/bad guy for Stephenson to fall back on (though he partially redeems himself by eventually twisting that just a bit further, though that adds yet another foolhardy antagonist to the mix).
The core of the ark is Izzy (and what's been built around it), but most of the survivors are housed in the swarm of 'arklets' -- somewhat isolated, somewhat cramped. This population of 'Arkies' is rotated through Izzy, but there's only room for a small number at a time -- and many apparently resent Izzy's General Population, the decision-makers leading the way. Ridiculously quickly an opposition -- to the plan known as 'The Big Ride', involving the comet-ice and getting everything into a higher orbit -- develops, and splinter groups go their own way; not a great idea in space and with such extremely limited resources, one would think (and predictably, the smallest splinter group, which sets out for Mars, soon isn't ever heard from again).
Much as Stephenson didn't explore the social dynamics that the end-of-days announcement would surely have explosively changed life on earth, there was apparently very little planning or thought about some of these issues that might arise once the Cloud Ark was all that was left of civilization. Admittedly, the unexpected late arrival added to the complications, but you'd think they'd have a much better-thought-out organizational plan and structure in place: surely as essential as the technology functioning is the certainty that everyone on board is actually on board with the direction of things. And they failed miserably in that regard. (Stephenson does suggest that issues of governance have been carefully thought-through, but given how these matters are handled no one seems to have been paying too much attention; it's hard to believe that this isn't an issue as complex as many of the technological ones, and that the planners wouldn't have spent as much of the two preperatory years they had to figure every last detail regarding this out.)
'The Big Ride' wins the day eventually, sort of, but it's a somewhat hollow victory. The title of the book is Seveneves -- referring to the 'seven Eves', the seven fertile survivors (there's also one post-menopausal survivor) -- that, after a few years, reach what finally amounts to safety. A place to start over.
Good does not triumph over evil, here. Stephenson reduces his cast to the bare essence, but he maintains diversity; the survivors are very different 'types' (a bit cartoonishly so ...). From early on it had been recognized that maintaining genetic diversity was going to be key in helping ensure the survival of the human race -- if not their mantra, heterozygosity is the one thing they know they must constantly keep in mind. The absence of any males is only a minor problem: the ... seminal technology has remained intact, and the surviving expert in the field can even tinker with the genetic material, both ridding it of recognized defects -- and enhancing it. It's this potential that Stephenson grabs onto, setting the stage for the future by giving the seven future mothers of the human race the ability to shape things beyond what natural evolution would. Each is offered:
One alteration -- one improvement -- of your choice, applied to the genome of the fertilized ovum that will grow into your child. And your child only. You cannot force it on any of the others.
Leaving off pretty much there, the novel's final part jumps a full five thousand years ahead, and we see what's become of this experiment: yes, Seveneves is also a story of eugenics, and the seven master races the seven Eves initiated.
While the first two parts cover longer periods, the final part of the book takes place over a much shorter time. It centers on one character, who is then brought together with representatives of each of the other races for a mission, a rare 'Seven' where all seven groups (should) work together.
Here Stephenson takes his time in covering all the changed terrain (and space), focused on the present and then filling in a variety of the gaps. Mankind has blossomed once again, the population orbiting the earth now up to three billion people. There are two large factions, 'Red' and 'Blue' -- mirroring old antagonisms --, who don't get along, but otherwise civilization is well-established. Work on making earth inhabitable again proceeds apace -- TerReForm, as the project is called -- and has picked up speed in recent decades. And while earth isn't being properly (re)settled yet -- the stage isn't fully set yet -- there's considerable surface activity.
The mission which this section centers on turns out to mark another milestone, another shift in many of the assumptions about the survival of humanity. It's a fine additional little twist, even if Stephenson only deals with a limited part of it and all the ramifications. Good is again forced to battle evil -- or Blue to compete with Red, at any rate -- in a somewhat simplistic head-to-head competition for this next beachhead for humanity, but it makes for decent drama.
Still, Stephenson clearly revels much more in the technology (and biology). It's well woven-in into the story, and it's certainly fun and interesting, but it kind of swamps any story too; the individuals, the characters, barely matter here: literally representative (of their races) types, they function mainly like the chess pieces one of them uses in an analogy.
Stephenson's technological vision is of considerable interest throughout, and Seveneves can be enjoyed just for that. Both the problem-solving in the mad rush to get as much into space before the world comes to an end and then the making do with what they have is entertaining. In the part five thousand years later, Stephenson can then offer a much more expansive vision of what steps humanity might have taken. There are interesting contrasts: flying about is common -- but in gliders, as there are few planes and "high-capacity turbofan engines were extraordinarily difficult to make". Traveling to the earth's surface, or aboard the orbiting ring where most of mankind lives and works, is relatively straightforward, but involves technology and engineering that are still completely foreign in the present-day. Meanwhile, printed books are still popular and the future-day version of the e-reader is still easier to load up by cable rather than wirelessly; the equivalent of the Internet seems to be at about 1990s levels, as:
In the decades before Zero, the Old Earthers had focused their intelligence on the small and the soft, not the big and the hard, and built a civilization that was puny and crumbling where infrastructure was concerned, but astonishingly sophisticated when it came to networked communications and software. The density with which they had been able to pack transistors onto chips still had not been matched by any fabrication plant now in existence. Their devices could hold more data than anything you could buy today.
In Stephenson's future, the focus had understandably been on 'the big and the hard'.
Among the most amusing moments in the book comes in the laconic description of one all-out battle for the future of mankind while what was left of it was drifting in space:
That, at least, has proved less of a problem in the new world.
If the technological capabilities are consistently interesting, one of their consequences is certainly a lot creepier: the genetic tinkering, and especially the establishment of the various races. Obviously, there's a solid scientific foundation to this -- genetic differences do make people 'different', in all sorts of ways -- but it's dangerous territory, too, and Stephenson goes down at least one very questionable road in suggesting a sort of Sippenhaftung carrying on over generations, regarding one of the original seven mothers-of-all
She knew that the other six Eves would always loathe her personally and that this feeling would inevitably be transferred to her offspring. Human nature being what it was [...] They would never be assimilated into the society descended from the Four.
A bit of paranoia is fine, but with his Red/Blue divide still there five thousand years on, Stephenson supports and confirms this ridiculous hypothesis. His weakness in describing and dealing with human relationships was already apparent in the early part of the novel, and here too he goes for broad strokes and black/white reductionism, limited in what he can imagine -- at least on any larger scale (he's much better on the individual scale) -- of social interaction (and how it might be guided). The clash of personalities that already wreaked near-havoc in the early sections is extrapolated -- much larger, now -- in the present-day rather than addressed and treated when it first arises -- yet again an odd contrast to all the technological-problem-solving, which is always carried out quickly and efficiently (though admittedly these are often more obviously pressing). In a novel where humanity is willing to fundamentally change anything they can get their hands on -- space, earth, their own DNA -- it's odd that fundamental social issues don't get a bit more attention; Stephenson seems to just write the difference off -- "Human nature being what it was".
Seveneves is good on a great deal of (especially technical) detail -- the danger of cosmic rays as well as debris, for example, a constant concern while anywhere in space -- and offers a neat picture of the potential of some relatively simple technological advances (robot technology; advances in flight technology (of a very different sort than the prevalent ones)). The story, or stories, are decent too -- Stephenson unspools them well enough to keep the reader engaged and entertained -- but given how significant the occurrences are (the end of the world ! for one) it can also feel underdeveloped. There could have been a whole lot more to this.
It ultimately makes for an oddly limited work -- a decent read, with some very memorable bits (though rather fewer memorable characters) but ultimately without enough to it.
- M.A.Orthofer, 3 June 2015
Links:
Q & A at Slate
Publishers Weekly
Other Books by Neal Stephenson under Review:
The Baroque Cycle:
In the Beginning ... was the Command Line
The Rise and Fall of D.O.D.O. (with Nicole Galland)
Other books of interest under review:
See Index of Contemporary American fiction
About the Author:
American author Neal Stephenson was born in 1959. After his novel about academia, The Big U, he wrote "the Eco-thriller" Zodiac and then began writing true science fiction, with which he has had great success.
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Airtime is a social app, and we encourage making new friends. Room hosts can send invitations to other Airtime users to join their rooms. Room invitations can be found in the activity area of Airtime and expire after 60 days.
To manage your invitations:
When you are invited to a room, it will be visible on your “My Rooms” page.
Tap “Accept” if you want to join the room or select “Not now” if you wish to decline the invitation.
Tap in the upper right corner of your device to view any missed activity.
If you were invited to a new room or were invited to host a room, you'll see those invites and updates here. Tap "Accept" to welcome the invitation; otherwise, you can ignore it.
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Sarah Yost prepares her classroom for her new students at Wesport Middle School, in Louisville, Ky., on Friday, August 8, 2014. Photo by Eleanor Hasken
This morning, students will file into schools throughout Louisville for the first day of class in most Jefferson County Public Schools. The first day leads to a bulk of questions—logistics, who's who and more. JCPS has some of the information available, but here are answers to some of the lingering questions, big and small. Some very small.When does school even start?Some schools may vary their start times, but most schools share the same schedule, according to information provided by JCPS. Elementary schools typically begin class at 9:05 a.m. and end at 3:45 p.m. Middle and high school classes begin at 7:40 a.m. and last until 2:20 p.m.How can you make sure about what bus you or your student will ride? For many bus-related questions, JCPS provides the Bus Finder website at www.jcpsky.net. The district is also making available a transportation hotline, 485-RIDE, through which families can get more information about bus depots and routes.A district spokesman said families should expect delays from 30 minutes to an hour on the first day of school, as school staff and bus drivers will need extra time to ensure students get on the right bus and off at the proper stops.Nearly 69,500 students will travel on 975 buses for the 2014-2015 school year, according to information provided by JCPS. Schools send home transportation information for parents to fill out, and district officials request that every piece be returned to students' schools. That's especially important for kindergarteners students to make sure they know where to go and what bus to ride—and what their address is. Related: Superintendent Donna Hargens Discusses The Challenges For the New JCPS School YearHow many students will be enrolled at JCPS for the 2014-2015 school year?The district’s projected enrollment in 102,367. That’s nearly 2,000 more students than three years ago. And kindergarten classes continue to climb, as well. JCPS officials expect more than 7,700 kindergarten students attending JCPS schools this year, according to a district news release.How can you contact my student’s school?Each school has a website, which can be found by clicking here. If that doesn’t work, call JCPS’ central office at (502) 485-3011.How can you apply for free/reduced meal plans and find more information about nutrition services?This school year will be the first time the district is participating in the Community Eligibility Provision—which will provide free meals to some 55,000 at 95 schools. You can find more information, including a list of eligible schools, here.For information about school meal menus and steps to applying for free and reduced programs, go here.Are there any after-school or before-school programs for students?Yes. The school district has a partnership with the YMCA that offers a number of options for filling time space before and after school hours. For more information on these programs, go here.Can I volunteer at my student’s school?Volunteer opportunities at JCPS schools are available. For more information on those opportunities, go here.When is the first holiday for students?Labor Day, on Monday, Sept. 1. The last day is tentatively scheduled for May 28, 2015. Here's a complete calendar.
News jefferson county public schools
Jacob Ryan joined LPM in 2014. Ryan is originally from Eddyville, Kentucky. Email Jacob at jryan@lpm.org.
See stories by Jacob Ryan
Words for the People
Each episode features an established writer and an emerging writer, sharing their wisdom to help you free your own story. “Words for the People” is hosted by Crystal Wilkinson, Kentucky’s Poet Laureate.
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Verité’s main business includes social audits, consulting, training and management system building. Since its establishment, we have partnered with thousands of multinational companies, factories, and institutional investors to illuminate labor rights violations in supply chains and improve their CSR performance to the benefits of workers and companies alike. Verité, as a recognized leader in the field of corporate social responsibility (CSR), applies unique approaches with specific and practical goals in its CSR auditing, training, consulting and capacity building.
Charitable Activities
In 2010, two years after the Wenchuan earthquake, due to lack of resources, the schools in Baoxing County, Ya’an City, Sichuan Province still did not open the books donated by the community after the Wenchuan earthquake. The books were still lying quietly in cardboard boxes and piled up in a vacant room. Upon learning of this news, with the support of relevant leaders in Ya’an City and Baoxing County, Verité Company donated to a total of three schools: Tibetan Middle School and Primary School in Qiaoqi Township, and Yanjing Township Fengjingzhai Yanjing Central Primary School with bookshelves, to help the schools build a library and book corners in the classrooms, to make full use of the books, so that every child can enjoy the fun of reading. Reading can change children’s life. For children who are in remote areas and lack of resources, good books can build a bridge to a better future for them. However, children’s reading habits need to be developed from an early age. Simply moving books from a box to a shelf may not be enough to develop children’s reading habits. Therefore, Verité Company decided to set up a “Verité Reading Fund” to encourage teachers and students to read more books, write diligently, and think well.
Since 2011, with the support of Baoxing County Education Bureau, Verité Reading Fund has been distributed in the three schools. The fund is divided into two components: “Teacher Reading Fund” and “Student Reading Fund”. Teachers are encouraged to read, and they would encourage students to read. Participating schools organize reading notes awards every year, and the winners receive recognition from the school and a small bonus. As of 2019, 1,557 students and 273 teachers participated in the activity. The students’ reading enthusiasm, reading and expression skills have been improved significantly. In 2015, Yang Kang, a student of Qiaoqi Tibetan Middle School, used his reading note “Unity of Loyalty and Personality” in Verité reading activities participating in the “2014 National Ministry of Education-China Mobile Project Love Reading Essay Activity”, and won the national first prize, and as the sole representative of Sichuan Province went to Shandong to attend the award ceremony.
First Prize Winners of Reading Festival in Yanjing Primary School – 2014
Library – bookshelves donated by Verite
Library – students are reading
Merit Awards of Reading Festival in Yanjing Primary School – 2012
Merit Awards of Reading Festival in Yanjing Primary School – 2014
Reading Festival Award Ceremony in Qiaoqi Primary School – 2012
Reading Festival Award Ceremony in Qiaoqi Primary School – 2014
Reading Festival Award Ceremony in Yanjing Primary School – 2015
Reading Makes Me Happy – Hand-written newspaper competition in Qiaoqi Primary School
Reading Notes Exhibition in Qiaoqi Primary School
Script Contest Qiaoqi Middle School – 2018
Second Prize Winners of Reading Festival in Yanjing Primary School – 2012
Second Prize Winners of Reading Festival in Yanjing Primary School – 2015
Verité is a professional organization dedicated to off corporate social responsibility service and supply chain management service, and is one of the industry leaders. We provide knowledge and tools, and through capacity building, to improve the working conditions of the supply chain and the level of corporate social responsibility management. We are not only a socially responsible organization, but also an enterprise full of human care. Verité has been committed to helping employees improve their abilities and qualities, and is committed to the construction of the company’s corporate culture. Reading is an important part of it. Every year, Verité provides books to its employees according to their own wishes and needs, helps employees develop reading habits, develops employees’ thinking and writing skills, and allows employees to open their horizons and enrich themselves after busy work. Verité has tried every means to motivate employees to read more, read good books, and write reading notes, and recommend the outstanding works to be published in public journals. Under the double encouragement of spirit and material, our colleagues in the company keep reading and writing, and every year there are wonderful articles published. In addition, the company also holds a photography contest every year to encourage everyone to record life with mobile phones and cameras, and discover and capture the beauty of the ordinary life anytime and anywhere. The company will collect photos of work, life and travel and articles written by the employees into a yearbook. The company also holds singing competitions, team sports meets and culinary competitions from time to time, enriching everyone’s spare time.
ABOUT US
ABOUT US
Verité’s main business includes social audits, consulting, training and management system building. Since its establishment, we have partnered with thousands of multinational companies, factories, and institutional investors to illuminate labor rights violations in supply chains and improve their CSR performance to the benefits of workers and companies alike. Verité, as a recognized leader in the field of corporate social responsibility (CSR), applies unique approaches with specific and practical goals in its CSR auditing, training, consulting and capacity building.
Verité Workers' Occupational Health and Safety Project Launched
Companies Receiving Verité Training and Consulting Services Successfully Improved their EcoVadis Assessment Performance
Worker Wellbeing Project Launched by Verité and Levi’s
Office address: 28B, Building B, The First World Plaza, 7002 West Hongli Road, Futian District, Shenzhen, China 518034
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Marshall is an Educator by trade, and currently lives in Oregon. He was lucky enough to grow up in a musical household, and though the AV equipment wasn't the greatest, it was always on. His dad introduced him to Queen, Paul Simon, and Sgt. Pepper's, and his mom played Lionel Richie and Disney Soundtracks. When Marshall was 14, his uncle passed down a pair of JBL towers and Marshall finally had his own system. Having enjoyed podcasting and video production over the past 10 years, Marshall is happy to be contributing at Audioholics.
About the author:
Clint Deboer was terminated from Audioholics for misconduct on April 4th, 2014. He no longer represents Audioholics in any fashion.
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When we witness someone who is spending money on some luxury we deem unnecessary, whether it be a luxury car, a seemingly pointless toy, or a service that "nobody needs," it's helpful to keep in mind that those who sell and market such goods are usually ordinary people.
Thursday, January 17, 2019
One of the more persistent myths about capitalism is that wealth and resources are "wasted" when spent on luxuries.
At the core of this myth is the idea that when you buy, say, a $5,000 75-inch LED television, the money you spend on that item goes only to improve the life of the person who ends up owning the television. "Look at those rich people and their expensive televisions! Don't they know that some people in the world don't have televisions at all?"
This is an old story. The basic premise of shunning luxuries has long been this: people should not spend their money on luxuries while there are some people in the world who can't get enough to eat, or who lack adequate housing, or who lack an education.
Now, there is no doubt that real value can be obtained from charitable giving to people who live in poverty. Both the giver and recipient benefit. Encouraging people to share the wealth in this way—freely and without state coercion, of course—is a good thing.
However, much of the argument against spending on luxury items completely ignores the many non-wealthy people who benefit from creating and selling luxury items and services to relatively more wealthy people.
Put another way: many people benefit when the rich are separated from their money—and an easy and non-violent way to separate the rich from their money is to convince them to buy luxury goods and services.
Who Benefits?
After all, in the case of a high-end television (or any television), who benefits? Many people who aren't rich people.
For example, if the television is purchased at an electronics store, the person who sells the item then earns a commission. Or, if it's a non-commission job, then the salary must come out of the proceeds from the sale of the television. The same is true of everyone else who works in the store, from the manager to the cashier to the janitor.
The truck driver who delivered the television to the store, of course, has value as a worker because someone wanted the television he delivered. And then there are the people who actually assembled the television and the people who built the parts used to make it.
The truck driver who delivered the television to the store, of course, has value as a worker because someone wanted the television he delivered. And then there are the people who actually assembled the television and the people who built the parts used to make it. The fact these people may live far away in some other country doesn't make them irrelevant or unimportant.
And we need not stop there. Many other people earn money because people buy luxury goods. The advertisers and marketers who let people know about the existence of these luxury items exist because the goods are sold. The insurance salesmen who sell the casualty and liability policies to the sellers and manufacturers of these luxury items also can earn a living because some people like to buy expensive televisions.
The situation is not fundamentally different if someone buys the television online. Someone must still deliver the television. Someone must build the truck it is delivered in.
Similar situations occur with all products and services.
It's true that some of that money goes to CEOs. And some of it goes to stockholders—many of whom are certainly not millionaires. But the fact that some wealthy people partly benefit from some industry, good, or service is hardly a reason to limit or abolish those things.
The Problems with Forced Redistribution
Some may respond to these observations by claiming, "Well, if we forcibly redistributed all that money spent on luxuries, that television delivery driver wouldn't have to work hard just to feed her children or help her ailing mother.
At the core of the "money-spent-on-luxuries-is-wasted" argument is often an assumption that some government agency could do a better job of allocating the money.
In other words, at the core of the "money-spent-on-luxuries-is-wasted" argument is often an assumption that some government agency could do a better job of allocating the money.
But let's look at what would be required to "re-allocate" this money in an allegedly better way.
First of all, government agents would have to determine which people are spending too much on luxuries and then determine what portion of their income to confiscate for purposes of re-allocation.
Then, it would have to be determined which people would receive the redistributed funds.
All of this would be dictated by rules and regulations, and government bureaucrats would take their cut in the re-allocation process, of course.
In the end, some people would end up with more money than they had before. And some would have less. And government employees would certainly have more.
But can we be sure that the delivery driver who supports her family with the profits from television sales will actually be better off? No, we can't be sure. It's entirely possible that as the wealthy are less able to purchase luxuries, the driver will have her hours reduced. She may then have to find a job working in a field she less prefers and possibly even hates.
Moreover, we can't be sure that she'll even see a net gain in her income since the rules authored by bureaucrats may not favor people in her particular situation.
As luxury spending is forcibly curtailed, everyone who earns a living from the sales of these items will themselves see a reduction in their income.
It spreads outward from there. As luxury spending is forcibly curtailed, everyone who earns a living from the sales of these items will themselves see a reduction in their income.
And finally, the workers overseas in poor countries who made those televisions will see less demand for their work, and thus less income. These people are probably the ones who will suffer the most from our attempt at punishing people who spend too much on luxury items.
The cumulative effect is substantial, and there's no way a government planner could account for every possible outcome.
And then, of course, there is the total arbitrariness of declaring some things to be luxuries and other things to be essentials. Are all televisions luxuries? Or are some televisions "essential"? And if some televisions are essential, at what price level do they become luxuries?
Many things that appeared to be wildly luxurious and largely unattainable to past generations are considered to be essentials today. Telephones, microwave ovens, air conditioners, and refrigerators were all once luxuries for a few privileged consumers.
Needless to say, there is no objective measure by which a government agent might declare some items essential and others unnecessary frills.
So, the next time we witness someone who is spending money on some luxury we deem unnecessary, whether it be a luxury car, a seemingly pointless toy, or a service that "nobody needs," it's helpful to keep in mind that those who sell and market such goods are usually ordinary people.
This article was reprinted from the Mises Institute.
Ryan McMaken is the editor of Mises Wire and The Austrian. Ryan has degrees in economics and political science from the University of Colorado and was the economist for the Colorado Division of Housing from 2009 to 2014. He is the author of Commie Cowboys: The Bourgeoisie and the Nation-State in the Western Genre.
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1) When we read the Psalms of David, we learn that his primary objective was to consistently glorify God. It is easy to see him as a young man herding sheep in the open country, playing his harp and singing his songs. We can still enjoy the blessings of these beautiful psalms today. It was clearly his heart’s desire to praise God’s greatness and omnipotence. God created us humans so that we “should be to the praise of His glory” (Ephesians 1:12). Yes, God still wants to be glorified among us today. Not everyone has the talent to sing or play a musical instrument. However, God has given all of us skills and gifts that we can use to His glory. God wants us to live our lives for His glory and to exalt His name. “And whatever you do in word or in deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him” (Colossians 3:17). “And whatever you do, do it heartily, as to the Lord and not to men” (Colossians 3:23).
2) In his approximately 73 psalms (the exact amount cannot be determined with certainty), we gain a small insight into the heart of David. We see his deep desire for God over and over again. God was his light, his salvation, his fortress, his rock, his protection, his strength, his shepherd, and much more. The Lord was everything to him! In emergencies and battles, David clung ever closer to God. How often do people turn their backs to God in disappointment after experiencing difficulties or defeats in their spiritual lives? They decide to try mastering their lives on their own while losing their hold in the almighty God. Let us learn from David and hold on to God in all circumstances. If we consistently live in close communion with God, it will be easier for us to trust God in difficult situations.
3) For a certain period of time, David’s life was in great danger. King Saul wanted to kill him. Twice, David barely escaped Saul’s spear. Then, completely unexpectedly, David was presented with the opportunity to kill Saul in the mountains of En Gedi, thereby ending the threat to his own life. It seems that his companions appeared to him as “angels of light,” so to speak, trying to convince him to kill Saul (1 Samuel 24:1-7). It would have allowed David to become king quickly. However, David was absolutely determined not to act against God’s instructions. He resolved not to take his destiny into his own hands but rather to trust and follow God’s schedule.
Our discipleship should demonstrate similar determination. We need it in almost all areas of our lives. Just think about the areas of your life in which you could use more conviction and learn to say with David: “The Lord forbid that I should do this thing” (1 Samuel 24:6).
4) David’s adultery with Bathsheba marks a dark chapter in his life. We may look at David, this heroic figure, and ask ourselves: “How could he?” However, rather than looking back and judging David, let us take this as a warning for ourselves. We, too, are surrounded by a sinful world full of temptations. God already warned Cain in Genesis 4:7: “If you do not do well, sin lies at the door. And its desire is for you, but you should rule over it.” If we are not watchful, sin, regardless of which kind, can affect you and me just as easily.
Although David would have liked to hide his sin, he was not able to do so. It was revealed. And yet, David did not give up in this moment and let go of God. Instead, he humbly sought forgiveness and help from God, bearing the consequences of his sin patiently and without resentment. In his penitential psalm (Psalm 51), we can see his desire to clear the slate with God and to regain a pure heart.
Let us learn from David to glorify God through our lives, to have a close relationship with Him, to walk decisively in His path, and to keep our hearts pure. Do you also have the desire to be a man or a woman after God’s own heart?
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Mr B and I are watching the Grand National. The race actually finished two and a half hours ago but we were out enjoying ourselves when the race was run so we are now in catch-up mode.
We have made our choices but we are not sure we really want either of our horses to win, on the basis that if they do we will wish we had wagered a pound or two on victory. We need not have worried unduly. Mr B's takes a tumble and mine comes in a creditable eighth so I am claiming the upper hand in our own personal Grand National duel.
We had arrived home to watch the Boat Race in real time. Cambridge came second. In case you didn't know. When they left us, three of our lunch companions were off to watch the race from a bridge somewhere. They will have been cheering Cambridge on from above but obviously didn't cheer loudly enough to will them over the line in first place.
It's quite a sporting weekend, isn't it? I have promised Mr B that I will watch the last day of the Masters golf tournament with him tomorrow. He likes the idea in theory though he will doubtless regret it when I start asking questions all through the play and commenting on the sartorial choices of the master golfers.
We spent the best part of the day having a long and leisurely lunch in Wimbledon with the Middle and Youngest of the Darling Daughters, my best friend from schooldays and her own two Darling Daughters. Plus Young Faris and The Twinkles, of course. Faris was in his best Rampaging Rascal mood; Wagamamas didn't know what had hit them. To be fair, it wasn't Our Boy's fault - he hadn't had his daily nap and being confined to a high chair was just no fun. So tired was he when his Mamma gave in and took him home, that he has even passed up the opportunity to write today's Daily Blog - though he would doubtless have had plenty to say about the free gift of a small net and two plastic ladybirds which came with the magazine I bought him. One of the ladybirds went missing (possibly seeking asylum?) while Faris tossed the net over into the kitchen where the chefs were cooking up Noodles and Other Nosh for their clientele. What has become of the last surviving ladybird is anybody's guess.
My old school friend still lives in the town where we went to school and can be relied upon to fill me in on the latest news of Former School Pupils We Have Known. I have to rack my brains trying to remember some of them. Well, it was such a long time ago. We recall the days when pupils who could sing were privileged to join the lads from the Boys' Grammar School in annual productions of Gilbert and Sullivan operettas. Neither of us made it through the auditions, though Pat, being of an artistic bent, was sometimes allowed to paint scenery. Mr B, who met us both on the same day, listens to us rambling on, as he has done for the last fifty-two years, with a bemused expression on his face. There's nothing quite like a good old catch-up. We must do it again - and soon!
Tala and Lilia say: We were adorable today. Though we say so ourselves, as shouldn't (as Nanni would say.) But don't just take our word for it - everyone said the same thing. Pat who is Nanni's friend, Pip and Cheryl who are her little girls, special Auntie Karen and, of course, Nanni and Grandad. They all said we were adorable and we reckon they must know what they are talking about, as they are Ever So Old, especially Nanni who, according to Faris (who is both our Big Brother and Our Hero) has reached a Great Age.
Soon we will be able to sit in two high chairs, side by side, and throw our food at each other and say "Cheers!" before we drink from our cups. Nanni will buy us magazines with free toys on the front and we will try not to lose them. We expect we will have different magazines, with different toys stuck on the front but, because we are twins, we will share them. That's what twins do. Mummy says so and Mummy knows everything. Almost as much as Faris.
One day when we are older, say five months or so, we feel sure we will understand some of the things that puzzle us at the moment. Such as why, when we go to a restaurant, are we always shown to a table right at the back, out of everyone's way? And why do Mummy and Nanni think this is A Good Thing? Why is Faris given crayons so that he can do some colouring while we have to make do with being cuddled and drinking our milk? We noticed that Cheryl did some crafty colouring when nobody was looking, so she probably felt it wasn't quite fair too.
And, while we're about it, what does "adorable" mean, exactly....
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lovely and heartwarming - an inspiration to us all x
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Love this story told as ever beautifully.x
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What a super account of a special event. I loved meeting you last night and seeing your creation come together. I’m so pleased you got so much from the activity
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It’s simple, because tomorrow is not guaranteed, seriously! I mean we hear people say that all the time but it’s really true. Reality really hit me hard when two of my family members passed away from covid19. It happened so suddenly and my family and I were in disbelief. After that experience my perspective about […]
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I recently visited Haiti and it was the trip of my lifetime! It was not like any other vacation, it was homecoming. I was excited yet nervous. the real question was why did I take so long? Well I had no actual answer to this question. I was suppose to go in 2010, but then […]
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China doesn't have a Covid exit plan. Two years in, people are fed up and angry | #socialmedia | #hacking | #aihp - Am I Hacker Proof
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Restricted borders, constant digital tracking, and the potential for mass testing and snap lockdowns whenever a handful of cases appeared were all trade-offs for a comparatively Covid-free life while the pandemic raged overseas.
In the tech hub of Shenzhen on Sunday, videos shared online showed residents protesting in a locked-down district, after restrictions lasted for several days longer than scheduled, according to social media posts.
“You can’t do this — we need to eat and pay the rent,” a man among a crowd of protesters is heard yelling in anguish at health care workers, who stood behind high plastic barriers, according to a video shared online.
“Unlock! We demand lifting the lockdown!” others shouted in a second clip.
In another instance, in the neighboring city of Guangzhou earlier this month, thousands of people were seen in video footage trying to escape being caught up in a snap lockdown at a trade fair. Some hopped fences to avoid being locked inside the venue after a single positive case was found.
Such scenes are largely unprecedented in China’s more than two-year fight against the virus. And while many remain supportive of keeping Covid-19 at bay, these instances are not the only signs of changing attitudes, as millions remain under lockdown and cases continue to climb in China’s worst outbreak since early 2020.
The case against living with the virus
The extreme measures are being rolled out even as the toll of Covid-19 within the highly vaccinated country has been limited, so far.
The caseload this month has now exceeded 56,000 cases across 28 provinces. Though it is not clear how many of these cases are severe, only two deaths have been reported since the beginning of the newest outbreak. Earlier this month, when the caseload stood at 29,000, officials reported some 95% were mild or asymptomatic.
Some Chinese citizens now appear to think the health measures are more onerous than the illness.
On China’s popular — and heavily censored — social media platform Weibo, a question about why China can’t relax its Covid-19 restrictions like other countries was the top trending hashtag on Wednesday, racking up over 500 million views.
The top post linked to an interview, given by the head of the National Health Commission’s expert panel on Covid-19, that stressed China must “persist” in its strategy to protect the vulnerable.
The prominence of such a conversation is itself a radical departure from how questions had been dealt with in the past.
Last summer, for example, esteemed Shanghai infectious disease physician Zhang Wenhong came under a vitriolic nationalist online attack for merely suggesting the country would need to eventually find a way to coexist with the virus.
Now, these conversations are playing out in the open as huge swaths of the country face significant restrictions to their daily lives in the latest outbreak.
At least 25 million people across four cities are under lockdown in the northern provinces of Jilin and Hebei, and an untold number of others have been subject to district or neighborhood level lockdowns this month, including in the affluent first-tier cities of Shanghai and Shenzhen.
Measures take their toll
A stark example of the human toll of China’s stringent measures came on Wednesday, when an off-duty nurse died of an asthma attack in Shanghai after reportedly being turned away from several hospitals, including Shanghai East Hospital, where she worked.
In a statement Friday, the hospital said that its emergency room was temporarily closed for Covid-19 disinfection when the nurse’s family drove her there. Several outpatient and emergency departments across Shanghai have been shut due to exposure to positive cases.
Wu Jinglei, director of Shanghai health commission, offered his condolences to the nurse’s family and vowed to reduce the disruption to normal medical service, especially for emergency rooms, while hospitals are being disinfected.
Reports of residents not being able to receive non-Covid medical treatment or having inadequate access to supplies in Shanghai circulated on social media earlier in the week. These were noted by Shanghai’s prominent specialist Zhang, who called for such issues to be “addressed in the future.”
“Otherwise, the significance of the success of the fight against Covid-19 will be largely compromised,” Zhang, who is head of the Center for Infectious Diseases with the Shanghai-based Huashan Hospital of Fudan University, wrote on his verified Weibo account Thursday.
Shanghai is facing its most serious outbreak yet, with 1,609 Covid-19 cases reported Thursday. And while authorities have denied they plan to lock down the city of 25 million people, numerous residents tell CNN that a growing number of neighborhoods are being temporarily sealed off to undergo mass testing — as part of a “rolling lockdown” strategy — with local officials vowing Wednesday to “further strengthen the prevention and control measures.”
And even in a city with some of the best infrastructure in the country, social media complaints suggest that systems to ensure residents have what they need are failing, as lockdowns are extended without notice.
“How can I buy groceries? … I can’t get medicine for my kids …how can we order this online when we can’t even get a hospital appointment?” wrote one social media user, who said their Shanghai neighborhood had been closed for 15 days.
Another complained that she was without staples after listening to the government’s assurances that supplies were sufficient and there was no need to hoard.
“They said there was enough food … but they didn’t mention there weren’t enough people to deliver it,” she said.
On Wednesday, Shanghai’s health authorities responded to a question about how citizens in the city’s Jiading district could report problems buying groceries. Officials noted they were making “every effort” to ensure supplies by supporting residents to use online platforms to get what they needed or arranging bulk purchasing and distribution. They also explained that some neighborhoods may see control periods extended if positive cases are found, as screening will need to start again.
As for those wondering when the zero-Covid strategy will end, China’s health officials have been ambiguous.
When asked at a news conference on Tuesday, government epidemiologist Liang Wannian said China must “not waver” and stick to its plan, while waiting for a range of things to happen: outbreaks to ease overseas, the virus to mutate to become less dangerous, and better treatments and vaccines to become available.
“Under these circumstances, I believe we will thoroughly evaluate the situation of the epidemic in China….and then take more adaptive measures to counter the disease,” he said.
But for those in China who are counting the days until they can be released from lockdown, such answers may not be reassuring.
As one social media user, who expressed concern that a lockdown in his Shanghai complex could be continually extended, wrote on Weibo this week: “Have the people in charge really not studied this issue carefully? The price paid by people inside is endless.”
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If they had had a balloon of their own, they could have foreseen each step of the disaster that had unfolded in the seaway before Dominica. And if they had had a radio, the cargo galleons might have fashioned an organized response to Resolve‘s dash into their midst at flank speed: a wolf plunging into a flock of sheep. For instance, they might have attempted to box in the USE warship from all points of the compass. However, even had they been able to coordinate, they were also massively under gunned and the wind and current was now against the majority of them. So such an undertaking would have been risky and quite perilous. At best.
Instead, Resolve had struck terror into her foes, both near and far. Her carronades — split into forward and after batteries of three guns and two four-gun waist batteries, one afore the beam, one abaft — had engaged any target within four hundred yards or less. The percentage of hits was only moderate, but the impact upon Spanish morale was severe. The wallowing galleons veered away from the steam cruiser without any thought to wind or current. Their understandable instinct was to diminish their target profile in the face of gunnery that struck its targets with one out of four balls it fired, and in which every hit penetrated the stoutest hull and wreaked unprecedented havoc.
Those few captains who did attempt to close with Resolve, either from an excess of martial spirit or dearth of tactical intelligence, found their boldness rewarded with catastrophe. Even two who had been able to find enough wind and current to make three knots toward the cruiser discovered that, in the three minutes it took to close from four hundred yards to one hundred, Resolve‘s rate of fire and murderous close-range accuracy reduced them to drifting hulks before they could turn and deliver a broadside. Even if two such galleons had chanced to close simultaneously from opposite sides of Resolve‘s compass rose, she would simply have added a bit of steam or set her sails to catch a little more wind until the range had opened once again. In the event that both ships had not been thoroughly brutalized, the survivor would then have had to choose between trying cases with her once again or to sheer off from another exercise in naval futility.
After having roughed up, or outright mauled, half a dozen merchantmen in this fashion, the Dutch spyglasses saw what the reports from Tower were confirming: that the Spanish were now pressing north. Not in response to any orders — they were maneuvering so frantically that signals were all but useless — but simply because it was the only direction which offered any chance of survival. That the thirteen waiting ships of Tromp’s Anvil had more guns and were better rigged for reaching winds did not seem to deter them.
At about that time, sails appeared behind the Spanish on the far northeastern and southeastern horizons: the nearest jachts of the net that Eddie had used to detect La Flota had now reached it, like the ends of a seine pulling close to seal behind a great school of trapped fish.
Kees adjusted the plot, swallowed a cup of water handed to him by one of the runners. Although the breeze kept them cool and the awning over the flying bridge helped, they’d all been in and out of the tropical sun throughout the day, and it was nearing two in the afternoon. “Some of the galleons closest to us are coming about, Admiral.”
Tromp nodded. “Like a school of fleeing fish, each is hoping it will be one of the lucky ones to slip past.”
“Widen the head of our Hammer, sir?”
“Yes. That time has come.”
Kees sent a runner with a message. Within minutes, Resolve‘s four escorts sheered away from the cruiser, which they had been paralleling closely. No further instructions were needed. This was the next part of plan Alpha: to obstruct, and if necessary cripple, the ships. Under normal circumstances, achieving that would have been far more difficult than it sounded. But with the Spaniards fleeing and unable to out sail the Dutch warships, they could not maneuver to deliver a broadside, nor could they deny their adversaries the opportunity to cross their stern and lay into them with broadsides of shot and chain. The first two that tried to slip past Resolve in this fashion were soon nearly dead in the water, one with flames springing up at various points. Tromp tried to see that as a victory, but he could only see it as one less ship and cargo with which to strengthen his fleet and its home port.
A very similar situation was playing out in the north. Although the Spanish outnumbered the Dutch ships of Tromp’s Anvil better than two to one, they were coming as scattered, desperate hulls, not a formation. Again, Tromp’s ships simply followed plan Alpha, with occasional tweaks and adjustments made possible by the Tower’s observations. And with Resolve heading into the rear of that diffuse collection of galleons, Anvil would not need to take on all of them alone.
Tromp decided to come quite close to the rearmost of the fleeing merchantmen — five hundred yards — before ordering a standard round fired for ranging purposes. Ironically, it hit the afterdeck and the Spaniard’s progress became unsteady: damage to the tiller ropes, probably. He steamed past, changing his tactics as he went. Plan alpha called for controlled, high accuracy fire into the galleons, starting by hitting the rearmost until she burned high and fast. Then Resolve would work methodically forward through the other shaken Spaniards.
But the Spanish were now so panicked that Maarten feared such a spectacle of destruction abaft would only resolve them to more desperate measures. Better to make the path ahead more fearsome, and so, propel them into a state of indecision. Once in that state of mind, the notion of surrender might have enough time to push up through their panic as a reasonable option.
Tromp called for the range to the galleon closest to Anvil.
Bjelke was about twenty seconds in getting the measurement. “Twenty-two hundred yards, sir.”
Tromp glanced at Dirck whose gesture was one of invitation and his permission; the Admiral was cleared to give direct orders to Resolve.
“Engineer, full speed.”
“Full speed, aye.”
“Helm, give me a course toward that lead galleon, but adjust for the current and the swells. I need low chop rather than maximum speed.”
“Understood, Admiral.”
“Mounts One and Two, can you both bear on lead ship?” Affirmatives came in. “Commence tracking. Load standard round. You will commence fire at fifteen hundred yards, pending my orders.”
More affirmatives as the full measure of steam reached the propellers and Resolve surged forward.
Galleons struggled away from the cruiser’s path like lead-coated pigeons. There was little conversation on the flying bridge; the day had been long and this was not the thrill of the hunt, so much as it was ending a battle that was already decided.
At fifteen hundred yards, Tromp called for speed to reduce to one half, and, as soon as Resolve had settled into what felt like an almost frictionless glide, he gave the order for both mounts to fire. As expected, both mounts missed, but only by thirty yards or so. Forty second later, the mounts reported ready and the range had dropped to just over twelve hundred. Both mounts fired, both missed again, but the forward mount’s round was so close that as it passed harmlessly through the rigging, the sheets and ratlines swayed in its wake. Another forty seconds: nine hundred yards, two more rounds, and this time, two hits. Pieces and dust flew up from both the stern and foc’sle of the galleon. The other Spanish ships that Resolve has sped past were sheering off from her line of advance. Their northward rush was rapidly becoming a roiling, multidirectional chaos that Tower was updating every minute. Tromp ordered the rifles loaded with explosive round. He had about a dozen left for them: the last in the New World except what remained in Intrepid‘s magazine.
At seven hundred yards, Mounts One and Two fired.
In a day that had been difficult for gunnery to begin with, and with marginally substandard accuracy, the gun crews of Resolve‘s naval rifles redeemed themselves in that moment: one round went in amidships, the other into the starboard quarter. The explosions were akin to flame demons bursting out through its sides, multiple secondary explosions cracking and blasting in their wake. Smoke poured out of her. The sea around her was thick with smoking debris.
Rik looked over at Tromp. “Sir, what orders for the rifles?”
Tromp took a quick look around; at least half of the galleons were still trying to flee north, but they had all sheered away from Resolve and her victim. Maarten had seen captains in a fleet lose their nerve before — and it looked just like this.
“Mounts One and Two load explosive shell.”
Dirck Simonszoon raised an eyebrow but said nothing.
The cries of the forward gun crew announced the start of the reloading process which had taken on the sound of a familiar ritual, one that might be practiced in the temple of a dispassionate god of war. Tromp looked up —
— just in time to see the stricken galleon vanish in a furious flash, followed closely by a deafening — literally deafening — roar. From almost a third of a mile, a sudden puff of wind marked the power of the explosion as smoke jetted out in every direction. The top half of the foremast flew upward even faster, a malformed and broken javelin.
Dirck made a teeth-sucking sound. “Well, that’s two rounds saved.”
Tromp muttered to Rik. “Mounts One and Two, secure from battery. Prepare to reload with standard. Await instructions.”
Then he sighed and tried not to think of all the human souls he had just sent to their Maker in parts too small for even God Himself to recognize.
The standard rounds that were readied for loading never went into the breeches of their respective rifles. The Spanish had had enough. However, it took a while for all of them to actually realize that they were out of options.
One or two still tried running north. The smaller and faster of the Dutch ships gave chase, crossing the Spaniards’ sterns at will, peppering them shot and chain until the much bigger galleons struck their colors. So heavily laden that they were low in the water and sluggish, they could barely run at all, and fighting the speedy and maneuverable jachts while doing so was out of the question. And then there was the concern that doing so might attract the attention and displeasure of the satanic steam cruiser that could run down and destroy any ship at will. Indeed, it moved and inflicted so much damage so quickly, that the primal logic of what Tromp had mentally labelled the “fleeing sheep reflex” — scattering with the knowledge that a single predator could not bring down more than one or two prey — no longer obtained. Resolve had demonstrated why that desperate logic no longer applied: she was a wolf so swift and so deadly that she could lay waste to the whole flock — or certainly, any sheep that called attention to themselves by daring to kick at the lesser wolves in the pack.
Similar outcomes prevailed in the seaway that had been the site of most of the day’s action. But here, a few galleons — possibly taking confidence from being in an areas still thick with their own numbers — actually fired defiant shots at the larger Dutch vessels. Which, although not as swiftly as jachts, were easily able to gain the wind gauge and cross either the bows or sterns of their adversaries with horrific effect. And when one such pass failed to compel a Spanish captain to strike his colors, a quick set of signals by flag, Aldis, or both brought Resolve around, heading for the recalcitrant galleon. Which hastily relented and suffered to be taken. So Resolve spent the better part of the following hour moving toward one troublesome Spaniard after another, her dire intent working in place of her guns.
Even when all the jachts of Tromp’s detection net arrived, the number of hulls in his fleet still did not equal the number of galleons that were undamaged or only moderately. The enemy ships were all ordered to fix each gun’s tompion in its muzzle, lower their anchors, reef their sails, and have their full crews gather on deck. Compliance with the latter was no doubt woefully incomplete, but with so many men staring into shot-loaded guns less than fifty yards away, they well understood the gruesome execution that would follow the slightest sign of defiance. On those galleons where Dutch captains detected suspiciously restive or lethargic reactions to their orders, they loudly added that they were already sorely tempted to show the same kind of “mercy” that the Spanish had shown the Dutch at Dunkirk, two and a half years ago. That did not fail to produce swift if bitter compliance.
However, when the Spanish sullenly asked if the formal surrender was to be effected aboard the galleon or the Dutch hull that was its warder, they were told to hold fast. Philip the IV’s captains were baffled: did the Dutch not mean to take the ship, to board it? In our good time, was the only answer they got. In the meantime, the each prize hull was visited by one of the Dutch steam tugs, which remained long enough to affix a crude spar torpedo directly to the stern, close on to the rudder. Once the tug began moved on, a skiff from the Dutch warder put down and its well-armored team fastened its painter to the rudder itself. If the crews of those captive galleons had begun to entertain thought of treachery, of turning on their captors either now or when they attempted to board, it was now entirely defused. Clearly, first response of the Dutch would be to sweep their decks, followed shortly by lighting the fuse of the explosive and so, destroy their rudder and probably breach the hull.
As if to establish these outcomes as a rule, there were several exceptions where a junior officer or a deckhand was resolved to die for the glory (or more dubiously, the honor) of Spain. Their actions varied: a ragged broadside that surprised the Dutch because of its utter hopelessness; a cannon discharged moments after a captain had struck his colors; an attempt to surprise the enemy with a flurry of fire from hidden muskets. Tromp had known from the outset that there was no such thing as a perfect outcome. If battles were replete with dead and mangled bodies, they evinced an unthinkable superabundance of mishaps, mistakes, misunderstandings, and what Eddie called Murphy’s Law. In sum, and in short, anything that could go wrong would, at some point and time in any given engagement.
The resulting consequences to the Dutch were minimal; some damage was done, some lives were lost. The consequences to the Spanish were severe but, contra intuitively, were worst in the case where the Spanish captain who struck his colors at the mere approach of an enemy warship was killed by his own men. They turned their guns toward the approaching Omlandia, perhaps emboldened by its modest gun-decks. However, their attack was made in haste, no doubt to commit any uncertain crewmembers to an unalterable course of action. In consequence, only one of her twelve portside guns hit home at one hundred yards range. Omlandia was still under enough sail to come sharply about and cross the Spaniard’s stern, raking it with shot. Whether from lack of control, heat of battle, or both, the galleon’s crew did not rethink their course of action, but turned toward Omlandia as she passed, thereby giving her starboard batteries a shot as well. The results were inconclusive and within a few minutes, the speedy Wappen van Rotterdam arrived and brought her thirty-eight guns into play. The result: Omlandia would require some minor repairs and would have to consign several of her crew to the deeps, whereas the Spaniard was sprouting fires both on and below the weather deck while lacking the crew or organization to control them promptly.
And so, Tromp thought as he felt the onset of regret and anticlimax that followed every battle he had ever won, La Flota of 1636 is no more.
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Cosmetic surgery is a branch of medication that focuses on changing as well as bring back the human body. It can be divided into two major groups: reconstructive as well as cosmetic. Reconstructive surgery take care of problems such as craniofacial conditions, hand as well as microsurgery, and also burns. The goal of reconstructive surgery is to make a person look much better or feel much better, and it is typically done as a last hope after an accident or serious injury. Divino Plastic Surgery
Cosmetic treatments
There are numerous types of aesthetic treatments that can aid you really feel more youthful as well as extra eye-catching. Most of these procedures entail removing excess skin or changing the shape of your face. Nonetheless, certain people are extra at risk to difficulties than others. These clients include immunocompromised individuals and also those with cardiovascular as well as lung conditions. Additionally, cosmetic treatments carried out in a day spa or beauty salon by inexperienced workers are most likely to create problems. Fortunately, there are now much safer treatments for these sorts of clients that can minimize their risks.
Since the area of cosmetic surgery is highly competitive, you need to select a qualified cosmetic surgeon based on personal recommendations as well as the knowledge of various other physicians. You need to also ask about the cosmetic surgeon’s fellowship training and talk to your state clinical board. Many specialists will certainly refer individuals for therapy before executing particular procedures You need to likewise ask about his or her board accreditation and membership in specialist organizations. These can be extremely helpful if you are not sure whether a doctor is received specific procedures.
While plastic surgery is done to enhance one’s appearance, it is likewise used to fix and improve damaged areas. Some individuals use these procedures to make a significant adjustment to their look. Others might select them to recover damaged locations or correct developing conditions.
Reconstructive cosmetic surgery is a field of surgical procedure that concentrates on changing and also repairing physical defects. It makes use of aesthetic medical concepts to treat different sorts of physical deformities, including birth defects as well as scarring. Surgical methods for this sort of surgical treatment involve a selection of complicated procedures.
These procedures aid people bring back feature to parts of their bodies, such as the face, arms, or hands. They likewise help people with problems such as repetitive strain injury or rheumatoid arthritis. People can additionally undergo hand surgical treatment to repair abnormality and also deal with illness that causes discomfort in the hand or fingers. Additionally, foot surgical procedure is an option for dealing with lumps as well as webbed toes.
Rebuilding cosmetic surgery likewise treats face problems and also a vast array of conditions. For instance, a woman can undertake a breast reduction if she had a mastectomy or has a rash under her breasts. Guy can also go through a breast reduction if they feel their busts are as well huge. In addition, reconstructive surgery may help load the void left after an amputation. Various other examples of rebuilding plastic surgery consist of face repair after a cancer cells surgical procedure. Rebuilding cosmetic surgery additionally addresses the issues of infection as well as trauma.
Botulinum toxin shots are a quick means to lower facial wrinkles. A percentage of the contaminant is infused into the muscle utilizing a thin needle. The toxin after that deteriorates the muscle mass responsible for crease production. The treatment usually lasts three to 4 months, although it may require to be duplicated to preserve the results.
Botulinum contaminant injections are usually executed in a physician’s workplace. The variety of shots required differs depending upon the area to be dealt with. The contaminant is safe to utilize, but it does have some adverse effects. Some clients experience minor swelling, wounding, or feeling numb afterward. Usually, these negative effects diminish within a couple of days.
People of any age can obtain botulinum contaminant shots. Young patients ought to beware, as they might experience emotional results. Older individuals need to be checked for any useful problems. As an example, numerous older patients need brow lifts to remove their vision. A high dosage of botulinum contaminant can affect these lifts, as it can deteriorate the frontalis muscle mass.
Despite its one-of-a-kind marriage of scientific research as well as art, Cosmetic surgery still deals with an obstacle when it concerns determining objective results of procedures. This has triggered researchers to re-examine their research study methods. Nevertheless, the individual experience of individuals can be a crucial source of info for more efforts to boost treatment.
Regardless of the prominent nature of the area, the undergraduate clinical curriculum usually supplies little formal exposure to cosmetic surgery. To address this issue, a potential mate research study was carried out using clinical students from 2 educational systems. Students from both colleges were asked to complete a confidential online survey regarding plastic surgery. They were asked about the source of their information concerning the specialty, their understanding of its range, their preferred finding out approaches, and their factors for seeking a profession in the field.
Research study objectivity in cosmetic surgery must take into consideration whether individuals are looking for surgery because of a functional or aesthetic problem. Practical conditions are much better fit for surgical treatment, however the factors for such procedures are not constantly clear. Clients with practical conditions are more likely to gain from plastic surgery than those without.
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From the Gulf to Israel, countries and armed groups like Yemen’s Houthis and Palestinian Hamas are relying more than ever on guided missiles and rocket technology, which is changing the nature of warfare.
The Middle East has been embroiled in various conflicts and has become a battlefield where various war machines and weapons have been used by different states, but something unprecedented has happened in recent years.
Missile technology is no longer taboo for non-state actors. Different armed groups have unfettered access to different types of missiles, changing the nature of warfare.
“Missiles have become a balance in many asymmetric conflicts in the region, as non-state actors no longer rely solely on unconventional warfare tactics when targeting state adversaries who have traditionally had technological superiority,” says Andreas Krieg, Senior Lecturer at the School of Security Studies at King’s College London and Royal College of Defense Studies and Fellow at the Institute of Middle Eastern Studies.
According to recent studies, more than 5,000 advanced missiles have been launched in armed combat since World War II, and more than 90 percent of them have been used in the Middle East. The US is responsible for nearly 2,000 missile strikes in the region during its two invasions of Iraq and other operations in the Middle East.
“Everyone knows that the use of drones and ballistic missiles by states and non-states has changed the nature of warfare,” says Khalil Dewan, a researcher and analyst on drone warfare and armed conflict.
A missile should not be misconstrued as a missile. In military parlance, a missile is a long-range guided missile that can be launched from both static and mobile launch pads. Unlike rockets, rockets can penetrate deep into enemy territory, severely damaging people and infrastructure.
In recent years, Yemen’s Houthi rebel group has gained easy access to missile technology, and the armed group has used it against states such as the United Arab Emirates and Saudi Arabia. On the other hand, Hamas’ armed wing, the Qassam Brigades in Palestine, has relied heavily on missiles during wars and skirmishes with Israeli forces.
But how do non-state actors acquire such weapons?
Iran, a Shia-majority country using many proxies from Iraq to Syria, Lebanon and Yemen in the Middle East, plays a pivotal role in supplying missiles and advanced missile technology to various armed groups in the Middle East. It not only supplies these groups with technical equipment, but also trains them in building homemade rockets.
“Iranian missile technology in particular has been widely procured in the region to bridge the technological gap between state and non-state actors. Equally important was drone technology, which has become much cheaper and has become the new AK 47 of insurgents and terrorist groups,” says Krieg TRT world.
A woman walks past Qiam (left), Zolfaghar (top right) and Dezful missiles on display at a missile capabilities exhibition in Iran. The Houthis use Burkan-3 missiles, which are a modified version of Qiam missiles. (Vahid Salemi / AP Archives)
The Houthis, fighting a Saudi-led coalition in Yemen’s civil war, and Hamas, which is fighting Israel, have used both Iran-made missiles and the country’s missile technology to create homemade rockets and missiles.
“Drone and missile technology allows non-state actors to bypass conventional defenses and hit states deep within their territories, increasing the strategic cost and burden on state actors that may have operated with impunity in the past,” says Krieg.
“In the context of Palestine and Yemen, non-state actors have recently surprised their adversaries with both the quantity and quality of new ballistic technology available,” he adds.
In recent years, the use of missiles has become even more common from the Gulf to Syria and Palestine. In the past three weeks, the Houthis have repeatedly launched ballistic missiles at UAE territories, including the capital Abu Dhabi and the commercial hub of Dubai.
“Both Hamas and the Houthis are capable of inflicting damage on their opponents and taking the war deep within their territories, forcing the conventionally believed superior enemies to make concessions. While low-intensity insurgency might be sustainable for some state actors, ballistic missiles and drones produce high-impact strikes that are not sustainable for state actors in the long term,” Kreig says.
Houthis against the Emirates and Saudis
Since 2014, Yemen has been mired in a brutal civil war, pitting the Houthis Shia group against the Saudi-backed coalition that includes the UAE. The civil war also triggered the world’s worst humanitarian crisis.
While the Saudi-led coalition has launched deadly airstrikes against Houthi-controlled areas, the Shia group has also deployed its drones and ballistic missiles, targeting both Saudi and UAE territories.
“The recent activities of the Iran-backed Houthis against Abu Dhabi are an example of how domestically improvised drones can influence geopolitical negotiations and conflict dynamics at a low threshold of violence,” Dewan said TRT world.
The Houthis have recently targeted the United Arab Emirates as Abu Dhabi has stepped up its military involvement in the Yemen conflict and is helping its allies defeat the rebel group in the critical oil-rich regions, particularly Marib and Shabwa, experts say.
The UAE-backed Giants, a Yemeni militia, released footage allegedly showing their forces roaming through central Harib in Yemen’s Marib governorate. (AFP)
“The Houthis want the UAE to return to its non-confrontational policy and are firing rockets to urge Abu Dhabi to do so,” said Sami Hamdi, a Middle East political analyst and head of International Interest, a political risk group. in an earlier one TRT world Interview.
The first Houthi attack on Abu Dhabi airport killed three foreign workers, while the second attack left no casualties, according to Emirati sources. The third attack occurred this week during Israeli President Isaac Herzog’s visit to the United Arab Emirates, marking a first between the two countries.
Following the Houthi attacks, the UAE-backed Giants Brigades, a Yemeni force, announced last week that they would end their military offensive in the Houthi-held areas around Shabwa and Marib, according to Mohammed al Qadhi, a Yemeni expert. “This coincides with a halt to coalition airstrikes on Sana’a and other provinces,” he wrote on Twitter.
The Houthi attacks also appeared aimed at deterring the oil-rich UAE’s trading network, which includes many foreign investors.
Prior to their attack on the United Arab Emirates, the Houthis also sent many rockets into Saudi Arabia, targeting the country’s major oil production hubs, causing disruptions to the world’s oil supply for some time.
How states react
This week Israel also sent rockets into Syrian territory, targeting Iran-backed Hezbollah positions near the capital Damascus. Tel Aviv has previously attacked Syria on several occasions, reportedly hitting the supply lines and weapons depots of Iran-backed Shiite militias. Iran supports the Assad regime with the help of its Shia proxy forces in Syria.
But states are going beyond using missile technology to pursue their enemies and rival armed groups, and are developing better communication and cooperation among themselves to either defeat them or contain them. They use the most advanced technology to hone their fighting skills against non-state actors.
“The real game-changer is network-centric warfare, where states collaborate on signals intelligence, share target data, and enjoy multi-strike capabilities in conflicts in the MENA that they’re not even involved in,” says Dewan.
“This is the level of development where the changing nature of warfare is really at — which can be upgraded with artificial intelligence and autonomous beings,” he says.
“While newcomers to drone warfare focus on optics, machinery and sales, others in the shadows exploit ‘air supremacy’ and ‘air policing’.”
Source: TRT World
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Last year, Ohio State was arguably the most talented team in the conference, with seven RSCI top 100 players on the roster. But the pieces didn't fit very well together, and more significantly, that talent was very inexperienced. This year, the team is less talented ("only" 5 RSCI top 100 players remain), but more experienced. The pieces, however, still don't fit very well.
We predicted last year that the Buckeyes would struggle with turnovers due to a lack of a true ballhandler, a prediction that held true. Unfortunately, a steady point guard has not materialized in Columbus, so turnovers will still be an issue this season. However, everyone else returned, and the overall numbers should get better, if still a liability. The point guard responsibilities will likely again fall to Evan Turner, who did an admirable job considering he's ideally suited for the small forward position. For most teams, that situation would result in disaster. For Ohio State, the result was an NCAA Tournament berth, which was due in no small part to Mr. Turner's skills. Simply put, there is no better one-on-one player than Turner in the conference, and probably all of college basketball right now. He's quick and skilled enough to easily drive past big men, and he's tall and strong enough to shoot over smaller players. The "21" number on the back of his jersey is appropriate, considering that it usually takes 2 men to guard the 1 Mr. Turner.
All of that attention devoted to stopping Turner opened things up for the rest of the Buckeye offense, one of the better shooting teams in the country. The 57.2 eFG for Thad Matta's team easily outpaced the league. The difference between Ohio State and the next best shooting team (Northwestern) was greater than the difference between Northwestern and the worst shooting team in the conference (Minnesota).
To be fair, a lot of that shooting came on a result of a play that has been summed up as "Mongo Go To Rim." There really isn't enough information out there to know if Mongo's replacement, Zisis Sarikopoulos (can't wait to see the 10 point font on that jersey), is equally adept with the skill of catch-ball-and-make-go-through-orange-circle, but based on his statline at UAB, we can probably expect a less aggressive player than Mullens, and probably less efficient at scoring when he does shoot.
That's not too much of a problem, however, considering how many other options are present in Columbus. David Lighty returns for his final season after missing most of last year with an injury, though his presence is mostly felt on the defensive end. Jon Diebler regained his shooting touch after a disastrous freshman season, making 46% of his 3-point attempts in conference play last year. However, the biggest piece of the puzzle returning alongside Turner is last year's Freshman of the Year, William Buford. Though he didn't get a lot of credit for it, Buford was every bit as efficient as, say, Eric Gordon was a year before:
Offensive Rating
Although they were different players style-wise (Buford is much more of a pure shooter than Gordon was), the efficiency and usage rates were quite similar. But there is one big difference -- Gordon never returned for his sophomore season (not that you could blame him, given the NBA millions and the circus in Bloomington at the time). Buford figures to improve on his freshman numbers, and he and Turner comprise the best duo in the Big Ten. In short, when this team doesn't turn the ball over, they will be extremely difficult to stop.
Defensively, however, Ohio State was mediocre, and this one I pin on Matta. For three seasons in a row, Matta has had two outstanding shotblockers in his starting rotation. Over that same time period, however, the defense has allowed opponents to make plenty of three point shots. That's excusable -- every defense has a weakness. What I don't understand is why Matta installs a zone defense that encourages opponents to play to OSU's weakness, rather than its strength. This season, Ohio State will again feature outstanding shotblocking talent. Whether or not the Buckeyes get any mileage out of it will depend on the scheme Matta goes with. And there are signs that some changes might be coming.
Regardless, because of this team's offensive ability, the only way this team misses the NCAA Tournament is if Evan Turner goes down (knock on that wood, Buckeye fans). Frankly, the talent and experience is there for this team to compete for the Big Ten title.
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I chugged along fine here for ten minutes, creeping up to 1,600 chips until my KA met a QQ on a JJJ flop. I was down to 310 chips after that and only lasted another three hands. 392nd place out of 1,198.
This was a no-guarantee game with 42 players. I had a good hand about half an hour in when I got eights full of fives on the river with Q8 to beat a flopped straight. I lost a lot of chips along with another player at the hour mark when each of us were holding jacks (J8 for him, J9 for me) and the flop rolled out 3J4. The spaded jack was first to act and went all-in for 1,605. The player between us called with another 760 behind and I re-raised to 3,210. A fourth player mucked but the second player to act called all-in, flipping over 44.
I was down to 1,655 and was lucky enough to get QQ on the next hand so I threw it in pre-flop. I was in the big blind (125/250/20), two players ahead of me had gone in for 750 and the raiser went all-in to push the caller out. The queens were heads-up against 99 but the flop went down 74JT8 and the nines straightened out. If only one of them had been on the board instead of the 4! Out in 11th place with no money.
Just had a little bit of money left in my Cake Poker account and put it into a ring game. Not only did my last hand of 77 get double-counterfeited by the Q898Q board, but the other guy had AA. – 135BB/100 hands.
Another classic example of me blowing the best position to bust out—or win a lesser prize, in this case. My first hand was a dreamy KK. I went to the flop after a re-raise and call with one other player. I got KA3 and made a doubled the pot with a bet of 555. He raised and I went all-in, getting a call. As I suspected, he had a very strong ace: QA but a pair was the best he could muster against my set and I was over 3,000 chips.
Only four hands later I was dealt QQ. A pair of cracked aces had eliminated another player, so there were two of us with stacks around the 3K level. I made a min-raise (to 40), got a call, was re-raised to 120, four-bet to 280 and got a call from the other raiser and we were heads-up. Once again I got a set on the flop: 58Q. I put out a tiny 60 chip bet into the pot of 620 to see if I could get a read and he raised to 800. He might have a flush draw or an over pair or another queen. Maybe a straight draw of some kind. I went all-in and got a call. He had a set with pocket 99. No 9 showed up so I was clear.
It was another set that cost me big. The table was down to five players. My stack was about 4,300, almost 1,500 ahead of anyone else. I was the big blind at 60/120 with a decent JT. The cutoff raised to 360 and I was the only caller. The flop looked very nice: T2T. I checked to see what he’d do and the bastard put out 780 to try to steal the thing from me! I put him all-in and he called. With AT. A 68 on the turn and river gave me four to a flush but that was how I lost 2,600 of my chips. I never managed to get back in to the top two slots for a Step 2 ticket.
Live by the kings, die by the kings. My last hand in the match was KK. We were down to four players. Everyone playing was assured of at last a Step 1 ticket. I was the small blind at 100/200. UTG raised to 400. I put another 1,000 on top of that, leaving 780 behind, hoping to indicate some ambiguity and wanting to get more than the blinds and the raise. Big blind folded and I got a call. The flop was a worrisome J8T but I went all-in. I got a call (the player was the same one I’d lost my chips to earlier) and he showed 98. I was ahead through the 6 on the turn but the Q on the river did the deed. 4th place and a Step 1 ticket.
I don’t think there’s anything of note in the 111 hands I played in this cash game session. I almost recovered from a couple of 15-20BB losses. -4.5BB/100 hands.
JJ on the second hand here got me off to a good but unsustained start. I was over 2,000 almost immediately and the exact same hand ten minutes in put me past the 2,500 chip mark. I hovered around that point for about fifteen minutes, sank below 2,000 for twenty minutes, and very briefly managed to get up to 3,500 before slipping back down to starting stack territory (albeit at a somewhat higher blind level). 54 minutes, 78 hands, 11th place, no prize.
I’d been curious about the dynamics of these Early Ante tournaments. I didn’t find this one appreciably different from a standard tournament, the antes just aren’t large enough to make much of a difference when people are doing things like going all-in. At the early stages, the antes are slightly larger than the big blind but you’re talking less than 1% of the starting stack size with a 3K stack and blinds of 10/20/3. In the last level I played of this tournament (150/300/25) it’s no different than a regular tournament.
I took a big hit on the first hand of this game with a K7 in UTG position. I limped, UTG+1 limped, the cutoff raised to 100, both blinds called and we limpers went for the ride. The flop was T58 and everyone checked. The turn was 9, giving me an up or down straight draw. The small blind made a pot-sized bet of 524 and I was the only caller. The river was a useless 5, we both checked, and he turned over a 97. A king would have given me a better pair but my straight would have just been a draw.
I doubled up to 4,500 with AA twenty-five minutes in when KK had some bad timing. Forty minutes of languishing at the same level followed, with the inevitable minor ups and downs. Then with AT in my hand in the big blind at 50/100/10, five players limped in to a flop of ATJ. Possible Broadway straight, a flush draw, top pair with an extra pair for me. I checked after the small blind, the hijack position bet 690 with 2.300 more behind. The button called, the small blind folded, and I re-raised to 2,000 to give them something to think about. Hijack went all-in for 3,020 with everyone but me folding. 7,420 in the pot, he had JT, much to my relief and no jack appeared on the turn or river. I was over 9K and in the top 100 stacks.
A QA cost me 1,500 and smaller amounts of less than half that on decent, ill-timed hands, but the blinds and antes ground away at my stack until I was down to about 3,200 at the two-hour mark. There were about 320 players left out of more than 1,100 but only 108 payouts. I got 9K in UTG+2 and called (150/300/25) after action folded to me. The button raised to 1,200 and the blinds folded. He’d been fairly active, so I raised him all-in (3,309) thinking he might be trying a steal. He called, though, apparently feeling good about his 8T (he did have another 11.5K). I was ahead all the way. The next hand played out almost exactly the same way, except for the part where he had a crummy hand. I was out in 315th place of 1,139.
Typically, I don’t enter these more than once (and I’d never play multiple entries simultaneously) but my first entry into this evening’s MM! ended so heinously I had to go in again. I took a big hit on hand six with AT. I was in the big blind, heads up for a pot of just 180 chips with J29 on the flop. I bet 45, my opponent raised to 120, I called and the turn was Q. I put out 120 to test the waters—I had 1,200 behind—he raised to 420 (the “pot smoker raise”) and I called. 3 on the turn. I had nothing and folded when he went all-in. He flashed 4A after collecting his 1,260 profit. OK. I still had 900.
Three hands later. 8J. Heads-up again to the flop. 5T9. Up-and-down straight draw. Flush draw. Opponent checks to me, I raise 120 and get a call. T on the turn. Made flush, up-and-down straight flush draw. Opponent bets 180. He could have a higher flush, pocket nines or fives or ten-nine/five combos for a full house, four tens, or any number of drawing hands. I go all-in. He calls with KQ. Then the 4 shows on the river and his flush beats me.
Eight hands of humiliation wasn’t enough. I started another entry but ended up waiting nearly five minutes for the blinds to get to me to play. Cards are uncooperative and I’m down to 1,245 about thirty-five minutes into the game when I get TT. Blinds are at 80/160, UTG limps in and as UTG+1, I raise to 480. The small blind raises to 1,280 and the two stacks between us get out. I have to go all-in to call. He flips over QA but the board doesn’t cooperate with him, giving me a full house of fives over tens: 755K5. Two hands later the same player gets it all back with interest. I have KK in the big blind. Hijack goes all-in for 200. The guy I tangled with before is in the cutoff and calls, the small blind folds, and I raise to 1,000. There’s a call from the cutoff. The K32 flop gives me a set and I raise all-in. Cutoff goes all-in for less, leaving me 755 in the hole. 6 shows on the turn and 7 on the river. Cutoff has TQ for a backdoor flush and takes a pot of 4,390.
A K4 doubles me up with a flopped set of 4s a little later but spades fail me on the next had and I lose everything trying to triple up on a three-way all-in with A8 against TT and 77. The flop misses everyone and the tens win.
My first entry went out in 2,314th place. The second was 1,500th.
This was my “good” outing for the day. I entered rather late: nearly forty minutes in with blinds already at 60/120. My third hand, I was on the button with KT. There were two limpers ahead of me. I called and the small blind was in. The flop didn’t look good for me with 42A but everyone checked and I was the last to act, so I checked. The 8 on the turn improved my hand a bit and when the action folded around to me again I bet 320. I got one caller from a large stack to my immediate right. The 6 gave me the nut flush and when I bet 560 after a check the big stack folded.
I blew 300 entering a contest with 86 when one of the short stacks at the table was about to get knocked out. Missed the flop entirely and when the bets and raises started flying I folded. Eventually, two players fell to pocket AA held by the guy on my immediate left. I picked up about 1,200 with a 600 chip post-flop bet my next turn in the big blind holding T5 on a 7K2 board.
Clubs did well by me a little bit later, as well. I was in UTG+2 with 9K with blinds at 250/500/50. I called, as did UTG+3. The giant stack in the big blind checked. The flop was J7K and my 1,000 bet folded the other two players. The next hand I was dealt QA. I raised to 1,000 and the player to my left went all-in for 3,747 with only 2,200 in the pot. I had him covered by just over 1,000 and I called; he flipped AK. The board gave him a king on the river but with J56TK that was actually the last card he wanted to see, because it made my Broadway straight. I took a bounty and nearly 5K in profit to put me over 9,750.
A T9 combo just a couple of hands later in the big blind went up against a couple of limpers. I had nothing on the 65Q flop and both I and the other players checked it through. The T on the turn was interesting, although it could have been a real pain as I found out. I checked again but the first player after me bet 1,199 with 8,122 behind. There was a call from the button and I raised to 3,000. The original raiser folded but the button went all-in to call. 8J, so I wasn’t looking for another spade. The K on the river was wonderfully safe for my pair of tens and I got another bounty.
I pushed as high as 20K but had some setbacks and was down to about 12K by the end of my first hour in the game. 88 came to me on the button in the 800/1,600/200 level. There was an all-in raise of just under 10K, an all-in call for about 2,500, and a call from me with the blinds folding. The flop was a less-than-pleasing K59 but an 8 on the turn made it all good, even with A on the river. I took the 26K pot and two more bounties. Shortly after that—in the 1,000/2,000/250 level—the Mutant Jack appeared in its AJ avatar. I raised to 4,000 as UTG+1. UTG+2 re-raised all-in to 11,280, about half my stack. Everyone else folded and I called. We were interleaved, he turned over KQ. I got a A on the flop and nothing else mattered except the bounty and the 27K pot, which put my total up to 43.5K.
Those were the last of the good days though. I played forty more hands in the match and lost money on all but two of them to antes (from 250 to 600 per hand), blinds (3,000/6,000 by my last hand), or contests (just eight hands). My next-to-last hand I started with less than 10K (after losing 5,600 on the big blind with 74) and 9A. Not usually a hand I push with, but I was down to less than two big blinds. UTG, sitting on far from the largest stack at the table with 60K, raised to 15K. Action folded to my paltry stack of 9,300 (with 2,500 already in for the small blind) and I went all-in. It was a race against 66 but I caught my A on the turn.
I was out on the next hand, though, calling an all-in from a 92K stack with a better ace kicker than my 9.
Five bounties and a small cash for an ROI of 271%. 95th out of 1,774 entries.
Posted on Wednesday, 23 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
Tomer’s made it into Day 2 of EPT Copenhagen after a rough start that dropped him from a bit over the starting stack of 30,000 chips to less than 10,000. He recovered, but he’ll be going into a new day down 700 from where he began, in 189th place out of 262 players left, with the average stack at 51,400 and blinds beginning at 500/1,000/100.
Update: As of the first count of Day 2, Tomer had chipped up to 74K.
Update 2: During other events I’ve tried to do a little bit of research about the table draws on Day 2 and beyond, but hadn’t been able to find tables. Just ran across the Day 2 draws for Copenhagen now, quite a bit late.
Martin Hansen (Denmark). About $50K in tournament winnings, all in the past couple of years. Fourth place in an EPT London side event; 102nd in the EPT London Main Event. 81,000 chips to start.
Michael La Masse (USA). No records. 17,700 chips.
Daniel Lundgren (Sweden). $21K for 4th place in the Malmo Open last August. 67,000 chips.
Jon Spinks (UK). $35K in winnings. Two fifth place finishes for $15K each: a side event at EPT San Remo and UKIPT Brighton. 30,600 chips.
Mike Erst (Ukraine). No records. 32,300 chips. Busted out in this report.
Afshin Alikhani (Norway). No records. 58,900 chips.
Daniel Pettersen (Norway). A 12th place finish for $6,600 in Prague in August. 102,400 chips.
Giacomo Maisto (Italy). $31K in winnings since August in EPT Main Events at Vilamoura (53rd place) and Vienna (20th). 56,800 chips.
Kristian Moller (Denmark). No records. 62,400 chips.
Update 3: According to the latest chip count, Tomer’s been busted. Then again, so is just-back-from-retirement WSOP Main Event winner and Copenhagen hometown fave Peter Eastgate.
Posted on Tuesday, 22 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
Puffmammy Tournament 19 (1,500 chips)
This seemed to be going okay at first. My goal for the night was to bust out later than D, who took the POY lead away from me last event but was only a point ahead. He was seated two seats to my left at the second—six-handed—table at the beginning of the event. I was holding my own until the player between us wiped out the first of six (out of thirteen total) players she’d eliminate before she won first place. After that, the dynamics changed a lot, and I got over-extended on one particular straight draw that she bluffed me out of on the turn. I was close to dead after that and since it was after the end of re-buys I went out ignominiously in twelfth place. D made it to the money and extended his lead to twelve points. That means no skipping out to attend Stan Ridgway’s concert at Mississippi Studios on March 7th if I want to maintain a chance to win by the series’s end in May.
This tournament didn’t work as an attempt to clear the taste of my earlier loss at the live game from my mouth by getting back on the Steps. I won a hand with JT, lost twice as much with QA, then played JQ on the tenth hand from UTG and got a Q32 flop. There was only 120 in the pot and the small blind bet out 120, I re-raised to 300, he three-bet to 480 and I called. A T hit on on the turn and he went all-in. I stupidcalled and he flipped over Q3 for two pair and a flush draw. The A nailed the coffin shut.
My initial outing here went well for the first hour. I got AJ about thirty-five minutes into the game and pushed hard on a player on the other end of the table who I figured had flopped kings and tens. I just had a gutshot straight draw on the flop but another ace on the turn scared him off when I raised, putting me up about 3,000 from the starting stack, overall. He wasn’t happy when I showed my hand, and shortly thereafter he had to re-buy.
I took the same player out on the last hand before the break with another Mutant Jack: AJ.
The second hour didn’t go so well, however. I only got a couple of good hands; everyone folded on a raise with AKo, and then a big blind special of AK met an extremely ugly flop and I folded. I can’t even remember my last hand, but it came not too long before the end of the second hour, at the final table. Seventh place out of eighteen, three positions short of the money.
Posted in General Poker, Live Games, Tournaments | Tagged aces, Encore Club, Full Tilt, Mississippi Studios, Mutant Jack, player of the year, puffmammy, Stan Ridgway, Steps
Posted on Monday, 21 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
Full Tilt $2,500 Guarantee (1,500 chips)
Nothing to see here. There were almost 3,700 entrants at the time I busted out. I took an early hit with a A6 that didn’t pan out. An 87 paired the eight on the flop to put me back over the starting stack. I more than doubled up with TT, beating a pair of nines to make it to nearly 4,000 chips twenty minutes into the game. Twenty minutes later, a different suited ace combination (A8) flushed through on the turn to beat a pair of kings.
I was mostly quiet after that, staying between 4,000 and 5,000 chips until just after the first hour of play, when a far weaker A3 combo lost out to A9 that got four clubs on the board. All-in against a larger stack with three clubs on the flop? What was I thinking? Out in 794th place.
Very quiet for the first quarter-hour. I get a couple walks for 15 chips apiece but give it away. A couple of small opening raises go bye-bye when the flop fails to cooperate. Then I get 66 in the small blind (at 20/40) with action folded around to me and only seven seated at the table. I min-raise and get a call from the big blind. The board has three over cards—including a king and queen—to my pair and the big blind keeps firing off small bets but I take the 480 in the pot when he has a pair of twos. The next hand I eliminate a player and make a profit of 1,460 when the bottom end of my AQ pairs on the flop. QA on the very next hand only makes me 40. Then it’s quiet until about the 50-minute mark when I have AK. I min-raise to 200 from UTG+2 (with eight players), getting calls from both blinds. The flop is A49, the blinds check and I open with 600. Small blind raises to 1,200, big folds, and I three-bet all-in. Big mistake. Small blind not only has me covered but he’s got 9A. two more clubs show on the board, and if that king had been a club it would have been real nice, but I’m out in 1,703rd place out of 2,016. Pathetic showing.
When I said I would never play another Super Turbo so long as I lived, I should have specified that only idiots play Super Turbos. I am an idiot. Five hands. I’m in my first big blind (there’s 10% of my starting stack right there). I’ve got a wretched J4 but lo and behold the flop is Q23. I know that if I can double up or just grab some chips in this early stage I’ll be a lot better off when the blinds go up on the next hand. I bet the pot to open (90), get re-raised by UTG+1 (the only other player in except for the small blind) and the small blind folds. I shove and UTG+1—who’s already taken out one of the players at the table so he has the bog stack— calls, showing K9. Finished 82 of 99.
Full Tilt $2,500 KO Guarantee (2,000 chips)
I’ve taken a run at this low buy-in event a few times in the past without any luck. Bustouts in just four and six hands, half an hour at the best. Last night things clicked—at least for a while.
I was below the starting stack for most of the first ten minutes then managed to avoid having a pair of sevens suck out with a flush on my pair of queens and picked up 900 chips.
My first big win was pushing all-in with A3. Action had folded around to the button, who raised to 480 at the 80/160 level. Small blind folded. I had the button covered by 900 chips (out of 3,200) and my all-in was called. Up against KQ and an A came on the flop. Things were a little worrisome with a turned J but the river was safe and I got my first bounty. I picked up another 960 on the next hand with Q9 that made it to a king-high straight on the turn.
I made a move about 25 minutes later holding QA on the button at 80/160/25. Two players ahead of me were in for 480 and I called, with the big blind following along. The flop was 4AJ. The big blind checked, the next player (UTG+3) bet 755 and the hijack called. I went all-in for 3,875. All thee following players had me covered by 500 to 9,000 chips but everyone folded and I picked up 3,270 to put me over 7,500.
An hour-and-a-half into the game and I’d lost several hands, dropping down to 4,500 with blinds at 200/400/50. My hand on the button was a somewhat less-than-sterling KT. UTG+1 limped, UTG+2 raised to 800, hijack called, I called, as did the blinds, and UTG+1 matched the raise, so the pot held 5,250 prior to the flop. The flop was 957. Nobody had put in 800 with 68, apparently, because everyone checked to the turn, which was 8. UTG+2 bet 1,200 with the hijack calling and I took a stab at it with my four-card straight, raising all-in for 3,655. Everyone folded and I built up to 11,300.
I got knocked down to 5,300 with another KT combo. It was suited (KT) but slightly behind the JK at the end of a board that didn’t connect with either of us.
The same player gave most of the chips back on the next hand. Five players went to the flop, limping in at the 300/600/75 level. My hand was K5 and the flop was A42. UTG+2 bet 1,200, UTG+2 raised to 2,400, and once again on the button I re-raised all-in to 4,620. The blinds and UTG+2 folded, UTG+3 called, showing 9A, and the turn dropped a 3, completing the straight and putting me over 14,000.
The humdinger hand of the night was my second bounty. I had about 13,700 chips in UTG+1 and was dealt QA. We were still at 300/600/75; I raised to 1,200. UTG+3 went all-in for 11,460. Everyone folded to me and I called with him flipping over TT. Things were just about over with a Q5Q flop but 6Q on the river sealed the deal for a 13,000 profit.
I was the big stack at the table for the moment but lost my next five entries into the pot, losing between 1,000 and 4,000 each try until I was down to 8,400. Blinds were nipping at everyone’s heels, at 600/1,200/150. KK fell into my hand in UTG+1. I raised to 3,000. The huge stack with 90K re-raised to 12,600. The button three-bet all-in to 28,297. Action folded to me and I called all-in for 8,259. The big stack called the three-bet. Big stack had KA, the other all-in (the same player I’d traded chips with above) had JJ. The board ran out TQ673 and I took just about 28K of the 68K pot. Two hands later I lost everything to the big stack, going out with a small cash in 207th place out of 3,401 entries after 150 minutes.
Sunday was the last day of the FTOPS tournaments, and early in the morning fresh off the KO tournament above I took a shot at a super satellite to the next-to-last event, a 6-max bounty tournament. The field grew to 61 entries by the end of registration, with five entries to the satellite, worth $55 each and two smaller cash awards.
Twenty minutes in I got my first break with KK in the cutoff. UTG picked up a ten on the flop to match their T8 for top pair and went all-in and I picked up the KO and 830 chips. I wiped out another small stack of 720 shortly after with QA vs. AT. AA against TT shortly thereafter made another bounty and put me over 4,000 chips. I took out two players (one with only 25 chips in the big blind) holding 88 when the board showed QKQ8Q.
Forty minutes in, I’d been knocked down to only about 2,500 chips again, losing 600-900 chips on hands like A6s and A9o. Kings served me well again when I doubled up through the big stack at the table to 7,700. Another bounty and 1,495 came my way with TT a few hands after that. I got a couple thousand more holding K6 when the board gave me a 9-high straight on the river and nobody contested my 1,000-chip bet into a pot of 3,270.
A key mistake came when the field was down to about ten players. The cutoff raised from 200/400/50 all-in to 4,105 and I was the only caller, holding QK and 6,200 chips behind. The all-in showed KA and he got aces full of kings by the end of the hand.
Still, I was in the top five, on track to get a ticket to the satellite until I called another all-in by the same player five minutes later. My 66 against his QQ. Out in 7th place with an award about 1.5 times the buy-in and seven bounties, bringing the ROI to 169%.
Posted in General Poker, Tournaments | Tagged 6-max, bounty, flush, FTOPS, full house, Full Tilt, it was suited, Midnight Madness, pair, quads, queens, satellite, Steps, straight
Posted on Sunday, 20 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
My memory is so very fickle. People all around me recount stories of hands they’ve played earlier in the day or a year ago and I can barely remember which two cards are under my protector. Every round of betting I have to check what I’ve got: “What ranks? What suits?” Sometimes people razz me with: “What? Did you forget what you have?” Truth be told, that’s not unlikely. Even if I know I have AA or AK, I might not remember what suites they are. Maybe I’m easier to read because I look at my cards so many times. Then again, if I don’t remember what they are, that might not be a very accurate read.
Either way, it makes putting together detailed accounts of my live tournament games rather difficult for me, particularly if I wait a day or two and if I play two or three similar events in close succession. No hand history file to fall back on, no record in Poker Tracker.
Anyway, this game was a night game. I know that sometime before the first table break, a player on the second table vomited (I was on table three) mostly into a garbage pail. The initial scuttlebutt was that he’d taken a particularly bad beat, later I heard that he’d either had a couple of drinks before playing or gotten some bad food. All I know is that there was a general consensus among the players who were headed to table two when tables were consolidated shortly afterward that they did not want to be sitting in or near that seat. One of the players at our table actually missed a big blind hand because he had stepped away from the stink.
I made it through the first break but not as long as the second.
Another second-hour bust-out. This one was notable because one of the players on the far end of the table was someone I’d seen in previous tournaments and who was acknowledged by others around me as pretty good. I’d sat next to him before and been my usual pleasant self, but his demeanor to me had always been kind of bluff. Not that I thought he was friendlier to anyone else.
I’d heard from someone else previously that he was good enough to have drawn the attention of someone who’d staked him to play in Vegas, so I asked him if he had been playing down there recently and just got shut down with what seemed like an annoyed response. A simple “no” would have sufficed.
We were involved in a couple of big hands. I pulled a suited ace of clubs and four-bet him on the flop when two more clubs showed up. He was sitting on a slightly larger stack than mine and really pushed hard on the non-club turn, and I folded, then he showed a king-high garbage and and made a comment about not letting flush draws shove him around.
A bit later, I got AA in late position. The big blind was something like 200 and there were five or six limping to the flop, including myself. The flop had another A on it, as well as a 7. Action came around to me and I bet something like 600, then Mr. Stoneface doubled that to 1,200. Everyone else ditched and I called. I don’t remember what the turn or river cards were but the bets escalated until I went all-in and he called, showing pocket sevens. People were flabbergasted that I’d slow-walked the aces through the pre-flop betting. Stoneface pronounced that he knew I had a good hand, he could see it in my eyes when I looked at him, and I said out loud that he was a good enough player to know that I was always playing with good hands, but I left unsaid the fact that he obviously didn’t know how good a hand I had. He was nearly felted at that point and had to re-buy shortly thereafter. But he was still in the tournament when I was busted in 13th place.
Posted on Thursday, 17 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
I played quiet and slow during the first hour. I’d picked up a couple of big pots, then lost a bunch when I chased down the top pair on the flush from the big blind. Unfortunately, the flush was 345, and a couple of major over cards showed up on the turn and river. I’d called about 1,600 in raises but when the guy to my left raised 1,000 on the river I let him take it down even though there was several thousand on the table and a call would only have cost me another 20% or so of my stack. He flipped over A6 for ace-high just to rub it in for everyone who’d contributed.
The last hand before the first break, one of the guys across from me was itching to rebuy and I picked up a respectable TJ. Blinds were at 200/400 and there were several callers but the itchy guy raised to 1,200. A couple dropped out, seeing where this was going, but I matched the raise. The flop was a dreamy 89Q. He bet another 1,200 and I called. The turn was the Q, giving me the first straight flush I can ever remember getting in live play. I was pretty sure I’d won the hand by that point, so when he went all-in it was an easy call. He was pretty flabbergasted with his Q9. After he’d rebought and returned to the table after the break we were talking about the hand and one of the other players had to point out to him that I’d had him beat from the flop; he hadn’t realized I’d made a straight to beat his two pair which turned into a full house.
Sadly, my last hand was well before the final table. I picked up AK, a couple of actors in the hand before me limped in for 600, then the player to my right went all in. The count was 6,900, leaving me with 100 behind. I called and we were heads-up. He turned over KK. There was an ace in the window on the flop. There was an A on the turn. I was crushing this dude’s kings! Then the river was a spade. A fourth spade on the board, to be exact, and that gave him a flush, which beat my set of aces. The 100 went in on the next hand for a pair of nines but a pocket pair of jacks scooped that up.
Chopped to the Felt
Posted on Thursday, 17 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
This was a match made in hell, or maybe it was limbo.
One of the players was taken out in the first few hands, doubling up the guy two seats behind me, but I got QQ on hand 9, pushing off another player with a 500 chip bet after the 646 flop and picking up a profit of 375 to put me in second.
Six hands later I get QQ. UTG min-raises to 120 and I make the same move I did with queens pre-flop before with a re-raise to 300. Everyone gets out of the way and UTG goes all-in. He’s got me covered but I call and he flips over QQ. The flop’s a rainbow, there’s no chance of a flush, and we make a big 45 chips each from the blinds.
I have to fold a couple of suited ace hands, including a Mutant Jack AJ when the flops don’t look good, and fifteen minutes in I’m down to seventh place with only 1,170 chips.
The blinds go through me, and have increased to 60/120 by the twenty-minute mark. I’m down to 8.5BB, there are still eight players, and I decide to play a marginal A6, after throwing away A6o the previous hand and eight hands earlier. I raise to 300 from UTG+1 and get a call from the big blind. The flop couldn’t be much better: K66. The big blind checks and I go all-in, getting a call. He’s got 6A, so we chop the small blind’s money and get 30 each.
The blinds are closing in on the next hand. I have 9A and raise to 300. The cutoff (the smallest stack) and big blind call. The flop is KTT and I try to bluff it with another all-in and the small stack calls. He’s got KQ. My nine pairs with 9 on the turn but the J river card gives him a straight and me nothing but 60 chips which disappear in the big blind on the next hand.
I won three showdowns in of 35 hands, had queens twice and three of a kind on the flop, but two of my three wins were essentially negated by draws. No ticket for this game. back to the bottom.
Posted on Wednesday, 16 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
Playing with the ticket I won earlier, I don’t manage to get ahead in the first fifty hands. A 3BB raise with JA early on just gets me the blinds; I pick up 150 with a 57 in the big blind when a couple of players limp in and the flop of 869 gives me a straight; AA in the small blind gets me 240. But when I push a smaller stack’s all-in with an all-in of my own holding AQ, he turns over TT and neither of my over cards connect. I manage to double up and get back as high as 1,150 before my 9A all-in is called and out-kicked by TA and I’m back at the foot of the steps.
Full Tilt $2,500 KO Guarantee (2,000 chips)
I like this little bounty tournament althoughI’m at a loss as to why. I’d have to check to see if I’ve picked up any bounties, and I know I haven’s cashed in it. It’s cheap and it’s there if I’m not playing Midnight Madness (or if I’ve busted out). I came into this edition late, with blinds already at 50/100, lost 333 on my first contested hand, and the rest of it only fourteen hands in when my KT got clobbered by QQ that would have had me beat even if my straight draw had come through.
I caught a very lucky KK just four hands in. UTG limped in for 30 and I raised from UTG+1 to 120. UTG+2 called, then everyone but UTG folded. The flop was 29T and UTG opened with 405. I shoved all-in, +2 folded like a good boy and UTG called for slightly less than I had. My kings beat his tens—although he was one card from a straight by the river—and I eliminated a player.
I stayed up over 3,000 as chip leader with some small induced folds, then had 87 on the button with five players left and blinds at 50/100. I’d slipped to second place, the big stack was in the small blind. UTG called, I called, and the small blind called for four players to the flop, which was T9Q. After checks from the blinds, UTG made a pot-sized bet and I doubled it. Straight flush here I come! The blinds dropped out and UTG went all-in for an amount that would leave me with only about 1,400. Naturally, I called. I got a straight with a 6 on the turn. The A still didn’t give me a flush but I was up to 5,300+. My own KT knocked another player out a little later when I flushed to beat not only his 66 which tripped up in the flop but a straight on the board: 73654.
I tried letting the two remaining players battle it out but they were taking so long the blinds ate away 1,500 of my 9,000 chips and I figured I’d better make my presence known when I could. I had about 6,600 in the small blind at 80/160, the big blind had 4,200 and the button had 2,700. I was dealt KA, the button made a min raise, I re-raised to 640, big blind folded, button called. The flop was a rather ugly 6KQ but I raised all-in and got a call. I had the better made hand but with QA it was far from over. Fortunately, diamonds are my best friend and the rest of the cards were 64. No flush, no more queens. Just a Step 2 ticket for me and guy in the big blind.
An early JJ pops me up to 2,000 but I nearly get felted 34 hands in when I get over-confident and call an all-in with AJ. The all-in turns out to be AK and I drop to 530 chips. It doesn’t help that the other ticket winner from the previous game is in this one and is either an ardent admirer or has a novel method of making me a target by appearing to be a sycophant, praising every win and warning people getting into hands with me that they’re going to be sorry. I manage to double up twice in the next eight hands, with a K5 that pairs the top card on the flop and then 88 in my pocket, each of which sets off a barrage of admiration and my own attempts to deflect.
I lose another big pot to the same player as before with an out-kicked king (he’s got KA this time) and have to build my way back up from the sub-1K region again. We’re down to five players, I have 1,160 in the big blind at 100/200 and I’m dealt AQ. The guy who’s been beating me is first to act with a call. My fanboy’s on the button with 1,925 and raises to 900. The small blind folds and I shove all-in. UTG raises all-in—he’s the largest stack by far with 5,875—and the button preserves his remaining 1,025 with a fold. When the cards flip UTG has TT but he’s in a bit worse shape when the flop shows Q89. Another Q on the turn closes just means he has fewer chances for a straight, but the 8 on the river makes my full house instead. I move from fifth place to second, with 3,320 chips. Another 88 gets me 600 more chips.
Then I spend twenty-five hands waiting for a good opportunity as my stack shrinks from 3,800 to 1,700. I have to make a move at 120/240 and get very lucky with an all-in from the small blind holding 2A. By the turn I have a six-high straight and the A9 of my nemesis is busted. (My fan is gone by this time, thankfully). After my double-up, nemesis and I are relatively even at around 3K while the chip leader is at 7K.
I’m able to push a little better with a larger stack and—frankly—a better run of cards. I creep slowly up through the 4,000s and into the 5K range while meanwhile my nemesis doubles through the chip leader. Now we’re even at about 5,250 while the former chip leader is just above 2,500.
I manage to bump up to more than 7K with 87 in the big blind at 200/400 with a rivered nine-high straight. The two other players are now at about 3K. The non-nemesis opponent goes all-in from the button when I have AQ and I go all-in. He’s got just 2A, the Q shows on the turn, and the match is over after seventy minutes including sixteen just three-handed (there are two winners, so there was no heads-up play).
This game looked rather grim. I’d made it to Step 3 before only to crash and burn. Sixty hands and thirty-five minutes in, with blinds at 50/100 and only five players left and I was under the starting stack. Then a KJ in the big blind met up with a QAT flop and I pushed everyone away from 1,850 chips with an all-in for my straight. On the small blind the next hand my JQ double-paired on the river of a AKJ9Q board. A little scary but the all-in forced another fold for a profit of 1,350.
Three hands later I had the same combo in slightly different suits: JQ. I was the first to act and limped in for 120; I was heads-up against the big blind. The flop was a pretty safe 6Q2. Big blind bet 180 and I called. The 9 didn’t look scary to me and I matched the bet of 400. I figured a KT could have me beat on when J showed on the river, but I matched the 1,570 all-in bet and when he showed 96 it was mine.
I maintained top position three-handed at about 7K, hoping my two opponents with 3,500 each would weaken each other, to no avail for ten minutes. Then I matched a 480 raise from the small blind while I was in the big blind holding T8. The 383 flop gave me two pair but I should have been more leery of the 480 post-flop bet. I raised all-in and was called by A3. An A on the turn just made it worse and I was reduced to 3,700. A couple of hands later my all-in call with JQ failed to improve and was beat by 66, putting me out with another chance at Step 3.
I re-raised a 3BB raise with AA ten minutes into this two-table match, inducing a three-bet all-in that I called. I was up against QQ and another ace showed on the flop, putting me in an early lead. I kept the lead as the table shrank through elimination and balancing to six players, then ran my TA into JA and lost 1,200 chips. A freak river 7 paired my A7 to wipe out a JA and put me over 5K. Then another four-flush struck when I stupidly contested the big stack’s big blind and I dropped from third place and a sure Step 4 ticket to sixth and Step 3 again.
Posted on Monday, 14 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
285 hands per hour. Is that too many? I play for 16 minutes, I hit 17.5BB/100 but I’ve been underwater most of the time.
I never manage to get above even over 12 minutes and a double-ended flush draw on the flop goes nowhere to knock me out.
My first hand and I can’t resist going all-in with KT on a flop of 6d 4c 5d]. Of course no more diamonds show and the best I have is a match to my ten on the river against pocket queens. I buy in with another entry and try to play it a bit close to the vest but when people are beating your K9 with 6T, it’s time to hang it up. OK, maybe I deserved to lose pushing with my 99 on a J66 board, but not to J7.
Full Tilt $2,500 KO Guarantee (2,000 chips)
Had a couple of successes but I was determined not to suffer the fate of my brash Madness! attempts. Unfortunately, after flopping a king-high straight in my first half-hour the cards dried up and I was blinded off from 4,000 down to about 2,500 over most of the course of my 100 minutes of play. A large stack with AJ put paid to my A5 and another player’s AK in one swoop.
I got into this half an hour in, at the 30/60 level but half the field had been eliminated already. That made the top stacks a bit difficult to catch but potentially my standing was closer to the money. I think that was probably an illusion though. Got knocked out with 8T in my hand and A5K on the flop. Guy to my left had 9Q for the nut flush.
First out. Straight got me.
Slow and steady wins the Step 2 ticket. I need to figure out what I’m doing here that I’m not doing elsewhere.
Posted on Monday, 14 February 2011 by Poker Mutant
So I realized where pokerterms.com had gone wrong in their evaluation of the so-called “computer hand” of Q7o.
As the legend has it and my own evaluator showed, Q7o is the hand just above the 50% mark in heads-up matches. Q7o has a very slight statistical edge (winning 50.56%) against random hands when the board runs out to the river. The entry for “Computer Hand” at pokerterms.com, however, claims that the Poker Stove application “Q-7 shows 51.77% equity versus a random hand.”
The problem arises from a misunderstanding by the folks at pokerterms.com of what Poker Stove calculates. As the Poker Stove FAQ itself states (emphasis added):
What does PokerStove calculate?
The values generated are all-in equity values. This is not the chance that a hand will win the pot. Rather it is the fraction of the pot that a hand will win on average over many repeated trials, including split pots.
So what we’ve got here is a sort of apples and oranges comparison. The “computer hand” specification is precisely about how often a hand will win. Poker Stove is making an entirely different evaluation.
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COACHING
ABOUT
E106 – Chala Dincoy | CEO and Founder of The Repositioning Expert
Chala Dincoy is the CEO and founder of Repositioning Experts, and as someone who helps B2B CEOs fix up their elevator pitches, she’s an expert on creating the perfect message to make the most sales. Now, she’s here to share her One Big Tip for finding your sales niche and bringing in the most money with your elevator pitch.
The perfect elevator pitch
Chala’s formula for an elevator pitch that works is simple: it should include who you help (if you do B2B sales, this is the industry you’re selling to. If you do B2C, it’s your interest group), what problem you solve for them, and what you do to solve the problem. This should be the most expensive and painful problem these businesses or individuals might experience because that’s what they will be most willing to pay for a solution to.
Chala says you should offer this concise elevator pitch any time your prospect is in front of you and asking what you do. This can be in person, or it can be virtual, which is more common these days– situations you may find yourself in lately, like virtual networking over zoom and virtual conferences, are the perfect opportunities to present your elevator pitch. Although 3 out of 4 business owners never get asked for their card after giving their pitch, a good one that follows Chala’s formula will always end with someone asking you for a way to talk to you, a meeting, or a business card. Perfecting your pitch is all about niching down and making sure you’re heard over all the other noise at these sorts of events.
Niching down into a pain point
Chala says that 70% of people purchase based on pain, while only 30% will make a purchase for improvement. This means that offering a solution to improve someone’s life won’t be nearly as effective as offering a solution to save someone’s life, she points out. That’s why it’s vital to niche down on an interest group and find the biggest pain point there. Then, use that as your hook. Chala offers a process for finding the most effective interest group and pain point: Start by writing down every interest group you can help and every problem you can solve for each one. Then, rate each one on a scale of 1-10, first based on your personal fit for these groups and issues based on your background, interest, and skill set; then based on how much money you could make by solving each problem. After you add your scores up, the next step is to actually talk to someone from those interest groups to check if your evaluations were accurate.
What is their most painful problem? What would they pay you to solve it? What would need to happen for them to hire you? Chala has found that even this research and information gather often results in sales. The key to this is offering a strategy session at the end of each conversation. During this strategy session, you can have a more in-depth conversation about the specific pain you’re addressing and what would happen if that pain is never solved, as well as the cost of not realizing the vision this pain is holding someone back from. Finally, you can offer your solution for that problem– Chala says you should “position yourself as the vehicle between pain and pleasure,” and that it will always end in a sale.
To connect with Chala and gain access to tons of training, programs, and interviews with B2B CEOs, join her private Facebook group and B2B CEO society at repositioner.com/society.
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Israeli forces demolish Palestinian homes in Jerusalem on 1 March 2021 [Mostafa Alkharouf/Anadolu Agency]
March 27, 2021 at 10:58 am
Israeli occupation authorities demolished and seized 26 Palestinian-owned structures in Area C of the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem between 2 and 15 March, the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) has reported.
As a result of these demolitions and seizures, 42 people were displaced, including 24 children, the Protection of Civilians report published by the UN OCHA disclosed.
Seventeen of the structures, and all of the displaced people, were recorded in Area C, which is under full Israeli military control.
OCHA confirmed that two buildings were demolished in Ein Shibli village, in the Nablus area, displacing 17 people on the basis of Military Order 1797, which allows for demolitions within 96 hours of the issuance of a "removal order".
The remaining displacement resulted from the demolition of four homes in Al-Tuwani and Khallet Athaba' communities in Hebron and Beit Jala in Bethlehem.
READ: Israel demolishes Bedouin village for 185th time
The livelihoods of 20 people were affected by the demolition of a vegetable stall near Qalqilya city, while 16 were affected by the demolition of two uninhabited houses and the confiscation of one metal container in Isteih in the Jericho area.
Meanwhile, Israeli settlers injured six Palestinians in the Hebron governorate and damaged Palestinian-owned property, including vehicles and trees. Four of the injured were physically assaulted in three incidents.
Two boys, aged 13 and 14, were injured in separate incidents in the H2 area of Hebron and the Bir al 'Idd area, respectively. In the latter incident, the donkey on which the boy was riding was stabbed.
According to Palestinian sources, Israeli settlers damaged at least five vehicles, a house and an agricultural structure in the villages of Jalud and Huwwara in the Nablus district, and Kafr ad-Dik and Bruqin in the Salfit district.
Unless otherwise stated in the article above, this work by Middle East Monitor is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 4.0 International License. If the image(s) bear our credit, this license also applies to them. What does that mean? For other permissions, please contact us.
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Wax nostalgic about and learn from the history of early electronics. See articles from Popular Electronics, published October 1954 - April 1985. All copyrights are hereby acknowledged.
While a bit far-fetched, this Carl & Jerry saga from the June 1963 issue of Popular Electronics magazine has the two amateur radio hobbyists cum detectives applying their knowledge of standing waves and an invention called SNARE, "Signal Net for Actuating Radio-sensitive Explosives," by Irwin Ehlmann, to thwart an assassination attempt on a visiting foreign dignitary. The name of the patent is actually "Method and apparatus for detonating radio frequency sensitive blasting caps," but the principal is the same. The choice by author John T. Frye of a halo antenna on their mobile shortwave rig was probably no coincidence given the guardian angel role it played in the adventure.
" ... see if you don't make out a pair of wires going down over the edge of the bluff ... "
The dew-washed June morning found Carl and Jerry testing out their super-duper Field Day radio station atop a high limestone bluff overlooking the river. Radio amateurs, on their annual Field Day, familiarize themselves with the operation of emergency radio equipment by competing to see which station can make the most contacts during a 24-hour period. The score made is multiplied substantially if the station is set up out in the "field" with no connection to commercial power lines.
Determined to run up a high score, the boys had two five-hundred-watt transmitters in the back of a station wagon borrowed from Carl's parents. One was a band-switching job that could be operated on all amateur bands from 75 through 10 meters. The other transmitter was for six meters only.
An all-band trap antenna had been swung between two trees for use with the band-switching rig. On Field Day, there would be a rotatable beam for the six-meter station, but today the boys intended to test the station out with a halo-type antenna mounted on the rear bumper of the station wagon.
A two-wheel trailer containing a husky 10-kw. gasoline-powered a.c. generator was hitched to the rear bumper of the station wagon. It was puttering away while Jerry hunkered down inside the station wagon connecting antennas, mikes, switches, relays, etc. Carl was outside playing around with a powerful, tripod-mounted, prism-type spotting telescope he had recently acquired.
Carl looked back along the steep, narrow, twisting dirt path up which the station wagon had clawed its way from the paved road running alongside the river down below. Then he raised the front of the telescope and looked across the river at the road running along the top of the bluff on that side.
"Hey, wonder why the law is so busy across the river," he called to Jerry. "I can see the sheriff's car and two state police cars cruising along over there."
"Didn't you look at last night's paper?" Jerry asked. "The president of a South American country is going to inspect a typical Midwest corn farm about two miles west of here on the other side of the river at ten this morning. It's feared political enemies from his country may try to kill him and so create an international incident. Naturally, our government intends to do everything possible to prevent anything of this nature. That's undoubtedly why the police are checking the route so carefully."
"So that's it," Carl muttered, swinging the telescope to the right and peering through a thin screen of bushes at the top of another limestone ridge a half-mile away on his side of the river. "Boy, this 'scope is really a honey," he remarked. "There are a couple of guys sitting over there on that other ridge, and I can see the buttons on their shirts. Wonder what they're doing. They seem to be just sitting there with a kind of funny-looking gasoline can between them. One of them keeps watching the road across the river through a pair of binoculars."
I'd like to answer personally all the wonderful cards, letters, and messages wishing me a quick recovery from my recent illness; but, as I'm sure you understand, that is virtually impossible; so I'm taking this means to thank all of you who sent them.
The good wishes and prayers mentioned in so many of these heart-warming messages must certainly have "worked," for I have recovered completely.
Writing future Carl and Jerry stories will be even more fun now that I know so many of you readers enjoy them. Thanks a million!
Note: This greeting was published in response to a notice of Mr. Frye's illness that appeared in the February 1963 edition of Popular Electronics.
Jerry slid out the back of the station wagon and came over for a look. "That's no gasoline can," he exclaimed; "it's a blasting-cap detonator! Look closely and see if you don't make out a pair of wires going from it down over the edge of the bluff to the road below and then across the road through some treetops and on down toward the river."
"Yeah," Carl agreed, "and those wires keep right on going across the river and up the bluff to that little culvert under the road over there. So help me: those jokers must be planning on blowing up the president when he crosses the culvert! We better go tell the police."
"There's no time," Jerry objected, looking at his watch. "The president's car should be along any minute now, and there isn't a farmhouse either way for two miles. By the time we got to a telephone it would be too late. I'm going to try to raise someone on seventy-five meters and have them call the police!"
The boys scrambled into the station wagon and fired up the bandswitching transmitter. Jerry pushed the button on the mike while he watched the meters on the front of the transmitter. A worried frown creased his forehead as he quickly rechecked the knob settings.
"Something's wrong," Jerry said.
"We're getting no drive to the final." Gingerly he raised the lid of the exciter and peered inside. "The driver tube is stone cold," he announced, "and we don't have a spare. The filament must have been jarred in two by the rough ride up here."
"Try the six-meter rig," Carl suggested, glancing nervously across at the empty highway on the other side of the river.
Jerry quickly put the high-frequency transmitter into operation and desperately called "QRRR," the amateur emergency distress signal. No sign of an answer was heard in the receiver.
Twice more he put out the distress call, with absolutely no results. "It's no use," he said as he snapped off the receiver and started unscrewing the coax cable antenna lead from the other transmitter. "No one monitors six meters around here this time of day. Our only chance is to get down there to where the wires cross the road and try to break them before the president comes along.
"You drive," he suggested hurriedly as he threw the end of the cable out the rear of the car, "and don't spare the horses."
"Hadn't we better uncouple the generator?" Carl asked as he climbed into the driver's seat.
"No time for that; get going!" Jerry urged.
The drive up that steep zigzagging path had been spine-tingling, but it was nothing compared to the ride down. Carl sent the station wagon hurtling along the narrow, twisting path while behind, the heavy generator, still humming away, bumped and jolted and careened first over on one wheel and then on the other, threatening to overturn at any instant. Somehow, though, they finally reached the black-topped road that paralleled the river.
Just as Carl made a tire-screeching right turn onto the road, Jerry glanced up at the top of the bluff directly across the river and uttered an exclamation.
"There's the motorcade now," he shouted. "See if you can gain a good lead on them before we reach the wires."
Carl tried. The accelerator was clear to the floor as the station wagon and the heavy trailer raced along the winding black-topped road, but the cavalcade across the river was also traveling at a fast clip on a stretch of highway that ran perfectly straight. As the station wagon neared the point where the wires should run across the road, it was obvious to both boys the scant 200-yard lead they had over the state police car leading the motorcade was not enough to give them time to locate the detonating wires, stop the car, get to a point where they could reach the wires, and cut them.
Carl kept taking quick upward glances as he let the car slow down. "There they are!" he said, pointing to where two inconspicuous wires crossed the road from one treetop to another. A glance was all that was needed to convince the boys that the wires were far too high to be reached even if they stood on top of the station wagon.
"Stop the car with the back bumper directly under the wires," Jerry called to Carl.
Carl slammed on the brakes, and the wagon came to a lurching stop with the halo antenna squarely underneath the twin strands of wire. Jerry threw full power into the six-meter transmitter, and he and Carl stared in sickening fascination at the rapidly closing gap between the motorcade and the mined culvert across the river.
Suddenly there was a muffled roar, and a fountain of dust and broken pieces of concrete erupted from the point where the highway crossed the culvert. As the rocks and chunks of concrete rained down into the river, causing splashes that reached almost halfway across, the boys saw the entire cavalcade brake to a halt a scant hundred yards from where the explosive had torn a gaping trench clear across the highway.
The boys leaped from their car and looked upward at the point where the wires disappeared over the top of the bluff above. Two dark-skinned faces silhouetted against the blue sky stared down at the boys and at a car parked at the side of the road not far away from the station wagon. After a few frozen seconds, the faces disappeared.
"That must be their getaway car," Carl exclaimed. "They probably will be afraid to try to get to it now with us here, but just to make sure we'd better take the rotor out of their distributor. They must really feel pretty sick about getting impatient and blowing up the culvert too soon."
"They didn't blow up the culvert; we did," Jerry corrected him.
"We what? You must have had your little gray cells jarred by that explosion. How could we have set off the dynamite, or whatever it was ?"
"We did it with r.f. from our six-meter transmitter. Radio frequency currents from the halo antenna induced similar currents in the wires leading to the dynamite caps. Standing waves on these wires produced heating in the caps and detonated them."
"So that's why you wanted "me to stop with the back of the car directly under the wires! What ever made you think of detonating the caps with r.f.?"
"Well, we both know it's dangerous to use transmitting equipment in an area where blasting is going on. We've seen highway signs warning against that sort of thing. And then I was reading a story recently about a patent that had been taken out to eliminate explosions on airplanes caused by bombs concealed in baggage. The apparatus is called SNARE, or Signal Net for Actuating Radio-sensitive Explosives. A man by the name of Irwin Ehlmann of Hatboro, Pennsylvania, is the inventor.
"The device consists of a 30-foot bombproof chamber with a conveyor belt running through it. Baggage on this belt is exposed to strong radio frequency waves of different wavelengths. These radio frequency waves will detonate any caps concealed in the baggage and so set off the explosive.
"When I realized we couldn't reach the wires in time, all this flashed through my mind. There wasn't anything else we could do; so it seemed worth a try-"
Jerry was interrupted by a wailing siren, and in a few seconds a state police car came to a stop behind the generator which was still sitting in the middle of the road. The police across the river had seen the wires leading across the water, and they had dispatched a cruiser to investigate. The officer, "Doc" Watson, was known to the boys, and they quickly explained to him what had happened. He relayed the information over his radio, and a net was quickly thrown up around the area.
"Those fellows will be picked up shortly," officer Watson prophesied. "They don't stand a ghost of a chance of getting away on foot.
"We all certainly owe you two a big debt of gratitude," he said then, "but I must admit I still can't understand how you set off that dynamite clear across the river without even touching the wires."
"Elementary induction, my dear Dr. Watson, elementary induction!" Carl replied with a teasing grin.
Carl Anderson and Jerry Bishop were two teenage boys whose love of electronics, Ham radio, and all things technical afforded them ample opportunities to satisfy their own curiosities, assist law enforcement and neighbors with solving problems, and impressing – and sometimes toying with - friends based on their proclivity for serious undertakings as well as fun.
Carl & Jerry: A Low Blow - March 1961
The Black Beast - May 1960
Pi in the Sky and Big Twist, February 1964
The Bell Bull Session, December 1961
Cow-Cow Boogie, August 1958
TV Picture, June 1955
Electronic Eraser, August 1962
Electronic Trap, March 1956
Geniuses at Work, June 1956
Eeeeelectricity!, November 1956
Anchors Aweigh, July 1956
Bosco Has His Day, August 1956
The Hand of Selene, November 1960
Feedback, May 1956
Abetting or Not?, October 1956
Electronic Beach Buggy, September 1956
Extra Sensory Perception, December 1956
Trapped in a Chimney, January 1956
Command Performance, November 1958
Treachery of Judas, July 1961
The Sucker, May 1963
Stereotaped New Year, January 1963
The Snow Machine, December 1960
Extracurricular Education, July 1963
Slow Motion for Quick Action, April 1963
TV Antennas, August 1955
Succoring a Soroban, March 1963
"All's Fair --", September 1963
Operation Worm Warming, May 1961
Dog Teaches Boy - February 1959
Joking and Jeopardy - December 1963
Santa's Little Helpers - December 1955
Two Tough Customers - June 1960
Transistor Pocket Radio, TV Receivers and Yagi Antennas, May 1955
Tunnel Stomping, March 1962
The Blubber Banisher, July 1959
The Sparkling Light, May 1962
Pure Research Rewarded, June 1962
A Hot Idea, March 1960
The Hot Dog Case, December 1954
A New Company is Launched, October 1956
Under the Mistletoe, December 1958
Electronic Eraser, August 1962
"BBI", May 1959
Ultrasonic Sound Waves, July 1955
The River Sniffer, July 1962
Ham Radio, April 1955
Wired Wireless, January 1962
Electronic Shadow, September 1957
Elementary Induction, June 1963
He Went That-a-Way, March1959
Electronic Detective, February 1958
Aiding an Instinct, December 1962
Two Detectors, February 1955
Tussle with a Tachometer, July 1960
Therry and the Pirates, April 1961
The Crazy Clock Caper, October 1960
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January 9, 2017 by dominiccummings
‘Politics is gambling for high stakes with other people’s money… Politics is a job that can be compared with navigation in uncharted waters. One has no idea how the weather or the currents will be or what storms one is in for. In politics, there is the added fact that one is largely dependent on the decisions of others, decisions on which one was counting and which then do not materialise; one’s actions are never completely one’s own. And if the friends on whose support one is relying change their minds, which is something that one cannot vouch for, the whole plan miscarries… One’s enemies one can count on – but one’s friends!’ Bismarck.
‘The most important thing is not to fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool.’ Feynman.
In January 2014 I left the Department for Education and spent the next 18 months away from politics. A few days after the 2015 election I wrote a blog about Michael Gove’s new job touching on the referendum. When I wrote it I assumed I would carry on studying and would not be involved in it. About ten days later I was asked by an assortment of MPs, rich businessmen, and campaigners including Matthew Elliott to help put together an organisation that could fight the referendum. I was very reluctant and prevaricated but ended up agreeing. I left my happy life away from SW1 and spent eight weeks biking around London persuading people to take what was likely to be a car crash career decision – to quit their jobs and join a low probability proposition: hacking the political system to win a referendum against almost every force with power and money in politics. In September we had an office, in October ‘Vote Leave’ went public, in April we were designated the official campaign, 10 weeks later we won.
Why and how? The first draft of history was written in the days and weeks after the 23 June and the second draft has appeared over the past few weeks in the form of a handful of books. There is no competition between them. Shipman’s is by far the best and he is the only one to have spoken to key people. I will review it soon. One of his few errors is to give me the credit for things that were done by others, often people in their twenties like Oliver Lewis, Jonny Suart, and Cleo Watson who, unknown outside the office, made extreme efforts and ran rings around supposed ‘experts’. His book has encouraged people to exaggerate greatly my importance.
I have been urged by some of those who worked on the campaign to write about it. I have avoided it, and interviews, for a few reasons (though I had to write one blog to explain that with the formal closing of VL we had made the first online canvassing software that really works in the UK freely available HERE). For months I couldn’t face it. The idea of writing about the referendum made me feel sick. It still does but a bit less.
For about a year I worked on this project every day often for 18 hours and sometimes awake almost constantly. Most of the ‘debate’ was moronic as political debate always is. Many hours of life I’m never getting back were spent dealing with abysmal infighting among dysfunctional egomaniacs while trying to build a ~£10 million startup in 10 months when very few powerful people thought the probability of victory was worth the risk of helping us. (Two rare heroes who put up a lot of their own money and supported the team were Peter Cruddas and Stuart Wheeler.) Many of those involved regarded their TV appearances as by far the most important aspect of the campaign. Many regarded Vote Leave as ‘the real enemy’.
It is hard to explain the depth of TV derangement that gobbles up SW1 souls. Much of politics involves very similar tragi-comic scenes re-created by some of the basic atoms of human nature – fear, self-interest and vanity. The years, characters, and contexts change, the atoms shuffle, but the stories are the same year after year, century after century. Delusions and vanity dominate ‘rationality’ and ‘public service’. Progress, when it comes, is driven by the error-correcting institutions of science and markets when political institutions limit the damage done by decision makers at the apex of centralised hierarchies. It rarely comes from those people, and, when it does, it is usually accidental or incidental to their motives.
Discussions about things like ‘why did X win/lose?’ are structured to be misleading and I could not face trying to untangle everything. There are strong psychological pressures that lead people to create post facto stories that seem to add up to ‘I always said X and X happened.’ Even if people do not think this at the start they rapidly construct psychologically appealing stories that overwrite memories. Many involved with this extraordinary episode feel the need to justify themselves and this means a lot of rewriting of history. I also kept no diary so I have no clear source for what I really thought other than some notes here and there. I already know from talking to people that my lousy memory has conflated episodes, tried to impose patterns that did not actually exist and so on – all the usual psychological issues. To counter all this in detail would require going through big databases of emails, printouts of appointment diaries, notebooks and so on, and even then I would rarely be able to reconstruct reliably what I thought. Life’s too short.
I’ve learned over the years that ‘rational discussion’ accomplishes almost nothing in politics, particularly with people better educated than average. Most educated people are not set up to listen or change their minds about politics, however sensible they are in other fields. But I have also learned that when you say or write something, although it has roughly zero effect on powerful/prestigious people or the immediate course of any ‘debate’, you are throwing seeds into a wind and are often happily surprised. A few years ago I wrote something that was almost entirely ignored in SW1 but someone at Harvard I’d never met read it. This ended up having a decisive effect on the referendum.
A warning. Politics is not a field which meets the two basic criteria for true expertise (see below). An effect of this is that arguments made by people who win are taken too seriously. People in my position often see victory as confirmation of ideas they had before victory but people often win for reasons they never understand or even despite their own efforts. Cameron’s win in 2015 was like this – he fooled himself about some of the reasons why he’d won and this error contributed to his errors on the referendum. Maybe Leave won regardless of or even despite my ideas. Maybe I’m fooling myself like Cameron. Some of my arguments below have as good an empirical support as is possible in politics (i.e. not very good objectively) but most of them do not even have that. Also, it is clear that almost nobody agrees with me about some of my general ideas. It is more likely that I am wrong than 99% of people who work in this field professionally. Still, cognitive diversity is inherently good for political analysis so I’ll say what I think and others will judge if there’s anything to learn.
Apologies for the length but I didn’t have time to make it shorter. The next ones will be short.
Reality has branching histories, not ‘a big why’
Much political analysis revolves around competing simple stories based on one big factor such that, in retrospect, ‘it was always clear that immigration would trump economic interest / Cameron’s negotiation was never going to be enough / there is an unstoppable populist tide’, and so on. Alternatives are quickly thought to have been impossible (even if X argued the exact opposite repeatedly). The big event must have had an equally big single cause. Confirmation bias kicks in and evidence seeming to suggest that what actually happened would happen looms larger. People who are quite wrong quickly persuade themselves they were ‘mostly right’ and ‘had a strong feeling’ unlike, of course, the blind fools around them. Soon our actual history seems like the only way things could have played out. Brexit had to happen. Trump had to win.
You see these dynamics all the time in historical accounts. History tends to present the 1866 war between Prussia and Austria as almost inevitable but historians spend much less time on why Bismarck pulled back from war in 1865 and how he might have done the same in 1866 (actually he prepared the ground so he could do this and he kept the option open until the last minute). The same is true about 1870. When some generals tried to bounce him into a quick preventive war against Russia in the late 1880s he squashed them flat warning against tying the probability of a Great Power war to ‘the passions of sheep stealers’ in the Balkans (a lesson even more important today than then). If he had wanted a war, students would now be writing essays on why the Russo-German War of 1888 was ‘inevitable’. Many portray the war that broke out in August 1914 as ‘inevitable’ but many decisions in the preceding month could have derailed it, just as decisions derailed general war in previous Balkan crises. Few realise how lucky we were to avoid nuclear war during the Cuban Missile crisis (cf. Vasili Arkhipov) and other terrifying near-miss nuclear wars. The whole 20th Century history of two world wars and a nuclear Cold War might have been avoided if one of the assassination attempts on Bismarck had succeeded. If Cohen-Blind’s aim had been very slightly different in May 1866 when he fired five bullets at Bismarck, then the German states would certainly have evolved in a different way and it is quite plausible that there would have been no unified German army with its fearsome General Staff, no World War I, no Lenin and Hitler, and so on. The branching histories are forgotten and the actual branch taken, often because of some relatively trivial event casting a huge shadow (perhaps as small as a half-second delay by Cohen-Blind), seems overwhelmingly probable. This ought to, but does not, make us apply extreme intelligent focus to those areas that can go catastrophically wrong, like accidental nuclear war, to try to narrow the range of possible histories but instead most people in politics spend almost all their time on trivia.
We evolved to make sense of this nonlinear and unpredictable world with stories. These stories are often very powerful. On one hand the work of Kahneman et al on ‘irrationality’ has given an exaggerated impression. The fact that we did not evolve to think as natural Bayesians does not make us as ‘irrational’ as some argue. We evolved to avoid disasters where the probability of disaster X happening was unknowable but the outcome was fatal. Rationality is more than ‘Bayesian updating’. On the other hand our stories do often obscure the branching histories of reality and they remain the primary way in which history is told. The mathematical models that illuminate complex reality in the physical sciences do not help us much with history yet. Only recently has reliable data science begun to play an important role in politics.
Andrew Marr wrote recently about the referendum with a classic post facto ‘big event must be caused by one big factor’ story:
‘Connected to this is the big “why?”. I don’t think we voted to leave the EU because of clever tacticians or not-quite-clever-enough pollsters, or even because Johnson decided that one of his columns was better than another. I think we voted to leave because so many British people had been left behind economically and culturally for so long, and were furious about it; and because, from the 2008 financial crisis onwards, they had accumulated so much contempt for the political elites. In these circumstances any referendum narrows down to a single question: “Are you happy with the way things are?” The answer was “no”.’ Andrew Marr, October 2016.
‘The big why?’ is psychologically appealing but it is a mistake. In general terms it is the wrong way to look at history and it is specifically wrong about the referendum. If it were accurate we would have won by much more than we did given millions who were not ‘happy with the way things are’ and would like to be out of the EU reluctantly voted IN out of fear. Such stories oversimplify and limit thinking about the much richer reality of branching histories.
Branching histories in 2016: three powerful forces, many possible campaigns
Sometimes the outcome of a vote is clear before a campaign starts such that it is reasonable to say ‘the campaign didn’t matter’ other than in the negative sense that, provided it avoids huge disasters, the twists and turns, the exact messages and adverts, thousands of decisions taken and so on very likely had no impact on the binary outcome. For example, Reagan’s re-election campaign in 1984 or Blair’s re-election campaign in 2001 were campaigns like this. Both won by so much and were clearly predicted by very large and historically very unusual poll leads well in advance. It is not plausible to say that the weeks of campaigning affected who won. At most the campaigns affected the scale of victory.
The referendum was not like this. Throughout the second half of 2015 and the beginning of 2016 the averages of polls – the only sensible way to look at polls – showed clear IN leads. All polls showed significant shifts towards Leave in the last five weeks (then a shift towards Remain at the end but this was at least partly because London-based pollsters changed their methodology thinking that they were making them more accurate – they fooled themselves). Polls tracking deeper attitudes that had been consistent for years suddenly changed in the last few months in ways that were significant given the close outcome. Recent claims that the polls ‘really’ showed Leave ahead all the time should be taken with very large pinches of salt given their dodgy statistical claims, charlatan authors like Matt Goodwin (who treats data dishonestly), and the inherent impossibility of discovering the truth of such a question.
One example from our private ICM polls (I will post the data tables for all these): Vote Leave asked people to choose between these options regularly to probe attitudes to the EU that are more informative than just the referendum question. The 11 point gain for ‘strong out’ is much bigger than the margin of error, is supported by other data, and is clearly significant.
The cold reality of the referendum is no clear story, no ‘one big causal factor’, and no inevitability – it was ‘men going at it blind’. The result was an emergent property of many individual actions playing out amid a combination of three big forces (see below). Many of these actions were profoundly nonlinear and interdependent and the result that we actually witnessed was very close. If about 600,000 people – just over 1% of registered voters – had decided differently, IN would have won. This is a small enough margin that it could easily have happened if quite a few specific events and decisions had turned out differently. If just one person had behaved differently the dominant story now would be ‘the economy was always going to trump a revolt against the elites, the status quo and “the economy stupid” always win’ – which is what the overwhelming majority of pundits said before 23 June and in some cases had drafted for their columns after the vote.
For example, if Michael Gove had stayed out of the campaign then Vote Leave would almost certainly have either collapsed (which it nearly did anyway) or been forced into fighting the campaign on a losing message like ‘Go Global’, a firm favourite for many years among a subset of MPs and Farage’s inner circle (Leave.EU adopted this as its first slogan) and a total loser with the public. (Therefore another counterfactual: why did Cameron and Osborne not try very hard to get a clear commitment from Gove that all he would do is issue a statement but would carry on with his day job and would not campaign? I hope he would have refused but it was worth a shot and they didn’t try very hard.)
Without Boris, Farage would have been a much more prominent face on TV during the crucial final weeks, probably the most prominent face. (We had to use Boris as leverage with the BBC to keep Farage off and even then they nearly screwed us as ITV did.) It is extremely plausible that this would have lost us over 600,000 vital middle class votes.
Without Victoria Woodcock, an absolutely phenomenal manager and by far the single most important person in the management of Vote Leave (and who would have been running Downing Street now but for the Gove-Boris debacle – more branching histories), we would not have been able to build anything like the structure we did and this could easily have cost us the winning margin of votes.
Anybody who says ‘I always knew X would win’ is fooling themselves. What actually happened was one of many branching histories and in many other branches of this network – branches that almost happened and still seem almost real to me – we lost.
Problems with Vote Leave
This is not a claim that ‘we won because of the Vote Leave campaign’. Our campaign failed to do much that we should have done. There were powerful connections between:
infighting over who appeared on broadcast and strategy,
the lack of resources (many kept clear because of the infighting and many used infighting as an excuse to keep clear of something they thought was doomed),
the extreme difficulty of finding a governance system that could work,
four crucial posts held by the wrong people (including the disastrous John Mills as first Chairman),
the extreme difficulty of getting prominent people to say on TV what research showed was necessary to win, and
the lack of anything resembling a well-organised mass movement.
Despite many years to prepare, the eurosceptic community had built remarkably little to prepare for the battle. On the ground were many small ineffective and often warring little groups and essentially no serious machinery (though Business for Britain had begun to build a business network). All this had to be built almost entirely from scratch in an environment in which many of those in charge of the small groups were sure we would lose, were less interested in winning than they were in ‘preserving our group’s identity Dominic’, and were keen to get their hands on cash being handed out by Leave.EU on condition that they not contribute to the campaign with Vote Leave. At various points UKIP HQ sent out emails to UKIP activists telling them not to work with Vote Leave and some senior activists were told by Farage’s gang that they would lose their UKIP jobs if they helped our ground campaign (luckily most of those out on the ground ignored these instructions but they were disruptive).
The office implemented the winning message in ~125 million leaflets and nearly a billion targeted digital adverts regardless of all complaints. We recruited more active volunteers (~12,000) in 10 months than UKIP in 25 years (~7,000 according to Farage). Our GOTV effort targeted crucial voters identified by traditional polling, a new type of experimental polling, the ground campaign, and the social media campaign, all overseen by the data science team. But until the last 4-5 weeks we had a big problem getting those going on TV to give the same message. The office could only do so much. If Boris, Gove, and Gisela had not supported us and picked up the baseball bat marked ‘Turkey/NHS/£350 million’ with five weeks to go, then 650,000 votes might have been lost. In the awful weekly campaign committee meetings, there were constant complaints and arguments for variations on ‘Go Global’ (until all the polls swung our way and people remembered ‘I’ve always said stick with 350 million’.) The Big Three knocked this back despite great pressure.
Some people had spent a quarter of a century talking about things that appealed to about 10% of the population and they would not pay attention to what millions of normal people actually knew and thought (‘I’ve spent years trying to ignore the NHS in elections Dominic and I’m not going to change now’ said many like Peter Bone). Media planning was extremely hard. Paul Stephenson’s media team of half a dozen, massively outnumbered by hundreds of officials, did a fantastic job but we could have done so much more if more MPs had been more determined and more supportive.
It should be remembered that the net effect of Conservative MPs was strongly supportive of IN. We won despite the net effort of Conservative Party MPs, not because of them, though the support from a small fraction was vital. Although Leave voters were more enthusiastic and determined than Remain voters, Cameron and Osborne were more focused on winning than most Leave MPs were. (Almost all Labour MPs seemed to be in a parallel universe until they got intelligence from their constituencies about postal votes after which they panicked ineffectually.)
Most of the MPs we dealt with were not highly motivated to win and lacked extreme focus, even those who had been boring everybody about this for decades. They sort of wanted to win but they had other priorities. They were very happy having dinner parties and gossiping. They were very happy coming to meetings with people they thought were important. This wasted enormous amounts of time as we had to create a string of Potemkin committees for people to attend while the core team actually did the campaign, then reinvent them as people became convinced that there were other secret meetings that they were being excluded from. They were very happy to be on the Today Programme. But they didn’t want to win that much. Not enough to work weekends. Not enough to stop having all their usual skiing holidays and winter beach holidays. Not enough to get out on the streets day after day. Not enough to miss a great shooting weekend. Not enough, most of them, to risk annoying a Prime Minister who they thought would still control their next job after 23 June.
This lack of motivation is connected to another important psychology – the willingness to fail conventionally. Most people in politics are, whether they know it or not, much more comfortable with failing conventionally than risking the social stigma of behaving unconventionally. They did not mind losing so much as being embarrassed, as standing out from the crowd. (The same phenomenon explains why the vast majority of active fund management destroys wealth and nobody learns from this fact repeated every year.)
Our core campaign team were not like this. They sacrificed weekends, holidays, and family events. They worked like dogs week in week out for little money often treated with appalling rudeness by people calling from their beach loungers (Boris, Gisela and Gove were three notable exceptions and all three were liked by junior staff partly because of their good, therefore rare, manners). We were happy to risk looking stupid to win. We knew that almost nobody in SW1 understood or agreed with what we were doing. We also knew we had more chance of winning if we did not explain a lot of it – most importantly the entire digital and data science element which (combined with the ground campaign and GOTV) gave us a chance to exploit strong network effects (and which we hid from the Board and MPs, see HERE).
Example… We were urged by everyone to hire a big advertising agency and do traditional posters. ‘When can we discuss our posters?’ I was asked constantly by people who would then try to explain to me their creative ideas (‘we need another Labour Isn’t Working, Dominic, I’ve got an idea for a picture of the globe and arrows…’). One of the few reliable things we know about advertising amid the all-pervasive charlatanry is that, unsurprisingly, adverts are more effective the closer to the decision moment they hit the brain. Instead of spending a fortune on an expensive agency (with 15% going to them out of ‘controlled expenditure’) and putting up posters to be ‘part of the national conversation’ weeks or months before the vote, we decided to 1) hire extremely smart physicists to consider everything from first principles, 2) put almost all our money into digital (~98%), 3) hold the vast majority of our budget back and drop it all right at the end with money spent on those adverts that experiments had shown were most effective (internal code name ‘Waterloo’). When things are digital you can be more empirical and control the timing. The world of advertising agencies and PR companies were sure we had screwed up because they did not see what we were doing. (Tim Bell told everybody we were doomed because we hadn’t hired one of his companies.) This points to another important issue – it is actually hard even for very competent and determined people to track digital communication accurately, and it is important that the political media is not set up to do this. There was not a single report anywhere (and very little curiosity) on how the official Leave campaign spent 98% of its marketing budget. There was a lot of coverage of a few tactical posters.
There were some MP heroes.
Example… Steve Baker often disagreed with me, sometimes very strongly, but he was a rare person in the campaign – an honest man. Not only did Steve win some important Parliamentary battles he also played a vital role during the attempted coup of 25 January. If he had thrown in his lot with the coup, it might have proved fatal. Instead he spoke honestly about the situation. We did not agree and we were both under pressure from a set of people who thought that ‘if they [HQ/MPs] control the campaign we will lose, we [HQ/MPs] must control it’. We came to an agreement that we both stuck to. With five weeks to go, there was an attempt to revive the coup by a couple of VL Board members working with players from the January coup like Malcolm Pearson. The demand was to replace the Big Three (Boris, Gisela, Gove) and the core campaign team with Farage, and replace £350 million / NHS with ‘go global’ trade babble. This didn’t get past the usual weekend boozy chats partly because of Steve Baker telling them he thought it a mad plan. This also shows how volatile the situation was right until the end and how few prominent eurosceptics even then understood that a) the £350 million / NHS argument was necessary to win and b) their ‘go global’ message was a total loser.
Other MPs also made significant personal sacrifices – backbenchers like Anne Marie Trevelyan and Graham Stringer, and ministers like George Eustice and Dominic Raab.
Rough balance of forces
The IN side started with huge structural advantages.
IN started in 2015 well ahead in the polls and had the advantage of having the status quo on its side which is intrinsically easier to explain than change is, as lots of historical data around the world shows. Usually the ‘change’ campaign has to start considerably ahead in order to win as it loses support as the campaign goes on. This argument was even stronger with something so much bigger and more complex like the EU. VL had to persuade millions of people to risk a profound change. Those on the IN side made this point repeatedly for many months. They were right then. After 23 June many of them say the exact opposite – it’s so complex to explain all the wonders of the EU, they say, and so easy to argue for change. This is laughable.
IN had the government at its heart including the Downing Street machine, the Cabinet Office, and Government departments and agencies all of which added up to thousands of people including hundreds of press officers. Cameron and Heywood also instructed Permanent Secretaries not to share EU material with Secretaries of State supporting Vote Leave in order that they did not have access to new information about all the ways in which EU law affected policy. (In general Whitehall has made great efforts to hide the scope of EU control. It also preserves, Potemkin-style, old processes like circulating Cabinet papers ‘for approval’ where the only acceptable response is ‘approve’ – it is not actually legally possible not to ‘approve’ but still the papers are sent round via the absurd red box system daily.) VL had a few dozen effective people and no access to the official machine other than some leaks. We had a research team of about five. MPs proved largely useless in helping this team.
IN controlled one side of the renegotiation and its timing. VL was at the mercy of events and could not get any ministers supporting us until the process ended.
IN controlled the timing of the referendum. VL had to plan resources on the basis of many scenarios.
IN controlled the Cabinet and junior ministers – bribes for support and threats to deter. They had the chance to set the terms for how ministers engaged in the campaign (though they partly blew this). VL had to meet ministers in secret, could guarantee them no jobs, and (as was pointed out to me by many) could not dodge the basic truth that purely from a personal career perspective it was usually better to support the PM.
IN controlled the governing party and the Parliamentary timetable and procedures. VL had to work with a small number of MPs many of whom had spent many years in constant opposition to their own leadership and were unused to any sort of discipline or collective action.
IN set the legal rules. VL faced a huge imbalance in how these worked. For example, Cameron even during the official campaign could do huge events at places like the British Museum and the IN campaign did not have to account for such events as part of their £7 million. Meanwhile VL was told by the Electoral Commission that if people we did not even know put up huge signs that appeared on TV we might get billed for them. There were many other consequences of the imbalance. E.g. the Government’s legal timetable meant we had to commit before the official start of the campaign to a load of activity that would occur after the official start of the campaign without knowing if we would be the official campaign and therefore legally entitled to spend this money. We therefore had to choose between either a) not do various things, be sure we would not break the law, and lower the chances of winning or b) do the right thing for the campaign and riski being judged to have broken the law. Obviously we did (b) though we had to hide this choice from some of those on our Board as this was exactly the sort of thing some of them were very weak about.
IN had access to huge resources – financial, personnel etc. IN had the support of almost every entity with power in Britain, Europe, and the world from the senior civil service to the CBI to the big investment banks, to Obama and the world bureaucracy (G20, UN, IMF etc). Very few senior people were prepared to risk supporting us. Those who did mostly did so in a small way and on their own terms without getting involved in our campaign. While IN could send out name after name to deliver their message, we could depend on very few names who would deliver our message. The Government machine, the Commission, and the Cabinet Office were effective in scaring off prominent people from supporting us; many of them told us (some embarrassed) about the phone calls they’d had and their ‘duty to shareholders’ and so on. Advanced media planning was almost impossible and we had to shuffle things around at short notice constantly. IN had millions more than us before the campaign ever started and used this money for direct voter communication. We could not afford this. We sent out one 10 million voter mailing to people identified by the physicists just before the spending limits started and we could only do this by tricking some of those on our Board about the numbers. (I was also helped by Peter Cruddas saying, ‘Don’t worry about the fundraising situation, don’t listen to everybody panicking, just do whatever it takes to do the campaign, if the money doesn’t come I guarantee I’ll put in whatever you need’. I knew I could trust him. This gave us vital flexibility and also meant we could ignore some of those on the Board who were more focused on whether they may be liable for a bill post-23/6 than they were on winning.)
IN had the support of most journalists and senior management in the main broadcasters. The broadcasters let the Government set the agenda on TV for almost the entire campaign, apart from ten crucial days after the immigration numbers on 26 May. VL had the support of some powerful papers but we were overwhelmed on TV news. (Two broadcast journalists who were conspicuous by their unusual professionalism and determination to act fairly despite the behaviour of some of their management were Laura K and Allegra Stratton.)
IN started with legal access to vast amounts of electoral data from at least three political parties, unofficial / illegal access to vast amounts of data from things like CCHQ data and the Crosby/Messina models built during the campaign, and vast amounts of commercial data. (CCHQ laughably claimed that there were ‘Chinese walls’ that prevented any abuse of Party data.) VL had none of these things. We could not even afford to buy standard commercial datasets (though the physicists found ingenious ways around this). We had no way even to acquire the electoral roll until the official process allowed us in early 2016, after which we had to wait a couple of months for LAs to fulfil their legal obligations to provide us with the data (which they did patchily and often late).
IN had a great boost to its fortunes in the form of a network linking Nigel Farage, Aaron Banks, assorted peers (e.g. Malcolm Pearson), MPs (e.g. Bill Cash), businessmen (e.g. Richard Smith), and a handful of Vote Leave Board members (including the one-time Chairman John Mills) and some staff foisted on us (one of whom won the title of the most repellent person I’ve met in politics – Nigel Griffiths, an ex-MP who some female staff refused to be in the same room with). Farage put off millions of (middle class in particular) voters who wanted to leave the EU but who were very clear in market research that a major obstacle to voting Leave was ‘I don’t want to vote for Farage, I’m not like that’. He also put off many prominent business people from supporting us. Over and over they would say ‘I agree with you the EU is a disaster and we should get out but I just cannot be on the same side as a guy who makes comments about people with HIV’.
On 25 January 2016 a network of these characters launched a coup. But for the actions of Stephen Parkinson, Paul Stephenson, and Victoria Woodcock (supported by most but not all of the office) it would have succeeded. This would have given control of the official campaign to the Farage crowd. They ran with vapid slogans like ‘Be in the know’. Ironically for a group of people who claim to be anti-SW1 they rehashed the classic losing SW1 eurosceptic trope for 25 years – ‘Go Global’ – showing how little they understood the electorate and mass communication. They rejected the connection between immigration, £350 million and the NHS, which was absolutely vital, as the IN side has said after 23 June (see below). They published dumb offensive videos. They talked about privatising the NHS. They built little grassroots organisation and their claims about social media were (and remain ) laughable. Farage himself admitted after 23 June that they did not have the organisation to run the campaign if they had won designation: ‘quite what we would have done if we had got it I’m not really sure!’, which sums them up (Shipman, Location 4,150). The media would have covered this gang’s official campaign as a version of their own book – a bunch of childish dodgy boozers on an ego trip.
Before the 2015 election Farage said to me at Stuart Wheeler’s that he knew he could not be the leading face of the campaign – ‘I’m one of the generals but I can’t lead the army’ he said, to my relief. When I next saw him in the summer, I was amazed at how his tune had changed, his obsession with the debates, and his pessimism. One can only understand some of the behaviour from those around Farage if you realise that much of their operation was about positioning Farage for what they assumed would be defeat.
One of the biggest problems during the campaign and biggest misconceptions after concerns this issue. Those who argued ‘we need one campaign’ were wrong. Those who argue now ‘we would have won by more if there’d been one campaign’ are wrong. One campaign would have meant total bedlam and 60-40 defeat.
If MPs had had extreme focus on winning then they would not have used Farage as leverage against us viz official designation and therefore much of the infighting could have been avoided as Farage would have done a sensible deal with us early, realising much earlier that we would not compromise over him running the campaign under any circumstances. By encouraging Farage to think that he could get a much more prominent position, people like Bill Cash nearly destroyed everything.
Given all these huge advantages, if their campaign had been of equal effectiveness to Vote Leave then, all else remaining equal, Cameron would almost certainly (>95% likely) have won.
Why did all these forces not add up to overwhelming and devastating firepower? If you want to understand the combination of things that gives us largely dysfunctional government and therefore undermined the IN campaign – a mix of selecting and promoting the wrong people, wrong education and training, bad incentives, anti-adaptive institutions and so on – then read this in which I explain in detail why Whitehall does not and cannot work properly.
The closest approximation to the truth that we can get is that Leave won because of a combination of 1) three big, powerful forces with global impact: the immigration crisis, the financial crisis, and the euro crisis which created conditions in which the referendum could be competitive; 2) Vote Leave implemented some unrecognised simplicities in its operations that focused attention more effectively than the other side on a simple and psychologically compelling story, thus taking advantage of those three big forces; and 3) Cameron and Osborne operated with a flawed model of what constitutes effective political action and had bad judgement about key people (particularly his chief of staff and director of communications) therefore they made critical errors. Even if (1) and (2) had played out the same, I think that if that duo had made one of a few crucial decisions differently they would very likely have won.
When I started to research opinion in 2014-15 and compared it to my experience of the euro campaign (1999-2002), it was clear three forces had changed opinion on the EU.
1) The immigration crisis. 15 years of immigration and, recently, a few years of the migration crisis from the East and Africa, dramatically portrayed on TV and social media, had a big effect. In 2000, focus groups were already unhappy with immigration but did not regard it as a problem caused by the EU. By 2015, the EU was blamed substantially for the immigration/asylum crisis and this was entangled with years of news stories about ‘European courts’ limiting action against terrorists and criminals. Actually often these stories concerned the Strasbourg court of the ECHR (not the ECJ) though, ironically, the EU’s adoption of its Charter of Fundamental Rights meant that many issues concerning the ECHR became relevant to the EU debate, something that almost nobody in SW1 realised and we tried and largely failed to explain (one of the very few who did understand this was Boris’s wife, an accomplished lawyer, who I discussed this with in autumn 2015).
2) The 2008 financial crisis. This undermined confidence in Government, politicians, big business, banks, and almost any entity thought to be speaking for those with power and money. Contra many pundits, Miliband was right that the centre of gravity has swung against free markets. Even among the world of Thatcherite small businesses and entrepreneurs opinion is deeply hostile to the way in which banks and public company executive pay work. Over and over again outside London people would rant about how they had not/barely recovered from this recession ‘while the politicians and bankers and businessmen in London all keep raking in the money and us mugs on PAYE are paying for the bailouts, now they’re saying we’ve just got to put up with the EU being crap or else we’ll be unemployed, I don’t buy it, they’ve been wrong about everything else…’ All those amazed at why so little attention was paid to ‘the experts’ did not, and still do not, appreciate that these ‘experts’ are seen by most people of all political views as having botched financial regulation, made a load of rubbish predictions, then forced everybody else outside London to pay for the mess while they got richer and dodged responsibility. They are right. This is exactly what happened.
Many Tory MPs and ‘free market’ pundits / think tankers are living in a fantasy world in which they want hostility to big business to end even though everybody can see that those who failed largely escaped responsibility and have even gone back to doing the same things. (I’ve argued since 2001 for big changes on executive pay to almost zero effect. SW1 is full of people who think they’re ‘defending markets’ but are actually defending the opposite – corporate looting. In the 1930s Britain put people in jail because of what happened in the 1920s. We should have done the same after 2008.)
3) The euro crisis. Britain joined the EEC because it was a basket case in the 1970s and ‘Europe’ was seen as a modernising force that could help us recover and improve the economy and living standards. As the euro crisis hit, millions saw Greece in chaos, even flames, for month after month. This undermined confidence in the EU as a modern successful force – ‘it’s so bad even Germany’s in trouble now because of the euro’, ‘not even Germany can afford to sort this out’, people would say.
Together these three big forces undermined confidence in the EU project as a modern force for progress that brings prosperity and solves problems and pushed it into about 30-35% of the population (younger, richer, better educated) which increasingly saw the EU in terms of ‘are you racist / supporter of Farage?’ This feeling was central in 1975. It diminished gradually but was still partly there 1999-2002 when I was doing focus groups on the euro. (It is why I had so many arguments at the time with eurosceptics explaining to them that if we accepted Blair’s framing of the euro debate as IN/OUT of the EU, we would lose. Our two slogans were therefore ‘Europe yes, euro no’ and ‘Keep the pound, keep control’.)
Second, they undermined confidence in those in charge. There had been strong anti-Westminster feelings growing for over a decade. In 2004 with James Frayne and my uncle I set up the campaign to fight the referendum on the North East Regional Assembly as a training exercise for an EU referendum (then envisaged after Blair’s 2005 victory). We came from behind and won 80-20 (not a misprint) despite having almost no money, no support, and the entire North East establishment against us because we exploited this feeling (‘politicians talk, we pay‘ was our slogan). SW1 ignored the result. It did not appreciate the scale of this growing force even after the financial crash and expenses scandal. Normal electoral politics and the structural grip of established political parties fooled insiders about the extent of support for people like Cameron. Cameron won negatively – because he was not Brown or Miliband. There was very little positive feeling for him. They fought the referendum with him and Osborne at the front as if they were fighting Brown or Miliband and asking people to make a choice: this is not how most people saw it.
These three big forces and the failure of the parties to cope, combined with the daily resentment of paying taxes for the bill of the 2008 Crash, meant that in a vote like 2016 where people did not have to vote to stop Brown or Miliband ‘stealing my money’, millions who were unpersuaded by Cameron/Osborne felt free to vote positively for something (‘take back control’) and against a duo they disliked, distrusted, and saw as representative of politicians’ failure over many years.
These three big forces had global impact and had much more effect on people who pay a normal amount of attention to politics than every speech, article, pamphlet and ‘campaign’ about the EU over 15 years, the sum total of which had almost no discernible effect.
Those who think I am exaggerating the relative lack of influence of conscious SW1 activity could consider another example – the Gove education reforms 2010-14 (which I was closely involved with). These reforms were one of the most prominent stories of the 2010-15 Government with thousands of stories and broadcast discussions. I researched public attitudes to these reforms after I resigned from government in January 2014 (contrary to widespread belief the Cameron operation spent very little time and resources before 2014 on researching public opinion, they were focused on the media rather than the public). Approximately nothing of our arguments – including the years of speeches by Blair too – had got through to the public.The entire SW1 media debate had approximately no impact on public opinion. People had some idea of some changes if they had kids in school but knew almost nothing of the arguments. Consider how much more motivated people were to learn about this than they were about the EU. (Part of the reason is that the language that Cameron and SW1 generally used was about ‘choice, competition’ and so on. I was almost totally unsuccessful in persuading people to talk about the issue in a different way which is one of the reasons I spent so little time on communication and almost all my time on management in the DfE. Gove knew the problem but also knew that there was no chance of getting Cameron to do things differently.)
This is relevant to the immigration argument in particular. Many pundits who described themselves as ‘modernisers’ wrote columns over the years arguing that immigration was an issue because Cameron was making foolish promises about it and the media therefore paid more attention to it. This is wrong. Cameron’s foolish promises certainly made his situation worse but it is wrong to think that public interest in an issue is proportional to the attention paid by politicians and newspapers in SW1. The public only pays attention to a tiny subset of issues that politicians and the media bang on about. It is largely impossible to predict which things will catch fire and which will not, though process stories and ‘scandals’ almost always have zero effect and insiders repeatedly get this wrong. Long before there was any prominent media discussion of ‘the Australian points system’ you could hear it being discussed in focus group after focus group to an extent that was very surprising to me and was very surprising to every single person I discussed it with, including Farage (who adopted the policy because of focus groups, the causal chain was not – Farage talks >> focus groups respond).
Making these three forces even more powerful was the nature of the reaction from those in charge in the EU and Britain – a general failure not only to grip the problems but even to show that they understood what the problems were. There was clearly no sensible movement for reform of the EU. As it lurched from crisis to crisis, its only response was ‘the EU needs more power’ (this is, of course, the founding logic of the Monnet-Delors system). The British Government clearly had no sensible plan for dealing with the EU’s crises and dysfunction. Worse, their responses were often obviously rubbish, such as the ‘tens of thousands’ immigration promise that people could see had no chance of being met yet politicians just kept repeating it. People naturally concluded – these guys in London don’t grasp the seriousness of the problems, they haven’t a clue what to do, and are treating us like idiots. Cameron’s renegotiation did not change this view. The Government therefore entered the campaign in a very different state to Wilson in 1975.
These three forces meant that by summer 2015 only about a third of the electorate positively wanted to be inside the EU. Another third strongly wanted to leave and were not worried about the economy. Another fifth had roughly the view that – the EU is rubbish, I’d like to be outside, but I’m worried about the short-term effects on jobs and living standards so maybe I’ll vote IN (see the ICM table above). Further, our research showed that the strong Leave third was significantly more enthusiastic about the referendum than the strong Remain third and the swing fifth, and therefore more likely to vote.
Vote Leave exploited these forces
I will go into this in much more detail and I will ignore all management/operational issues here.
Our story rested on five simple foundations that came from listening very hard to what people really knew, thought, and said:
1. ‘Let’s take back control’. The overall theme. When I researched opinion on the euro the best slogan we could come up with was ‘keep control’. I therefore played with variations of this. A lot of people have given me a lot of credit for coming up with it but all I really did was listen. (NB. ‘back’ plays into a strong evolved instinct – we hate losing things, especially control.)
2. ‘The official bill of EU membership is £350 million per week – let’s spend our money on our priorities like the NHS instead.’ (Sometimes we said ‘we send the EU £350m’ to provoke people into argument. This worked much better than I thought it would. There is no single definitive figure because there are different sets of official figures but the Treasury gross figure is slightly more than £350m of which we get back roughly half, though some of this is spent in absurd ways like subsidies for very rich landowners to do stupid things.)
Pundits and MPs kept saying ‘why isn’t Leave arguing about the economy and living standards’. They did not realise that for millions of people, £350m/NHS was about the economy and living standards – that’s why it was so effective. It was clearly the most effective argument not only with the crucial swing fifth but with almost every demographic. Even with UKIP voters it was level-pegging with immigration. Would we have won without immigration? No. Would we have won without £350m/NHS? All our research and the close result strongly suggests No. Would we have won by spending our time talking about trade and the Single Market? No way (see below).
NB. Unlike most of those on our side the IN campaign realised the effectiveness of this, as Cooper, Coetze and others said after 23 June. E.g. ‘The power of their £350 million a week can’t be overstated.’ Andrew Cooper, director of strategy for the IN campaign.
Some people now claim this was cynical and we never intended to spend more on the NHS. Wrong. Boris and Gove were agreed and determined to do exactly this. On the morning of 24 June they both came into HQ. In the tiny ‘operations room’ amid beer cans, champagne bottles, and general bedlam I said to Boris – on day one of being PM you should immediately announce the extra £100 million per week for the NHS [the specific pledge we’d made] is starting today and more will be coming – you should start off by being unusual, a political who actually delivers what they promise. ‘Absolutely. ABSOLUTELY. We MUST do this, no question, we’ll park our tanks EVERYWHERE’ he said. Gove strongly agreed. If they had not blown up this would have happened. The opposite impression was created because many Tories who did not like us talking about the NHS reverted to type within seconds of victory and immediately distanced themselves from it and the winning campaign. Unlike Gove and Boris they did not learn from the campaign, they did not listen to the public. Until people trust that the NHS is a financial priority for Tories, they will have no moral authority to discuss management issues. This obvious fact is psychologically hard to absorb because of the strength of gang feelings in politics.
(There are already myths about some of these events. The press conference of 24 June is now written up as the two of them ‘terrified of what they had done’ but this is completely wrong. They were subdued partly because they were genuinely sad about Cameron and partly because they did not want to be seen as dancing on his grave. Some of the media created the psychologically compelling story that they were regretful / frightened about victory but this was not at all their mood in HQ on the morning of 24 June. Boris came in punching the air like Maradona after a great goal, hugging staff and clearly euphoric. It is completely wrong to portray him as regretful.)
3. ‘Vote Leave to take back control of immigration policy. If we stay there will be more new countries like Turkey joining and you won’t get a vote. Cameron says he wants to “pave the road” from Turkey to here. That’s dangerous. If we leave we can have democratic control and a system like Australia’s. It’s safer to take back control.’
I was surprised at what a shock it was to IN when we hit them with Turkey. By the time this happened they were in an almost impossible position. I wanted them to announce a veto. It would not have been believed and would have had the opposite effect – people would have taken the danger of Turkey joining more seriously. If your life depended on winning for IN, the answer is clear: they should have said long before the campaign started as part of the renegotiation process that they would veto any accession.
4. ‘The euro is a nightmare, the EU is failing, unemployment is a disaster, their debts and pensions are a disaster, if we stay YOU will be paying the bills. It’s safer to take back control and have a new relationship based on free trade and friendly cooperation instead of the European Court being in charge of everything…’ (This is not an official text, just a summary of the notion off the top of my head.)
5. Anti-Establishment. E.g. We aligned our campaign with those who were furious with executive pay / corporate looting (about 99% of the country). We aligned ourselves with the public who had been let down by the system.
Mandelson regarded this as ‘sheer nerve, sheer chutzpah’. It was obvious. The hard thing was sticking to it despite the sensibilities of many of our own supporters. One of the most effective TV performances of the campaign was the day Boris hit the theme of corporate looting in a market square. No10 were rightly panicked and in response pushed out Heseltine a few hours later to make a very personal attack on Boris. This made sense tactically but was a strategic error. All such personal attacks helped persuade Boris to up the ante. This was vital with a month to go when the immigration figures came out. Rudd and others argue that Cameron should have attacked Boris and others more. Wrong. They should have played it Zen publicly and had a much better black ops team.
I’ll go into this separately but just to give a few examples…
1. Cameron never had to offer the referendum in the first place. His sudden U-turn was a classic example of how his Downing Street operation lurched without serious thought in response to media pressure, not because of junior people but because of Cameron himself and his terrible choice of two main advisers (Llewellyn and Oliver). This happened many times and I wrote about all the damage it caused on other issues after I left government (HERE). This was the biggest example. It was a product of a deeper error – a combination of his failure of party management (misleading them about the best way to handle the party) and failure to understand how swing voters really think and therefore the dangers of a vote (see below).
2. If Cameron/Osborne had had a top notch person like David Plouffe running their campaign and they did as they were told then they would have won (>95% confidence), all else being equal. They were warned many times by their closest friends about Oliver and Llewellyn, including by Gove, but would not listen.
3. Their renegotiation was flawed from the start and badly undermined their central message. They compounded their errors in 2015 by accepting the pathetic deal in 2016. If they had walked away in February then Vote Leave would quickly have imploded and the flying monkeys would have taken over the campaign.
4. They made themselves too prominent in the campaign and were too crude. Lacking a feel for psychology they gradually undermined their own message. Oliver thought Obama’s ‘back of the queue’ was brilliant. It was counterproductive. They thought ratcheting up the warnings to DEFCON 1 was effective. It was counterproductive.
5. They doubled down on ‘tens of thousands’. They thought they would lose credibility if they didn’t. The opposite was true. They should have dropped this in 2015 – for example, in an exclusive to the Independent on a Saturday in early August 2015 – and gone into the campaign without it. Every time they defended it they were helping us.
6. They suckered themselves into over-prioritising their coalition versus message. Blair’s campaign against us in the North East did the same. When you do this you lose focus and clarity which is usually fatal. The error was perhaps most visible the day Cameron unveiled an absurd poster that effectively listed all the ‘serious people’ on their side and – creative genius! – a blank page for us. A total waste of valuable time. The fact of being the Government meant the broadcasters let them lead the news almost all the time but they often wasted it like this. (I would bet that that ad was never put in focus groups or if it was the results were ignored.)
7. One of my basic criticisms of Cameron/Osborne from the start was the way they steered by pundit. During the 2015 election Crosby partly corrected this and they partly learned the lesson. But left to their own devices in the referendum when under pressure they defaulted to their instincts at a crucial moment. The reaction to the dreadful murder was an example of how the media and SW1 can live effectively in a parallel universe. Somehow they convinced themselves that this event might undo over a decade of growing hostility for those in power. They therefore tried to push the theme that actually MPs are great, ‘they are in it for good reasons’ and so on. The media led themselves into a dead end and No10, defaulting to their instincts of steering by pundit, followed. As soon as I saw Osborne and Matt Hancock wasting their time tweeting broken multicoloured hearts and encouraging #weloveourMP, I knew they had screwed their own OODA loop. We knew from focus groups (conducted by the brilliant Henry de Zoete who also played a crucial role in coordinating the digital and data science teams) that opinion outside London was extremely different to that of MPs and those in charge of most news. We went straight back to what we knew were the winning messages leaving Hancock and co to tweet broken hearts.
BUT BUT… Roland Rudd and others have attacked them for their basic strategy of focus on the economy and argue there should have been ‘a positive campaign for the EU’. WRONG. Cameron and Osborne were right about this big call. There was not enough time or money to change basic attitudes. As the campaign developed and there were signs of pressure from Rudd and others I crossed my fingers and hoped they would shift strategy. No10 were right to ignore him.
I suspect that in general big mistakes cause defeat much more often than excellent moves cause victory. There are some theoretical reasons to suspect this is true from recent statistical analysis of human and computer decisions in chess. Two results are particularly interesting. 1) The very best computers seem to make moves that preserve the widest possible choices in the future, just as the most effective person in politics for whom we have good sources, Bismarck, operated always on the principle of ‘keep two irons in the fire’. (We tried to mimic this by adopting a message that we thought had the highest probability of winning in the largest number of plausible branching futures, hence £350m/NHS.) 2) Even great humans are distinguishable from great computers by their propensity to make clear tactical errors occasionally amid the fog of war. This is significant enough that it wipes out the advantage of going first – i.e. it being ‘your move’ is seen as a plus but in fact it is a minus for humans because of the probability of a significant error, while for computers this effect is absent. (See Human and Computer Preferences at Chess, 2014. It would be very interesting to know if these results are supported by the recent success of Deep Mind with computer GO.)
False: ‘Leave won because of the campaign.’ E.g. Without 15 years of out of control immigration, our message of ‘take back control’ would not have had enough traction. Campaigns can ride big waves but they almost never make them.
False: ‘Leave won because of a big event [immigration, 2008 crash etc], the campaign was irrelevant.’ E.g. If the campaign had not deployed £350 million and the NHS (which almost nobody on our side liked), we would not have neutralised/overwhelmed Project Fear.
True: ‘Leave won because 1) three big forces created conditions in which the contest was competitive, AND 2) Vote Leave exploited the situation imperfectly but effectively, AND 3) Cameron/Osborne made big mistakes. If just one of these had been different, it is very likely IN would have won.’
Overall, the now-mocked conventional wisdom that ‘the status quo almost always wins in referendums like this’ obviously has a lot of truth to it and it only proved false this time because of a combination of events that was improbable.
Since losing many inside the IN campaign now talk dejectedly as if they could never have won and tell rationalising fairy tales. They are wrong. They almost did win. Some have latched onto the idea that they were overwhelmed by an epic, global force of ‘right-wing populism’. Mandelson defends himself by saying 48% looks ‘like a miracle’ given the populist tide. Most have latched onto the idea that their ‘complex truth’ was overwhelmed by ‘simple lies’ and they are happy with their comforting ‘post-truth’ sobriquet – a delusion that leaves them very vulnerable to being shocked again. Many have even argued that they lost because they could not persuade Corbyn to make more speeches.
These stories are psychologically preferable to the idea that their own errors caused defeat (just as it is for some of those in Hilary’s campaign) but should not be taken seriously.
The least plausible claim is that Corbyn sabotaged what was otherwise a winning campaign. This is argued mainly by the same people (including Mandelson) who in a party context also argue that Corbyn is a joke who nobody takes seriously. The idea that more speeches by Corbyn would have persuaded vital swing voters has no good evidence. These people wanted to ‘take back control’. Corbyn’s message was – there should be not just more immigration but no limits on it. There are not many branching histories in which this is a winner.
This ‘epic global force’ of ‘populism’ was thought by the same people before 23 June to be puny in comparison with the force of the combined Establishment hammering a message of economic fear in support of the status quo. Having underestimated certain trends in public opinion the same people are now exaggerating them (see below).
This is connected to ‘complexity’. Month after month they argued (including to us in private discussions) that they would win largely because they had the advantage of the status quo – an advantage proved in votes around the world over many years. They were right. That was a big advantage. It is much simpler to argue for the status quo than for a very complex change – that is exactly why most ‘change’ referendums lose, just as they briefed the media. Now they say ‘The EU is very complex, it requires a lot of information to explain it’ (Craig Oliver). Their claim that actually they had the ‘complex’ argument to make against our ‘simple lies’ is laughable for exactly the reasons they gave themselves before they came unstuck.
Connected to this idea is that the great rationalists Cameron and Osborne – they of Project Fear and their comic ’emergency budget’ and in 2015 the pictures of Salmond picking pockets designed successfully to persuade the English that the Scots would steal their money – were undone by a great surge of ’emotion’. Osborne is taking this delusion so far he is writing a book titled ludicrously ‘The age of unreason’. When you lose and you blame it on millions of people being overtaken by ‘unreason’ – after previously winning by exploiting nationalist hostility – it’s a sure sign that you are the one not reasoning straight and able to face your errors. For the likes of Osborne it is ‘irrational’ to reject the views of people like him. For most of us, people like Osborne are not experts to be trusted – they are charlatans not to be taken seriously.
Many of those who blame defeat on ‘lies’, including Cameron, Osborne, and Clegg themselves told flat-out lies. One example will do. Cameron and Osborne claimed repeatedly on TV, almost always unchallenged, that their new deal meant ‘after six months if you haven’t got a job you have to leave’. This is not an argument over the fairness of using a gross/net figure, like ‘£350 million’, or even a properly bogus figure like the Treasury’s £4,000 per household figure. It is a different category of claim – a flat out 100% lie. (For more details see HERE.) How much time did Today, Newsnight, and the Guardian spend explaining to people that the PM and Chancellor were lying through their teeth? Approximately none. Why? Because very few of those complaining about lies really are cross about ‘lies’ – they are cross they lost and they are not so interested in discussing a lie that undermines the pro-EU campaign’s attempt to neutralise fear of immigration.
Further, many of the same people spent the entire campaign saying ‘Vote Leave has admitted a Leave vote means leaving the Single Market, this is what will happen make no mistake…’ and now say ‘the Single Market was not an issue, Vote Leave never had a policy on it and there is no mandate for leaving it’. Cameron, Osborne, Mandelson, Campbell and Clegg spent much of the last 20 years lying through their teeth to further their own interests and prestige. Now they whine about ‘lies’. They deserved worse than they got – and reasonable Remain-ers deserved better leadership.
Many of those who worked on the IN side are now wrongly attacked as fools by pundits who would have praised them as geniuses had they won, while many on the OUT campaign are wrongly praised.
Example… ‘If Remain wins Cameron ought to be hailed as the genius strategist of western democratic politics’ (Rentoul). Pundits who wrongly hailed Cameron as a genius after the 2015 election now wrongly describe him as a bumbling oaf. He was neither – he was the best of a bad bunch picked pseudo-randomly in a broken system and out of his depth. 600,000 votes either way does not make one set of people geniuses and another set of people morons. Geniuses in politics are rarer than in maths and physics and nobody involved in the referendum on either side is remotely close to one. Some of those who worked on the IN side were much more able than many on the winning side. It does not make sense to label people on the IN side idiots because of errors made by Cameron, Osborne, Llewellyn, and Oliver.
Example: many have said to me ‘you were so clever to hold back on immigration until the start of purdah’. Wrong. It is true that we did not do much on immigration before the 10 week official campaign. That is because, as I wrote in 2014, we did not need to. It was far more important to plant other seeds and recruit support that would have been put off if we had focused early on immigration. Immigration was a baseball bat that just needed picking up at the right time and in the right way. The right time was before purdah and we set in motion during January-April a series of things like the free referendum address with the right message but we could not persuade many prominent people to do what was needed until after 26 May. The right way was via the NHS (unifying) – not ‘we want our country back’ of Farage (divisive). The timing was not ‘a brilliant move’ by me, it was a combination of good luck and seizing a tactical chance to persuade people of something I’d failed to do for weeks, but such things get rewritten as such if you win.
It is also foolish to see the conflict in terms of who is ‘nicer’ and ‘nastier’. I don’t think the people on our side are nicer. There are lovely and loathsome people, liars and charlatans on both sides.
Many OUT-ers talk as if we were destined to win. Wrong. The IRA used to say ‘you have to get lucky every time but we only have to get lucky once’. For Leave to win a string of events had to happen many of which were independently improbable or 50-50 and therefore the combination was very improbable. The result was certainly not an inevitable outcome of ‘the great British public simply voting for democracy’ as some romantics delude themselves.
Oblonsky and the frogs before the thunderstorm: fashion, delusions of the educated, and the Single Market
‘I feel that, in some ways, this was a conflict between good forces in society and bad forces. I feel that the bad forces on 23 June won a very significant victory.’ Matthew Parris.
Matt Ridley: Matthew, you’re not saying that 17 million people are, deep down, racists?
Matthew Parris: Yes. (Spectator, December 2016)
Why is almost all political analysis and discussion so depressing and fruitless? I think much has to do with the delusions of better educated people. It is easier to spread memes in SW1, N1, and among Guardian readers than in Easington Colliery.
Generally the better educated are more prone to irrational political opinions and political hysteria than the worse educated far from power. Why? In the field of political opinion they are more driven by fashion, a gang mentality, and the desire to pose about moral and political questions all of which exacerbate cognitive biases, encourage groupthink, and reduce accuracy. Those on average incomes are less likely to express political views to send signals; political views are much less important for signalling to one’s immediate in-group when you are on 20k a year. The former tend to see such questions in more general and abstract terms, and are more insulated from immediate worries about money. The latter tend to see such questions in more concrete and specific terms and ask ‘how does this affect me?’. The former live amid the emotional waves that ripple around powerful and tightly linked self-reinforcing networks. These waves rarely permeate the barrier around insiders and touch others.
These factors are deepened by the fact that almost all of those whose job it is to explain politics and campaigns have never been responsible for a complex organisation in general or a campaign in particular, so they are unsuited to understand how politics ripples out from decisions at the centre through dysfunctional bureaucracies to the ground. They almost always exaggerate the extent to which important decisions have been considered carefully by people who know what they are talking about. (The worse educated are actually often helped by their lack of education towards the truth.) They constantly discuss complex systems as though errors can be eradicated instead of asking how quickly errors are adapted to and learned from. This perspective biases them in favour of existing centralised systems that fail continually and against innovations with decentralised systems. They understand little about the challenges faced by small businesses and the lower middle classes.
The more closely involved people are in the media and politics the more they are driven by fashion and the feeling, rarely acknowledged and almost always rationalised, that ‘this is my gang’. Look at all those in SW1 who tweet attacks on Dacre to each other then retweet the praise from their friends, then look at those who attack them. Look at Robert Peston tweeting pictures of the London Eye and Habermas quotes on election night and his opponents ranting about ‘elites’. Both sides are just like football team fans defending their in-group and attacking their out-group enemies. The more they think of themselves as original the more likely they are to be conformist – and conformist within very narrow parameters. We all fool ourselves but the more educated are particularly overconfident that they are not fooling themselves. They back their gang then fool themselves that they have reached their views by sensible, intelligent, reasoning.
This makes them particularly vulnerable to ‘influence operations’. It also makes them vulnerable to repeated errors about what the sort of people who ignore politics other than for a few weeks before voting time are thinking. It creates something of a paradox: it is almost impossible to get a good feel of public opinion, or of ‘the winning strategy’, by listening to those whose job it is to speculate about it. However often this happens, the lesson is never learned. It is very hard to see how it could change as it is so entangled with our evolved nature.
There is a wonderful passage in Anna Karenina that sums this up, much better than any ‘political scientist’ has done:
‘Oblonsky never chose his tendencies and opinions any more than he chose the style of his hat or coat. He always wore those which happened to be in fashion. Moving in a certain circle where a desire for some form of mental activity was part of maturity, he was obliged to hold views in the same way he was obliged to wear a hat. If he had a reason for preferring Liberalism to the Conservatism of many in his set, it was not that he considered the liberal outlook more rational but because it corresponded better with his mode of life… The Liberal Party said that marriage was an obsolete tradition which ought to be reformed, and indeed family life gave Oblonsky very little pleasure, forcing him to tell lies and dissemble, which was quite contrary to his nature. The Liberal Party said, or rather assumed, that religion was only a curb on the illiterate, and indeed Oblonsky could not stand through even the shortest church service without aching feet, or understand the point of all that dreadful high-flown talk about the other world when life in this world was really rather pleasant… Liberalism had become a habit with Oblonsky and he enjoyed his newspaper, as he did his after-dinner cigar, for the slight haze it produced in his brain.’
Towards the end of the novel, there is a discussion about the then big issue of Turkish atrocities and the rise of pan-Slavism. The old prince replies to the intellectuals who are talking rubbish about ‘the national feeling’ that they think is ‘sweeping the country’:
‘Yes, all the papers say the same thing. That’s true. So much the same that they are just like frogs before a storm! You can’t hear anything for their croaking.’
Many will reply, ‘Oblonsky is a dilettante, not a serious character, you can’t compare him with people like Robert Peston’. Oblonsky isn’t a dummy, he’s brighter than many of the posh duffers in his club. And also consider Anna’s husband, Karenin – a terrifying reminder that the ‘serious characters’ in politics are really no better than Oblonsky regarding fashion. In politics, just about all of us are some combination of Oblonsky and Karenin. If you think you aren’t, you’re probably fooling yourself. If you’re on TV a lot, you’re almost definitely fooling yourself.
There are many examples of how real Oblonskys, who control practically all important cultural institutions, think. They believed things about Stalin’s regime so outlandish that it is hard to appreciate now. They were more in favour of Britain joining the euro, not because they understood ‘the complexities’ better but because they were suckered into thinking about it as a moral test – are you on the side of the ‘baddies’ or the goodies’? As the BBC Europe editor said to me back then, in similar terms to Matthew Parris about the 2016 referendum, ‘the thing is Dominic, we like foreigners and cappuccinos and we hate racists’. Polls show that better educated people are less likely to have accurate views about the science of evolution and genetics (their desire to send moral signals suckers them into believing fairy tales).
The conformity of the educated is in some ways a good thing – most obviously, a basic consensus about things like not killing one’s domestic opponents that is extremely unusual historically. But it has many bad effects too. There is a collective lack of imagination which makes the system very susceptible to disastrous shocks. They share a narrow set of ideas about how the world works which mistakes their own view as the only possible sensible approach. They are aways writing about how ‘shocking’ things are to them – things that never were as low probability events as they imagine. They can’t imagine something like Stalin deliberately creating a famine or deliberately murdering millions. They tell themselves that Hitler will be ‘more sensible in power’ and ‘engagement’ is the right path. Western liberals (like Clinton and many pro-euro campaigners) and conservatives (like Bush) talked of relations with Putin as if he is a normal western politician rather than an ex-KGB mafia overlord with views very far from western liberals. They tell each other ‘I can’t imagine President Trump, it just can’t happen’. Many conservatives are now telling themselves that they should not take Trump too literally but that too is a failure of imagination – his character is clear to those unblinded by gang mentality and he will govern in character.
The referendum was a great example of this. Large numbers of people better educated than average – the sort of people who work as producers at the BBC – talked about their vote like this:
‘Farage is racist, he hates gay people and made that comment about foreigners with HIV, he wants to turn the clock back and pull the drawbridge up, I’m not like that, my friends aren’t like that, I am on the other side to people like that, I am tolerant and modern, I will vote IN.’
All over the country sentiments almost identical to this were expressed in large numbers. The idea that millions of graduates voted because they ‘studied the issues’ is laughable to anybody who spent time measuring opinion honestly. Almost none of these people know more about what a Customs Union is than a bricky in Darlington. They did not vote on the basis of thinking hard about the dynamics of EMU or about how Brussels will cope with issues like gene drives. Millions thought – there’s two gangs and I know which one I’m in. Another subset of the better educated feared the short-term economic disruption of a Leave vote would cost them money. They also did not vote on the basis of deep consideration of the issues.
The modern day Oblonsky reads an op-ed about how ‘the CBI warns of the dangers of leaving the Single Market’ and ‘the dangers of racist extremists’ and, having no idea of what ‘the Single Market’ is, jabbers away at their dinner party about how concerned they are about leaving ‘the Single Market’, and a warm haze of knowing one is on the ‘good’ side of the argument envelops the brain.
When it comes to the central issues of the nature of the EU’s trading relationships and what a UK-EU relationship might look like outside the EU, we are dealing with a particularly strong example of this phenomenon. Not only do the Oblonskys not know what they are talking about, neither do almost any of the supposed experts and specialists.
Lots of people said to me ‘when are you going to set out the details of the UK-EU trade relationship if you win?’ What would have been the point of that?! Approximately nobody knows anything about the important details of how the EU works including the MPs who have spent years talking about it and the journalists who cover it – indeed, often those who talk about it most are the most ignorant (and most overconfident). This is still true six months after the vote – imagine how much more true it was in the six months before the vote.
I am not aware of a single MP or political journalist who understands the Single Market – its history, its nature, its dynamics, its legal system, the complex interactions between law, economics, business, history and so on. Cameron, Osborne and Clegg certainly don’t. Neither does Bill Cash. Neither does any head of the CBI. Neither do Jon Snow, Robert Peston, Evan Davis or John Humphreys so they do a rubbish job of exposing politicians’ ignorance.
The number of people who do is tiny. In our campaign there were two – Oliver Lewis and Richard Howell – who understood a large fraction of it and the common misconceptions. They constantly had to explain to MPs, MEPs, and journalists why their ideas were misunderstandings. Maybe there is a business/economics journalist somewhere who really understands it. There are certainly some exceptional lawyers who understand narrow aspects extremely well, though few of these also understand the political and business dimensions. I have spoken to many very successful business people and never met one on either side who understands the Single Market in depth. In the entire campaign I am not aware of a single programme on TV that even tried to delve into these issues seriously (Newsnight was particularly bad, combining smugness and vapidity such as dropping Evan Davis by helicopter on an offshore platform to babble about ‘sovereignty’ trying to make the Leave side look like a bunch of weirdo cranks). British elites handed over power to the Monnet-Delors project with barely one-in-a-thousand understanding in detail why, what it involved, and its likely evolution (and that one-in-a-thousand almost all concluded that the public could not be trusted to know the truth – I’ll explore another time the ideas of this tiny group).
Further, it was clear that Cameron/Osborne intended to run a campaign based on hysterical warnings and bogus arguments/figures while ignoring the big questions about how the EU works and its trajectory. No10 tried to turn the whole complex issue into a question about whether the economy would grow a little bit slower over the next few years – a trivial issue relative to the significance of the overall question. They are not a duo who have ever engaged the public on a serious matter in a serious way. Their brains don’t work like that. They formed early habits of looking at everything through a very narrow prism of SW1 conventional political wisdom. Given this, the way the media works, how outnumbered we were among the influential broadcast media, and the way in which the media (inevitably to some extent) takes its lead from No10, why would I have tried to run a campaign based on educating normal people to a far higher level than the professionals and ‘experts’ who were fighting and covering the campaign? It would have been impossible to get even two sensible MPs to explain the same complex argument about such things on TV without cocking it up – it was hard enough to get people to say ‘let’s spend our money on our priorities’ without days of arguing. (If the vote had happened in 2017 and we’d had all that time to build sensibly more could have been done.)
We did try to get the media to focus on deeper questions of how the EU is run, its problems, its evolution and so on. We knew from the research that the more coverage of the EU, its powers, its record, its plans and so on the better for us. We had little to fear from serious policy discussion and much to gain. But we largely failed. (A big speech from Gove was turned by the Financial Times – yes, the FT that bemoaned the ‘low quality debate’ – into a story about whether he had ‘gaffed’ by mentioning Albania, though in plastering ‘Albania’ all over the place the FT accidentally helped us.) No10 calls up the BBC and says, ‘we’ve got a business letter tomorrow with dozens of household companies warning of Armageddon.’ If we published something worthy on the Eurozone’s debt and demographic nightmare, the structural problems of the Eurozone and implications of the Five Presidents’ Report, how far did this get? ‘Sounds boring. Who’s fronting it? Got any new names? Any chance of Boris putting the boot into Dave and George?’, is the first question from the BBC TV producer who has no interest in ‘the arguments’.
It was not in our power to change basics of how the media works. We therefore twisted them to our advantage to hack the system.
The media is obsessed with process and the snakes and ladders of careers. Many hacks said to me words to the effect: ‘I don’t care about the issues, I care about whether Cameron will still be PM at the end of the year.’ We could not match No10 in the golden currency of ‘names’. But we could give the media an even more valuable currency – a leadership story. When Boris and Gove decided to go for it after 29 May immigration numbers, we launched the story of ‘the alternative government’.
The media were understandably obsessed with this story so we served it up to them in such a way that they also had to cover our message. For 10 days, we dominated the news with a set of stories on the Australian points system, VAT on fuel, Turkey, the NHS and so on all based on ‘it’s safer to take back control’. Broadcasters lapped it up – even ITV News which barely pretended to be impartial was useful.
What did the public hear? They heard that prominent Conservatives, particularly Boris and Gove, did not trust Cameron’s promises or warnings and that there was an alternative path – we could ‘take back control’, have ‘an Australian style immigration system’, and ‘spend our money on our priorities like the NHS’. In an environment in which the central arguments concerning trade and the economy were incomprehensible to the ‘experts’ themselves and the history and dynamics of the EU either unknown to or suppressed by broadcasters, people chose between two simple stories. Vote Leave’s was more psychologically compelling, given the three powerful forces at work and No10’s errors.
(NB. Whoever leaked the Hilary email story was probably doing something similar. This played into the media obsession with scandal and process such that they spent a ridiculous amount of time on it despite probably 80% of them wanting Hilary to win. It shows how powerfully the media is in the grip of dynamics they rarely reflect on themselves. Putin’s communication maestro, Surkov, uses these sorts of tricks all the time. Cf. Peter Pomerantsev’s great book, a must read for any MP before they pontificate on Putin’s mafia government.)
The political media and how to improve it
High prestige pundits and editors yield great power over the stories told (and have far more power over politicians like Cameron, unfortunately, than they realise) but the field is not based on real expertise. Fields dominated by real expertise are distinguished by two features: 1) there is enough informational structure in the environment such that reliable predictions are possible despite complexity and 2) there is effective feedback so learning is possible.
Neither condition applies generally to politics or the political media. In the most rigorous studies done, it has been shown that in general political experts are little better than the proverbial dart throwing chimp and that those most confident in their big picture views and are most often on TV – people like Robert Peston, Jon Snow, and Evan Davis – are the least accurate political ‘experts’ (cf. HERE).
We know that cognitive diversity is vital for political accuracy yet almost all political institutions and the media – including the dominant people at Newsnight, the Economist, the FT, and Parliament – are actually remarkably homogenous, as discussed above, and they herd around very similar ideas about how the world works. Scientists and entrepreneurs in particular are almost totally excluded from political influence.
There is no structure to hold them to account either internally or externally so, like anyone when not forced to be rigorous, they fool themselves. It is normal to write month after month that the IN campaign cannot lose because of XYZ then just as confidently and authoritatively explain why IN lost without any intermediate step of identifying and explaining errors.
Despite the rise of social media most people get most of their news from TV. TV coverage of politics rarely illuminates much because there is no clear way to decide who is right about anything. The format makes it almost impossible for any useful discussion to happen. Interviewers, politicians, and pundits talk past each other with no clarity about assumptions. Questions are vague, often meaningless, posed by interviewers who rarely have more than a thin bluffer’s understanding of any policy issue and the same is usually true of those answering; the more famous the interviewer, the less likely it is they know anything about, say, education policy and like David Cameron they are bluffing. (As soon as a story is deemed ‘political’ it is taken out of the hands of specialists (who are very rarely actually specialists anyway) and given to ‘political’ hacks who have no idea of the policy.) Most of those professionally involved are much more interested in the ‘horse race’ political dimension than the policy. They obsess on process and scandal but most people have no interest in the process or ‘scandals’ because they assume ‘they’re all dodgy in some way’. Nobody tries to make predictions that can be checked and the shows don’t take what is said seriously enough to catalogue it. Simplistic stories compete so political analysis is dominated by endless false dichotomies.
Those making the shows do not understand how people learn so the dead format recycles grim clichés like Evan Davis saying ‘… economy down the plug hole’, while filming an actual plug hole, or Nick Robinson saying ‘… will the economy take off’ standing in front of a plane actually taking off (both of these have happened). Every night the News contains reports that are a mix of incomprehensible, facile, and boring to millions while also usually at best simplistic and often just wrong when it comes to policy / issues. The possibilities of the medium are largely ignored.
Insiders think of the masses as being irrational in paying so little attention to political debate. I think they are rational. If you want to understand politics you should read serious things and invest time and effort in researching public opinion. You should particularly make an effort to invert your point of view and consider opinions very different to your own. Time spent watching/listening to shows like Newsnight and Today is not just wasted – it is actively distorting reality and making you less informed. I often meet people who are cleverer than those in politics and successful but they have deluded views about politics because they pay too much attention to political analysis. Overall, unless you are professionally involved in politics you will be better off if you stop >95% active reading of political analysis. You will miss occasional worthwhile things but the effort of sorting them is not worth it. If something is genuinely very good / unusual and you have avoided isolating yourself in an echo chamber that insulates you from opinions very different to your own then someone reliable will send it to you. Even if you are professionally involved in politics I would do roughly the same. Extreme focus on important things you can control will repay far far more than time spent reading speculation about things you can’t control.
I read very little punditry during the campaign – just enough to preserve a sense of the gaps between the ‘croaking frogs’ and the real world. If I’d had less infighting to deal with I’d have read even less as I could have been less concerned about tracking certain things. In my entire time in the DfE (three years) I never listened to Today once (I listened to a handful of interviews on the web). I focused on managing priorities and saying ‘No, stop, that’s a waste of time’ every day.
This situation is particularly ironic because the media industry is in a panic about the internet, falling ad revenues and profits, the collapse of print journalism and so on.
There is a better way.
Example 1. Shows should require precise quantitative predictions about well-formed questions as Superforecasters do. Newspapers should do the same when interviewing people. The next step is using this process to push people towards admitting conditional errors like ‘if I am proved wrong about X by date Y then I will admit I was wrong to claim Z’. If political shows pushed their guests to do this and kept track of the predictions it could have a big positive effect. (Next time they come on you can flash up their record on a screen so the public can see how often they are right.) It is vital to change incentives so people are encouraged to admit errors and learn instead of fooling themselves constantly. For those who refuse it would be easy to develop a protocol that categorises their vague comments and puts numbers on them. This will push them to ‘correct the record’.
Example 2. Rip up the format for political shows and base broadcasts on a) an empirical assessment of what people actually know and b) the science of how people really learn and how best to communicate. Instead of the tedious low-information interviews, imagine what could be done if one had a mix of artists, scientists, and policy specialists trying really hard to use the possibilities of film to explain things, then used cutting edge data science to test how effective they were as part of a learning cycle driving higher quality. A news broadcast now contains much less information content and much higher noise than reading. The only way to improve this is experimenting with formats in a scientific way. Doing this would force those making the news to think more about policy and the audience would be much more engaged. People are interested in policy and ‘how X will affect me, my family, and my community’. It would also obviously require a lot of changes in the media but this is coming anyway because existing business models are blowing up.
Example 3. Pay for this partly by firing most of your political commentators like Dan Hodges. Broadcasters, fire 90% of your political correspondents. They are a waste of money. Hire a much smaller number of much better people with radically different skills and backgrounds and a different focus. (By doing #1 you will soon see who is more/less accurate so you’ll have a good benchmark.)
Together these changes could improve the quality by a factor of x10 or more. The same principle of focusing on precise quantitative predictions about well-formed questions could also be used to improve policy making and management of bureaucracies by developing clusters of well-formed questions that ‘surround’ a vaguer big question that is not so susceptible to measurement.
For example, break down ‘will Britain leaving the EU be a success?‘ into dozens of simpler more precise questions that can be quantified and which together give a useful part of an overall answer. This process could be put on a prediction platform for little money and dramatically improve the quality of decisions. The Superforecasters new consultancy could do this pretty simply with little help and not much money.
As usual in systems that are failing, the youngest people understand the problems and possibilities best while the most senior / prestigious figures can’t think of anything to do other than get overpaid for what they’ve always done. If you run a big media company, you should replace the expensive old schoolers like Jon Snow with younger, cheaper, and brighter new schoolers with an extreme focus on the public, not SW1.
An example of a simple, powerful media story that is wrong and contributed to forecasting errors on Brexit – ‘the centre ground’
One of the most misleading stories in politics is the story of ‘the centre ground’. In this story people’s views are distributed on an X-axis with ‘extreme left’ at one end, ‘extreme right’ at the other end, and ‘the centre ground’ in the middle. People in ‘the centre’ are ‘moderate’. ‘Extremists’ are always ‘lurching’ while ‘sensible moderates’ are urged to ‘occupy the centre’.
This story is one of the dominant features of political discussion and the basis for endless interviews, columns, and attempts at political ‘strategy’. The story is deeply flawed and where it is not trivially true it is deeply misleading.
Swing voters who decide elections – both those who swing between Conservative/Labour and those who swing between IN/OUT – do not think like this. They support much tougher policies on violent crime than most Tory MPs AND much higher taxes on the rich than Blair, Brown, and Miliband. They support much tougher anti-terrorism laws than most Tory MPs AND they support much tougher action on white collar criminals and executive pay than Blair, Brown, and Miliband.
One of the key delusions that ‘the centre ground’ caused in SW1 concerned immigration. Most people convinced themselves that ‘swing voters’ must have a ‘moderate’ and ‘centre ground’ view between Farage and Corbyn. Wrong. About 80% of the country including almost all swing voters agreed with UKIP that immigration was out of control and something like an Australian points system was a good idea. This was true across party lines.
This was brought home to me very starkly one day. I was conducting focus groups of Conservative voters. I talked with them about immigration for 20 minutes (all focus groups now start with immigration and tend to revert to it within two minutes unless you stop them). We then moved onto the economy. After two minutes of listening I was puzzled and said – who did you vote for? Labour they all said. An admin error by the company meant that I had been talking to core Labour voters, not core Tory voters. On the subject of immigration, these working class / lower middle class people were practically indistinguishable from all the Tories and UKIP people I had been talking to.
The media tried to categorise Vote Leave as ‘right wing’ while Tory MPs and Farage’s gang were screaming at me about our championing the NHS and our attacks on the indefensible pay of FTSE CEOs. SW1 did not understand our appeal but the crucial voters did because they do not think as the ‘experts’ think they think. We tried to speak to a majority in the country. Cameron and Osborne have never won even 40%. They approached it as they did previous battles but this greatly limited their appeal. Most UKIP and Tory voters (rather than MPs/insiders) agreed with us on the NHS and executive pay while also agreeing with us on the need to take back control of immigration policy from a system that has obviously failed. Our campaign was neither Left nor Right in the eyes of the crucial audience.
The media made a similar mistake with Trump. Trump did lots of things wrong and the post facto re-branding of his campaign as ‘brilliant’ is very silly. BUT he had a national message the core of which appealed to a big majority and which defied categorisation as Left/Right. Again the media do not realise this – they label it, like Vote Leave, as ‘populist right’ (abetted by some charlatan academics). But the reason why it is successful is exactly because it is not a simple right-wing message.
It doesn’t occur to SW1 and the media that outside London their general outlook is seen as extreme. Have an immigration policy that guarantees free movement rights even for murderers, so we cannot deport them or keep them locked up after they are released? Extreme. Have open doors to the EU and don’t build the infrastructure needed? Extreme. Take violent thugs who kick women down stairs on CCTV, there is no doubt about their identity, and either don’t send them to jail or they’re out in a few months? Extreme. Have a set of policies that stops you dealing with the likes of ‘the guy with the hook’ for over a decade while still giving benefits to his family? Extreme. Ignore warnings about the dangers of financial derivatives, including from the most successful investor in the history of the world, and just keep pocketing the taxes from the banks and spending your time on trivia rather than possible disasters? Extreme. Make us – living on average wages without all your lucky advantages – pay for your bailouts while you keep getting raises and bonuses? Extreme and stupid – and contemptible.
These views are held across educational lines, across party lines, and across class lines. Cameron, Blair, and Evan Davis agree about lots of these things and tell people constantly why they are wrong to think differently but to millions they are the extremists.
(This is not a post facto rationalisation. I wrote about the centre ground and the EU in 2014 HERE.)
Why I got involved and my role
Winning the referendum against Cameron was not the way I wanted things to happen. I thought the chances of winning a referendum against a PM on the other side, with all the possibilities for him to mobilise the system behind IN, were low. Many prominent Eurosceptics (not all) lobbied for it out of a combination of self-promotion and not knowing how to solve the real problem – what should the UK-EU relationship be? The referendum was very useful for many Out-ers: it provided a much simpler political focus than figuring out a complex positive agenda, removed the need for difficult thinking and action, and gave people a chance to pose on the side of ‘democracy’. I thought it foolish to push for a referendum while simultaneously not building a serious movement to win it. (I had tried to start building such a movement in 2004 after the euro battle was clearly won but could not persuade crucial people so decided to drop the issue for a while.) Romantic long shots are rarely wise in politics particularly if there is a better path.
I thought it wiser and safer to wait for Cameron to go then try to capture the Tory leadership and change the UK-EU relationship from Downing Street with someone who actually wanted to solve the problems (Cameron’s best friends would not claim that he wanted to spend his time trying to solve these deep problems, he wanted not to think about the EU and got into an existential battle he never wanted). If you are going to have a referendum, then have it when controlling the institutions and when you can set the agenda. A British PM could invite the EU to evolve such as to include a) those in the euro, Single Market and ‘free movement’, and b) those outside some or all of those three but with free trade and friendly cooperation between all. The chances are low that there would have been support for fundamental change but then a divorce could have happened after a serious clarifying debate which would have occurred ~2018-25, including the Eurozone countries figuring out what they would do. This would have been a much better way to proceed than the charade of Cameron’s ‘renegotiation’. Either Europe would have embraced a new and more open architecture (unlikely) or the Government would have won a Leave referendum with 60-70% and prompted a lot of clarifying thought across Europe.
I also thought it foolish of Cameron to cave into the pressure and promise a referendum in 2013. So did Gove and Osborne both of whom told Cameron not to do it. He mistakenly thought it would take the wind out of UKIP’s sails and did not understand why it would actually boost UKIP and Farage. (This was not hard to foresee and I suspect part of the problem was that Cameron did not appreciate that him promising a referendum would be thought by most as just a typical pre-election lie.) The idea that there was an irresistible force for a referendum is pushed by Farage’s and Cameron’s supporters. They are both wrong. The country supported one but without any passion outside the small fraction who had long been passionate about it. Most Tory MPs did not want it. Most Tory donors thought the timing was wrong and wanted a focus on stopping Miliband who they feared. Those MPs who did want it could mostly have been bought off or distracted in other ways – a mix of some policy, gongs, bribes, and so on in the usual fashion. Putting a date on the vote was particularly mistaken – it would have been far better to leave it open-ended ‘in the next Parliament’.
Once the election happened there was a sudden panic among OUT-ers. UKIP was an organisational disaster. There was no national campaign prepared. There were many tiny groups who often hated each other more than they wanted to win and were conditioned to expect failure and defeat. There was an abundance of people who thought that the campaign was quite simple – put me on TV, they thought, and the nation will appreciate my natural leadership. There was practically nothing of what was actually needed. Many quickly flipped into panic mode assuming the vote was unwinnable.
Having opposed the push for a referendum, I was faced with an uncomfortable choice in May 2015. Either keep out of politics, refuse to help, and then feel miserable about the tragicomic campaign, or re-engage with people I did not want to work with, feel miserable about the tragicomic campaign, and in almost every way make my life worse. In many ways irrationally, I chose the latter. My thinking was something like this: the chance of changing the whole political system (more profoundly than in a normal election) comes along very rarely, the chaos of the eurosceptics and the complacency of Cameron creates a very slim bridge to seize control and do it, a small chance of very high impact is worth the gamble. About a month or so later my wife was pregnant. If the timing had been slightly different I might well have stayed retired.
Why do it?
I thought that Leaving would improve the probability of 1) Britain contributing positively to the world and 2) minimising dangers. I thought it would:
minimise Britain’s exposure to the problems caused by the EU;
improve the probability that others in Europe would change course before more big crises hit, e.g. by limiting free movement which is the biggest threat to continued free trade;
require and therefore hopefully spark big changes in the fundamental wiring of UK government including an extremely strong intelligent focus on making Britain the best place in the world for science and education;
improve the probability of building new institutions for international cooperation to minimise the probability of disasters.
The foundation problem with the EU was best summarised by the brilliant physicist David Deutsch, the man who extended Alan Turing’s 1936 paper on computation into the realm of quantum mechanics. Deutsch said:
‘The EU is incompatible with Britain’s more advanced political culture. I’m voting Leave… [E]rror correction is the basic issue, and I can’t foresee the EU improving much in this respect… [P]reserving the institutions of error correction is more important than any policy… Whether errors can be corrected without violence is not a “concern” but a condition for successfully addressing concerns.’
Healthy and effective systems like our immune system and the English common law allow constant and rapid error-correction. Unhealthy and ineffective systems like the EU and modern Whitehall departments block error-correction. They are extremely centralised and hierarchical therefore information processing is blocked and problems are not solved. In politics this often leads to disasters when more and more resources are devoted to reinforcing failure. NB. This most fundamental question played effectively no role in the debate.
This fundamental problem generates its other problems. It arises because of how Monnet and Delors created its institutions deliberately in opposition to the Anglo-American system they bitterly opposed. The Foreign Office romantic delusion of ‘influence’ was peddled by every PM since Thatcher. Every one left office having demonstrated how empty the hope is. True influence comes from demonstrating success – not sitting in meetings for forty years in an institution that is programmed on principles that guarantee worse error-correction than the evolved institutions of the Anglo-American system.
I will go into the problems of the EU another time. I will just make one important point here.
I thought very strongly that 1) a return to 1930s protectionism would be disastrous, 2) the fastest route to this is continuing with no democratic control over immigration or human rights policies for terrorists and other serious criminals, therefore 3) the best practical policy is to reduce (for a while) unskilled immigration and increase high skills immigration particularly those with very hard skills in maths, physics and computer science, 4) this requires getting out of the EU, 5) hopefully it will prod the rest of Europe to limit immigration and therefore limit the extremist forces that otherwise will try to rip down free trade.
One of our campaign’s biggest failures was to get even SW1 to think seriously about this, never mind millions of voters. Instead the false idea spread and is still dominant that if you are on the side of free trade, think controlled immigration generally a positive force, and want more international cooperation rather than a return to competing nation states then you must support the EU. I think this error is caused by the moral signalling and gang mentality described above.
What was my role?
My role mainly involved:
a) trying to suppress/divert/overcome internal coalition warfare to a level where about ten crucial people were protected enough to do their jobs,
b) building the team,
c) management,
d) taking a small number of important decisions about policy, message, money, and the machine,
e) providing clear focus and priorities, including the vital job that nobody likes of saying ‘no’ to hundreds of people (thus making (a) harder), and
f) dealing with big problems.
The media tends to suggest my role was mainly talking to them. This is wrong. The same happened with my role in the DfE. In both projects my main role was management. Serious management means extreme focus and this requires saying No an awful lot. Contrary to the media story, I dislike confrontation and rows like most people but I am very strongly motivated by doing things in a certain way and am not motivated by people in SW1 liking me. This is often confused with having a personality that likes fighting with people. One of the basic reasons so much in politics is mismanaged is that so often those responsible are more interested in social relations than in results and unlike in other more successful fields the incentives are not structured to control this instinct.
Many have written that I got involved with this because of ‘hate’ or ‘loathing’ for Cameron. Wrong. I do not hate Cameron. I do not respect him, which is different. I thought that he was in politics for bad reasons – essentially because he was someone who wanted ‘To Be’, not someone who wanted ‘To Do’ (see the Colonel Boyd speech) and his priority was himself and a small gang, not the public. I also thought Cameron was mostly (not all) bad at the job, despite having some of the necessary temperamental characteristics, and was flattered by having Brown then Miliband as opponents. I didn’t object to him blocking me from Government in 2010. He was entitled not to hire someone who did not take him seriously and ignored the orders of his Chief of Staff.
I spent a few years of my life (1999-2002) trying to stop Blair on the euro before anyone had heard of Cameron. In 2004 I co-founded the campaign that won the referendum on the North East Regional Assembly 80-20 as a training exercise for a possible future EU referendum. My motivation was the issue itself – not personal antipathy for Cameron or anybody else. I’ve never been a party person. I’m not Tory, libertarian, ‘populist’ or anything else. I follow projects I think are worthwhile.
Farage’s motley crew claim that I did this campaign in order to lose it deliberately then get a job in No 10 with Cameron. It is pointless to discuss this theory though the fact that they understood so little about the political environment, and struggled to use Google, was an important fact.
I am not clever, I have a hopeless memory, and have almost no proper ‘circle of competence’. I made lots of mistakes in the campaign. I have had success in building and managing teams. This success has not relied on a single original insight of any kind. It comes from applying what Charlie Munger calls unrecognised simplicities of effective action that one can see implemented by successful people/organisations.
Effective because they work reliably, simple enough that even I could implement them, and ‘unrecognised’ because they are hiding in plain sight but are rarely stolen and used. I found 10-15 highly motivated people who knew what they were doing and largely left them to get on with it while stopping people who did not know what they were doing interfering with them, we worked out a psychologically compelling simple story, and we applied some simple management principles that I will write about another time. It is hard to overstate the relative importance in campaigns of message over resources. Our success is an extreme example given the huge imbalance in forces on either side. In many ways Trump’s victory has little resemblance to what we did but in this respect he is another example.
We also got lucky.
I will post a number of blogs of the referendum to try to answer some basic questions including:
What were the main political, operational, financial/budgetary, and data/digital lessons from the campaign?
What worked and did not work?
How confident can we be about these judgements?
There is a natural set of categories and I will post links to blogs below:
Some basic numbers that summarise important elements.
Policy.
On data science, digital marketing, canvassing software made available for download. (NB. There has been some confusion about this blog. The VICS system is a web-based canvassing tool, the first proper one that works in the UK – it was one component of our overall data science approach and should not be equated with it. It is not a data science tool – it provided data to the data science team.)
The ground campaign.
Internal politics and the infighting.
Dynamics that affect ‘what next’.
The rules: how could they be improved to make future votes serve the public better?
Please leave comments and corrections below. I am happy to approve hostile comments if they have substance and will moderate comments to avoid putting sensible people off reading them.
Related
Unrecognised simplicities of effective action #1: expertise and a quadrillion dollar business →
101 thoughts on “On the referendum #21: Branching histories of the 2016 referendum and ‘the frogs before the storm’”
Luke Jacobs | January 9, 2017 at 16:46
Dominic. Appreciate your candour and self-criticism here, and your own adherence to error-correction. One thing that I’d like to ask is that if you firmly believe “a return to 1930s protectionism would be disastrous” then how do you square that with the (hardening every day) idea of the UK reverting to WTO rules once we leave the EU, and falling back on tariffs? Appreciate that the end game would be FTA’s with other countries, and over time the EU, but isn’t this a backwards step?
LikeLiked by 1 person
Les Kaye | January 10, 2017 at 16:09
There is an argument that we should abandon the Article 50 process and just leave. This would cut out all the uncertainty and friction. WTO tariffs are not that bad with UK exporters facing around £6bn largely offset by the devaluation of the Pound whereas EU27 exporters would face around £13bn tariffs into the UK helping to discourage UK imports and correct the trade imbalance. These figures are trivial as a proportion of our £1.8tn economy.
I do not agree.
The European Council (EU27 leaders) confirmed at its December meeting that it would “remain seized” of the Brexit process. They will provide a representative of the Council at every negotiating meeting with the UK in order to keep the Commission and Barnier on a tight leash. There is an excellent possibility of concluding a satisfactory free trade agreement as part of the A50 process and within the allowed time frame.
The UK is the EU27’s single largest export market and foreign currency generator. The UK’s £291bn imports representing 2.6% of total EU27 GDP. Their annual growth rate is optimistically forecast at 1.5%. Remain supporters should be the first to understand the perils of creating a “DIY recession”.
It is inconceivable that the EU 27 can play “hard ball” in the Brexit negotiation with key EU leaders facing their hostile electorates over the next 15 months and the EU banks and the Euro teetering of a mountain of debt and rising interest rates.
Grant Manheim | January 15, 2017 at 08:54
Thank you for your compelling and fascinating piece….your granularity prompted me to twice re-read it.
As you suggest (and I recall as the WSJ posited) the referendum asked: who are you? Are you a Brit, or, are you a Euro? Once answered, the consequence was near predictable.
And I was thrilled you noted Cohen-Blind…..
And – if you don’t already know about – suggest you would be amused + interested in the hustler “PARVUS” (spook name for Israel Lazarevich Gelfand), who in 1917 sold the Wilhelmstrasse the idea of sending Lenin to Russia ….and …. Bricmont, the lefty physicists who says convincingly national identity dooms the EU.
Again, thank you.
Paul Howard | January 9, 2017 at 16:50
Probably one of the most brilliant blogs I have ever read.
reads like a thriller, and made me think.
your highly intelligent and thoughtful analysis has helped me see the referendum in a new light
I was , and still am a staunch remainer ,and was always hostile to you.
You have excelled in this
thank you
Maggie Ansell | January 9, 2017 at 21:03
l agree totally with the first half of your post. But I was a staunch Brexiteer from the get-go (actually from the day the Common Market became the European Union by such stealth) – and I campaigned actively. And I was truly astounded at the strength & dedication of the VL central office and its tireless, wided-ranging work and the insights I saw. No stone was left unturned, no approach or tit-bit of information from anyone, incluidng the workers in the field ignored or unacknowledged.
It was a masterpiece example of ‘how to do it’. Hats off to this man – huge Respect !!
LikeLiked by 1 person
Susan Fairley | January 9, 2017 at 16:51
So nice to hear history from the front line Dominic..a rare event.
However..there is always a however…could you possibly make it hugely shorter…..you lose your impact by repetition and volume…and that shortchanges you so much.
Ken Maxwell | January 9, 2017 at 16:53
Thank you for doing what you did, when you did as regards the EU referendum. I hope writing it up is as insightful for you as the output is fascinating to me. I wish you, your wife and newish baby well for the future you have helped so much to create.
Maggie Ansell | January 9, 2017 at 21:05
Agreed & heartily seconded by me !
OrphicQualities | January 9, 2017 at 17:39
When governing is seen as “management” (based on positive outcomes) rather than “politics” (the art of power and persuasion), assumed systems of government become evidently unsuited. The study of “politics” and PPE’s is causing a severe supply issue for the “educated politics class” as they are being shown by their actions as unempirical. This considered with the additional issues of “virtue signalling” and social bubbles reveals a insightful background for why modern governments in the UK and across the Western world have drifted from the concerns of the majority.
Fantastic Post. Thanks for sharing.
Jack Hennessey | January 9, 2017 at 17:47
simon wookey | January 9, 2017 at 17:55
The biggest problem I have with the whole anti-EU movement is that it prevents a much needed look at the sclerotic institutions within the UK. The UK is one of the most centralized countries in the world and it suffers greatly because of it. Rather than letting the regions play to their strengths and innovate everything is homogenized and centrally controlled through various policy and management techniques.
This country used to have wonderfully innovative and diverse municipal cultures that provided for the public good, encouraged business, and sought to engage with the world without having to look to London for funds or permission. Towns like Boston used to have more trade with the continent in goods and ideas than it did with the south of England. Boston is also the town that voted to leave more than anywhere else is now, ironically, seeing a renaissance because those links are returning in the form of people and trade. New factories are opening to process EU foodstuffs because Boston is once again becoming a European hub thanks to immigration – which they voted to end because the central authority couldn’t get its act together and provide the services a growing community needed. Something that wouldn’t have happened if local communities had agency over their destiny.
Blaming the EU for problems that are inherently self inflicted is a huge disservice to the people and the country.
neokrokodil | January 9, 2017 at 18:16
Absolutely fantastic writing, this text should be compulsory reading for future students researching this time in British politics.
Thank you.
Maggie Ansell | January 9, 2017 at 21:07
Hear hear – and I’m sure it will be !!
david wootton | January 9, 2017 at 18:16
One of the most interesting essays I have read in a very long while.
A Loser | January 9, 2017 at 18:31
Uh, RE: The Corbyn thing, polls showed that around 50% of Labour voters (in 2015) didn’t know Labour favoured remain. Hard to say if that had an effect, but they aren’t wrong that they did a lackluster effort.
..Silicon Implant!! | January 9, 2017 at 18:40
Fascinating, thank you for taking the time!
FWIW, I voted Brexit, while holding my nose over the whole Farage faction and his fairly blatant xenophophobia. I had ‘priced in’ that the result would not necessarily be economically pretty, but I was motivated by long term antipathy to the democratic deficit, made real and acute by the fates of Cyprus, Ireland & Greece… but I don’t really see that as being a strand in your messaging anywhere, so I probably didn’t get that view reinforced by your campaign, and if you weren’t pushing that line, it’s probably because I was not representative of any significant slice of the electorate?
Wendy Buss | January 9, 2017 at 18:55
A very interesting blog, I learnt one or two things – thankyou.
Joe | January 9, 2017 at 18:59
Really interesting read.
It did make me feel rather miserable for the state of politics. Only at the end do we get to Mr Cummings’ outline reasons for being on the VL side. These are far more interesting and reasonable than anything we heard in the whole campaign (although I disagree with 3, maybe all of them, but I’m sure nobody who has got this far down wants to know why!). But I do accept that any simplification/falsification was just as prominent on the IN side. And the cultural/signalling point about the remain vote rings very true from experience, which is also probably why people were so angry afterwards, as the vote revealed that they/we didn’t live in the country they thought they did.
What a shame though; to see such an intelligent piece concerned for so long over what people think (who aren’t really thinking, on either side), rather than what ‘is’, and I’m sure the author would agree.
Two points:
1. Cummings rightly acknowledges that the vast majority of MPs/commentariat don’t have the foggiest when it comes to EU law, customs unions, single market legislation, and the EU’s interaction with human rights legislation. Cluelessness on both sides. But surely it is more pressing for those pressing to actively leave to understand the status quo so the change isn’t chaos and promises can be realised (by contrast, on the remain side, this is the job of civil servants on a day to day basis rather than legislators). So to see high profile leave politicians, in their newly created, Leave-specific posts, spouting nonsense, is more galling than a remain MP talking a bit of bollocks about the customs union during the campaign.
It is easy to criticise ALL political commentators and journalists, but to name two, I have yet to see any Leave (or indeed Government) responses to the considered critiques by the likes of David Allen Green (on law disentanglement and process) or Ian Dunt (on trade policy) that remotely match up in terms of quality or knowledge. Perhaps I’m not looking in the right places.
2. If you treat politics cynically as being purely the means by which you achieve your ends, which is probably sensible, you do have more responsibility on issues where you are playing with fire. Of course VL didn’t create anger about immigration out of thin air. But using and inflating the issue of immigration as a signifier for people’s general sense of discontentment, way beyond any factual relationship (beyond temporal correlation) that exists, is cynicism verging into recklessness. More racist attacks since June. Or, more importantly I’m sure, for an ideas man like Cummings, the victory of a populist logic that rejects trade, immigration and blames others- hardly the ally of free trade. Try putting that genie back in the bottle.
Peter Scrowther | May 28, 2017 at 09:18
Fascinating read, but I too am concerned about stoking fear and hatred for expediency’s sake (even if leave campaign didn’t create the base for this). Two people just murdered in U.S. for trying to protect Muslim women from racist abuse. Do we want to set a tone that helps foster such events?
Mark | January 9, 2017 at 19:14
I was for remain but understood some of the arguments for leave. This analysis is absolutely fascinating.
Andy | January 9, 2017 at 19:36
Fascinating reading of what was an extra-ordinary achievement winning against the odds, the establishment and all it’s rescources. I had never before (I’m 54) joined a campaign, delivered leaflets or manned a street stall – donating a few £ or joining a political party yes but mever before getting off my backside. For this issue the decision to do so was a no brainer. This was achieved without more than a few words about how close to collpase the eurozone is and the economic pain inflicted on much of Europe by it’s flawed design and mismanagement. It’s failed and dysfunctional on so many levels, economically and politically. All this and they want an army !
Good luck with whatever the future holds for you and a massive thanks you.
Maggie Ansell | January 9, 2017 at 21:15
Well done Andy. Without the inspired campaign management from the top down and spreading gradually until it reached the local street-stall & leafletting levels, it wouldn’t have happened – but it was people exactly like you who helped to turn the tide….
Sheila Pettett | January 10, 2017 at 17:35
Yes, The same for me. I have never been so fired up, I read some books and am totally convinced that we should leave the EU, usually I cant be bothered with politics mainly because of what Dominic mentioned. They have absolutely no idea of the opinions and concerns of the average ‘Lower Middle Class voter’ and take the path of To Be rather than To do. I still feel passionate about it. I just hope I live long enough to see it happen. (I am 72!)
andrewgnixon | January 9, 2017 at 19:41
As I read this extraordinary post, great vertiginous vistas of my own ignorance opened up. Thank you for writing it.
Philip Craig | January 9, 2017 at 19:43
Thanks for writing this – one of the best political reads since the Clark diaries.
Angus McNeill Peel | January 9, 2017 at 20:00
Found this utterly fascinating and tremendously written. Your revelation of the highest echelons of British politics as full of the greatest incompetency is genuinely worrying. A question: do you think that the civil service and May administration can remotely deal with Brexit negotiations if they have inherited that same chaotic, uninformed bureaucracy?
Christian Koefoed-Nielsen | January 13, 2017 at 11:23
I thought this was a superb piece of work – and share your concern over the ability of our existing administrative structure and politicians to deliver any kind of exit.
RobbyB | January 9, 2017 at 20:20
Thank you for an interesting read. I write with the perspective of a VoteLeave volunteer in N Yorks. I usually vote Tory but prior to the referendum I had never been politically active other than taking a close interest in current affairs. Contrary to the stereotypical media narrative, my wife and I are both professionals and our student children both study academic subjects (you will like that my eldest is studying for a PhD in Physics). All of us voted to leave on sovereignty grounds. My wife and I both campaigned locally on the streets and would like to offer some thoughts based on what we observed:
1. It seemed that people had a great many different reasons for supporting Leave. It was enough to appeal to their one or two main issues to secure their vote. I very much agree that leave voters were highly committed to cast their vote and they were proud, albeit somewhat guiltily, to tell you that that’s what they’d do.
2. People didn’t seem really interested in whether you wore a red VoteLeave T-shirt, a green ‘Go’ one, or a purple UKIP one. We campaigned right alongside these other groups and were in fact organised by a local coordinator that marshalled resources from all 3 organisations.
3. I deduce from this that whilst I accept that Farage toxicity might have been a concern at the strategic campaign level, it was less of an issue at the grassroots level where we were united in a single aim to win the referendum.
4. At the time, we were horrified by the divisions between the leave campaigns which we were concerned would become the sole media focus. With hindsight, I accept your argument that the divisive arguments in London served a wider purpose to set the tone especially early on in the campaign.
5. As a foot soldier, I very much look forward to reading your blog on the street campaign. Thanks again.
Andy Orpointis | January 9, 2017 at 20:33
Fascinating stuff Dominic. I am an avowed Remainer, and an admittedly shrill one on occasion, but I cannot deny that your post above is significantly more thoughtful and considered than much of the Remain message was during the campaign. More power to your elbow, and thank you for your honesty.
Bendor Grosvenor | January 9, 2017 at 20:34
Fascinating insights; indeed brilliant in many ways.
Applaud your modesty, but don’t entirely believe it.
Agree wholly about ‘news’, & political approaches of SW1.
Disagree with view (hope?) that if only Boris/Gove had got in, all would be well.
Tom | January 9, 2017 at 20:37
//We all fool ourselves but the more educated are particularly overconfident that they are not fooling themselves. //
I think this is incorrect. How do you square this claim with the Dunning–Kruger effect? I grant that intelligence =/= education, however I think there is a correlation. Doesn’t the balance of empirical evidence indicate that less intelligent people are more certain in their beliefs?
DS | January 9, 2017 at 23:31
“How do you square this claim with the Dunning–Kruger effect”
Maybe you can answer for him?
Mike | January 10, 2017 at 14:35
I think it may be different in a sphere like politics where victory is won by making salient points, finding good analogies and debating. Clever people win debates.
Clever people are not necessarily as smart as they think they are, which is Dominic’s point…
James | January 10, 2017 at 16:57
That’s not a correct interpretion re. Intelligence, in my view, and the answer you’re looking for lies in the arguments made in the Kruger-Dunning nobel prize winning paper itself:
“Unskilled and Unaware…”
The authors argue that competencies are skill/ domain specific. ALL people suffer from these cognitive biases, independent of their level of education / skills in other domains. There are of course transferable skills, but a person educated to degree level, & competent in, a particular subject does not necessarily justify high confidence in other domains they haven’t been trained to evaluate the evidence available.
Anecdotally, I’ve seen many more examples of misplaced confidence in university educated persons when making claims regarding other domains e.g. Politics.
I think Daniel Kahnemann should be compulsory reading at undergraduate level! We are all prone to heuristic mechanisms where we substitute hard questions for easy ones without realising it. The question “Should the UK leave the European Union?” Is an extremely difficult question that requires weighing up numerous variables, and significant time investment to answer competently. Unknowingly, I think it could easily be substituted for some variation of the far easier question “Do I like Europeans and European culture?”
Chris Doyle | January 11, 2017 at 07:58
James, I love Europeans and European culture and was lucky enough to live in Spain in the early nineties, learning Spanish in the process.
The UK should never have joined the EU in the first place and should have left decades ago. Certainly, we should leave now.
There is no contradiction between these statements and so your alternative question seems to add nothing but confusion.
TinyCO2 | January 11, 2017 at 20:04
Not at all James. Most British like the Europeans and their cultures very well, they just don’t like the EU. The problem of immigration is not the many ‘cultures’ that concerns us, it’s the ‘many’ that causes problems.
Some if not all of our objections towards the EU may have been possible to eradicate if our MPs, MEPs, justice systems and Civil Servants had been more vigorous in defending British citizens but they cave at every opportunity. Worse, they were happy to blame the EU for everything. The only argument that worked was the financial one and like many blackmail opportunities, it loses its potency every time it’s used. Eventually people say ‘do it’.
Will McNeill | February 3, 2017 at 09:12
Contrary to some of the other comments I think that for some people (both Leave and Remain) the question did become one of culture. Chris & TinyCO2 – you can easily see James’ point as influencing people (perhaps irrationally) to vote ‘remain’.
I’ve been thinking about the ‘groupthink’ issue quite a lot since reading this post.
“Anecdotally, I’ve seen many more examples of misplaced confidence in university educated persons when making claims regarding other domains e.g. Politics.”
(1) anecdotal evidence is a very dangerous input to weak heuristic thinking and groupthink.
(2) Dominic asserts that the university educated tend to talk more about (at least ‘high-level’ or abstract) political questions. Hence there would naturally be more chance to observe over-confidence.
(3) Dominic’s idea that the well-educated are *more* prone to groupthink just seems completely unevidenced to me. They have traditionally been (i) more of a group of the sort for which feedback loops can emerge and (ii) more engaged in and with more priveleged access to the ‘broader’ discussions in politics.
Given this, there has been more potential for groupthink of a broad political nature among this (very protean) ‘group’.
This imbalance is now changing. Social media sets up the conditions to have groups with the vicious kinds of feedback which were once the preserve of th privileged few. That’s one reason why ‘Leave’ were so wise to concentrate their resources on digital.
Steven Durrant | January 9, 2017 at 20:54
So for such an intelligent and in depth study, I wonder if the writer has any kind of…you know…plan. Because nothing was expressed in the campaign or in this piece or by “government” since.
It really is quite important stuff. Is asking for a plan really so out there? I often get called a traitor for it.
Nick Delfas | January 9, 2017 at 21:22
Great essay. Some of it was laugh out loud funny, especially barbs against Peston, Marr, Snow etc.
Just as I read this I turn on Sky News to see Ed Conway reducing Brexit to flavours of ice cream and saying we might (might!) leave the Single Market. No useful information imparted at all.
Harry Dibbs | January 9, 2017 at 22:33
My God, brilliant. I find you a most eloquent writer, and took a lot from this account. That is not to say I think you’re a hundred percent on the money, Mr Cummings, but your arguments about the centre ground, for instance, were distinctly compelling. I shall be sure to send this to all my wannabe Machiavelli friends.
Paul J. Adam | January 9, 2017 at 22:35
M Bridson | January 9, 2017 at 23:16
Thadia Quirk | January 9, 2017 at 23:22
The modesty is beguiling, the nuance and apparent honesty interestingly at odds with the campaign tactics. Missing from this account is the question: what now? What after the EU? What if your criticisms are valid, but your method in addressing them turns out not to be a remedy, but actually makes things worse? Will you be content in the role you played, particularly as you were not straightforward with the choices you presented to people?
Bill quango MP | January 9, 2017 at 23:22
Very interesting. A very useful insight.
I have almost finished Tim’s book. It is very good. I wondered if he had been so dismissive of Farage because Farage was doing a different book. You seem to suggest Farage was a hinderence to leave.
But he must have been worth his 12 – 14% of UKIP votes? Or do you suspect they were in the bag at the start and Nigel on Tv 24 hours could only have lost some floaters?
Jim Hill | January 10, 2017 at 00:48
dds | January 10, 2017 at 03:40
As always, a pleasure to read.
The phenomenon of the irrationality of the better educated is something I’ve been considering lately.
I don’t disagree with the ideas you put forward, but would add two more to the mix which I think may contribute:
i. There is a desire to reach an answer, a position, or a solution, when often there is no evidence to justify doing so. Better educated people, particularly those educated in the humanities, struggle to invest time in complex ideas only to yield the same level of uncertainty as when they started (cf. physics/maths). “I don’t know / I am uncertain” is an entirely acceptable outcome. But for many, when confronted with such horror, the temptation to succumb to heuristics and oversimplifications becomes too much. I suspect in part that this is fostered by years of rhetorical training, largely through essay writing and debating.
ii. In a social environments where status and image are overvalued, which are often those the better educated find themselves working in, the magnitude of cognitive dissonance is amplified. Thus reneging on false conclusions is an even greater challenge.
I have yet to finish reading your educational manifesto, so apologies if it’s there, but see a pressing need to teach our more able students (I’d prefer it if we taught all our children) that no matter how erudite they become, no matter how slick their rhetoric gets, they still run off a monkey lizard brain and should always be on their guard.
Fred | January 10, 2017 at 03:45
Reading the stuff about Farage one wonders even though he did want to win, how much he cared about winning and how much he cared about creating a populist identity (as he’s doing now).
Thanks, anyway. I didn’t like how anti-intellectual the victory seemed but maybe that fight is for another day and I’m glad the first hurdle has been passed.
RNewton | January 10, 2017 at 06:20
Thank you, absorbing read. Speaking as a professional charlatan and purveyor of humbuggery, a couple of points re: ad and communications effectiveness. Your strategic decision to focus spend on digital at the single, once in a generation, binary, decisive moment makes perfect sense, in the context of months long saturated media coverage, clear sides, decades of buried (EU) emotions, ground game, and a couple of PT Barnum-esque figures to make, as the master said, “glittering appearances”. Agree completely with your point on data. Take all that stuff away, and apply the same digital strategy for x, y, or z, product, throw in other variable e.g. low vs high involvement, low vs high sociability, then recency theory not so robust. You did the work of a good agency yourself, in terms of listening to audience and landing on ‘control’ message.
andrewgnixon | January 10, 2017 at 07:45
Dominic – I commented with a brief word of thanks above but felt I had to return with something more fulsome. Without exaggeration, this is the article I have been wanting to read since June, and it probably renders every other opinion piece I’ve read about the referendum virtually irrelevant.
I hated the referendum and I hated the debate and I hated all the media and social media coverage, yet was quite addicted to it, all of it. I voted Leave, but only after absurd amounts of agonising and only finally made up my mind in the polling booth.
I fully expected Remain to win and when it didn’t, I was thoroughly discombobulated. It felt rather as if the tectonic plates of my political and sociological assumptions had lurched violently beneath me.
I couldn’t articulate exactly what or why this was, but two things seemed clear: (1) that my close following of the great rotating circle jerk of the British political commentariat (Twitter – newspaper op-eds – Newsnight – Twitter and round again) had actively diminished my understanding of the world rather than improved it.
And (2) that there had at some point in the recent past appeared a really very profound disconnection between the concerns and priorities of what you call SW1 and the concerns and priorities of the great majority of the British public. Many pundits on left and right have of course banged on about this in various ways, but usually they’re just complaining that the ‘Westminster Bubble’ isn’t pushing their particular agenda.
What really did it for me was Cameron’s own assessment that his greatest achievement in politics was the upgrading of civil partnerships to gay marriages. Now I approve of gay marriage, it’s fine by me. But it’s the sort of pleasing thing that should be a cherry on the top of a substantial cake of political achievement. It has almost no bearing on the pressing practical concerns of voters. A whole generation of young workers that can’t afford to buy even the most modest property; people whose home towns have, without consultation, been utterly transformed by unprecedented economic migration; a nagging sense that one’s children will have lots of gadgets but no real prospect of reliable, well-paid work or a decent family home…. And there’s Cameron proudly trumpeting gay marriage as his great achievement for the nation? He left no cake, only a cherry sitting sadly on a great empty plate.
Your post – particularly the sections on the media and how it influences politicians, and the myth of the centre-ground – begins to fill in some of the disconcerting blanks at which I’d been staring. It is not just required reading, it feels like it requires one to stop reading nearly everything else.
Chris Doyle | January 11, 2017 at 08:08
Hear hear, Mr Nixon. I fully agree with your comments and they are well made. My only difference with you is that, if Remain won, I think I would have given up on politics for a very long time. Mind you, Mr Cummings’ piece has me wondering whether I should still do that anyway!
Maggie Ansell | January 11, 2017 at 16:01
No way !! Just imagine where we would have been now had Dominic Cummings given up on politics, rather than engaging ….
Tudor Rickards | January 10, 2017 at 07:49
Impossible to contribute without reading several (more) times and thinking very carefully. Congratulations on a meaningful contribution.
Perhaps the first two of the three significant factors were conflated in the famous old dictum of ‘events’.
bellefrappe | January 10, 2017 at 10:52
Fascinating and illuminating. Why are your blogging this, and not cashing in with a major publishing house?
Maggie Ansell | January 10, 2017 at 15:54
Good question – but I would hope that the one will follow the other, in due course …
B.B. | January 10, 2017 at 11:23
Interesting that you mention Surkov and Pomerantsev. I was under the impression that Surkov was out of the picture after his demotion in 2014. I know that Surkov is supposed to have opposed the KGB-style purge of all political opponents. Arguably, the purge has left the Kremlin in no need of providing a coherent ideology at all. As a result, there is little place for a figure like Surkov whose instance that politics is a text (of which the audience is the author, rather than speechwriters or politicians) is ultimately dependent upon the exploitation of others’ ‘ideologies’. I would argue that Surkov’s zenith actually came when Medvedev was President. Pomerantsev’s book is good but again it doesn’t seem to realise the main purpose of the Russian government, which is to enrich itself. Thus, the ones that bring in most cash are the most powerful. Corruption is not a problem of the Russian system, it is the Russian system.
Richard Drake | January 10, 2017 at 12:44
Absorbing, thank you for everything you and the VL team achieved for our country.
Roland Openshaw | January 10, 2017 at 13:35
What a fantastic piece. Thank you for writing it. This coming from a strong remainer.
One thing I don’t get in the original in/out debate was the “free movement of people = impossible to control immigration” concept. You touch on this, and immigration appears to be a motivating factor for you, so I will ask my question here: why not control immigration via internal bureaucratic systems like residence permits rather than trying to control arrival rates? This appears to be what other rich EU countries do. E.g. Any EU citizen can go to Spain, but if they want to stay more than 3 months, they need to obtain a residence permit, which will involve non-spaniards in showing that they have enough money and health insurance so as not to be a burden on the state.
You touch on the need for diversity of thought amongst politicians and the 4th estate, and I agree wholeheartedly. I think that many of our problems could be simplified by looking at how other countries are coping with them. Us Brits seem very inward focused, uninterested in other peoples. I am suggesting that we may be too insular in our thinking, and that Brexit may reduce our social links with similar countries, impoverishing our thinking.
Mark Campbell | January 10, 2017 at 14:00
Brilliant and insightful. Thank you for cutting through the fog of meaningless wittering that pervades the instant nature of communication these days.
Your blog speaks to me because it understands who I am – a leave voter that took the time and trouble to investigate the issues of the day. I concluded it was best to leave the EU in the interest of my children and the human race. I do not have a University education because I grew up in an environment that did not recognise this as a possible conclusion to my schooling. I am working class by birth and have been in the business of cold hard sales for nearly 30 years.
My sales experience tells me you efficiently identified the importance of VL’s USPs, focused on simple messages derived from these and were not distracted by outside influences that can only ever diminish one’s chances of closing the deal. I sense that Alec Baldwin’s soliloquy in Glengarry Glen Ross could be a favourite…
For me, the error made by the IN campaign was that it left a vacuum of objectivity that anyone interested in leaving or thinking of leaving could inhabit. It reads to me that VL simply occupied this space. IN patronised voters with clearly ridiculous prophecies of doom and ignored completely the fundamental aspects of the EU that rankled so strongly with voters. Most of the time people like me were not challenged – by anyone – about the conclusions we were reaching. IN’s messages did not resonate with me at at all as I would gladly have lost some wealth in order to gain democratic sovereignty.
Ultimately it is clear that the IN campaign could not address the EU’s fundamental fault lines and so the focus on racism and the economy were strategic decisions that they made. This in itself could have driven anyone that took the time to understand it to vote leave – I was one.
Many people will distort your blog to suit their own narrative, they will elide parts of it to suit themselves and this will be a shame.
The referendum cost me friends and added many grey hairs in the pursuit of objective debate. It was depressing to me that it was so evident that friends I had previously held in high esteem were doing no due diligence of their own. They freely bounced around in their own echo-chamber not taking the time to rehearse arguments or inform themselves of the other side’s perspective. As you have said, the natural assumption among many was that a University education and membership of the cosmopolitan liberal elite conferred upon one the the badge of truth. How wrong they were…
John Grounds | January 29, 2017 at 10:10
Your reply repeats the canard around sovereignty and otherwise says very little. It is the UK’s London – centrIc economic policies that have left much of the country disaffected. This is nothing to do with the EU – surely you get that?
Coming back to sovereignty, and without re-running the immigration debate, can you please tell me which laws imposed by the EU keep you awake at night? Your comments about losing some wealth to regain ‘democratic’ sovereignty feels like petty nationalism and we all know where that leads.
Jane | January 10, 2017 at 14:27
I really enjoyed reading this. I would have voted against the Lisbon Treaty given the chance.
As a Leaver I recognised myself in your three major problems, immigration, financial and the euro crisis.
My feelings about immigration were not based on racism. but were based on what was happening in respect of the boat people coming into Europe and the EU’s lack of desire to find out who the smugglers were and attempt to stop them, in spite of the fact that ISIS just might take advantage of this extremely sad situation. They didn’t seem to identify economic migrants from genuine asylum seekers and the Shenghen agreement allowing free movement made the situation worse. I know we are not part of this agreement but nevertheless the EU’s inability to act for the sake of its own citizens shows a lack good leadership. Although immigration has not affected me personally I was aware of what was happening in our towns and the negative effect on low paid workers. The impact on our housing hotly denied by the comfortably housed Remainers was ignored as was the impact on our hospitals and schools. Also the Government’s inability to deal with hate preachers, protected by EU courts.
Financial. Well yes, the rich have got richer and the poor poorer and yes those up north were, like all citizens, paying off a debt whilst those responsible got away scot free, rewarding themselves for their failure. Those same people who just love the EU and have since even suggested they remain members. Well why not just as long as they take the debt with them and leave us in the black. Then we can start again. No, we do need them even if we detest them.
Finally the EU. Our experience of, and the reports coming in regarding the problems in Greece, Spain and Italy and mass unemployment of their young people and added to the immigration problem was a
deciding factor. David Camerson’s failure to make a tangible deal with the EU, in fact went cap in hand almost to beg for changes was the final straw for me. Their disdain was their downfall.
It was an excellent campaign in contrast to the other side who used bullying tactics and Obama who to me came across as threatening but others would disagree.
There were a lot of if’s in the run up to the campaign which could have derailed and prevented it. If Labour and the Lib Dems had agreed to offer a referendum, would David Cameron have won the election, would UKIP voters have voted Labour. If David Cameron had taken a back seat and worked on positives of remaining in the EU (if there were any), rather than the negatives of leaving. The attraction of Leavers being enthusiastic about leaving and ignoring the insults of the Remain side was so appealing. Finally had Labour been in touch with their grass roots voters the result for leave could possibly have been greater. Gisela Stuart was excellent as was Boris and Andrea.
E.Ward | January 10, 2017 at 15:57
This is a fascinating read whilst being totally abjectly depressing.
I am very puzzled by this statement though, when talking about the marketing campaign: “weeks or months before the vote, we decided to hire extremely smart physicists to consider everything from first principles”. How do you hire ‘smart physicists’ for a temporary role in marketing? Where/who are these amazing jobbing advertising physicists? Why do you need physicists to create a marketing campaign? Why would a physicist know anything about a political campaign anyway?
Do you really mean ‘physicist’ at all? I am very curious.
E.Ward | January 10, 2017 at 16:03
misomiso82 | January 10, 2017 at 16:50
I was one of your VL volunteers, and given all your experience with Data and Campaigns, do you think it would be theoretically possible for a new ‘Moderate/Labour Right’ independent Scottish Unionist Party (Or Peoples Party) to Win against the Nats in Scotland?
It just seems that given that 38% of the Scots voted out, and given what you say about Fashion in politics, it may be possible to put a coalition together to win a Westminster election (even by just one seat), by wresting the Scottish identity away from Sturgeon, as focus groups seem to suggest that the SNP always win as they ‘stand up for Scotland’.
When there was an independent Scottish Unionist Party in Scotland they used to win elections, and one of the theories as to why the parties united was to give the center (pro European at the time) more control.
Had their been an independent party in Scotland at the time of Maastricht they would never have given away fisheries, and could have been more protective over legal safeguards because of Scot’s law.
Would be interesting to hear whether you thought it was possible to ‘Hack’ Scotland as well.
Calvin | January 10, 2017 at 17:00
I can’t confess to having read the piece in full, but I was interested in that you start off by seeking to put some distance between yourself and the campaign (in particular, but not only, the comment that the Shipman book threatens to exaggerate your importance in it). You were Campaign Director, after all! I looked consequently for what your own thoughts about the EU were and, while there is a section there and your view that we should leave the EU seems to be clear, it is very brief and the argumentation does not look fully-formed. I therefore wondered whether your reluctance to review the events leading up to the vote and the distance you seem to be putting between yourself and it reflected that your heart was not fully in the campaign that you ran?
Maggie Ansell | January 11, 2017 at 15:15
Calvin, might I respectfully suggest that you read the whole offering before making your comments ?
Tantalo (@tantalotoo) | January 10, 2017 at 17:19
Bismarck and Potemkin aside, thank you for a very comprehensive polemic. Glad to hear, too, that future posts will be more concise, but fully understand why you had to get this one off your chest. Also explains why Messrs. Raab and Cook H. may have bright futures!
Steve Pepper | January 10, 2017 at 17:31
Dominic, firstly thank you very much for all you did to secure this historic result and for making my children’s future prospects brighter. Secondly thank you for such an original and educational blog. I have followed the EU issue for many years and studied every twist and turn. I was always hopeful but I just thought the weight and power of the establishment would win the day ……… clearly they very nearly did. Your superb account articulates so very clearly why they didn’t. I too would be very very interested to read what you think should/may/will happen next. Thanks again.
Lin Wright | January 10, 2017 at 18:03
Fascinating read…thank you. I found myself agreeing with most of your analysis on how fed-up the public outside of the London political/media bubble are at being told how and what to think. If nothing else it gave me a bloody good laugh too. I had never hear the expression ” Like a one legged man at an arse kicking competition ” before but I have now memorised it for future use!
Big Al | January 10, 2017 at 19:03
This is a really interesting insight into the Brexit saga and far more honest than most accounts we see in the mainstream media where as you point out the argument is largely portrayed as only having 2 sides.
Personally I voted “in” but I possibly caved in to my own Project Fear – my concern is/was that Britain’s departure would destabilise the EU to the point of collapse; and following some of your own observations about history it would not take much for parts of the EU such as the Balkans to return to military conflict which we would inevitably get drawn into, especially with Russia in its current state.
I am surprised the “in” camp didn’t make anything of this point, but maybe people are tired of having large numbers bandied around – after all the financial cost of the Second World War ($4.6 trillion in today’s money) is only 4 times the amount committed to bailing out the banks (amazing to me anyway).
And as you say Project Fear backfired spectacularly so maybe this would have just been more kindling on that particular bonfire.
Ultimately I think Cameron did a *terrible* job of negotiating any kind of deal for the UK and the country has paid the price (good or bad!).
Nigel Marriott | January 10, 2017 at 19:27
Excellent post Dom! I’ve been clicking on all your links as well and now have a lot of reading material. I’m about to start my own blog and you have set the standard I should aspire to.
BTW, I first heard of you via David Laws autobiography and was left with a rather negative impression. However, when I started reading your blog, I quickly realised who was the greater intellect.
Dominic, you may remember me from the days of Business for Sterling when I co-authored the first pamphlet ” The Case for Keeps my the Pound” with Bill Jamieson. Lord Marsh was the first CEO then came Nick Herbert, George Eustice and you. Whent Matthew emailed all us supporters saying you were on board, I replied saying He’s a Rottweiler that I knew we would win and Blue British passports had hoven it view.’ You’re being uncharacteristically modest about your involvement in VL.
The ground response in deepest rural Wales was surprisingly positive back in Feb 2016 when I first started leafleting and I told my husband and the handful only of helpers that our only weapon was positive thinking against the battery of Remain focusing media, especially here. This campaign is unlikely to have been successful without you.!
Clive Hole | January 10, 2017 at 23:22
Many thanks for a brilliant analysis of a super successful political campaign, which was both refreshingly honest and most revealing about a very gifted political communications player.
I would like to make a few comments from someone who is Anglo-French, spent the first half of his life based in London and the second half based in Paris, and who has worked as an international finance director throughout Europe, both North and South, and in other regions of the world.
You named several key areas :
Immigration – but there has been more non-European immigration, and much of it from different cultures. Immigration volumes have been made dramatically worse as a consequence of the Iraq war, but which European country actively participated in it?
You mention Turkey, but it was the UK, particularly Thatcher who pushed for their entry, together with as many new countries as possible so as to hinder any thoughts of a political union, and to force a purely free trade area. The EU was from its inception a political project, which Nigel Lawson had the honesty to say so in the FT. It was the UK that set up its free trade area in 1960, EFTA. Incidentally, nobody in Europe, certainly not Continental Europe, is seriously thinking about a Turkish entry now or at any time, quite the opposite.
The financial crisis of 2008 had nothing to do with the EU, indeed it started in the US, with some help from the Bearn Stains hedge funds lodged in the Cayman Islands, and some 50 billion of Leman Brothers liabilities parked in the City due to laxer UK accounting rules.
As for the understandable anger of the population about the greed of bankers and CEOs , it was the EU which tried to cap bankers bonuses but the UK government was dead against it, and again the EU has NOTHING to do with the tax policy of UK citizens, bankers or otherwise.
As the UK is not part of the Eurozone, it’s not the UK’s problem. As for Ireland it’s a lot richer country today, Euro crisis and all, than when I had to deal with an Irish subsidiary back in 1985.
The £350 million a week saving going to the NHS was a brilliant communications ploy, but again a net £8 billion a year when public spending in 2016 was £762 billion seems to me somewhat deceitful.
And I think that I would use the words of deceit and bad will for the European project. I agree with you that much can be improved in the European project but your approach is purely negative, there is no intention of trying to correct it, purely to destroy it.
As a European I can accept that someone doesn’t like the project, but I do object to the sheer lies, deceit and bad will that has been shown by people like you. For me, the campaign was the dirtiest and grubbiest I have ever seen in the UK, and believe me I have seen some in my 69 years. It leaves me with the pained impression of the UK embarking on the path of grubby, grabby, grim new Britain, which believe me for the UK’s sake I much regret.
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Michael Morice | January 25, 2017 at 21:51
Thank heavens someone is saying this – in an ‘echo-chamber’ for leavers! This man Cummings seems totally unconcerned about honesty, despite protestations to the contrary. He is extremely clever (too much so by half?), despite his denials of being so. He seems to think that because the remain side told lies, these cancelled out those of the leave side. Most amazing to read his pinpointing of the NHS/350m stunt as the pivot on which victory turned, blithely ignoring the falsity of the promise.
I stand with the despairing and disaffected leave voters and their sense of disenfranchisement (as opposed to those more comfortably off leavers motivated by ‘little Britain’ ideology), and wait with trepidation to see what they will be doing some time down the line when they discover that the ‘newly sovereign’ British political system is even more intractably untransparent, centralized, and inherently undemocratic than the EU. And with no European Court to resort to when needed as a balance to possible injustices in the British legal system (heretical thought).
Lastly, what about the totally ignored reasons for a Union in the first place – that is, to avoid once and for all the little question of a third world war with an European epicentre?
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Chris Doyle | January 11, 2017 at 07:38
I’ve just read this fantastic piece on the Spectator website and I am moved to say that this is by far the best thing I’ve read about the referendum. And, as someone who keenly wanted our country to leave the EU for 20 years, I have followed this subject very closely, especially over the last year. There has been no shortage of words written on the subject, from both sides. But Mr Cummings’ contribution in this piece alone strikes me as sounding very much like the last word in the matter. That said, now that I’ve come across this blog, I shall be digging deeper: I am very interested to hear else Mr Cummings has to say.
I am somebody who previously thought that the £350M/NHS argument was extremely minor in its influence. Certainly it had zero effect on determined Leave voters like me and other like-minded Leave voters I spoke to. And, of course, it didn’t sway any Remain voters. But, before reading this piece (all the more potent for its modesty and honesty) I failed to appreciate the swing voters. I guess I’ve always had issues with swing voters: I am critical of people whose voting convictions can be swayed whichever way the wind blows. But, I am now persuaded that their votes were decisive and that £350M/NHS was an influential factor.
This was just one of many thought-provoking and original nuggets and I shall be re-reading this piece and recommending it.
Impressive work, Mr Cummings. Leave voters like me are indebted to you: thank you.
marikarblog | January 11, 2017 at 12:04
Its good to see such self reflection in the age of “look at me”, your points certainly provide food for thought. The logic of your complex systems argument is compelling but does not sit very well with the simplistic messages required to get people to vote and the ideological positions of both left and right . Messages such as the NHS funding when not followed through comes across as typical political cynicism.
You repeat the fashionable “virtue signalling” argument, and in many cases this may well be righteous hypocrisy however virtues are good things, there is a danger of inadvertently making it a bad thing to enjoin goodness and compassion. I think the key point here is that people should put their money where there virtue is.
Pandering to fear, self interest is the way to win votes but what does it do to society in the end ? Does it act as a positive feedback loop in the system that results in a non-linear unintended outcome ? There are many historical examples to suggest this could be probable.
Immigration is a favorite instrument to use to arouse passions, but the problem is the cost for these passions are paid by others. None of whom you meet. A more sensible debate here is required but it will always get drowned in the fear messaging.
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bpwebster | January 11, 2017 at 18:46
Great piece, but it does seem like your own – very interesting – historiographical thesis is working in tension against your account of the referendum. Apologies for the obnoxiously long comment…
1. Obviously, I can’t speak to the personalities involved, but possibly at least some of the people behind “Go Global” were thinking about governance post-referendum, instead of being myopically focussed on a win? Some of the current mess in UK politics bears that out. You present resistance to your “Turkey/350m/NHS” line as a simple sign of political incompetence, instead of – perhaps? – a resistance to what could be characterised as populist half-truths, or racial paranoia. However effective a winning strategy it might have been, many people would hardly praise Boris, Gove et al. for so enthusiastically embracing that line.
2. Indeed, your own – fascinating – analysis about branching histories would seem to suggest that making those promises that rely on so many factors you know to be essentially unpredictable, even unlikely, is exactly the kind of poor political decision-making you decry. For someone who’s making a claim to clear-eyed analysis (and operating with Feynman’s warnings against self-delusion in mind) your trust that Boris and Gove would have kept their NHS investment promise seems wilfully naive – and relied on their being in a position to deliver, which did not in fact come to pass. It does seem a shame that you (and – of course – others, on both sides) didn’t feel that public debate around such a major decision deserved the same kind of nuanced treatment of possible outcomes you embrace here.
3. And on that note: given your analysis of historical processes, your claim to be playing a long game based on thinking “a return to 1930s protectionism is disastrous” requires so many unlikely steps, and so many other actors behaving in very specific and unforeseeable ways, that it does seem either to be magical thinking or simply a convenient dishonesty. It strikes me that, by your own reasoning, the safer “Occam’s razor” approach would have been the rather less roundabout path of making a positive case for European cooperation and internationalism… Obviously, since the Leave campaign won, I very much hope you’re proved right and – against every indication I can now see – Brexit somehow boosts the forces of moderation in the UK and elsewhere. A very big gamble has been made with other people’s money against some long odds. Fingers crossed?
Peter Davies | January 13, 2017 at 02:38
This is the best thing I have read so far this year, and I have a high degree of confidence that it will remain so for at least several months. Thank you for posting it.
Mike Wilkinson | January 13, 2017 at 12:14
It has always struck me that mainstream politics occupying the centre ground (slightly to the left or right) has led to entrenched divisions where the country swings on a pendulum from one ‘extreme’ to the other. Whilst the main parties remain diametrically opposed to each other & utterly refusing to concede that their opposite number may have actually had a good idea or pointed out a flaw in their position is an utterly disgraceful way to behave. Politicians have to get back to first principles, everything they do has to be for the good of the nation, not for their friends in business or in Unions.
I hate to use the word but we need a political class that are patriotic, not tribal. Everybody sees on a daily basis the injustices around them, homeless veterans, the queues outside the job centre plus (folks finding it impossible to make work pay more than the state because of the state) etc. etc. Our political classes have morphed into a homogeneous group of Oxbridge educated PPE graduates with little or no idea about how the vast majority of their ‘constituency’ exist. How many politicians & the civil servants who ‘advise’ them have ever worked a real job outside of the bubble & struggled whilst doing it? Yes, I know there are a few but even many of those mentioned had privileged positions like ‘Officer’ in the forces.
The point so eloquently made by Dominic (better than I ever could) is the public view the politicians as the extremists & have views & opinions that are spread across the spectrum of all parties.
The main point is, when we joined the EU it was in our best interests & politicians knew it. Now, it isn’t & if politicians had been honest about it instead of subscribing to some liberal wonderland utopian view that it’s a bad mess but we’re better off in that bad mess (& I think politicians of all stripes liked having the EU as an excuse for their failings (‘it’s not us joe public, It’s he EU, they won’t let us do X or Y’)) instead of telling the truth in that membership of the EU as currently constituted is not in the UKs best interest.
Politics, the civil,service (mandarins) & the way lobbying is carried out has to change if joe public is going to re-engage in the political process. If it doesn’t, don’t be surprised if we end up with UKIP as the main opposition or worse.
John W | January 14, 2017 at 13:09
Thanks. A worthy second draft of history. Compelling, fascinating and (from my perspective) ghastly: I write as someone who favour(s)(ed) ever closer union, and who considers there are interesting and positive branching histories where the UK joins the Euro and Schengen. However, this is not the place to debate them.
There are a couple of things here however which don’t quite ring true to me.
1. You dismiss the “Corbyn AWOL” problem. Well surely the problem was that Corbyn was Corbyn. If England had had its Alex Salmond, even a far-left (but not Corbyn) Labour leader in the Ken Livingstone mould, I’m sure Remain would have benefitted very significantly.
2. Credit to Farage. One significant factor was the number of people, particularly the less well-educated from deprived communities, who seldom or never normally vote, but who turned out on 23rd June. I can see exactly how Farage, like Trump, appeals to that demographic in a way most unlikely for high-profile Tories like Gove or Johnson.
David Osborne | January 15, 2017 at 10:10
This is the single most fascinating thing I’ve read about the referendum since it took place. I would be interested to know whether you think a political party could structure itself and its policy making using the same methods. Could a party formulate policy by constantly correcting errors in assumptions about what people want / need or would it be accused of following rather than leading?
John Grounds | January 15, 2017 at 23:32
Interesting as an analysis of how you did it it. However, all I get out of this is that we will end up as a country with the same failed/failing right wing policies and a strong whiff of Colonel Blimp about it. Fixing the unbalanced economy and creating a fairer society seems to be getting further and further away. I wonder how the good people of Sunderland and Boston will view things in five years time?
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Alexandre Borovik | January 16, 2017 at 05:23
“There is a natural set of categories and I will post links to blogs below:
Jazi Zilber | January 16, 2017 at 18:35
Wish many others would have the guts, intelligence and candour to post analyze like this!
Kenneth | January 21, 2017 at 13:44
I voted Remain and campaigned for Stronger In and this is one of the best and most interesting analyses I have read of the referendum, period.
Dominic, you are clearly a very smart guy. That being the case, it is surprising to see you make the following errors – or at least use language which is much less precise than in most of your writing:
– “Have an immigration policy that guarantees free movement rights even for murderers, so we cannot deport them or keep them locked up after they are released? Extreme.”
This is a one-sided explanation of the truth. Free movement certainly limits the grounds on which non-UK EU nationals can be excluded from the UK (something which I don’t have any objection to, since I believe in the concept of European citizenship), but it is not true to say that “murderers” can never be refused permission to exercise treaty rights in the UK. Is it actually rational in any case to want to deport a reformed offender – or is this just a base human instinct which we have to live with and make policy around?
As an aside, on the subject of European citizenship, you haven’t actually addressed anywhere in your writing as far as I can see whether it is rational and an example of the higher-quality policy that you do discuss to seek to limit the number of non-citizens living in one’s country, even non-citizens from one’s closest geographic neighbours (vs the current system whereby nationals of the EU member states are treated as one step a way from a national in whatever EU state they’re in). There are evidently pros and cons of both free movement and non-free movement systems, so a knee-jerk, “Well, of course only UK nationals should have the guaranteed right to live and work in the United Kingdom”, based on one particular worldview, wouldn’t appear to cut it.
Do you think this point is arguable with facts and figures and the smarter ways of doing politics which you describe, or do you think this is simply a topic which in a democracy people are entitled to take a view on, and other policy has to bend around that view?
– “improve the probability that others in Europe would change course before more big crises hit, e.g. by limiting free movement which is the biggest threat to continued free trade”
It’s not clear whether this is the typical UK erroneous conflation of hostility to non-European immigration which exists in many countries in Europe with the UK’s own issues with European free movement, or if it just refers to generous immigration policies more generally (ie, not specifically to the EU/EEA/Swiss system of free movement). You also don’t explain the causal link between the existence of free movement and the threatening of free trade, nor the actual purpose/expected benefit of “changing course” before further crises hit. The whole statement is extremely vague – perhaps deliberately.
I’m not aware of any other country in the European Union that is as bothered about other Europeans having the right to move to their country whenever they wish as the UK appears to be (assuming the country, in the aggregate, even views this system negatively at all). Therefore, it’s not clear that limiting European free movement is a position which there is actually public support for in most of the European Union, never mind it being necessary to avoid the disruption of free trade. (Even in Switzerland, which of course is not in the EU but is currently part of the EU’s system of free movement, opinion on the topic is on a knife-edge and would seem to be less vehement than in the UK.)
Immigration to the EU by non-EU nationals is already limited, so there’s nothing particular to be done here. In any case, this policy area (both in the UK, and in the rest of the EU) appears to have little to do with whether the UK remains in the EU (though I’m curious to know if you have some theory which provides otherwise – ie, specifically around the likely impact of the Brexit vote on *non*-EU migration to the EU).
– “require and therefore hopefully spark big changes in the fundamental wiring of UK government including an extremely strong intelligent focus on making Britain the best place in the world for science and education”
This one is both particularly surprising and not surprising. You make the typical English/’British’ intelligent person’s mistake of conflating England and the UK, or of not caring a jot about the difference between them. You also use the vacuous word “Britain”, presumably not really sure of or bothered about whether you mean England, Great Britain, or the whole United Kingdom – you’d presumably happily say England, other than for the English nationalism which that might associate you with. One gang you’re sure you don’t want to be in is that one.
In any event, notwithstanding the important contribution of the UK-wide Research Councils, the UK government has little overall responsibility for education (including higher education) in Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales. It seems remiss to entirely avoid mentioning that very important constitutional fact in an explanation of why you thought the UK *as a whole* should leave the EU.
An informed reader might be reminded of your earlier remarks about how few people understand the workings of the EU. It seems you don’t understand the UK’s own constitutional arrangements – or you think England and the UK are so much the same thing that the other parts of the UK can be airbrushed out of the discussion.
PS You might find this article helpful:
Will McNeill | February 2, 2017 at 14:11
A very interesting, honest and insightful account. As a committed (rural) remainer I can tell you that you’re right about the susceptibility of metropolitans to ‘group think’ and an over-confidence in their views on good/moral policy/strategy.
And it’s also excellent to hear with honesty the very pragmatic machinery of persuasion and catalysis that lay behind the Leave campaign.
It’s slightly frustrating that at the same time you keep the simplistic ‘elite’ meme alive though (one of the groupthinkish markers of ‘those outside London’). Plenty of Urbanites on 20k a year or thereabouts were buying into and feeding back into what you describe as the ‘elite’ mentality – surely better classed as an urban or ‘metropolitan’ phenomenon.
I’m intruiged by your claim that:
“Polls show that better educated people are less likely to have accurate views about the science of evolution and genetics (their desire to send moral signals suckers them into believing fairy tales)”
Can you link me to these polls?
Will McNeill | February 2, 2017 at 14:47
You say: “the false idea spread and is still dominant that if you are on the side of free trade, think controlled immigration generally a positive force, and want more international cooperation rather than a return to competing nation states then you must support the EU. I think this error is caused by the moral signalling and gang mentality described above.”
Surely this is kind of simplistic answer that you so carefully ask us to avoid when it comes to the “why did Leave win?” question (but were so happy to encourage in the Leave campaign itself).
I know that these bigger questions about The Future were not the focus of this particular post. So it would be *excellent* to hear more of your (less simplistic) thoughts about the connection people make between the importance of international cooperation and the EU.
Simon Reynolds | February 6, 2017 at 08:20
Superb account Dominic. Many thanks. Summary seems to be: Rabble rousers beat gang, right or wrong, unlikely to happen often. ?
Richard | February 6, 2017 at 08:41
If only the EU had done something about free movement. I understand there are attempts to limit it, to require that immigrants have jobs in place, but these are weak. It will be interesting to see where this goes and if it can be solved within the EU before we do see a swing towards nationalism of the kind embodied by Trump.
You claim the press as being against you, yet amongst our most popular papers we have The Express, The Daily Mail and The Sun. These are strongly biased towards Leave and strongly play the immigration card. Their stories, even now, are often misleading and they go as far as attacking our judiciary and anyone who dares question Leave. It was claimed that places that had higher immigration were less afraid of it. If anything stoked the fear of immigration it was these papers. It is sad that actual statistics tell a very different story both about the effects of immigration and the drivers behind it.
I’d hope, as you say at the end, that we could see an improvement in education and investment in our people and services. But are the Tories the right people for this, with what seems a Small State mantra? This doesn’t seem to have worked where practiced by The Republicans in America.
Mr Educated | February 6, 2017 at 12:50
Educated = having a degree. Educated more likely to vote irrationally. Got to love assumptions in statistics. Those who have a degree are more likely to vote irrationally would be the correct statement. But then again, I would not expect many people to be careful with the words they choose in an era where being informed and accurate has become a taboo.
Quite frankly, this blog post lost credibility when it attacks ‘educated’ people as incapable being set up to listen and change views and forming rational arguments. You have not considered that no-one listens to you because what you are saying is irrational, incomplete, ill-informed and so on… Surely someone who knows something about statistics would be aware of such other variables?
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Richard | February 6, 2017 at 13:09
Mr Educated – People with a degree level education are more likely to be in the kinds of jobs or industries that benefit from globalisation and the EU. Globalisation is unescapable in my work. People don’t have to immigrate here to compete with me for a job. They can do so sitting at their laptop in India. This has been the case for some time now and our world hasn’t ended, in spite of fears towards the start of the century that it would.
So for someone like me it makes sense to be in the EU, not just because of the well founded economic risk of change but:
* Myself and my children can benefit from freedom of movement without seeing its drawbacks
* A lot of the companies that myself and my cohorts work for export to Europe and will suffer given non-trade barriers that may arise from Brexit.
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Clev | February 7, 2017 at 19:29
DC’s line about polls suggesting smarter people vote more irrationally is probably a reference to the phenomenon of educated Republicans in the US being more likely to reject climate change.
It has been found in other policy areas too and generally applies most strongly among people of a “conservative” mindset.
DC’s is a very entertaining and thought-provoking piece but like a commenter above I was puzzled by one glaring omission: in a piece of 20,000 words he mentions the role of the printed Press in half a sentence (“VL had the support of some powerful papers …”). This is to ignore the hostility towards the EU among the public engendered by years of implacable and often wilfully inaccurate bile from the Mail, Sun, Telegraph, Express, Times, and their Sunday incarnations – something surely not replicated in the media of any other EU nation. Without this, would VL have ever seen got out of the starting blocks?
Tim | February 11, 2017 at 19:28
Dominic… tremendous article. It seems to be getting a lot love now on this side of the Atlantic. I found it via a Feb. 9 mention on Instapundit, and it has been talked up quite a bit at ricochet.com. I read it comparing it with our recent election. Would really like to have you take up residence in this country for a couple of months and write up what you see as a traveling political/cultural correspondent. Tim W.
Jim Clark | February 15, 2017 at 15:22
This is a fascinating blog post Dominic, well done. I don’t agree with Vote Leave’s aims, but I always respect a winner.
Michael Powell | March 31, 2017 at 15:43
A great article, though almost long enough for you to publish your own Brexit book.
I voted Remain, even though I think in the long run the UK will be better outside the EU. I had 2 main reasons for doing so:
1) I didn’t think the disruption and distraction that would ensue would be worth it, taking up so much of our national attention. I still don’t.
2) I couldn’t see how a sensible Brexit could be achieved by our political class given a successful Leave vote. I still can’t.
I do hope it’s a success though and am now 100% behind the reality of what is going to happen.
You are dead right on so many aspects of this campaign though, and you sell yourself short in terms of your contribution. If you had been running Remain then I’m sure you could have tipped the balance that way, though getting Cameron and Osborne to abandon their collective delusions on how to win would have been extremely hard. All the effort they devoted to winning the argument over the economy was merely addressing their core who were already staunch Remain.
The article also answers the question for so many Londoners (and I count many of my friends among them) who were totally shocked by the Leave victory. Not only were we living in our own echo chamber, but none of your marketing was ever targeted at us.
Looking forward to seeing what you’re going to do next.
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There are several elements that could effect the expense of vehicle insurance policy. Becoming Safe and sound and liable will reduce your Price tag. When evaluating fees, it can be crucial to just take into account your automobile’s design and model, its worth, and also the frequency you utilize it. You are more likely to be linked to an accident should you push extended distances. The most effective way to scale back your high quality is to get a policy that fits your prerequisites.
Price of auto insurance
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Differing types and kinds of insurance for cars
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Vehicle insurance requirements
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How to obtain Car or truck Coverage
Shopping for car or truck insurance coverage is hard. There are a number of variables it is best to acquire into consideration. Specified states have minimal limits on coverage as a way to provide Property in addition to Uninsured motorist coverage. It’s going to address the hole in between your fees or perhaps the policy Restrict in the at-fault social gathering. Other states never call for underinsured motorist protection. Here are a few ideas that can assist you discover the ideal coverage for your requirements. These suggestions can make the procedure slightly easier, and could help you save you some money.
Car Insurance Companies
Legal responsibility insurance plan
Liability coverage for automobile coverage is important in an effort to safeguard both you and your assets from statements of personal injury or house damage. The coverage addresses the price for protection and settlement In case you are held accountable for a mishap involving your car or truck. There are a selection of varieties and levels of coverage. To stop unpleasant surprises, It can be important to know the distinctions. Condition Farm offers An array of protection degrees at affordable expenses. It is recommended to decide on a medium protection.
Legal responsibility insurance policies is obligatory in all states. It handles damage to home and also bodily accidents. This coverage will safeguard your legal rights in case you are linked to an collision with other motorists. This coverage would be the standard policy in most States and is highly suggested for drivers from numerous nations. Remember that the limits for liability insurance policy differ In keeping with condition. Your liability limit establishes the level of insurance you demand to safeguard against damages.
Property coverage
It is illegal in just about every state to generate with no legal responsibility coverage. This is often also the situation for residence injury legal responsibility. Legal responsibility protection pays for damages to house of Other individuals. But, your insurance plan would not address the harm to your automobile. There might be different minimal necessities within the point out you live in for legal responsibility coverage. It’s important you confirm your insurance coverage coverage prior to buying it. Your economic security is depending on home protection. It helps you steer clear of spending big insurance costs during the occasion of a mishap.
Insurance coverage guidelines should contain some sort of residence hurt protection so as to include damages a result of a collision. The coverage will include the damages you bring about to another person’s car, together with repairs. Also, it covers the removal of particles immediately after a mishap. Home protection is commonly prepared with a few numbers, which involve bodily injuries protection for every incident and also the protection for assets hurt per accident. Greater boundaries present much more coverage. Be sure you study your policy and request your insurance plan representative if you will discover any exclusions or limits.
Uninsured motorist coverage
New York presents uninsured motorist protection. This applies when the driving force who’s at fault is just not insured to address the costs of the collision. This kind of coverage is offered if the opposite driver can not be identified and the incident was successful-and–operate. The Insurance coverage Regulation SS 5217 states that uninsured motorist coverage is simply offered from the celebration of the Actual physical collision. On the other hand, courts have interpreted the provision to only utilize to physical incidents.
Although uninsured and underinsured motorist protection is just not needed in specified states, you need to have both of those in Many others. By paying for both equally insurances, you are going to present you with extra protection in case you really need to include healthcare charges or other expenses. The uninsured motorist plan can include the price of repairs towards your motor vehicle if you are confronted that has a harmed car or truck due to an uninsured motorist. While this protection is just not demanded nonetheless, It really is a great plan to own at the very least the minimum amount degree of legal responsibility protection.
Car insurance plan discounts If you are not conscious of They’re an excellent way get monetary savings and to stay environmentally friendly. Many new autos have security options like anti-lock brakes and airbags that may reduce your insurance rates. Basic safety options like anti-theft alarms and daytime operating mild could possibly get you extra discount rates. It’s also possible to acquire twelve months of aid from payment by paying out your premium in full each and every year. About half of all insurers provide this discounted.
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Youthful motorists are seeking affordable auto coverage quotations. Here are some guidelines You should utilize to cut costs on your car coverage: Growing your deductibles, getting a no promises price reduction, and getting an coverage policy from an insurer that is certainly regional. The following tips may help you save numerous dollars every year on the auto policy. They may also allow you to obtain the most beneficial rates you can get. Keep reading To learn more. You can be grateful which you did.
Discover inexpensive insurance policy for cars and trucks coverage for younger drivers
Younger drivers can spend less by staying safer and driving considerably less. It is also achievable to lower your car insurance policy rates by shopping all around. It is essential to buy close to for auto insurance plan. Plenty of insurers charge greater costs to younger motorists. It is not difficult to match on the net quotations employing cost-free equipment. When you have multiple automobiles, you can obtain a discount and they are all included by the exact same organization.
When you are seeking a plan ensure you compare quite a few estimates and select the very best price tag and the highest high-quality. A superb solution is to search out an agent who will support you in rising and building vital adjustments as your driving record changes. Evaluating insurance policies that have comparable coverage may very well be a major aspect. Restrictions and deductibles can have a big effects. For younger motorists it is critical to possess enough protection to prevent monetary spoil.
Obtaining a no statements price reduction
Decreasing your regular monthly insurance premiums is achievable if you can get an insurance policies lower price that does not require statements on auto insurance coverage. It’d be truly worth asking the insurance company whatever they can perform to have it. The low cost could sum to as much as thirty% right after a single yr or as high nearly sixty five% in the following 5 years. It truly is depending on the insurance provider you choose. If you’re concerned by an accident You will be not able to declare a two-year no-declare bonus. Furthermore, many statements will also erase your no-promises bonus. Notifying your insurance company of any incidents is critical. Usually, upcoming promises could possibly be turned down.
Insurance plan firms deliver no-claim discount defense for approximately PS25. You can also make a specified volume of promises Every calendar yr without the need of stressing about premiums heading up. When you’ve got No Claims Bonus you’ll be able to involve it inside your new coverage. You could possibly transfer your no-claims price reduction an insurance provider within your alternative if you so drive. It is really worth switching insurers every other calendar year to take care of your no claim discount.
A terrific way to decreased the cost of your insurance when trying to find low cost motor vehicle insurance is to lift your deductibles. Your deductibles may help you help save among fifteen and 30 p.c off your insurance Price. These discounts are depending on your driving file in addition to the type and laws within your condition and your driving behaviors. The increase with your deductible can cut down your yearly high quality by around 40 percent.
While it’s actually not the ideal final decision for everybody boosting your deductible may help you help save hundreds of bucks in the end. Whilst the quantity you choose to raise your deductible will likely be contingent in your monetary problem, experts recommend saving at least two months’ truly worth of bills for dwelling. Moreover, it could reduced your insurance charges every month. It may also help you in saving dollars if there is ever an eventual declare.
You can find a plan from an insurance company from the region.
Acquiring a policy through a regional insurance provider is an effective choice for Individuals which has a very poor credit score. You can decrease the cost of your insurance regular monthly Monthly bill and have superb customer service. Getting a plan that has a regional insurance company is on the market throughout all 50 states and you can also Examine rates across states to uncover the lowest prices. It is crucial to bear in mind you could involve developing your credit rating score over the system of. Some drivers with inadequate credit score histories can pay much more than $400 each year.
Erie Insurance plan is another regional insurance provider that gives low-Price tag car insurance policy at a affordable. The corporation is situated in Pennsylvania and is operating considering that 1925. Erie provides auto insurance policies as in addition to existence and home insurance policy. Erie isn’t going to supply coverage across all states. It has about thirteen,000 unbiased brokers in the course of The us. You could possibly decide to hire an agent or go straight to a regional provider with regards to the protection you require. It really is on the other hand suggested you read all good print before making a preference.
Five Items to look at when evaluating Automobile Insurance policies Prices
You should think about the quotations for vehicle coverage to find out the ideal Price tag for your needs, particularly when you happen to be significant chance driver. Also, you should investigate the availability of protection as part of your location to determine if a reduce charge may very well be possible. An increased deductible or decrease hazard may well help it become cheaper to have larger protection. All is depending on the protection you require. The good thing is, there are many choices that are offered to you.
Most inexpensive vehicle insurance plan for top-chance drivers
If You are looking for The most affordable fees on vehicle insurance plan for prime-possibility drivers, Then you certainly are in luck. With just a few clicks, you will find 1. The online market place can give you a number of estimates for coverage at below the price of standard car or truck insurance policy. The world wide web tends to make signing as much as insurance coverage easy. Fill out the online sort, pay out your Value and you’re completed. You can expect to receive a certification in the insurance company as proof within your insurance protection. After that and you also’re wanting to travel with your policy.
Plenty of insurance coverage organizations check out you as large-danger motorists when you have a lousy credit score rating. Because you’re more unlikely to file an insurance policies situation than a person who has good credit. This is because: Credit scores Participate in An important affect on how insurance policies providers check out you. A former DUI/DWI could improve your insurance Price by as much as 65%. This amounts to a rise of $677 on a 6 month coverage. The driving document is yet another element that insurance coverage providers take into consideration. Your premium can be elevated by just as much as $174 Should you have a DUI/DWI. The price of a speeding ticket could also include nearly approximately forty five%.
A DUI could induce an issue to discover the greatest vehicle insurance policy company. State Farm, American Family members and Progressive provide alternatives for motorists with superior possibility. Additionally they give reduced rates. They are going to also take note of your credit rating rating once the determination of the Price tag. Insurers look at these things in determining the quantity you’ll pay out in your insurance. Insurance premiums can skyrocket If you have poor credit history. This is exactly why it is so critical to understand your credit history score before making a call.
Motor vehicle insurance for drivers at the most effective cost
There are several components that you might want to consider when choosing the appropriate vehicle coverage plan for younger motorists. The marital status within your spouse, the age and marital standing can have a big impact on the quantity you will pay for auto insurance. The kind of car you travel might also have an effect on the expense of your insurance coverage. For illustration, high-performance vehicles are generally extra expensive to insure than low-overall performance automobiles. It is critical to select a car or truck with numerous security measures to acquire the bottom cost of price of coverage for your auto.
Assess Motor vehicle Insurance policy Costs
The simplest technique to reduce the insurance plan on autos for motorists who’re younger is to cut back the level of protection. Coverage corporations frequently supply bargains permanently university student, or In case you are in driver schooling. Inside the celebration of a mishap, chances are you’ll incur huge charges by reducing your protection. It is important to weigh all potential dangers and have a much better offer.
Young people often have trouble finding inexpensive automobile insurance. Even though the price of coverage coverage for the 16-yearold driver is considerably costlier than for an adult, it can be done to decrease it by introducing the teen to an present coverage. This could raise prices by $1,461 per annum nevertheless it’s generally less expensive than purchasing a independent plan. It is also an excellent alternative if you are an aspiring driver.
Cheapest automobile coverage for minimal-possibility motorists
The price of insurance for autos will vary extensively depending on your driving historical past. You might require to search to uncover procedures which are economical for lower-hazard drivers. Insurers consider a number of elements when selecting on the most effective insurance coverage approach, for instance your driving report, demographics, and In general danger stage. The 5 most crucial facets to get into consideration when evaluating insurance coverage quotes are given beneath. Don’t forget that low coverage fees don’t always signify fewer excellent.
To start with, contemplate your zip code. The premiums are going to be greater for individuals who are in places with large criminal offense. Insurance organizations also think about traffic volume. Insurance policy organizations also consider the quantity of targeted traffic. This could effects your rates. To stop overpaying you’ll want to Examine your fees each individual six months. It’s also advisable to take into consideration obtaining special discounts for multiple policies if you’ve got many policies with a particular insurer.
Though credit score scores cannot be lawfully utilized by coverage organizations in all states, they must still be taken into consideration when evaluating automobile coverage rates. Hawaii drivers with bad credit score are needed to pay out 168% greater than motorists with very similar credit scores. Massachusetts drivers who are superior possibility are billed 30 per cent under motorists with thoroughly clean credit score. Prices for drivers who will be new will probably be greater if they may have an DUI or rushing ticket, or undesirable credit. It is crucial to have a look at distinct quotations before you make a choice.
Motor vehicle Insurance policies Around Me – Components That Have an effect on The price of Motor vehicle Insurance plan
Expense of insurance coverage is impacted from the zip code wherein you reside. In the event you reside in a location with an abnormal amount of criminal offense and significant costs of mishaps, you can anticipate to pay a lot more to obtain insurance coverage quotations. Insurance policy expenditures can also be impacted by other aspects like the amount of traffic or background of mishaps. As a way to find out the quantity they should demand, most coverage businesses analyze a driver’s driving history. Insurance policies firms demand additional for coverage for drivers which have negative driving histories than for motorists with fantastic driving history.
Price of car insurance coverage
As wellness care expenditures carry on to enhance, insurance policy for cars has increased by fifty-one hundred pc in the final 5 years. Drivers will have to also have insurance policies that isn’t insured or PIP. This can be a higher-than-typical point out obligation. Big apple, in contrast to other states, requires drivers have PIP and legal responsibility coverage. The extra coverages can boost the insurance plan Price tag and sometimes raise the high quality. Lastly, motorists want to check their protection restrictions. Particular policies offer a reduced minimal standard of protection than Other folks.
New Yorkers shell out a mean of two.eight per cent in their earnings for automobile coverage. That is slightly lower than the countrywide median of two.forty percent. Folks of their 30s, 40s and 50s shell out under the typical. Rates are increased for the people aged 70+ than for motorists with a lot less experience. Having said that, the premiums for married drivers will be increased than solitary drivers.
Motorists might also get lessened fees every time they consider defensive driving courses. The courses last for 320 minutes and cover the attitudes of drivers and targeted traffic laws. You may also understand defensive driving techniques, which can dramatically reduced your insurance policies premiums. They may also aid in improving upon their driving general performance. A training course can lower the price of motor vehicle coverage. If you are not certain with regards to the insurance coverage protection you require, the Insurance Information and facts Institute can assist.
Car insurance plan costs in other states
Though gasoline prices can vary between states, auto insurance policies prices in other states might be considerably more or less as opposed to fees inside of your own private point out. You could take note of the following variables including the quantity of motorists who’re not insured as well as the condition’s legal guidelines pertaining to insurance policy. Additionally, the frequency of theft. Insurance policy charges will also be impacted by negative temperature. Down below is a desk which illustrates the normal cost of auto coverage for various states. These estimates were being determined by analyzing the insurance plan prerequisites of each point out.
Missouri is the most very affordable condition for total protection vehicle insurance plan, costing only $944 lessen than Louisiana. Also, the state ranks fifth in conditions charges of dwelling, in addition to has just one Among the many most economical prices for each particular person. Texas motorists, even so, must pay 33% of their yearly profits to go over their motor vehicles. This is likely as a result of substantial quantities of drivers that are not insured in Texas and many lawsuits.
The normal countrywide Expense for automobile insurance policy with total coverage is $1771 a annually. Louisiana will be the condition with best insurance premiums, by using a $two,839 top quality. That is a 19% rise from 2020. Maine’s ordinary insurance plan Charge, nevertheless, is only $858. This is because no-fault states have higher insurance premiums. It is feasible that the cost of insurance for your vehicle in A different point out is substantially greater than it is in this article. There are a number of things to just take into account In combination with the laws of your respective condition with regards to insurance policy.
Superior-danger drivers spend additional for vehicle insurance policy
Trying to find high threat car insurance policies for top drivers near me? You may be curious how to get A reasonable policy. Higher-danger drivers pay back better rates for coverage than regular motorists. This is due to they have a tendency to obtain extra mishaps or violations on their own file. The maximum can be around 5 years based The situation you reside in. In a few situations, you may be suitable for special discounts if you are taking a driver security course.
Though the nationwide averages for high-hazard driver car or truck coverage in my spot are rather regular, you will find that rates vary appreciably from one condition to an other. There are many companies that adapt their prices to specific states. There may be an insurance company providing you the best protection at a lower Price Should your point out isn’t incorporated. Point out Farm is the greatest significant-risk driver insurance coverage policy near my property. State Farm has an extended-standing status for supplying superb customer service.
To Identify significant-hazard driver automobile insurance policies close to you, enter your ZIP code. Assess the offers. Whilst the price of higher-possibility auto insurance in close proximity to you can vary between states nearly all of significant coverage firms offer such a protection. Nationwide Basic, such as is a business which specializes in high-hazard protection. If you’ve got excellent grades, a very low-hazard auto, therefore you are capable of obtaining an insurance policy policy that’s lessen you may be able to get a person.
Comparing auto coverage organizations presents a lot of benefits
Evaluating motor vehicle insurers offers many Advantages. This information will target probably the most important areas like discounts, rankings in addition to customer support and consumer gratification. To make sure your protection and stability selecting the correct insurance plan policy is important. Look into the guidelines of different companies. If you find yourself done looking through this article you may realize that you know which insurer offers the best coverage with the bottom prices. Here are some suggestions that can assist you select the most fitted 1.
Comparative study of varied auto insurance companies
Examine quotations for auto insurance from various corporations to find the most aggressive charges. The expense of insurance is decided by numerous areas. It is vital to identify your requirements and Examine charges among providers. Sports activities cars that are insured might be costlier than People of normal cars. Moreover, your locality and driving document can influence the prices you receive. By using a Software for comparison to find the bottom fee on the identical protection which includes precisely the same deductible.
The cost of insurance policy premiums differs so it is necessary to totally understand how Each and every policy operates. The weather that have an affect on insurance policies rates include things like driving history, age and credit historical past. Compare the benefits provided by Every single enterprise like roadside support or accident forgiveness. It might be daunting to Examine estimates from different companies so you can select the best just one. Here are some tricks to get you started.
In the situation on the comparison of insurance policy firms for autos it is recommended to begin with the J.D. You’ll be able to charge electrical power car coverage corporations. The ratings are determined by customer satisfaction surveys finished across thousands of automobile-insurance coverage customers. These results are then compiled into numerical scores which can be the normal pleasure score of each organization. These rankings are printed on a yearly basis, and the highest automobile insurance plan corporations in Every classification acquire gold medals. How could you figure out no matter if these corporations advantage your focus?
There are a selection of techniques to ascertain the economic power of car or truck coverage providers. 1st, check out the AM Greatest insurance ranking. This offers financial steadiness scores to insurance policy companies. In case the insurance company is rated with the A or B, C, or F rating, you have to know about its balance before choosing to the coverage. This is a vital facet of customer service. Make sure to overview and recognize the great print prior to deciding.
There are numerous special discounts supplied by automobile insurance policy providers. Quite a few of these bargains will not be obtainable for all shoppers, so be sure you take a look at the web site of the company to make sure you qualify for special discounts which might be applicable to you. You might be eligible to receive many savings from different firms. Check out with all your agent to determine whether you are suitable. The procedure is simple and frequently can take less than an hrs. Down below are a few examples of feasible discounts on motor vehicle coverage.
Legacy Discounts Car insurance businesses could give a reduction for new motorists who invest in their coverage through the mum or dad organization. The discount usually is around ten percent. This is a way for fogeys to indicate their appreciation for their dedication over time. Additionally, it could help in preserving revenue on auto insurance coverage. There are actually many insurance coverage firms that provide lower price for motorists who will be youthful. Look at with your company to understand whether they contain the benefit. It’s also doable to explore the procedures which might be provided by American Relatives, Farmers, or USAA.
Customer support
You can find couple companies in the insurance business which excel in customer care. Esurance is one of them. It scored four out of five during the J.D. Electric power scores for customer support, which can be a large mark for an organization which has a mum or dad corporation that doesn’t. The business scored increased than its Competitiveness in all other locations, which include pricing and insurance policies and the standard of company provided by its Reps and Site. (personalized support)
Probably the most critical facet of car insurance policy for the majority of customers is definitely the defense, however it is the customer service that’s The key. Prospects want to get prompt and welcoming help from their insurance policies firms. Buyers would like to obtain prompt and pleasant responses to their calls in addition to e-mails. They also prefer to talk with an agent who listens and can give remedies. Though all car insurance policies companies can provide excellent customer service, some are a lot better than Other people. (rideshare insurance policy) (just few clicks) (insurance policies choices).
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| 39,003 |
The nose of Slyrs is full-creamy, with vanilla and fruits. The palate is malty, with hints of mocha-chocolate. Towards the finish it becomes somewhat bitter and woody-dry. Despite then use of wood smoke, I can’t detect any similarities with the best-known wood-smoked malt whisky: St George. Slyrs does have an unusual note playing through the more familiar notes of fruit and malt. Difficult to put my finger on, but it reminds me a bit of acetone. To me, Slyrs is by far the best German whisky I have tasted so far. Curious how it will develop over the coming years, and also what longer maturation
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“In August of this year, I started my Senior year as a sixteen year old at Cumberland International Early College High School. What a difference COVID-19 made in the world in 2020 but thankful for technology that allows us to keep normalcy in our lives. Books are still important and I had a bunch for my college classes. My family and I have used the library as a big source for homeschooling and projects for ten years. I’m a person that tries to stay positive in all aspects of my life. I’m the first to set goals and motivate myself and others. For example, in school, travel soccer games, tournaments, debate, and 4-H. The big thing about me is volunteering in the community and making a difference in a person’s life. I was instilled with those traits and values by my parents, Angela & Henry Ray. We were able to keep our tradition of sorting and packing boxes for Operation Christmas Child last month. It was a charity that I have done with my family and friends, since I was a toddler.”
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“Hope Mills Branch Library! The staff is always willing to help and they called me by my name. It’s because we are frequently there a few days a week.”
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| 950 |
WHEN I WAS a kid, I loved Valentine's Day, mainly because my teacher had us decorate shoeboxes with pink and red hearts, bring in Valentine cards featuring our favorite cartoon characters (mine was Little Lulu), and then collect as many cards as we could from our classmates. Plus we got chocolate.
When I first fell in love with my husband, I went to a lot of trouble picking out the perfect Valentine gifts—chocolate-covered strawberries, heart-printed boxer shorts, and homemade "I Heart You" cards. And he'd always give me dyed pink daisies from the grocery store and a heart-shaped box of drugstore chocolates.
Eventually we started showering our kids with Valentine goodies. My husband would sneak into their bedrooms early in the morning and sprinkle princess- and Star Wars-themed valentines all over the kids' beds and floor, while I made pink heart-shaped pancakes, pink scrambled eggs, and pink milk.
Now that I've got so many Valentine recipients in my family, I've decided to keep it simple and just pass out chocolate roses wrapped in pink foil, along with a humorous card from the stationery store.
When I mentioned Valentine's Day to a friend of mine who recently got dumped by her husband, I realized not everyone loves Valentine's Day like I do (mainly because of the chocolates). So I quickly created a party for my "Valentine's Day Sucks" friend to help her get through this mushy time. If you prefer to celebrate "Valentine's Day Sucks" too, here are some suggestions:
# Begin with invitations. Create your own, using the "Roses are red" formula. First cut a valentine card in half using a zigzag pattern so it looks like a broken heart. Then write a poem to invite your guests, such as, "Roses are red, Violets are blue, Butch is a pig, So let's kiss him 'Adieu!' " or "Roses are dead, Love is a lie, Bozo's a jerk, So let's roast the guy!"
# Suggest what to wear. Instead of dressing up in fancy or sexy outfits, have the guests come as slobs and be comfortable. Better yet, have T-shirts made with Bozo's face, circle it with red permanent marker and run a line through it, then pass the shirts out to guests.
# Time to decorate. Have guests create their own banners to hang on the walls, such as "Valentine's Day Sucks," "Men are Pigs," or "Love Hurts." Play lady-killer music, such as Shania Twain's "Whose Bed Have Your Boots Been Under?" Place a chocolate rose at each place setting.
# Get your game on. Play some killer games to keep from actually murdering the guy, such as "Venus vs. Mars." Write down some question prompts about men, such as, "Why don't men like to shop?" "Why do men have only three bathroom products?" "Why don't men like cats?" "Why do men act like children?" "Why don't men put the toilet seat down?"
# Have the players write down funny answers and read them aloud. Then watch a marathon of chick flicks featuring strong women, such as "Thelma and Louise."
# Time to eat and drink. Serve junk food, decadent chocolate desserts, and wash it all down with champagne!
#When the party's over, send the girls home with gourmet chocolates, a poster of Tiger Woods, and a good murder mystery — in which the boyfriend gets it.
posted by Penny at 11:28 AM
Anonymous said...
Loved the "un" Valentine's party idea. One of my friends hosted a Valentine's Day potluck, assigning pink and red dishes to each of us. The main dish was lasagna. It was a lot of fun, and didn't cost anyone very much. We all wore red, and we told stories about our worst and best valentine's gifts. It was surprising how many of us remember decorating shoe boxes and making our own cards to give to our classmates. I guess that dates us, but so what? Kids nowadays miss out on a lot of stuff.
I'm looking forward to beginning your party-planning series. I love themed mysteries, and I have really expanded the number of books I read weekly since I retired from teaching.
Enjoyed reading your blog.
February 16, 2010 at 8:44 PM
Lynn said...
Have you seen the new movie, Valentine's Day? In it one of the characters hosts a Valentine's Sucks kind of party. Fun idea for those who are disenchanted with romance (at least for the time being).
Your book, by the way, looks fantastic. I love culinary-themed mysteries, and yours looks like it's lots of fun. I'll have to look for it. And if you have any chocolate recipes you'd be willing to share, please send them my way! I have a recipe blog and like to feature other authors when I can -- a recipe and then a link to their book :)
February 17, 2010 at 6:51 PM
Penny said...
Thanks for your comments.
What fun!
If you'd like a complimentary Mini-Party Album, email my your address and I'll send it along.
February 20, 2010 at 8:31 AM
Penny said...
Lynn,
February 20, 2010 at 8:37 AM
Love the Roses are Red poems for the invitations!
It was great to see you at the S.F. Writers Conference, and I enjoyed your workshop, especially your humor.
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My dress is REALLY nice, it looks and fits GREAT. (I had it custom sized) The only reason I didnt give it 5 stars is because its longer than what it looks in the picture but other than that I cant complain. The material is great and the belt color is exactly the same color as the one shown on the model (I picked ruby) and it only took 22 days to arrive. You cannot go wrong with this dress.
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Ballbella is a vibrant online clothing store. Its founder is a small designer, engaged in online clothing stores for ten years. When she was still at school, the beautiful dress in the window of the roadside clothing store stopped her, but she was just a child of an ordinary family, and every time she was deterred by the expensive price of the dress.
| 794 |
Tourism can be an economic gold mine when approached properly, and most countries around the world have embraced visitors with open arms. However, there are several places across the globe who decided that they were better without the masses of newcomers: here are 10 countries that have closed their doors to Americans and many other nations around the world.
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David says:
October 26, 2017 at 2:28 am
Add Thailand to your list.
They love tourist revenue but discriminate against visitors.
Entrance fees to National Parks, zoos etc are more than doubled for visitors.
Taxi drivers are well known for ‘ripping off’ tourists.
And the Tourism Authority of Thailand has been selling a lie about Thailand for decades.
October 26, 2017 at 11:39 am
Thank you for the addition, very insightful!
October 26, 2017 at 3:26 pm
None of these countries is good to go. let them stay alone and never bother traveling to another man country for any reason…. One love for the rest country thats allow each other to visit. traveling is part of education and many more good experience..
maryam says:
October 31, 2017 at 8:55 am
pooria is true .iran is a big country and very beautiful .Iranian people are very warm and love to host foreigner .
November 9, 2017 at 2:44 am
That’s not true, you’re probably just born at iran and left w hen you were a kid but trust me nothing good happens for tourists here specially now just come once and you’ll see
November 25, 2017 at 10:13 pm
I agree with this comment. I was in Tehran 3 times and I can vow for this
December 4, 2017 at 11:44 pm
Im iranian. You can travel to the my country. We are your friend
December 5, 2017 at 4:15 am
I am happy with your comment, may Allah regard us Ameen.
Dude says:
December 6, 2017 at 10:08 am
From what I have read the Iranians are warm and friendly as a people and take a keen interest in america. We can’t judge them all based on a radical ten percent that chant death to America. That would be like judging democrats based on antifa.
Of course I approve of the latter
December 8, 2017 at 1:07 am
Iran is beautiful country with anciant cultural about human and people that loves together and know guest and like forigen people and growing guests, specially tourists ? them and i can’t believe some Iranian, same that friend, write wrongs about this lovely and peaceful people, Iranian is so kindness you can read about this realty from some people ??? that had a experience about this so ancuant country with10 000 years of humanity, please don’t jugs of same, some darky minds ?? person, we are ?? Iranian and we love you come in my country be my guest and than judging us…
Love you.
Asad. M
Masum says:
December 21, 2017 at 3:34 am
yes iran is a vary beautiful country
December 24, 2017 at 12:13 am
I can visit Iran and Saudi with no harm and very peacfully
Drnnis says:
December 25, 2017 at 3:37 am
Saudis don’t like to welcome people in their country they kill and rape young women from Africa and their policemen are corropt.
December 25, 2017 at 12:43 pm
Exactly.
But I’d like to say, Iranian people will be happy to see foreign travelers from every country.
All of us are living and moving fast at the home, called earth. ????????
December 30, 2017 at 9:05 pm
Maryam is true. Iranians love all people and all nations in the world. Their hospitality is really unbelievable for the tourists who visit this country. There are thousands of touristic places in Iran. Many historic sites date over 3000 years and many of them are registered (or candidate) as UNESCO world heritage. Since last year, you don’t need any VISA before traveling to Iran, since the VISA is accorded at the frontiers to all nations. Iranians love American people and they are really welcomed to visit Iran.
Athar says:
January 3, 2018 at 2:32 am
Exactly. If you don’t believe it, Just search “travel to Iran” and read amazing stories about visitors in all around the world who have fun time in Iran. Iranian people are so friendly and kind, Especially with foreigners, and act around them respectfully.
Unfortunately, American and European medias shows a negetive sight about Iran, Because Iran is their enemy and political things… Don’t believe these strange things tryna shows Iran scary and creepy!
Hope you visit and enjoy!
January 6, 2018 at 6:44 am
hello maryam. how beautiful is Iran? I hope to visit there too?
January 6, 2018 at 11:39 pm
I will soon be there In sha Allah
January 7, 2018 at 3:00 am
Really? I think Iranian people are very Racist and dangerous.
January 10, 2018 at 1:09 am
Very true. Iranians are very warm people. I am not sure about politics there though.
January 14, 2018 at 2:11 am
Iran is an amazing country to visit.
I was there in April of 2017 for three weeks.
The people are the friendliest, kindest more welcoming people I have met anywhere. I have travelled to many countries and Iran is my favourite.
January 20, 2018 at 2:05 am
Hey, I traveled Iran recently in my own vehicle, great people, loved it
(except the taxi drivers in Tehran who can be a little stressed)
January 23, 2018 at 8:46 am
I would love to go to Iran and see all the history
January 25, 2018 at 9:03 am
There country is a muslim country they still want to maintain there belive, in some aspect most esspecially religion
paul says:
January 29, 2018 at 8:49 am
What a shame one can rarely judge a country just from negative comments based on ignorance of the place .
I am British and have travelled widely throughout my life I spent a year 1977 to 1978 In Iran mainly Ahwaz north of Abadan in the oil belt which was not very interesting in itself but we ventured into the mountains near Dezful -fond memories of the river through the rocks . I loved the country and its rich heritage especially places like Persepolis truly one of the most amazing historical places I have ever visited with antiquities dating back thousands of years .You should be proud of this history however it us now perceived . Shiraz was a beautiful city with amazing mosques I never got to Isfahan and Pars in the south had wonderful agriculture and friendly colourful people . Tehran was a little crazy but seemed interesting and diverse but never spent much time there.
The potential seems amazing . There are I believe 80 million people and they need the tourists to come and open up the country to the world again .. Can you explain why we do not get enough good reports …. come on INvite us from the west…
Muhammed Ali says:
January 29, 2018 at 8:49 pm
Alright nice miss Maryam since as I hear it from you since I intention to visit Iran I will come for visit
Arman says:
February 2, 2018 at 12:16 pm
Maryam say true.
February 3, 2018 at 1:55 am
February 6, 2018 at 8:41 pm
This list couldn’t be more incorrect. Iran and Cuba are more welcoming than you can imagine and I am sure other countries on this list can’t be justified either. What people are led to believe through media outlets is mostly rubbish. There are good and bad elements across the world. North American folks have been kept in fear for the longest time. Fear and hate sells like hot cakes. One should always experience the world not through media but in person. Governments have their vested interest of divide and rule. Americans for the longest time have been kept in fear and hate for the rest of the world. Every country has its bad pockets, just avoid those and you will end up falling in love with the world, people and cultures.
sahar says:
February 8, 2018 at 6:13 am
look guys
non of the negative stuff about iran is true !
i am iranian my self and i can assure you that every one is welcome to my country
most of bad stuff you hear about us is because of wrong politics. we are not terrorists and we don’t support them at all !
after all we are all human and living in the same planet there is no reason to hate each other
Iran would be happy to host any of you from what ever country you are !
p.s we are not racist at all !!
Regal says:
February 9, 2018 at 2:19 pm
@dude… I want to clarify a very important point; when you hear “death to USA” it does not mean “death for its people, country, culture etc”, but rather it mesns “down with its goverment’s dictator attitude toward other countries”.
If you peruse the contemporary history of some of the countries in the list, such as Iran and Cuba, you will understand their point of view.
February 10, 2018 at 3:21 am
I went to Iran recently. The people are really hospitable and warm. Many places to visit. And it is also safe to travel in Iran. I’ve been traveling to 6 continents and traveling in Iran is so easy.
Eoin says:
February 13, 2018 at 6:48 am
Yes I concur with Maryam, Iran and Cuba shouldn’t be on this list nor Algeria either – I understand this is written from an American viewpoint so is different for most other people.And while for Americans you may feel there is animosity from the bureaucrats, most countries citizens are welcoming.
Abdulbaki Lukman says:
February 15, 2018 at 1:22 pm
Yes thanks
February 23, 2018 at 11:40 am
Hi. i agree with maryam . Iran is a good and beautiful countri and it has a friendly people. iranian people loves forigner tourists and we will happy if tourists com too iran
February 27, 2018 at 12:28 am
You are absolutely right. Me once visited Iran (Tabrez)
November 15, 2017 at 9:52 pm
December 7, 2017 at 5:44 pm
I disagree with uour assumption about Japan. Japan is a home to many US military bases and military dependents love it here. Very clean environment, very helpful and kind people. I work as a DoD civilian and been here in Japan for over 18 years and working with Japanese nationals in my unit.
Uno says:
December 11, 2017 at 7:10 pm
Japan is wonderful & the people are so courteous, so helpful, so kind. You must have offended them.
Jeff says:
December 12, 2017 at 2:03 pm
You misunderstood their culture. Be more open minded. Did you even try to speak their language!? Imagine how Americans treat the regular Asian tourist who can’t speak English in NY or any other place…rude and disrespectful. We Americans are the worst!
December 17, 2017 at 9:52 am
The Japanese don’t appreciate rudeness, filth, poor hygiene, laziness, arrogance. Are you perceived as one of these people? The people are private, but kind and compassionate. You’ll be hard pressed to find more polite people anywhere in the world!
Eleanor says:
December 20, 2017 at 12:06 am
I agree, unfriendly and unhelpful. It shouldn’t be added to the list though. The culture is very exotic.
Taz Kuhn says:
December 23, 2017 at 2:54 am
I don’t know which Japan you visited…..
December 23, 2017 at 3:58 am
What Japan did you visit?? Have been going there for over 30 years and it is amazing!! Hands down the safest, most polite and welcoming country in the world!!!
December 23, 2017 at 5:24 pm
Unusual comment about Japan??? As a frequenter of Japan, I have a very different experience.
I have had taxi drivers fold origami (paper folding) at stop lights and give it to me as a gift when I
exit the cab. (I have also had drivers tell me their personal worries (divorce, financial problems, etc.) because it is safer to confess to a foreigner than a local. Whenever I drop something, immediately someone retrieves it and lets me know
I have left it behind. I have left my briefcase on the rack of a train and when the train came around
on the circle line–it was still there. I have dropped my billfold and had it returned to me at with all money and cards intact. When something doesn’t work, a repairman is quickly there and politely makes sure all is well.
Everyone does there bit of work and there is no one more friendly than the wealthy shop owner
sweeping his patch of sidewalk and saying good morning. Of course, a little effort at Japanese goes a
long way. I have not the slightest clue where you were in Japan to have this impression.
This list is rather ridiculous–I’ve been to 77 countries and, of course, who wants to go to most of the listed countries— they are major points of violence in the world. Who cares whether they want you or not. When stablized, these countires will be begging for dollars.
December 24, 2017 at 2:40 am
Certainly not our experience of Japan. Beautiful country with beautiful, friendly people. There for three weeks earlier this year. Loved every second.
December 24, 2017 at 6:35 pm
Can’t agree with Norma, unfriendly by citizen doesn’t mean unwelcome by government. Its a known fact if you don’t speak the countrys language, they are more likely to ignore you. Noone want to pretend to understand english. They would rather save themselves the embarrassment by being rude.
December 26, 2017 at 2:09 pm
December 26, 2017 at 8:39 pm
Rubbish! I live here and have found nothing but warmth from the Japanese. Don’t confuse their lack of English as a cold shoulder ?
December 27, 2017 at 5:01 am
I I was stationed in Japan back in the early seventies when I was in the Marine Corps at that time I was treated decent because I was representing I guess the Marine Corps the US in 2009 several of my buddies and I former Marines and Vietnam veterans that had grew up together went in the Marine Corps and served in combat and had been stationed in Japan decided to go on a vacation there and see how Japan was that now well I can tell you we were treated nothing like we were treated when we were quote-unquote representing the white man the people were rude disrespectful at times not very helpful when we would try to ask questions
everybody would act like no English no English when you would actually have previously heard that person speaking English listen if you’re an African American and you want to travel and be treated like a king go to Tanzania East Africa I’ve been there 3 times in the last six or seven years it is amazing you must go on Safari in nigora un’goro Gora crater in Arusha . Jamaica is another place African-Americans should not go and spend their money they dislike for African-American males
December 31, 2017 at 8:18 am
when i went there They were Extremely helpfull and polite
besides there are some societal rules i looked upon and asked before i came
So i didn’t offend anyone when i went
January 2, 2018 at 6:05 pm
In Japan, they are very bigoted. They will act nice to your face, but have racist feelings. Japan is a very developed country that doesn’t allow immigration.
January 4, 2018 at 7:35 am
I doubt that. Allthough there may be strict policies regarding wast, exploitation and overly western behaviour. Respect and gratitude come first.
Troy says:
January 4, 2018 at 9:03 pm
What do you expect? We nuked them!
January 5, 2018 at 5:17 am
Japanese may be cold people sometimes, specially towards Americans but I guess you might know why.
Mel says:
January 7, 2018 at 1:53 am
You do know that Japanese people aren’t very social, right? They aren’t like Americans who can easily communicate with each other. They prefer to keep within their own comfort circle. This is coming from an asian myself. (Sorry for bad English)
Tony says:
January 7, 2018 at 2:56 am
No way. I was there last year and stayed with a Japanese family. They looked after us, cooked, showed us around and bought us presents. I found it the most friendly place I’ve been. Strangers went out of their way to show us directions. Awesome place.
January 9, 2018 at 4:40 pm
Japan is not cold and unfriendly. We have been living here for a year and,I’ve the people. Always kind and thoughtful. Before that we came as tourists. A great place tolive
Jerry N. says:
January 11, 2018 at 5:24 am
Let’s go North Korea. I heard it’s a very friendly country.. Especially, government / authorities are very helpful.
January 12, 2018 at 9:11 am
Ms. Keatley…Why didn’t you just stay at home and watch travel videos about Japan? People with attitude issues like you shouldn’t actually visit those places…you’re probably the worst representative for your Country there could possibly be. Your last statement is a case in point (oh, “tho” is not a word in the English language), showing that your attitude toward your host country was one of superiority. Wow, lady! How wrong could you be?? Japanese people are some of the most warm, friendly, generous and forgiving people on the planet. Granted, there can be rotten apples in every barrel, just look in YOUR mirror, but in Japan those are few because they’re winnowed out by their peers. Next time you want to open your pie-hole about a culture as ancient and respected as Japan’s…do your homework. Again, I suggest you make thorough use of the travel channel and Fodor’s travel books (he’s a dweeby snob, too) and just stay at home. I would imagine you’re one of those who refers to the United States as “America”, huh? Surprise! The America’s consist of Canada, USA, Mexico, Central America and all of South America. Those of us who actually pack the backpacks and suitcases and schlep through jungles (both urban and botanical) don’t want your sort of traveler out here ruining it for the rest us with your bad manners and worse attitudes.
Jay Sloan says:
January 14, 2018 at 2:21 am
ummm..I was in Tokyo on October 12, 2017 and I found Japanese to be extremely helpful, even going out of their way to help me when I was lost..clean, respectful, not sure where you went but my trip was quite pleasant.
January 15, 2018 at 8:08 am
Japan people are very generous for visitor.
January 20, 2018 at 6:53 am
Maybe if you spoke their language???
Carolyn says:
January 21, 2018 at 7:00 pm
Japan, really? We couldn’t find a more welcoming and a most courteous place to visit. Are you sure you went there.? People went out of their way to be helpful and explain things. Would return in a hearbeat.
Ken P says:
January 22, 2018 at 10:19 am
Japan had some rude people that we came across. In disney! Since we were visitors we kept quiet and moved along. Not on our lists to visit anytime soon.
January 22, 2018 at 11:50 pm
We can add Pakistan in the list.The northern Pakistan is a real wonder and know to be a Switzerland of Asia. People are very simple and entertaining and tourism is cheapest in the world.
January 27, 2018 at 8:13 pm
may b I don’t agree , japnees are not cold but shy, they don’t mix with new people but when knew you they are the best
paul says:
January 29, 2018 at 9:09 am
If you approach anyone in any country in the world and immediately speak in your own language and they don’t understand ,it can be perceived by you as rudeness . I suggest this is how you approach foreigners normally . What a shame for you . You have missed out ……
If you show manners use body language and smile most people will help you if they can understand you . It annoys me that a country can be judged by a few conversations . There are good and bad people everywhere . I have heard that the Japanese are very polite and respectful although I have never visited . Not sure which other countries you have visited ….I feel sorry for your narrow minded approach…
February 10, 2018 at 8:15 am
I says:
February 11, 2018 at 1:58 am
Darn. Who cares if people are cold or friendly? Question was: is it difficult to get visa to Japan?
March 26, 2018 at 7:26 pm
I found Japan one of the best places I’ve been to Japan and my daughter spent over a year there teaching English because they can read it but cannot speak it so sometimes they may come across as a bit aloof but they are so polite and respectful and were wonderful to my daughter. Besides that the temples are amazing and serine, there are great theme parks like Disney land, the city lights, the culture. It’s got just about everything.. I guarantee you will love it if you go there
November 17, 2017 at 7:35 pm
Well, do something about your own education, your post sounds instable and unencumbered by any knowledge.
Cuba is visited and liked by many European visitors. When a certain regime or administration is the reason not to go instead of meeting locals and communicate with them the US of A should be added to this list
texas aggie says:
December 31, 2017 at 8:36 am
Amen. People from other countries not the US have absolutely no problem visiting Cuba and they do it regularly.
Edward Sykes says:
January 6, 2018 at 5:47 am
Canadian visit Cuba my the millions each year (i’m In Cuba right now) amazing people.
January 7, 2018 at 8:46 am
word.
As an American expat i hate visiting the USA anymore. Not good for anything except family and tax free shopping. It has become ugly, run down and populated with punk cops and criminals. Hard to know which is worse. The government employees or deadbeat criminals living on the street.
Damion Lum Fai says:
January 7, 2018 at 2:00 pm
Cuba is a must on the bucket list. I’m Trinidadian and I worked there for some time where I met my wife. Lots of Europeans, Canadians, Africans and the people are warm and inviting.
It’s just a political thing with the US but visit is a must.
January 8, 2018 at 2:46 pm
I completely agree, I’ve visit more than 30 countries and one of the most friendly is Cuba, it is also safe. The appreciation seems to be very political oriented.
January 8, 2018 at 3:31 pm
This is for Americans only. Canadians visit Cuba by the thousands as they don’t create mistrusts such what the American government does…in MANY countries!!!
January 13, 2018 at 7:09 pm
Totally agree viktor. I thought Cuba was a good place to visit, and the only people who have problems are Americans.
January 15, 2018 at 6:32 pm
Cubans love tourists. Its a very vital revenue for them. The country is beautiful and super safe, people are incredibly friendly and honest. They try very hard to please the visitors everywhere. We went motorcycling to the mountains, and visited tiny, now allowed private restaurants in the villages. The food was delicious, everything is organic, and very cheap. They are very honest too, never tried to overcharge us. Its a time travel to a different realm, far cry from the stressful , busy, greedy Western civilization. Yet they hsve top noch healthcare and free university education.
January 16, 2018 at 9:22 pm
Frida says:
February 26, 2018 at 3:31 am
I agree that it’s not fair Cuba is on the list. My parents travelled all the island (not just the beach and Havana) and they were welcomed everywhere, even the smaller towns. They couldn’t go to Bahia de Cochinos and Guantanamo for obvious reasons. It was a safe environment too, they went with a big group of tourists and neither was robbed or felt threatened at all. Getting a visa was no problem at all.
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:23 am
perhaps you might the correct, but as far as Iran is concerned, it should not be on this list, Iran is a jewel with kind people, beautiful ladies, and no crime.
Nick Mills says:
December 10, 2017 at 11:22 pm
I have only ever met 2 Iranians,both of them were top geezers,very friendly
December 14, 2017 at 1:55 pm
Are you kidding? What does it have to do with the beautiful ladies? You can’t see them under all the crap they are wearing anyway. They are a notorious terrorist supporting country. And want to kill all Americans.
It once was when the Shah was still in power.
December 24, 2017 at 4:28 am
I would love to marry one of them. They are really cute.
January 2, 2018 at 4:49 pm
I agree with you. Iran is a great place to visit and have wonderful people. Do not listen to media. Tv and Hollywood just lie and lie.
Jacqui says:
January 3, 2018 at 8:20 pm
@ Ugo indeed there are beautiful ladies in Iran but l would not think this a a wise comment …No visitor would be encoraged to go there to find love or whatever it is you propose ….Thank goodness Iranian women are both veautiful and intellegent….some bloated aging visitor looking for love is not really welcome …if you are one …go to Thailand …there are litterally thousands of girls waiting to steal your money with the promise of love …and then send you packing ….Ahhh what happened to the good old days when people traveled to see beautiful countries and observe and respect local customs ….
nick says:
January 6, 2018 at 10:44 am
But they will put you in jail for long time for sex with unmarried woman!!!
January 10, 2018 at 2:44 am
Thanks for the addition of ANGOLA & SOMALIA …
they should take their country .
Alex says:
January 14, 2018 at 6:23 am
That’s Right. some countries in list are lovely place to travel such as Iran, Syria
Lee says:
January 23, 2018 at 4:27 am
I concur. Iran and Iranians are beautiful people. They are just unfortunately enemies of Israel, which controls US policy. Israel should definitely be on the list.
November 23, 2017 at 4:19 am
Every country and its law enforcement departments have good and bad individuals.
As far as visa application is concern ,hotel booking, invitation letter from a company or individual,proof of finance, is a basic requirement for most of the countries
Several countries also require to furnish confirmed air tickets and health insurance( European countries specially Schengen states).
However, scrutiny of the visa application is based on the strength of the passport and the applicant’s previous travel records also.
December 17, 2017 at 1:03 am
What I have to contribute is that!Am urging the whole world to stop self racisim,be human to our own self!lets own our selves,feel like others,”NO MATTER WHO YOU ARE”,or where you came from.Remember human is “HUMAN”,aint called our self of creatures neither animals!Remember,when you turn around or look at someone.My question is “HOW DO YOU FEEL”?We can’t be DOG’S but just human and we are only 2 human existance in this world.Guess who will denied about this….?My brothers and sisters let’s feel love of one another and stop this brutal killing with harashments,it has no use.Besides,if we are not changed for our own good,never shall we thing of human right on this plannet.”GOOD TO CHANGE”!Is the slogan for Hunan.
Ariyo says:
November 27, 2017 at 12:17 am
Yes you are right
December 17, 2017 at 12:39 am
Yes I agree with u..
February 25, 2018 at 4:26 am
We Europeans are very happy to visit Iran,which has excellent ski resorts and fine food (and drink). The Christians and the Jews have reserved seats in the Iranian Parliament, but the locals do not like us to wear inappropriate clothing in their places of worship. This may also be true of the USA and other Jewish and Christian faith-based nations. When Saddam Hussein and his army invaded Iran, supported by the USA (Dick Cheney), the defence forces sent them packing.
Siavash says:
November 28, 2017 at 12:36 am
Iranians always welcome you, despite political hostility. Iran’s government imposed these tackles to reply Trump’s restriction law against Iranians traveling to US. By the way, we are not alone in the world.
January 10, 2018 at 1:16 am
I agree that Iran is a jewel, a country with long history and culture, very warm and welcoming people. Not to mention that Iranian ladies are considered among the prettiest in the world- darker skin with green eyes.
January 10, 2018 at 2:45 am
as you know
November 30, 2017 at 12:45 am
we dont want to stay solitude my friend. its the dictators rule forcing people to be recluse
January 8, 2018 at 3:35 pm
You are so right. I have had a friend in Iran with whom I corresponded often. People are quite the same in all countries but gobvernments cause most of the problems with their misguided policies and secrecy.
December 7, 2017 at 12:30 am
all this matters its because of the governments of those countries and its not related to peoples,I my self as a Iranian love to everybody from all over the world travel to my country
sa says:
December 17, 2017 at 11:43 am
it is matter of government not people of country or country itself!
January 27, 2018 at 2:51 pm
People who are inside the country
December 17, 2017 at 9:50 pm
Actually Cuba is an awesome country to visa. Crime is very low and Cubans are welcoming people. And it is NOT true that Cuba does not want people to visit, it is US propaganda that SAYS that, but Cuba doesn´t care. People from all over the world flock to Cuba´s beautiful beaches every year. Everyone, apparently, except Americans who know very little about Cuba anyway.
December 19, 2017 at 4:19 pm
Please visit Vietnam my country, you will never regret with this
Le thi sinh says:
February 9, 2018 at 9:42 pm
I don’t think so!
February 12, 2018 at 6:21 am
Hi we are coming tomorrow!!! Hanoi and then Ho Chi Minh city. Looking forward to seeing your amazing country. Any Suggestions???
amir says:
December 19, 2017 at 9:45 pm
but what about the people who live in these countries. They need to support by the other countries to make their live better then before. All the humans are same and you cannot judge the people by they countries. in addition to these countries are alone by they government ,policy and other things and not by the human.
December 21, 2017 at 4:02 am
Is true, they like to travel to other people country but they like to see different people in their country. We the citizens of Liberia will not allow those hateful countries citizens to travel here or build embassy here.They don’t have respect for different people.
younes says:
December 23, 2017 at 2:04 pm
if you dont like to come my country its dosent mean that we are alone Dude.
and its ok because its stay mystery,
and if we dont have usa embassy in our country,its because we change the name that to house of spy,and we found to many reason by the people not even our goverment,
December 27, 2017 at 4:50 pm
Restrictions should apply to trump only. He is the problem. He only wants us citizens their cos he thinks they wont argue with him. He a dictator and racist and can rot on his own in his own country with all the red necjed brainless fools that voted for him while the rest of the world get on and embrace our wonderful world and different cultures. The mans an idiot and causing nothing but problems
Ahmad says:
January 4, 2018 at 7:36 am
Let us stay alone ? :)) That’s true that our goverment are corrupted, but our people are so kind and they really like tourists. I mean IRAN. I’ve hosted too many foreigner visitors in Iran and if you could ask them you would change your mind my friend.
January 9, 2018 at 8:37 am
I agree. He should stay at home. It s best and safe for him. Don’t bother to go anywhere. All are too dangerous for him to visit.
Yaz says:
January 12, 2018 at 1:40 pm
Am so impressed with your education!
January 13, 2018 at 6:10 am
You are right, if your visit is not appreciated leave them the hell alone
January 19, 2018 at 2:16 am
& visit historical buildings.
& then give your opinion
January 19, 2018 at 5:14 pm
listen go to algeria and you find your misconception wrong
all hdt rubish all you need is to book accommodation bank statement and fees
January 21, 2018 at 12:22 am
No you can not know about dubai and italy i think these are best for vist.
Monica says:
January 22, 2018 at 12:56 pm
Iran is the most hospitable and kind country in the world
January 23, 2018 at 2:33 am
yes its true that travelling is a form of education….yet I feel if someone doesn’t wash their filthy hands they shouldn’t go shaking other peoples hands that are well washed or clean especially when they want it to remain clean, this is in reference to people who exhibit vile and heinous crimes against other people in other peoples country especially the USA, most colonialist nations, terrorist etc….notwithstanding, the listed countries should be restricted from going else where since they don’t want to welcome others as stated by the golden rule of life “do unto mothers as you want to be done to”.
Alex says:
February 3, 2018 at 9:32 am
Regal says:
February 9, 2018 at 1:53 pm
None?!
Iran is one of the most interesting destinations for travel! I think you should get a look at some backpacking experiences there.
February 19, 2018 at 11:28 pm
I like the way you spoke.
Mohammad says:
November 4, 2017 at 12:42 pm
I am a persian and live in Shiraz/Iran
We always Wellcome tourist and anyone ever come here for 1st time say it is amazing.
We always be good to tourists.
Everywhere always has good and bad people.
If our government is bad,but we are not bad.dont put it to all.
Just try to visit cities like Shiraz or Yazd or Isfahan and etc.
If you come to shiraz i strongly recommend you to visit cultural places like NASIR-AL-MOLK MOSQUE, ARG-E KARIM KHAN, HAFEZ, SAADI and other places then come here and just comment your opinion after thet!
November 18, 2017 at 6:49 am
Please change the title to “10 countries the USA won’t let its citizens visit”. As it stands the headline is simply no true. I expected better.
December 7, 2017 at 11:24 pm
Exactly my thoughts as i read through the list. Well said.
December 12, 2017 at 1:08 pm
That is right
December 17, 2017 at 9:54 am
December 27, 2017 at 1:52 pm
Thanx i will come in u s a
texas aggie says:
December 31, 2017 at 8:38 am
Exactly.
January 8, 2018 at 3:36 pm
January 17, 2018 at 6:40 am
USA has no diplomatic relations with these countries, so if you get in trouble don’t expect USA to help you
January 24, 2018 at 3:45 pm
I agree. Interesting article as US requests the same proof of those who want US Visas, not to mention how badly potential tourists are treated at US embassies and the impossibility to get an answer from anything other than recorded machines…i guess we are getting what we do unto others…
Kate says:
February 6, 2018 at 11:24 pm
Well said! I applied for US visa and they refused it without giving me a reason! I just wanted to visit some beautiful places of the US without even thinking about to emigrate or stuff like this! Wish I’ll have at least one chance in my life to visit Us especially Arizona Utah and California
Regal says:
February 9, 2018 at 1:58 pm
I think you are throughly right!
Citizens of much of these countries are not easily allowed to enter US; hence there are some problems for entering these countries for US citizens.
For example, based on the text, Iran dies not have any embassy in US and that is a hurdle for getting visa; but it is also the case for Iranian who are in Iran and want to enter US.
On the other hand, the title is so general! The mentioned problems usually are just for Americans.
Alex says:
November 26, 2017 at 10:55 pm
Please eliminate Iran from this list.
IRAN is not categorized in this list. This country has a welcoming and peaceful inhabitants with the history of about 3000 years. Although there are some conflicts in political aspects, there is no war, no racism and of-course no ISIS. So, I love this country so much and I definitely and strongly propose you to travel there and visit historical and lovely cities and places such as: Isfahan, Shiraz, Mashhad, Tabriz, Tehran and you yourself will see how Iranian are welcoming. These days there is high propensity among international tourists to travel and visit Iran, individually or in group. If USA does not have an embassy there, it is not the desirable excuse that encourage individuals not to travel there. It is like to say that, DT is the POTUS so visitors do not have any willing to travel to US!!
As an American citizen I sincerely advice you that eliminate Iran from this list.
bob says:
December 12, 2017 at 7:22 pm
what about girlfriend ?
Izza says:
December 31, 2017 at 1:14 pm
n.r says:
January 1, 2018 at 7:21 am
Lily says:
January 2, 2018 at 9:13 am
Iran is a country that welcomes visitors/tourists. My aunt has visited over 30 times… And she is American
January 4, 2018 at 8:31 am
I agree. I am Argentinian, not Iranian and I loved the country, its incredible tresors and the warm people.
Abraham Amah says:
January 11, 2018 at 3:40 am
I completely disagree with you. a country that will not allow a Christian access to his bible or freedom of his worship can not right fit your narrative.
January 17, 2018 at 6:47 am
I agree with your comment. We have too many naive people that are willing to risk their lives and challenge their country in the name of their freedom.
They won’t listen to reason even when Innocent Americans are in prisoned there .
January 12, 2018 at 4:38 pm
I visited Iran in 2017. That was no problem at all. As a French national I got a visa on arrival. No need to go to a consulate. That doesn’t mean that I like the influence of Muslim clergy in that country.
November 27, 2017 at 7:14 pm
If for any reason you want to go there (like taking up arms against, or joining ISIS) just go to Turkey and smuggle yourself over the border. Be sure to avoid snipers and US drones that will try stop you using lethal force. But once there there are many vacant rooms to stay in. They may not have all 4 walls or rooves, but if it’s summer you will find the breeze pleasant. Oh, and beware land mines, chemical attacks, random air strikes and do not get kidnapped as you most likely will end up on a graphic YouTube video and never be heard of again.
Tunisia wasn’t much better when I was there either, but your odds of returning home with your head still attached are much better. Compared to the above Thailand is paradise.
December 30, 2017 at 8:35 pm
Hawaii is beautiful why go to that county in Asia thailand has murders tourists many prostitutes
Naya says:
December 15, 2017 at 6:01 am
You see, Am Nigerian and we sure do get most of these treatments and protocols for almost all the countries except the west African countries. Americans are special that’s why you’ve got a list for just 10. However am proudly Nigerian, the world is incomplete without us
January 4, 2018 at 5:00 pm
You should add “as an American” I’m not American so that is bullshit :p
Rellu says:
January 9, 2018 at 11:22 pm
Those restrictions are mostly for people with US passports. Passport holders of other countries have entry to all of these countries waaay easier.
On most of the listed countries, I just asked and got visa on arrival at the destination airport or crossing the land border, no problems in any of those. North Korea required the same all inclusive package tour, but that is same with all passports. But again, some of countries are more difficult/impossible for US, Canada or UK passport holders, while few countries do not mostly allow US passport holders at all in practice.
January 25, 2018 at 11:47 pm
You also forgot Bhutan. They officially don’t want tourists because they are afraid that tourists will mess up the country. They only recently approved tourists to come on a guided tour and only a few a year. What’s different from the others on the list is that their government is not oppressive.
January 30, 2018 at 11:52 am
it’s not “insightful”; it’s stupid. The Cubans are happy to have people from the US visit. It’s our own government that doesn’t want us to go.
February 3, 2018 at 3:05 am
I can not agree. It is my 2nd time to Thailand. I am sitting on the beach in Phuket writing this. One of the best countries to visit in the World in my opinion. We rented a Schootet for B300 per day and took part in most of the activaties offered. Fishing is poor. I think they ate them all.
February 15, 2018 at 11:37 pm
I believe that the title of your article should read: “10 countries that do not wish for Americans to visit” !! most people are welcome.
Bobby Green says:
October 27, 2017 at 8:21 pm
You are right, David. Thailand is not good place to visit if we take bad experiences in the country from all over the world into consideration. However, I have another country that should be added to the list – the Philippine. Be warned of taxi drivers, mobile prostitutes and even security guards/police officers. You foreigners could robbed easily if you take no special attention and high alert. Please also be careful about hotel staffs. Beautiful girls does not mean beautiful mind! Take my words, guys!
November 19, 2017 at 12:47 am
I totally agree with you… I’ve been traveling around the world for almost 30 years and the Philippines is the worst of any worst.
December 24, 2017 at 11:12 pm
please my friend do not generalize the whole country in the Philippines, don’t you heard about the comment of of Joe that filipino people are very hospitable, very kind, very helpful, very most of all best in all aspects of cultural behaviour.
December 27, 2017 at 7:25 am
Sorry to hear abt this but I disagree with you .you probably were at the wrong place..there are many other parts of the Philippines where you can feel like in paradise ?
Many foreigners love to live in the Philippines.and many think that Filipinos are very friendly, hospitable and even happy people even if they are poor..
Bad people is everywhere in all countries.even in a very peaceful and safe country, you can find bad people too.
Sara Nunez says:
January 4, 2018 at 6:31 pm
Flips in general are rude and act like a mafia when they’re in groups.
Henry Elisher says:
January 6, 2018 at 4:39 am
How the hell is Cuba on this list!? Of course Americans make it difficult for themselves but for every other nation wanting to enter the process is easy and the country more than accommodating.
So, to all my friends in the US, the difficulty of obtaining a visa is based on your own politics and currently due to the stupidity and blatant ignorance of your president (a fake president)
November 20, 2017 at 3:29 am
Phil and Thai girls aren’t beautiful, they’re submissive and waiting for the leftover Western men that Brit/American/German women ignore cos theyre cheap af and hygiene poor
Dean Barrett says:
December 21, 2017 at 6:31 am
Anyone who thinks Asian women are submissive has never been married to one.
December 22, 2017 at 12:55 am
It seems that you speak from experience. Service was not up to your expectations ?
December 27, 2017 at 7:30 am
Don’t generalize the Filipinos and thai girls. There are many well-off and well educated Filipino women who just chose foreign men than of their fellow citizen because of love.NOT of money..
December 27, 2017 at 7:33 am
Many foreign men chose to marry filipino women because they are faithful and caring wives ?
Mohd yusuff bin sharif says:
January 2, 2018 at 8:10 pm
Elderly europen men rejected by ladies in Europe are highly grabbed with greed by cheap Thai young ladies dreaming European husbands
January 5, 2018 at 5:46 am
I completely disagree with you my Thai wife is very beautiful and yes I could have married other American women
January 5, 2018 at 5:49 am
I completely disagree with you my Thai wife is very beautiful and yes I could have married other American women it just sounds like you’re jealous of these Philippine and Thai women for being so beautiful on the inside as well as the outside
January 5, 2018 at 7:36 pm
so so True These old rejected white men cannot get a younger white woman in their country so they go the Poor Hungry young asian girls waiting for them to feed them and build house for them
Aye says:
January 7, 2018 at 8:49 am
Excuse me, not all Thai women are like that. I think you met the wrong group that’s the minority. How did you end up meeting those women? Are you in the wrong group. Many countries have these women. There’s no exception.
November 21, 2017 at 5:21 am
Thailand is best place in world to visit kindly talk true
December 10, 2017 at 11:20 pm
Thailand is the worst place I have ever visited. They are very rude to the tourists though their economy mostly depends on tourism. They care about the money tourists spend, but do not care about tourist comfort. They are highly selfish people. Hotels will try to trap you and even charge you falsely with theft. Be careful about these fraudsters.
David says:
December 21, 2017 at 3:40 am
Nonsense. Thai military junta suppresses Thais and Thailand is noe the most dangerous place to ride/drive in the world! Plus, as I said, ‘Farang’ (foreigners) are selectively discriminated against.
December 25, 2017 at 8:57 pm
It s 4th time i am in thailand, paradize, most frendly people, love it all there..
January 5, 2018 at 5:53 am
I agree with you Thailand rocks I’ve been here 40 times never been disappointed and yes I’ve been to Europe and other parts of Asia Mexico and Canada Thailand is the best
Aryan says:
January 11, 2018 at 10:28 pm
I fully agree with you. Thailand tour for me was really excellent. I didn’t notice any partiality among tourist and locals. Entrance fees and all are fixed same and posted there.
David says:
March 17, 2018 at 3:48 am
Entrance fees for tourists are at least double than for locals and the authorities try to conceal that information by writing the prices in ancient Thai script so that their discrimination is not obvious. I know, I live there. I could post photos of many entrance fee signs at Zoos, National Parks, waterfalls even menus. Oh, and we foreigners are officially referred to as ‘aliens’. But when people think they are in ‘paradise’ they don’t notice, or don’t want to notice, the negatives.
sis says:
November 24, 2017 at 8:32 pm
so tell us what was your experienced in the philippines with girls, taxi drivers, hotel staffs and everything?
December 22, 2017 at 9:50 pm
Libya is a good country to invest with any little cash’ but are very wicked to emancipate visitors.
feng says:
November 26, 2017 at 9:29 am
thank you for your tips
December 12, 2017 at 6:32 am
Sam, you do better to stay at home. Even better close to Mum and Dad. Guess you stick out like a sore thumb when travelling, attracting any villain within miles. I travelled 2months through Thailand and another 2 months through the Philippines (on a rented motorbike), I am 77 years old today, 6 feet tall and weigh 200 pounds but have never been threatened, attacked, conned or taken for a ride by police, crooks, prostitutes etc. so I can only assume that you need some education before venturing out into the world.
I will not comment in several of the other negative comment listed below as I find them too pathetic to deserve my time. However I would like to suggest to anyone visiting these countries to read about them, prepare themselves thoroughly before you go and they will enjoy their trip, contrary to those squealing visitors listed above and below – including the guy who is trying to make us believe that he has been travelling for 30 years.????
Ben Mill says:
November 28, 2017 at 9:42 pm
Booby Green Maybe you’re a kind an arrogant person visiting countries like Thailand or Philippines showing off kind of a dollar man and expecting that you can do whatever you want because the value of your money. Yes, Bbe attentive when you’re traveling. Bad combination to brought with you is your “manuvaise attitude.”
January 6, 2018 at 7:09 am
Ben, please don’t pick offence. By sharing experiences with other, may help us alot. At least I have to avoid Phillipine and Thailand as no go countries for now.
Michelle says:
November 30, 2017 at 11:08 am
Yes Bobby Green. You are absolutely correct about Phillippines in the Manila and Quezon area. Never trust a beautiful woman. They need money to feed their offspring, as most have children out of wedlock. For taxi, use only Uber or Grab apps. Trust worthy. Never ask Hotel to book cab for you as they start with minimum of 1500 Pesos.
December 12, 2017 at 1:59 am
Michelle is absolutely right Phillippines are excellent to be with..
January 2, 2018 at 11:14 pm
Why got to a place @ all were most people only look to rip you off? No need for that.
Malia says:
December 9, 2017 at 11:05 pm
Oh, sorry for your bad experience in our country, i wont deny it, but it doesn’t crossed your mind that every country have bad and good people? Don’t ya?? Go back to PHIL again, and go south, look for me and i will show you…maybe it would change your perspective towards our country! ? and next time, go on a vacation to relax, not to go after with girls do dirty things…? you know before hand those girls do it because of money, so dont expect anything nice… As you speak, CHEAP, cheap are no good quality..think about it…
Elizabeth says:
December 10, 2017 at 10:56 pm
Bobby green. Please read and well informed before you visit Philippines. Next time don’t stay in Manila area. Outside and provinces where you can see the beauty and true culture of my country.
December 21, 2017 at 4:18 am
You are 100% right and clear. I did research on that.
Craig says:
December 23, 2017 at 3:39 am
Strangely Australia would be a good idea for a holiday
Mohd yusuff bin sharif says:
January 2, 2018 at 7:05 pm
When I was in Manila a policeman asked me for money outside a discotheque in remedios..claiming that he protected me from danger.policemen in uniform in Thailand ripped me off when they asked me to do the currency exchange with them.Both incidents spoiled my travel enjoyment.
January 2, 2018 at 11:13 pm
Yes indeed. People need to know that phils is full of hookers & cash IS king in phils. You`re ok as long as you got some $$ to spend, if not they totally ignore you since filipinos are damn greedy *sses. Anyway that country & culture has never interested me since it`s poor & has nothing to offer. But chat with a filipino & he thinks he comes from the world most awesome country! That`s BS. Those people are clannish & discriminating. No need to go there & deal with them. & Thais are also discriminating against foreigners. One can`t win against Thais there even if 1 is right. They also pull cheap tricks to fool people. I would not trust those cheap hookers.
January 4, 2018 at 2:45 pm
Bobby Green probably you went to Philippines looking for special treatment and you were very very disappointed because it didn’t happen. I’m sure you are not stupid enough to be robbed by most of the people you mentioned. You can be robbed anywhere you go. Is there anywhere else in the world that you ever went or that was the first time you ever left your place because if you are a traveler you know what I’m talking about. If you think Philippines is the place not to be, why did you go there in the first place? Don’t you ever read about the place before you go? About the hotel there’s lots and lots of hotel that I’m sure you are very very safe because they are run by international chains hotel like Conrad, Sofitel etc and the list is endless. I’m sorry about your bad experience but people like you are not welcome to Philippines.
David says:
October 28, 2017 at 2:35 am
David, you’re out to lunch on Thailand, many countries rightly charge tourists extra for entrance to National parks museums etc, you only get ripped off by taxi drivers if you’re naive and don’t ask around for the best price.
Sharris, you’re 100% correct the US should be at the top of the list with Canada not far behind, especially for visitors from Latin America.
The Cuba info is complete BS as they welcome tourists. It’s the US that doesn’t want its citizens to visit Cuba!
dale says:
October 31, 2017 at 2:32 am
Thank you for correcting the bullshit about Cuba not wanting visitors. Those nations requiring tours are not saying they don’t want you either. This article needs a follow up: 10 nations the US does not want you to visit. And ask the Mexicans, Venezeuelans, Syrians, etc. which country doesn’t want them.
My travel fantasy is to visit all countries demonized by the US, from Venezuela to North Korea. The way to get to Cuba is to fly to Cancun and then hop over. They love American tourists! Iranians love Am3rican people (not the government). Most demonized nations have the wisdom to distinguish American tourists from the government, which does not legitimately represent them.
Trump says American tourists to Cuba hurt the Cuban people. Total bullshit!
November 1, 2017 at 8:15 am
Hi Dale, I’m a Canadian born Venezuelan. Venezuela was, until late 90s the most open, stable, and democratic country in South America. The influence of people from US, due to our O&G industry was huge. Not on vain our national sport is Baseball instead soccer. I grew up with US neighbors and the country was, by a long long time the best ally and friend of the US in the region. We didn’t need visa to go to the US and we were often welcomed to your country as we were highly trained professionals and great tourists. We used to attract immigrants (the competition was with Canada on this regard), and never were illegal immigrants anywhere.
It’s necessary to clarify that we, Venezuelans don’t hate USA. We never did nor do. That’s bullshit. Problem is that a Cuban-Comunist dictatorship took the power: Hugo Chavez. 3 years after that, he was forced to quit. And he did under the popular pressure, but the Cuban regime infiltrated the country and made the dictator return and become “permanent”. Then he died and Maduro stole elections. So from fraud to fraud, the destructive communist and “anti-us” regime remains in power. Supporters of the regime has always been a tiny minory. The fact is that Venezuelans (90%) are victims of the regime and hates it. Venezuelans DO NOT hate the US. On the contrary! We had a long term friendship. So much so that, 80 to 90% of the oil used by the US in WWII was provided by Venezuela.
Today, Venezuela is a very dangerous place to visit because of the criminal and pro-terrorist regime that supports itself on illegal drug trafficking, international terrorism and irrespecting Venezuelan human rights. Yes, they chase, torture, jail, or kill detractors.
Do not believe “official truths”. Venezuelans used to be happy people and extremely welcoming to tourists to enjoy our natural marvels. Not in vain George Bush (Sr.) had a property in our Amazonia as several other US presidents!
My advice is: do not visit Venezuela while their criminal regime is on power. Same as Cuba! Visiting Cuba is a crime against poor Cubans because tourism support the oppressive regime of Raúl Castro!!!! Problem are the regimes, not the people!!!
Jon says:
November 16, 2017 at 7:30 am
US dont want those countries visitors because they dont go home!
January 6, 2018 at 6:42 am
O boy! You think say if i go to US a go go back to my country? A dey craze? Everything is good in America. I t is the best place in the world! They tolerate everybody, irrespective of ethnic, political and religious diversity. Please God help me visit US in my life time!
November 18, 2017 at 8:55 pm
November 20, 2017 at 12:28 pm
Dale, as Venezuelan Citizen, I don’t advise you to Visit Venezuela. I go there every year just because I have to. That country got the highest inflation rate of the world rigth now and people is crazy for US Dollars. Cuba is probably OK and Iran as well. Thailand is a beautiful place if you know where to go and have Thai friends, if you go alone and don’t speak Thai, you will be Rip-off.
Mohammad Safar says:
November 21, 2017 at 5:19 pm
You are right!
the government always make trouble between people,
like here they said Syria don’t want visitors what??
the reason is war not we don’t accept people,
Matusalen the old and wise says:
November 25, 2017 at 12:42 am
If you make it into and out of Venezuela alive as an American/Canadian/Anzak/EU passport holder other than Spaniards, I will be surprised. I have family and friends that have frequented Venezuela in the past and under the leadership of Maduro I can assure you that entry into and the exiting safely is no easy feat. You also have to worry about one of the highest criminal murder rates in the World. I have to confess, that, whenever I hear or read the boastful and more than often moronic words like these….I realise that the person(s) saying these things is either clueless, naive, or just plain stupid. In either case if you’re a person of conviction and followup on your words, well you will more than likely be meeting your maker in the not so distant future. Good luck young sod!
December 20, 2017 at 4:25 pm
I was stopped at the Caracas airport on my way out for no reason except I have a US passport. They held me in a room for interrogation but let me go at the last minute to make my flight. It was intimidation at its worst. That was several years ago, today I would probably be in jail. I will never go back.
December 2, 2017 at 5:51 am
this is so true. i will call all this bs write up as “American Chauvinism” they forms opinion about others and try to make it stick. im just wondering how liberal the US visa policy is. sending travel warnings on countries with less crime rate than the US, changing the marks on the thermometer to make the fever look normal. the view expressed here is basically American view not a global view.
Samuel says:
December 5, 2017 at 2:02 am
Such a great title: “10 nations the US does not want you to visit”
January 6, 2018 at 7:14 am
Samuel, please don’t change the title. It is just true that some countries are bad. One of these Asian countries eat blacks. Or have you not heard of this?
Alex says:
January 14, 2018 at 6:30 am
definitely Right
January 11, 2018 at 10:23 pm
Excellent! Tourists dealing with people and culture not politics and be government.
This article is based on unrealistic ideas.
You could consider countries which severely handpicked people which apply for visa and refuse them for nonsense reasons.
Mark says:
November 25, 2017 at 4:20 am
I agree. I live in Beijing and there are a variety of tourist scams including renegade taxis who prey on naive tourists. I’ve been to Thailand 5 times and will go a 6th during Chinese Spring Festival. I never take taxis. I walk, take Sky Train, or a tuk tuk..
December 20, 2017 at 11:40 pm
Mark, I agree you. I am an American living in Thailand for 2 and a half years. I love it here. Just like in the states, you pay out of state fees for National Park. Most Thais are honest people. They don’t get paid much. If you can afford to travel, you can afford a few dollars more. Some of them works all day for 300 baht. That’s less than 10 dollars per day.
December 2, 2017 at 11:57 pm
Thailand is the most tourist friendly
Bitching about meter taxis in the age of Uber and Grab. If you’re an idiot expect to feel ripped off anywhere.
Only thing they could improve is not allowing Trash Aussies entry without Visas.
January 5, 2018 at 11:34 am
Well said. Aussies, means White Australians. Real Australians are indigenous Black Aboriginal people. Australian are also multicultural and they are not thrash luke many White Aussie. Australia is a Black mans country.
January 7, 2018 at 4:32 pm
January 7, 2018 at 4:37 pm
Been there, done that would not go back there again.. Much better places to see
Luke Thomas says:
December 13, 2017 at 10:51 pm
Not correct to say that Thailand charges tourists more as it charges white skinned people more whether they are tourists or not.
December 16, 2017 at 4:33 pm
Cuba is a beautiful country to visit and its people are amazing. I drove around Cuba and never had anyone interfering with us. They are very friendly and i saw so many tourists from different countries including the US. (The language they spoke -English, Spanish, French, German, Italian, etc. gave them away) .It’s the US policy that does not want its people to visit there for a stupid and inhumane embargo. The only thing there is that the US $ is NOT king like in many countries. You have to convert your money into CUC (the Cuban currency) at the Casas de Cambio there. I’m going there again to visit the beautiful beaches and islands. I must tell you that we walked around and I had no trouble. Of course, I did not walk alone in the middle of the night in dark or solitary places..
As to getting into the US is no easy thing. (I am speaking from a Belize perspective) One has to apply online and pay pay $200 at a local bank before be called to the embassy for an interview. If you are lucky you get a visa ; if not, then you $200 is kept by Uncle Sam.
December 26, 2017 at 3:42 am
Cuba was a bad experience for me because my host and his accomplices stole all my cash while pretending to be caring and kind.
March 20, 2018 at 2:13 pm
I don’t even know if Nigeria is mentioned here. But I wanted to tell you that Nigeria is a good country you can visit.
We’re very accommodating, we love our visitors, we are caring and peaceful. Tourist can testifying to this.
David says:
March 17, 2018 at 3:52 am
If you are happy to be discriminated against then ‘up to you’.
Technically, this practice is illegal but the Tourism Authority of Thailand is not willing to do anything about it. Why chop off the head of the geese that are laying the golden eggs? As far as they are concerned morality, right/wrong, has nothing to do with it. Yet reverse the discrimination and the uproar wold be deafening.
October 28, 2017 at 6:00 am
Sorry that you don’t like the Kingdom, though there is some extra charge here for being a tourist, like many countries. You know that all foreigners are filthy rich, that is the thinking by many people in other countries, of course it’s not true, but in many places the cost of a airplane flight to get there is a very big sum for the locals. I hate to hear anyone bad mouth Thailand, to bad that they rush in here thinking they would be treated as someone special, tourists have been coming here for a long long time, the sight of a foreigner here is nothing special. Sorry you don’t like the Kingdom, stat home.
HansNL says:
November 1, 2017 at 10:22 am
The conclusion to stay away if you don’t like certain things in a country is superbly short sighted.
Thailand should heed warnings from the tourist front, too many people rely on an income from it.
And tourist’s tastes are easily changed.
John Green says:
December 3, 2017 at 9:21 pm
I’ve lived in Thailand for over 20 years. I can say it’s changed a lot and mostly those changes have been bad.
I never recommend Thailand to oversea friends- dirty beaches, tourist sites and tourist areas are full of rip offs and aggressive locals plusthe younger generation is getting like westerns lazy and want everything for nothing and disturbingly violent. Those comments about younger Thais are from my Thai wife. I also think the food is overrated.
December 25, 2017 at 6:20 am
I’m an American and I’ve lived in Thailand for 3 years now. It’s one of the safest and warmest places I’ve ever lived. There are dangerous parts of Thailand just as they’re dangerous parts of America. You wouldn’t catch me going to Baltimore Maryland after dark the same way you wouldn’t find me walking around the streets of Bangkok after Dark.
Tourist are welcome here and you will find the freedom of being able to go where you want to go see what you want to see all at reasonable prices.
Before going anywhere learn the Customs try to learn some of the language you will be surprised at how far that gets you.
December 27, 2017 at 1:58 pm
Cesar says:
October 28, 2017 at 6:26 am
David obviously you have not travel out of your small town but is the same in many countries in the world including USA, England, Australia and many many more developed and undeveloped countries so your statement is very predigest to Thailand and is not fair for you to talk like that while is the same in many other countries …. Thailand is for Thai people we are are visitors and we enjoy the country site the cheap hotels and cheap food and transport but you should go for a visit to LA or Miami or London O Madrid for you to compare and learn before you talk like that about any country ….. please keep yourself in your little town and do not go anywhere is better for you.
Read, Lean and compare before you express yourself in such terrible and uneducated manner ….. Take my advice …do not travel anywhere – stay in your small town they like you there and you are happy …
October 30, 2017 at 8:55 am
People like Cesar are really out of context, out of reality, talking just to talk, the post of 10 countries people (what people )should not visit is BS, why, because USA is in the war with them (bullet flying /cold war or just political difference )few years ago I was visiting France, Germany, the only people who are wilingly communicate with me on english were on airport, car rentals, asking the ordinary people for info, answer was “no speaking english “which is a lie, 80 % of people in Europe speak more than one language, the point is, to find shit no need to go to neighbors toilet, check yours, the problem is that we are not behaving correctly, and results are negative impact on the country we visited, they’re bad, not us ,but we are just a humans, traveling is nice, educational, enrich your knowledge of the world, but my question is, how much we know about our own country, not much.
Olga says:
November 5, 2017 at 11:48 am
Well, if you guys don’t feel welcomed in Thailand, Middle East or somewhere in Europe may be you should ask yourself WHY?
Did You bothered to learn the language of the country You are planning to visit? So may be just stop feeling yourself as the center of Universe??
And BTW Your own country as well as Canada isn’t welcoming foreigners as well, a visa application is such humiliation experience… Shame!
November 9, 2017 at 11:54 pm
hi, many people are not thinking like u, tanke u so much, it,s very pain full to living under a dictator religious regim, iranian are peaceful people , but we don,t surrender , and one day we will get our freedom , sorry for bad english, god bless u, from iran
December 9, 2017 at 5:14 pm
Which freedom you are talking about like for Libya or Iraq or Syria don’t bring problem you people
January 9, 2018 at 5:18 am
Thanks for the correction of impressions, I have been dreaming of visiting Iran for a while now, looking up to hook up with nice people like you..
November 12, 2017 at 7:53 pm
The United States doesn’t charge foreigners more than they charge anyone else
December 21, 2017 at 4:38 am
The United States is the most friendly country in the world. The US is open to anyone around the world once you are qualify.The Us accept people from all over the world to work and help they and their family.
texas aggie says:
December 31, 2017 at 8:45 am
Yes, they do. My wife’s American visa costs a lot more than mine does.
Jimmy says:
January 1, 2018 at 7:28 pm
I do believe this because i used to study in texas.Yhe university only charged the tuition as local residents.
Painthacker says:
November 26, 2017 at 1:21 pm
I’m an American living in France since 2003 and the only French people I know who speak more than rudimentary English are those who have an English speaking parent but were born in France. Most French people I know speak no English at all.
December 7, 2017 at 11:40 pm
Painthacker: That is probably true of older generations but I find that younger French people generally speak some English. Try being a foreigner in UK and talking to a ‘local’ and see how well you get on. I am English but have been travelling and working abroad for most of my life and have learned bits from lots of languages over the years although I cannot say I an fluent in any of them.
January 2, 2018 at 11:06 pm
Why should they Painthacker? You are living in France for the last 15 years and you are so “limited” that you can’t learn french?
Lionel from Paris says:
January 10, 2018 at 7:03 am
I am French and I speak a fairly good English, with an acceptable accent, but then again both my parents lived a long time in English-speaking countries and sent me to an international college, so I acknowledge that helps a lot. However, I’m not sure I’m actually fluent.
ali altar says:
November 21, 2017 at 6:07 pm
am sure you dont kniw what you are talking about.have been to thai and i know what david is saying is true.am from dubai and i travel alot.as a custom officer i meet people day in day out.thai people and culture is diffrent.
November 26, 2017 at 9:51 pm
your absolutely right
savior says:
December 1, 2017 at 10:41 pm
You are right cesar I truly like ur comment Uk and us doesn’t want u to visit at all, especially their restriction on african applicants.
Earle says:
December 23, 2017 at 3:25 am
Cesar, you are 100% correct. I am Canadian and have lived in Thailand for 12 years. Almost all my friends are Thai and even though there are always bad people in EVERY country, l feel more safe walking in Bangkok any time of the day or night, which is much more than l could say about most large cities in Canada or USA. Sure a person will get ripped off by a taxi driver if they don’t know where they are going etc. But a person must learn about the country you are visiting before you arrive. Also, learning some Thai language is not only a great help, but l considered it my responsibility to learn Thai, the same as if l was visiting LA, l should have some English skill. You cannot expect all the Thai people you meet on your trip to suddenly learn English just for you. If you don’t agree, then at least say home and not give a bad impression to local people about visitors.
Michelle says:
December 25, 2017 at 4:25 am
I love Thailand and the Thai people. I have never felt ripped off. I love the food. Everything about it. Be respectable of their culture and they will treat you accordingly. There is good and bad in every nation,
Kevin says:
January 20, 2018 at 1:23 am
If you visit Thailand try the north, chiangrai Chiangmai and pai that’s the real Thailand your not ripped off you pay the same as the Thais.
If you go to places like Phuket and Pattaya everyone will rip you off, number one is the police every time I’ve hired a car or motorcycle I’ve just been a ATM for the Thai police now I only use the public transport
Brian says:
October 28, 2017 at 5:01 pm
I think you have been reading too much TEAK DOOR or the POSTBAG SECTION of the BANGKOK POST or may your info comes from certain establishments in Soi Cowboy, Nana, Soi seven or Pattaya. I live in Thailand and have done for a couple of decades utter rubbish simply sound bite reaction. On ripping off tourists no worse than any other tourist destination such as LONDON UK etc. in happens everywhere in the world.
toyn says:
October 28, 2017 at 7:40 pm
I’m deeply regrets for your bad experienced in our country. Even though everything in the world have got two side and we cannot change anything we cudn’t control, but you know one thing will never ever been lied on you that is natural. Overlooking at a bit thing and open mind for the difference it going to bring you to get a fantastic side what our country’s got.
Thailand always welcome to you !!
December 3, 2017 at 1:52 pm
yes thailand is wonderful!!!!
Gerald says:
October 29, 2017 at 4:45 am
I have been in Thailand for the last 6 months & considering the amount of ex pats I have met from various countries I don’t know where U were in Thailand. It is a beautiful country with beautiful people. The weather is usually sunny with temperatures around 30 Celsius everyday if it does rain it rains hard & it usually only lasts an hour or two. Rain has never ruined any plans because you know it will be over by the time you reach your destination. Thailand is really inexpensive especially the rent. Like in any country even Canada where I’m from there are always cabbies & others that are looking to rip off the naïve tourist. In Thailand they will give you a price up front & at a lot of the taxi stands the recommended rates are posted.
AJ says:
November 17, 2017 at 4:14 pm
I’m a single woman and went to Bangkok and Phuket alone.One of the best trips of my life. No, should not be on list. Just be smart about it. It’s a beautiful place with lovely people. I’d be more afraid to go to Detroit or LA!
December 16, 2017 at 2:24 am
Thanks for your comments!
everywhere have good or bad in many situations…
Next. I hope you have a good trip…
Smith says:
November 26, 2017 at 11:42 pm
I agree with you about Thailand. My experience was phenomenal and the various expats there spend the majority of the year there for the god weather, relaxed economy and sites.
Every country has prostitutes, and honestly given their risk they should have benefits and health insurance provided to marginalized the spread of disease. However, to each to own but I enjoyed Thailand. It has many western offerings and substantial amount of the population speaks English so it makes it easy to navigate and enjoy.
Again each one has its Pros and Cons, I am an American and even my country has the same relative issues depending where you are.
Travel well and live jovial always my global friends.
พิชญาภา ฉิมแสง says:
November 30, 2017 at 9:36 am
thank you very much for write very nice thing about thailand .
Sly cuba says:
October 29, 2017 at 6:49 pm
They are doing not different than what the US is doing! When ever you point a finger point one back!
Unknown says:
November 1, 2017 at 2:57 am
Thank you for adding this! USA should the first on the list. Long process of getting a visa to end up refused whether you are able to pay for your trip on not.?
John Hayes says:
November 7, 2017 at 10:47 am
Actually, THREE will be pointing back at you.
November 8, 2017 at 3:40 am
Predictable! Any and I do mean ANY country you visit will have taxi drivers cheating tourist. This I why Uber is so popular. I’m in Thailand as we speak (Chiang Mai) and I love it. Beautiful scenery, nice people and very affordable . Will definitely return. Strongly recommend. CHEERS!!!
John says:
October 30, 2017 at 12:40 am
Hi David, there is a chance there some times you meet the bad guys in any country, it is totally depends on your attitude toward the people, I am travelling to most Asian country and always been polite and respectful person towards those people of that lands and of course it is very important in Thailand as well, if you don’t give them a respect, in return you wont receive the favor.
I always received the good hospitality and smile from from Thai people, i remembered once a police man ask me to have a sit and offered me a drink and lunch.
depends on your behavior and your self.
November 12, 2017 at 8:00 pm
Wow! I never would have thought about the ice. Best information I’ve seen here. So I guess you go through a lot of bottled water. Do they hike the price on water?
November 17, 2017 at 4:09 am
i see you .!anything i want say you know i believe you understand and i don’t care ever,and i like friend good loyalty and trust rather than make things worse between the two, and you’ll see and look at all the people in the farm you will always see a lot of bad guys want to take away those trying to help ground them sometimes strong will do everything to split each person it help them cope more easily ground and remove me that’s what we need to do because when they get what they want them to make arrangements to see the opposition and how to deal in the game with them and the failure to do they always find a way to make us weak
December 20, 2017 at 11:18 am
You are a good man! please come and visit Ethiopia.
Alex says:
January 14, 2018 at 6:48 am
definitely Right John
Shiva says:
October 30, 2017 at 8:05 pm
x_x says:
November 22, 2017 at 6:17 am
Ahhh seems the dumb is getting angry. ^_^
November 1, 2017 at 1:43 am
David is 100% correct same with the Philippines everybody is out to rip you off they all think with their tiny little uneducated minds that all foreigners are rich. The Government doesn’t seem to care. Do what I do, I catch them ripping me off I smash their little faces in. I carry a knife and on one vacation must of stabbed 20 of them, 5 taxi drivers. Did I kill any of them, probably who cares. I hoped I killed all of them. We all start doing it they will stop ripping us off. If you get caught by the police be ready to pay about a $100 but most people don’t care.
November 1, 2017 at 9:31 pm
Why the reason is I am a genuine person(Indian) having bachelor degree civil engineering(age 48) and having Indian news paper (The HINDU) grand a genius award also(having genuine passport and all genuine papers.)
But I applied a visit visa for 7 days for the attend the international technical seminar but they refused. I like America but I does not like their bad judgment about genuine people.
SS says:
November 1, 2017 at 10:44 pm
Thailand is a good place to visit, witho mountains, beaches, city, that suits everyon. What more can you ask! Please open up your mind, and U will see the horizon. Do not restrain yourselves within your own community, see the world before you made such comments. Cheers.
November 2, 2017 at 8:53 am
you should add, if you are AMERICAN, you do not want to go there… I have no problem to go to Cuba, a most beautiful island. whz have Saudi on your list? they are friends or only as long as you get cheap oil? and the money from the advertising links yo utake with no problem. hypocrites you’re ,big time. stay home, best for you all, who needs you and who wants you?
November 2, 2017 at 4:50 pm
November 2, 2017 at 8:09 pm
This isn’t really a reply to you, David, but I couldn’t find out a way to just make a comment. Consider attraction fees that are higher for tourists as “actual costs” with discounts for citizens. Why should a local resident pay as much as a tourists when they already pay in taxes for the preservation of the parks (or scenic sites), security, environmental impact, infrastructure improvements, etc?
Eric says:
November 3, 2017 at 7:48 am
David, in your post replace “Thailand” by “Costa Rica” to get my post. Except park fees are 5x for foreigners.
RT says:
November 3, 2017 at 8:15 am
Thailand is one of the best countries to live and work, I have been going there for 20+ years without a ripoff or concern I wasn’t being treated fairly.
When you arrive at the airport, leave your attitude on the plane.
November 5, 2017 at 7:12 am
to David, thank you for your precious suggestion to add my country to the list of hatreds tourism. And please, do inform it to all your white Caucasian friends to do the same thing. we are always welcoming to all who are open minded, educated and has normal attitude towards others countries, especially third wold country like ours, because we hope that many visitors understand that tourism is the main business of the country. We do our best to provide goods and services that satisfy customers experience in exchange with a little money in your pocket. Thank you ! again for your support. Warning !, I’ll tell you that we have all kine of things that satisfy your addiction brain, a part of the brain the occupy the dependence for extreme happy and juicy high. I’m happy that your euphoria get reached in a bar from a dirty street full of cunt, where you spend out you money without regretting its expensive value. Oh! may it be your life time value that you never have it in your mother country. So, just loss your mind here, relax, you don’t have reason to be warring about. And do not resist your desire; Be your self; Express all your personality. Don’t care us! That’s normal. We know that it is nature of fucking cunt american bastard who searching for a place to drag down all the humanity faith. You may run out of your worthless bills. Don’t worry, just beg for it. Thais are always kine and help helpless people for essential need. Don’t be surprised if your journey to the hell is not funded. Then you can go to drug trafficking. Import it form your friends and Sell it to your western friends. So,your getting rich do drug all the day and live like superstar in american movie that your mind is set to believe. Don’t worry, your mom will not call. she may has problem on her-own. Getting rid of stupid bastard son is always wanted by Mrs. american bitch. You can, even, kill your self by stupidity or get your self killed without bringing sadness or surprise to anyone. But please, keep it for the worst case in order that you cant get over it. We do not want a bad stupid new to be herd and causing appetite lost during the meal. Please keep that in mind; But don’t mind understanding, feeling and thinking the way i mean to say.
I got nothing writing here, may be practicing my hatting English skill. l would be happy if it touch your heart so hard.. if not the case, just forget it (if you can). And please, you can pass this message to your friend or person who really need to read it. i mean some stupid bastard who want to pay less and get more of profit from poor inferior hopeless people just for satisfy their-own stupid sick mind of addiction resulted from their precious land of birth.
November 7, 2017 at 5:21 pm
Thank David for your recommendations. Vietnam is an excellent destination for many tourists because of its beauty. People here are friendly and hospitable. Prices are good and especially, food is tasty, delicious. Once you have been to Vietnam you’ll never forget and are eager to come back.
Ed Rowe says:
November 8, 2017 at 3:58 am
I`ve been to Thailand about 10 times over the past 10 years..They have always treated me with kindness. I`ve never been cheated. The prices for some places are more but considering the average Thai salary, I don`t think its a big deal, a few dollars. I`ve never heard or seen the police targeting tourists.
December 20, 2017 at 11:49 pm
Ed, same for me.
January 10, 2018 at 1:44 am
I fully agree. Thailand is a lovely country. If you are nice and respectful, people are nice too. I have been there several times and always love to visit again. As a european i have been discriminated much more in the US , but never in Thailand. Go to Thailand and enjoy! Like everywhere else, if you are looking for trouble you will find it!
November 9, 2017 at 11:30 pm
I believe that you must have had a one-off bad trip; I have traveled to Thailand on many occasions, to different parts of the country / Islands and have had excellent experiences. I will no doubt be going again soon. The police there will only bother you for drink driving or rowdy behaviour (drunken).
YES they do charge more for tourist sites – but so do all the SE Asian countries, including Malaysia (you listed the country).
All in all the Thai people are a very welcoming bunch, helpful and accommodating.
The only key issue is the immigration at Bangkok airport – not enough staff, takes over an hour to get through.
Athan says:
January 1, 2018 at 12:51 pm
Pls if I travel to Thailand with tourist visa and like the country and want to settle down in the country I’ll the give me residential permit.
November 10, 2017 at 10:41 pm
Too many Chinese Thai in Thailand now , not a good place as before , the third generation of Chinese in Thailand change Thailand to be greedy and selfish.
M says:
November 11, 2017 at 10:59 am
Have you ever traveled to Iran in your life?
emily says:
January 1, 2018 at 2:54 am
November 12, 2017 at 9:50 am
What about Australia…I tried to get my tourist visa online (this is the only way I can apply from my country) and it was so hard and confusing,it took me weeks.
February 5, 2018 at 6:43 pm
I personally would never go to Australia. I mean, snakes, sharks, and fish that are all very dangerous… Just about every creature there wants to kill or eat you.
Douglas Ward says:
November 13, 2017 at 9:30 pm
November 14, 2017 at 7:57 pm
This article is so subjective and far from reality it should be renamed “10 Countries That I Don’t Want (You) To Visit”…
Amir says:
November 24, 2017 at 3:48 am
very true
January 12, 2018 at 4:12 am
I know right. When I saw the title of this article, I saw it as “10 Countries That You Don’t Want To Visit”. It really is subjective and far from reality. And David (the person whose comment is first on the list) is just like the author of this article, in my opinion. What is with these people and not going to Thailand, the Phillipines, Malaysia etc? I love going to Thailand and the Phillipines and I practically stay in Malaysia! It wasn’t that bad at all! These people are just exaggerating!
November 18, 2017 at 2:40 am
What Dave says is correct. 40TB for a local to get into a national park and 400 TB for a “farang”, their racist word for westerners. While I don’t see this as a big deal because I believe the Thai people should have easier access to their parks what is a big deal is the constant harassment for fees. In principle an entry fee is good for 24 hours after purchase. Our experience was that you could buy an entry fee one afternoon and then be required to purchase another entry fee the next morning; now we are up to 800 TB. They been using propaganda techniques from 15 years ago. Most coral reefs are dead in Andaman and the Gulf of Thailand although they still advertise otherwise. Corruption is rampant and it is starting to spill over to tourists. Cambodia is a great place…. genuine people
December 21, 2017 at 12:04 am
John, I’m Cambodian American. I was discriminated against when I went to visit Angkor Wat Siem Reap a year ago. One person told me I don’t need to pay because I’m Cambodian and another person yelled out, “No she is not Cambodian! She looks like Chinese trying to speak Cambodian.” Although, my passport said I’m Cambodian. At the airport, there were a couple of them trying to make me pay bribes so next time I don’t need to pay for Visas fees. But my family is an experienced travelers. We don’t play with dishonest people. For 3 days, I’ve experienced the worst from my own people and the country I was born in. I will never go back for this reason and the corruption that is going on.
January 3, 2018 at 11:11 am
How would you feel if you are a person living in Thailand, who never have visited outside of the country. I am myself a traveller. This is more about inequality.
I myself grew up poor in childhood in Myanmar and migrated to Sweden. Those two countries are like World number 351 vs. World number 7. Differences in what citizens in the developed countries can do vs. developing countries.
Whenever I have money I travel, never buy new products or buy new car.
Right now I am having this dilemma after much travelling. I am just a normal social class who like to explore. Went to universities.
Poverty I have experienced. It is like a disease.
I think it concerns the culture differences. Norms which are accepted in each country. When you are in Rome you have to act like Rome.
But I understand what people can complain about paying fees.
Maybe you never have been poor. No food on the table for days.
November 18, 2017 at 5:22 am
The article is correct! These are places where freedoms are restricted, and can be classified as the “rumps” of the world. Add Pakistan and Afghanistan. Do NOT add Thailand, which is a great and beautiful place, with a free visa-on-arrival program, great food and reasonable prices. We have spent some great holidays in Thailand in the past and will definitely visit there again!
November 18, 2017 at 3:19 pm
Vietnam has it all over most South East Asia country’s but the people are wonderful and the countryside beaches are great.
November 19, 2017 at 5:36 pm
I find Thai people very fake and greedy, in general, though there are beautiful natuaral landscapes there, and I have to say that inflated tourist prices for natural parks etc. can be found throughout SE asia, though perhaps less inflated than in parts of thailand.
Jeeves says:
November 20, 2017 at 12:34 am
I couldn’t agree more with you . Thailand has been the pits for innocent tourists for years. Cambodia, Laos are up an coming. The English have ruined Thailand, hooligans come over there and turn the place into a garbage dump. Kao San Road, the tourist hub is a scam and the street vendors have total contempt for visitors. Avoid.
November 21, 2017 at 2:09 am
I’m so sorry for you that you made a bad experience in Thailand. But I think there’s no perfect please in this world.
So then you shouldn’t go there again, but let the people to judge them self, if they’re also your oppinion..!!
November 21, 2017 at 12:05 pm
You must be joking about Myanmar
Myo says:
January 4, 2018 at 11:44 pm
Yes
You should go myanmar is enjoyable
Mary says:
November 21, 2017 at 6:20 pm
This is dumb because you don’t even need a visa to enter Thailand as an American. The article is discussing countries that don’t want us there. And many countries discriminate against visitors including the US!
Peter says:
November 22, 2017 at 6:32 am
You are right. Thailand is changed a lot since their King deceased. Only 3 yearly entrances, have to show a certain amounth of cash, closing hours in area’s as khoasan,…. laos is indeed a lot better but going there through Thailand to Bangkok and then with Train alor domestic flight, like I always did, are now not that easy anymore.
For the moment I am in China. Certainly a place to visit buy first is communication extremely difficult, besides ni hao is my cantonese horrible, and to get connected with the Home front is also almost impossible. Not possible to log in in Facebook, Messenger, you tube, whatsapp,… even Google. China is nice for An organised trip but not easy to do on your own.
I have also been a few times in Venezuela. In the Resort perfect but outside almost suïcide. Too dangerous
November 22, 2017 at 12:03 pm
The best thing as an American that I feel anyone should do, is to stay home and visit places in America and enjoy our beautiful country!!!
February 27, 2018 at 10:33 am
I agree with you. I was about to write the same about my Israel.
Anup says:
November 22, 2017 at 3:33 pm
I agree. Thailand is not a friendly country to be in.
Ms. Sharie Acheson says:
November 22, 2017 at 7:55 pm
USA an expensive rip off place. SE Asia is wonderful. I have been to many countries repeatedly. Thais are so great
December 25, 2017 at 5:08 pm
Clara says:
November 23, 2017 at 5:07 am
December 13, 2017 at 4:29 am
There is nothing wrong with Vietnam. I’ve lived there for over a decade and like everywhere in the world, the danger comes with your attitude. Showing off your wealth is so wrong, disrespecting the people and their culture is asking for trouble. If you want to do business and you can’t coop with the locals you will be faster out than you got in. Fantastic country with lovely people.
Rick says:
November 25, 2017 at 6:58 pm
Thanks for your info. I was considering moving there. I think I’ll pass on it. There is some natural beauty there, but I suspected what you have wrote for a while.
John says:
November 26, 2017 at 2:06 am
I have lived in Thailand a very long time. I love it here warm all year.
The problem with Thailand is they love money it in there coulcher now
Touris they try to milk them and are very good at it now. Take your money and give you nothing. I could right a book.
November 26, 2017 at 6:45 am
@David (26 Oct 2017 / 2:28am): B.S. about your perspective on Thailand.
True it loves the tourist revenue – name one tourist location that despises tourist revenue.
The Thai Police do not target tourists – but they have no qualms about arresting and jailing a tourist who disrespects their laws (e.g., using illegal drugs, working without the proper work visa, overstaying one’s visa, assualt and battery, larceny, etc.) and tries to use the “ignorance card”.
Entrance fees to National parks, zoos etc., have two different prices: local and visitor (their rules) but you are free to visit other locations which don’t have fees.
Taxi drivers, true some do rip off their customers, but, just like in the USA, Europe, and the Middle East, and others, the taxi drivers in those countries do so with no malice. Try taking a taxi from the Las Vegas Airport to the downtown area (Golden Nugget Hotel) and the driver will avoid a direct route, regardless of traffic conditions (light or heavy). I know this as fact since I once lived there for four years.
Thailand is very hospitable to its visitors / guests; but one must reciprocate and behave their self and be respectful and courteous to their hosts.
I’m glad you won’t be in Thailand during my next holiday there.
December 9, 2017 at 7:37 pm
November 28, 2017 at 6:52 am
Why thank you Mr. David for that comment! I wonder where you are from! Hope its even worse than the beautiful country Thailand! I mean I am not precisely from Thailand, but trust me, the police don’t target tourists! That would be called racism! “Ripping off tourists” wow! Taxi drivers don’t “rip off” their costumers (’cause that’s not a thing!) Dear Mr. David! I think you should go to Grade 1 due to your condition of stupidity! Thanks you and have a nice day!
December 27, 2017 at 2:08 pm
k says:
November 29, 2017 at 3:37 pm
I agree
November 29, 2017 at 5:43 pm
Thank you for your vote to visit Vietnam <3
November 29, 2017 at 6:01 pm
I have been to Thailand five times and I do not find the above comments to be true.
I have always been pleasantly welcomed.
December 9, 2017 at 7:35 pm
Lionel from Paris says:
January 10, 2018 at 7:12 am
I did enjoy Thailand too, although I avoided the bar girl scene (so squalid). But I had a hard time with its humid, hot climate. You have to live at night there, but I’m not a night person, so…
Michelle says:
November 30, 2017 at 11:12 am
Traveling in Tuk-Tuk should be careful as handbags or other things could be snatched by motor-borne assailants. If we approach a nearest police station, they would say, the CCTV in the area where the incident took place, is not working. So beware with police as well.
January 1, 2018 at 6:16 am
True that…
Uyen says:
November 30, 2017 at 8:30 pm
They really know how to make money from tourism in fact
December 1, 2017 at 12:47 am
December 9, 2017 at 7:34 pm
Exactly! Been on holiday in Asia for the last 8 months! Not ONE SINGLE PROBLEM getting into or leaving India, Sri Lanka, Thailand, Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia…even China was pretty easy. Most visa requirements can either be done online or on arrival.
December 3, 2017 at 6:58 am
In this Country more people are murdered by gangs and crazy people than anywhere else in the world.
But the most important reason not to visit the USA is there fucking stupid, mentally sick president, named Donald Duck Trump. An arshole par excellence.
December 25, 2017 at 5:10 pm
emily says:
January 1, 2018 at 2:57 am
Peter says:
December 4, 2017 at 5:54 am
Malik Amuta says:
December 4, 2017 at 12:42 pm
The list is far from the truth, without south Africa, killers of foreigners. Countries mentioned, have due to security issues, the right to strictness. Taxi fares cheating and all mentioned are welcomed in place of south Africa killing. Would you rather be killed or dupped?
Linda says:
December 6, 2017 at 12:23 pm
Thank you for your information. I will not put Thailand in my list ever
masha says:
December 9, 2017 at 2:56 am
that is not ture
December 9, 2017 at 5:57 am
December 9, 2017 at 8:15 am
article is wrong. should say AMERICANS. i as an Austrian would have no problem to go an visit any of these countries. because we have learned to respect their custom and rules, you Americans think the sun is shining just on you and the whole world ahs to bow to you. to bad you do not want learn and be a little bit thoughtful and adapt. and than when something is happening, you come crying…
December 9, 2017 at 7:30 pm
Ridiculous…just spent a month in Thailand and everyone was nothing but hospitable and helpful. We almost got overcharged for a taxi in Bangkok ONCE, but our hotel manager blasted the taxi driver and we got the fare for free. We stayed in nice hotels right on the beach for less than $25 USD a day and ate delicious meals for a few dollars. The rates go up over the holidays because of the huge influx of tourists from American, Australia Russia, and Europe. More power to them! Why should their country stay poor while the affluent use it as a holiday playground?!
ly minhson says:
December 10, 2017 at 7:00 pm
Uno says:
December 11, 2017 at 7:07 pm
You must be obnoxious. Thai people are very warm & friendly. Been there at least 50 times.
Stc says:
December 11, 2017 at 11:07 pm
Writing this from Thailand, great, please keep thinking that!
nce says:
December 12, 2017 at 10:36 am
you should eliminate iran from the list. As an iraninan I invite you to see iran and you will understand that negative advt and iran phobia is not correct. I really recommand you to see iran
Thay Jim says:
December 12, 2017 at 5:37 pm
Vietnamese also target foreigners for economic abuse. I have lived and paid taxes in Vietnam for 15 years now and I still find myself having to pay higher prices than locals. And don’t think the locals are all poor. Many of them are quite well off.
December 13, 2017 at 5:30 pm
You are 100% correct. Munk are on TV, everyday speaking out against roads as they lead to change.
I always amazed that there are many smart Thai people who speak English well but never see them in visa office or hospital reception where there are tourist seeking help.
December 14, 2017 at 5:41 am
I can’t imagine why your experience seems entirely opposite to those of the thousands of tourists who visitvThailand each year. As long as a tourist checks on what is considered acceptable behaviour, nobody I know would be looking forward to their next visit. I have been a regular visitor since the early 90s, and have had no negative experiences. The ‘Land of Smiles’ beats most vacation destinations hands down.
December 14, 2017 at 1:58 pm
Those 10 countries are no brainers. There is no way I would ever go there but I can probably add another about 50 to that list. Just pick the majority of African countries. Rwanda, Zimbabwe, Nigeria, just a few examples but other parts of the world as well.
December 16, 2017 at 9:22 pm
How many times you have visited Thailand??
It is such a seriously insulted comment!
Eric Frederick says:
December 16, 2017 at 10:54 pm
This person must have had a very bad experience in Thailand. I have spent 9 weeks during the past year in Thailand. The people are very friendly and kind. Yes there are a few scams as in other counties. One hour research on the internet and you can easily avoid them all.
Yes there is a two tier pricing structure in Thailand. Went to a national park and Thai’s paid 10 baht to get in while it cost me 50. Cheap compared to US Oarks when you consider a US dollar is worth 33 baht.
Compared to Thai people most tourists are rich and food and entertainment costs are very low. If you take Thailand off your list you will surely miss a wonderful place to visit.
Terry Johnson says:
December 17, 2017 at 2:34 am
Sorry David, you must be very uninformed.
For the last 11 years I have traveled all over Thailand. The country and people are wonderful.
When needed, the Thai Police and the Thai Army have always been helpful.
Parks and zoos do have dual prices, one for tourists and one for locals. Heck, Disneyland in California does that.
Metered taxis are the best way to get around for local travel in large cities.
Thailand is a wonderful tourist destination.
January 28, 2018 at 2:00 am
Good day,
Mr Terry Johnson can you tell me more about your visits to Thailand am considering applying for the visa to have another experience of life.
Thanks
Tom Kent says:
February 11, 2018 at 12:27 am
A great place to live in, but not to visit as tourist!
John says:
February 13, 2018 at 5:30 pm
John says:
December 17, 2017 at 8:30 am
Just like UK
Ruth says:
December 18, 2017 at 5:05 am
10 Countries that don’t want you to visit if you are American! Cuba is wide open to most people. As for the rest, who would want to go there anyway? Also there are other countries which are difficult to get to for travel/Visa reasons. You can add Russia to the list and probably all the central southern European countries ending in Stan. Again, not exactly the centre of the universe for travellers and also as most Americans are too afraid to travel abroad, (only about 40 per cent have passports) the list is hardly relevant anyway!
December 21, 2017 at 2:50 pm
You are so wrong! My family and I lived in Thailand for 7 years, from 2008 to 2015 and now we’re moving back again because we a) miss it so much. The people are wonderful the cultures great, the food is fantastic and all you have to is get a Thai driver’s license to get all the same pricies that the Thais get. it’s a wonderful place for tourists to live especially ChiAng Mai!
December 22, 2017 at 12:48 am
Disappointed with some services there maybe ?
December 22, 2017 at 4:09 am
Very true even Thailand Airport people target tourists with the help of police to extract money
December 22, 2017 at 6:59 pm
to a certain extent you are correct, but the present is trying to change all that. however, there are many plusses and in the majority people are very friendly.
December 23, 2017 at 5:36 am
This is true. Thailand now a days has become more greedy towards tourist.
In last few months they doubled everything right from visa.
It is better to visit other Asian countries then Thailand.
December 23, 2017 at 2:30 pm
>>Taxi drivers are well known for ‘ripping off’ tourists.
Agree 100% they are little more than highway robbers not to be trusted at all.
We booked a taxi to take us to “Tiger Temple” and stupidly paid him because he said he needed gas money first.
Sounded reasonable at first but turned out to be BS because he vanished after we stopped for lunch on the way
leaving us stranded in the middle of nowhere. One good thing came out of it, we held the hotel responsible since they arranged the cab for us
and they gave us the money back. However; That made me promise to myself that was the last tourist dollar/baht they will ever get from me.
Teerapan says:
December 23, 2017 at 11:17 pm
Thank you for your comment. I am from Thailand and live in Bangkok. I have read your article and replies from other readers through and through and feel very uneasy that you have such a bad experience about Thailand. I feel very sorry that you have such a feeling about my country so it might be good if someone like me could give you and other readers another point of view from the locals.
Most average Thais are not pretty good at speaking English. Some even walk away from you in a cold manner in the streets just because they are not good at English. In fact, they are helpful. They can read and understand you quite well if you write it on papers or speak in clear English slowly. The situation is getting much better these days because the Internet is widespread and many Thais are addicted to the YouTube videos and the western cultures so the language barrier is narrowing the gap. They love tourists, really.
Taxi drivers here in Bangkok are notorious for bad manners. The Transport authority try to hunt down those rejecting the customers, jailbreaking meters, pulling over the cars and blocking traffic, talking too much, robbing customers, etc. , but things are beyond control. There are 2 types of taxis in Bangkok, metered and negotiable taxis. The latter one is the traditional taxi and that is the Tuk-tuk. Beware of the Tuk-tuk taxi drivers in the tourist areas, they are greedy to make money from naive tourists as much as they want to. Some even reject Thai customers and will stop by only for tourists. The problem is the tourists never know what is the appropriate price for the destination they are heading. Because it is negotiable so the law could not get down to it. I guess this is where you were ripped off and that made you feel bad. If you take a metered taxi, you do not need to negotiate. Just show them your destination and sit down. If some drivers try to give you an option to pay the other way, just reject them. If you find a taxi driver that talks too much in English, be careful because that is not a normal situation. Some drivers are involved in crimes and the taxi owners did not make a crime check for bad drivers’ record. To apply to drive a taxi is easy and too easy to cause the problems. As long as the Transport authority does not change the whole structure, things will never improve. I agree with you that the taxi in Thailand is not a reliable system and negotiation for prices should no longer exist.
The police here are corrupted for the most part but it does not mean that they protect the bad guys or they are all bad. If you do something wrong, you will be fined. In any case, if you are facing a serious problem and feel that you are not getting a fair treat, give a petition to the upper level of the police department like a Crime Depression. They have more authority over the police station and will be willing to help. It is not quite true that they target on tourists. If you find one, jot down their name or take a photo and send them to the upper authority to help us.
I agree that a 2-tier pricing is very bad and could bring a lot of serial problems. I have no idea where the 2-tier pricing structure has started but it seems that it is a standard here to charge visitors a higher price and this point of view started from the Thai authority and that it makes some vendors in the tourist area try to sell goods at the higher prices for tourists. This practice is not acceptable and the tourists have a feeling that they are ripping off. Unfortunately, the Tourism Authority of Thailand has no authority over the Zoo, National Parks, etc. because they are a separate unit organized to promote Thailand’s tourism only. Thais view foreigners as somebody richer than they are and nothing else. One other reason is the Thai authority try to promote Thais to travel domestically in several places instead of going abroad so many of them are free or lower fees for Thais. If they charge all equal at the prices of tourists, no Thais will come and this is really true. This system instead gives the illusion to Thais that they need to charge tourists for more than the standard prices. If only they could lower the fees in half and charge everyone the same prices regardless of nationals, the situation might be better, I guess. It might take a while before the regulators from many authorities could agree on this.
We are suffering from a growing economy as well as most of the service or sales staff in some areas are not Thais, but they are from our neighbors. They are usually hired from the cheap hotels, small vendors and even some department stores. Of course, they could speak Thai and English a little bit and some could do very well but we know from their pronunciation that they are not Thais. Some of them are doing nasty things like ripping off tourists, pickpocket, bad manners to tourists that do not pay the money for something or even involving in crimes. Most of the beggars you see in the Bangkok streets 80% are not Thais and involved in a syndicate from our neighbor countries. In view of the tourists, they thought they are Thais because their looks are the same but in fact they are not. This does not mean that all the Thais are good. We have to protect ourselves from some bad guys too. All in all, most of us feel happy when we see tourists visiting our country and we really want to give you a long-lasting impression about Thailand.
If there is anything that I could probably do to make up your feelings about my country, I would definitely be willing to help you out in your next visit. I really mean it. I regard your comment as a good point to mend it. I will find a time to give this an attention to the Thai authority especially about solving a 2-tier pricing structure. It might be hard to change the pattern how they are doing for a long time but I will try.
Please do not look at this as a point to spoil your whole traveling experience. Thailand is still a better place to visit. You are mostly welcome.
Geoff Fellows says:
January 23, 2018 at 6:15 pm
Thank you so much for your kind, understanding response about Thailand. I am on my third visit, in 12 months, to this lovely country with its warm, friendly and smiling people. Yes, there are rip-offs, but that applies almost universally – and people should be more aware of taxi , hotel, restaurant, bar, shop, visitor site, etc., scams which can be avoided by a little research, locally or online. Many Thais speak passable English and those that don’t are almost embarrassed to admit it. It is not the totally impoverished, third-world, nation that it once was; but low wages, rising prices, unemployment and dire straits, do drive some people into criminal activity, as elsewhere; plus, many ladies are driven into prostitution, as the only means to support their families. On the other hand, a large proportion of Thais are becoming increasingly prosperous; plus, there is a vast number of single mothers, abandoned by native husbands, who are understandably seeking the financial/emotional security offered by many foreigners (‘farangs’), who themselves are attracted by the delights of ‘normal’, hard-working, Thai ladies, as prospective wives. A great country, which I am seriously considering as a place of permanent residence; and a wonderful contrast to many other places in the world, including the UK, where I was born.
Dan says:
January 28, 2018 at 12:56 pm
Teerapan. What an excellent and honest summary from a Thai citizen. I have lived here for many years and accept the Thai culture you have written about. Now I just smile when I see something that I feel is a rip off and walk away. Thank you again. Chok di.
Mark says:
January 31, 2018 at 5:23 am
Your comments is tipical Thai blame others for problems …. I one word you said it all 100% corruption on every level , from school teachers to police to government . Corruption is in the culture , everyone k owns it .
December 24, 2017 at 4:15 am
December 24, 2017 at 5:56 pm
David, not sure about your specific experience but many of those who came and had bad didn’t bother to do any research before they arrived. They don’t take in facts like, be sure you understand norms & culture…, what it permissible and what is not…, understanding you’re a visitor. If you encounter police, there’s probably a reason for it and the venue questionable. Entrance fees to national parks…, more for farang than locals…, suck it up buttercup…, the fees are still far lower than national parks in US. Taxi drivers…, be kind and know the fare. Ask only for “meter”…, if they say no wait until another comes as one certainly will who will meter. waiting (teetering) for a taxi @ 3AM in a tourist trap area, go figure. Learn to smile, say “please”, “I’m sorry” and “thank you” in Thai (not hard).
Your other country choices aren’t without their issues either. I know as I’ve been to them all multiple times over many years. It will always come down to personal civility, understanding you’re in THEIR country, and being nice.
December 24, 2017 at 6:25 pm
Guy is right about Vietnam , I’m here atm. Everything is fine. Looking a lot more like a democracy nowadays.
December 24, 2017 at 8:07 pm
welcome to Vietnam where beautiful country and have a lot attractive location in the world like Son Doong Cave and Ha Long Bay…
December 26, 2017 at 2:05 pm
True.
December 27, 2017 at 1:49 pm
December 28, 2017 at 8:05 am
What about Chicago Il in the USA. Visitors there are never heard from again. Yes I know it’s not a country.
December 29, 2017 at 12:08 am
But Vietnamese is very friendly. Traveling here is also cheap
December 29, 2017 at 11:45 pm
We always see what we are looking for. Thailand is my winter home and have never had a problem. Cabs are really cheap and always agree on the fare first – same as anywhere on earth. Police never bother me but of course I am not a roudy drunk or anything. English speakers are everywhere so no problems with language. Its safe, cheap, and warm.
Max says:
December 30, 2017 at 6:41 am
Maybe these countries observe that the first tourist of the world were Europeans who in their own right were also territorial thieves who befriended friendly inhabitants, taught them Christianity, chained them up, turned them into the first immigrants (without visas), scattered them all over the world on stolen land, work them in slavery, reap the wealth of these lands, and enrich Europe and America and then dampened their iniquity to turn colonialists and when they deemed themselves satisfied they talk about giving independence and then the IMF and World Bank become the new (economic) slavemasters.
Dave says:
December 30, 2017 at 10:16 pm
Totally agree with you David, I will confirm more on Malaysia !!!
December 31, 2017 at 6:36 am
All True.and no rule of law,if a rich Thai wants you dead you will be dead, look at two English tourists murdered out of a beach bar on paradise island Koh Tao, the police did not even secure the murder scene for over 24 hours.
Look at the Red Bull Heir ran over and killed a Policeman in Bangkok dragged his body 200 metres down the road and left the murder scene, went home and drunk alcohol , we know why , has not been to court in two years some charges have expired, Thailand is incapable/not trying very hard to bringing him to justice.
January 22, 2018 at 4:05 pm
David didn’t you know or read further news that the murderers who killed the two tourists are from Burma(Meinma). They were hired as labours to a Thai business employer.
December 31, 2017 at 9:34 am
What makes you say Thailand, I imagine you had some unexplained bad experience, that you did not agree with. Please let me enlighten you, if you where to take time & learn Thai customs, your overall experience of Thailand & it’s people, would be a positive one. The truth.
James says:
December 31, 2017 at 6:51 pm
I agree 100%.
January 1, 2018 at 8:58 pm
I am Thai. Don’t totally agrees with your comments. We are friendly welcome and warmness to tourists.
January 2, 2018 at 10:56 pm
I’m Chinese, what do you think of China
Leo says:
January 3, 2018 at 4:08 pm
Thailand is just great! Just don’t be a total gringo and you will have a lot of fun for very little money. Negotiate prices beforehand and nobody will rip you off. They usually honor what has been negotiated. But if nothing has been negotiated beforehand, be prepared to ou too much. Yes, sure, locals will pay less than half of what you pay, but in London, Tokyo or New York you would be paying 5 times more than that anyway. Just be slightly slick and you will be fine.
January 4, 2018 at 2:12 pm
I appologize for your bad situation here.
About the double entrance fee, it quite same as other country that free for only citizens and charge only visitors. And others that also like ‘the black hole in every countries’.
In Europe, My dad was stolen his watch while raised his hand for say Hi. My sister was stolen her iphone while someone acted as she need help.
Anyway, there are a lot of beautiful things waiting for you. ^^
January 5, 2018 at 8:04 am
Frank says:
January 5, 2018 at 6:00 pm
I’ve lived in Thailand for 3 years on a retirement visa and true, they make it difficult, however it’s the nicest, safest and cheapest place.
I’ve been to Burma and Laos. Both totally poverty stricken and extremely expensive. Cambodia is not to good either. Most capital city’s are fair, but once 5km outside it all ends.
The USA should imitate Thailand’s immigration policy.
Loeurn says:
January 7, 2018 at 3:59 am
How about Cambodia? Angkor Wat temples in Siem Reap city.
January 7, 2018 at 10:38 pm
Okay now how can I gets info about communication
Jane says:
January 8, 2018 at 8:03 am
Yes, this is truth. I am totally agree.
January 9, 2018 at 2:18 am
Also add to the list most of East European countries, lately they have been becoming a strong dictature, you can easily be part of victim of the authorities’ abuses, its enough not to give them “black money”. The corruption is so high that an innocent, normal visitor from a civilizated country can have very uncomfortable experiences (Hungary, Rumania, etc etc, as we always say, the line between civilization and “barbarie” is the Austrian-Hungarian border).
Pandey says:
January 11, 2018 at 11:44 am
Very correct observation. Vietnam is very cheap and good place for visit, people are vary nice and honest.
January 12, 2018 at 5:35 am
January 12, 2018 at 3:14 pm
yes that’s right in some ways in Thai big cities as Bangkok,Pattaya,Phuket….Krabi and Koh samui but if u try to go to other provinces in the heart of Thailand u will find other kind of sweet peaple very friendly very helpful,they ‘re not interested in how much money in ur wallit….provinces full of historical areas and beautiful sightseeing……cities as Chiang mai and Chiang rai in the north of Thailand cheap hotels and nice food and very safe if u re interesting in hot nightlife……. i have been there 2 years ago …i’ve stayed for more than 3 weeks alone with a very small budget ……Thailand is not that bad
Tanya says:
February 3, 2018 at 10:21 pm
Right..I saw that.It is a amazing place. I used to eat and drink with payless. Money is meanless.I saw their smile and brought me a coconut milk from the palm and told me .test .test in the south of
Thailand.
Booob says:
January 13, 2018 at 12:21 am
Hey ! I have lived and worked in many so called first world country and am now in Thailand and it is the best I have been to. So each person has different experience so do not put down any country. I guess people can say negative about your paradise country.
Scott says:
January 13, 2018 at 6:47 am
Thailand is my favourite place to visit. Just behave and you will have the time of your life. Tourists are the lifes bread of Thailand and you will find the best food and welcome of any country. A more warm and friendly people cant be found anywhere else. If you have problems you have brought them with you.
January 20, 2018 at 7:06 am
That’s a common myth usually spread by tourists who learn nothing about the place. Thailand is usually around 27th in the world GDP list and only about 10% comes from tourism. They welcome the extra revenue but they don’t depend on it.
January 14, 2018 at 3:31 pm
Are these countries just against Americans then,? as the article keeps mentioning the American embassies. My grandson didn’t like Myanmar, as the locals chew this red stuff,( don’t know what ) and then spit it out, he says everything is red, yuck, As for Cuba, my nephew just last week came home from his Honeymoon, and had no problem getting to go there, mind you, he is English, and booked his trip, from England, hence my original question.
George says:
January 16, 2018 at 9:59 am
Maybe you should think about why they don’t want US citizens to come in…
January 16, 2018 at 9:09 pm
January 17, 2018 at 8:04 am
Thailand is not the only country that charges more than double for entry fees, not even close. Guatemala, Colombia, Peru are just some of the many countries I have been to that do that.
As for taxis, you have to be careful of taxis in EVERY country and research your route beforehand, even in the states. Does Thailand have uber now? I went in 2010, so it has to by now I would think.
Mike says:
January 18, 2018 at 4:01 am
Obviously you have had a bad experience in Thailand but to put it in the same list as the countries mentioned in the article is really to exaggerate. “That the police target tourist in Thailand..” Well it happens especially in some parts of Bangkok where the police target tourists throwing away cigarette butts on the street. It can cost you up to $60 but mostly people get away with around $30. In some tourist areas the entrance fee is higher for tourists. “Taxi drivers are well known for ripping off tourists..” I would say in what country isn’t it like that ?
I have been living in Thailand for more than a decade and I’ve never been targeted by the police neither overpaid or been ripped off by taxi drivers. Thailand is still much cheaper than the countries you mentioned to visit instead and if you use common sense you don’t get ripped off. It’s very simple; for example, don’t sit in a taxi that refuses to put on the meter, refuse to pay more in places that try to overcharge you , don’t break the law etc. When you follow that and as I said use common sense you will have a nice and cheap holiday in Thailand.
January 18, 2018 at 2:57 pm
john holmes says:
January 19, 2018 at 1:55 am
I have lived in Thailand 16 years and i find the place wonderful, very very nice people in general. You got bit by a sex worker????
January 20, 2018 at 6:59 am
Thailand is better off without you.
January 21, 2018 at 2:29 am
Ditto on that..Thailand is a dirty money grubbing country..there is so much deceit about what that country is really all about..the sex tourism is the only thing that is actually represented with truth..and it is degrading and dirty..the rest of the country is pretty much 1-2 star everything..and the smiles you see?…phoney as the king…that disgraceful “ monarchy”:is a sham…has billions yet people in bangkok live in shacks by the tracks..the country is full of suspicious simpletons that will take your money, smile and laugh with each other at the stupidity of tourists..lived there 5 years…unfortunately…job demanded it of me..would rather eat glass then go back.
Louise says:
January 21, 2018 at 10:43 am
Thailand isn’t the only country that rip off tourists, plus can you really complain when half the stuff is 10 times cheaper than you would get it other countries? I’m in Thailand and I got a pack of Marlboro cigarettes for only £3 (converted into GBP) – I wouldn’t complain much if I were you
January 22, 2018 at 4:29 am
Add to list Russia possible to street stopped your car stolen all got street pirates ,…
January 22, 2018 at 3:37 pm
Everywhere, there are good and bad people even in your own country. It’s depend on your luck to find different kind of experiences. I have been to several countries and can never escape certain kind of experiences you have had. The thing is that the more i travel, the more understanding about people, places, surrounding and environment expanding my mind with less and less bias and discrimation. Just let live and enjoy every moment we are given whatsoever.
January 22, 2018 at 6:34 pm
Been to Thailand. No problems whatsoever. One of the least restrictive countries in the Far East. I entered with a USA passport, my wife used her UK passport. Brilliant country to visit. Really recommend going there. Also North Korea welcomes foreign visitors. Been there twice. Excellent shopping as well.
January 22, 2018 at 8:51 pm
pico says:
January 22, 2018 at 10:21 pm
I am Thai and I agreed with you except the tourism authority of Thailand cause some of them are not bad at all.
I think you just understood and met some bad ppl or bad company and I recommended you to try another, not just only meet the bad once and say they’re all bad.
January 23, 2018 at 4:51 pm
Thailand is a beautiful country and the park fees are used for conservation and cleaning up after tourists.
Roger says:
January 24, 2018 at 2:19 am
Thailand is awesome. Chiang Mai is the best to live long-term. I was there for a year plus. Got Dengue.
Sean Wakely says:
January 25, 2018 at 12:02 am
Are there police in Thailand ? I was there for 4 weeks in 2007. To be honest, I noticed a few police officers, and I felt safe at all times and places, so they must be doing something, but they weren’t annoying me ! Thailand…what a place for holiday, for a Kiwi at least !
January 27, 2018 at 4:08 am
How many times you have visited Thailand?
Stuart says:
January 28, 2018 at 5:50 am
My experience in Thailand over the last 9 years has been very positive.
Yes some fees for national parks are doubled to only a few pounds but as many of the locals can’t afford it I don’t have a problem.
Only had one taxi driver who didn’t want to use the meter in 9 years.
Dan says:
January 28, 2018 at 12:44 pm
Absolutely correct. Thai tourism authy ask you to report double pricing for non nationals on national parks etc. When you do, they just smile or should i say smirk and promise to investigate. Thais do not like to lose face and thus smile and do nothing. I have lived here for many years and have come to terms with it. So they do not get any income from me for their parks. They want your money but not your presence. Corruption is accepted by majority of Thais as a way of life and is from the top down in all govt depts.
Mark says:
January 31, 2018 at 5:15 am
You are 100% right . Thailand only want your money . And scam you all the time double price on entry , police booking none stop … , a tourist is just a atm walking around for then and you are the target to any one .
How I know I spend 4 years there .
Mark says:
January 31, 2018 at 3:06 pm
Yes, entrance fees to National parks etc are doubled for non Thais, but to say the police target tourists is just ridiculous, and as far as taxis are concerned, as long as you insist on turning on the meter, you will have no problem. taxi fares in Thailand are hugely cheaper than in the US.
jeff says:
February 2, 2018 at 12:19 am
I have lived in Thailand for the past 10 years, and am a bit disappointed in Davids remarks. He does make some strong points but the ignores the plus side as thais are some the most pleasant and kind people on earth but the sad fact is the tourist industry has become a pit for ripping off tourists. Advice become more adventures Avoid tuk-tuks and Taxis but ride the songtaws,subway-bangkok and regular busses Thailand does have tourist police and they are manned by both locals and expats like myself Entrance fees….damm shame and it includes some private businesses as well
Me says:
February 3, 2018 at 8:27 am
What you said sounds unfair to Thailand. How do Thai people discriminate the tourists? Can you explain clearly? But I am sure not everyone believe you in what you said. Many tourists revisit Thailand which means the they like something about a Thailand.
Tanya says:
February 3, 2018 at 10:14 pm
Indeed ! you are not wrong. Right ,Thailand love tourist revenue but discriminate against the visiors. That is the point that you see. In another point that you never see,Thai is so kind and you will see that those of people help to arrest the bad guy who attack the tourists ; in rural area that money is meanless and Buddhist are the worth thing, you will meet the positive view that you never think you can seek in this planet.I didn’t love Pattaya and Bangkok. I love to walk along the street from Bangkok to another place of this country.I am so hungry and feel hot and want some drink.It is amazing that people gave me some drink with their smile on their face.and they said why don’t you take a sit for a while. In another point,in Kl , I saw the bad guy who are in the same room and noboby want to get involve.Thailand, I saw the same nevertheless; Thai told the police to take a look ,they guess in this room have something ‘s wrong .And that day ,I
saw many people from many country were arrest in the position of deceiving.
Francis says:
February 4, 2018 at 12:22 am
It was You. Not tourists. the police is super friendly. and yes, you pay 50 cents more to visit a zoo. As for taxi drivers ripping off tourists you are kidding right ? same thing in all the countries in the world.
Dont come back to Thailand.
Amal says:
February 5, 2018 at 8:29 am
Many non western countries practice this cheaper prices for locals to make things affordable for their people…don’t forget they earn heaps less than what we westerners earn.
Thailand is a beautiful place to visit especially Phuket and surrounding islands…one of the best I’ve been to. We loved it so much we went 3 times…beats Malaysia and Vietnam hands down
jc hurley says:
February 6, 2018 at 2:34 am
well dog gone! I am an American, and live in Thailand, and it has been a lovely experience. What you described, in my current 2 yr 6 mo stay I have yet to see. Nor did I see anything like that in my PREVIOUS 2 yr 6 mo stay, albeit in the military during Vietnam. And the suggestion for Myanmar I would not suggest a visit, nor Malaysia. Singapore, however, is a green light. But holy cow, it is a fast city. I am a bit more laid back, but still enjoyed my visit there.
Sean, ly says:
February 6, 2018 at 3:25 pm
In vietnam, the police will always see you as spies. In addition, taxi drivers, peddlers and extra fees will even rip you more than in Thailand.
February 6, 2018 at 7:28 pm
Excuse me! But that, to put it mildly, is not true. I’ve been staying in Thailand for 7 years already and can say it’s still a very friendly country for visitors especially for ones who respect the laws and the culture of this beautiful country.
February 7, 2018 at 8:11 pm
I am American and spend about one-third of my time in Thailand. I find the Thai police polite and helpful and I have never been targeted. I suppose they might be indignant if your were drunk and rude. Yes, entrance fees to many venues are higher for tourists, but this true in tourist area around the World. Residents often get preferred pricing. It is true in most communities in America (golf for example is usually cheaper for residents everywhere). There are some unscrupulous taxi drivers everywhere, not just Thailand. Try using services like Uber or Grab. Those are great, but in Thailand taxis are usually less expensive than those ride services. What lies does the Thai Tourism Authority tell? All such agencies around the World put a positive spin on their own country. That is their job.
Igor A says:
February 9, 2018 at 3:55 pm
I enjoyed reading comments here. guess thats why i m writing a few sentenses.
A lot is repetative. in a very nice way though. Praising the people , talking about kindness and welcomness and such.
To me – its simple. like many pointed out- there are good and bad ppl everywhere.
also as we all know, US has some of the most ignorant, stupid, loud, disrespectful beings on the planet. so there is a stigma, a reputation.
these are the ones that leave negative comments here. i live in the US for 20 years being a russian immigrant.
just like other countries, US has the most warm smart open good people too.
I guess the point is- current political stance vs US, turmoil, what have you is sure an obsticle.
But the obvious thing is- be polite, respectful, kind, modest, speak few local words, smile and what not- and wherever you go, you are likely tobe met with reciprication. people are people. most people are good and also get exited to talk to someone who is a bit different.
you ll prob make their day. something intersting happenned today. something to tell their spouse at dinner table. maybe joke about. and they ll try to make yours . we all have more good inside.
the rest is noise, talks about visas, unfriendliness, shadyness and this garbage. its mass media, ignorance and brain fuck. i mean, we got internet now…. why bother get brainfucked by 6 US corporations w their agendas that control 99 per cent of news outlets? like all newspapers already have went up in flames, TV is next. is dinasour crap for dinasours and lazy folk who cant figure out which buttton to press on his comp or iphone to find a real news source.
i wish everyone fantastic time and adventures during their travel.
February 9, 2018 at 6:52 pm
Vietnam is the peace country. Just come to discover about culture, food and people especially landscape. I swear you all guys will be love this country. If you have a chance to come to Vietnam I will help you with my abilities.
Marcus says:
February 9, 2018 at 7:52 pm
Dual pricing is really bad in Thailand. At places the foreigner will 5 or more times pay the local rate. Locals go for free to their church (temple) as we allow them to enter our churches. But the wat pra keow in Bangkok, tourist 500 baht , Thai for free, even when they arrive in a Ferrari. Judgement is often based on racial characteristics, were even Thai “who do not look right” (as in parks and historical sites) have to pay foreigner rates.
February 10, 2018 at 12:17 am
Fully agree yes
Gary says:
February 10, 2018 at 12:20 pm
If the things you said are supposed to be common occurrences rather than exceptions, then why do millions of tourists continue to visit Thailand, many of them again and again?
Col says:
February 10, 2018 at 2:01 pm
February 11, 2018 at 6:17 am
why Cuba has the name on this list ? i love cuba, peaceful country , friendly people
February 11, 2018 at 5:30 pm
We are out here now. Don’t care about those charges, we’ve enjoyed excellent hospitality at half the price we would pay in England. My only complaint is with the longtail boats, the noise and pollution keeps us away from the beaches they regularly pass.
As for the taxi drivers ripping you off, its not as bad as most places. Negotiate a price before you get in. No problem.
Grow up David, still expecting everyone to bow to the white man?
February 11, 2018 at 10:40 pm
“Absolutely True!!!”
February 12, 2018 at 11:47 pm
Even the USA has dual pricing… Hawaii for example has resident price for golf and price for visitors..
Joe Kicker says:
February 14, 2018 at 11:52 am
You dolt, that’s why they DO want you to visit.
Kareena Thomas says:
February 14, 2018 at 6:38 pm
I am in Thailand now. the Thai people are the most gracious people on the planet. I have travelled here over 25 times and have a business in Chiang Mai. They help whenever they can and serve you like you are a king or queen. The food is the best and also the hospitality. My taxi driver in Bangkok was very kind. The wages are very low for the Thai people so it only makes sense that tourists pay more, If you can afford an airline ticket you can afford 3 extra dollars at a National Park. You seem like the type of tourist who only takes and never gives back to the people you are visiting. I agree, you should visit these other countries and stay out of Thailand.
mk says:
February 16, 2018 at 3:47 am
I am in Thailand right now, just linke TENS oft thousands oft Westerners every year.
Yes, entrance fees are lower for locals. Guess what, they also subsidize them with their income tax, that you as a foreigner do not pay.
Taxi drivers are known to ripp people off EVERYWHERE. Taxi drivers fuck with tourists, in Egypt, in Hungary, in Thailand, in New York, in Berlin.
Putting Thailand in the same list as Lybia shows that you might be retarded.
Jordan says:
February 16, 2018 at 6:45 pm
Ignorance is bliss. Every tourist country has tourist prices and local prices. USA Canada and where we now live, Mexico is the same, friend. Double the price for those who can afford it. Do not be a tourist in soneone else’s country and expect to pay local prices. I guess it takes more life experience and simple economics courses to understand. Sigh…
K mali says:
February 18, 2018 at 3:45 am
When you travell to other countries for pleasure or business you must feel safe to go there, you must enjoy the culture, the tradition, the food of that country and get respected as a visitor and welcome it by the people of that country the truth this moment the world hate each other and don’t trust each other because of internet gossip, Facebook, utube, TV and propaganda and bad leaders Like USA, Saudi Iranian , North Korea, Russian, Syrian, Israeli, etched creates hate among the world.
Kenji says:
February 19, 2018 at 6:16 am
Im Thai myself and I couldnt agree more, dealing with most Thais are a hell on earth.
February 20, 2018 at 9:34 am
Bruh its not only Thailand its all other countries including America , china etc etc ….. Thailand got so many tourist attractions and yes we need money to develop and also they is tax refund in the airport so pls if u don’t know don’t mention our country …. And The Reason Why u Earning Is for Enjoyment And Thailand Got So Many to enjoy n view
Paul says:
February 20, 2018 at 7:45 pm
Visit all countries but do not visit racist countries. I have decided not to visit France and USA due to their racist and discriminatory visitor visa policies.
February 21, 2018 at 6:06 am
Oh, so you were bothered that they doubled an entrance fee from $3 for locals to $6 for visitors? Were here *right now *, and I’ve never been able to travel this cheaply.
February 21, 2018 at 7:21 am
I have been to Thailand seven times in the last three years. If you had a bad experience, no need to discredit a country that loves tourists. Everywhere I have gone in the past you always find people that try to take advantage of tourists. Thailand is overall a great destinations both for long term expats and tourists alike. Even with those extras that you complaint about Thailand is an extremely safe and cheap place to live and/or spent your holidays.
February 21, 2018 at 8:07 pm
I disagree I love visiting Thailand… Never had anything but helpful locals it’s an amazing trip each time I go,
February 22, 2018 at 12:41 am
I could not agree with any of them comments I have been visiting Thailand for years my opinion is the opposite,we are being ripped off in our own country.
lee says:
February 22, 2018 at 7:55 am
Mo says:
February 23, 2018 at 9:24 pm
Avoid the areas that exploit women. Be polite, humble and respectful ( like they are) Thailand is the best country in the world.
February 24, 2018 at 5:40 pm
No! I live in Thai it’s wonderful! My cousin visit us so many times!
Sky says:
February 25, 2018 at 8:17 pm
Sawaht dee! Well, I certainly don’t think Thailand rates as one of the worst. It could use some improvement sure, like everywhere.
1. What country doesn’t like tourist revenue? How do they discriminate against visitors? Thailand is a very, very, friendly, fun country.
2. (Some) police target tourists sure. Targeting tourists? How so? Did you get targeted? How? Why are the tourists breaking the law in the first place?
3. Entrance fee doubled? Well, I know that in the U.S. there are “residency” prices to some locations and senior discounts; what’s the difference, and so what? They need to raise revenue to facilitate and service these areas – for you in part. Thais pay taxes, and it’s their country last time I checked. Anyway, you don’t have to pay it if you don’t want.
4. Taxi drivers around the world rip people off. If you don’t want to get ripped off, learn some Thai, get a map, negotiate, and ensure that you get the best deal – just like any country.
Yes, I have lived here for 20 years and have seen some changes. However, I am not biased one way or the other. Sure, there could be some improvements, but it is still a great place to visit and live, still friendly, and still the land of smiles. Maybe learn some Thai and NOT ACTING like a dumb tourist would help alleviate your financial disappointments. Yes, go other countries (I do). Laos for example is worse, and Viet Nam from what I hear. Enjoy!
February 26, 2018 at 4:48 am
Completely false I have been to Thailand 30 times it’s easy to visit and they live foreigners
Tommy says:
February 27, 2018 at 12:08 am
Udhay says:
October 26, 2017 at 7:53 pm
Do you really feel the procedures are tough? You ask any asian, visa to any country in the world is toughest procedure than your 10 listed countries. (except Singapore Malaysia Japan and Southkorea)
Bobby Green says:
October 27, 2017 at 8:11 pm
You are really right! Asian is highly discriminated when come to visa for overseas travel. In Laos, it takes months before application would be accepted or decline by embassies especially the USA, Australia, Canada etc. However, to get Lao visa might be relatively easy but, be warned, to say in Laos is another story. Check with your embassy website before making a move.
jeff says:
February 2, 2018 at 12:21 am
Laos enter from Thailand much easier. and lets not forgot the fact its very difficult for a thai and laos national to get a visa to the united states…..my thai wife was denied even though married to me an american
November 2, 2017 at 8:21 pm
Hmmm, first time I applied for a visa to China I got a one year visa. Not a problem. As a condition I had to leave China every 60 days and come back in so I visited Vietnam…no problem. Every where people were friendly (VERY friendly) even in Vietnam. Now I have been in China for 5 years. Costs are far less, everything else about the same as the USA, well crime is a lot less, and it is hard to get good beef and good hot dogs! and people are still a lot more friendly.
December 25, 2017 at 5:06 pm
Jordan says:
February 16, 2018 at 7:08 pm
Agreed! We loved visiting Zim for the JW International Convention in August 2014! We still keep in touch with our brothers there! Jw.org
Meysam says:
October 26, 2017 at 10:26 pm
I think It’s not true about Iran, second place after Saudi Arabia? Even before North Korea and Libya?! really? ?
Have anyone any experiences about traveling to Iran? (specially the writer)
fateme says:
October 27, 2017 at 9:24 am
I really agree with you….they must emend this news….
sara says:
October 27, 2017 at 11:26 pm
Iran is completely different from what you have been saying and shown on television.
Iran has four seasons.
Iran is not a desert.
To never see or ignore yourself, never believe it
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:21 am
Have toured Iran TWICE, EU passports get Visa on arrival ! No problems at all. Iranians are very very kind, hospitable people. There is no danger, crime is almost non existant. Iran has a deep history, they are welcoming people, the only real “not nice” thing is the request for the ladies to wear a head scarf or men not to wear shorts, nothing else. USA president is a bias individual, a sort of right winger colluding with Saudi Arabia and the likes, just for money….nothing else, once Trump is removed, the world will be a better place.
December 28, 2017 at 5:13 am
You guys obviously did not visit Iran before 1979! That’s when it was a great place!
ali says:
December 4, 2017 at 5:57 am
Sara I agree with you e
Parsa says:
December 12, 2017 at 9:15 am
George says:
November 29, 2017 at 12:38 am
Only one problem with Iran it that’s its full of Iranians
Reza says:
January 4, 2018 at 12:21 am
Hi, I beg you study about Iranians then judge about them, the nation with nice IQ that if decide ti leave America promptly you will face huge management and scientific difficulties you can not imagine! See how many great and famous scientists live there in US. Indeed you have to upgrade your study and knowledge about Iran before saying non -the- less. Have a nice time!
December 5, 2017 at 5:39 pm
Iran is most beautiful hospitable place
I go there to enjoy 5 times a year
Very in expensive
Good people
January 4, 2018 at 7:07 pm
I don’t think there was any order with the list
October 27, 2017 at 1:15 am
the trouble of Angola are only the politicians and hight prices
but Angola have good people nice place to have a big party
November 6, 2017 at 2:15 am
is the true about angola real is the good plaese to holiday becouse´ve a great people good party and other!
A.M says:
October 27, 2017 at 3:23 am
Asking why?
What common to those counties?
November 28, 2017 at 10:05 pm
Countries under some form of threat from the US.
October 27, 2017 at 8:50 am
He is not true about Cuba. Tourism is the second most important sector in the Cuban economy. Anybody can travel to Cuba by a tourist visa that you could buy with tour plane ticket.
Mary says:
November 21, 2017 at 6:21 pm
Exactly! Cuba is welcoming. It’s the US government that doesn’t want it’s citizens visiting.
jeff says:
February 2, 2018 at 12:23 am
Sad fact the united states still holds a grudge after all these years….Cuba sounds like a blast
Nathan says:
October 27, 2017 at 9:46 am
I don’t believe the info on Cuba is all accurate. Cuba, like most of the Caribbean relies on Tourism as the main economic activity and earner for the country. The US has an embargo against Cuba, hence why US citizens find it difficult to get there. But Americans can travel to Cuba via Jamaica or the Bahamas.
October 29, 2017 at 8:08 am
Cuba is one of the most important place visited for tourist. Maybe this information is just for USA citizen.
I don’t agree about Thailand description because according my experience in the country is my favorite place
Paul says:
December 5, 2017 at 6:14 am
The U.S ought to be on this list for some because of the recent Border Walls and stringent immigration laws.
Sharris says:
October 27, 2017 at 1:46 pm
This is totally incorrect about Cuba. I have been there, and it is one of the most beautiful places to visit, with many tousist attractions, some of the world’s best beaches, and the people are kind, warm and friendly. Whoever wrote this has surely never been there.
Jhon says:
October 27, 2017 at 8:04 pm
Its not true some country first i vist Saudi Arabia be for 3years and nothing bad its better than dubai go to jedah & abha its betufull nice place to
Normal Norm says:
December 1, 2017 at 7:25 pm
Absolutely correct. And Cuba does not bar access to Americans, America restricts that access. Cubans are ingenious survivors of a blanket embargo of the same products that America offers to other third wheel countries.
Sharris says:
October 27, 2017 at 1:56 pm
Wait. Why isn’t USA on this list? To just apply for a US Visa costs US$160.00, a non-refundable fee if declined btw, and a large percentage of applicants are declined. And of course, let’s not forget the travel bans trying to be currently imposed for several countries. Welcoming indeed.
November 1, 2017 at 8:11 am
I agree with you Sharris. The US of A isn’t on the list. They should as a matter of urgency get on it.
Babafree says:
November 16, 2017 at 4:23 pm
Yeah, this is a list of 10 countries the US doesn’t like…Cuba, for a starter is crawling with tourists. The US is nasty to visit. Just ask anyone who has had to apply for a visa and then go through the TSA gauntlet. Couldn’t be more unfriendly and I’m a citizen!!!
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:25 am
yoyu are 100% correct, say no more
November 28, 2017 at 10:11 pm
The article is about the assumed difficulty for Americans to visit those countries.
The real problem is when Americans return from those countries.
Paul says:
December 5, 2017 at 6:15 am
Exactly
john says:
October 27, 2017 at 3:51 pm
travel to iran. then post this information. Iran is an amazing country with lovely people.. plz research more, about iran
sara says:
October 27, 2017 at 11:22 pm
Thank you very much
Hanieh says:
October 28, 2017 at 3:28 am
Have you traveled to Iran? Thanks for your comment… we really love tourists and Iran is really cheap, you can even buy house for yourself for one night even
mike6080 says:
November 15, 2017 at 4:05 pm
how much do bodyguards cost to prevent kidnapping by muslim terrorists
Alex says:
January 14, 2018 at 6:53 am
that’s correct Hanieh. unfortunately US want to raise fear among the people in the world and increase the risk of war for selling their weapons. this is the story
January 6, 2018 at 7:16 am
John, I really want to visit Iran. Some told me it’s a beautiful country.
January 16, 2018 at 6:56 am
October 27, 2017 at 10:50 pm
Most of these countries have made most of their population into slaves for a small ruling class, usually belonging to certain clans, using fondamenatlistic religion or political principles as tools, and the oligarchies are afraid any influennce on the population from outside. Cuba is perhaps an exception, . It is not that extreme anymore, and it encourages visitations, except from citizens of USA.
November 28, 2017 at 10:14 pm
The enlightened would say that describes America.
Nicholas says:
December 31, 2017 at 10:01 am
Yes, you should state that the European Union, has also made slaves of the population of Europe, to serve the likes of Germany.
January 6, 2018 at 7:21 am
Holt, I think I get you right. There are specific groups of people who rule us and we don’t want to know. These few groups don’t tolerate foreigners who they think may open our eyes! Oh my God!
sara says:
October 27, 2017 at 11:20 pm
Writing the name of Iran among this list is ultimately unnecessary.
Iran is not Iraq. Iran is not an Arab country. Iran has the most security in the Middle East, which is not the day when nobody is killed by ignorance.
November 13, 2017 at 11:15 am
What have you got against Arab countries? You Americans always think that if we are Arab that means we are terrorists and we hate Americans, that’s wrong, it is you Americans who don’t accept us and spread lies about us
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:31 am
Dear Sara : people vilifying Iran are mostly ignorant, let us remember that only 4 to 5% of Americans travel abroad….Iran will soon be recognised for what it is: beautiful country with deep history, lovely, welcoming people. Virtualy no crime. Shall visit again, God allowing.
November 23, 2017 at 7:22 am
But some are muslim fanatics
January 6, 2018 at 7:27 am
But Gino, there are unwelcomed people everywhere in the world. US is the best place in the world – This is my oppinion. However, there are shootings everywhere.We can’t say US is bad guy!
Baba says:
December 27, 2017 at 12:52 pm
I’m a tourist from Afghanistan yes its hard to believe and i’ve visited 37 countries from four different continents. Ive been to Iran and my experience is awesome, i loved people’s hospitality regardless of where you come from unless you have a political intention then its not going to be easy for you. I loved Cuba and i visited Cuba three times in three different years. Currently i live in Belize (Central America) which is my second home and i love it. I’m not a religious nor a politician thus i don’t lie nor i support any country. I love Jews, Christians, Muslims, Hindus and Athiests as long as you are a normal human being. But one thing i want to share with you guys is that, i applied for US tourist once and another time i applied for a transit visa my both time they refused my application without explaining me why? even though i have background of working with US army in Afghanistan. So should you add US to your list?!
Hanieh says:
October 28, 2017 at 3:24 am
well, you must see Iran up close before any idea. Iran is the cheapest country, because Rial lows down every day. And you have no idea how people love tourists. There are even documentaries about traveling to Iran : Iran’s great/ Don’t go to Iran, you might have the best trip of your life by TOLT
Sam says:
October 28, 2017 at 4:24 am
Good, those useless countries can buries their heads in the muds for all I care. I am not interest in those horrible countries anyway. Add CCP China to the list too please, thanks.
Peter says:
October 30, 2017 at 4:38 pm
Have you been to China, better learn few words in Chinese , thank you, hi. And find out that you are welcome everywhere. They do not expect tip, Restaurants, Taxi, they don’t expect tip, but, in New York, even if you are not served properly, the Restaurants call Police and fine you or arrest you if you don’t pay tip. So, different countries, different custom.
Mary says:
November 21, 2017 at 6:25 pm
This is not true. Tipping in the US is common practice but ask any server and they will tell you that many people don’t leave tips. It’s not the law.
And China is not all that welcoming to foreigners. The visa process is ridiculous. They ridicule anyone that looks different, openly pointing laughing and taking pictures and the government will stop you on the street to ask for your papers. Once I had gone through immigration and was leaving the airport, a customs person singled me out, walked all the way across and asked, “Why are you here.” Yeah, very welcoming.
November 28, 2017 at 10:20 pm
Ask the British or the French.
Light says:
January 2, 2018 at 1:08 pm
i don’t understand why you think british or french have a problem with american as French i can say that majority of the people in france love america and would love to go over there so they’re always glad to meet american people
Ian says:
January 15, 2018 at 2:37 pm
I’m British and wherever I have been in the world, Americans are always the worst idiots you can meet.
London is also the worst place you can visit in the UK. Lots of things to see but the people who live there just want to claw their way over everybody else. They are not nice and are mostly very antisocial.
Greece is my favourite place in the world.
February 9, 2018 at 9:07 am
Cheers mate on that Greece remark!
Badoo says:
October 28, 2017 at 5:34 am
Rubbish even for a million dollar what is attractive in those 4th world countries, to bother anyone taking holiday there .I rather go to ogbunike cave ,okomu park than ,somalia ,Saudi Arabia ,north Korea ,that has no internet ,all the aforementioned countries are trash for .
October 29, 2017 at 11:03 am
Typical racist coment.
November 28, 2017 at 10:24 pm
You need to get out more.
December 2, 2017 at 10:47 pm
This guy is an African yet he is racist and its because all those countries kill drug traffickers. Unfortunately for Africa, it’s these criminals that the rest of the world is seeing because Africa is the best place to be.
America’ll find most countries unwelcoming brcause they use themselves as reference, but they have forgotten that their country is getting even more hostile than North Korea. For me, travelling to the US has never been ab option because i’ll not allow any embassy tell me bullshit over my money afterall i’ll be going there to spend, not to live as illegal immigrant even for one second…
January 6, 2018 at 7:32 am
Oladipo, I want to go and live in the US for some time even as illegal immigrant, no problem.
January 6, 2018 at 7:53 am
Oladapo, I am African as you said. But you are aware that some countries in Asia eat black people not because they are traffic drugs but simple that blacks don’t look like human beings. This is a clear issue. People should be informed of this attitude! I love every human being but hate people who eat blacks. Except you want to let us know you hail from Asia but bear African or Yoruba name.
Moore says:
December 23, 2017 at 3:36 pm
So true never been there and no plans to visit these countries , most people living there are desperate to leave this countries for good.
October 28, 2017 at 6:38 am
Very bad article. Has the writer ever travelled to Iran ? .iran is one of the most beautiful countries in the world with a lot of historical places dating back to 5000 years ago. Iranian people likes foreigners and u will be suprised that how they are open and kind with u. I don’t deny that our government is not a good one and I know they have problems with Americans , but it’s not true with Iranian people. Travel to Iran and u will be suprised
Mohammad says:
November 12, 2017 at 4:45 am
You are not right about Iran’s government.
Iranian government is open to all nations and regimes except the US and Israel, who, themselves are hostile towards Iranian nation.
October 28, 2017 at 6:56 am
It is easy to visit CUBA for a holiday or for business. Many countries do so and their passports are not stamped because of the US attitude towards anyone who visit the island. I have never visited but I have many friends and business colleagues who have, and their feedback has been excellent. For both business and pleasure .There are many repeats by them.
Moi says:
January 3, 2018 at 12:33 am
@ Bolleood film: Cuban immigration not stamping passports of visitors due to future victimization of some country having visited it, is considered a huge act of the country’s selfless sacrifice! GOD BLESS CUBA..(I’m not Cuban though)
October 28, 2017 at 7:54 am
This is pure and rude right-winged manipulation. It’s just a list of countries that are not submisive to US policies and have been blockaded by the for many decades. If you say Saudi Arabia with their cruel, obsolete, middle ages legislation, well, Ok. But Cuba?!! A country which welcomes tourists in a familiar environment, prepared humanly to make visitors feel at home and being almost the safest country in the Western Hemisphere, only second to Canada? This page is a shameful manipulation. Iran is another country which respects visitors and their culture, and even North Korea is an extremely safe, beautiful country, though being true that they will asign you a guide who will tell you where you can go and where not. This website stinks!
November 28, 2017 at 10:34 pm
Your ignorance is no different from the author’s.
Saudi Arabia has millions of visitors from around the world, many of them Americans. What they don’t want is the American tourists culture,(or lack of).
Dan says:
December 26, 2017 at 11:40 pm
There are thousand of American and europeans there but they make life difficult for others to go to their countries. I think America and Europe should be added. I undetstand why Iran and cuba and many countries in the list don’t like tourist because they send spies and like to destabilise other countries
January 7, 2018 at 6:55 am
This not my experience. I am in Amman International Airport right now, and I am flying to Dubai, because Saudi Arabia is making very difficult to visit the country -your country, I assumed-
I am from Denver, CO where many Saudi Arabians go to learn the language and go to College. Many of them advised me to visit the country because “it is beautiful”. then, why making it so difficult to get the visa?
I had been in 80 countries -so far-, and in several posted in this list. I do consider this list to be biased: I had been in Madrid and got rip off with the taxi -and I do speck Spanish-, same thing Egypt and Jordan were they triple the prices for the tourists. Taking a taxi is the worst thing anywhere, unless you agreed to the fare before the trip. To my fellow travelers:
Keep traveling, learn and contribute to the World Peace!
October 28, 2017 at 9:06 am
First of all, why would anyone in a right mind would like to travel to ANY of those places?
I’ve traveled to all, but Angola, where I lived 1 year as a child, and truly, none of them is worth a simple glimpse.
November 28, 2017 at 10:39 pm
Except for the civil wars backed by America, those places have history, culture, natural beauty,..
Camila says:
October 28, 2017 at 10:51 am
Saudi Arabia is amazing and its really protected and safe so I don’t blame them.
October 28, 2017 at 4:07 pm
You forgot USA. If u are tourist you will be treated like a terrorist or illegal immigrant by the border police. So if u say that You (USA citizen I supose) are not welcome to visit Iran, you can say the same thing for we (non USA citizen) if we want to go vissiting NY for example
Mike says:
November 27, 2017 at 4:44 pm
Would never set foot in the USA,even with the offer of a free flight. When Trump gets locked up I would go.He insulted the UK.Also you’ve got a good chance of getting shot!
October 28, 2017 at 4:46 pm
Its just another example of American ignorance and non education towards other countries, their culture and history.. oh I forgot.. yes its not easy to understand other countries history when you not have one ..
November 28, 2017 at 10:48 pm
Satish says:
October 28, 2017 at 4:52 pm
Is it true that In the US they make you strip naked in the customs for a security check up ? Wow! and what do they see?! All countries have issues. I’d lose a million before I even thought of entering the Saudi kingdom- you could be beheaded before your head realises why!
November 23, 2017 at 12:06 pm
Satish, bull shit! Dont comment with hate and commit religious hatred against a muslim country without knowledge. Main source of foriegn exchage assets to india coming from indians employed in saudi and other gulf arab countries. How many heads you have seen in saudi roads?
November 28, 2017 at 10:51 pm
Only if you are trafficking drugs.
October 28, 2017 at 7:00 pm
The US of A must be the least desirable place to visit, full of people who are
either too ignorant or too poor to gain experience of civilised countries.
It is dangerous, dirty and diseased in the majority of its larger conurbations,
with its natives carrying more weapons than Libya, Syria and Korea combined.
China says:
October 28, 2017 at 7:12 pm
Who would want to go to any of those s$%#holes anyway. Lock the gate and throw away the key.
November 28, 2017 at 10:55 pm
You are everything they wish to keep out of their countries.
Robyn Noel says:
October 28, 2017 at 9:02 pm
I think some of you negative critics should go explore the tourists destinations in your own countrys first before travelling anywhere else . I am from New Zealand and have lived in Australia’s major cities , I have lived in Malaysia and am now living in Beijing China, it’s the same wherever you go (if you get in) try challenging the service you are using , you might be surprised, most of theser people are really testing you.
October 28, 2017 at 10:18 pm
Looks can be deceiving ( About IRAN ) , you can find beautiful scenery , we really love tourist and you can enjoy your traveling ,your claim is incapable of proof !!! i think your evidence of this article is full of errors and you need more study and investigate. put yourself to the prooof
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:28 am
you are 100% correct, Iran has history, nice, welcoming people and places like Shiraz, Isfahan ect ect are unforgettable ! Have toured twice, wish to go back.
October 28, 2017 at 10:49 pm
You are really right! Asian is highly discriminated when come to visa for overseas travel. In Laos, it takes months before application would be accepted or decline by embassies especially the USA, Australia, Canada etc. However, to get Lao visa might be relatively easy but, be warned, to say in Laos is another story. Check with your embassy website before making a move.
November 2, 2017 at 6:37 pm
Pirates were eradicated and now it is a safe place. you have to know that somali people are smart and they greatly welcome to
October 28, 2017 at 11:08 pm
This article assumes we are American. I am English and have lived and worked in 4 countries in your list. OK, I had to get sponsored etc. but didn’t have any problems.
SA says:
October 28, 2017 at 11:46 pm
10 Million Expats are currently living in Saudi Arabia, almost living in their home country. I think you need to redo your homework again.
david says:
December 2, 2017 at 10:11 pm
expats living in saudi arabia? are you kidding me? .99% of foreigners in saudi arabia are poverty stricken asians that go there to work and are treated like near slaves by their employers. there are documentries about how many of these so called employees return to their native countries in a box. im a expat that spends a lot of time in panama and costa rica. dont even need a visa.. stay in panama for 6 months without applying for a visa. all they ask is prove you can leave. and most of the time. they dont even ask that.
October 28, 2017 at 11:52 pm
Pirates were eradicated and now it is a safe place. you have to know that somali people are smart and they greatly welcome to the foreignness.
November 1, 2017 at 6:39 am
that is true actually somali is safe only some parts are not safe
John Mikail says:
November 5, 2017 at 10:55 am
Yes, the tourists are welcomed in Somalia with explosive belts & machine guns. Are you kidding?
January 10, 2018 at 12:58 pm
I fully agree. Thailand is a lovely country. If you are nice and respectful, people are nice too. I have been there several times and always love to visit again. As a european i have been discriminated much more in the US , but never in Thailand. Go to Thailand and enjoy! Like everywhere else, if you are looking for trouble you will find it!
October 29, 2017 at 2:06 am
….and the question is, Why?
Whocares says:
October 29, 2017 at 2:13 am
That’s for the warning about these countries , fact is why the hell would I want to goto most of them in the first place utter shite holes
November 28, 2017 at 11:00 pm
Your superior ignorance is showing.
Someone says:
October 29, 2017 at 4:01 am
I agree with the commenters who say that the writer of this article has no clue and has probably never travelled anywhere except the West. Most of what he says seems to apply to AMERICAN travellers, who find it more difficult and pricely to get visas into many countries than anyone else from the WEST. I’m Western, too (Australian) but I’ve lived and travelled everywhere since babyhood. The only country I’d not be able to get a visa for is North Korea (but that applies to almost everyone; even Mainland Chinese can seldom be allowed there). In my case as an Australian, I’d be able to get a transit visa for Saudi with just an inexpensive letter of introduction from my consulate, and since I”m a female, a letter from a male relative (if I were a male, I’d not need the latter). But many countries require similar types of documents to obtain their visas, and yes, it is true that the article is only geared towards Westerners: Asians and people (even wealthy, well established people) from Asia, Africa and most non-British-Commonwealth less developed countries find it very very difficult to get Western visas, and YES, THE US TOPS IT FOR DIFFICULT ENTRIES, EVEN FOR ITS SO-CALLED WESTERN ALLIES. Although I’m Australian and grew up in Canada, I was once threatened to be put under police surveillance in a locked room at the airport when I was travelling in transit to Mexico with absolutely no desire at all to leave the airport or spend any time in the US: I was ONLY there to change flights after a brief wait. Fortunately, the official in LA immigration did not after all enforce this rule, but this depended upon the whim of the official. Even then, for me to visit the US requires a great deal of rigmarol and red tape.
I’ve lived in Syria (just before the revolution: it was very easy to get in there without any visa sponsorship) and I have travelled in Iran, and I did both ALONE (I travelled to Syria from Greece by land via Turkey and crossed the Syrian border on foot. I was treated very well. Yes, there is a problem now with getting into Syria but there is a problem getting into ANY country which is having a current war or revolution. I lived in the Republic of Georgia and when I crossed into there from Turkey, the bus avoided one province and did the long way around (not because of me; almost everyone on the bus was Georgian and there were no other Westerners) but since the region was having a civil war and was unsafe. THAT is why you are not granted visas for places in crisis: for your OWN protection. Unless you’d like to get in there and be caught up in the crossfire, which is your own choice. I know a British man who travelled through Iraq on his own without incident during the Iraq War: he arrived at the border and was granted the visa after being warned that the region was at war and unsafe, when he insisted on the visa to pass through Iraq to the next country. He had done his research and just avoided certain areas.
For the idiots who say that these are all “bad countries” to visit, that is total bigoted apparently American, naive rubbish. I am very happy living in and travelling through most of these countries, happier in fact than in the West since they are so welcoming and group oriented, not cold and individualistic like many Western developed countries.
And about Iran, as an Australian it’s very easy, and cheap, to get the visa. Any police I encountered (including immigration police) were polite and kind, and I was very welcomed by the local people, and I travelled across the country ALONE AS A FEMALE.
And the silly person, David I believe, who posted the rubbish about Thailand is beyond naive. I”ve lived in Thailand (did part of my graduate degree there and also worked there). It was one of the nicest countries I’ve ever lived in and I’ve travelled the entire country ALONE. Yes, we are charged more than locals for certain things, but the prices are VERY low. We are charged more for economic reasons (the prices are so cheap for us). Sometimes I also paid local prices with the help of local friends who came with me when getting the tickets. For almost everything though I was charge local prices. And yes, this is the norm in many countries. As for being ripped off by taxis, that can happen in any less developed (and one developed and eastern globe) countries, but it’s NEVER happened to me in all the 60 countiries on every continent I’ve been to. Why? Since I’m not naive: I tell my price to the taxi drive BEFORE getting into the cab, and if anyone doesnt agree I find another cab. In the United Arab Emirates (it’s developed but taxi drives are mostly from less developed countries), if anyone tried to overcharge me by taking the long way around (there’s a meter in the cab) I’d just demand to be let out of the cab, not pay them at all, and get another cab. When one guy was reluctant to let me out of the cab, i called the police FROM the cab, and the guy freaked out and let me out instantly. And I’m a shy, polite young, attractive female, yet I’ve never had an issue. Oh, by the way, UAE, the country I’ve just mentioned is one of the SAFEST countries in the world, despite its name “Arab”. But most of these countries are very safe, and MUCH safer than the US, or Canada too for that matter. I’m always disoriented when I return to the West since I forget to protect myself (like not go out alone at night, etc etc).
And Viet Nam? The guy is an idiot. THAILAND is much more foreigner friendly than Viet Nam. Viet Nam will let you in with a very expensive visa, and will treat you like dirt from day one unless you take tours (which I never take). The local people push you off buses by hand and tell you “You’re rich, take a taxi” even if you are on a low budget. You have to pay to enter the country and again to leave. It’s all about money and they are a very harsh culture. Of course, the naive idiot, David I believe, who mentioned the place is no traveller, so if he was there, or knew someone who was, they were probably TOURISTS, not travellers, and they took taxis and tours like good little (and terrified) tourists who cant handle getting around on their own, so they didnt encounter the flack. But I was so relieved to get from Viet Nam back into China where I’d been living, and when I told the border police about it, they agreed that the place is abusive and that they have the same experience with them. Although I did make friends with a former Vietnamese general who fought on the chinese side during the Viet Nam war, and when I was with him I was treated well by locals.
If you dont know anything about the world, don’t write articles on it and definitely DO NOT go posting rubbish here to scare other people. Get out of your ivory tower and find out what the world is really like, and then we’d be able to deal with the issue of American bully imperialism and the current regime there. Since all these things take place due to sheer anglo North American ignorance. We don’t need people posting FANTASY BASED negativity in order to get everyone stirred up for nothing.
OH about the higher prices, please recall that most less socialist Western countries (not some West European countries, though) charge DOUBLE their already exorbitant fees to foreign university (including graduate) students, including all those from less developed countries, in order it seems to force only the rich to be able to study in their countries. Less developed countries when they charge Westerners more do it since we can actually pay the prices (which are very low anyway). But the West does it since they selfishly wish to get even richer than they are. And to racistly reduce whom they allow into their countries (the wealthier from less developed countries also tend to be more “Westernized”).
Someone Else says:
October 31, 2017 at 3:03 am
“total bigoted apparently American, naive rubbish”
Hypocrite. Your blind hatred for my country is real. You sound an awful lot like the moron that posted this article. But I guess that’s okay, as long as your rant fits your own prejudice, yeah?
Good luck in life..
Akam Adah says:
November 26, 2017 at 11:33 am
Nigeria is a better place to visit,so u can come and enjoy yourself
December 12, 2017 at 2:20 am
Yeah Adah true with Nigeria, but please try once with Ghana…..”Akwaaba”
November 1, 2017 at 8:21 am
November 8, 2017 at 4:47 pm
“Asians and people (even wealthy, well established people) from Asia, Africa and most non-British-Commonwealth less developed countries find it very very difficult to get Western visas,”. This statement is not always the truth. I am an Asian American, and I can say I was able to receive visitors from Asia without problems. In fact, the Immigration Officer at San Francisco International Airport “loves” my mother – an Asian lady (I am not mixed-blood). We are not wealthy people. You just have to have your travel documents in order. Every country has a protocol. Without a protocol, there is no country. I regret your experience in the U.S., who knows, you may have the wrong papers, and became a suspect. Believe me if you come from a sloppy/sleazy background, you are most likely picked out. Did you wear appropriate attire to begin with? I have met women from down-under on-board an aircraft wearing inappropriate clothing (i.e. no bra or with panty band showing above the back of their skirts). Makes me want to visit Australia, but, I won’t, even though it is visa-free. *
Forget about the Vietnamese General. Even a Vietnamese Lance Corporal would fancy you since you look far different from them.
*I heard there is quite a bit of racism in Australia?,,,,from Asian immigrants. Pity.
January 7, 2018 at 6:28 pm
And you know women in a lot of countries wear inappropriate attire doesn’t mean it is a reflection on everyone in Australia. Bit of a narrow view don’t you think. So you don’t want to visit Australia? Pity( uttered with sarcasm)
peoplepostbigotedshit says:
November 12, 2017 at 9:44 am
Iran welcomes all travelers but political relations is another thing and it is very difficult for Americans to get visas.
@ someone Actually, what you say is not true about Vietnam. The visa is 25 usd and i found the people very welcoming. They do not treat you like dirt. None of what you said was even remotely true. Maybe you showed a lack of respect for the culture as I had locals walk me across the street, seal up my wounds, fix my motorbike for no cost.Walk me to the cheap streetfood places. Please do not spread lies about a very nice country.
And PJ, London. The british don’t have the best stereotypes either. Especially when they take the stag party to eastern Europe and leave a trail of destruction behind . Brits need an organized tour of Iran as well as do Canadians. Your border guards are not exactly nice either. Speak to people who have sat in the Heathrow holding cell for hours. I had issue in Israel and uK and do not blame the entire nations for the bordergaurds.
@brian, i traveled through Cambodia, Vietnam and Thailand and always had ice in my drinks. I never once had issues with food.
Pick says:
November 21, 2017 at 9:43 am
Thank you for your comments. I am Malaysian. The article is misleading. Thank you again.
Rog says:
November 23, 2017 at 2:20 am
Someone: as an American, like you, have traveled the world. I am currently in Vietnam.
When it comes to Vietnam you are as naive as Dave. Sorry, but I don’t agree with anything you’ve said about Nam. I have been in Ho Chi Minh city, can doa island and right now in rainy da Nang. I find the Vietnamese people gracious hosts and genuinely friendly. They are very eager to welcome me and help with any questions I have. Thailand is great too and is known as the land of smiles and I can easily say that applies to Vietnam too. I love nam and Thailand too. Vietnam also has one of the best cuisines in the world. I was just in Rome, and find Vietnamese food more flavourful than Italian and I love Italian. I would return here any day. I got an online visa for $28 usd. That included the fees, direct from the Vietnamese government website in one day. So it goes.
Mahdieh says:
November 23, 2017 at 2:34 am
Yes you are absolutely right.most of these rules are for taking care of visitors actually and they don’t hate foreigners at all!
November 26, 2017 at 1:53 am
Good analysis, am totally agreed to every insightful and objective analysis made by you. Thanks
November 28, 2017 at 1:08 am
Visas for Vietnam are easy, quick and cheap. I, a US citizen an veteran of “the American war”, have lived in VN 2004 to 2008 and have visited many times since. My only major complaint is they don’t have a retirement visa program, because I would retire there if it were feasible.
November 28, 2017 at 3:08 pm
As far as I know, you’re true about my country, Iran and also Thailand, because many Iranians travel to Thailand and I heard how good Thai is. Iran’s ancient locations, even to 800 hundreds years ago, people really love tourists, European, American or far east… Sea, desert, jungles, mountains, rivers, different animals, waterfalls… Everyone is invited by Iranian people. I hate politics, but we talk about tourism here. Looks like this writer has the article from white house, except Saudis of course who are a good buyer for US weapons, other countries are not submissive to US policies. I like peace and freedom and friendship all over the world
November 28, 2017 at 3:11 pm
I meant 800000 years ago or even more.
January 6, 2018 at 1:35 pm
November 28, 2017 at 11:11 pm
What ‘Someone’ said. ?
Moi says:
January 3, 2018 at 12:55 am
@ someone:your post is truly of great insight to me..’been reading your post over and again! True Inspiration..(I’m female too and you’ve just inspired me….GOD bless you!)
Someone says:
October 29, 2017 at 5:02 am
Charles, I agree with almost everything you say, but in fact West Europe, Australia and New Zealand are safer than Canada; I’m living in West Europe at the moment and when I’m in Canada I always have to “rethink” and be careful when going out alone after dark, not go to certain areas of the city, etc; situations I don’t have when anywhere else I’ve lived including the above mentioned places. But yes, Canada is definitely significantly safer than the US.
And yes, I definitely agree with Charles that this is right-winged manipulation, the same which is responsible for garnering American support so that the US can go and bomb more countries, making them then “unsafe for travel” at the time the are being attacked.
Dana, why do you go to “such places” if you look down on them so much. I’ve LIVED in many of these countries (I’ve lived in 16 countries in fact) and travelled through many more. I’ve only twice been in countries that were turnoffs, both of which were developed countries, and one which is the US.
If you are going to go dropping in on countries you look down on due to your indoctrination, I’d recommend using your money to go somewhere you’d actually like, such as Miami Beach. No one needs your negativity or bigotism.
November 28, 2017 at 11:17 pm
??Opinion expressed is that of an informed person.
Ian says:
January 15, 2018 at 2:59 pm
Hi Someone,
If you don’t already, I suggest you find a TV company to help you make documentaries. You seem to be so experienced and successful that you make Michael Palin and every travelling journalist, male or female, that has ever worked for the BBC, look like a moron. I’m in the UK, surprise surprise.
October 29, 2017 at 11:08 am
Lots of respectful people love to travel and know different cultures. As for you, just stay home then and keep your mouth shot and your keyboard idle, instead writing disrespectful and discriminative coments.
November 28, 2017 at 11:19 pm
??
October 29, 2017 at 3:09 pm
To be honest i am syrian and we love foreigners, however the conflict makes it hard to make tourism a thing, it is not that they hate foreigners.
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:35 am
when I toured Syria seven years ago I found nothing but : a lovely,safe and beaufiful contry.. My heart is sore for what happened. Syrian people did not deserve a war. At times I think USA who is exporting terror……..
October 30, 2017 at 2:31 am
travel to iran. then post this information. Iran is an amazing country with lovely people.. plz research more, about iran
November 29, 2017 at 3:04 pm
Friends of mine went to Iran as tourists , the only nuisance was the Chador she had to wear ( it was summertime ) all the time .
The people were friendly , ready to talk to forigners , curious about Europe , helpful , honest , and smiling , in spite of the heavy sanction which Europe has inposed on Iran .
The people have been more outstanding than historic memories, landscape and food .
By the way , they are Italians .
October 30, 2017 at 2:48 am
yeah. i think each country is beautiful in its way. we go and come and each of us has our own coment, but we should show our respect.
October 30, 2017 at 3:22 am
Many of US citizens now in Somalia, and traveling from USA to Somalia is not totally see traveling that’s the reality not your sh**t publish
October 31, 2017 at 2:06 pm
Many US Citizen in Somalia now..
October 30, 2017 at 3:31 am
It baffles me that in this century, some countries still prefer to be Island to themselves. Travelling is part of education and relationships are built up by individuals and governments. It is barbaric to make visits to other countries a bottleneck in as much as such visitors are prepared to visit legally with adequate documentations. The world is now a global village and one may like to experience what has been heard or read and also know about the topography of such countries. Unless there are some nasty things in such countries that they are holding to their chests visits to other countries is of much benefit for such countries. This article is very educative. Thank you.
Maria says:
October 30, 2017 at 5:34 am
Add South Africa to the list. 55 murders a day.
November 22, 2017 at 12:19 am
January 7, 2018 at 6:45 pm
Yes I’ve been to South Africa on two occasions and as a woman it was not safe. CapeTown is a beautiful city scenery wise but I won’t be going back there
October 30, 2017 at 7:31 am
I have been to Cuba 9 times. It is a friendly and kind Country ; while the tourists live better than the common people; but that is the same with many other Tourist Destinations yes even USA.
I look forward to going to Iran in the future when time permits.
I never feel in danger in Cuba ; but when I visit many USA States I feel imminent danger and keep to my hotel complex…but there are some very nice places in USA as well.
October 30, 2017 at 9:16 am
December 8, 2017 at 12:19 am
William: Yes, you are correct but it is impossible to have an un-biased opinion. Any author is going to write from their own perspective whether they are Asian, American, European or any other nationality.
I’m English and have travelled widely and never experienced half of the problems that have been listed here.
Most of what Someone wrote is quite true apart from Vietnam. She obviously had a bad experience here and so her article is biased.
Any article by anybody is going to be subjective and should be read that way.
George says:
October 30, 2017 at 9:31 am
then after all the solution is just one–>visit Greece
the country discovered hospitality and gave democracy and civilization to
the rest of the world.
Safe country,reasonable prices and all r welcome here.
Find yrself in a safe atmosphere ,visit as many islands u can and discover
the spirit of ancient Greece,you ll find very interesting the local kitchen among other
things.
Take care all of you….
Selim says:
November 28, 2017 at 2:01 am
With regard to Greece,
A total rip-off. I would never recommend it to anyone. It has to be one of the most corrupt countries in the world, and very dangerous, like Nigeria. My long experiences in visiting over 60 countries, I am 72 and very well traveled: these two are the most dangerous and corrupt countries, and should be number one and two on your list. Compared to Greece, their neighbors are fantastic, cheap and very friendly countries, like Macedonia, Turkey, Malta, and Italy. You can say the same for Nigeria. Nigeria’s neighbors are very friendly, cheap and beautiful countries to visit, like Cameroon, Ghana and Senegal. Take care and think very well before visiting any one of them: Nigeria and Greece
olu says:
December 9, 2017 at 9:17 am
Many foreigners currently working working in Lagos Nigeria were scared before coming but now they don’t want to go back. some have been in the country for 10 -20 years. They tell their friends back home not to come yet they refused to leave. An expatriate once told me he advised his friends back home not to visit Nigeria to reduce competition………. Nigeria is a massive country with people of kind heart. Like in any country, even America, you can get ripped off by taxi men, and that can now be eliminated with the advent of UBER and Taxify.
Malanding says:
December 16, 2017 at 3:39 am
Hey how about in the west Africa the Gambia?
January 10, 2018 at 8:47 pm
This post is biased and certainly untrue. Greece is a jewel, i do not need to defend.
Ian says:
January 15, 2018 at 3:07 pm
Yiorgos I agree! Greece is the nicest country I have ever visited and the Greeks are lovely people. I wish I could afford to retire there. The only bad thing is that the Drachma has gone :O(
Reza says:
October 30, 2017 at 2:08 pm
The post is biased
October 30, 2017 at 3:00 pm
Only to remark that restrictions to visit Cuba is for US citizens and comes from the USA regulations not from Cuba.
October 30, 2017 at 4:45 pm
Well Saudi Arabia has more visitors more than any other country annually why would people be selfish if that’s so what about isreal, Us, UK, Ukraine etc with their resist ideology??
Ian says:
January 15, 2018 at 3:21 pm
Saudi Arabia has very few true visitors. Those large numbers it does have are only there for religious reasons, the Hajj. They go once in their lives because their religion tells them that they have to, not because they want to. Saudi also beheads more people per year than ISIS has ever done.
October 30, 2017 at 5:10 pm
We don’t need approvals from Americans to be a good place. You need a fooking visa to visit Algeria or Cuba..
May the writer be right when it comes to Libya and Ksa.. however one things is sure we don’t need your money or mass- tourism /bikinis to live and therefor we don’t eat maccdos ( cheap food)
Selim says:
November 28, 2017 at 2:16 am
It is unfair to make opinions regarding countries, that the owner of the comment has never visited. I have been vising Algeria for over 40 years, on and off, and it has to be one of the most friendly, fantastic and beautiful countries in the world. Algeria is a very modern and democratic country in fact. It has a tremendous richness in history and culture, from Roman ruins, in all its coastal cities to palaces from the Ottoman period, mountains, with pine forests, beautiful beaches and deserts of the romantic Sahara. Officials are very friendly, the food is some of the best in the world, from Berber, Arabic, Turkish, to French and Italian, you will always find what you would like to eat, including fresh fish, lamb, chicken, pigeon, and beef. The prices are some of the cheapest in the world. The restaurants are some of the best I have ever eaten. The hotels are also reasonable and the country is very clean. Highly recommended for any vacation. Also, Algeria has an excellent economy and a very brisk business environment. Just one visit and you will be presently surprised and it will be one of your favorite countries in the world.
Ian says:
January 15, 2018 at 3:26 pm
Selim, thank you. I have never visited Algeria but I have always wanted to. Your description is very accurate I think. It is so close to Southern Europe and easy to get to. I will go there when I can, hopefully quite soon. Thanks again!
Bou says:
November 30, 2017 at 8:36 pm
You saying you don’t need money? From where your money is coming then? Open the tourism and apply good rules and your country will florish.
brian says:
October 30, 2017 at 5:17 pm
Look as though when one disagrees with “DAVID” over Thailand one’s posts get deleted or removed. I have lived in Thailand for over two decades what DAVID quotes is completely unbalanced and untrue. Simply looks like the usual “sound bites” that are banded about in certain “falang” establishments in Pattaya, Soi Cowboy, Nana or Soi Seven or simply copied from postings on TEAK DOOR or the postbag section of the Bangkok Post. Utter rubbish Thailand is no worse or better than any other “tourist” destination for ‘rip offs’. Stay SOBER, keep alert as one would on any foreign travel destination and one will have a fantastic experience of a lifetime!
Mel says:
October 30, 2017 at 6:05 pm
I’d rather travel to any of these 10 countries than to the US. Yes, I’ve been there before. Horrible place. Can’t control their guns. And what’s with this orange president? If more US citizens took the time to learn about the rest of the world, they’d probably be welcomed in more places.
Lee says:
January 5, 2018 at 5:25 pm
Can’t agree more. Americans should start asking themselves why they were treated like that when the rest of the world were not. And that their opinion does not represent the universe.
American people is lovely and warm however sometimes they need to learn more about the world outside and widen their perspective. And oh, when you want to be welcomed, you should do the same. Visiting US is not easy either.
Larry Grayson says:
October 30, 2017 at 7:40 pm
How insightful putting countries that are a war zone. It must have taken a degree in rocket science to work that out. Remarks above about Thailand: it is actually an easy and great place to visit (if you’re going to not go there because of the government then you may as well boycott most of the world – USA has an unofficial policy of shooting black people, Australia keeps refugees in off shore concentration camps etc, etc.). Of course you can ripped off in some areas, especially if you have a indulge in prostitution, but that’s common in lots of countries and if you have a modicum of common sense you will be fine and enjoy a very friendly people.
yogesh says:
October 30, 2017 at 8:22 pm
An Indian here.. The author is absolutely wrong about Iran.. Currently in Iran on business.. Fantastic country, fantastic people, great food, great weather… Everything needed to visit a country… Not sure what is author is going about.. Do not believe the western media talking trash about Iran… Come over and experience a great culture and great people…
pooria says:
October 30, 2017 at 9:52 pm
this article is not true . we like peoples that comes from other countries and surely we hostess them warmly.Iran is big country that you can find history of it in all cities so you can easily come here .
Danny says:
October 31, 2017 at 12:26 pm
You may qualify for a discount on return fare to Iran and several of the other countries if you take your own body bag with you for your return flight.
Arman says:
November 21, 2017 at 9:52 am
Hahaha really funny. I mean really, what do you think about Iran? You think the people and the police are trying to the terror you or something? Wow, some people are just too close-minded
shayan says:
December 7, 2017 at 2:57 pm
i moved from iran to uk 4 years ago and honestly i wouldn’t travel there if i were u. people in iran are mean no matter what they think about themselves.
Yvonnick says:
October 30, 2017 at 9:53 pm
Proof of accommodation, return plane ticket, proof of purpose of your visit, security background checks, proof of knowing someone in the USA…. Visiting the USA for foreign tourist has also become a nightmare deterrent for any one who just wish to visit and see different culture. Every country has its own restrictions, sad for the citizen of the world.
seyyed mossa madani says:
October 30, 2017 at 11:33 pm
Hi,I am very sorry for you.
you are very bad judgment about Iranian and so on…
My Dear, please more study subject’s nation Iranian and their behavior against other people.
please, spread friendly sentences about Iranian and so on.
We don’t forgot impose war at last 30 years that, your government help our enemy.
we don’t forgot your first government occupy united state violently and how make your nation on motherland’s Indian ,your governments make houses themselves on blood’s Indian.
Please more study about your nation government.
kamran says:
October 30, 2017 at 11:44 pm
you guys are totally wrong, which one of you have been recently in Iran? None of your saying is true here . please do not mislead others by your comment. You don’t know Iran as well ! so please don’t judge the book!
Iran is a one of the biggest country in the region , a four season country , hospitable people , well known for everybody please get back to the history. I am not talking about politics either power, no!
I am talking about familiarity with Iran itself. The nature of Iran , landscapes , sceneries , waterfalls , mountains, flats, north of the Iran is known for “green belt” you won’t believe unless you come and visit us . surely we will welcome you.
November 20, 2017 at 3:24 am
Iranian food is amazing and the people are gorgeous
January 10, 2018 at 8:58 pm
Unfortunately many Americans are ignorant and often naive. Donald Duck Trump is not by accident there. This is what Americans deserve.Sad but true. Look at there comments on countries like Iran, Thailand, Cuba, and believe what i am saying. Let the lions roar…
Evan says:
October 31, 2017 at 2:11 am
Many countries policies make it difficult for people to visit, which is often a different story once there. Some countries are easy to reach but hard to navigate (culture shock, attitude of locals towards visitors), and some are very hard to reach (visa conditions) but easy to navigate. It all depends where you are coming from or going to, and perhaps both. Cuba’s information is specifically mentioning Americans; the US government has everything to do with that but in no way it is a reflection of how Cuba receives all visitors. Though some of these countries may be worth visiting in one way or another, for the average traveler, most are no attractive or if they are it is for a specific reason, such as Canadians hooked on Cuba because it is the cheapest Caribbean destination and offers warm weather during the long Canadian winters.
Only savvy, expert and perhaps risky travelers will visit Somalia, or Iran, for example. It makes it all the less attractive when some policies are completely out of touch with the current market reality, such as one requiring to have an airline ticket (what if your visa is not approved? Airline tickets are non-refundable in most cases). So save yourself the trouble if Saudi Arabia does not seem to want you, or the US, or Angola. The world is a big place with a lot to see and most likely, even in the best financial position, you will not have the time to see it all.
If you are an average traveler, take this site for what it is worth, a fishing site looking for you to buy stuff through ads by luring users in with information that’s been given elsewhere with less overhead.
October 31, 2017 at 3:56 am
You’ve missed out The USA – their visa regulations are ridiculous and they’re even talking about building a friggen wall for ffs!
November 5, 2017 at 2:23 pm
and racism is rampant, over all since this new clown of an ignorant president, there are shootings and crazy people that can run you over for nothing…
October 31, 2017 at 4:31 am
Misleading article maybe it should be called “Countries that don’t want you to visit, if you’re a US Citizen.
November 1, 2017 at 8:44 am
It would be much easier to list the countries that DO want US citizens to visit.
–
Danny says:
October 31, 2017 at 12:18 pm
I think North Korea should be removed. Not from this list, just the face of the earth as POTUS suggested.
Rith says:
November 24, 2017 at 7:00 am
Mike says:
November 27, 2017 at 4:52 pm
North Korea is indeed a basket case, but so is that arsehole Trump.This Brit won’t be going to the USA till that prick is locked up.
October 31, 2017 at 12:56 pm
I think personal experiences isn’t really the point of this article. Tourists are going to face discrimination in most countries period. Higher fees, ripping off, and not speaking English is normal in any non English speaking country. After all, ur going on a vacation for fun and spending money, means u have excess money in comparison to people of many of these countries with poor people who work everyday just to be able to have one meal a day. It’s also normal in English speaking countries that those people don’t go out of their way to welcome tourists either. This article is really speaking about political climates and tensions between various countries and the US specifically that prevent people from traveling there, the governements. It’s not about the people that live there, most of them have little say in what the government does. Rather it’s about the about the procedures and time it takes to be able to even allowed to visit. The countries listed here make it waaaay harder for tourists to visit than most Asian countries do. Asian countries (except NK) don’t require you to stay in ur designated tourist spots and hotels all. You have freedom to do what you want. You just have to be a smart experienced traveler to avoid being ripped off.
October 31, 2017 at 1:01 pm
Such a lot of HOGWASH as I was born in Mauritius , lived in South Africa. Australia, USA, and now Mexico and have spent a great week in CUBA
I can assure one and all that you will feel as threatened as you want to feel and you will see crimes where you look for them
I had a wonderful wonderful week in Cuba and was always well received and treated wherever I went as I wasn’t looking for the bad things one hears about Cuba but was there to interact with the Cubans listening to their great music and enjoying their food and fun and if ever I were to receive a fully paid trip anywhere in the world I would choose Cuba without a doubt
October 31, 2017 at 2:47 pm
Top tip for American travellers. “Pretend that you are Canadians” (of course you will find that very difficult as you have to be polite and pleasant)
The fact is that no-one, that is right No-one wants Americans.
As a Brit, I have been welcomed in two of the countries mentioned and about 13 others. Only ever had problems when American colleagues travelled with me.
I will never travel again to the USA, the most ill-mannered and despicable customs and border personnel. You may enjoy being teated as a criminal, it only ever happened to me in US (twice).
So please Yankee go home and stay there, all others welcome.
Ugo says:
November 20, 2017 at 11:38 am
lot of ignorant people in the USA : yes border control at times can be harsh, the officers think they are demi-gods…..
December 2, 2017 at 12:48 pm
Hi Traveller, I agree with you 100% if I took in everything that I read that is published by western governments I’d still be in London sitting in front of the fireplace, instead I follow my own mind and travel wherever takes my fancy, I may have ever had only one regret and that is not starting to travel much sooner, I have been to some beautiful places and met some great people, I wish I could continue to do this for another 50 years, but I’ve found a nice beach house that is open for all my extended family to have a taste of the good life, I don’t miss England at all because when I do visit I can only last a week before I feel the need to go fishing in the Indian Ocean, plus I miss picking my own mango and coconut first thing in the morning, life is about being happy so I can’t understand why people ask me what I get out of living a stress free life, they should try it.
david says:
December 2, 2017 at 10:25 pm
judging people from where they come from is what bigots do. im a polite person with a usa passport. i have anglo features. im treated well in panama and all of latin america. only a bigot would say we dont like you based on your passport.
October 31, 2017 at 4:46 pm
The only country on the list I would be tempted to visit is Cuba and that wouldn’t be a problem since in addition to being an American citizen I also have Panamanian citizenship. So I would travel to Cuba using my Panamanian passport. Right now I am in the Dominican Republic so Cuba is not that far away. Also the USA is not that easy to visit if you are from most countries in the world.
November 1, 2017 at 1:35 am
This list is based on the American Traveller point opf view. Why would anyone want to travel to those countries anyway. Those are not favourite destinations in the world. it is only Americans that are interested in going to these places for only God know why.
For me the first on the list should be the United States.
November 1, 2017 at 8:27 am
please consider that this nomination in depends on some different points.
I swear we have all and more than in IRAN. its really unfair nomination to put iran in this list. you can find no one that had been traveled to iran and regretted . complexity between governments should not keep away people from each other.
I’m an Iranian and I’m proud of my nationality . I recommend to all that give this chance for a once to themselves for visit our country.
Anon E Mous says:
November 1, 2017 at 9:36 am
There are far more than 10 countries that I would not go to unless God specifically told me to go there!
Anon E Mous says:
November 1, 2017 at 9:45 am
For instance, like Jonah, God would have a hard time getting me to Nineveh ( Iraq)!
November 1, 2017 at 1:20 pm
your artical is full of sheet. do your resurch befor you say anythings , am sorry to say that …. befor you mention algeria ,check with your gouvrnmets why they imposed visa with ticket reservation and hotel booking and bank statment in local currency and euro ,plus work paper and holiday statment mentioned start and finish date and somtimes stupid question on the forms like HOW MANY TIMES A WEEK YOU EAT MEET AND FRUIT . .so be fair and squar same goes for any country ask visa for algerians passport holder they get treted the same viseversa , so don`t excpet to be superiour that other nations ….
Max says:
November 1, 2017 at 2:57 pm
American brothers and sisters, don’t go to any Latin, Arab or African Country, and of course, North Corea.. is what i can say, no security at all. Just a waste of time.
November 1, 2017 at 2:59 pm
Agree with most here. And…The number 1 country that doesn’t want visitosterol is the US since Trump. We wanted to fetch a client’s car in California in march. When I found out they want 2x 200 dollars entrance fee plus a lot of red tape we abandoned the idea.
My passport is European .I have been to Algeria and there is no hassle with a visa. I have also been to Cuba and wish to go again. So has my Costa Rican business partner. . It is actually easier to fly to Cuba than to the US.
Ps visitors from the US pay zilch to enter our country, please do the same for us.
Shee says:
November 1, 2017 at 3:24 pm
I can not take this article serious. They are spreading lies for at least 4 of these countries. I am actually AMERICAN and residing in Iran right now as we speak. Teaching English. So, please tell me where they don‘t want Americans? They love Americans, just not the American politics. But then again, most Americans don’t even like the politics. Also, the mention of Angola is false. The mention of Algeria is false. I also Saudi Arabia.
November 1, 2017 at 4:42 pm
Add Hong Kong to the list, really expensive, taxi drivers that take you wherever they want and charge what they want, if you don’t like it, step out of the taxi in the middle of nowhere, even raining !, they seem not to know addresses, hotels or english !!, when they want to rip you off they start speaking cantonese.
Brian says:
November 1, 2017 at 5:27 pm
Re Davids comments on double pricing in Thailand. Lived here for two decades or more personally I have never had this problem. However when it does occur keep thing in perspective one is probably talking about a couple of pounds or around three dollars. One also must remember that Thai’s earn considerably less than those who live in the west in Thailand a “good’ wage is on average THB15,000 (£350) PER MONTH even for professions in banks and medical services. The average factory or farm worker is usually on THB300 (£7:50) or less PER DAY. As for taxi’s from the airport to central Bangkok (about 23 miles) the average charge is THB400 to THB500 (£12) try taking the same journey in London (gold card job). One can even splash out on an airport limousine for about THB1,200 (£28) for the same journey. As for eating out it is a really great experience however yet again one must remember “etiquette” is totally different in the east to the west however there are plenty of KFC’s, McDonalds etc who would welcome people like David. Admittedly some Thai foods I simply do not like (pure personal choice) but the range of aromas, tastes and varieties available at very low prices in a THAI eatery is fantastic especially when one leaves the “tourist traps” behind. Explore live a little and you will enjoy THAILAND. One important piece of advice though when eating out NEVER HAVE ICE IN YOUR DRINKS (as one never knows it’s origin) biggest cause of stomach problems throughout the Far East.
November 5, 2017 at 11:04 pm
As someone who has lived in Thailand for 30 yrs, I think your remarks are nieve to say the least. Thailand is a very nationalistic country, and when combined with the rampant corruption, then it’s easy to understand why many, but not all, Thais considered Europeans as an easy source of money, usually obtained by one form of con or another.
You also forgot to mention that approximately 10 million Thais ( the so- called elite ) that are fabulously rich. Far more so than most visitors to Thailand. Just ask the very wealthy military P.M
November 10, 2017 at 10:37 pm
“One important piece of advice though when eating out NEVER HAVE ICE IN YOUR DRINKS (as one never knows it’s origin) biggest cause of stomach problems throughout the Far East.”….nearly correct, that is, it is safe to have ice while in Singapore. Singapore’s tap-water is portable. Another food hazard … fresh salad. There is a joke..it can’t be fresher. Take along some anti-diarrhea pills and one roll of toilet paper* to be safe while traveling in the region!!
*toilet paper is not available in most public loos, unless in an up-class shopping mall. If out of luck, you have to wash it off with a hose (typically provided, attached to a faucet).
Earle says:
December 24, 2017 at 5:05 am
Well you are correct on most of your comments, but the ice thing is wrong…having lived and travelled to most provinces in Thailand for the past 12 years, l never have had a problem from ice in drinks…cannot be just luck!
amir says:
November 2, 2017 at 2:43 am
Iran, Iran ,Iran is greate country and greate people. the only problem is, hospitality of iranian(سپاه) may cause , never let you come back to your country. like Nazinin saghari,
Meli says:
November 2, 2017 at 3:26 pm
Cuba loves tourists! you only have to pay a visa at the airport, not sure if this is from the perspective of an USA citizen but the rest of the world is more than welcome, don’t expect modern services but expect a wonderful experience in this country that is very safe to travel , they look after tourist very well ; but do not challenge authorities cause they don’t take brats very well. so be respectful, cautious and enjoy! as a solo lady traveler the rest of the countries listed have never been in my interest.
November 2, 2017 at 4:42 pm
Algeria??!!!!!!! All EU, US, CA, Aus. and NZ have the same visa requirements for visitors from outside these countries (Asian & African) !! How do you feel when a country from the “other side of the world” treat you the same? No bad intention, but it is a “policy of similar treatment” that such countries follow.
Besides, this article is for Americans who like to travel, it is not a general one.
Sara says:
November 3, 2017 at 5:55 am
I think all countries are worth visiting … I dont know why we are not kind to eachother ….just think about these comments that some of them how terrible they are…we cant judge countries based on our bad experiences.
Carl says:
November 3, 2017 at 6:08 am
While aa lot of what u say “might” be true a non US individual I think USA could be added to the list as well?. As many of the reasons cited for other countries apply to visiting the USA as well. Exorbitant visa fees with no guarantee of acceptance, intrusive information on financial standing and statement on all assets own, evidence of where u will be staying and ability to pay, police records and professional background, ginger print and other such information. And after all these requirements you can be denied entry simply because some one is not satisfied that u have enough ties to your family, your newly wed wife of 2years, your newborn child, your two jobs your new home. So even though your own parents are US citizens you are still denied entry to attend your uncle’s funeral who helped to raise you. So yes I don’t think when you are required to do the same as you ask that criticism should be levelled at these countries. Not to mention the prejudice that is experienced by many when they visit.
Let’s level the playing field then criticize. From one who is on the other side.
David says:
November 3, 2017 at 7:38 am
Cuba actually has a thriving tourist industry. Amazing all inclusive resorts all over the country. And Americans are very welcome. It’s the USA that forbids Americans from traveling there. Most Americans travel to Cuba from Mexico or Canada. And get this: The Cubans are kind enough not to stamp the entry into your passport to save you the hassle of explaining it back in the USA. They will stamp a separate piece of paper for you to carry with you.
November 3, 2017 at 4:36 pm
yes, you should not even think to visit these places and I will add also
you can see them all on ‘youtube’, safely at your sofa with a glass of wine !
November 3, 2017 at 7:16 pm
What about USA and Australia they should be on the list
November 3, 2017 at 10:53 pm
The various comments showed so much lack of understanding about the gist of the article. I found only one comment from one Sunny to be forthrightly logical and unbiased.
By the way, it surprises me, why is there an assumption that it is an American right wing biasper se? Not that I am an American. All peoples have their own kind of discrimination wherever you go. People must be closing their eyes or are completely naive, or totally lie about their own discriminate attitude, if they don’t understand that. Or that they may not have seen or experienced it first hand. That is a reality, accept it or not.
Let us take the article for what it proposed to share, nothing discriminatory as perceived.
November 4, 2017 at 12:23 am
saudi ppl will not give a f**k of what you saying about their country and they still gonna welcome you.
Hannah says:
November 4, 2017 at 1:55 am
unbelievably incorrect information !!! Iran requires these conditions for Americans since they do the same to us! tourists use couchsurfing and also homestay easily in Iran. you can get visa just when you arrive at the airport here, without any additional information which other countries requires for Iranians.
please do not write what you are not sure!
Barry says:
November 4, 2017 at 2:41 am
All hail to the great American Empire which dictates what people think, thanks to its very powerful MSM. Great is the American Empire value system which promotes peace and love, by any means necessary, and if you don’t like it, they’ll just kill you.
Ali says:
November 4, 2017 at 3:06 am
Iran is not only dangerous but also a secure and beautiful country with very kind and hospitable people whome will tell welcome to anyone who want to visit the country as a tourist. I am sure your knowledge is very little about Iran that say so!
isagani hernandez says:
November 4, 2017 at 5:11 am
I dont think that saudi arabia is a country that dont like tourist.
KSA has Hadj…a pilgrimage that is required for every muslim in the world..
.take note…in the world…how many billions of muslim are allowed to make pilgrimage to Mecca…as long as they can afford finacially…for working class citizen,,,there are ample of oppurtunity for skilled men…..
November 4, 2017 at 10:26 am
With so much trouble and danger, I will not visit them even if they are free
November 4, 2017 at 10:22 pm
Add La Republique du Cameroon. Gross human rights violations, abductions, torture, extra-judiciary killings. Torture of war criminals and innocent citizens. Just ask UN and State Department about Southern Cameroons and severe torture of Boko haram prisoners. Boycott this nation completely.
November 5, 2017 at 2:01 pm
Somalia is peace
November 5, 2017 at 2:19 pm
“10 Countries that don’t want U.S. Americans to visit” is a more correct headline
Mahmood Abi says:
November 6, 2017 at 1:16 am
This article is meant only for citizens of United States of America. For it is impossible for a Pakistani to visit America.
November 6, 2017 at 3:47 pm
It’s never been easier to get a 15 days or even 3 weeks tourist visa straight from Tehran airport…
From all the countries I visited Iran was the most warm and welcoming, and also the safest.
It completely blew up all expectations, it’s amazing how medias and governments are trying to make you swallow anything about Iran…
November 6, 2017 at 7:13 pm
Nigeria is best country with lovely people
Ralph says:
November 6, 2017 at 7:32 pm
Holy shit, other than Cuba, I wouldn’t want to visit any of the other nine douche holes even if all my expenses were paid!! What a totally stupid and laughable article to state the very least, come on Syria, where they still have a civil war raging, Iran, etc., lol!!!
November 6, 2017 at 8:49 pm
When you are in Rome…do as the romans do…. ever heard of that ? It works so well for all.
November 6, 2017 at 9:15 pm
Anyone who voluntarily steps foot into anyone of these countries is an idiot and deserves whatever happens to them.
bash says:
November 7, 2017 at 12:55 am
good i am a somalian citizen it is true we have pirates and tourists all over the country but this doen’t mean we hate visitors. it means we don’t want to risk their lives and their wealth so untill we have full full guartee to your lives stay away from somalia. but we have the best places to visit. we love theworld and the good people but not pirates andtourists we also love our children wake up and go to school to learn as u do.
November 7, 2017 at 1:56 am
While writing an article you should have considered other nationalities problem as well, Like as US citizen the way that you have some difficulties while getting a Visa from above-mentioned 10 countries, remember that traveling to some countries are literally impossible for middle east nations.
Likewise, I have had an admission from Australia, paid to university any to my visa application in advance which is a nonrefundable fee in advance, spend a whole lot of money but at the end god a visa rejection with a very silly reason.
Plus, right now I have been granted a volunteering program in the Czech Republic, I have been asked to show proof of accommodation, buy the ticket in advance, show bank statement and much more.
So this is where the world is going nowadays, creating these kinds of nonsense problems for travelers is pretty common among highly profiled countries like USA, Australia etc.. and some other developing countries.
Ariel says:
November 7, 2017 at 7:36 am
That happens because of the criminal policy of the United States imperialist debloqueo against Cuba
Mark says:
November 7, 2017 at 8:24 am
As others have noted, Cuba welcomes visitors; the restrictions are from the U.S. You should definitely look at Equatorial Guinea. I have read about people working unsuccessfully for a year to get a visa. Also, Nepal is very restrictive (Not to mention hard to get to)
November 7, 2017 at 10:21 pm
a suggestion for the author don’t watch fox news before writing anything about Iran .Iran is a four season at a time country with kind people to foreigners and its very far from north korea or saudi arabia…
Richie says:
November 8, 2017 at 9:05 am
90% of the listed countries are enemies of USA not enemies of the world. Americans are selfish too, they believe that they control the whole world. Libya, Syria etc are in that state because of USA and allies. I can visit all the countries listed since I am not an American
November 8, 2017 at 3:23 pm
It’s an international problem, i.e. taxis. You just have to make sure a fixed price had been agreed upon if you suspect the meter is faulty or absent. I heard it is bad in Stockholm, Sweden; but so is Cusco, Peru; and on Bintang Is., Indonesia. Wait till you arrive in Cusco, Peru, and you will get a little surprise from the airport taxis. They are more expensive than a return from a Cusco hotel (arranged by the hotel management). On the other hand, I have had an interesting experience in S. Korea. My taxi driver forgot to turn on the meter (he was too taken away making negative comments about certain political figure during my Jan. 2009 visit to Incheon), and later estimated the fare, which to my surprise was much less than a metered one (on my return, I took another taxi with the fare meter in operation).
William Burrowes says:
November 8, 2017 at 3:40 pm
Mohrez nl says:
November 8, 2017 at 4:01 pm
I know you can’t experience of being or travelling in these countries but as a person who is living in IRAN I want u guys to know that’s not correct about my country
We love world and world is going to love the people of IRAN
To prove my sentences I invite u to my home and my magnificent country to feel it
And stop mixing politic issues with this kind of things
November 9, 2017 at 7:50 am
I just returned from Iran five days ago. It was a trip of a lifetime! I went with RoadScholar Tours, and we had 11 travelers, one tour escort from Turkey, and an Iranian tour guide (both wonderfu). Our tour guide was a walking encyclopedia. I felt like a celebrity, as when people saw me, when it was not obvious to them I was American, they asked where I was from. When I said USA, they smiled and said” Welcome!” . Everywhere we went, we were touched by the warm, friendly, and welcoming Iranians. One woman invited me to her home about a minute after I met her. Another young woman, who began talking to me in the main square in Qom, said to me, “I want to give you a gift”, and gave me the most beautiful ring off her finger! When we were taking photos, people would come up to us and ask to be in them and want photos of us, too. I was so touched by the love they expressed. They conveyed that our governments may be at odds, but it didn’t change the way they felt about us.
I have never seen so much beautiful art and architecture, and I have traveled the world. This is something that has to be seen. When we were in cities, we would never guess, if we didn’t know, that we were surrounded by desert–there is so much greenery: grass, trees (flowering and fruit), flower beds everywhere, sculptures at every intersection, wide streets. I could go on and on.
Add to all that the woderful food, and the excellent hotels, the safety of tourists, and you will have one of, if not THE, best trip you have every taken.
I had to apply for approval to get a visa, but that was no big deal. It just takes a little time, and the visas service companies do all the work. My advice is, if you want to go, go. You will not regret it.
November 10, 2017 at 10:11 pm
In regards to editing, you may want to change the title to something like: 10 countries that don’t want United States Americans to visit. This article is easily disappointing upon realization that is does not apply to those outside the borders of the United States, for whom it does not apply.
November 10, 2017 at 11:00 pm
As a Thai people , before now I always pickup hitchhike tourists , but now I rarely pick them up because many tourists were not friendly even they were in my car , when they leave my car some one didn’t even say thank you and slam my car door. I feel like I was a Taxi who made mistake.
Many foreigner insult Thai people. If possible please visit other countries that make you feel you come heaven.
Light says:
January 2, 2018 at 1:40 pm
i was very surprised when i saw all the hate about thailand but not everyone is the same of course there will always be rude people at some moments but not everyone is like that happily
November 11, 2017 at 2:15 am
Add Sri Lanka to your list it is more worst than the above 10.
Asal Soufi says:
November 11, 2017 at 4:39 am
Well i can say that its totally incorect about Iran , please do not say something when u dont have any idea how things are going in a country like iran , there are bunch of good people , they are helpful and really really hospitable . Im really sorry for you and your false informations .
David says:
November 11, 2017 at 8:09 am
How about USA? Their visa officer don’t even talk to you properly not explain their reason except handing out a piece of paper with enigmatic article reference (like you need to go to a library to read their immigration statutes… weird!! ). Not to mention the official umwelcoming rhetoric from Donald Trump! Ironically they keep handing out visa for terrorists & those who never come back to their countries.
November 12, 2017 at 2:23 am
hi I am from iran . this news is a untruthful… iran is very very good I am sorry for author
November 12, 2017 at 3:47 am
I am from iran.a iranian gril. We never ask you to come and visit us beacuse yoy are afraid of some thing wich is not excisting any more. You are just listening to your countris advertisments.go and ask from all those travlers who came hear,you will undrestand how my real iran looks like not like your imgination of my country my people.
Toga says:
November 12, 2017 at 7:07 am
Add India as well, mainly due rape attempts on female tourists by locals.
November 12, 2017 at 10:52 am
When I opened this file, I had expected the USA to be on the list – but now I realise it is being written by someone from the USA! It all depends on your perspective.
bill miller says:
November 12, 2017 at 10:58 am
Jamica its the people have a prison mentality and will rip u off
Dave says:
November 13, 2017 at 2:03 am
Why is England not on the List??
I mean come on! The English invented Discrimination.
I made the mistake in 2014 of coming back for a holiday and brought some foriegn friends with me. The moment they opened their mouths they were treated with distain and agression. Even from the Nationally challenged “Londoners” in Pyjamers and Turbans.
November 13, 2017 at 2:13 am
Iran is a good palce to visit
Ali says:
November 13, 2017 at 11:47 am
Iranians are people very warm Every tourist who travels to Iran speaks of different people. They say Iran and its people are different from the things we already heard. Iran is not like Iraq or even Afghanistan. Western politicians have made Iran very bad, and this is not true. Iranians are peaceful.
November 13, 2017 at 11:48 am
This article should be renamed as: “Countries that America doesn’t like”
You Americans always think you are the best place when you are actually one of the worst places in the world, I tried to travel to America but I was banned because I was Syrian, and before Trump became president, I traveled once and it was a pain just to pass through Airport security.
Besides you put some countries like Syria and Lybia and Somalia, and say they are not safe to go to, well that’s because of the WAR {I think you had to study 5 years of collage study for you Americans to realise that.} Ask yourself a question, do you think if you had war in your country, people would want to visit you, and do you think it will be easy or safe?? As for other contrived like Iran, you say it is bad to go to because of the recent conflict between America and Iran, so what, if America doesn’t like Iran, that doesn’t mean that it is dangerous or bad to go there, Iran is a beautiful place and the people are really kind!! Also, Syria is full of history from the Greek, Roman, Babylonian, and Phoenician times, but America history? Oops, no history. Did you know Mr.American that Damascus is one of the oldest capitals in the world? And about Cuba, you Americans don’t like it because there isn’t an American embassy there, for your information, it’s not only Americans who can travel, the WHOLE WORLD can travel, not only Americans so you can’t say it’s bad.
November 13, 2017 at 12:08 pm
Went to Australia. What stood out to me was the service. Went to a restaurant. Had to ask for water. Service was really slow. Food had no flavor. Went to liquor store. Handed me the bottle. I had to ask for bag. He had to look around for one.
November 13, 2017 at 1:49 pm
Its easy to get carried away with negativity when staying in foreign countries, like Philippines that Bobby mentioned. However this is the 2nd main phase all expats go through no matter where they are. The first phase is being over-enthusiastic about the place, praising the culture and the people, recommending all your fiends to go there and everything is just great. When you get into the second phase when everything is just bad try to remember what made you so enthusiastic to begin with, its the same place, your opinion is simply getting more seasoned as years go by and the recoil from the extreme enthusiasm you had can be very severe, especially if you sit and drink beer together with half-old expats, the topic of discussions will be overwhelmingly negative. Tell them “why are you still here, go back to your perfect country then”. And they would, the thing is just that Phil, Thai and Indonesia arent THAT bad, but the bad things always has priority in discussions between western men living in Asia.
November 13, 2017 at 3:45 pm
If you add Central and South America my “Feelings are Mutual List” is complete.
adda says:
November 13, 2017 at 5:32 pm
I find this article is only fir US citizens… I went 3 times to Iran and didn’t even need a visa… it’s a really lovely country with amazing food and welcoming people… this article isn’t really valid, in my experience
November 13, 2017 at 6:50 pm
You must be out of your mind or rather to say you do not even have mind to go to any one of these country ! I came from one of these shitty places and I know what I am talking about!! , 3rd world dangerous countries. Do not even think about it ok?? Even if one of these country offer you free plane ticket and visa. say no thank you. I do not think , you want to be kidnapped, robbed, rapped killed..etc in one of these very dangerous countries. do you?
November 14, 2017 at 12:37 am
This article should be retitled “10 Countries that are utterly sick and tired of relentless US imperialism and covert action since the end of WW2” If a country doesn’t want you to come to them, it may have something to do with the country that you are coming from. Iran is one of the most beautiful countries in the world with wonderfully hospitable people. Imagine how different their lives might have been if the Shah and his incredibly repressive regime had not been foisted on them by the Americans. There would possibly have been no Government of the Mullahs and perhaps no Iran / Iraq war. It is hardly surprising that Americans are not welcomed with open arms.
November 14, 2017 at 3:08 am
Having been to over 30 countries, I find people in most of them pretty disgusting. Thailand, Germany, France, Greece, Sri Lanka, Burma, Taiwan (super-racist). Europe? No way!
I wouldn’t consider North or South Korea, China, and there’s plenty more that are a big racist turn off.
Light says:
January 2, 2018 at 1:48 pm
and could we know where are you from ? if everyone’s disgusting in those countries i would be glad to see where you are from, heaven ?
Arshia Ahmadi says:
November 14, 2017 at 3:31 am
This is lie because i am an irainian and we here love visitors and there is no different whit an american or an African and i add pls come to our country
Lucas says:
November 14, 2017 at 5:35 am
You should rename the article, countries the US have pissed off. The most factually correct part of the entire article is the disclaimer. As for Thailand, it’s awesome, and some of the best food on Earth. Scamming in Asia is just part of the experience, although I’d put Vietnam below Thailand. Vietnam is far worse.
And given the reasons you give other than “They don’t like Americans”, basically you are listing reasons why you should travel. I hope not all Americans are such closed minded pussies.
I long for the time when people writing all these articles stop thinking America is the centre of the universe.
November 21, 2017 at 8:33 am
jackel says:
November 14, 2017 at 6:50 pm
All of these countries are mention they are not americans friends only saudi arabia is american puppet because america want to be boss and police of the world every where in the world America is pushing himself or fighting to get his own interest but i don’t say all american people are bad they are generous and good people although i don’t mention all americans are good they are some negative america people like klux klan idiot thinking towards foreignes together with their american goverment and his foreign policy make them american citizen not to be welcome in some part of the world , look all countries in part of the world can still travel except american citizen why because of their own goverment ,and dont forget America is making other countries to fight one onether to sell wepons because of his own intrest for oil and lying propagandas danger of creating terreur ,no one has created terreur in this world today that america and now making their puppet saudi arabia to fight with iran , AMERICA has burn the world , they way he burns his own country with free guns law, i think thailand is more safe today than american street,your talking about ripping off in thailand just go to Newyork you will be ripped off from street to taxi every where ,as i live in europe i can travel any where in the world Cuba nice place to be than in newyork and safer.
Joe says:
November 20, 2017 at 9:36 pm
Thats where you are wrong about america. We only show up when the countries call us to help them. It is part of the un policy. Dont belive everything you hear. Maybe we should start charging the countries for our military services we provide. Then i am sure you will not see us in your countries. Yep everyone criticize america but it seems that a whole lot of people come running to america to get away from there countries forna better life. Idk. ????????
November 22, 2017 at 12:14 am
Sheena says:
November 15, 2017 at 4:41 am
Iran is really nice! I suggest you to visit this country. Isfahan and Shiraz are fantastic cities!!
Georgia says:
November 15, 2017 at 6:17 am
Gee whizz…. yet these people come to the West in droves…. Saudi Arabia don’t want their poor muslim brothers… nor want to help them…. go figure….
James says:
November 15, 2017 at 10:38 am
Reciprocate visa rules shall apply between all countries.
November 15, 2017 at 11:20 am
How about US that gives hard time to other countries just for a tourist visa its so hard,its almost like trying to get Citizenship in heaven yes its that hard pls add US to the list they don’t want others visiting them.
November 16, 2017 at 6:58 am
November 16, 2017 at 8:26 am
US applys almost all mentioned rules for travelers from 70% of the countries in the world. It took me 60 days to get US visa
November 16, 2017 at 9:49 pm
This article assumes that only Americans travel to these countries. Or is the article meant for only Americans? If the listed countries are less receptive to Americans, it doesn’t translate to being receptive to other nations.
November 17, 2017 at 3:32 am
You speak of the requirement to prove that you can afford your stay in a country as if it’s evil. First, there is nothing wrong with that because inadequate preparation and a lack of a show of such evidence is how people get stranded in other countries; and also how people with other intentions pose as tourists and get across borders. Second, proving that you can afford your stay + having a sponsor with an amount of money that exceeds a certain mark is top of the list before one gets a US visa from my country, Ghana, and several countries across the world before we can get your visa, even when we do have a significant amount of money and we meet all other qualifications. I bet the US will show up on top as “country that doesn’t want you to visit” in several places, more than we can count.
Reza says:
November 17, 2017 at 6:08 am
No. That isn’t true. We love people all of the world.
November 17, 2017 at 10:19 am
I was in Bangkok this past October with a group of friends and was surprised to read an article about Thailand that was totally untrue.
We stayed at Amari Watergate. Compared to my country of South Africa I was so happy there; the people were very friendly and life reasonably inexpensive. You go shopping even at night without fear of attacks; even learnt a bit of Thai language.
Problem would be if you show up there (same anywhere in the world) and begin to act like a big fish. The taximan was not a problems either; negotiate the price before you jump on and tell them to take you to your destination directly and you will be okay.
I travel a lot – what I do is to know the place before I get there; thanks to the Internet.
November 17, 2017 at 2:19 pm
Cuba, who wants tourists, could come off the list and be replaced by North Sudan, who do not really want to see any tourists.
| 248,813 |
The fiery red figure was a “horse” with a black body and a single horn on its head. The mane and tail of the horse were like flames, and its 4 hooves were burning with real flames. The soldiers along the way seemed to be traumatized; one after another soldiers moved away from its path.
“Incubus Beast!” Many people exclaimed. Obsidian who was detoxifying could not help but raise his brows, and his eyes fell on the cloaked rider on the back of the Incubus Beast.
Incubus Beast was the horse demonic beasts unique to the Demon Realm. The speed and power were comparable to the unicorns of the human world. They were immune to all mind control. Individuals with a mutated bloodline could also manipulate the Incubus Beast to use [Lightning]. Its greatest talent was [Terror], which could weaken the opponent’s combat power and fighting spirit. It was known as the Demon Realm’s most powerful ground mount.
Incubus Beast was extremely rare, and it was tameless by nature. It would rather die than surrender under normal circumstances. It was unexpected that this person had such a mount. Judging from the situation of the nearby electrocuted soldiers, it was even an Incubus Beast with a mutated bloodline!
The cloak of the rider flashed with a strange bright light. As he waved his hands, a large area of the capital soldiers within a range of tens of meters began to collapse into a state of weakness and chaos; some even killed each other. At the same time, countless huge vines appeared in the capital army which frantically attacked the nearby soldiers. The entire capital right wing fell into chaos. When the rider rode past the Dark Moon Army, that strange power became another feeling. The Dark Moon Army in the area felt that their injury was recovering quickly, and their energy became vigorous again as though they were reborn.
The soldiers recognized the rider riding the Incubus Beast, and their morale was greatly boosted. Initially, the capital army had a sharp drop in combat power due to some special reasons, now they were completely suppressed by the Dark Moon.
The Incubus Beast soared into the air. The cloaked rider seemed to be looking for something, and he soon discovered the situation in the central army. Seeing the collapsed Shea, the blood-stained Isabella and the almost unconscious Olypheus, the eyes behind the visor suddenly burned. He urged the Incubus Beast to fly toward the central army quickly.
Chen Rui didn’t know what happened previously. Judging from the current scene, Shea and the others must have experienced unimaginable dangers. In the past few days, he rode the little black horse day and night to rush toward this place, but unfortunately, he still failed to catch up with the war. Fortunately, Shea and the others were still alive, and he finally made it.
Obsidian had a cruel smile on his face when he thought of Shea’s resolute phrase “I only belong to a man in this life”. Aguile? Shea’s fiance? He defeated the Red Spirit Estate and the Blue Lava Estate in the war of lords? He should be the Demon Emperor-level strength at most. It’s just right that I can eliminate these threatening guys all together!
At this time, the poison in Obsidian’s body was finally suppressed, and the green color on his left hand became a lot paler. With a wave of his hand, the purple sword on the ground had returned to his hand. The sword burst with [Dark Flame], turning into dozens of huge beasts that charged toward Shea quickly. If this blow was successful, even if Shea was now at the Demon Overlord level, she would be eliminated.
The sound of a sonic boom in the distance sounded at the same time. In the blink of an eye, there was already a figure in front of Shea. A soft water-like power was fluctuating in his hand which glowed with a faint light, and he waved it toward the huge beasts.
The huge beasts madly slammed the figure blocking at the front, but under some mysterious power, they actually turned around unbelievably and rushed toward Obsidian who was in the air.
Obsidian was taken aback. He blocked with his purple sword, and black flames scattered around. After the violent concussion, all the huge beasts disappeared. It was obviously uncomfortable to be counter-attacked by his own ultimate move. Obsidian’s helmet and 2 shoulder armors were already completely shattered. Murderous intent had filled his eyes.
At this time, the little black horse, Incubus Beast, that rushed over had already carried Isabella and Olypheus behind it, and it ran far away at the command of Chen Rui. Obsidian did not stop it because his gaze was fixed on Shea. Shea rose into the air under the protection of Chen Rui, holding a longsword high in her hand.
The tail of this sword was a purple gem, and the quillons were 2 back-to-back angels. The body of the sword was white and engraved with 2 strange marks. The simplicity was full of mysterious breath.
Obsidian could tell the name and characteristics of this sword even with his eyes closed. This sword had been with him for 300 years, but he, the legal owner, had never been recognized by it.
However, in Shea’s hands, this unapproachable artifact, which had always been repelling everyone, actually shone a strong light that he had never seen before when it was in his hands.
Shea’s clear voice sounded through the battlefield, “Rebellious Obsidian, the Sword of Fallen Angel is here!”
For a moment, almost everyone stopped. Countless gazes focused on the sword that exuded the powerful breath in the hands of Shea in midair.
The highest artifact in the empire!
Even if Obsidian was usually gloomy, he finally couldn’t help but lose his composure at this time. For 300 years, he exhausted all the methods and he was rejected by the Sword of Fallen Angel every time. Why, this woman who is only 20 years old, can be recognized by the artifact by just being the granddaughter of the Midnight Sun?
The lords, generals and soldiers were all shocked at this moment. The artifact that represents an empire has been passed down for hundreds of thousands of years. Almost everyone knows its appearance and characteristics. Judging from Obsidian’s attitude, this sword is the genuine one!
Only the true ruler of the empire can be recognized by the supreme artifact! So… this is the artifact’s choice!
Shea held up the Sword of Fallen Angel, “Our sharp swords should not be aimed at our own people! Our blood should not flow under our own swords!”
As soon as this sentence came out, most of the soldiers, including the capital army, lost their fighting spirit.
Obsidian felt the soldiers’ psychological changes, and he involuntarily had a huge fear as if what he had been worried about had become a reality. He roared wildly, “Damn artifact! Damn woman! You all shall die!”
The flames suddenly burned in the air, and a sea of fire engulfed Shea and Chen Rui.
Obsidian, who was almost in madness, had activated his territory desperately.
This was a world of flames. The land was burning, the sky was burning; everything was burning. The only liquid was the black molten lava that could be seen everywhere. The world was full of destructive suffocation and high temperature. Shea and Chen Rui simultaneously felt that the power in their body was continuously disintegrated and disappeared under the burning as if they themselves were the fuel of the flame.
Obsidian stood in the distance, and the [Holy Wings] behind him had turned into black flame wings. There were 6 pairs, like the true wings of the Fallen Angel Empire in the legend. His purple eyes were full of scary blood veins.
“I’m the true owner of the Sword of Fallen Angel! You rebels are going to die! I want to suck all your blood and use your flesh and blood as a sacrifice!”
After something that had been suppressed in his heart for 300 years completely collapsed, Obsidian showed his lunatic side. The flames between the sky and the ground began to rise and fall rapidly with the emotions of the controller. Giants emerged from the lava one after another. It was 5 meters tall, and it exuded the terrifying heat that swarmed toward the 2 of them.
Chen Rui’s mind shifted, and the flame world in his eyes began to change rapidly. After he re-realized the Super System, many functions were unprecedentedly strengthened. In other words, Chen Rui had truly mastered these functions. For example, the original [Analysis] ability of [Analytical Eyes] could only show simple attributes and some kind of danger prompt. The present [Analytical Eyes] already had the “function” of analysis. The power fluctuations in the territory, the attributes of the structure, and even the strengths and weaknesses were all at a glance.
Shea nodded, and she did not ask why she couldn’t use the Sword of Fallen Angel. Another long sword from the storage ring appeared in her hand. In fact, she had previously felt that the light and biting aura of this sword were not so simple, it seemed… out of her control. All she could do was to trust him without reservation which was a kind of tacit understanding and trust.
10 Demon King-level goldmen suddenly appeared around Shea in a circle. At the same time, Chen Rui’s figure left Shea’s side and appeared not far from Obsidian. The lava giants had already pounced on Shea, but the surrounding goldmen were prepared for it. The goldmen were knocked down almost in the blink of an eye, but they stood up stubbornly and continued to fight. Those lava giants were extremely hot, and the goldmen had already begun to melt. Shea’s eyes lit up in black and white. With a stroke of the long sword in her hand, a halo appeared around her body, stopping the lava giants from approaching.
Chen Rui didn’t turn his head to look at Shea’s side. The light on his body continuously lit up as he activated the [Hot Blood Halo] of Mystic Jade Armor and the [Battle Enhancement] of [Link Enhancement].
There were 2 types of [Link Enhancement]: Permanent [Star-level Enhancement] and the temporary [Battle Enhancement]. [Star-level Enhancement] was very expensive and required 100,000 faith crystals. Because [Royal Star Transformation] was frequently used. It consumed a lot of faith crystals. Since Shura swallowed the Wheel of Hera, the growth of faith crystals had been slower and slower for some reasons, so he couldn’t get the required number of faith crystals yet.
There was a mask at Chen Rui’s visor. In the next second, the flame power between the sky and the ground surged toward him uncontrollably. The terrifying temperature suddenly dropped a lot, and the strength of the giants was also declining.
“Swallowing talent? Beelzebub?” Obsidian felt the rapid loss of spirit power in the territory, and he suddenly thought of a certain rumor about Aguile and sneered. This swallowing almost emptied the spirit power of this territory, but the Demon Emperor’s territory power was not a match for the Demon Overlord level which gradually began to replenish and recover as if it was a real world that was inexhaustible.
When he was in the Crystal Valley, Chen Rui used this trick to absorb Manu’s territory, but Manu’s territory was basically based on magic and spirit power, so he was greatly suppressed by the God-Eating Mask. The most important thing was that Catherine seized this opportunity to activate her own territory and injure Manu badly.
Without Catherine, Manu’s territory would automatically recover within a period of time.
When Obsidian’s territory power weakened, many more balls appeared all around. They spun in a strange rhythm. From a distance, they turned out to be stars that intertwined with the flame world.
The stars were filled with scorching heat and burning power that were different from the attributes of the flame world. The flames seemed to be continuously assimilated and absorbed by the stars.
Obsidian felt that his strength had been weakened tremendously, and he was secretly shocked. He had a brand new evaluation of Chen Rui’s power. How could a Demon Emperor reflect my fire beasts? How can he activate his territory freely in my [Fallen Flame World Territory]? Judging from the momentum, he is close to the peak stage of the Demon Overlord. (In fact, it was the result of [Royal Star Transformation] plus [Galaxy Territory] plus Mystic Jade Armor plus [Battle Enhancement]). “Aguile” must be the one who gave the Sword of Fallen Angel to Shea, so “Aguile” should be one of the culprits of the capital chaos.
Thinking of this, Obsidian’s hatred skyrocketed again. His figure appeared in front of Chen Rui, and he slashed with a sword. The 12 wings behind him were not decorations, but a transformation that was a combination of physical strength, vigor, and spirit power. It was already a bit close to the [Armor of Faith] of the territory kingdom which buff one’s own ability to the maximum. He had the confidence to fight even if the woman with horrifying magic power was in front of him.
But Obsidian did not know that the enemy who was “close to the peak stage of the Demon Overlord” in front of him had the real [Armor of Faith]. The Northsea in Chen Rui’s hand was rippling with ripples-like light patterns as it parried Obsidian’s flame sword. Under the bizarre effect of the light patterns, the flames on Obsidian’s purple sword were continuously being disintegrated. What was even more bizarre was that the swords on both sides had not collided once. Chen Rui parried the sword by diverting the force, making Obsidian unable to exert force.
This was obviously the result of Chen Rui’s control. This swordsmanship was realized from [Star Diversion] which incorporated some principles of “Tai Chi ” of another world, but Chen Rui was just an otaku before the crossover. He didn’t know anything about martial arts. Perhaps because of this, he could comprehend his own water swordsmanship with only a little “intention”. Although Chen Rui’s strength was inferior to Obsidian, he relied on the superior spirit power, coupled with Northsea Sword’s characteristics of attack acceleration and swordsmanship proficiency buff, he was in a stalemate with Obsidian for some time. He also became more familiar with the water swordsmanship in this actual combat.
Obsidian became more and more frustrated as he fought. The enemy’s power level is clearly similar to that of the black dragon girl which is far inferior to me, but he has plenty of experiences and strange means, which makes him difficult to deal with compared to the black dragon. It will not be advantageous for me if we continue this close combat.
Thinking of this, Obsidian’s 6 pairs of flame wings spread out, and he pulled the distance away. He pointed the purple sword with his black and white eyes flickering, the flames turned into countless light streams that flew toward Chen Rui one after another like meteors. This kind of pure energy attack could no longer be resolved with the water swordsmanship. Chen Rui attached Stridebug under his feet, and he flexibly dodged the flame meteors by relying on the trajectory of the [Analytical Eyes]’s analysis. Obsidian caught a glimpse of Shea surrounded by the flame giants. With a murderous intent, the sky full of meteors immediately turned to Shea’s direction.
Will this assault succeed? Or will Chen Rui save the beauty once again? Can they activate the Sword of Fallen Angel in this battle with Obsidian?
Find out what happens next by getting early access to chapters with Patreon! Please do check out the community goal in our Patreon as well! Thanks for the support! Click here to access our Patreon page.
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It has been ages since he used his Dragon Possesion, right? Last time was just the long ranged attack I think. Perhaps he can use it more after he levels up next time without getting lame for days afterwards
| 16,507 |
We're still joined by our senior political editor and correspondent Domenico Montanaro, as well as our national political correspondent Don Gonyea. And, gentlemen, what do we make of the results in Georgia, where Republicans got a lot of energy, a lot of focus out of the false claims that Donald Trump was robbed somehow in 2020? Republicans then were the ones who got to make the new rules. And even under the new rules, election deniers didn't do that well. What do you make of that?
DON GONYEA, BYLINE: For me, it says that candidates like Raffensperger and Kemp, who have long history with voters and who have been talking to voters for years and years and years, can still succeed in a - within a Republican Party in the state of Georgia, which is not to say that they are broadly representative of what the Republican Party looks like in that state. But I think their success is a statement.
INSKEEP: Domenico Montanaro, why don't you set up - set the stage for us here? We have a very close Senate race in Georgia. Herschel Walker was the Republican candidate. He seems short of 50%. Raphael Warnock, the Democratic incumbent, also seems short of 50%. Could be an interesting few weeks in Georgia if those results hold up.
DOMENICO MONTANARO, BYLINE: Yeah - Warnock very close to almost getting to that 50% threshold - 49.4% of the vote. He needed to get just above 50% to be able to avoid a runoff that would take place on December 6. I wanted to make a comment about, you know, having - you know, talking to Secretary of State Raffensperger. You know, Georgia has really stood out here in these past - in this past year or so after the January 6 riot at the Capitol, where, you know, you've had Republicans in Georgia be able, unlike other places, to defy Trump and be able to survive politically. And you've seen secretaries of state - people in secretary of state races do fairly well who are not election deniers.
INSKEEP: OK. That's Domenico Montanaro and Don Gonyea. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
Steve Inskeep is a host of NPR's Morning Edition, as well as NPR's morning news podcast Up First.
See stories by Steve Inskeep
You're most likely to find NPR's Don Gonyea on the road, in some battleground state looking for voters to sit with him at the local lunch spot, the VFW or union hall, at a campaign rally, or at their kitchen tables to tell him what's on their minds. Through countless such conversations over the course of the year, he gets a ground-level view of American elections. Gonyea is NPR's National Political Correspondent, a position he has held since 2010. His reports can be heard on all NPR News programs and at NPR.org. To hear his sound-rich stories is akin to riding in the passenger seat of his rental car, traveling through Iowa or South Carolina or Michigan or wherever, right along with him.
See stories by Don Gonyea
Domenico Montanaro is NPR's senior political editor/correspondent. Based in Washington, D.C., his work appears on air and online delivering analysis of the political climate in Washington and campaigns. He also helps edit political coverage.
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And you all spoke up. And asked how you could help. And while I hadn’t realized that the post had read as a cry for help, once I read your comments, I went back and re-read my post and I then I couldn’t really deny that I obviously needed help, which I wrote about HERE.
And then, because you are all sorts of brilliant, you came up with the idea of creating a place to help one another — A place where those with questions could ask them and those with wisdom could share it.
And then, because I am just smart enough to recognize a really good idea, I said, “Um, that’s a really good idea.”
So here’s how this works, my friends — If you have a question, you leave it for other readers in the comments. If you have ideas or suggestions that can help, you leave them in a comment replying directly to the person asking the question.
Now, just because I won’t necessarily be a part of the conversation here, my absence does NOT mean that Diary’s Comment Policy will not be in effect on this page. It will be, just as it is everywhere else on the blog. It reads as follows.
My greatest hope is that the discourse on this blog and its accompanying Facebook page can serve as examples of environments in which compassion, understanding and mutual respect are paramount.
That said, I publish nearly all comments, but there are rare exceptions.
I have long been frustrated and deeply saddened by the chasms in the autism community. I will not allow diary’s comment section to become a megaphone for the anger that serves to keep us divided.
I will not abide personal attacks, either on me or my readers. While I actively welcome constructive disagreement and respectful discourse, this is not a forum for unproductive anger, particularly that which is directed at one another.
While I am happy to respect anonymity, please note that I also do not publish comments without a name (or consistent pseudonym) and a valid e-mail address.
From the bottom of my heart, I thank you – not just for sharing in our family’s journey, but for joining the conversation. And in so doing, respecting each other, supporting one another, and finding ways to bridge the space between us.
Lastly, I reserve the right to remove any and all comments that do not comply with the policy above or for any other reason at any time.
Thank you so much for supporting each another. It’s everything.
Ed Note: It seems that WordPress limits the number of replies to a comment. If you find yourself unable to reply directly to someone’s question, please reply instead to the last person who replied to the same question. That way your response will still show up in that thread. Thank you!
Reddit
Mom says:
May 22, 2012 at 5:10 am
Love you,
May 22, 2012 at 5:15 am
Wattle says:
May 22, 2012 at 5:17 am
Happy to see this
Erika says:
May 22, 2012 at 5:20 am
My son had a tramatic experience at school. His psych is considering using EMDR. Has anyone ever used it?
May 22, 2012 at 7:11 am
Yes. I have done EMDR. I had a wonderful therapist who specializes in EMDR. It was probably the single best thing I’ve done for myself. If done correctly it will transform the trauma from something that pulls you down into the hell of reliving it whenever it is remembered, to just being a story that you know is part of your past, but will not necessarily pull you down into the horrors of it every time you think about it. It’s almost like having a scrim unfurled between you and the traumatic experience.
August 7, 2012 at 5:01 am
Sarah says:
May 22, 2012 at 5:21 am
Carrie says:
May 22, 2012 at 5:53 am
this sounds like it will be a great resource to all of us with this in commen. thank you so much.
Erin says:
May 22, 2012 at 6:01 am
This is awesome.
akbutler says:
May 22, 2012 at 6:08 am
Perfect. Thank you.
Kim says:
May 22, 2012 at 6:19 am
OK so this is supposed to be where we can help each other, right? I’ll just put it out there then. I have a son on the severe end of the spectrum who is a sensory seeker. I need to put a behavioral plan in place for home but am at a loss as to where to start. I have tried professional after professional and they have turned us away, saying he is “too violent” for their programs. Funny, he isn’t too violent to live at home… and the violence isn’t intentional on his part, he just needs to find a better way to express things. At this point hospitalization has been mentioned. We are on waiting lists we have been on for months for specialists, but those lists don’t help me work on things TODAY and it’s rough. Does anyone know of a good how-to website or book for behavioral plans? I am on my own here, floundering, trying to do the right thing by my child… any information would be helpful. Thanks.
Wattle says:
May 22, 2012 at 7:04 am
Perhaps you can look at the following books – if you look at them on Amazon, you can look inside them, I just have these links because that is where I bought them
May 22, 2012 at 7:30 am
Kim, I’m so sorry you’re having such a hard time finding support for your son locally. If you can answer a couple questions we might be able to help find some good resources.
How old is your son? What types of behaviors are you you most concerned about? Is he ablet o speak? If he is not, does he have any kind of communication system in place (sign language, picture exchange, pointing, speech generating device)? So many children have SIBs (self injurious behaviors) either from pain or frustration at not being understood (or a combination of those things). A behavior plan will only go so far to help if your son doesn’t have a way of making himself understood.
Is he in school? Is he in an early intervention program (if he’s 3 or younger)?
All that being said, a basic behavior plan involves identifying the things which cause your child to escalate his behaviors and then “trouble-shooting” in advance. For example, if he has trouble transitioning from one activity to another, you could try giving him a 2-minute (or whatever time works) warning and tell him that when the time is up, you will move on to (name of activity). Also, picture schedules or lists (if he can read) really help lots of kids feel some control by knowing what to expect next.
If you google “create a behavior plan” you can find lots of resources which may be helpful. Ter Mauro wrote an article about BH’s here: http://specialchildren.about.com/od/specialeducation/qt/behaviorplan.htm
I hope any of this helps. Best wishes!
If you want to email instead of answering here, you can reach me at niksmother (at) gmail (dot) com.
Kim says:
May 23, 2012 at 5:05 pm
Wow, sorting through all of this… this is great, by the way, a place to give and take from! Ok so to answer your questions, my son is 6 years old and he is in an Autism program at school. The school hasn’t helped me any either… not sure if I mentioned that. They would like me to do things “exactly like we do it at school”, HOWEVER when I visit I see things like them allowing him to crawl on the floor and bark or things going on with other kids I don’t think is supposed to be going on, things they don’t tell me about. His school behavioral plan has him doing puzzles or hooking up connecting toys, which is all they tell me, however that isn’t the truth either. One time when I went they brought him up from the ‘quiet room’ where they said he was ‘readjusting’… no further explanation. He is in Kindergarten… well he was… last day was today… and has been in Autism programming for 3 years now.
As far as communication, we do some PECs, he isn’t very verbal. But the school requested I do nothing further because they said if I do it would go against what they have working at school. I was going to get him an ipad and they said if I do he will have no incentives to TALK for what he wants and so he might never be fully verbal. I also feel I need an Advocate, but the only one I have found was through our area education agency and she gave me some phone numbers and basically said have a great day. I have called every help organization in my area, and what it comes to is it’s all me. I made an appt. in Iowa City at behavioral health but that won’t be until November, they are really backed up, and it’s a two hour drive every trip up there, so I would like to make that trip as little as possible. A normal car trip involves my being punched in the back of the head, kicked in the back (he broke my seat), screaming… you name it he does it, no matter what toys or games I supply him with.
Erin says:
May 23, 2012 at 6:31 pm
I was reading what your school said about PECS possibly removing your son’s incentive to talk. There is a lot of evidence to the contrary. My daughter is moderately deaf, autistic, nonverbal. We are using sign language and PECS with her. If and when she is ready to speak, she will,but until then, at least she has another avenue of communicating with us. I would question your son’s team more closely on why they feel PECS would interfere with speech, when there is a lot of evidence to show that it (like ASL) helps develop language in children, and in that way may actually encourage speech. Also, there is a book called The Out of Sync Child that may also help with many of the sensory issues. My suggestion would be to find a speech language pathologist who specializes in PECS. This doesn’t have to be an autism specialist. They could at least get you started. Perhaps some of the frustration would be eliminated if he had another way of communicating. I am so sorry that you are going through all of this. Feel free to email me if you need anything.
May 23, 2012 at 6:46 pm
I’m trying to reply to Kim…. but it won’t let me! Kim… my son will be 6 this fall. We also just finally got an appt down at U of I Child Health Specialty clinics… took nearly a year. We go in late June. I’m running into some of the very same AEA/school issues you have mentioned and we really have to fight for anything and everything and in the end wind up doing it all ourselves. I feel for you and am right there with you. I will say this… PECS and the iPad were miracles for my son. He was never non-verbal, but now he is so much better able to express himself than he was before and he is using his words a lot more and just screaming at the top of his lungs a lot less. The iPad also is a savior for us on car trips… I guess I have no real advice other than do not totally discount PECS or iPad… and know you are absolutely NOT alone in this struggle.
May 23, 2012 at 6:53 pm
oh, and I wanted to add, my son is also a sensory seeker with aggressive tendencies especially at school. OT was another godsend for us. Difficult, time consuming, and absolutely necessary. We also saw some progress with a system called Integrated Listening Systems, which they did at our OT appts when all of the other therapeutic listening things failed. These headphones vibrate and he really liked that input I think. The book the other poster mentioned The Out of Sync Child was really good and helpful too. There was something else but I can’t think of it right now…. will try to remember it. Also, I don’t know which direction you are from Iowa City but there are some awesome autism clinic resources in Dubuque at Mercy hospital there (we can’t get over there, but everyone I’ve met who went there had only good things to say). Of course U of I is supposed to be top notch as well (guess we’ll find out in June…)
May 23, 2012 at 9:14 pm
Anytime a “professional” tells you that their way is the only way and that you should not try other approaches, this is a BIG, GIANT, RED FLAG. Ideally, you could confront them and remind them that this is your child, and they are only there to help you. YOU are in charge. It is an unfortunate reality that there are certain “professionals” who use their status to bully people. In this case, they use your concern and confusion over your child to try and take control of things that should not be controlled by them.
The appropriate attitude for a provider in this situation is one of collaborative effort. Good providers are overjoyed to find parents who are concerned and active in the care of their kids, because there are parents who are uninvolved the neglectful that they see all the time.
Now, I could be reading the situation wrong, but it sounds to me like they are using scare tactics to keep you from using other methods and other tools other than the ones they provide. This is completely inappropriate. It sounds like you really do need an advocate to help you. I wish I lived near. I would be happy to help, but this is a really hard one. The only thing I can offer at a distance is my support and a listening ear.
Feel free to contact me at scintor@aol.com or I can give you my phone number if you would rather talk over the phone. You were dealing with a very difficult situation and it never helps when you find you’re being bullied.
Julie says:
October 20, 2013 at 9:21 pm
Chadd.org will help you
Stella says:
January 7, 2014 at 2:55 pm
I know that I’m really past the activity on this thread, but, I am wondering how things are for you and your son. What changes have you all made and which have ‘worked’?
I am asking because the reply thread includes some very helpful information, and there is more, as you know!
Please give an update, if you are still following this site! My son has violent outbursts at home, school, wherever, and I have come across some very helpful techniques in the last year, but would like to also know what has worked for you and others!
For us, utilizing Dr. Ross Greene’s model found in his book “The Explosive Child” has been extremely helpful. This model is well-described in his website: http://www.livesinthebalance.org/ where there are links to a weekly call-in online radio show for both parents and educators.
I hope all is well and look forward to a reply!
Thank you.
May 22, 2012 at 6:34 am
Thank you Jess. I woke up this morning thinking to myself…I could really use that community support page right about now…and here it was.
I NEED HELP…or at the very least some support Please…
My daughter is 4 and a half. She was doing amazing and making tons of progress up until a couple of months ago. She started making requests, was potty trained, communicating in her way, happy, and regulated.
Now…NOW…she is so bad. She is screaming at every little thing. ALL day. Screaming, crying. The behavior is off the charts. She’s also having more accidents, when she was doing really well. She is screaming in private therapy. We are loosing it over here.
We’ve racked our brains trying to figure out what’s wrong…allergies? 5 YO molars coming in? Both? Is something going on at school? Is she eating something she shouldn’t be? (she’s gf/cf)
ARe we doing enough? Are we doing too much?
I’m setting her up with therapeutic horse back riding. She went last year and it really helping. I’m hoping and praying my insurance company will cover some ABA therapy….working on that now.
I just can’t take much more of this. My heart is breaking. I can’t sleep. My marriage is stressed (though we talk a lot) and I’m crying pretty much every day.
What can we do?? What am i missing? Has anyone else had something like this happen? ANY idea at all what might be causing it, or what I can do to help?
akbutler says:
May 22, 2012 at 6:55 am
Hi Barb. I’m sorry things are so hard right now. I totally get this. Sometimes it seems like these behavior changes come out of nowhere for my son too and I play detective to figure it out. Then three days later, it comes clear (sick, school anxiety, etc.) Best advice I ever got was to try to track everything, from hours slept to toileting changes to food. And ask if there’s something new happening at school. I know my 6 yr old has been anxiety-riddled over the end of the years school play and the constant talk of first grade.
If Jess is okay with this, I’m also linking to a post written by a friend of mine called “It isn’t Regression”. http://www.spdbloggernetwork.com/2012/04/26/it-isnt-regression-2/ This time of year is really hard for our kids sometimes, and we may have to give them a little more space to breathe to help them through.
Good luck. You sound like an awesome mom and your daughter is lucky to have you.
May 22, 2012 at 7:55 am
May 22, 2012 at 8:04 am
That blog was AWESOME!! And I think that it’s helped me. And it’s right…this is a tough time of year for her. This was also her first full year of school. There could be so much going on she is just too stressed. Thank you so much for that.
May 22, 2012 at 7:11 am
My 6 yr old daughter (who is not autistic) has gone through SO many phases of emotional stresses in her life, that I often wonder if there IS more to it all (we’re in therapy with her for some issues currently). My point being, that even without the challenge of autism, girls can be tough! Have you considered problems with her ears at all? I know it sounds crazy, but we have had so many issues with my 2 yr old’s (he is PDD NOS) ears over his life so far, and it has caused him a lot of pain (we’re off to the ENT today to have his tubes checked). When he was an infant, he would scream for no reason and we had no idea why…at 6 mos old, we found out he had a dandelion seed stuck in his ear…had floated in there in the fall! He had to go through surgery to have it removed, it was so far lodged into his ear canal/on his ear drum. While this may not be helpful, it’s something you might want to consider…I know ear pain has caused him some pretty extreme discomfort and made him inconsolable at times. Hang in there and I hope you find some solutions!
May 22, 2012 at 7:56 am
It could be something like that going on. I’m planning to take her to the doctor, dentist…to get her checked. It could just be end of the year stress…it could be something more. Thank you so much for your support, it means a lot
May 22, 2012 at 8:28 am
Hi Barb! My son had a few potty accidents after a year of being potty trained and we discovered it was from anxiety and that he was being picked on by kids in preschool. They are all the same age but he’s little for his age and wasn’t speaking up for himself if they took a toy or something. After we brought up the problem the teachers and bus driver started watching for it and moved the kid to another area that was being mean to him. Try asking the teacher or anybody who would know because maybe that is happening but it’s not being caught.
May 22, 2012 at 9:12 am
Thanks, i will
May 22, 2012 at 10:28 am
As an Adult with Autism who is raising two autistic kids, I can sympathize. Since I am not there, I can only guess, but it really sounds like sensory issues. From my own experience, autistics tend to need a small amount of sensory stimulation of the right type and shielding from stimulation of the wrong type or overwhelming amounts of any type. Unfortunately, what kind of sensory stimulation is bad and what is good is different for each autistic person.
Because she is still little, the only way to figure this out is by observation. If she screams every time it gets quiet, it may be that she needs sound stimulation. Some low background music like classical or ambient could make a great deal of difference. On the other hand, if she screams every time there is a noise, this could mean she’s being overwhelmed by sound. A pair of headphones that completely cover the ears could be an amazing help to her.
If she likes to hide in dark places, or seems reluctant to go out into the sunlight, she may have light sensitivity. A pair of sunglasses, even indoors, can be a real help. If she is drawn to the light and things that are brightly colored, she made need more visual stimulation. Shimmering and iridescent things could be very comforting to her.
She’s constantly rubbing herself she may need more tactile stimulation. A stim brush such as occupational therapist use could be very helpful. On the other hand, it is not uncommon to be overwhelmed by things like clothing touching her skin. Warning signs here are things like constantly taking off her clothes or rejecting rough blankets or towels. In this case removing clothing tags and making sure the inside lining of the clothing is smooth and not scratchy can be very important. Another thing to watch out for here is sensitive skin. If she is constantly scratching at her skin until it’s red and raw, she may be sensitive to things like the chemicals in fabric softeners or the scents in laundry soaps.
Smell can also be the big sensory trigger. If she is constantly burying her nose and things she may be smelling them. In this case scented candles or Glade plugs might be useful. Conversely, she may be overwhelmed by smell. If she avoids the kitchen or rooms that have just been cleaned or any other strong smells, scents may be overwhelming to her. In this case Frabreeze becomes your friend.
In any case, sensory triggers tend to be a big deal for autistics of any age. Being overwhelmed by their senses makes all the other tasks in their life much more difficult. This can lead to her being unable to deal with things that she previously mastered. I really hope that this can be of use to you or others.
April 8, 2015 at 4:44 am
http://cleoland.com/ Please view and leave comments at my newly created page, I could use the support. Thank you.
June 9, 2012 at 4:41 am
totally get what your saying. I am so sorry your dealing with this. It is hard when we can’t seem to figure it out. We have been through times like this with Sammy too. What we found it was for us was often a developmental leap about to happen. It gets sooo bad before he gains a new skill I just want to run away…or drink heavily
we do find that trying to isolate the skill and working on it can help. being really careful about sleep and water/hydration because those are huge triggers for my guy. Anything with Dyes, artificial flavor, or BHT make him CRAZY! I hope it’s better for you by now
May 22, 2012 at 7:04 am
What a wonderful idea!!! I’ve been trying to link up to some sort of support group (mostly under NEARC) but have had little luck, and not very much time to meet up face-to-face. While my concerns are not as trying ast those mentioned above…I do need help…
One thing–any ideas how to stop a child from chewing on their shirt? My 2-yr old son is ENDLESSLY CHEWING the collar of all his shirts (or the wrist area)…looking for ideas on how to stop this as we’re running out of shirts and he’s walking around with wet/smelly shirts all day. I’ve tried the vibrating teethers, but he’s chewed through them and they’re not ideal to carry around the house.
Wattle says:
May 22, 2012 at 7:09 am
Valmae, have you tried behavioural type rewarding ie in the most simplistic terms – say, yay, you didn’t chew for 1 minute, have 5 minutes on a rewarding activity, then once the 1 minute is happening successfully, update it to 2 minutes – yay, you haven’t chewed for 2 minutes, have 5 minutes on the reward until you can get the time up – I know that sounds simplistic but you might have to start at a really short time interval and/big reward and gradually increase the demand/reduce the reward or maintain the reaward – you don’t need to keep increasing the reward if it is done slowly.
May 22, 2012 at 8:53 am
Am def going to give this a try, as I feel he finally understands. He has his favorite toys now, so I can certainly use those as “reward”. thanks!
May 22, 2012 at 7:20 am
At 2 yrs old, many children are still exploring their world through ALL of their senses. If the behavior is constant, you could try either a behavioral approach (not always successful with kids that young as they don’t have as much control over some impulses) or you could find something more suitable such as a chewy tube or “chewelry.” Both of them can be found online at various sites for various costs. Here are some links: http://www.mayer-johnson.com/nsearch/?keywords=chewelry&s_kwcid=TC|16135|chewelry||S|p|11413471264&gclid=CJ7utpjwk7ACFUdN4AodXkbMpg
and http://chewytubes.com/ The chewy tubes come in different thicknesses and textures, even letter shapes.
Also, I find that my son is less likely to chew when he is fully engaged in another activity. The chewing usually ramps up more with boredom, anxiety, or (when he was younger) teething. (Is your son getting his 2 yr molars?) Hope this helps!
May 22, 2012 at 8:55 am
Thanks so much for the links, I will have to check it out. I had made one myself, by braiding together teeshirt fabric, but that got pretty gross, pretty fast! I do feel he chews ALL the time, but it is certainly less when he is engrossed in an activity. Going to check out those links now, thanks!
May 22, 2012 at 7:28 am
I also turned up the heat in the house and took his shirt off him. He had to “deal” without the use of chewing on his shirt. He gets LOTS of therapy and I tried to up his stimulation on other things b/c his shirt chewing was mostly from computer stimulation. After a while it phased out and now we only see this on a hard day. I REALLY liked Wattle’s advice as well. A lot of autistic kids work well on the “first – then” way of thinking. First you don’t chew on your shirt for “x” minutes THEN you get a treat . Make sure it is a treat he really wants and GOOD LUCK ps a good behaviorist has been a serious plus in our lives.
May 22, 2012 at 8:57 am
Thanks, this is on my list for the summer…no shirt…no pants Hoping to start potty training…or at least awareness of the potty (he seems to have NONE) given that he will be 3 at the end of August. He is starting pre-k this fall to continue getting services that he outgrows through EI & Building Bocks, so I feel I need to nip this chewing in the bud…or at least provide some alternative. Thank you!
Ardea says:
May 22, 2012 at 7:35 am
We also went through this phase when my son was 4. His OT bought him some really cool foam-like teethers (but stronger than foam, so he could really bite down hard on them but they didn’t fall apart in his mouth), and they were easy to carry around with him. The key was that we would give him the teether RIGHT when we saw him start to chew on his shirt, so eventually he started just going for the teether instead of the shirt. And, one day, out of nowhere when he had been obsessed with it the day before, he just stopped doing it — so maybe that will be your solution.
May 22, 2012 at 8:52 am
Thank you for the input…very good idea. I just have to have the patience/time to intervene when it happens. We did try the vibrating teethers and it worked for a bit…but he really did chew those up fast. We’ll give it another try!
May 22, 2012 at 10:40 am
As a 42-year-old autistic adult, I remember doing that very thing as a child. It sounds like a form of sensory stimulation to me. It might even be useful to try and use behavior rather than curb it. Beef jerky, chewing gum or other chewy foods can be used as rewards to help shape his behavior. I remember being given a rawhide dog chew toy as a child because I was doing this very thing. I took it as a challenge and chewed the thing completely to pieces within a day or two.
MomToKiddo says:
May 22, 2012 at 4:12 pm
Sounds kinda crazy… but get his zinc levels checked..
Terry says:
May 22, 2012 at 7:30 am
Yay!
Lisa says:
May 22, 2012 at 7:41 am
This is terrific! Thank you!
May 22, 2012 at 7:43 am
This is great! Thank you!!
May 22, 2012 at 7:52 am
This is awesome! Our 3 year old son was diagnosed with high functioning autism. The whole process of getting the appropriate services him is really quite daunting! However, that’s not my question. We are having a really really hard time potty training him. We have tried the 3 day method twice. The second time we thought he had it but when he went to daycare, he did not have the same success as at home and he basically reverted back to having accidents all day. Plus, he would yell “NO! NO! NO!” when his teacher told him or asked him to go to the potty. They definitely did not force the issue. Do you have any recommendations for books or websites or advice? Thanks! I am SO glad I found this place!!!
May 22, 2012 at 8:15 am
Hi! We used a method with my daughter that is for children with developmental delays. It’s called Foxx/Asner. It WORKED. It’s not easy, and you have to be consistent…in school and at home. It took my daughter 2 weeks and she had the idea. If you want the info email me at mommylovescymbie@gmail.com, and let me know your from the page. I can email you over a copy of what we did with her…the hand out I got from school. If you’re interested. Good luck
May 22, 2012 at 12:10 pm
Hi Anheerah, my high functioning boy took quite a while. My “typical” boy wasn’t really using the toilet regularly until 3.5, either–boys can just sometimes take quite a while. When we were having good success, and then not so much, my wonderful pediatrician suggested just backing off completely for a few months and starting again slowly. We did that when he was 4 and it all went smoothly–by that point he was really physically ready as well as emotionally ready. Hope this helps! Karin
Kim says:
May 23, 2012 at 12:40 pm
I agree. My boy was about 3.5 when it became his decision. Until then, if we tried, he just didn’t care. But once it was his decision, it happened pretty quickly. However, not at night. It was really until he was almost 9 (yes, 9) until nighttime became dry. And that was when he decided to try an alarm that would wake him up. His typical sister went late, too, as far as the nighttime…so probably a family thing, as well!!
Strained Peas and Other Wall Spatterings says:
May 22, 2012 at 7:59 am
Thanks, Jess! This is going to help so many of us!!
May 22, 2012 at 8:28 am
Love this idea Jess! Thanks so much for starting this. I just have a gripe with my son’s school I wanted to share in case any of you have ideas for me.
Yesterday my son’s (HFA/adhd/spd/anxiety, age 8, 2nd grade)speech session was changed from am to pm because of a meeting conflict. He was told about it in the morning but refused to go at 1:30 when it was time. His para brought him to the office where he was put into the conference room to calm down. He crawled under the table to hide and picked up a paper clip from the floor. The determination was made that the paper clip was unsafe so they wrestled it away from him and did not give him time/space to chill out. He was removed from under the table and staring out the window when he wet his pants. He was told he needed to clean up his mess. He stripped and threw a wet sock at an adult which they took as an act of aggression and restrained him. After the restraint he got dressed and punched his restrainer in the stomach which resulted in a second restraint. Is it just me or could this entire scene have been avoided by letting him stay under the table until he was ready to talk?
Amy says:
May 22, 2012 at 8:54 am
Ugh . That sounds awful! I’m so sorry your son had to go through that. Yes, it does seem like the whole situation could have been avoided if they’d left him alone. The making him clean up his mess part bothers me. He likely wouldn’t have had an accident if he hadn’t been in that situation in the first place. It’s not his fault that he couldn’t go to the bathroom because he was locked in a conference room! They should have known that changing his schedule with such short notice would throw him off. It seems that they could have been more prepared than that.
May 22, 2012 at 10:51 am
Yes, this sounds like he was overwhelmed by the change in his schedule. The reaction by the teachers and paras simply escalated the situation until he had a meltdown. His para especially needs to learn to see these kinds of indications and take the initiative to cancel such appointments.it sounds like neither of these people were autism experts and they got confused and overwhelmed by him becoming confused and overwhelmed.
I would ask for a meeting with them, and try to explain what happened without making accusations. Let them know we would’ve been much better to cancel the appointment or simply let him isolate until he calmed down. They need to know that he was not being bad, he was simply being overwhelmed by his disability at that time. Helping them learn will help your son in the future. If they don’t learn this kind of thing could be repeated and possibly get worse.
Julie says:
May 22, 2012 at 12:56 pm
I agree. I’d say their responses really escalated the situation. Also, the school needs to make sure that the calm-down area is kept clean and safe so your child can have time to regroup.
Kim says:
June 5, 2012 at 5:31 pm
Sounds like you have my daughter in male form (she hit her principal after stating “I know tai kwon do and I’m not afraid to use it”). The “professionals” absolutely escalated the situation. They could have let him have the paperclip and had someone watch over him instead.
You may want to talk the people at school after you have thought about ways that you have handled similar situations. As also, be as calm as possible and use a non-accusatory tone (even though I found that very hard in our situation I mentioned above).
Amy says:
May 22, 2012 at 8:41 am
Thank you SO much Jess. My 3 year old with high functioning autism holds her urine for as long as she can…hours or even all day. She doesn’t want to pee. She will get extremely agitated until she finally goes and then she feels better. She fights me to sit on a training potty and is terrified of a regular toilet. I’m not pushing her to potty-train. I would love it if she just went in her diaper, but she won’t. She does her little dance, holds herself, even digs into her “girly parts” and gets really upset. I began to wonder if urinating actually hurts her, so I took her to the pediatrician. A test for a UTI came back normal. On several occasions when she is holding it and getting agitated, I put her in the bathtub and turn on the water and she will go in the tub. In the last couple of days I’ve tried sitting her on the training potty and putting her feet in little bowls of warm water (old slumber party trick). She will go immediately! I’m glad to have found something to help her, but where do I go from here? I still think it hurts her to go. I think I should have her seen by a doctor, but her pediatrician doesn’t seem to know what is going on. What type of doctor should we see? Urologist? We are beginning ABA in August and I’m hoping they can help, but I don’t think we can do this for 2 more months. I would love some advice!
May 22, 2012 at 9:33 am
Amy, my daughter (now 8) did everything you describe when she was younger. I was convinced that it was painful for her to pee but it turned out to be just one of her behaviors. We did potty training boot camp over the course of 5 days with our ABA provider and a group of special education graduate students who needed some therapy experience. It basically involved taking her to the bathroom every 10-15 minutes, lots of positive reinforcement and then extending the times. I had my husband take our son away to visit friends for a few days and I took time off work. The grad students came in shifts so I would not lose my mind and would stick to the program. It was exhausting but it worked for us. Once she was potty trained the behaviors mostly went away although we still need to reimd her from time to time to use the bathroom.
May 22, 2012 at 10:56 am
It sounds like this is a sensory issue, rather than a pain one. Giving her something she likes to do while sitting on the training potty might be helpful. a mild pleasant sensory stimulation can often help with other sensory issues.
Amy says:
May 22, 2012 at 1:44 pm
Thank you so much. It is so nice to know that someone else has gone through the same thing. Everyone else I’ve talked to has been baffled about this one. I appreciate the advice and support!
May 22, 2012 at 11:34 am
My daughter struggled with potty training as well. She wore pull ups to bed until she was 7. I still struggle with getting her to go on a regular basis. For her, she doesn’t want to stop what she’s doing, to go. I have explained to her that tv and movies can be paused, as well as games, and that her teachers won’t mind if she gets up to go to the bathroom. But she waits, and then when the urge hits, it hits hard. She will drop to the floor, with her legs in the ‘W’ and she’ll wiggle until she ‘gets a hold of it.’ I do my best to remind her to go, but have learned that I have to be very specific with what I tell her. She would say that she didn’t need to go anymore so I would tell her just to go sit on the potty and see…..well, she sat on it, clothes and all. Now I am careful to explain that her pants should be pulled down before she tries to ‘sit on the potty’. lol
May 22, 2012 at 12:17 pm
Hi Amy, Our 4-year old son was also trained using the method Dawn described. He is in an Autistic program at school, so his teacher and Para started him there first. They asked us to send in super-high reinforcers that he would do ANYTHING for – in our case, mini-m&ms. They started taking him every 10-15 minutes, and told us not to worry about following up at home just yet. Then after he was up to going every 30 minutes with a good success rate, we took over at home as well. There were lots of accidents in the beginning, he got bored of the m&ms (swedish fish was next), but eventually he did get the idea of it. Pooping was a different story. That took a full six weeks longer – but just when I thought I couldn’t clean up one more poopy mess – he got the hang of it. Believe me when I tell you that one year ago I looked at him and thought, “this kiddo will never get the hang of the whole potty thing” – and in just a few months – TAH-DAH! I have a book at home that describes the method step by step. I can scan the pages and email them to you if you’d like. Let me know via email at nickysmomma@yahoo.com
Erin says:
May 22, 2012 at 12:30 pm
I am having problems training my five year old daughter. One thing that was helping for a while was this thing called the “potty watch.” You can google it. It’s about $10. It is basically a timer that goes off every 30, 60, or 90 minutes to remind her to go, and then it resets itself. If you had something positive (this thing lights up and plays a little song) to remind her to try, and then you could do your warm bowls of water? The trick with ABA is not that they typcially come in and wave a magic wand, but more that they have the ability to be extremely consistent (because they are there for a few hours instead of 24/7). If you had a tool to help you with the consistency part, it might hold you over until you can get therapy set up. (that’s all assuming this is behavioral and not medical. If you think she really is in pain, follow your mommy gut and talk to the doctor again). I will warn you, after about 5 months with the potty watch, my girl has become bored with it, and is still in diapers. Hope you have better luck!
May 23, 2012 at 7:48 am
Chiming in on the potty/holding it in issue. My son has a very difficult time simply relaxing his body enough to go until the need is so urgent that he simply MUST GO IMMEDIATELY. We’ve put him on a slightly loose schedule (roughly: TRY going potty every 90 minutes) and find that when he is distracted by singing a song or something, he can relax and goes fine.
Also, young children have SO little control over their worlds that they will often control the only things they can: what goes in and what comes out. Don’t know if this might be at play with your daughter or not. I would suggest trying some of the techniques people have recommended and then, if there is still no improvement, start with a visit to a pediatric urologist just to rule out any medical issue. Good luck!
Julie says:
May 22, 2012 at 9:03 am
Thanks for creating this great resource.
Luna says:
May 22, 2012 at 9:08 am
May 22, 2012 at 9:30 am
I look forward to the twist of the wrist…..
May 22, 2012 at 9:47 am
thank you for setting this up
May 22, 2012 at 10:58 am
This is a fabulous resource…thank you so much! I have never reached out to a support group before but am quickly realizing that I should have, and long before now. My daughter (9 yrs) has been diagnosed with Asperger’s. First it was developmental delay, then Asperger’s, then not Asperger’s, now possibly Asperger’s or severe anxiety. Whew…. She receives speech therapy at school, and spends time in the resource room each day. Overall, she is highly functioning, but there are issues that have me baffled. I have a very hard time communicating with her b/c she can’t stay in the moment. She is constantly in her own head, replaying a show she loves, or a funny moment she is recalling. I have tried making sure that I have her attention before I begin speaking, but she quickly disappears. Example…last night I told her it was time for dinner but she never came out. I went looking for her and she was naked, preparing for a shower. When I asked why she was naked, she sd that I sd that it was time for a shower. We had a little laugh about coming to the table without clothes. lol
It seems simple enough but it happens ALL the time. She is really beginning to struggle in school b/c she can’t keep up with subjects like science and social studies. She has become a decent reader but only with ‘fun’ books. Textbooks have far too many words that she has never heard before so she does her best to memorize and then she just guesses for the rest. They do in-class study sessions, and are even told which pages to find the answers for their study guides. Even with all of that, she usually gets failing grades b/c she isn’t listening during the study sessions and then just guesses on the study guides, in spite of basically having the answers right in front of her.
I guess the issue is comprehension and focus, and I am at a loss as to how we can achieve either of those.
The other struggle is that after all of these experiences with her, I am now convinced that I am struggling with whatever it is that she struggles with, but mine was never diagnosed. I had almost identical struggles as a child, but somehow learned better coping skills than I have been able to teach her. It’s very difficult to know how to help her when I am unclear as to how to help either of us.
Any tips on communication or comprehension….or sanity? I think I just needed to vent more than anything, so thanks for listening! I’m sure I will post again…b/c I could keep writing all day and never get all of it out. Have a nice day!
akbutler says:
May 22, 2012 at 11:53 am
Hi! I was wondering if you ever used visuals or PECS with your daughter in the past. I’m wondering if that might be a useful place to start. My son is a little younger at 6 yrs old, but I find that to really make sure he stays in the moment, he still needs visuals from time to time. They use them on the bus with him to remind him of the rules because when relayed verbally he doesn’t always hear it. I’m just thinking out loud, but I wonder if you were to give her a PECS picture of “dinner” as you said it was time for dinner, then she’d have it in her hand and know what is coming. It may help at school too for visual schedules as it’s also being told to her.
I have a similar problem as an adult…if someone verbally gives me directions somewhere, I’m lost after step 2. But if I have a visual map and written directions…no problems.
May 22, 2012 at 12:16 pm
Hi Chelsea, wow do I know this one! (With my 11 yr old HFA/ aspergers.) As he likes to say “Mom, could you please be quiet? I’m thinking right now…” Why be out in the world, which can be so tough, when you can be having so much fun in your head? In addition to various therapeutic interventions, one thing that works with him is making a hand phone. You know that shape you can make with your hand that looks like a phone? I pick it up and say “ring, ring!” and he picks up on the other end! Never fails. A small whiteboard that we carry around is another way we communicate when he’s in his head. I write on it, hand it to him, and he’ll write his answer. It gets him engaged in the conversation/ exchange. I liked akbulter’s response, too, and am looking forward to what others have to say!
Rebecca says:
May 22, 2012 at 12:57 pm
Another possibility to consider is an auditory processing issue. Sometimes it can be difficult to filter what needs to be heard from the rest of the noise, hence the difficulty with attention span especially to spoken direction. Our 9 yo son still has auditory processing issues, but Tomatis therapy was very helpful for him. Warning Tomatis is still controversial, not helpful for every child and can be expensive but was very helpful for our son. I would carefully screen your provider and make sure there is pre-testing to see if auditory processing may be an issue with your daughter.
We have also found that when listening seems to be a problem a tap on the shoulder to get him focused on me and what I am saying can be a helpful small reminder to bring him to the present task.
May 22, 2012 at 1:07 pm
Yes! We found therapeutic listening to be very helpful. It was 5-6 years ago so I’d almost forgotten. We’d always thought auditory processing was part of my son’s puzzle but he always came back in the “normal” range when tested. Yet clearly he still benefitted from some intervention in that area.
In that same vein, we also asked for (and still ask for) extra processing time in his IEP. Teachers often repeated and/or restated directions for him to make sure he was getting what was being covered.
May 22, 2012 at 1:03 pm
Hi Chelsea, Your daughter’s evolving diagnosis is almost identical to my son’s. (He’s 12, almost 13). You mention anxiety…is she being treated for it? For us, the anxiety seems to be the key component and when it’s under control he is much more engaged and in tune. For him, sertraline (generic Zoloft) was literally a magic bullet. I know meds aren’t for everyone but they were a livesaver for my son. He’s recently weaned off them, by the way, and so far so good.
And for what it’s worth, I think I also had/have many of the same issues, yet milder. I think that’s fairly common today…kids ending up with “magnified” versions of issues their parents faced.
May 22, 2012 at 2:27 pm
Thanks so much for all of the responses! What an awesome feeling….to be heard.
There was so much I left out, in the interest of space (and keeping others engaged lol), so I will add-on here. She had visual schedules in her earlier years at school but then expressed to us that she no longer felt she needed them. The start of a new school year always brings about the need for one, until she learns the routine, but we have never really had one at home…probably b/c I am such a scatterbrain as well. It’s a shame that ‘life coaches’ are so expensive b/c I sure could use a life makeover. lol I often tap her on the shoulder or hold her hand before I start talking but if I talk for more that 5-10 seconds (sometimes a little longer, depending on the subject), I have lost her again.
Anyway…she has also been tested for auditory processing issues and she tested in the normal range. I had her tested again, but a less extensive test, and it was normal as well. At the moment, she is taking Methylin ER and sertraline but has only been on them for about 4 months. I was hesitant to try pills in the beginning…convinced that mommy could make it better, I guess. I’m glad we went this route b/c I do believe that it’s helping, but while adjusting meds it feels like the wait is endless.
We live in southern Illinois so we don’t have a lot of resources around here. My daughter is in a small school system with very caring teachers and I am convinced that love and care from them, combined with all of us having a ‘never give up’ attitude, has got her further in school than any therapies that have been available.
Another question…my daughter loves tv. And when I say love I mean she LOVES it. I know how much peace and happiness it brings her to get lost in her shows but I also feel that it’s part of our problem. Where do I find the strength to take away or severely limit her favorite thing, or do you caution against doing that? It’s hard to get her outside b/c she is terrified of anything that buzzes. She doesn’t care for sports b/c she doesn’t have the patience for learning. When she tries the first time and doesn’t do it perfectly, she cries and quits.
My hope is that by limiting tv I can possibly pull her out of her own head a little more, possibly get her more interested in reading books to stimulate her own imagination, or develop a hobby. Thanks, in advance, for any advice…..
May 22, 2012 at 2:55 pm
An idea that might work here is using a WebCam to record instructions be played back for use with video chat. If TV is that absorbing to her, using it is a medium of communication might be effective. I know that this won’t always be practical but it might work. . The reason I think this is because I’m an autistic adult that is easily absorbed by TVs. I have found I can absorb information through TVs much more quickly than I can from verbal. I don’t know why, it just seems to work like that.
May 22, 2012 at 3:15 pm
Thank you, John. She has an iPad and uses Skype to talk to her grandparents..maybe I can use that. I welcome any and all ideas…this was such a fantastic idea!
May 22, 2012 at 11:05 am
Awesome. I need a place like this. Thanks, Jess. You rock!
Jess says:
May 22, 2012 at 12:02 pm
Here to subscribe, thanks Jess your awesome!
Erin says:
May 22, 2012 at 12:14 pm
Watching this happen… Just so awesome, so incredibly awesome. (and trying to subscribe to comments again, didn’t work the first time. ). So amazing… I am forever grateful to be part of this community.
May 22, 2012 at 12:23 pm
LOVE LOVE LOVE THIS! Why didn’t we think of this sooner?? Thank you, Jess, for your sort-of accidental cry for help – see how well it all turned out?
Wattle says:
May 22, 2012 at 5:04 pm
Chelsea – For some reason I can’t reply against your post.
Another thing to test/look at is her working memory, my son has really struggled since year 3 at school because the working memory problems become exacerbated with the fact that from year 3 onwards, it is a lot less visual, a lot more talking and since the kids are supposed to be more independent, instructions aren’t repeated as much – so all the crutches that were there for all the children seem to be removed around year 3 and that is when things start really falling apart if you have a working memory problem. Using the Super Duper Auditory Hear Builder software (not that expensive) has highlighted where the problems are and helped (I feel) as they also provide strategies – the http://www.superduperinc.com/ page has some great resources and for anyone that knows their cards in a box, they have converted many to apps now and they are brilliant. Also Difflearn has Earobics on special at the moment and I know that is used for APD – not working memory
May 22, 2012 at 7:41 pm
I think that there is a limit to the “depth” of the replies. I noticed it too. It’s probably built into WordPress.
May 22, 2012 at 7:43 pm
i think what we can do to skirt it is to reply to someone who has replied to the question. does that work?
May 22, 2012 at 9:03 pm
That’s what I did earlier
May 23, 2012 at 10:28 am
Yes! Great tools (the Earobics, too) that my son’s old resource teacher and speech path used with him and similar peers. I’d forgotten about those, too! I think I’ve blanked out some things, especially if they appeared during a stressful time in our lives.
May 23, 2012 at 11:30 am
Chelsea, wanted to reply to your comment above about limiting her TV. It is such an ongoing dilemma for us: To indulge the obsession or discourage it? My son’t current obsession is sports on TV (ironic that he has evolved into a obsession that is socially acceptable!). We try to keep a balance (easier said than done, I know.) and not discourage it completely because we know it calms him and gives him a chance to unwind from the stresses of everyday life. He’s actually gotten pretty good at monitoring himself because he now worries that too much screen time is unhealthy, bless his heart, just like he worries that the chemicals in Diet Coke are poison to me!
I seem to always come back to how hard he works every day to function and how little he has in the way of joyful, easy interaction…so how can I deny him his one true pleasure? Sorry, that’s probably not very helpful right now.
May 23, 2012 at 3:18 pm
Audra, You have no idea how much help it actually is to me! Just knowing that someone else has felt the same way about this subject…i love this part the most, “I seem to always come back to how hard he works every day to function and how little he has in the way of joyful, easy interaction…so how can I deny him his one true pleasure?” That’s fantastic and exactly how I feel most days, but I guess I worry that my desire to make my child happy could be hurting her. Goodness…sure wish this could be just a smidge easier. lol Thanks so much for reaching out!
May 23, 2012 at 7:15 am
Ok I need some help. We recently took my 13 year old autistic son off of anti-psych meds after being on them for 7 years. I am so happy this happened as now he is present, and talking more. The problem… He now gets stuck on one thought and can’t let it go. Right now its waterslides. We recently took a trip to a waterpark and he LOVED it. Now he wants to go back. Like NOW. He is wearing his bathing suit under his clothes to school. We have tried redirecting, telling him its broke, closed, tried to tell him we can’t go right now. Nothing is working. To the point that he was running around the house yesterday screaming. I had to give him his anxeity medicine and wait for it to kick in just to get him to settle down. Having to deal with my son having such a STRONG opinion is brand new to me, and I would appreciate any advice on how to handle this. I love that he is expressing himself now, but need to find a happy medium. After all we have been through in the past couple weeks with him detoxing from the old medicine and now this, I am just at the end of my rope.
Jess not that Jess says:
May 23, 2012 at 7:36 am
We’ve had a very similar situation. I’d suggest scheduling a time that you *can* go back to the waterslides, then writing it on a calendar and putting the calendar up in a very central, visible place. Then, each day until the day, you can look together and count down how many days are left until you can go. My kid’s biggest hurdle with this stuff tends to be the anxiety that if she doesn’t go RIGHT THIS VERY SECOND that means she’ll never go at all. So finding a way to show her that not now doesn’t mean never tends to be really helpful. Incidentally, it’s also helped her understand time. ;). Good luck!!
Rebecca says:
May 23, 2012 at 10:52 am
We have also dealt with this in numerous analogous situations. My son wants to go visit certain stars of television programs he enjoys, which we have explained cannot happen until he is 18–by then we hope to be able to explain that stalking is illegal. I agree with Jess that scheduling a time when you can go is very helpful to diffusing anxiety. We have found that even if that time is a year or several years away as long as we have a commitment to a return trip, the perseveration and anxiety diminish. But only make the commitment if you can live up to it because the whole system only works if your child can trust that you will follow through on the commitment later. But also look at it this way–what a powerful motivator you have just found. Certainly a return trip could be used as a reward for meeting other expectations.
May 23, 2012 at 8:51 am
HAs anyone ever had to get a Religous exemption for vaccinations? I need to register my daughter for Kindergarten and I can’t because she is missing her MMR and a few boosters. We are in NY and that is the only exemption we can get…just looking for some info on what to say. We have already done her annual review…b ut I need to get her CSE transition meeting going and they “can’t” until she is registered. Help……
May 23, 2012 at 4:46 pm
I did not realize that each State could individualize the exemptions. I am in Ohio and we have Religious, Medical or Philosophical. Have you obtained the form? You may simply just need to “sign off” and check a box and if your only box option is “religious” then, in my opinion, check it. My daughter has only received a tetanus booster since she was diagnosed at 2 1/2. ~Becky
May 25, 2012 at 11:27 pm
No in NY only Religous or Medical are options. Which is horrible…because I can’t get any doctor to give us a medical and it is not just a check box. You have to explain your religous views…and can be subjected to “sincerity questioning” and possibly asked for backup documentation. Since we are catholic…..and there is nothing there to “forbid” vaccines….I basically have to concoct something! It is just to get her registered and move on with our lives and the services she desparately needs. You are forced to act a little crazy. Just wondering if anyone else had to do this???
May 23, 2012 at 9:03 am
Thanks, Jess, this is wonderful, just subscribing for now.
Jenn says:
May 23, 2012 at 9:06 am
Stepping out of lurking to say thank you for this wonderful resource… I look forward to helping and being able to ask for help.
May 23, 2012 at 10:16 am
Brilliant idea, this will be helpful to so many people!
May 23, 2012 at 6:07 pm
My son is 6 years old and has to have a root canal surgery. However he has astmah – the doctors have told me that they will have to put him to sleep for the proceedure.
Is it safe to put a child this young to sleep for surgery? Also considering he has astmah?
I need help from all the Moms out there. Has anyone gone through this before? I am just really woried.
Thanks in advance for all your help!!!
May 23, 2012 at 7:02 pm
Miguel, assuming it is being done at a hospital facility, yes, it is. When they put him under they will have an entire team monitoring all of his breathing, heart rate, etc. they will also, most likely have you give his inhaler or nebulizer treatment the morning of the root canal, too.
My eight year old has had many surgeries in his life, including when he was 19 days old. He has respiratory issues and has not ever had trouble with sedation. All that being said, make sure you talk to the doctor or team performing the procedure and voice any concerns and ask as many questions as you need to to feel comfortable with it. No question is silly except the ones you don’t ask but wish you had.
May 24, 2012 at 11:55 am
Miguel, my daughter is 9 and had oral surgery last year. I was very nervous as well but it turned out to be a wonderful teaching experience for her. We were careful to go over everything so there wouldn’t be any surprises. She was a little nervous but mostly wanting to be reassured that she would be completely asleep. After it was over, she never required any of the pain meds that were sent home with us, and she even said “wow, surgery isn’t as scary as I thought!”
Ask lots of questions so that you feel comfortable with the surgical team, but I am sure that all will go well. Best of luck to you and your son!
May 24, 2012 at 12:43 pm
I’m an autistic adult and I had oral surgery, and I remember them asking me to count to ten and then wondering when they were going to start and then they said “all done.” It was alot better than when they used shots that were never fully effective on me, which was a nightmare every time.
May 23, 2012 at 7:51 pm
Thanks so much for setting this up, Jess! You are awesome.
May 24, 2012 at 2:15 pm
need help! I have a 7 year old girl with AUTISM . She is mostly non verbal.
we got an Ipad but i cant find sample communicaion pages anywhere that are relevant do daily living.
anyone? i feel that parents that have been succesful at making pages should share…. i would and once i am succesful i willl….
fee very lost
May 25, 2012 at 5:23 am
My son’s IBI therapist has just started using a program on the ipad called proloquo2go….check it out. I think it may be just what you need.
May 25, 2012 at 5:27 am
Erin says:
May 25, 2012 at 5:40 am
My daughter uses a PECS program on the IPad called TapSpeak Choice. It has been working well for us, but it is pricey – so is proloquo2go that the earlier poster just mentioned. Before we invested in TapSpeak, we tried some of the free communication apps out there, just to see if it would work for her in general. One that was pretty easy to manipulate was Choice Board Maker (free!). (There is also a free app called Autism Apps that shows you different apps recommended by parents with reviews and prices listed.) You can upload your own pictures into both of these programs in addtion to the pictures already included. I’m not sure if you have an Apple store where you live? I found the folks there to be extremely helpful. Many of them are actually trained on these programs, and give you honest feedback on what they liked and disliked and what different teachers liked. I do wish you could give these apps a “test-drive,” though – especially the pricey ones.. We have considered proloquo2go for my daughter, but it looks like it may be too complicated for her just yet (too much scrolling through pages) as she is only 2 1/2. It is available on the iphone, which would be easier for her to carry around… But TapSpeak is working great for her. I think the big thing to remember is start small and start slow. We offer two choices on each page for now. (more / finished; yes/no; books/watch tv; eat/play; etc..) Then we will add three… Then we will start to add navigation buttons that switch pages for her. Any program you choose should let you start small. As far as daily living stuff, you can create your own pictures and words (the app can read them for you), in most if not all of these programs, so just start small. I know it’s really overwhelming, but take it in baby bites, and be patient.
May 25, 2012 at 2:52 pm
Thank you all so much for your help, i have proloquo and go talk now and talk tablet….. they all have their vertues- what i am trully having a hard time is with page customazation and language build up.
proloquo can be a maze…how to customize and make pages that are appropiate and meaningful for a 7 year old girl and how to simplyfy proloquo so that i dont loose her in the complexity of the linked pages…
You are all amaizing for taking the time to respond to my desperate plea
what i think i was trying to ask was for a place were parents even my self can load copies of the pages we have built as an example for other parents who struggle with this like myself
Wattle says:
May 25, 2012 at 5:32 am
There is an awesome app called AutismApps which has lots and lots of useful apps all categorised – brilliant.
mamabear99 says:
May 25, 2012 at 9:23 am
We just finished (finally) the school system’s evaluation process for ASD. We actually school at home, but our son needs services and this is the only way for us to get them right now. One of my problems with this whole process is that basically since he was an infant we knew he was different. We spent the first 7 years of his life telling pediatricians, teachers, and anyone else who would listen that he was different and that we had concerns. We were always reassured that he was developing “normally”. Now, after a year of speech therapy through the school system, someone finally sees what we have always seen and they agreed to evaluate. I know in my heart that he has autism. I don’t need some do-da who has spent the past 7 years ignoring a mother’s concerns now be the one to confirm what we already know. I want to tell them to shove it and go to hell.
There’s already been talk by them about him needing to be back in school so he can learn social skills. The times we have had him there for the evaluation testing have been terrible. He comes home after an hour or two and rages then has a meltdown the rest of the day. Do we think that it is in his best interest to go there for 7 hours a day so that he can learn how to interact with his peers? Hell no.
At what cost would we be doing that? For our child that cannot articulate how he feels…our child who cannot put words to the emotions…we would be causing more harm than good just so he could learn how to socialize better.
And…I’m afraid of them trying to tell us once again that there’s nothing atypical about him…that he is really developing “normally” and that we have no idea what we are talking about.
In a few hours, my husband and I will be meeting with one of the school system psychologists. She will go over the evaluation with us and answer any questions we may have. I feel like I’m going to throw up. And cry. Because as much as I already know it…we have been fighting to get him the help he deserves for years…for a “professional” to finally acknowledge it is probably going to push me over the edge.
Thanks for listening.
May 25, 2012 at 2:43 pm
I am so sorry that you are having such a challenging time. Please remember that you are the only person in the world that knows what is best for your child.
You and your husband need to decide what will work for your family and then see which ,if, and how the resources available out there would apply to your family.
Its easy to forget but you are in charge and yes this process is overwhlming.
but there is always hope. Autism is a challenge but its also an incredible journey. filled with beautiful chos, advocay battles, and trully earned sucess.
My daughter was diagnosed at age 2 and trully she has been my teacher.
We may always mourn the child we planned to have once in a while but belive you me My little girl is the most amaizing hard working happy little one on this earth.
much love shallada
May 25, 2012 at 3:20 pm
I agree with the above and would add that there is a reason for a diagnosis. The reason for it is that it gives you leverage. As soon as he is diagnosed, he becomes part of a federally protected disadvantaged minority that has extra rights and protections under the law. This can help you get them to pay attention and help you find and receive services. It is by no means a guarantee, but it can be helpful.
mamabear99 says:
May 25, 2012 at 5:29 pm
Ok so…we are back from the meeting. As much as I already knew it, I can’t believe how unbelievably difficult it was for me to hear them say it…the diagnosis they gave us is only for educational placement purposes…it’s not a medical diagnosis (whatever). He definitely falls into the Asberger’s category according to them. We meet next week for the case conference and IEP. We have a lot of thinking and praying to do between now and then. We have two other children (who of course, we also school at home)…my husband is thinking that if we send our son to school even a bit of the time to get the services he needs and deserves that we would have to send the other two full time. I know he is worried about me…he thinks I’m about to break…I feel like it sometimes…because it has been 7 years of doing it on our own…but this isn’t about me. I want our son to have the best possible chance at success. (Of course, so does my husband.)
I think we have to look at what our goals would be for our son…what are his needs. He does not struggle academically. (He struggles with how information is presented to him.) He tests high average for his age in reading and math. The area he struggles with is social development. He is below age level. I guess I wonder why we would send him to school for 7 hours a day to work on social development. It’s not like we have our family locked in our house with bars on the windows. We go out in the community. The kids are involved in several different activities.
I don’t know…I feel like I’m fighting my husband on this one. I have no problem with the actual school. It is a good school…the people are nice…the teachers are good (for the most part). I just don’t feel like it is the right choice for our son or our family.
Why does this have to be so hard? The main reason that we reached out for help yet again was because we have been having so many behavior problems with our son related to him not knowing what to do with the emotions he feels. How did we go from that to talking about putting him in the public school system?
You are right John Mark…this is a necessary step to get him the help/rights/services he needs and deserves. Thank you for the reminder.
Thank you for the encouragement Shallada. I really appreciate it.
May 25, 2012 at 6:17 pm
I am so sorry you are going through this.
There are a LOT of EFFECTIVE treatments out there that can really help your son learn to socialize and manage and understand his emotions.
The diagnosis is your friend because it qualifies you for all sorts of services through medical insurance, mental health insurance, and through the school system. Our experience with the school system was that once one person finally understood what they were seeing, the others came on board. If not, it might be worth trying to get a diagnosis by paying for your own assessment. You want to use a psychologist who has had a LOT of experience with diagnosing kids on the spectrum who are your child’s age.
Even if he doesn’t go to school he can improve his social skills and emotion management. There are as many different ways to deal with ASD as their are people with it.
May 25, 2012 at 8:23 pm
Some detail that might be useful.
With a medical diagnosis (by a psychologist) health insurance usually covers:
1) weekly psychotherapy that can really help you son to recognize his emotions and how to manage them (sometimes there are short term caps on therapy services so you should check details with the insurance company)
2) weekly speech therapy (though the insurance company will likely have hoops you must jump thro before they will pay for anything so check their rules) which will deal with social cognition (what is the other person likely thinking if they are saying or behaving in a certain way – and what are they thinking of me if I am speaking or behaving in a certain way). You will need to find a speech therapist used to dealing with spectrum, especially high functioning ones.
3) weekly occupational therapy to deal with any sensory issues, and some of your sons behavior may be due to sensory integration issues. Again most insurance requires an assessment and a formal plan before they will pay for this.
Depending on the state you are in or the specific insurance you have (assuming you have it) your insurance might pay for a weekly social skills group. I really like groups that use a lot of Michelle Garcia Winner’s work on social cognition.
Depending on the state you are in and the specific insurance you have, your insurance may cover 20 hours a week of ABA (applied behavioral analysis). Depending on how difficult your son’s behavior is in the home, you might qualify for this under regular mental health/medical insurance. Again usually this won’t be covered without an assessment and formal plan and goals.
While it is great to have all these services, the out of pocket expenses are still hefty (we run about $4000 a year, though they can be much cheaper outside California). And you have to take a very zen-like and detail-oriented attitude in dealing with the insurance company (regardless of where you live).
To get the medical diagnosis, you can use the school diagnosis and ask your doctor to authorize an assessment. Once you have that in hand, check with your medical insurance about exactly what they will cover. Chances are you will have to go out of network to find an appropriate specialist.
For my son who was diagnosed at 6 and who is academically brilliant, but socially and emotionally slow, I have found reading Michelle Garcia Winner’s work really helpful in understanding what he is struggling with.
What having your son at public school might be able to give you –
If he is not in a regular classroom but in a special education room he will be taught in a very small group, they can also get a behavior plan in place (in special ed or a regular classroom) and have an aid with him 7 hours a day.
Its worth discussing with the school behaviorist what your concerns are and what they think the best placement for him might be. They often have a lot of experience and can come up with a good plan. In our public school, some of the most academically able kids are in special ed. At least at our school, you do not have to worry about him not being served academically in that setting.
Hope that’s helpful.
May 25, 2012 at 6:30 pm
I’m a 42 year old man with Asperger’s. I came from a time when they did not diagnose people with autism and had to struggle through school all the way to Masters level without the help of a diagnosis. I was always told that I was to smart to be having problems. If I was having any problems it was because I wasn’t trying hard enough. I had to get a diagnosis the hard way; a degree in psychology. The other good thing about a diagnosis besides the help gives you access to, is a really does let you know what you’re up against. I now know why some things are hard and what I need to work on. This would have been amazingly helpful for me as a child.
I really suggest that you start looking for blogs and websites by autistic adults. Autism never goes away, but you can adapt. There are many successful autistic adults including those for leaders in their fields. this is not some sense you have to serve; there is real hope out there. Your son can learn to be successful and thrive, but it’s going to take some work in areas that are not normally addressed.
as for the issue of socialization in school, you’re right to be worried in that simply throwing him into a school situation will not help with socialization issues. Having Asperger’s means that you not get social concepts by association the way non-autistic people do. People with autism have to study how to be social; and it needs to be that blatant. The good news is that there are any number of autistic adults who’ve mastered such things and proven it can be done.
While it is true that it is helpful to social development to be around other peers, this is not enough in another itself. As a parent, you can help make the difference. What he needs is a guide for social situations that are confusing. He needs someone to come to when he doesn’t understand what just happened with other students or teachers. Now that doesn’t mean that you need to have all the answers personally. That’s what the online community is for. I would suggest frequenting sites for autistic adults like wrongplanet.org, where you can ask questions of autistic adults who have faced similar questions and found answers. I can’t really speak for anyone else, but I can tell you that if I had such a resource growing up, it would have made so many things so much easier.
I will always be available to help in anyway I can and there are many other places you can look as well. You can always contact me by e-mail at Scintor@aol.com and I will do my best to help you or at least point you towards another resource that could help.
February 26, 2014 at 9:16 am
Thank you for your post. We have a daughter who is almost 16 and just now being diagnosed. For the last 15 years we have been trying to get someone to notice, to help us help her. We’re with Kaiser and because she is so very high on the spectrum, there is a 50-50 chance that they will diagnose her. But yesterday — after all these years — we finally found a counselor who herself has a son on the spectrum and who told us, confidently and with the most encouraging smile “I will not try to ‘fix’ your daughter — she is not broken. I will try to help her learn to navigate through her world, focusing on her strengths and helping her meet her challenges.'” I wanted to cry. Finally, after all these years, it feels hopeful. The social stuff is the worst — but right now I think we may have found someone who can help smooth her path. I will also keep fighting for a formal diagnosis for all the reasons you mention. Your post is like a light pointing to the future. Thank you.
Jess says:
May 25, 2012 at 10:50 pm
Ok so I’m googling dsm iv to find the criteria for aspergers to prepare for appt on tue and I’m not sure what I’m where I should be. Is there a specific website address or place that I can type in to find the actual criteria. Any suggestions would be greatly apriciated. Not as Davy as I’d like to be when searching stuff online.
Erin says:
May 25, 2012 at 10:59 pm
Let me know if you need any extra info. My oldest has Aspergers, my middle has PDD-NOS but both are very similar, but different. Good luck!!
May 25, 2012 at 11:02 pm
Just google Asperger’s DSM-IVtr and it comes right up. Also this link goes to a copy. http://www.autismindicators.com/asbergers-diagnosis. Be prepared, it is probably not as impressive or as useful as you are expecting.
mamabear99 says:
May 26, 2012 at 2:31 am
Hi again. We need some assistance in the department of telling our kids about the Asberger’s diagnosis. I think we feel comfortable talking to our son about his diagnosis. We are concerned about telling his 10 year old sister (she’s older). Does any one have any recommendations? Any books that might help her understand her brother a little better?
Thanks bunches!
Wattle says:
May 26, 2012 at 5:14 am
“All cats have Aspergers” is a really good book that is kid friendly
May 26, 2012 at 9:22 am
I was going to say that, but you beat me to it.
akbutler says:
May 26, 2012 at 9:05 am
We bought this book for our oldest called Everbody Is Different : A Book for Young People Who Have Brothers or Sisters With Autism. We bought it a few months after our middle son’s diagnosis and it really helped us all understand and work better together as a family.
mamabear99 says:
May 26, 2012 at 10:01 am
You guys ROCK! Thank God Jess started this page…I wouldn’t have known where to go.
John Mark I especially appreciate your insight. Thanks for being present in this forum.
Deb says:
May 27, 2012 at 7:37 am
I love this! Thanks Jess! I have several questions re autism and play, and Floortime. My son has mild autism (not PDD-NOS or Asperger’s) and thankfully does not deal with a lot of sensory/behavior issues. He is very weak, however, in the area of play/creativity/social skills when it comes to relating to peers. Because he is not a “challenging” student, he seems to sometimes “slip through the cracks” at school. Right now in his integrated preschool he does not require a dedicated aide and does very well in a lot of the academic areas (he does receive speech, OT, PT). There seems to be little emphasis on play, learning to play creatively, and interacting with peers…instead I get comments from his teachers like, “When he’s older he’ll learn how to relate to kids through video games.” He has social IEP goals but they haven’t seem to work too hard to show me how he’s reaching them. I am wondering in this day and age how much I can argue that play/social skills MUST be incorporated into his education, for example, even during recess? He is 4 and in pre-K. It’s sad to me that even for typical kids play and recess are being shoved aside to drill them for standardized tests, etc.
Also – while his school’s program is ABA-based, I follow Floortime principles at home. There are no Floortime therapists in our area, that kind of therapy is not covered by insurance, and we don’t have the finances right now to pay thousands for a thorough Floortime evaluation/consultation/training. I can’t seem to find anywhere online (a message board, etc.) where I could just talk to people who do Floortime and ask them some questions. For example, we’re kind of “stuck” in a certain stage and nothing I’ve read in the books really addresses my son’s specific issues. Does anyone have any experience in Floortime and could help me out just a little? Thank you sooo much! I would much appreciate it, as my son does not do ESY and every summer I am looking for strategies to help him with his play skills. Thanks again!!
May 29, 2012 at 11:55 am
Alysia asked ne to reach out to you
Are you the Deb who is also my blogging buddy from “Open up and let go”- if you are then you know so much already
Just in case you are a different Deb I had almost the identical situation as you and here is what I did on Floortime
Are you on the yahoo board ?
Erin says:
May 27, 2012 at 8:46 am
I’m a little embarassed to say that I’m not familiar with Floortime, but I do agree with you that a wait and see attitude with regards to your son’s social skills is frustrating. My oldest has Asperger’s and we started him in a social skills group when he was 5. It worked wonders for him. I don’t know where you are located, so I don’t know if you have access to something similar, but I can tell you what they did. They established goals for him, such as “initiating play” where he would practice asking another child to play with him. All the kids in his group have some form of “high-functioning” (i hate that way of categorizing it) autism- meaning they are for the most part in mainstream classes and just need a little help socializing. (it is a separate therapy, not related to school). Anyway, the teacher would prompt him, “try asking Sam if he wants to race cars with you.” It went on from there, (other goals have been, maintaining a recipricol conversation with a peer for 3 or more exchanges, following group directives, playing with toys appropriately, etc.) and he is doing great. You could try this if you have a fairly regular group of children to play with, and you could do the prompting yourself. It sounds too simple to work, but it really does. It just takes patience.
mamabear99 says:
May 30, 2012 at 8:14 pm
We go for our case conference tomorrow. They are going to present an IEP for our son being in public school full time. Now, if you remember my previous discussion a few posts ago, we educate our kids at home.
So, I have to say, I feel a little defensive already. Especially since we specifically asked to see what a plan with partial days or less would look like.
Like this isn’t hard enough. Then we have to deal with people who appear to be ignoring what we are saying. I am not feeling good about this.
Can someone please give some advice?!
Thanks.
May 30, 2012 at 8:24 pm
go in with an open mind. listen. take it in. don’t respond on the spot to ANYTHING. sign nothing but the attendance sheet. it’s a conversation. remember that an IEP meeting is a TEAM meeting. YOU are a vital member of that team. so take a deep breath and hear what they have to say.
in a lot of years of doing this i have found that the best way to be heard is to be willing to listen.
oh, and bring cookies.
mamabear99 says:
May 30, 2012 at 10:00 pm
Thanks Jess. I’m just feeling extraordinarily overwhelmed lately with everything that is going on with our son. Not to mention the fact that our youngest has been showing the same/similar signs of Autism for the past year. I’m just tired of always feeling judged. Judged for the way they behave. Judged for our decision to educate at home. Judged judged judged. I’m sick and effing tired of being judged.
I know you are right…we need to go in with ears open, mouths closed. And, I know it’s my issue…the one where I want to tell them all to go to hell because after 7 years freaking years where I’ve been doing our own therapy at home because they all said he was “developing normally” now they finally see what has always been there and now they want to give us advice and tell us how to do things.
When we brought our kids home from public school 2 years ago, we finally felt like we had our son back…we got him to reengage with us…reconnect with us. And I don’t want to lose him ever again.
Wattle says:
May 31, 2012 at 8:18 am
Bring Cookies – that’s what I have been doing wrong !
By the way, always have a nice photo of your child on your folder or somewhere visible on the table so that it reminds everyone that they are discussing a real child, not just a statistic.
Erin says:
May 31, 2012 at 6:06 am
I totally understand what you are saying about feeling judged. It is really hard for us to shelve our own emotions and try to focus objectively on what might help our children the most. I agree with Jess, listen, listen, listen. Then go home and really process it, and try to put your own emotions to the side. If you are worried about your youngest son, it might be worth considering “delegating” some of the therapy for your older child to the school district, then giving you time to find some answers for your youngest. Try your best to stay calm in the meeting, and treat it like business (even though it’s not to you). If you can, bring someone else with you that can listen as well, so you wilk have a better memory of what they are offering. In the end it is your decision on what your next step will be, but try to look at the long term picture – will this help him become more independent. That helps me. And cookies are good too. Good luck. We’ll be praying for you.
mamabear99 says:
May 31, 2012 at 8:34 am
Thank you.
I will let you guys know how the meeting goes…
mamabear99 says:
May 31, 2012 at 7:58 pm
So we are back from our case conference/IEP meeting. I’ve let everything sink in for a few hours. Here’s the jist…
As I expected (because they are required to), they presented an IEP for our son being in public school full time. I was very pleased with their plan. Their goals are right in step with our goals for him. They each took turns discussing their findings and plan for him. Then at the end, after we voiced our concerns, the autism specialist looks at us and said something like:
What we are asking is that you sign this IEP today. We as a team
think that this is the best possible educational plan for J. We feel that
this IEP is the best possible plan for him.
So, this is when I turned to the principal and asked her “Don’t we have 10 days to sign this or not?”
That is when J’s speech pathologist (who has been an AMAZING advocate throughout our journey) spoke up and said, “Actually, you have 10 SCHOOL days to sign it. That means, you wouldn’t have to sign anything until August.”
Anywho…the resource teacher starts talking again…trying to re-cap the re-cap. She said that to sum it up, J would spend 98% of his time in his regular classroom with his regular teacher and that 2% would be receiving special education services including:
Speech therapy 3 times/month (which we already do)
20 minutes of writing help/day
To re-cap for you:
The autism specialist told us that the best thing for J to get the services he needs is for him to be in public school 7 hours a day. Followed by the sentence that he will spend 98% of his time in his regular classroom with no help.
Are you following me here? Does this seem asinine to anyone else? If someone can explain it so that I can understand how that makes sense, go for it.
That is all for now. Thanks for listening!
Erin says:
June 1, 2012 at 9:58 am
Good job waiting to sign it- especially if you are not comfortable with the recommendations. Since I don’t know your son, I can’t tell you if that is enough therapy or not. Often therapy at school is limited to what would make a student “function” at school, so sensory needs, etc often get left to the parents. It may be necessary to get additional therapy outside of school.
Devil’s advocate- your autism specialist may want your son to spend time modeling “typical” peers and that would be why she may want him in Tge classroom. If you think he needs an aid, though, you should tell them so. My older two go to a Catholic school, but bring a one-on-one aid with them (called a TSS here for therapeutic staff support) and their behavioral consultant observes once a week as well. That way they get the experience of interacting with “normal” kids, but have the aid to make sure they are successful. It has helped them immensely, but they are in small highly structured classrooms. (sorry about typos- typing on an iPod… ;). ) anyway, my point is, take your time to think about it. You just got the diagnosis. give yourself some time to adjust. There is no emergency here. He is the same boy he was two weeks ago. You just have some different opportunities to consider.
mamabear99 says:
June 1, 2012 at 7:05 pm
Erin — I do disagree with the lack of OT in the plan…I think he would benefit greatly from receiving OT once/week. However, my bigger concern is this:
we educate our kids at home now. The school’s answer is that he should be in school full time to receive all of the services he needs. If he goes to school he will be receiving services 2% of the time. So, how does that really benefit him? How can they say that he needs to be there if they are only with him for 15-20 minutes a day? And that is only for help with writing?!
I get the whole social skills perspective…that is an area he needs to work on. However, I’m more concerned about uprooting him from what he knows in order to give him 20 minutes or less/day of “services” that we could do at home. ( They said he would receive 15-20 minutes/day of help with writing activities.)
If he stays at home like we have been doing, he is still eligible for speech therapy 1/week. And doing OT once/month is pointless to me…we have been doing OT at home for years.
Since nobody ever listened to us until recently, we had to come up with our own therapy program…we worked with him on whatever he needed. When he was 18 months old, I bought a book and started speech therapy with him…did it for two years. He made awesome progress. We backed off when his only trouble was /r/ and /sh/ and /ch/. Again…the school wouldn’t do anything because those particular sounds weren’t a considered a delay at his age. So, when he turned 7 1/2 and still couldn’t say them, we again pursued an evaluation…that is how we met his amazing speech pathologist who has been such a great advocate for him and for our family. When he was three and we realized that he was having sensory issues but nobody would help him (pediatrician & preschool teacher kept telling us he was developing “normally”) we worked on those.
First of all it isn’t like we live on a compound where nobody goes out and nobody comes in. We are social people. He has social opportunities in gymnastics and swimming at the YMCA. He has social opportunities in Cub Scouts, Religious Ed every Sunday and church. He has social opportunities every time we visit a nursing home to spend time with residents. He has social opportunities on our trips to the grocery, library, parks, friends’ houses. He has social opportunities with his baseball team.
I guess part of what we were hoping for help with his his rage and emotional outbursts. The school is aware…we have told them many stories. His speech pathologist witnessed an event. However, they don’t have a plan for that. We even asked about it.
I’m feeling like we are really no better off than we were before the evaluation except for having an official educational placement diagnosis. (Even though we already knew the answer.)
Ugh.
Erin says:
June 1, 2012 at 7:36 pm
That really is frustrating. I wish I had some good answers for you. Do you know if there is any ABA (applied behavioral analysis) available in your area? It sounds like you might need more of that than anything else in terms of dealing with the outbursts. I’ve been there with my son more times than I care to recall. His team works on coping skills with him now that he’s old enough to understand what that means. (I also managed to record one episode on camera- not only did it work wonders with the insurance guy, but I also showed it to my son, and he realized how silly he looked….)
As far as sending him to school, as I said, I was just playing devil’s advocate. If you don’t think the social scene is what he needs (sounds like you’ve got that covered), then it sounds like they are currently not offering you much. Everything is negotiable, to a point. Think about what you think he needs, and see if they can work with you. If not, you may be able to secure those services elsewhere without having to send him to school full time. I’m not sure where you are, but in PA we have something called wrap-around services, paid for by a combination of private and state insurance (meaning it costs you nothing) where behavioral aides come to your home, out in the community with you and even to school. Perhaps that would be an option on some level?
This sounds so frustrating. I am so sorry you are going through this, but your son is so lucky to have a mom as dedicated to his well-being as you obviously are. Hugs.
mamabear99 says:
June 2, 2012 at 9:35 am
Thank you everyone. I appreciate that you have taken the time to reply. This is so helpful…to have different perspectives from people with different experiences…to be able to vent to people who have absolutely no emotional or familial connection to us. I am so thankful for this community.
June 1, 2012 at 7:34 pm
In this kind of circumstance, what I would do is set up a bidding war. I think you are already doing a much better job than they’re proposing. In order to make this clear, I would make a document in the same style as their IEP, but replace their proposed interventions with the interventions you been giving him at home. I would then return the next to meeting with them and place the two side-by-side.
I would then say something to the effect of, “I’m afraid I cannot accept this proposed IEP for my son as it’s clear that he’s already receiving better support. How could I possibly consider placing my son in a situation where he is not receiving at least comparable if not superior support.”
The ball would then be in their court. If they don’t come up with a better IEP with more supports for your son, then say, “thank you for your time but it looks like you’d be best for my son for him to stay at home.” If they come up with a better IEP, then your son wins out in the long run. If not, stick to your guns, and keep your son at home. They need to remember here, that the most important thing in this entire procedure is your son. If the outcome is not his benefit, then there’s really no point to the whole thing.
May 31, 2012 at 1:52 pm
Hi all…Chelsea, again. lol I have another concern to toss out there. My daughter (B, almost 10, Asperger’s) is having trouble understanding or remembering (not sure which) what is and isn’t appropriate behavior at appropriate times, and I am not sure how to achieve this goal.
If she interacts with the family, it is always on her terms (of course!) and on her time, but when she chooses it, it is usually some type of tickling or semi-wrestling or general roughhousing. We navigate things pretty well at home, but last night presented a new challenge. My youngest is playing softball and we were at a game. Toward the end, B and another child were playing and chasing and then a few of the parents got involved and everyone had a ball. However, B tries to tickle and wrestle these children and adults too, and not everyone understands or appreciates the situation. To make matters worse, I have to watch her very closely b/c she has a tendency to tickle at random and her hands can end up in places they shouldn’t. I know she isn’t intending to touch anyone in their “private areas” but sometimes she does, or the other person simply doesn’t want to be touched by a 9 yr old, with or without social graces.
We have talked, a LOT, about what is and isn’t appropriate, but when I quietly remind her that she needs to keep her hands to herself, she looks so defeated and deflated. I’m not trying to steal her joy, only to keep everyone happy and not feeling uncomfortable or violated.
Any thoughts, comments, advice??? Thanks, in advance!
mamabear99 says:
May 31, 2012 at 7:41 pm
Our son is the same way. And he’s rock solid and has no concept of his brute force. He loves to wrestle and the deep pressure sensation it brings…he loves being tickled too, but not lightly…that only irritates him.
Carole’s suggestion of social stories works for us too…for just about everything (usually).
We have this problem when he wants to wrestle with his friends for example at Cub Scouts…the boys feed off of each other and it turns into a madhouse quickly. The problem is that when the other boys are done, they stop…our son keeps going and it leads to problems which gets stressful for me as a parent. However, I find that when I can take the emotion out of my voice and just tell our son things in a matter-of-fact way, he tends to not only take it better, but he seems to process it easier. I suppose this is because he isn’t trying to decipher the emotion on top of trying to figure out what I’m telling him.
May 31, 2012 at 8:01 pm
I have a large autistic son as well loves to wrestle and tickle. I dealt with it by wrestling with him a lot and letting him know that he was a very big strong boy. Whenever you do something that was potentially damaging, I would stop and remind him that he need to be careful and gentle because he was strong. (And I collected quite in collection of bruises while teaching in this lesson.)
Another idea is to get her used to the rule that as soon as one person asks to stop, the game is over. Even without this kind of situation, it’s a good rule to have.
June 1, 2012 at 9:35 am
Tommy is the same way. We wrestle him at home for the deep pressure release and to burn off his energy, telling him what a big, strong boy he is. We worked on gentle touching for quite a while. And we still need reminders occasionally.But it has worked tremendously well.
Tommy is having a hard time with the part about it being over when someone asks for it to stop. There are so many ways to say “stop”. He gets confused.
May 31, 2012 at 2:17 pm
My son has a similar issue with tickling and rough housing. He can take down a kid more than twice his size in a heart beat with his Very professional wrestling moves. Explaining does not work. Showing gets confusing. The only really useful tool we have found is social stories. When we run out of ideas for them his teacher at school has been invaluable. I learned some great tips from the Gray Center.
http://www.thegraycenter.org/social-stories/how-to-write-social-stories
May 31, 2012 at 2:32 pm
I will look into that, thank you! I had forgot to mention her size earlier, but she is built like a tank and does not know her own strength. She is completely tenderhearted and means no harm but she just doesn’t realize how strong she is, and how tickling isn’t always as much fun for everyone else as it is for her.
June 1, 2012 at 9:22 am
Tommy is in the same boat. He is twice the size of every kid in his class. And he is just having fun. It breaks my heart to tell him no when he is playing with “good intent”. I think that is another reason we prefer social stories. It is an easy out from having to be the bad guy who is always saying no. Good Luck!
Tina W. says:
May 31, 2012 at 7:06 pm
I am not very succinct, please bear with me.
My 6 year old son, dxed with pdd-nos and is mainstreamed.
We just had his first re-evaluation since age 3. The school psychologist recommended going back to our DX doctor and have him *undiagnosed* and have the autism removed from his record, in case he wants to have a top security clearance job in his future (like my husband, who is undxed). They suggest getting his dx switched to ADHD.
On one hand, my son is doing incredible – especially when we thought at age three, he was considered violent and we were not functioning as a family – he spent the majority of his day in a meltdown.
Now, he fully participates in class, including most recently (Feb ’12) – being able to change teachers successfully without an aid, to participate in his reading-level class. Most people (including teachers) do not have any idea he is on the spectrum (mostly because he is a rule-follower).
On the other hand however, his day is structured and scripted; which has helped him thrive. He can not tolerate the gen-ed bus. He can not tolerate lining up for recess, sudden noises or touches, or other people not following his scripted routines/following the rules.
He still qualifies for an IEP – but only in one area: adaptability. I’m assuming next year we will have to roll over to the 504 plan (which I refused this year).
I am wondering why the school would suggest removing his autism label. Do they have something to gain from it? IS it truly better for his future to NOT have a DX? They would like to have him (and his NT twin) tested for highly-capabile. Is that something they can not do with a DX?
I do not want to hold him back, but I do not want to be duped into giving up our legal protection.
His NT twin, who I suspect to be very ADHD, lost his IEP last year due to graduating from speech (which I didn’t agree with); now that we are looking at ADHD and sensory issues, we do not have legal protection and battle his teacher almost weekly about using aids (chewy, and having an aid remind him to go to the bathroom – he comes home soiled once a week).
My question really is: why would they encourage me to have him “undiagnosed”? Do they have something to gain from this? Can they graduate him off of an IEP if he no longer tests as needing one – and just needs supports?
What kind of supports would be available/are typical with ADHD kids with or without a DX?
Tina W. says:
May 31, 2012 at 7:10 pm
Oh, and although he is working at ‘pier-level’ for fine motor skills (writing, drawing, cutting) – he is receiving low marks for rushing and not being able to draw well, nor form his letters on a line and with punctuation/capitalization. That wasn’t marked as a qualifer for him, but if he gets low marks, how can it be pier level? Do schools consider anything “not completely failing” to be pier-level?
May 31, 2012 at 7:51 pm
I don’t want to sound paranoid here, but this sounds like they’re trying to do it for their benefit not his. What sounds especially weird to me is their basis for doing so. High security clearances go through all of your records not just the latest ones if they have a question with autism and they will question it even whether it’s been undiagnosed or not. I know an awful lot of schools are facing pressure to cut down their social services simply because of budgets.
On the other hand, I don’t think they’re trying to dupe you and are taking away your legal protection. I think they are being pressured to cut down on their special needs kids load and are therefore wanting those who are doing the best to no longer be special needs.
As someone who’s had Asperger’s 42 years as well as two children with Asperger’s I really don’t believe it’s something that goes away with training. It’s something you can learn to adapt to. The only possible reason to undiagnosed someone would be they never had first place. Even if he’s adapting perfectly well to a main treatment environment and handling the challenges that come is way, it will always be something that affects his life.
I especially wouldn’t do this at the age of six. He still has an awful lot of developmental and social hurdles coming up. Even if he’s doing very well now, that doesn’t mean that there’s not going to be things coming up that he’s going to need help with. It seems like there’s a misunderstanding here that you cannot be on the spectrum and be high functioning. I went through school in honors and AP classes, but that didn’t me I didn’t need help in certain areas. Of course, back in those days, there wasn’t any help available.
Autism doesn’t mean that you sit there in special ed in this disability services all your life. There are plenty of very successful professionals with autism. It doesn’t mean that you’ll be unable to function. It does mean that there will always be times which you will need some help in some areas. I think that this request to undiagnose your son simply comes from a basic misunderstanding of what autism is on their part.
Tina W. says:
June 1, 2012 at 10:56 pm
Thank you, John. That is exactly what I needed to hear! Legally, can we keep an IEP if he doesn’t need accommodations? Currently, they tested him and said he only needs accommodation in one area – but like you said, that can change with the developmental and social changes the future holds.
Erin says:
May 31, 2012 at 7:55 pm
It sounds to me like you already know what you should do. It sounds like you don’t agree with removing the diagnosis. You should follow your gut on this one. If he has no diagnosis, the school saves money on services they don’t have to offer him. You know your child best. Also, many children develop more issues as they near puberty. It might be harder for you to reapply for services by then if you lose the diagnosis now. Follow your own intuition on this. Good luck.
Tina W. says:
June 1, 2012 at 10:53 pm
Yes, I do not agree with removing the diagnosis – I want to keep the legal protection if we should need it in the future. It just really surprised me that the school would suggest having the DX reversed because he has progressed. That the school saves money makes perfect sense to me – that gives me understanding at why they would suggest it.
I do worry about future issues, especially around puberty and changes in schools as he ages, etc.
Are we entitled to keep him on an IEP if there are no accommodations necessary at this time, other than giving him advanced warnings of changes? Can they legal force us off an IEP if they determine he does not currently need services?
June 2, 2012 at 12:06 am
The Individualized Educational Plan (IEP) was created to keep schools from warehousing disabled and troubled students by putting them in one classroom that was out of the way and then ignoring them. I know this because I’m from the generation when they used to do this. It forces the school to, when they find a problem, at least think about what to do about it.
Not having an IEP simply means that a given child does not have any problems or disabilities that warrant any specialized instruction or accommodations. Having said that, I cannot conceive of a situation where a child with autism would not benefit from an IEP to at least communicate to the teachers and staff that they are on the spectrum and may need leeway in certain areas. To put it another way, someone on the spectrum will always be an autistic person in a neuro-typical world. This will always present challenges and opportunities that are different from the norm. I say this as a 42 year old man on the spectrum with two children on the spectrum as well.
As far as I understand, being on the spectrum is a federally recognized disability, and therefore you are always entitled to a IEP, even if there are no extra services required. As I may have said before, the focus of an IEP should always be focused on the welfare of the child involved, regardless of any other considerations. I would simply remind them that ASD does not go away, no matter how well the child is adapting. As long as there is a disability, an IEP is basically a requirement.
Erin says:
June 2, 2012 at 6:01 am
I often remind our team that if my child is doing well with the services provided, it does not mean that his autism is gone, or that he is cured, but rather it is proof that what we are doing is working and that those services are needed and warranted. They are covering their own behinds. You have to be the one looking out for your child.
June 1, 2012 at 8:50 pm
Still reading all the comments and I think it’s wonderful that this community is reaching out to one another.
I have something that I’d like some input on. I believe my son is “sensory-seeking”… please excuse me if I use terminology out of the correct context. I believe that I am also sort of sensory seeking because I am also sensitive to touch, but in a good way. I use it as another sense, like finding my way in the dark and being able to know exactly what I’m holding without looking. Superpowers? LOL… no. What I mean to say is that I have nurtured this sensitivity and use it to my advantage and view it as an asset and something to nurture and develop and not to downplay. I also have very good eye-hand coordination.
My thing is this… I would like to do the same for my son, to somehow open that up for him. How can I do this? His sense of touch is not so sensitive that would overwhelm him… He loves to be touched and I’d like to show him the possibilities but don’t know how…. Are there books out there that can speak to this? Does anyone know what I’m talking about?
June 1, 2012 at 11:34 pm
I wrote an article about sensory issues and autism for my local autism group (REACH for a difference of Abilene) that might have some of the information you are looking for. I’m looking for a place online to publish it, but haven’t found one so far. In the meantime, I would be glad to share it with you if you could send me a note at scintor@aol.com or on Facebook at http://www.facebook.com/Scintor . Sensory seeking and sensory overload are huge deals in my and my children’s life as well as many other people on the spectrum learning to identify what senses someone on the spectrum is sensitive to, both good and bad, can open up the world to them.
June 4, 2012 at 5:53 pm
Hi everyone,
I’m a teacher and am working to get my Master’s in Applied Behavior Analysis. I’m currently writing a family perspectives paper and need to contact parents of children with Autism to better understand the needs of family members of children with Autism. What can schools or communities do to assist family members? What type of support aren’t family members getting that teachers can provide or at lest get you the information for?
I would love any input! Please feel free to email me if you don’t want to reply to the comment at kmchri10@asu.edu.
Thanks,
mamabear99 says:
June 5, 2012 at 9:45 am
Does anyone have any suggestions of a method for teaching our son with Asberger’s how to spell? He is a phonetic speller and has been super frustrated with learning how to spell. Then again, he’s only 8 and maybe it’s not that important yet. I don’t know…thoughts?
Also…any suggestions for ways to encourage him to practice writing? I’m out of ideas. It is something we really need to work on.
Thanks!
akbutler says:
June 5, 2012 at 9:54 am
Do you have a tablet or iPad or iPhone? Or does his school? There are some great apps for teaching spelling, sounding out words, blending sounds, etc.
mamabear99 says:
June 5, 2012 at 10:00 am
Could you please tell me what the apps are? We school at home.
Thanks!
akbutler says:
June 5, 2012 at 10:12 am
Sure! Here are great places to look for apps for kids with Asperger’s and all special needs kids:
http://www.squidalicious.com/p/on-ipads.html (click on her spreadsheet)
Personally, we also have Rocket Speller and Build-A-Word, plus the Bob Books series which helps with reading too.
Separate from using apps, you can take words/sentences from his favorite books about preferred topics for him to copy and practice. A very very good friend gave me that idea and it’s a great way to feel a connection to the words.
Wattle says:
June 11, 2012 at 8:58 pm
Here are some other app lists:
June 7, 2012 at 7:34 pm
This is mostly just a vent, but also looking for advice from anyone who has any to give…. son is 5, to be 6 in the fall. ASD/Asperger’s/SPD/ADHD. Lots of sensory issues, lots of anxiety, bit of OCD. Went through a horrible, horrible, did I mention “Horrible”?, biting phase from the age of 3 though turning 5 last fall. He finally stopped, and I thought we’d made progress. Yesterday it started again, seemingly out of the blue when he’d not bitten at all in about 9 months or so… and it’s almost like we’re right back where we were before all of the OT and the iLs and the play therapy and the behavior therapy and the floortime and the music therapy… color me at wits end… what to do? thoughts, ideas, input welcome. He’s to start Kindergarten in the fall and this won’t fly at his new school.
June 7, 2012 at 7:46 pm
My son is in almost the same spot. But he is not facing a new school in the fall. We have had a lot of visitors to our home the last month and now we are facing the end of school for about three weeks. Thank goodness we will have school in July, but August will be no school again until after Labor Day. Is it possible your son in feeling anxiety about switching schools? A meet and greet or two before school starts might help relieve anxiety, if that is the issue.
June 8, 2012 at 6:37 am
My little guy is 5 with PDD. A couple of days ago he thought it was a good idea to remove his pants and underwear after school on the playground.
Full frontal nudity and 4or 5 older girls were sitting right there facing him.
Yesterday after school a few kids were calling him Wee Wee Boy. Others laughing. The trouble is that he looks typical a lot of the time but does things that are totally socially unacceptable to kids (and saying non-sensical things), Breaks a mama’s heart to see them turn on him.
Wattle says:
June 11, 2012 at 8:55 pm
I would be asking his teacher to identify the older children and discuss with them privately the fact that he has PDD and therefore challenges and that they are in effect bullying him and appealing to their better selves, should stop. It might work. Kids can be cruel but if they can be made to understand why he is doing it, perhaps if they were designated to help him out, then they might stop and be his advocates in future.
Mom2Kiddo says:
July 7, 2012 at 8:02 am
I know this won’t help the kids on the playground, but my son’s Kindergarten teacher said the best thing a parent can do is go and talk to the class about who your child is and why they act the way they do. She said the year goes much better. When I did it I talked about the similarities, how he tries to do his best just like they do.. I brought in a scribbled picture and talked about how proud I was of him. The expressions on their face were priceless! I talked about what they like, what he likes that is the same and the things that are different. AND the fact that he has autism and Fragile X which makes him different… along with a few of the things he struggles with. (He has super hero senses.. his hearing for example!) I did this same talk for his Sunday School class when he was out. The next week a kid said, “you mom told me your secret.. you are a super hero!” BA HA.
Of course the most important part is that they should never make fun of him or treat him mean. AND he learns by observing peers so they are often his teacher. I sent a note home to their parents just in case there were any conversations that could be had at home.
At the end when I asked them what questions they had they were things like, “what is his favorite color?” Ahh… gotta love kids!
As far as the older kids those comments would fall under bullying… which should be taken care of by the school.
Amy says:
June 13, 2012 at 10:10 am
My daughter’s doctor (developmental pediatrician) recommended medication for the first time yesterday. My daughter is 3 1/2 years old. The doctor is recommending Risperdal. She only wants her to take it “as needed.” I am so nervous and sick about it. It would be to help control irritability, aggressive beahviors (toward herself and my husband and I) and mood swings. My daughter does have these struggles, but I don’t know if they are severe enough for medication. Other than the aggressive behavior, I don’t know if the other symptoms are worse than many typical 3 year olds. I’m torn. I do want to try something to see if it will help her, but I definitely want the option of stopping immediately if we don’t like how it affects her. The thought of giving my baby an “anti-psychotic” medication makes me squirm. We recently started the gfcf diet (about a week ago) for her and she is scheduled to start ABA in August. I am tempted to wait on the medicine until we see if these two things help. Has anyone tried this medicine for a child this young? Why do these decisions have to be so difficult?
Erin says:
June 13, 2012 at 10:29 am
I have not tried any medications with my children, so I can’t speak to the pros and cons of the one your doctor is recommending, but I have learned that the very best thing you can do with any of these decisions is to follow your mommy gut. If you want to wait, then you should consider that as valid as any advice you receive from a professional. Also, it sounds like you are trying a bunch of stuff at once. Sometimes it helps to try just one thing at a time, so that if you see change (good or bad) you can attribute it to one thing instead of guessing at which therapy helped or hurt. This isn’t a sprint. It’s a marathon, so slow down and pace yourself a little. Take time to think things through, and most of all, trust your own instincts- you are the mom.
Wattle says:
June 13, 2012 at 6:10 pm
I have some friends with kids who have been given Risperdal and it certainly isn’t a “take as needed” medication, it has a long go on/come off period and has some fairly significant side effects although it can be very effective – these are older children. I agree with Erin, don’t try everything at once and given her age, I’d be trying behavioural interventions before medication as they can have considerable positive effects then if that doesn’t work or you need extra, then try the medication. Now this is just my opinion after I have watched other parents go down this route and when the behaviours after all other interventions haven’t been sufficient, then they have done medication but tried other things first.
Julie says:
June 22, 2012 at 1:43 pm
June 22, 2012 at 1:59 pm
I am taking my son for the formal autism evaluation at the center for disabilities and development at U of Iowa on Monday. Nervous does not begin to describe it. It took us a full year to get this appointment. Anyone have any tips or suggestions for me? Apparently it will take about 5 hrs with one break. My son is 5 yrs old, ADHD (H), SPD (seeking), and likely Asperger’s/HFA, but no idea what will come out Monday. He can have spectacular meltdowns and can be very aggressive. I don’t know what to think or how or if we should even try to prepare for this… any advice appreciated.
June 22, 2012 at 3:45 pm
Just take him just like he is. They are used to autistic behavior, and they want to see it. Just let him know that some doctors want some advice from him.
Erin says:
June 22, 2012 at 6:47 pm
Try to have a mental (or even better written) list of behaviors that you find concerning or “different” and how often during a day he does them. They have all these fun questionairres for moms and dads to fill out, and it can be kind of overwhelming to try to recall details of an “average” day in that setting. For example, my daughter toe walks and flaps so much, that I simply don’t notice it too much, but it now (now that it’s been pointed out to me by the pros) gets checked off as “often”. It’s hard to be objective in quantifying something that you associate with your child’s personality. It never dawned on me as being different that my son wouldn’t let you change the tooic of a conversation, but the psychologist picked up on it right away.
Most importantly, remember, whatever they tell you, you will leave that appointment with the same precious little boy you walked in with. You may just have a little more information and insight into who he is.
June 25, 2012 at 7:15 pm
Thanks, your replies were helpful. Much to my surprise, he was on ‘best ever’ behavior today and he ended up with a diagnosis of PDD-NOS (along with the ADHD and SPD). The Dr doing the evaluation said he fit the diagnostic criteria for Asperger’s but didn’t display the severity she would normally expect to see for that, so she was giving him PDD-NOS. I am not sure that makes sense, but I’m not a Dr, I don’t suppose there is much I can do about it, and I suppose it doesn’t matter in the long run… does it?
June 25, 2012 at 7:29 pm
It shouldn’t matter. He should qualify for assisted services, which is one of the main points of a diagnosis. The differences of Autism, Asperger’s Syndrome and PDD-NOS are often a matter of how well you are doing that day in my own experience. I would also urge you to remember that people on the spectrum are capable of amazing things like artistic and scientific achievement that no one else in the world can. He is a wonder on his own merit and with your support and some help from others, he will amaze you.
June 26, 2012 at 2:21 am
Thanks, John. We’ve been operating on an ‘as if’ basis for two years now, as every therapist we’ve seen was convinced he had “either Asperger’s or HFA” along with the other things. I denied it, argued at first, but it became clearer to me as he approached 5 years old.
He is very bright, very inventive. He is teaching himself Japanese from Godzilla videos. He mostly taught himself to read, seemingly over night. He has a huge vocabulary which he uses mostly correctly (not entirely). There was no significant language delay when a period of physical deafness is taken into account. The big problems are social, non-verbal communication, and emotional (frustration tolerance/anger/aggression)/sensory.
I know he has a chance to do amazing things. I know this. Yet, today, putting my signature on that line adding this diagnosis to his medical record, and hearing someone else say those words to me still felt like a kick in the gut, which I for some inexplicable reason was absolutely not expecting.
So thank you again for your words of encouragement. They mean the world to me tonight.
June 26, 2012 at 10:52 am
Your quite welcome. I am both on the spectrum (Asperger’s) and have two kids on the spectrum. I get worried and annoyed by some groups that treat autism as a fate worse than death. There are plenty of successful adults out there on the spectrum, so there is no reason to lose heart because of a diagnosis. That’s not to say that everything will be sunshine and roses. There are going to be a lot of challenges and hard times, but it is also not time for sackcloth and ashes.
June 26, 2012 at 1:07 pm
What does a neuropsych do and when would they come into play? My son is 7 and was diagnosed PDD-NOS 2 years ago. Since then he has received OT, PT, and SLT (for communication skills) through the school system. He also attends an outside social skills group run by a psychotherapist, and outside OT when we can get insurance to agree to it. He is completely verbal and has some sensory issues. We only saw the developmental pediatrician for the diagnosis and our regular pediatrician is useless for autism. So I’ve been flying solo, and I’d like to get a professional co-pilot on board. Right now I pass some things through the psychotherapist, who is wonderful, but I’m wondering if a neuropsych should be a part of our team? Thanks.
racheld says:
January 2, 2015 at 2:01 am
hi, i don’t have an answer for you and i know this was posted a long time ago, but i am in a similar situation now with my 6 1/2 year old daughter and am curious what path you took. thanks.
Stacy says:
June 26, 2012 at 10:23 pm
Okay, I’m out of ideas and would love any suggestions. My son is almost 5 and has had aggressive behaviors in the past – hitting and kicking mostly, but also biting occasionally. I was so happy about a year ago when he seemed to be controlling himself better and we weren’t seeing those behaviors. Then a few months ago, the aggressive behaviors started again worse than before. There are some clear triggers, one being when other children cry; he just loses it every time. However, sometimes there is no clear trigger for the agression. For example, today he was getting into his carpool for school and bit a girl for no apparent reason. We’ve tried everything we can think of: social stories, sticker charts, time-outs, Listerine on his tongue for biting. Nothing seems to help much or for very long. He does know that he’s not supposed to hurt people, and celebrates with us when he is able to cover his ears or walk away instead of hit/kick/bite. But sometimes it seems like he just can’t let go of something until he hurts someone. I’m so frustrated and out of ideas. Any suggestions?!?
June 27, 2012 at 9:37 am
Stacy, I had many of the same problems with my (now 5.5 yr old) son too. It was especially bad from the age of 2.5 – 5. We were desperate for solutions and it seemed that nothing was working. We also tried all of the things you mention, the charts, the punishments, the rewards, the encouragement. Every child is different and I can’t begin to say that what helped us will help your son, but in the end my son was most helped by three things: OT, iLs therapy, and ultimately guanfacine (he also has severe ADHD). Of the three, the guanfacine was the turning point, but by itself wasn’t the answer. We still deal with aggression, but not multiple times per day at school like in the past and not with the severity we used to see. The iLs and the OT seemed to help with the sensory issues which were underlying a lof of the aggressive episodes and I think the guanfacine helps a tiny bit with his impulse control. We also cleaned up his diet a lot, removing preservatives and food colorings and upping protein intake and limiting sugars… but I can’t say if that actually helped or not (I think it did, but no proof and ymmv). Wish I had more/better information to pass along…
July 3, 2012 at 11:28 am
My 7 yo daughter has a PDD-NOS diagnosis and is currently taking Celexa for anxiety issues. Celexa has helped tremendously in her ability to sleep at night and in her own room, not sure how much it has helped with her overall anxiety levels, particularly in regards to school. Her pediatric neurologist now wants to start her on Intuniv to help with attention and focus. (She tends to drift off into her own world and has trouble concentrating at school.) Anybody have experience with Intuniv and care to share your story? My daughter is very high functioning, verbal, few emotional outbursts, and primarily struggles with extended concentration and social skills.
July 3, 2012 at 11:41 am
Suzanne, see my reply to Stacy just above your original post here. My son, 5 soon to be 6, diagnosed with ADHD and SPD and also just formally diagnosed PDD-NOS started on Intuniv in March. After a few weeks we switched him to the generic, guanfacine, b/c it is shorter acting and he had some troubles with getting too lethargic in the afternoons on the longer acting Intuniv (name brand). The switch did the trick. We no longer see the lethargy and we are also not seeing any notable side effects. He continues to take the short acting generic at 1mg 2x daily and it does seem to help — some, it’s no miracle cure — with the attention issues and for him also with impulse control and aggression. That said, I have not seen that it has helped in any other way with social issues for him… but it does seem to help with attention for him. Just our recent experience, but I hope it helps!
July 3, 2012 at 11:43 am
Oh, and, sorry, meant to add, we saw similar benefits on the Intuniv as we do on the guanfacine… but the lethargy wasn’t acceptable and did not go away after a few weeks as purported.
July 3, 2012 at 4:11 pm
Be very careful. These classes of medication tend to work differently for each individual. Knowing how it worked on one person may not tell you how it will work for your daughter. If you try it, watch her carefully and ask her questions. It took me nearly 20 years to find a good balance of medications to help with some of my autistic symptoms with side effects I could tolerate. We are still tweaking those for my two children. Be patient, because there isn’t any other way forward besides trial and error.
Sarah T says:
July 5, 2012 at 1:05 pm
What a wonderful resource! It’s beautiful to see everyone banding together here in support of one another!
I am mama to an amazing little girl, almost 3, who has the super powers of Asperger’s. We are blessed to live big with this sweet girl. Big joys and big sorrows.
We’re having one of those days. The ones that creep up without warning and every reaction to every event of days past come pouring out of a tiny body at a speed like no other. The broken pieces of my heart shatter a little more on these days as I try everything I know to bring peace to my baby and it’s still not enough.
This too shall pass and we will find peace again for a moment but what I’m hoping you can help me with is how you boost your spirit on these days? Where do you turn? What do you do to find hope and acceptance on these days? For me it’s an ongoing process but I’m in need of some new material.
To be on point…we just settled a two hour meltdown. Her little body was filled with the stresses of celebrating the 4th. She’s sleeping peacefully now. I’m feeling sad and broken down as is typical after the storm. What would you do for yourself at this point to return to a positive attitude, to prepare yourself to tackle the rest of the day?
July 5, 2012 at 1:42 pm
Oh honey, we all know this feeling. It hurts so much to watch your child struggle and heaven knows it’s exhausting for both of you.
Use the time while she recharges to do the same – find a quiet space for yourself, take a quick bath, step outside and feel the sunshine on your face.
Allow yourself the room that you need to recover your energy, just as she is while she sleeps.
The positivity can be tough to find, but it’s in there. Hope is ALWAYS in there. And it does get better over time. Together, the two of you will both amass tools that will make these times less frequent – more avoidable.
In the meantime, when time’s are hardest, I take comfort in Mary Anne Radmacher’s words –
“Courage doesn’t always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, “I will try again tomorrow.”
Hang in there. And remember to take care of YOU.
July 5, 2012 at 1:59 pm
Jess, I want to thank you so much for writing this blog. I cannot express how much it has helped me the last few weeks as we try to move around this maze of IEPs, therapies, preschools, diagnoses, etc. There are days where I am not sure how I can do it. My husband is so optimistic and I am too but all the worries from Will he be bullied? to Will he ever have a friend? come streaming at me all at once. Luckily he is three and actually can speak so we are blessed to have that. And man, he is smart and funny to boot. Did I mention handsome? In all seriousness, I just want to thank you for this. The last few days have been especially hard and I am become more and more worried about renting a house on the Cape with a group of friends. Although they understand, will they really when he has a freakout? I suppose I can take this all in stride and just enjoy each moment to its fullest and not dwell on the what ifs, and negatives. Just thanks.
July 5, 2012 at 6:50 pm
tis fills my heart. and i know the worry and the fear and the what the hell do we do? you try.
the jay train says:
July 10, 2012 at 7:03 am
Hi Everyone. I know Jess has written a few times about Brooke and the repeating game she likes. I haven’t seen any other moms whose blogs I follow talk about the same thing but my son (who is 4 and just beginning to say a few words) does a similar thing. I’m wondering if it’s something that he will grow out of (I know no-one can answer that) or if there are any strategies that we might use to curb the frequency of it. He really gets bent out of shape and cries real tears if (for example) we are driving down the road and he sees a sculpture of a lion and then he says “lion” but we don’t repeat it. We usually indulge him but sometimes we just miss it or don’t understand the word that he’s saying so we can’t repeat it and he has a major meltdown. Any help/advice would be appreciated. Thanks.
July 10, 2012 at 7:48 am
Autistic kids have a hard time with social communication and connection, but this doesn’t mean that they do not crave it. This game is a form of social communication and connection for him, and therefore essential to him. He is trying desperately to share his world with you. My suggestion would be that rather than indulging him, that you join him. Engage with him in the game and slowly add rules that make things easier. Two rules I would add are that you get to point things out to him and he has to say them, and a “repeat rule” where he has to say the word again before you say it. This should be done at home where things don’t pass out of sight to get the new rules down before it is played in the car. I hope this is helpful to you.
Jenn says:
July 10, 2012 at 8:23 am
My son used to be like yours with the meltdowns if we did not repeat what he said. In my opinion, it wasn’t functional for us to just repeat exactly what he said back to him, so we started to elaborate on what he said. For example, when your son says “lion” I would reply with, ” I see the lion. A lion roars really loud.” He got upset at first with us not repeating him exactly, but after a while he started to repeat more words that we said. So he would say “lion” and I would reply with “I see the lion. A lion roars really loud.” and he would say “Lion roars!” and giggle. It’s all about expanding the communication while giving him the reassurance that you understand what he’s saying. I’m no expert, this is just what has worked in my experience. Best of luck to you!
the jay train says:
July 10, 2012 at 9:15 am
Thank you for the suggestions. We will work on them and see how it goes. This support page is a really great resource Love to you all!
July 11, 2012 at 4:27 pm
Hi all — I haven’t posted here before but just lurking and reading has been helpful.
Today, I mostly just need a spot to vent for a minute – but who knows, maybe there will be help out there too!
My son N is 7 and seems to mostly be dealing with sensory processing issues. It was a heck of a year at school trying to deal with this new reality, but by the end of the school year I felt we were starting to get a handle on things.
Then – he and his dad went to visit grandma for three weeks.
I arrived today. Took an overnight train and crashed for a nap when I got in.
Right now N and I are sitting on the floor of the local multiplex playing on our iPhones, while dad and aunt and grandma are inside watching Madagascar 3D. Why? Because apparently no one listened to me when I reminded them to ask him if he wanted to go. Or if he was okay with the 3D. (I thought they had, but I was asleep so I just trusted then to do it.) This is a kid who can’t handle noises; needs earplugs for even regular movies; and needs a lot of prep for that kind of outing. But no, they wanted to see this showing, so that’s that.
So when we arrived he had a total meltdown. No surprise. Wouldn’t set foot in the theatre. And apparently dad had purged the earplugs I keep in the car. (why??)
He’s fine now, curled up in my lap on the floor. And I don’t care about the wasted $ for the tickets, because it’s not my fault (and I really didn’t want to see this anyway!)
But I’m not looking forward to dealing with grandma’s cluelessness when they get out; and I’m out of reason pissed at dad. Which I probably won’t express because it won’t make any difference.
Ugh. Just, why? Why am I his only advocate, the only one who listens to him? This meltdown, today, didn’t have to happen. And I’m angry. For him.
Not really expecting an answer…..but thanks for listening. I just needed to get it off my chest.
July 30, 2012 at 12:41 pm
I’m sorry you are in that position! I’ve spent many a day huddled on the floor of a movie theater/shopping mall/front lawn of a birthday party… My heart goes out to you. I’m sorry his needs are falling on deaf ears around you. Stay strong – you’re doing what’s right for your boy.
Kim says:
August 7, 2012 at 8:37 am
Keep on keeping on Mom. I have found that it is hardest for those who don’t deal with it as much. My in-laws don’t have a clue as to how to deal, but after 5 years my mother-in-law will now ask questions.
July 24, 2012 at 11:19 am
Anyone with advice on getting a 5 yr old sensory seeker to use the potty? He is perfectly content to sit in a wet or dirty pull up, unless he is painting. He is not severly affected.. he was briefly trained last year and now, not so much. I was hoping he would be out of his pull ups for kindergarten, but I just don\’t know.
July 30, 2012 at 3:26 pm
I would suggest a set of rules with rewards. (e.g. children who use the potty right get a Popsicle. Children who have no accidents get to pick a movie to watch after dinner. Children who go for a week without an accident get a new movie or game.) It’s hard to do without threats or breaking the rules for your own convenience, but it can be effective.
Erin says:
August 7, 2012 at 11:22 am
My daughter is five, just about to enter kindergarten, and we have had our share of potty training struggles too! We finally got her trained just about a month ago (Bribery finally worked! “I can’t afford to buy you that princess dress so long as I still have to buy you diapers….”) but it was way more than bribery. While she was in preschool her OT stumbled upon something called the “potty watch” (you can google it, it costs about $12). It is simple – you set the timer, and it goes off every 30,60 or 90 minutes. It lights up and plays a song, then resets itself. It gave her a measure of control over being responsible for remembering to go instead of us nagging her all the time. It did keep her mostly dry during school (until she started getting bored with it after three or four months). But it did help her lay the groundwork, so to speak. She started to understand the concept of going potty regularly a little better. The other kids in her class seemed to think it was just a neat toy watch…. I’ve also noticed that if she is wearing pull ups, she is more likely to use them. Her OT thinks she likes the feel of the wet diaper along with the extra weight on her waist. Underwear doesn’t seem to provide that as much (I know it’s a laundry risk, but actually seems to be working so far). Good luck. I totally understand your frustration.
August 7, 2012 at 2:49 pm
This is also helpful for me. I don’t know when to begin potty training for my 3 year old who is finally to take her pants down, but many times will not let us know when she has soiled diaper,etc. I will look into the potty watch.
Erin says:
August 7, 2012 at 3:15 pm
I think the website was pottytimeinc.com, if that helps. We are talking about starting to potty train my almost three year old. She is nonverbal, deaf, low-tone, etc. (we have three kids on the spectrum) but she is starting to leave the room when it’s time for her to “go.” We’re going to start with the potty watch, and see what happens. Anyone with any advice on potty-training someone with no expressive language, feel free to give me some advice– It took me three years to potty train the last one and she could talk!
July 30, 2012 at 12:46 pm
In light of the Joe Scarborough debacle, as Jess called it – I wrote a song about my baby… about our babies. I wanted to share it and wasn’t sure where to do that so this seemed like the best place. As Jess said, spread respect, love, understanding… that’s the purpose of this post… I appreciate having such a great community to reach out to… Heres’ the lyrics… followed by a link to vimeo…
“As the mother of a child with Asperger’s (Dear Joe Scarborough)…”
I got a lot of things I can’t count on
Round and round…
I see me runnin toward my baby
I know you’re scared
I know some days seem too big to be carried…
And says: “Mama, I see those angels dancing…”
He says: “Mama, do you see those angels dancing?”
I got a lot of wishes I can’t make go away
And he’s sitting in that corner while the other children play…
I know you’re scared
I know some days seem just too big to be carried…
And he touches my face but looks out at the world go by
And he says: “Mama I see those snowflakes laughing.”
He says: “Mama I see those snowflakes laughing.”
Man I see those snowflakes!
That’s when I think that sometimes …
That’s when I think that sometimes…
Oh my baby I wish I was a little more like you…
Oh my baby, I’d like to be a little bit more like you…
Kim says:
August 7, 2012 at 8:24 am
As a mom with an aspie daughter, I so agree “I wish I was a little more like you…”
autism says:
August 6, 2012 at 9:13 pm
I am new to this blog and so excited to be a part of the forum. My 3 year old daughter was diagnosed over a year ago. Every day is a challenge and new beginning. My daughter is the love of my life and my husbands. Recently she has been going through extreme behavioral changes.
Pulling her shirt over her head
Leaning over the couch
Pulling her hair
Major fits
I do have help in addition to where she is in school full time (9-4) once a week in home by a psychologist. It is just so stressful and at times I feel overwhelmed.
If you have any good tips or ideas, it would be appreciated. I also have a facebook page Autism-bridge.
I am not giving up or put blame on my sweet daughter. I only want the best for her in life.
August 7, 2012 at 4:51 am
JIll, My first instinct is to ask if she might be having GI / tummy trouble. The list of behaviors that you mention – pulling her shirt off, pulling her hair, but especially the leaning over the couch lead me to the question. When my girl’s got a tummy ache, the first thing she seeks is pressure to relieve it. If your little one’s in pain and doesn’t have the means to communicate it to you, the behaviors you describe would make a lot of sense.
August 7, 2012 at 12:58 pm
Is there a specialist I should go to for this? I will check with the psychologist as well to get her opinion. I have been learning how to use reinforcers (chips, crackers, ipad, ball toy, puzzles, bubbles,etc) and other strategies to help when her behavior is difficult.
Thanks for your help.
August 7, 2012 at 1:20 pm
Yes, a pediatric gastroenterologist (GI specialist) – preferably one with experience with autism if possible.
And the reinforcers are one thing, but I find that it’s VERY important to figure out WHAT Brooke is communicating with her behavior before trying to alter it. If a child is in pain – whether from sensory over- or under- stimulation or GI distress or anxiety or myriad other factors, a cookie may change the way that they express that pain, but it doesn’t get any closer to alleviating it.
August 7, 2012 at 11:04 am
One of the most important things to learn about in order to understand anyone on the spectrum is sensory issues. People on the spectrum really experience the world differently because our senses are set at a different level than the average person. These may be extremely high or extremely low. I wrote an article here http://autismtothefourth.blogspot.com/2012/06/sensory-issues-in-autism.html in which I go into detail about sensory issues.
Also, at your daughter’s age, it is very difficult to tell a meltdown from a tantrum, but this is a very important difference. Meltdown are caused be becoming overloaded (either emotionally or by sensory overload) and become involuntary once started. Tantrums can be dealt with by rules and consequences, but meltdowns have to be dealt with by removing her from the things that are overloading her and getting her where she can recover. I would also suggest visiting some adult autism self-advocate sites, as I have found they have much better and more practical advice than sites of “autism experts” who have not lived through a lifetime with autism.
August 7, 2012 at 12:59 pm
Thanks John, I will look into your suggestions. It is appreciated to get any feedback, especially personal insight that you have experience with.
August 7, 2012 at 1:34 pm
I’d love to find more resources and support for kiddos that are nonverbal. Our 4-yr son is nonverbal and has a Vantage Lite communication device. This year he has taken more ownership of this talker and able to make more requests. However, I know he has more to share and I’m trying to find more support for him but also our family including his brothers. Thanks.
August 7, 2012 at 4:59 pm
John Mark McDonald, I always find your responses so very helpful and easy to understand. Thank you for contributing and helping out here.
Linda says:
August 23, 2012 at 6:40 am
Does anyone know good stories or social stories about gettInv braces? My 9 yo daughter with ASD is about to start that process and could use some stories to guide her.
Luna says:
August 23, 2012 at 11:34 am
oi, i have no advice but i’m waiting to see what is posted. my 10 year old will need braces soon and my gut knots up anytime i think about it.
Erin says:
September 2, 2012 at 8:21 pm
Hi Jess and everyone!
I hate to bug you on a holiday weekend, but I could use a teensy favor. You know your friend at Luck to Tuck? I have a friend like that too. I mentioned her to you in a comment on Welcome to the Club when you were on your island getaway last winter. Anyway, her son has been fighting neuroblastoma for seven years. He is 11 now, and his little brother is good friends with my son. One thing that means SO much to her is the gold ribbon for Childhood Cancer Awareness month – which just so happens to be September. Since you have such a huge stage, of skilled autism mamas who are great at spreading awareness and advocating, I was hoping you might just give it a mention somehow. It would make a world of difference to these families- just to have another group of parents take up there cause, just a little.
Here’s a little something I wrote earlier today, for a little background – statistics, etc. I know you’re busy, but just thought it wouldn’t hurt too much to ask. Thanks.
September 2, 2012 at 9:38 pm
Thank you for sharing this story about your friend. This is another topic near and dear to my family. A dear childhood friend lost her 4 year old daughter 2 years ago to neuroblastoma. I would be happy to help spread the news. Thank you for letting us know.
My husband is the manager of a restaurant where we live and this Thursday they are donating 10% of their proceeds from the ENTIRE DAY to St. Jude’s. I’m so proud of him for initiating this and seeing it through!
September 3, 2012 at 6:53 am
erin, thanks for sharing. i posted the link on twitter. no child should have to face that. xo
September 3, 2012 at 5:02 pm
I was wondering if anyone else has their child on Risperdal? My daughter, who is 8, started displaying SIB of biting her hands, wrists, and arms when she got upset or frustrated. Our developmental pediatrician prescribed Risperdal .25ml once a day. The medicine has worked wonders for her and the biting has almost completely stopped; maybe one or two bites a day. But now I’m noticing that her chest has started to sprout, and she is developing breasts. Does anyone know if this is a side affect? I’ve googled and have looked at the paperwork the doctor gave me; but I don’t see anything about this. Thanks in advance for your questions or comments~Amber
Rebecca says:
September 5, 2012 at 8:33 am
Your daughter may have an excess of prolactin (same hormone that in high enough doses brings on lactation) activating breast growth/development while not actually bringing on puberty. I would discuss this possibility with your developmental pediatrician, they should be able to determine this with a blood test.
September 10, 2012 at 8:47 pm
Hi there. Looking for good books to use as support in discussing autism/Aspergers with my 8 year old son. Thanks so much for any recommendations!
September 10, 2012 at 10:04 pm
l agree with “All Cats have Aspergers”. Also, “What it is to be me: An Asperger Kid book.
We just recently told our 8 year old that he is autistic and has Aspergers. We spent time reading both of those books with him. He seemed to like both books.
Wattle says:
September 10, 2012 at 9:27 pm
“All cats have Aspergers” is a very good book
September 11, 2012 at 9:14 am
I am in need of some ideas on how to handle a sudden, drastic, downward spiral. My 5 yr old son (soon to be 6, just started Kindergarten, officially PDD-NOS, but really more like mild Asperger’s, ADHD, SPD) had been doing fairly well in recent weeks.
Suddenly, seemingly out of the blue two days ago it was like someone flipped a switch. Every tiny little thing is sending him into severe and immediate meltdown mode. He is suddenly perceiving slights where there are none and getting complete and totally out of control and is suddenly RIGHT on that very knife edge every minute of every day. It was so horrible yesterday morning that I didn’t think I could possibly send him to school and contemplated taking him to the hospital though I wasn’t sure what would happen if I did (so I didn’t).
Things as simple as me asking what he wants for breakfast, him not deciding, and his father, joking, saying something like “Why don’t you have a can of sardines!” (they had just watched Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs, where sardines are all the people have to eat before the machine is invented and of course no one liked them)… sends him into uncontrollable fits and screaming “YOU HATE ME! YOU’RE MAKING FUN OF ME!” If he sees or hears someone laughing he thinks that somehow they are laughing at HIM even if they have not interacted with him at all and aren’t looking at him, and are clear across the playground etc. He suddenly thinks everything that anyone does is directly related to him personally.
This is a huge and drastic and sudden change and I can not find rhyme or reason for it.
He is on guanfacine, 1.5mg 2x daily. He takes fish oil and a daily vitamin. We occasionally use melatonin, but haven’t in a long while. He sees a play therapist, a music/ floor time therapist, is starting ABA Social Skills therapy tonight, is on a waiting list for ABA therapy, and spent 1.5 years in OT though we’re on a break from that right now due to insurance red tape and “lack of therapeutic progress” or something.
Have you ever experienced this? What do you do in this situation? Who do you call? Where do you start? I’m at a loss….
Erin says:
September 11, 2012 at 9:36 am
I am sorry you are having such a tough time, and yes, we have experienced this too. My older son goes through periods like this, often when something has happened at school- either someone has picked on him, or he has perceived that they have picked on him. It often takes a while to drag it out of him. The other times I have noticed it has been when he gets MSG (listed on ingredients lists as monosodium glutamate). It is in all those prepackaged snacks that kids love to take to school with them – doritos, cheese puffs, vegetable dips, etc. it took me a while to catch on to it, but wow, what a difference it makes in him. We’ve found that Red dye #40 also affects him, but in a different (also not good) way. Kids are often eating different things at school than they are during the summer. It could also be just settling into the big transition of the school schedule. Usually the first couple weeks are kind of a getting to know you period, and then the real work starts – this could be like a separate transition for him. Talk to the teacher, the lunch lady and any other “spies” you may have at school to see if anything is up. Then try to keep your routine at home as tame as you can. Take a deep breath and just try to keep your cool through the storms – they will pass. I can’t comment on the medication, as my kids don’t take any, but I would try to keep everything – meal times, bedtimes, any other family routines and vitamins, as consistent as possible during a transition like starting school. Keep your chin up.
September 11, 2012 at 9:44 am
Thanks, Erin. We’ve already eliminated most/all food coloring (he especially reacts to red and yellow), preservatives of most types, and really severely limit processed foods of all sorts and he gets no junk foods like chips etc. He packs his lunch most days, but has had a few school lunches, so you may be on to something there. I’ve not looked for MSG, but I will now, thanks.
September 11, 2012 at 9:47 am
I should probably also mention that he has started throwing himself on the floor, thrashing around insanely, playing helpless for no apparent reason, and yelling things like “I can’t stand up! I don’t have any hands!” and other really bizarre things… I have never, ever seen him act like this…
Erin says:
September 11, 2012 at 9:56 am
Mine do that too. The weird thing is (I have 3 on the spectrum ages 8, 5, and almost 3), it seems like when they hit age 5, everything just kind of blows up – becomes way more obvious. I have no idea why, but it did with my son, and it’s now happening with my 5 year old (kindergarten too!) daughter… I have learned to just stand back as much as possible (so long as they are safe). Whenever I engaged my son in that way, it would just amplify the meltdown. It is NOT easy. Often these “tantrums” go on for upwards of an hour. I try to get them to a quiet cooling off place, like their room, or the car if we’re out. It often involves me carrying them (autism is like a great gym sometimes.;) ). Don’t worry about what anyone else is thinking at that point. The more intense he gets, the more calm and matter of fact you need to be. Over time, you will help hime learn coping skills to calm himself. When the event is over, and you have had time to separate from the episode., talk to him about it. There is no point in trying when he is thrashing. It WILL get better. Right now it just feels like you are running a marathon at a sprinter’s pace, but it will get better. I equate it to an asthma attack – when I have one asthma attack, for the rest of the day, my lungs are a bit more sensitive, and smaller things will set off another attack. For my kids the meltdowns are the same way, so keep that in mind for after it happens too. I have even explained that to my son (after he calms). Him being aware of that seems to help him.
September 11, 2012 at 10:19 am
Thank you, Erin… I so needed to hear that right now…. I was beginning to fear he was having some sort of psychotic break or something. I will attack it with calm and persistence and we will see how it goes. Thank you again!
Erin says:
September 11, 2012 at 10:22 am
Anytime. We’re all right here, anytime you need us. {{Hugs}}
September 12, 2012 at 8:09 am
Oh gosh, I remember worrying that my little guy was having a psychotic break in Kindergarten too. For my little guy it was anxiety that was driving the crazy thinking. The school behaviorist working with him an hour a week, and a very gentle treatment from the teacher worked wonders.
September 12, 2012 at 11:01 am
Thanks, Kinder, that’s good to hear!
September 13, 2012 at 4:53 pm
Can anyone suggest ideas for how I can prepare for my daughters IEP meeting? She will be 4 yes old end of December and about to change from a private Aba therapy full time program the I loved and saved her life.
She is transferring schools in two weeks where she will go to a public charter school for autistic kids.
This is all new to me and would appreciate any advice. I know in time through experience things will get easier, atleast I hope.
The IEP meeting is supposed to be 3 weeks from when she starts October 1.
Thanks for the support!
Feedback is appreciated.
Erin says:
September 13, 2012 at 6:15 pm
I actually don’t have a lot of experience with IEPs since my older two go to private school, but we just had our first IEP for my youngest yesterday. It would probably be helpful if you could talk to her team at her former school. Perhaps they may have some ideas of goals for you. Also, old treatment plans and evealuations might be helpful. One thing that we put into ours was an observation period for the PT and OT at the school to watch my daughter and evaluate her over 30 days and then come up with a treatment plan and goals that will be added into her IEP. We are sending our daughter to an approved private school, so they are very good at writing IEPs that protect the kids. My assumption is that if she is going to a specialized school, they may be less adversarial than a “mainstream” school, but that’s just a guess. Go in with your ideas. Listen to theirs. Then take the draft home and look it over before you sign it. Make sure the goals are not too vague. I’m pretty sure you can bring whoever you want as well, so it might be helpful to bring some of her current teachers or therapists if you can. (I brought three with me.) At least bring one other person you trust for moral support, if nothing else. Look through the comments here too, I think there has been some good (way better than mine!) advice given in the past on this. Good luck!!
September 13, 2012 at 6:14 pm
Hi there. The best advice I’ve ever gotten from an advocate friend of mine is to be nice and never say what you “want’ for your child. Never say, what I want for my child is… – Politely say: what my child needs is blank – how can you provide this to her/him? – sometimes language makes all the difference. Also, it empowered me to realize that I am not asking for favors for them to help me – they are required to provide the help my child needs and me “advocating” for him – literally means I am speaking for him. Not asking for favors.
Of course, this requires that you know what it is your child needs at this point, going into this new school and that can sometimes be the most scary thing. Hopefully you have at least an idea of some supports that help her already, some supports you would like to try and if not, then I would go with what they suggest and if you don’t see any progress or if anything they’re suggesting is detrimental – then you have the right to request another meeting at any time during the year to reevaluate.
I remember my first iep – i was terrified, it was very scary and the people on the other side of the table knew how new I was to the whole process and quite honestly, counted on me to not make waves, to not ask questions…
Hopefully you have/will have a great team and they really will be doing everything they can for your child – but if you don’t understand something they’re saying, an acronym they’re using – anything at all – it is your right to understand them. And not be intimidated.
It’s a great thing to ask questions – if the team is annoyed by your asking or you get the feeling in any way at all that they are burdened by what you’re asking for – then that’s a great red flag and you know you need to keep your eyes open and might possibly have to look into getting an advocate on your side.
I sincerely hope it doesn’t come to that for you – It’s just good to know that there are options out there should you need them.
I hope it goes well!
September 13, 2012 at 6:20 pm
“One thing that we put into ours was an observation period for the PT and OT at the school to watch my daughter and evaluate her over 30 days and then come up with a treatment plan and goals that will be added into her IEP”
Wow, great advice – especially if this is a totally new environment for her and you’re not really sure how she’s going to respond.
September 13, 2012 at 7:26 pm
Thank you for the response. I feel like there is so much to know, but with communication and the appropriate support I will feel in contol of getting what my daughter needs. I will keep what you suggested in mind.
September 13, 2012 at 8:25 pm
Thanks so much for the support. I will continue to share my concerns.
Rebecca says:
September 14, 2012 at 10:44 am
Bring snacks! The team at your school are working hard. These meetings tend to be emotional and difficult and they have numerous meetings to attend, though you are only there for one. We always bring coffee and pastries to show appreciation for the team working with our child and because it improves everyone’s mood.
September 14, 2012 at 12:10 pm
That is a great idea, I will bring some goodies and treats. Everyone usually likes sweets!
September 14, 2012 at 12:11 pm
Thank you. That is a great idea, I will bring some goodies and treats. Everyone usually likes sweets!
Lisa says:
September 14, 2012 at 2:47 pm
Hey! My friend just had her daughter re-evaluated. Her DD is middle-school, on autism spectrum and ADHD. She is feeling lost because so many bloggers have boys or younger girls. Anyone have a similar situation To hers? Also, any recs for literature for a mom with a daughter on the spectrum??
the jay train says:
September 14, 2012 at 2:49 pm
I have younger boys but I do read this blog. Maybe she can check here. I don’t know if that will help her. http://emmashopebook.com/
September 14, 2012 at 2:55 pm
Great advice, I will try to be assertive at these meetings. It all seems so overwhelming. I am an advocate and will do what is possible for my daughter. Thank you
September 16, 2012 at 4:01 pm
Today was such a great day, but also at very stressful. My daughter who I adore, many times for attention will take off her clothes, lean over the couch or even bend back on the booster.
What are some proactive suggestions?
I was recently trained with a psychologist, but any support and feedback that has worked is appreciated.
Thanks so much
September 16, 2012 at 9:28 pm
Please be careful before you decide that her behavior is attention seeking. Many behaviors that seem like attention seeking in people on the spectrum are actually reactions to sensory issues or emotional overload. I have both a boy and a girl on the spectrum and have Asperger’s myself. I cannot tell you the number of times I or my children were accused of attention seeking when actually is was sensory issues or emotional overload. On the other hand, like any child, your daughter will do things to get your attention.
What caught my attention was your mention of of her specific behaviors. Autistic children who take off their clothes is a classic indication of over sensitivity to touch. My 13 year old son to this day prefers to wear his shirts inside out because the feeling of the seems and tags are a constant source of irritation to him. The bending over a couch or the booster chair may a need for stimulation of the sense of balance or deep muscle pressure. I wrote an article on sensory issues that can be found here:
Without knowing more about the situation, I really can’t say more. I am available anytime to talk about this or any other autism issue.
September 23, 2012 at 9:12 pm
Tonight was very upsetting and stressful. My autistic daughter who is almost 4, is truly the love of my life. However, even with unconditional love a mom can have her moments of inner meltdowns. When Zoey starts doing things to act out like very wild at the dinner table, or running to couch where she will lean over, I know it’s either for attention or very overtired.
What happened that upset me was after her bath, Zoey was determined to bring the mini trampoline downstairs. Well, I have to walk or carry her down stairs since she is not able to on her own. She wanted the trampoline down at that moment. I took her down stair and than planned to bring the trampoline down once I got Zoey safely in the living room. The next things I feel for the first time was my hair being pulled by Zoey while she giggled and thought this was funny. As I tried to pull her hands off my hair, I began to raise my voice which only pushed her to pull my hair more. My husband luckily was home and able to assist.
In addition, after I was more calm and felt bad that the situation got so escalated, I went over to my daughter for a hug and kiss. I felt bad as being autistic and I know 3 yr old children do these things, it was still hard to handle. My daughter also bit me on the leg before taking her up to bed. It seemed like her behavior was just getting worse from being tired.
If anyone has had this situation occur as I am sure it is not so uncommon, please suggest some proactive strategies. The most important action I will need to do, will be to stay as calm as I can and know this is not my daughters fault. “Calgon take me away.” (If you remember those commercials where the mom is in the bathtub)
Erin says:
September 23, 2012 at 9:33 pm
All I can tell you is, it happens. Kids get tired, mamas get tired. We all raise our voices at some point. My kids do that too. It is frustrating. It is so hard to calm yourself at the same time as your child is escalating. I keep my hair pulled up at all times, to avoid the hair pulling. I don’t wear jewelry. It helps. But it happens to all of us. She will be ok. You will both be ok. Get some sleep. It will really feel better in the morning. Really. It will. Don’t beat yourself up. Hugs.
September 23, 2012 at 10:45 pm
Thanks, you are right.
I will take it easy and probably need a good night sleep. I usually put my hair up in a pony tail.
September 26, 2012 at 9:21 am
My autistic son just told me this morning that one kid punches him in the stomach everyday at school. Should I get the teachers and admin, etc., involved or wait and see? Shoot! I’m so sad and mad. Why does my sweet, sweet boy have to go to school every day knowing he’s getting punched by a schoolmate? Ugh!!
September 26, 2012 at 10:08 am
Get them involved. NOW. NO child should be hurt at school.
September 26, 2012 at 11:21 am
September 28, 2012 at 12:04 pm
I have three boys – my 7 and 5 year old are on the spectrum, my 2 year old is not. While our community has some great resources, our public schools are terrible at educating children with special needs, and private school for two is slowly bankrupting us (and not always giving the kids the access to the typical peers they need). My husband and I would like to move to another community (really anywhere in the US) that has great public schools and other therapeutic, social, and play opportunities. We have begun thinking about the Greater Boston area but are wide open to any other thoughts anyone might have. Thanks in advance for your help!
Erin says:
September 28, 2012 at 8:00 pm
PA is great for funding services (despite what is currently going on – see comment below). With a diagnosis, regardless of income, children qualify for Medicaid and are eligible for wraparound services (at no cost unless our current governor gets his way) – behavioral aids come to school and home with your child, as prescribed. Also, housing is much cheaper here. I grew up in Boston, but I live here now for the services that my kids get. Good luck!
Jodi says:
September 28, 2012 at 3:37 pm
anyone from PA know about the insanity that is the new copay system being started in Nov?
Erin says:
September 28, 2012 at 7:57 pm
Go to pennautism.org. Basically it’s a big mess right now, but there was a House Resolution just this morning to try to at least postpone implementation until the finance committee can look into it. Governor Corbett has decided to go it alone on this and somehow managed to get sweeping authority to do so. Contact your legislators. Tell them to support HR 879. I’ve also started a petition that you can add your name to, and please pass it on to anyone else who might be willing to sign. We can stop this, but we all have to work together.
For those who don’t know about this, the Governor is essentially implementing a tax on disabled children in PA. The services that are currently covered will be subject to copays, up to 5% of a family’s gross income. Families were notified this week. A bulletin was announced August 10, but quietly, so only a few of us knew about it. Few members of ghe general public are even aware of it right now. And it is set to take effect on Monday for newly diagnosed families, November 1 for families already in the system. It will certainly mean that parents will be forced to cut many prescribed and medically necessary therapies and treatments in order to provide food and shelter for the rest of their family. If this goes into effect, it will be disastrous for many families. Please sign the petition at the link below.
Jodi says:
September 28, 2012 at 9:45 pm
thanks for the info. i know a lot of families who are very anxious about this legislation. it’s not so much the idea of having to contribute to the cost of care but the complete chaos and disorganization of it is awful.
Erin says:
September 28, 2012 at 10:28 pm
I completely agree. i’m not necessarily opposed to contributing, but the way it’s being handled is cruel, unorganized, specifically targets autistic children, and they are being extremely vague about how it will be implemented. The reality is, if they would simply enforce the Act 62 Insurance laws already on the books by forcing insurance companies to cover autism services, they would save significantly more money, and actually help families. Just keep yourself informed – it seems things are changing by the minute on this…
Erin says:
October 5, 2012 at 8:04 pm
Just wanted to update you, in case you hadn’t heard: the copayment idea has been shelved. It was announced today after a massive joint effort by the advocates and families of disabled children in PA. A huge victory for our community, won today because we all worked together for our children. We will continue to keep an eye on the situation, but for now – huge sigh of relief. Happy Friday to you!
Julie says:
October 2, 2012 at 8:58 pm
Posting from Canada but needed to get this story out to “my community” for added support and to share this BEAUTIFUL song written for Noah Jacobsen. I think it speaks volumes to many of us on this journey. Noah tragically lost his father and proceeds from this song will go to fund Noah’s continued therapies and support. Listen to the lyrics and send your positive thoughts and support to this family. Our family.
PS: I have never met and do not know this family personally but read the story in a local newspaper and wanted to pass it along to others.
Dan says:
October 5, 2012 at 3:57 pm
Yours was the first blog I was directed to after our son was diagnosed with autism just this week. A new world is upon me and I decided to start my own blog for him. It’s called Jacob’s Voice on blogger. I’m new to this so I have no idea how to reach out and become a part of this community so I decided to start with you since you seem to be on of the cornerstones. Please feel free to offer any suggestions or help you see fit. Thank you – Dan
October 5, 2012 at 4:25 pm
Welcome! I’d invite you to read the following two posts, Welcome to the Club ..
both of which I often share with parents of newly diagnosed kids. I’d also suggest scrolling through my blog roll where you will find other dads who write, a bunch of moms, and most importantly, links to autistic perspectives.
If you’d like to join us on the Facebook page, there are some lively conversations there as well. You can check out the pages that I like from there – Thautcast, ASAN, Autism Speaks — lots of different perspectives.
But as it says in Welcome to the Club, don’t feel like you have to do it all at once. It’s a lot and it can be confusing and overwhelming. The information and the conversations aren’t going anywhere. Take your time and jump in as you’re ready. We all look forward to having you.
Jodi says:
October 5, 2012 at 10:17 pm
thanks. i had heard about that and i’m curious about the proposed idea of a premium. at least for the time being, people can continue to have services for their kids
October 8, 2012 at 4:07 pm
I am really struggling with what to do for my son for kindergarten. My 4 1/2 year old son was diagnosed with autism two years ago. He has been in early intervention (speech, OT, PT, music, ABA) ever since. He has also been attending a developmental preschool since he turned 3. The school district wants to send him to their autism program, and pull him out for some subjects. He has been reading, writing and spelling since he was 3. He is also doing some math. My concern is that he will stay in the autism classroom most of the day, and will not get enough academics. Or will not gain the social skills of typical peers.
We could also send him to a private Montessori school. M’s OT and BCBA therapists have recommended Montessori schools. But his pediatrician and his developmental psychologist have both said Montessori schools foster too much independence, which M has “enough of” and that he “needs to learn socialization” which the schools do not work on.
So, mainstreaming is the third option. But, I worry that it will be overwhelming for him. Even with an aide.
Any advice would be so appreciated. Thanks so much.
Luna says:
October 15, 2012 at 9:22 am
wow, that is so complicated. i struggle with keeping a balance between academics and socialization, also. what i’ve done is just gone with what he needs today. if he’s lacking more in social skills than academics, i kept him in mainstream. once his academics started to suffer (too much visual stimulation, noise, and intolerance in mainstream class to concentrate), i moved him to a situation where learning was easier. this isn’t a month by month change, as that would be upsetting for him. i had to concern myself with the fact that this journey will take decades and all i can do is make the best decision for him right now. for today.
in your mother’s gut, maybe you have an inclination as to what he needs, to say maybe your heart is already leaning toward one option. if so, i’d suggest taking that route. two different sources are giving you information. two sources with different goals. look at the motives of the source (the school districts vs the therapists). which one is truly trying to give the best life to your child? and if you can honestly say that they both are, then i really feel like either way you move will be okay. they both have their data backing their suggestions. neither way will be detrimental, i’m sure.
good luck with your situation. i hope you find confidence in your decision.
October 26, 2012 at 2:40 pm
Thank you Luna, for your advice. I think that you are right, and we will just have to explore all the options sinc I keep going back and forth. We are touring schools on Monday and I hope to have a better picture. and, like you said no decision is final.
Jill says:
October 10, 2012 at 6:14 pm
We are having some difficulties with my 3 yr old (4 end of December)
We recently moved for a trial relocation where my daughter is in a new public charter school for autism. Yesterday something amazing happened, my daughter said “stay daddy”, she had never said this. There was also very intesive fits where she tried biting her arm, pulled another childs hair and screamed wanting her way. I am in the process of getting addition behavioral therapists to help me and her. In addition, I am so concerned this will get worse and maybe looking into medicine to help. I prefer not to, but might be necessary as she was doing this before our move. If anyone can make a suggestion as I am trying to be strong and keep it together. It’s also hard as I lost my mother to cancer Feb 2011 and wish I could get the right support.
Luna says:
October 15, 2012 at 9:11 am
I wish I had some advice, but I do not. I understand your dilemma regarding medication. I’m also not a fan of it, but when they’re hurting other people it gets so very complicated. Are you located near any support resources? Nothing can replace a parent, of course, but having people around you who get it is so important.
Erin says:
October 15, 2012 at 4:59 pm
Jill- I am sorry you are going through this. Would it be possible to cut back on your daughter’s schedule? Perhaps a half day if she is in full day classes, or less days per week? My three year old had some pretty serious regressions when we had increased her therapy time. When we cut back a little, and maintained focus on just a few areas where she was doing well (as opposed to working her too hard on things she wasn’t having success at) we saw overall improvements everywhere. I see that you said she was doing this before your move, but perhaps something new is contributing to it now? {{Hugs}}
October 15, 2012 at 6:07 am
I am not sure if I am posting this for advice or just for the community support. Perhaps a little of both. I have two Aspie daughters; the older of the girls is fifteen, but only in 8th grade. We have been moving steadily along, since her diagnosis several months ago. (Why it took us so long to put the pieces together is another story entirely.) What matters is that we finally knew the root cause of all the different issues, and we were working together as a family, partnered with the school and therapists, to help her make positive changes. She struggles desperately with anxiety, and she actually has a dual-diagnosis of Asperger’s with General Anxiety Disorder. But, for the most part, she tries to be a typical kid, and she wants to do typical-kid activities. So, she went to her Homecoming dance Friday night…not with a date, of course. That would be far outside of her comfort zone. She went hoping to hang out with friends, but none of them showed up. So, she mostly hung out with her younger brother and his girlfriend. Unfortuantely, she was targeted by an aggressive young man who verbally and physically assualted her on three separate occasions. She was very frightened, and she asked an adult to help after the first attack. But, they did nothing. She did tell her brother, but while his back was turned, the second attack occurred. The third time, her brother was watching and waiting. Although he is three years younger than his sister, and has the soul of Winnie the Pooh, he stepped in front of his sister and protected her. He had to physically defend her. Again, no adult did anything until my son demanded help. By then, I was on my way to the school, and I arrived to the scene of disaster. All of this occurred during a very short span of time. Unfortunately, there were no school authorities at the dance, only parents. The attacker was basically free to do as he pleased, and he remained at the dance. OF COURSE, we are dealing with this officially first thing this morning, both with the school and with the police. However, the damage has been done. My daughter was already struggling with the temptation to cut. We had managed to hold it at bay by replacing the urges with expressing her feelings in art. But, this was too much. Friday night was a triggering event, and she confessed yesterday that she really cut herself this time. I was already numb and in shock from Friday night, and it really didn’t hit me until last night. Suddenly, a wave of grief and rage rolled over me like a freight train. I could hardly breathe, I was sobbing so hard. I am not looking forward to this day. I feel physically sick. There is really nothing any of you can do. I know the things we need to do, legally and emotionally. But, I guess I just need the support of the community, to know that I am not alone in my grief and rage. I feel powerless. I can do something about the enemy attacking my daughter from the outside. I can do very little about the enemy attacking her from the inside. It is the most frightened I have ever been as a parent. I will try to post updates and results later. Thanks for listening.
Luna says:
October 15, 2012 at 9:08 am
That’s terrible. I had a child in my care that cut herself when she was a teen. We set up counselors, etc, but it’s so very difficult to reach them. It’s not something you can fix with some medicine and a band-aid. Frightening is a good word for that situation. I hope you manage to keep her moving toward artistic expression.
October 15, 2012 at 3:09 pm
Before I say anything, I want to let you know where I am coming from. I am a middle aged man with Asperger’s who has two children on the spectrum.
Where to begin as there are so many overlapping issues here. OK, we’ll start with self care.
DO NOT BLAME YOURSELF! You did nothing wrong here. You sent your daughter to a place that should have been safe because it was monitored with friends and familiar people. It was other people not doing what they should have that caused this. Your daughter is probably not the only one who is internalizing their emotions in a hurtful way. Life is unpredictable, and torturing yourself with “if only’s” will only make things worse. Forgive yourself for not being all knowing and leave the past behind so that you can make the future better.
OK next is your daughter.
Your going to have to trust on this one because it will never make sense emotionally. Cutting in this case is an extreme form of stimming and like all forms of self-injurious stimming is terrifying to those who watch those in their care doing so. Stimming is a NORMAL human response to being overwhelmed by emotions or sensations. Because people on the spectrum are more sensitive to them than neuro-typical people, we get overwhelmed more easily. The situation that your daughter would overwhelm ANY teenage girl.
Now the best thing to realize here, is that the stimm is not the problem, but a symptom. Does that mean we leave it alone as some advocate? No, but we should try to never punish or demonize it. Stimming in response to being overwhelmed is normal and many times unavoidable, but the way we stimm can be shaped with practice, You are already on the right path with providing alternate outlets for her energy.
The first step is understanding in a way that she feels accepted, and this is where it gets even more complicated. Stimming is only semi-voluntary, like breathing. If you think about it, you can control the rhythm and timing of your breathing, but as soon as you stop paying attention, it does it on its own. Her cutting was not an isolated act of self injury, but part of the entire episode that was still going on inside her. She knows that she is supposed to cut and probably feels guilty that she was not “strong enough” to keep from doing so and feels like she has let you down.
The best thing I can recommend here is to let her know how overwhelmed, scared, angry, sad and disappointed she is at how the prom went. Don’t even mention the cutting, but deal with what caused it. She knows that she isn’t supposed to cut and doesn’t want to do it, if for no other reason than she doesn’t want to disappoint you. She was not trying to hurt herself; she was just trying to deal with that much overwhelming emotion. Let her know that she is loved and valued and that she didn’t do anything wrong that night. If she brings up the cutting, the best thing to say is something like, “I know that what happened would be too much for anyone to deal with, but you’re going to make it because I am right here with you.” Dealing with the possibility of her cutting again is something for a later time when her wounds are not so fresh.
(continued)
October 15, 2012 at 3:42 pm
As for your son; he needs to be praised for being enough of a man to stand up for her against her aggressor and the indifferent adults that were supposed to be taking care of things. He deserves a lot of credit and hopefully it won’t go to his head.
OK next for the people who were running the prom. This is the sort of thing where you need to demand a written apology from the people in charge of the dance. If it was the school, it needs to come from the principal and the staff and/or teacher that organized it. If it was the PTA, then it needs to come from the president and the person in charge of the event. The point of this is to is to make them realize the magnitude of the problem and motivate them to make the changes necessary to keep it from happening again instead of just quietly sweeping it under the rug. It also needs to be brought up at the next meeting of the people in charge (i.e. PTA meeting or School board meeting.) Don’t do so alone. Take with you the most opinionated, in your face person that never backs down from anything person that loves your daughter. If this is you, bring you most vocal supportive friends, but DO NOT bring your daughter. Boards tend to attract social bullies who will use social tricks to put pressure on her to accept the easiest solution for them rather than what is right. Going after the actual individuals at the prom will probably not be effective and may in fact cause them to “circle the wagons” rather than deal with the problem.
October 15, 2012 at 7:44 pm
Last for the perpetrator. Whether or not you press charges is up to you, but GET A RESTRAINING ORDER! Make sure it is a no contact, no intermediaries, no nonsense restraining order with teeth. Make sure the judge is aware that you daughter is part of a federally protected, especially vulnerable disabled group. It is so easy for teenagers to ignore the rules and just do what he likes and what impresses his friends and he gets away with it because of the “don’t involve the adults” unwritten rule that teenagers have. This is very important because it will be the only protection she has at school when you are not there. A clear judges order cuts through all the normal levels of social expectations that protect a perpetrator from the consequences of his actions.
P.S. I am available to discuss this anytime by e-mail or phone. I can also help with the cutting issue when the time comes.
October 15, 2012 at 8:38 am
I need help. I have 7-year-old triplet boys-two are neurotypical and one Asperger’s with other associated issues. The boys asked me about “curing” Autism. My husband and I have explained, to the best of our abilities, that Autism isn’t something you cure, it’s sort of someone you are. Anyone ever have that situation with siblings? What have you done? I have already put in a call to an autism group.
Luna says:
October 15, 2012 at 8:57 am
It’s such a tough position. My oldest is 10 and HFA. My two younger children are NT. My 8 year old asked the same question. I explained that he was born with an autistic brain. That everyone had different color hair, skin, eyes, etc. That brains can be different, too, we just can’t see it immediately. There are funny brains, brilliant brains, anxious brains, mechanically-inclined brains, artistic brains and autistic brains. I told her that I realized that some of the accommodations we make for him are frustrating. I asked her if her brother ever got frustrated with her, to which she said yes. I told her that we’re all very different personalities and that I wouldn’t try and ‘fix’ her because she was frustrating, and that our differences are important. Not always easy, but so very important. I told her that if there was a cure, I’m not sure I’d give it to him. He was created how he is and just because he’s different from me doesn’t make him wrong. And that doesn’t change no matter how many people he’s different from. I told her that if he wanted a medicine that would make certain tasks easier, then I’d help him. But never fix him. Because he’s not broken.
Your explanation would be different if you believe HFA and Asperger Syndrome needs to be cured, of course. My explanation would have been drastically different if my son’s autism was severe, if he harmed himself or others physically, etc. But for now, for her age, for our situation, i felt like the above was enough. It’s an ongoing conversation and it probably always will be. It’s tough for siblings. I’ve read that multiples have a very different sort of burden then non-multiple siblings, in that they feel that it could have been them, and then there is a sort of survivor guilt.
October 15, 2012 at 9:19 am
Thanks, Luna! We’ve essentially used the same words you have, and I, like you, would probably not give Bobby anything to “fix” him because I LOVE the person he is. I am currently working to get them into a support group. I didn’t realize (stupidly) how much autism affects them.
November 2, 2012 at 9:03 am
Hello, People of Diary of Mom! I have a question regarding summer time. Our son is turning four and is in a five day a week autism support preschool class. Obviously it will not go through the summer. We are in a huge quandry about summer. Both my husband and I work. He is at the age where he is too young for the autism camps. He is “high functioning” but I am terrified about sending him to a summer camp or daycare program. We live in Pennsylvania. Any ideas?
Luna says:
November 2, 2012 at 3:22 pm
THAT is a super tough one. I wish I had a suggestion or two, but i don’t. I live in southern Louisiana and the summer daycare programs wouldn’t take my son b/c of his autism. he’s high-functioning also, but the spot on the spectrum was a moot point. they wouldn’t take him. i tried a couple of places that sat from their homes, but leaving him with people i didn’t know when he was not able to adequately tell me how he was being treated proved too much for me. i ended up quitting my job and staying home. i’m not the stay-at-home type. it’s been hard. we’ve had to make some serious financial sacrifices. but the reward is well worth it, as my children have had the best payoff and my son, in particular, is flourishing. no regrets here, but it is a sacrifice.
you’ve got some tough choices to make. i hope you find a solution that fits for everyone, one that gives you peace of mind. Good Luck!!
November 22, 2012 at 8:50 am
Have you requested Extended School Year in his IEP? In our district teachers provide a “regression statement,” recommending ESY for kids who they fear would regress during summer. Might be worth talking to your CPSE/CSE chair.
Jodi says:
November 2, 2012 at 9:08 pm
Do you have an advocate? I’m in PA too (near Pittsburgh) and my son is high-functioning but still needed wrap around services and part of those services was an appointed advocate to help with a variety of things. The past 2 summers, my advocate had a very extensive list of possible programs for my son. I work part time on weekends so haven’t needed a lot of extra care but he did a summer camp program at the museum and they were very understanding and willing to work with him. You might also try to contact The Children’s Institute. Even if you aren’t near Pittsburgh, they might have some recommendations that might be local to you. Good luck and I hope you can find something.
November 25, 2012 at 10:17 am
My daughter is 10 yrs old and has been diagnosed with Asperger’s and anxiety. She is currently on sertraline for the anxiety. We are having problems lately that I can’t make sense of, so I am coming to all of you.
The first problem occurred a few weeks ago. My daughter was playing a game that she made up, while on the playground at school. She has named the game “Crazy Bailey”. I believe she calls it that b/c she is acting crazy while she chases other kids. The problem is, the other children aren’t actually playing with her, they are running away from her. On this particular day, she got into trouble b/c she was hitting kids on the butt. We had talks about inappropriate touching and keeping our hands to ourselves. I also explained to her that she needed to find a new game to play. Then, last Tuesday, I got a call from the school. She was playing the game again and this time she grabbed a boy’s crotch. She got written up and sent to the principal’s office. She was told not to play the game again, but by the end of the day she was playing it again.
Her focus is all but gone and there is a lot of repeating happening, in order to get her to stay on task. She also stutters and has speech therapy at school, and the stuttering is getting worse lately. I ran into her speech therapist the other day and she said that Bailey says she doesn’t care that she stutters. I know that this will make it much more difficult to correct the problem.
Her emotions are off the charts lately and she seems to be having a hard time expressing her frustration and anger. Then the stuttering really kicks in and then she just gets angry and shuts down.
I don’t understand why things are suddenly getting worse. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
Erin says:
November 25, 2012 at 10:40 am
I have an 8 year old boy with Aspergers (and two younger girls on the spectrum as well). I can’t speak to the medication, as we haven’t tried that yet. I have noticed that every year from about Halloween to February, he really starts to “lose” it. His behaviors get a little more… well, exciting. I don’t know if it’s the shorter days, colder weather, or the excitement of multiple holidays crashing together. He gets totally wild, his sensory needs climb, and the tantrumming increases. It always feels a bit like he is spiralling out of control. My only advice is to try to keep things at home as calm and as close to a regualr routine as possible. Just keep on reminding her about what is expected. Excercise seems to help too. I just bundle everyone up and take him somewhere that he can run, or have him haul firewood, etc. Physically wearing him out helps a lot. And take deep breaths, mom.
You might want add in a reward system – we started a behavior bead jar in our house. For good behavior, we toss in a few beads (a completely arbitrary number, so he doesn’t control the situation by demanding a set number). We do this for each of our children in the same jar, so they work as a team, but if you have just one child, obviously you would just do the jar for her. If they misbehave they lose beads. The goal is to fill the jar. When they do they get a previously agreed upon reward (for us it’s a make your own ice cream sundae party). The key is to keep it consistent, and to try any behavior plan for at least two weeks before ditching it. It has added a consistent, visual mode of encouragement for my kids. It might help your daughter – she may not care if she stutters, but if she gets beads for not stuttering, or for playing an appropriate game with her friends, she might be a little more encouraged.
It is REALLY hard for my kids to stay on track this time of year. All you can really do is try to keep some level of calm in your own home and try to stay as consistent as possible. Maybe even cut back on (this may seem nuts to some people in my neighborhood), or at least tone down the decorations for the holidays. This has helped my kids. Just keep it simple Only four months til spring….. Hang in there.
Luna says:
November 25, 2012 at 11:25 am
I have a 10 year old son with Asperger’s and anxiety. We’re not to the point of needing meds yet, but I’ve read that puberty for children with Asperger’s is incredibly difficult with elevated levels of depression. So I’m sure we’ll need something to curb the anxiety. I agree with the other commenter, that this time of year is especially difficult for our kids.
But, I’d like to add that at the age of 10, hormones can be starting to surge. My son has become “touchy” with private parts b/c he’s genuinely curious and doesn’t know how to handle it. My son has trouble knowing what is appropriate and inappropriate. He pushes boundaries where other children might not. He sees his friends “liking” girls and the girls “liking” them in return. I’m sure his anxiety is playing on this and i’m sure it’s confusing and frustrating for him.
Maybe she’s chasing them to get their attention, maybe she’s more interested in their attention now b/c of hormonal changes? Maybe she’s just being curious. I’m just making a random guess based on the game she’s playing and the inappropriate touching. Whatever the issue is, I hope you figure it out soon and that the both of you can find a resolution. Good Luck!
November 25, 2012 at 12:24 pm
Well, here is a bundle of things that seem to have happened all at once, but have probably been building for a while.
First, where I’m coming from. I’m a middle aged man with Asperger’s syndrome and I have two children (one boy and one girl) on the spectrum as well. My little girl is 11 an suffers from anxiety disorder as well.
From my own experience, the “Crazy Bailey” game sounds like protective identification to me. When you are on the spectrum, you know that you are different and that it cannot be changed. I embraced that difference and made it part of my identity. Further, I adapted a “crazy” persona that was even odder than I was in order to protect myself. That way, if someone was attacking me for being crazy or strange, they were attacking my persona instead of my core self. The chasing and scaring her peers seems like her going on the offensive so that she doesn’t have to wait to be attacked, but I will say more on that later.
Her age is a critical factor for girls with Asperger’s syndrome. She should be starting puberty, and this adds hormones to an already confusing and overwhelming situation. Many of the comorbid psychological problems that come with Asperger’s syndrome get worse with the onset of puberty. I know mine did, as well as many others who have shared their stories with me.
Finally I will get to the hard part. The chasing with the inappropriate touching really concerns me. With what little you have told me here, I have no doubt that she has been harassed by her peers, and she probably hasn’t told you about it. Unfortunately, this is par for the course for a child with Asperger’s syndrome. Even more unfortunately, sexual harassment by peers or adults for girls on the spectrum is more common than not. Predators deliberately target quiet isolated children, which results in AS children (both boys and girls) having a tragically high rate of victimization. The part where you explained about inappropriate touching and then her behavior escalated is especially troubling. Children on the spectrum learn early on that there are two types of rules: Those that people say and those that people do, and only the second type count. If you tell her that that type of touching is wrong and someone else is touching her or has touched her that way, then words are worthless. Now, there is a possibility that I am wrong and this is just her way of exploring her curiosity due to hormones, but the other possibility cannot be dismissed lightly.
Last of all, what to do about things. Asking her directly will probably not get you very far. Kids at that age have a very well demonstrated rule that you don’t bring adults into kids problems. If there is a predator involved, it’s even worse. as they use a combination of threats, blaming the victim and emotional abuse to enforce silence. Taking away her protective persona of “Crazy Bailey” will only serve to make things worse. I actually think that “Crazy Bailey” is, paradoxically, the key! Ask her to tell, write or draw stories about “Crazy Bailey’s” life (possibly through a counselor, if you can find one who is used to working with Asperger’s syndrome children.) Ask her to tell general stories and stay away from leading questions and do not react negatively to anything that happens in the stories. Once she gets used to story telling and establishes that it is safe to tell you about negative things, then hidden things will come out on their own.
P.S. Please feel free to contact me directly about this or any other matter.
November 25, 2012 at 11:44 am
My son is younger and I have not had any experience with this particular problem. But I do have personal experience with taking new medications. Aggressive behavior and mood swings are common side effects of many drugs. I recommend contacting the prescribing physician. In my personal experience the first medication is rarely the one that you actually end up using long-term when dealing with depression, OCD or anxiety. The dosage might need to be adjusted or the doctor might want to try your daughter on something else entirely. But definitely contact the doctor.
Jodi says:
November 29, 2012 at 10:52 pm
so, i have a 7 yr old boy with asperger’s. we’re thinking that it might be time to sit down and talk to him about his diagnosis. it’s never come up before. any suggestions for how to do it?
Erin says:
November 29, 2012 at 11:30 pm
First, let me say I think it’s great for you to tell him. It will help him understand so much more about himself in the long run. I told my son when he was five, about two weeks after his diagnosis (Aspergers). I made it “not a big deal.” We were in the car, my husband was at work, and I mentioned to him about the doctor we had seen, and did he know why we went there? I explained to him that his brain works in a special way. He has something called autism. It is part of what helps him analyze things the way he does – part of why he is so smart. But it also makes some things more difficult for him – like understanding the difference between his friend laughing during a game of chase and crying. But that it was the special way his brain works. It makes him special and smart, and that anything that seemed hard, we would just practice until it wasn’t so hard anymore. I let him process just that much – which he did with a smile on his face. We came back to it in short conversations here and there. He is 8 now. He understood it when I first told him, but he totally “gets” it now. His two youngers sisters are on the spectrum. And today, I made the mistake of hitting three different “technology” stores with them. Best Buy, GameStop and the Apple store. Then I was left to explain to them what sensory overload was – why we had to leave and how I understood exactly why they both started crying in those stores. My 5 year old daughter has pdd-nos. She doesn’t grasp the autism concept as easily as my son did. We talk about it frequently, but I think tonight was one of the first times she really understood it. I explained that they all have autism, which is a word that describes their superpowers. They perceive things so much more clearly than everyone else – “you can hear a conversation on the other side of the room, you see can see all the parts of the picture instead of just the whole thing, you can smell everyon’s perfume and the food cooking and the electronics.” But that sometimes superpowers can be a problem – I’ll bet Superman had to be careful when he hugged him mom that he didn’t squeeze her too tight. We just have to learn to control our powers so they don’t overwhelm us. I let them process that for a bit and then we talked about something else. For some reason, we have our best conversations in the car – maybe because I have my back to them while we are talking. Not sure.
I guess my point is, don’t act like you’re dropping a bomb on him. Don’t cry. Don’t make it a big deal. If he sees it’s not such a big deal to you, then it won’t be to him. He’ll ask more questions when he has processed the small bites you give him now. It doesn’t have to be an all at once power point presentation. And breathe deep. You are doing a very good thing. Good luck!
Luna says:
November 29, 2012 at 11:45 pm
there are many many books available that deal with this, easily searchable at Amazon. most people i’ve read about use books. the book would start the conversation. i decided to tell my son when he was 8 (he’s now 10) because I was worried someone else would mention it, either in teasing or just curiosity, and i wanted him to be prepared and not caught off-guard. So, instead of sitting him down like i was going to give him bad news, I started bringing it up nonchalantly in conversation.
When he’d start stimming, I’d ask what he was stimming about. He’d tell me. I’d say that a lot of autistics stim and they really seem to enjoy it. And then ask if he knew what autistic meant. If he was listening, I’d give him our cognitive age-appropriate definition. Sometimes when he says something out-of-the-box but completely perfect, I’ll tell him that I wish I could think the way he does. My brain isn’t autistic…and go from there.
I think the best way is to bring it up in convo. And don’t over explain. When they’re ready to know, they’ll ask more and more questions. Of course, I have no clue what I’m doing and I’m making it up as I go along. But that’s how I did it.
I think it’s good to be proactive with helping them understand and accept themselves, so bravo for that. I hope you find the right way to let him know what makes him beautiful. Good Luck!
Jodi says:
November 30, 2012 at 8:09 am
thanks for the tips. i love the idea of comparing it to super powers. he’s so into super heroes so i think that we’ll definitely help. we don’t want to overwhelm him with it but at the same time, we want him to have the opportunity to ask questions. so we’re going to have a special time with just him. we have a 6 yr non-spectrum very talkative and outgoing little girl as well. she usually doesn’t let him get a word in most conversations. we’re planning on talking to him about it and then eventually talking to her about it. she knows that he’s different and has these special appts but nothing more beyond that.
i’ll let you all know how it goes
December 3, 2012 at 12:15 pm
Ok so, my son is 5. He is was born with a brain birth defect – dysgenesis of the corpus callosum. We have been aware of the medical diagnosis since he was 10 days. At 27 months we were given a Autism diagnosis via developemental peds & second opinion pyschologist. So two diagnosis – medical and behavioral as it has been explained to me. Now, our school likes to play them off each other or only acknowledge one diagnosis. We have an upcoming IEP meeting on Weds. and looking at draft documentation. I caught that it has him listed with Pervasive Developmental Delay & the Dysgenenesis of Corpus Callosum. And in another spot it reads “..diagnosis of corpus callosum accompanied by characteristic austistic behaviors, impact all areas of his development…” So, should I be pushing for the autism diagnosis or is PDD ok? My son is nonverbal and seems to be closer to 3 yrs in most aspects except for a few areas. Other professionals (private) all list him with a Autism Spectrum Disorder… appreciate any thoughts. As we have gone around and around with our school district on his services. Thanks in advance.
Luna says:
December 4, 2012 at 9:41 am
wow, that is a problem. i wish i had some good advice for you. in our situation, whatever the school labels my son doesn’t have much affect on what services he has available. if he is deemed special needs, then he has access to whatever services will help him. (legally speaking, of course).
it has been my understanding that PDD is on the spectrum. the spectrum is so vast that they can’t come up with a moniker for every place on it. PDD-NOS, as i understand it, just means they have enough traits to be on the spectrum, just not enough to have a more specific label. I could be completely wrong, however, since my son’s dx is for classic autism.
whenever i have questions about the school/rights in my area, i contact the Autism Society’s local chapter. They not only have information, but advocates who will attend IEP meetings with me for free and hash out the details with the school staff.
Good Luck in your search!
December 4, 2012 at 11:10 am
Please look at the facebook page for Save our precious son’s life and pray and do what you can to help this family. Thank you
Sarah says:
December 17, 2012 at 7:55 pm
Once again Jess…thank you for creating such a wonderful resource!
I am really in need of some advice. We have recently transitioned from Early Intervention Services to the IU8. It’s a whole new world. We now have a case manager, psychologist, BSC, OT, Speech Therapist and MHA as our team. While I was hoping to love them as much as our old crew I am really struggling. My darling 3year old is growing by leaps and bounds and along with her growth has come a host of new and difficult behaviors. She has an amazing vocabulary that becomes non existent the moment she becomes overwhelmed in any way. I am a firm believer that each of her behaviors is an attempt to communicate. That said her new team, not knowing her well, has turned to an approach that makes me nervous. They seem to believe that her behaviors must all be broken. They repeatedly insist that I show her “tough love” at all times. They reference, of all things, Supernanny, again and again…as if it’s the magic bullet for each of our struggles. All fingers point to me, day after day. They’ve made comments that include, “if she’s really autistic at all…” They show up at school and home unannounced and insist on having discussions about her behavior right in front of her. I feel like I’m spending more time arguing her diagnosis than working towards helping her.
I feel so entirely confused. Almost as if we are at day one again. I wasn’t sure where else to turn and I’m not really even sure what my question is. I’m just feeling incredibly overwhelmed and frustrated.
Can anyone recommend a good advocate in SW Pennsylvania? I’m guessing that needs to be my first order of business.
Erin says:
January 8, 2013 at 5:00 pm
Sarah- I am so sorry that I am just seeing this. I had been getting emails regarding comments, but apparently haven’t gotten them recently.
As far as your problem, email me. I am also in SW PA also with a three year old who just transitioned out of EI. Maybe we can work together. Hugs.
(Don’t laugh my hubby made this up: super biology babe (all one word) at hotmail .com)
Erin says:
January 8, 2013 at 5:13 pm
I would also add, that you know your child best. If you disagree with something, speak up. Sometimes opening a good dialogue with your team will bring you all onto the same page a lot faster. I’ve had many disagreements with our own teams – I have three children all on the spectrum, all with their own behavioral teams – and I can be very opinionated with them at times, but they are all doing fabulously now. If you want to Email me, I might be able to give you some different contacts. Hang in there.
Lynn says:
December 29, 2012 at 2:25 pm
I am a middle school special ed teacher, and one of my students has autism and major behavioral needs. He hits nearly every day–other students, teachers, even the head teacher, and it’s enough to leave slap marks and bruises. He is very verbal and will tell you that he didn’t get what he wanted, so he hit you. I strongly believe that it is intentional and manipulative, but his parents insist that he has autism, so he is incapable of bullying or trying to hurt someone on purpose. They tell me it’s my fault and I don’t know how to handle him. They constantly belittle us at the school and show us no respect. I have bent over backwards making accommodations for their child, but they basically want me to give him everything he wants. Any advice?
Erin says:
January 8, 2013 at 5:03 pm
Hi Lynn- does the family have a diagnosis? If so, do they possibly have a psychologist or behavioral consultant that you could consult with? That might be a good starting point.
January 6, 2013 at 9:29 pm
Does anyone have experience with public schools in the Denver, CO area? Please share the positive and negative. Thanks in advance.
cwill says:
January 13, 2013 at 12:54 pm
My daughter is 8 years old and is on the spectrum with an official dx of PDD-NOS. She is considered “high functioning” and is mainstreamed into a regular class. She does have her own set of challenges, and goes to ST and OT multiple times on a weekly basis. She was late to speak and even later to potty train. Her baby teeth came in late, but her adult teeth have come in at the average time/a little early. She was adopted from China at 14 mos. We have no family history.
I’ve been hearing a lot about girls who are menstruating at a much younger age (as early as 9 or 10 y.o.). It’s been on my mind lately, how does a parent teach a girl on the spectrum about this part of her life? How do you prepare her for it, how do you teach her how to manage it, etc. Any words from those who have BTDT would be greatly appreciated. If you’d rather not do it on a public forum, please feel free to email me at artisgoodinyourlife [at] gmail [dot] com
thanks!
January 15, 2013 at 9:47 am
I have been thinking a lot about this as well as my kiddo is nine. This looks like it might be a good place to start ..
(Taking Care of Myself: A Hygiene, Puberty and Personal Curriculum for Young People with Autism)
I haven’t read it so I can’t recommend it, but it’s one of the few resources I’ve found that tackles the topic head on and includes personal safety.
January 15, 2013 at 9:51 am
One more link that might be helpful —
Sarah says:
January 21, 2013 at 3:48 pm
I’m starting a new job soon working with, and providing training for, young adults on the autistic spectrum in a digital archiving project . I have a wonderful 4 year old boy with ASD so I am incredibly keen to make the project a success.
One of the young men I’m hoping to be working with finds it very difficult to talk with people he doesn’t know well. He is also very sensitive to sound. We communicate well over email but when we meet up I find it tricky to work out how best to act. I don’t want to put pressure on him to talk by trying to engage him in anything but very necessary details for the job, so I try to keep our spoken communication to the minimum – but of course this feels awkward for me and I don’t want to come across to him as being cold or rude. Does anyone have any advice? My own son is incredibly chatty, and is also much younger, so it’s difficult for me to draw on personal experience.
Many thanks in advance for any thoughts.
cg says:
January 21, 2013 at 5:09 pm
Could you meet in person just to be there face to face, but IM via smart phone or chat room? We had a student at my school (where I work) who was a self selected mute. He would type everything, including his thoughts in class discussions, etc. and the teacher or a friend or table mate would read them out loud. If he had an iPad or iPad mini he could just use the notepad feature and type out his part of the conversation pretty quickly.
January 22, 2013 at 1:02 am
People on the spectrum can be very focused on a project, which makes it hard to chat. My suggestions is to use e-mails to work on an agreed set of rules. Be blatant about what is troubling you (which he is likely to appreciate.) An example would be work time is for work, and break time is time to get to know each other and talk about non-work things. Make sure he knows that it is perfectly acceptable to talk about work related things during work time (he may not know this.) Make these rules clear, and precise, and with no unstated assumptions, if it can be helped. Let him know it is always allowed to ask for clarification on the rules. If he is up to allowing chatting on non-work subjects during work, again make clear rules so that he knows what is acceptable. (i.e. Any subject is OK as long as it takes less than 30 seconds. It is courteous to ask how you are feeling at the beginning of each day. You can talk as much as you like if you can still do your work.)
Start slowly. most of us on the spectrum have had bad experiences with unwritten social rules at work, so we feel like we are walking through a mine field. Give us clear rules and, once we feel safe, it tends to be hard to get us to stop talking.
January 24, 2013 at 9:07 am
So what would be your take if your school district approved a program for special education in which they decided to name it – SAILL – Students Attaining Incredible Life Lessons ? It is for a k-3 multi-needs classroom? I have lots of questions about what even will be going on in the classroom….life lessons is that code for life skills. My desire is to see my son, 5, be taught academic lessons…really given a chance. My concern this move is to a life skills approach and even more that the district has a low expectation for what my son can learn. Incredible Life Lessons….is it incredible he can learn? Thoughts…ideas about how to enlighten the district on my feelings? This is the tip of the iceberg as the staffing, location, curriculm are still to be determine BUT yet my kid is being pushed to this placement for next fall. This seems to be their move to not allow us access to a private placement. I should note we life in a small town, 2500 people, so thus a school district too. Thanks for any input!
January 24, 2013 at 12:19 pm
This is one of those things that could be very good or very bad. My personal experience with school was that the academics were easy, it was my peers that were incomprehensible. People on the spectrum like myself need to be taught social rules and interactions directly and blatantly or we do not get it. If this is their goal and how they run the program, then this is a good thing.
On the other hand, both of my children were placed in special needs classes where their academics were (in my opinion) unnecessarily “dumbed down” when they were quite capable of doing grade level work or better in many areas. If this is what they are doing, then this is a bad thing.
My suggestion is that you go talk to them directly. Take someone with you who loves your son and is unflappable and who knows what you are trying to get across. I would say something like, “Children on the spectrum are well known for developing at different rates in different areas. They may be behind in one area and well ahead of their peers in another. I really want to make sure that his areas of strength are not being neglected while the areas he may be behind in are being addressed.” The idea here is to let them know that you expect them to assume competence in your son in all areas that he has not shown difficulty in. Most teachers want to be on you son’s side and be your partner in making him successful.
I know many schools are having financial difficulty especially with unfunded mandates (where they are required by law to provide services, but are given no money to do so.) They are probably as frustrated as you are if not more so. Offering to be a partner and a resource that is trying to help them will often get them on your side and lead to a much better outcome.
February 3, 2013 at 1:00 am
I was reading on CNN about the boy that the man is holding hostage in the underground bunker. The police had said the child needs meds and the perp got them to him but never said what they were for. Tonight I read that he is one of our kids, Aspergers and ADD. Can we all please say a special prayer tonight for the child and his safety? My daughter would not be able to handle being in a small enclosed space for as long as they have been there and she don’t have the added stress of ADD. Thanks everyone,
February 3, 2013 at 1:17 am
My heart is breaking. Is there a FB page set up for him where we could show him and his family some love?
February 3, 2013 at 10:56 pm
Mary says:
February 5, 2013 at 4:44 pm
Thw mon from “The Crumb Diaries” posted a link on her page to a family that is at the end of their rope trying to get help for their daughters outbursts. She has autism and has hurt the mom during an outburst. Wanted to share if anyone has info that could help them. Here is the link to her blog:
Karen says:
February 10, 2013 at 2:03 am
I need some help. I am looking at investing in some tools to help my son with his sensory needs. He seeks movement and chews like crazy but I also need things to help calm him down when he is upset and the meltdown is nearing. There are so many products I don’t know where to start. I was just wondering if anyone has purchased anything that they have found works well.
February 10, 2013 at 7:08 am
For home, this has been a Godsend, and it’s a fraction of the price of the ones you’ll find in OT catalogs.
Brooke also loves her body sock –
(again, these are MUCH cheaper than the ones in the catalogs)
Hope that helps and cuts down on the ‘investment’ factor a little bit.
Karen says:
February 10, 2013 at 9:46 pm
Thanks for the help Jess. I will invest in them both. I have a feeling the chair will be a big hit.
February 11, 2013 at 1:52 pm
I have been feeling a little helpless and lost lately to the point of tears so I thought maybe I should check in here… My son is going to be 12 in April. He is diagnosed with Aspergers / Adhd. I have recently gone through a divorce and we recently moved across the country and are now living in my parents house (a place where my son is VERY comfortable and used to, thank goodness). I realize this is a difficult time in general – but my son has totally “checked out”. On the weekends, it is a struggle to get him to maintain contact with anyone socially- let alone leave the house and do anything other than playing minecraft with his friends online… Things that haven’t been a struggle for us since he was five years old, such as dinner routine, bedtime routine etc are now a battle.
Puberty is hitting him so hard. He is 5’3″ and growing so fast.
I am trying to determine what is Asperger’s affect on this time in his life -vs – puberty for all “tweens” in general…
I feel like I had “it” figured out, which is silly I guess- but I knew where his vulnerabilities were, I knew how to handle them, I knew how to connect with him as a young boy… THIS… going on 12… is a totally different world.
My instinct is to go back to basics. Outlines on poster boards of schedules of the day which instead of including tooth brushing and meal times would now include times for when xbox and cell phones are appropriate and when outside time on weekends (which has always been a struggle) is expected.
Also… he is finding it IMPOSSIBLE to fall asleep at night. I have moved dinner to earlier in the night – no milk or sugar late in the day… nothing seems to help. He has a lot of anxiety about the dark etc, we battle over turning the lights off in his room because he can’t fall asleep with the lights on – but when I turn them off he has so much anxiety over the dark that he can’t fall asleep with them off either.
Now, as I type this, I realize that all of this could just be signs of non-routine due to this giant shift in our lives.
I just feel like my son and I are constantly in a battle. I know he needs me but he has emotional mood swings that are hard to handle. When I try to instill rules it’s like all hell breaks lose.
I feel like a terrible mom… I feel like everything I thought I had a handle on, I have no idea what to do about anymore because you obviously can’t handle a 6-8 year old the same way you would handle a 12 year old. I feel like this jump of who my son is, came upon us so quickly.
Anybody else have a pre-teen on the spectrum?
Thanks so much for listening – feels so good to write it out instead of walking around with it in my head.
Thanks,
February 11, 2013 at 11:07 pm
You are not a bad mother, but you and your son do seem to be going through a very hard time in life.
Let me introduce myself. My name is John Mark McDonald. I’m a middle aged man on the spectrum and I have two children on the spectrum as well (son, 13 and daughter, 11). Your parents going through a divorce, hitting puberty and moving all at the same time would be hard on anyone, and acting out under the circumstances is perfectly normal (of course, this doesn’t make it any easier to deal with.)
You mentioned that your son has withdrawn from social contact on the weekend. You’re going to have to trust me on this, but this is the most natural thing in the world for a person on the spectrum and should be treated as such. For those of us on the spectrum, social contact is distressing and exhausting. Telling us to be social when we are under stress is like telling a gasping athlete who is dripping with sweat “why don’t you sprint around the block and that will make you feel better.” People on the spectrum NEED solitude and downtime to recharge and recover. If he is interacting with friends online, then he is getting all the social contact he needs and can handle right now.
On the other hand, clear rules and schedules would probably be a great thing right now. This will be similar to when he was smaller, but with some significant differences due to his age. A great thing to do here is sit down together and figure out a set of clear rules and schedule TOGETHER. If you let him know what you want, he will do most of the work and will probably surprise you with how strict the rules he will come up with. You job will be to remind him of areas he may have overlooked and to NOT bring up the past. This exercise can go a long way in rebuilding trust and helping him feel that life is getting back under control.
The last thing I should mention is that transition points in life are always hard for people on the spectrum. Certain “experts” and pieces of literature seem to give the impression that one can solve the problems of being on the spectrum. This is patently false. Those of us on the spectrum learn to work around the things that do not come naturally to us like they seem to to everyone else. This does not stop them from being hard. This also means to a growing kid on the spectrum that every time that our peers make a major transition, we have to start over and learn a whole new set of rules about things that make absolutely no sense to us. It’s going to be hard, and he is going to struggle EVERY TIME. I’m 43, and it’s still happening to me. This is a normal part of life on the spectrum.
Anyway, this is a hard time for both of you, but with some time and patience (and a few adjustments), this will pass and things will get better.
February 12, 2013 at 11:11 pm
Thank you so much for your response. I can’t tell you how much I appreciate it. The advice to let my son be a part of the scheduling process is great.
Also the reminder that these problems can’t be “solved”. I guess that’s me trying to find some structure myself.
Also, it was very comforting to be reminded that it’s okay to let him get down time in his room alone… I just always feel that I’m not doing enough, I’m not trying hard enough… I feel guilty because it’s easy to let him stay in his room all weekend… Sometimes I feel like he’s the forgotten child. I have a three year old and he gets so much of my attention… I guess I just want to give my eleven year old attention too.
It’s very good to be reminded that leaving him alone is maybe just what he needs.
We used to read books… we used to watch movies together…. now, the preteen “coolness” has set in (and I think he mimics what he thinks being “cool” means) and he doesn’t want any of that anymore.
Ugh!
But honestly, thanks John, really a helpful, thoughtful email.
February 13, 2013 at 12:43 am
None of us can do it by ourselves. This is an especially hard lesson for those of us on the spectrum to learn. You reminded me of one more tip. Often those of us on the spectrum like to do things “in parallel.” This means doing the same thing at the same time, although not necessarily together. A good example is each of you reading a book at the same time, (although the favorite of boys on the spectrum is playing video games on two separate machines.) Try and think of something you both like to do that is calm and quiet. My son and I do this all the time (and it baffles his mother) and it makes us both feel great.
Anyway, I am glad that I could help, and I always try to be available.
February 13, 2013 at 1:51 am
Wow. That is great advice! I’m thinking of Jess’ post about Christmas… Maybe I’ve just been holding on too tightly to what I wanted to do with him. I will give it a try.
Thank you so much.
February 13, 2013 at 5:14 pm
I am a big fan of Jess , Luau, Katie and Brooke and just love living vicariously through them because, yes this is just like my life too. Well, mostly because Brooke ‘s father is supportive. My question is: do any of you know of any resources, support paths or practices to help deal with my son’s father, we are no longer married, who does not believe our son is ASD and does not want him on an IEP? It is constant conflict and I do what I can but I worry about the best interest of our son. School is caught in the middle and their hands are tied because we must agree. I could always hire a lawyer I cannot afford, but I would rather try a less conflicted path to try and resolve. His father is stuck in the new term Jess shared with us from another’s blog, “Ableism” where he wants our don to be “normal” and I just don’t know how to cope with it all. Any guidance, suggestions, and/or advice would be appreciated.
Luna says:
February 14, 2013 at 10:25 am
wow. that is a tough situation. my husband and i don’t always agree on what’s best for our son, but we still live together so i’m able to manipulate him a little
i’m not in your situation, so the best i can do is try to imagine what i’d do if i were. there is a local community-supported counseling group here that operates on a sliding scale fee chart. they would work with both parents in counseling, which would help your husband process and accept that his son has ASD. mediation is an option, but you’d have to get him to agree and then there is the fee.
regardless of how this situation progresses, i hope you don’t let it get you down. lots of parents don’t agree on how to raise their kids. the kids turn out okay and so will your son. as long as your son knows that YOU see him as he is and love him, that he can be himself with you and that your home is his haven, he’ll know that he’s valued. i don’t mean to underestimate your plight, though. if i felt that my husband was stopping my child from getting the most benefit from school resources, I’d feel angry and cheated. if your husband refuses to budge or cooperate with mediation, maybe you could see a counselor. at the very least, it would help you deal with the emotions so that you don’t end up resentful or bitter, which in turn will help you be a better mom. sorry i don’t have any answers. i truly hope you find the solution you’re searching for.
February 19, 2013 at 10:52 am
My son will be 9 in a few weeks. He is PDD-NOS, well enough functioning child in a regular ed classroom with little support. Great, understanding teacher, accepted by peers. I said ACCEPTED, not embraced. He is quiet, flies under the radar, you won’t necessarily know he is spectrummy till you spend a few minutes getting to know him, but once you do, it is fairly obvious. There are few playdates, birthday invites, etc, but he is fine with this. Full disclosure I do not seek playdates with “unknowns” from outside. He plays well with his siblings and the occasional “other” that comes in who gets him, but he does not ask for outside play dates nor does he question the lack of invites, etc. That is my concern, but not his, and he relishes his alone time as much as he may enjoy joining in a playdate in progress for his older sister (she is very inclusive and kind). I will admit that him not pushing makes me not push, as I want to protect him as much as possible from kids who won’t get him. I AM SCARED that they will not love him or tolerate his quirks when they are one on one. That they will think he is lame or count the minutes till they leave and then NEVER want to come back. I see the looks he gets sometimes when he is having a “moment”, and it hurts my heart EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. He’s not freakish, he’s just HIM. A playdate is fun for him for about 15 minutes and then he wants to do his own thing and will leave a friend hanging. No bad intent, just had his fill and moving on. He’s different with his siblings since they know him and embrace him and treat him like any siblings would. If he leaves the scene they move on and do something else in their own home. He is happy in his skin, happy with who he is, and doesn’t see/care if he is a little different.
My husband feels that I need to push him and schedule more playdates. I am on the fence. I so want him to have friends, but I want them to be the friends that he FINDS or find him, not the ones that I set him up with in a game of trial and error. Like a matchmaker. I want it to be on his terms, with a kid who thinks he is cool and who he thinks is cool and then they are cool. That has more value to me than a setup.
Please thoughts? I think….?
March 16, 2013 at 11:41 pm
There are so many comments on here that I couldn’t read them all to see if anyone has posted this already…asking for grace everyone! My son does alot of the “scripting” that Jess has described with her daughter, and I am wondering if the best approach is to play along, and respond to the script, or if it is better to try to steer the talking toward a more conversational give-and-take. I am wondering in part because his teacher says that he does this at circle time and it is very distracting (possibly his way of disengaging from something that he is struggling with). Its an Autism class, a special ed teacher, so I don’t think she has a “problem” understanding his issues. I would love to find a way to get him to attend to tasks and people rather than isolate himself with his repetitive speech, but I honestly don’t know if that’s right. Anyone?
Cheryl says:
March 17, 2013 at 6:27 am
That repetitive speech can be the first step toward meaningful conversation. It teaches the give and take if you go along, it’s predictable therefore comforting for the child, actual words and sentences are used ( in most cases, lol), and for my kid eventually those scripts started to evolve. Same cadence and inflection, but different words appropriate to the conversation. I still hear it sometimes and he’s 9, but other people can’t tell because they haven’t watched Max and Ruby in years to remember. :-).
Also, the script can indicate the emotion, meaning there can be a happy one, one that is triggered by anxiety, etc. I would tell him “no tv talk right now please” when it was not appropriate or being used for avoidance. (On the upside he’s probably gonna have an amazing memory, which comes in handy… Unless its to remember a mistake you made). There’s kinda no getting away from it esp at such a young age. Ride it out babe and try to correct it when you need to, but know its still gonna persist. Perseverative language has an upside and a downside.
March 17, 2013 at 2:17 pm
Thank you so much for your quick response! I really appreciate your advice and encouragement!
March 17, 2013 at 8:00 am
Cheryl said it beautifully. I’d also suggest reading this. No, really, read it.
Cheryl says:
March 17, 2013 at 8:59 am
http://momnos.blogspot.com/2012/02/spirited-away.html?m=1
And this…. Mom-NOS and Jess have pulled me out of the dark more than once.
March 17, 2013 at 2:17 pm
That was a great article, exactly what I needed to read. Thanks for your help!
Sarah says:
March 17, 2013 at 10:25 pm
Hi there
My son has autism and will be 5 in a few weeks. He is now successfully peeing in the potty. He will not poop in the potty. He will sit on the potty, but not go. He will either hold it, go outside or in his pants as soon as he is off the potty.
I have tried scheduled toileting, the potty party method and giving him highly reinforcing items (or the opposite-letting him know he will receive a reward). Nothing seems to work.
Please let me know any advice, tips or ideas that you may have. Thank you.
Luna says:
March 18, 2013 at 12:41 am
1st of all, it doesn’t matter his age if he’s not cognitively ready. but, regardless, i just went through this with my NT daughter. She’s all good with #1, scared shitless of #2. (<–see what i did there?) So what I ended up doing as a last resort was feeding her a natural food that was a known diarhetic and then waiting maybe 20 minutes and then setting her on the potty until she had a movement. Once it took 35 minutes of sitting and I felt (feel) like Mother, Dearest. I did that until she lost her fear of going and did it on her own, making such a large production of our victory that she now expects a party after every poop. Disclaimer: all natural foods, never enough to cause dehydration, just enough to strongly suggest to her bowels that something needed to happen, and my daughter is NT with a slight anxiety disorder which is not the same as a child on the spectrum. I also tweaked the rest of her diet replacing most beverages with water, etc.
My HFA son was almost 5 before he mastered the potty. A lot of us have potty-training horror stories. The peer pressure to have your kid potty-trained by a certain age is the most stressful, for me. I hope you act out of support for your son and not in desperation to please the masses. I wish there was a fail-safe secret I could share with you but each child is completely different. Good luck to you and try not to let it get to you. He'll get there.
Sarah says:
March 18, 2013 at 11:12 am
Thank you so much, Luna. Your responses are always so thoughtful.
He is on a rather natural diet, since we avoid high fructose corn syrup, artificial colors and preservatives and a few other things. That leaves mostly the good stuff. I have been increasing his fluids in the hopes that it will make things easier on his system. I like the method that you used with your daughter, and think that will work for us. Since he doesn’t want to go back to pull ups, we kind of have to push forward. perhaps patience and consistency will work in the end (fingers triple crossed).
Luna says:
March 18, 2013 at 4:37 pm
geez. that is tough. sounds like he’s already on an optimal BM-supportive diet. i talked with the hubs about a strategy when we were going through it. how do you make someone want to relax and go?? once, after 3 days of nothing, i gave her a half spoon of karo syrup. not sure if that fits into his diet or not, but it had an almost immediate affect. (and thank you so much for noticing my comments. very sweet of you!)
March 18, 2013 at 3:51 pm
We just went through a similar thing with my daughter. She was about 4.5 when she started to go to the bathroom pull-upless. But it wasn’t untll she turned 5 before she could actually tell she had to go and let us know. That’s for #1. #2 was more difficult, she would hold it for days. She just had some issues and in the end our friend whose (NT) had similar bowel issues told us she gave her 2 prunes a day at breakfast. So we started as well (daughter is PDD-NOS). It helped quite a bit. She’s not regular every day but much more than before. In terms of getting her to sit on the potty that was also difficult but it’s amazing how videos, social stories, a little peer pressure, and a lot of bribery-rewards-cheering-and stickers can do. It seemed like we searched for the perfect thing that would keep her motivated but in the end she the novelty of a reward would wear off so we had to switch around a lot.
By 6, just in time for kinder (late birthday) she was finally able to let us (more importantly, teachers) know and not have any semi regular accidents but our biggest problem was night time wetting. We were thrilled that at just days before her 8th birthday she was finally able to keep dry for 7 consecutive days. For three years it was fits and starts with the night time training and I felt an absolute failure. But now I know she just wasn’t ready, her body wasn’t ready. So some things you simply can’t force to happen. If the body isn’t ready, no amount of training will help.
April 11, 2013 at 4:19 pm
Hey Everyone: First time poster here. I think this is such a valuable resource and right now I have a question to pose to the “village”.
I have an almost 4 year old who while is not on the spectrum she does have Severe Childhood Apraxia of Speech, Hypotonia and recently diagnosed with Sensory Integration Disorder. With her Sensory needs she is very much a seeker and in the beginning when we began to notice something was “off” we would see her putting her tongue on things, pillows mostly but some of my clothes depending on the texture of the cloth. Over the past few months it has progressed to her sucking her tongue. This sounds so weird but its the only way I can find to describe it. Her tongue protrudes and she sucks with her tongue out. It is similar to a thumb suck but backwards sort of. The problem is that with this behavior and her low tone her enamel is disappearing from her front teeth. We do have an appointment with a dentist next week and I am hoping that perhaps they have seen something like this and can offer support as well. I have a feeling they will want to pull her front teeth which I am prepared for but I want to find a different oral input for her that won’t affect her future teeth.
Has anyone dealt with anything like this? Any other options to mention to the dentist or therapist?
She currently receives 120 min of speech therapy a week over 3 days / no OT because our insurance won’t cover and I can’t afford the costs along with speech.
Thanks in advance for any help you may have.
Erin says:
April 19, 2013 at 12:49 pm
I’m not sure I have any good answers for you. My daughter sucks on her bottom lip constantly and goes through intermittent periods of teeth grinding… Have you tried chew-noodles or other sensory type chewy toys that she could get some input from? There’s a website called fun and function .com (all one word) that has lots of sensory toys for chewers – even if you didn’t get something there, you might get some ideas… Another trick I discovered, through trial and error, but then confirmed by OT – low tone kids have trouble finding where their tongue is in their mouth, which leads to feeding and speaking difficulties. So big flavors – especially spicy flavors- can actually be very helpful. We give my daughter salsa with her eggs in the morning, my son is best behaved in Indian restaurants because the spice gives him the input he is craving. Not sure if this will help your little one, but could be worth a shot. Start mild of course, but see if she likes it.
April 19, 2013 at 12:55 pm
Thank you for the site to check out. She isn’t a chewer really but it might work and I am willing to try. My concern is that it’s mainly when she’s sleepy and sleeping that it happens a d I don’t want her sleeping with anything that could be a hazard of any sort.
She loves most all foods and does like some spicy stuff
Erin says:
April 19, 2013 at 12:58 pm
The OT theory is often that if you can get enough of the right kind of input, then possibly they won’t need to seek it out on their own- that their sensory appetite will be satisfied to some extent. It’s not always the case. Like I said, my daughter still sucks her lip, still grinds her teeth…. I’d be really interested to see if someone else has an idea for this one, because we could use some help over here as well.
cg says:
April 19, 2013 at 2:05 pm
Is she allowed to chew gum? My daughter is allowed to chew gum after school after her therapy session, she’s is also allowed to chew gum after dinner for about 20 minutes. But nothing before lunch on the weekends and definitely not during school time.
Sarah T says:
April 20, 2013 at 6:06 pm
I also don’t have any really good answers for you but my daughter does a lot of oral seeking as well. A few things that help her lessen inappropriate seeking are incorporating lots of crunchy foods into her diet ( baby carrots, popcorn, shredded wheat), massaging the inside of her mouth with a baby “toothbrush” (gum cleaner), lots of regular tooth brushing, and sadly, lollipops. As Erin mentioned, the more input we provide through the day, the less she struggles at night.
April 25, 2013 at 11:22 am
My son has recently had a bout with loose stools and some diarrhea. (YAY FOR FUN TOPICS LIKE POOP!) We are hoping that it is just allergy related (accidentally ingested some dairy at preschool) or a virus. However, I am wondering if anyone has seen digestive problems in their autistic children due to stress? He is four years old and doing well in an autism support classroom. He was doing so well that the increased his time in the inclusion room to full days. It seems like he’s regressing with the potty and having more temper tantrums. His team, my husband, and I decided to back him off in the inclusion room to half days for the time being.
Does stress seem like a plausible explanation to anyone or has anyone had a similar experience? Thank you.
April 25, 2013 at 2:04 pm
Oh goodness yes! I have had Asperger’s syndrome for 43 years and I always have digestive problems when I am stressed. This is one of the less fun side effects of being on the spectrum. Digestive problems are so common for those on the spectrum that many self-advocates recommend adding it to the criteria.
April 25, 2013 at 2:33 pm
Thank you for your response! I’ve notice more digestive issues when there are big changes in his schedule or more transitions in his day. I am sure it is causing stress; I know changes stress me out! Hopefully backing off on inclusion and easing him in a little more slowly will make a difference!
April 25, 2013 at 11:44 am
We have experienced the same thing. When our son (who is almost 5) had his schedule changed at school to include more transitions(which are always difficult for him)he experienced diarrhea and diaper rash.He also started refusing to even try to sit on the potty for a while. I would say that stress can definitely contribute. And not just in our kiddos.
Anxiety is the activation of the fight or flight system when no fears are present. That stress causes a rush of adrenaline that redistributes both water and blood flow. That redistribution means that your gastrointestinal tract is not filtering water correctly, leading to poor stool health. Your body also slows the digestion of food, which contributes to diarrhea.
There are additional factors at play as well. For example, the stress of anxiety will put a considerable amount of physical stress on your stomach and organs as well, and that pressure may lead to your body not processing food well. All of these can lead to diarrhea.
It sounds like you have taken positive steps to reducing his stress, so that should help.
April 25, 2013 at 1:28 pm
Thank you for your reply! This is exactly what we are dealing with. He has more transitions and slightly less assistance through those transitions. The expectations are higher and it seems like he is having a hard time with them. I will be interested to see if he has less problems now that we are backing our time off in inclusion.
Lisa says:
April 26, 2013 at 6:13 am
I am going to be totally honest here and say that I am terrified to bring this up in a public setting. But, since NO ONE talks about this anywhere, I figured this would be a safe spot. My daughter is at the Aspie end of the spectrum. (I would also add that our family is full of Aspies…we just didn’t know it until her diagnosis.) She is also diagnosed with Anxiety Disorder because her anxiety issues are severe and crippling. Her sensory issues are also severe, and she also has an extreme need to achieve perfection. In March, she started a rapid downward spiral…and she started having psychotic episodes. I know that many people in the ASD world believe that I have it easy. But, I want to stand on my soapbox and say that there is nothing easy about having to admit your child to a psychiatric hospital. She was in imminent danger to herself and others. After what happened in the school shooting in Connecticut, and the very public statements mixing Aspergers and mental illness, I have been even more reluctant to discuss any of this publicly. But, I NEED to talk to other parents who are dealing with the co-morbib issues of ASD and mental illness. I am walking a terrifying path right now into the unknown. I just want to know that I am not alone.
April 26, 2013 at 6:22 am
Lisa, I have very close friends whose children have very similar situations. It’s incredibly difficult. I know others will speak up but please believe me when I tell you that neither you or your daughter walk this path alone.
Hugs to you both.
Lisa says:
April 26, 2013 at 1:56 pm
Thanks, Jess. We started down this new fork in the road right after you started dealing with epilepsy. You were describing so many things that mirrored what we were going through. I wished like anything that I could call you up and just share the fear and stress and worry, especially when I was in a hotel room alone, three states from home, waiting for the one hour a day that I could see my daughter. Your blog is one of the safest places I have found to share. For the most part, everyone tries to be polite and supportive. And, I have been trying to think of a way to connect with other parents going through similar events, but NOBODY talks about this. I understand why…we are also interested in protecting our daughter’s privacy. However, if there has ever been a time that I wanted to lean into the comfort of a community, it is now. Thank you for providing such a space.
Luna says:
April 26, 2013 at 7:51 am
My heart breaks for you. I’m afraid I cannot fathom what you’re going through. I hurt having to hand my son over to the school. Handing him over to a hospital, well, i seriously can’t even begin to imagine that. I have a friend who is the mother of a little boy who is probably facing some similar issues. His mental illness is probably due to his birth mother who abused drugs extensively and had a history of mental illness herself. He has several issues, including Asperger Syndrome. He’s a little young to diagnose his other issues, but his psychiatrist is seeing markers. My friend is distraught as she contemplates his future, his safety, her safety, and the safety of others. My point being you are most assuredly not alone.
Have you tried the hospital where your daughter was admitted? Maybe other parents of patients could offer support? Does she have a diagnosis yet? Maybe with a dx you could find something online. MentalHealthAmerica.net?? 1-800-273-TALK is a hotline for that website. Networkofcare.org is supposed to provide help locating support.
Sincerest wishes that you find the help that you and your daughter need. {{hugs}}
Lisa says:
April 26, 2013 at 2:21 pm
Thank you, Luna. Honestly, I don’t want you to fathom what we are going through. It is a level of pain that I never imagined. I always thought that there was nothing worse than watching your child suffer. I was wrong. There is nothing worse than watching your child suffer so much that you have to surrender all control over the care and treatment of your child. I had to surrender the rights to see my child…to be with my child…to hold my child…to be by her side through the pain. The rift in my soul is massive. I cannot even acknowledge the guilt and regret that are lurking in the shadows. But, inspite of my doubts, we all survived her seven day hospitalization. I lived for those one hour visits. We were three states away from home, so I had to spend a lot of time alone. Sometimes, lying in the hotel bed a few miles down the road, I would try to project my love and protection to her…hoping she could feel it in her spirit. The day we brought her home was a day of elation. And the beginning of our new normal. She is a new person, and she is better. She now knows that we WILL do anything to help her. She knows that there are other people out there, who are just doing their jobs, who can help her, too. She does not HAVE to have us with her to survive. She now knows that she does not have to let the anxiety win. She has power and choices and options. And she knows who really loves her. I think she even learned to love herself. It was a great treatment facility. We loved the doctor and the staff that we were allowed to meet. They did a great job. But, as for life experiences, it ranks at the top of my chart for most terrifying. And this is far from over. She still has much to overcome. Just the thought of going back to school set off psychotic episodes. Sooooo, this week, I withdrew her from school, and we have registered to homeschool. I will do what I have to do to keep her moving forward. We do not have a long-term diagnosis. We are in “wait and see mode.” So, thanks for listening and caring, even if it is not something you can imagine. And thanks for the hotline numbers. Honestly, I had not even thought to look for something like that.
Luna says:
April 26, 2013 at 4:48 pm
giving her the tools to cope sounds like all you can do. good for you for fighting for her and for letting yourself suffer so that she could get help. i also pulled my son out of school, for much less dire reasons, but i understand completely your desire to put her health and quality of life ahead of what society considers *acceptable*. thinking outside of the box and willing to do any and every thing to help her is what a good parent should do. i know we’re on very different paths but if you feel like talking/venting/whatever, look me up on fb… Luna Mireles…i’m a pretty good listener and i never ever judge other’s choices. sincere wishes you find your village.
April 26, 2013 at 2:44 pm
This is a most assuredly a safe place to bring this topic out in the open. Mental health issues spend too much time hidden away in the general populace.
I am so proud of you for the way your family LISTENED to your daughter, took her concerns and anxiety to heart, and sought help.
I do not have any personal experience with co-morbid issues so far (fingers crossed), but I have heard of this website called Parenting Aspergers Community. The website is https://www.parentingaspergerscommunity.com/
Best of luck, and keep us updated. We are here for you.
Deb says:
April 26, 2013 at 5:51 pm
Lisa…you are from from alone! And it takes a lot of courage to do something so very terrifying to help your child. My son is on the spectrum and is also bi-polar. There have been a few occasions where we considered hospitalization…I had looked at a few local facilities and had an admittance plans a couple of years ago. I felt physically sick to think of putting my baby in a psych unit. Had he not been started on a new med that seemed to help him turn a corner, we would have admitted him. I also have friends who have had to admit their kids as well. Anxiety and mood disorders are very commonly co-morbid with ASD. It sounds like she greatly benefitted from her “break” to get the help she truly needed. As with any illness, our job as parents is to find the right doctors and stop at nothing to get them the right help. You did just that. I truly understand the anguish. Perhaps the doctors who have helped your girl can help you find a community for support. You definitely have one here.
Lisa says:
April 27, 2013 at 2:39 pm
Thanks, Deb. It has been cathartic to just get it out here. We have friends and family who know what is happening… But, I am the strong one. I am the one people lean on. I have few friends who can handle this. Actually, only one. I consider myself blessed to have her. But, she has her hands full with a severely disabled child of her own. Which is, of course, the only reason she is strong enough to handle MY fears. She has been thru hell herself and survived. When she says I can survive this, I believe her. I was also blessed to have recently met both Temple Grandin and her mother. When I listened to her mother, one of her statements has stayed with me throughout our ordeal. She said, “There are no right answers on this journey. There are only choices. And choices can change. When something does not work, make a new choice.” I needed to hear that because I am terrified of making the wrong choice. So, far my daughter is alive and making strides forward. And, for today, I will count that as success.
May 6, 2013 at 10:25 pm
Our local psychiatric teaching hospital (Lucille Packard Children’s Hospital, Palo Alto) has a parents support group (no therapists, just parents). It meets once a month. There are other parents going through similar experiences to the ones you describe. They advertise it with posters in the outpatient waiting room. Maybe your hospital will be willing to facilitate getting a group like that going, if it doesn’t have one already.
April 26, 2013 at 10:03 am
Hi there. I’m a 43 year old man with Asperger’s syndrome with two children on the spectrum as well. I have been dealing with mental illness since my first psychotic break when I was 16 that was brought on by bullying at school. I have only been hospitalized once, and strangely enough, I found it very restful. All the extra stimulation of the world was cut out and I could just sit and work puzzles for a few days. I take mood stabilizers and get along pretty well most of the time. Mental illness is a big challenge in my life, but it’s not the end of the world.
My little girl began having severe anxiety issues in the first grade. She would have daily anxiety meltdowns and spent nearly a month staying in the front office every day before being assigned to a special education class. She is now doing quite well in the 6th grade with only a couple special classes.
In both of our cases, mental illness is part of our daily life that we have to deal with and then deal with the rest of life. As someone who has been there, I know it can be lived through with help, support, and by learning the right tools. As a parent, I know that I would gladly take all of her fears and problems onto myself if I could … but I can’t, and that is the worst and most helpless feeling. Please let this community help and support you with love and ideas so that you can help and support your little one.
Lisa says:
April 26, 2013 at 2:36 pm
Hi, thank you so much for responding. My husband is on the spectrum, as well as, two of our three children. My mother, his father, some of our grandparents, siblings, nieces, great-nephews…are clearly on the sprectrum..even if not formally diagnosed. To be honest, I think my daughter would agree with you. Although she missed us very much while she was hospitalized, I think she enjoyed the structure of the hospital…and the absolute absence of her normal stressors. She was placed on additional meds and was monitored 24/7, and she was able to 100% focus on herself and her issues. They had some really great techniques for helping her identify her triggers and what to do about them. She has struggled with anxiety her entire life. Right now, she is fifteen, but she has struggled with anxiety all of her life. I had to pull her from school when she was only 6-7 and homeschool her…and put her in counseling therapy to help her. When she went back to school, she could only go in the special needs classroom for several months…where she would cry the skin off her cheeks…until she could slowly adapt to the regular classroom. We have a family history of depression and anxiety, but not the severity that would require a psychiatrist or hospitlaization. I have taken meds for years, and I have used the services of licensed therapists many times. I have never been ashamed to admit my weaknesses, and I have always believed in seeking help when it is needed. But, you are right when you say you would take the fear and problems yourself, rather than see your child suffer. We are facing each day with a good attitude, always moving forward. She is better, more stable, and expressing happiness. But, inside of me, I am filled with all sorts of feelings. I am too raw to even try to sort them out. I cannot even bear to look torward the future. I am trying to stay focused on ONE DAY AT A TIME!
April 30, 2013 at 11:00 am
Has anyone had experience with their autistic child in montessori classroom? Pros? Cons? The school where my son will go has a fantastic montessori program. My thoughts on why we would consider it are that he does really well with older children in the classroom and he is actually good at working independently (he just turned 4 in February.) We tried full inclusion in a non-montessori pre-k room and he had a hard time with it (diarrhea, chewing, various stress induced behavoriors.) I am not sure if it is the number of transitions or what it was. On the other side, is there not structure in the montessori room? I apologize, this is sort of a stream of consciousness question. Again, thoughts and experiences with autistic children and montessori schools. Thanks!
May 1, 2013 at 4:42 pm
Hi, looking for advice, especially for anyone in Maryland about inclusion vs. private contained school at the middle school level. My daughter is 11, 5th grade. 75% mainstreamed at a Type 2 school that is imbedded in a public school. She needs quite a bit of support but is relatively successful in her mainstream class. She does have significant sensory and behavior needs (BIP in place). The county is telling us our only option is fully contained private autism school that we can’t even visit unless we agree to a more restrictive placement. We want what is best for our girl but we don’t know how to weigh the different factors in the decision and realize middle school is a whole new ball game. Anyone who has gone through this have advice??? Thanks in advance!
Me says:
May 6, 2013 at 10:00 pm
Forgive me for the very long ramble, but if I don’t get this out of my system I will just crawl into bed and sob uncontrollably and I can’t right now, my daughter needs me. This was a conversation I had with a friend:
Friend: What i hate even more than “everything happens for a reason” is “god never gives you more than you can handle.” ummm…then what exactly is suicide?
I have been told many times over both phrases when it came to the miscarriage I had many years ago and M’s diagnosis of autism and our on going challenges with it. I am especially sensitive to these phrases currently because M’s had a rough week last week and if today is a precursor to the week it’s gonna be another rough week.
Top that off with the fact that now B is going to night school five nights a week -leaving me to do all afterschool pick up, therapy sessions (which I had done for four years before he got laid off) but also tuck in, clean up, dinner and dishes, AND he is in class all day on Saturdays. I feel like if there is a god s/he/it is priming me for the fact that B will probably get into the apprenticeship program and be away from us for weeks or months at a time. But still, I so fucking did not ask for any of this and I am not feeling so special about myself that I think I can handle all this and be an effective, loving, supportive mother and wife sometimes.
Then I remind myself that many single parents do this for a lifetime, or at least a couple of decades and for us it may be as temporary as 3 years or a new way of life.
Anyway, so very sorry to unload on you, your topic of conversation just happen to be the victim of my mindset. I should also add that as a special needs parent one of the most damaging to the sense of self as a parent is the ongoing “parent-teacher-therapist” meetings -large and small. The ones like IEPs or the ones where you get pulled aside when signing your child out and hearing about the stuff that’s been going on, usually the challenging stuff, the self destructive stuff, the inappropriate behavior stuff, the social and academic delays, and somewhere buried in all that is the little positive thing but usually it gets totally overshadowed and you walk away feeling completely deflated and depressed that you can’t do more to help your child cope and wonder in complete mind-bogledness why this happens so frequently in school/class and not at home. This type of interaction being a day after day thing and all. And then you curse the universe for this sick and twisted situation because there’s nothing else to do and no one else to blame.
Ok, I’m done, sorry for being a debbie downer. Clearly I need a shrink and a drink. Heh.
May 20, 2013 at 9:33 pm
Alexas Playc, which is part of Rady Childrens Hospital has lots of resources all over southern california and will put you in touch with someone who can help if they cannot directly
May 20, 2013 at 9:59 pm
I love reading your blog and fb page. I went to gradeschool and high school with Tom Fields-Meyer, I think you’ll appreciate knowing him.
Ryan says:
May 20, 2013 at 10:09 pm
We live about two hours south of Santa Clarita. We have been dealing with our son’s Autism and the state of California for three years now. Send me an email and I will try to help the family in need.
May 21, 2013 at 5:27 am
thanks, ryan! i’m hoping to find someone right in the town so that they have a personal contact when they land
May 20, 2013 at 10:32 pm
Hey Jess! Is there any chance that you can post a post about siblings of kids on the spectrum? Long story short have an 11 year old nt son who was an only until the twins came along 6 years later. He was also the first grandson on my side-and we have a big family. 2nd art infertility- Go figure- Got preggos by my now hubby before we got married..So funny my mom went with me to try on a wedding dresses, and she had to try on the dress after me to see if it would fit cause she had a pot belly that we both might have by the wedding day arrived-lol! She says to this day that we should have been on Yes to the Dress . Anyways, my buddy Fr. M. @ the hospital that I worked at that time was
instrumental in helping Markie and I have a Catholic wedding-being under the 6 month mark – Hey , If there is a will, there is a way! So my point? These siblings fight and make fake fart sounds that really set my little guy off to scream” Then he screams back then mommy tries to intervene, then they laugh- torment some more! Seriously, this shit happens when all kids are nt but throw PDD-NOS into the mix? Give me another IPA!!
May 21, 2013 at 5:27 am
May 30, 2013 at 10:38 am
*sigh* … Edward was not only one of my favorite employees I had the pleasure of seeing every week at Kroger, but he gave me so much hope as to how personable my ASD son could be with a supportive family and employer. I’m so sad that Kroger made this decision to remove him from the store area he knew and loved for 17 years. It’s stories like these that knock the wind out of my sail … http://news.cincinnati.com/article/AB/20130515/NEWS01/305150004/Where-world-Edward-
Susan says:
June 2, 2013 at 11:46 am
I am a teacher and work with 8 students with special needs. We have end of year awards coming up this week and a parent contacted me asking that I be sure to give her autistic son an award because he has felt left out before. I have one student receiving an honor roll award and I have chosen 4 students for the other awards each classroom gives. Her son is not receiving one, quite frankly because he has not earned it. I feel that it is important for him to learn that he needs to put in the effort to be rewarded but he seems to be very spoiled at home. Thoughts or suggestions on how to deal with this?
June 2, 2013 at 12:03 pm
I’ll be very interested in seeing how other respond to this. My gut reaction is that it’s simply not appropriate for any parent to ask for a merit / performance based award for their child and if he doesn’t deserve it, then giving him one would not only devalue the awards themselves but would do him a far-greater longer-term disservice than the short term satisfaction of winning.
However, I’m cautious because I don’t know the situation and I don’t know if he had the support that he’d need in order to earn an award.
But in general, if you’re only giving out four awards, then the only way that I think you’d be acting exclusionary would be if you didn’t consider him on an equal playing field with the rest of the class.
If you feel comfortable that he’s not at a disadvantage, I’d tell the parents that these are strictly performance based awards and you’re sure that, given the effort, he has a chance at one next year, as do all his peers.
Again, gut reaction, not well thought out. Hoping others will respond too!
Margaret says:
June 11, 2013 at 8:25 am
I feel the same way, given the information we have. This came up in a different way last week at school. They 5th graders had been working and rehearsing for 5 weeks on their end of year talent show. The day of the show, an adult approached the director to see if there was something that a child who had been “left out” could do. There had been multiple flyers, emails, and lots of publicity about the 5 weeks of rehearsals. No child had been turned away, even if they didn’t come to the first rehearsals. A child who had come to the final rehearsal had even been allowed to join a group number. But the day of the show? These kids had stayed after school and worked hard. Now they got to leave class early and perform for the whole school. It seemed to us that saying yes would be, as Jess says, a “far-greater longer-term disservice than the short term” of being included.
I’m assuming that there is a system to reward hard work in your classroom and that he gets “caught being good” when he does work. If he has no motivation, I’d wonder if he needs a goal? Are there such things as goals for working hard? Just thinking off the top of my head. I’m also assuming that his progress reports and report cards have reflected that he isn’t performing to his potential. You didn’t say what age or what level the kids are, so that also could make a difference.
Margaret says:
June 11, 2013 at 8:33 am
Hi, Jess. My dd is singing in a concert next week and the organizer is giving the money to Autism Speaks. I dislike the fear/disease model of Autism Speaks, and wonder if there is another charity I could suggest to her? The organizer doesn’t have a child on the spectrum, and doesn’t follow the autism community closely. AS is just the biggest, loudest name out there. My girl, who is on the spectrum, will be singing “Over the Rainbow” in the concert.
Amber says:
June 12, 2013 at 11:45 pm
I’m sitting here writing this and I don’t even know where to start. But I need some help and thought I would start here. Ive never asked for help like this before. I have a daughter with Autism, she is 9. She just finished 3rd grade. She was completely non verbal until age 4. In the past she has done SIB but grew out of the phase. Now we have something big happening. A month ago on May 10th, my daughter wandered outside in the wee hours of the morning. I didn’t even know she was gone. She just got up, and walked out the door only wearing pajama bottoms. We do have several safety measures in place. Shoe ID, door alarms, door knob covers, stop signs on every door from the Big Red Safety box campaign. She has eloped twice in the past but we caught her within minutes. This time baby girl just needed a walk I guess. She was found an hour later about a mile away. An elderly woman walked outside to get the morning paper, and found my precious baby sleeping on her front porch. Since my daughter had no way to tell the woman her name, address and phone number, she called police. They took an hour to respond to the house. 15 minutes later a reverse 911 call went out to everyone in our zip code asking for the publics help in finding the parent of a special needs child. There are not many special needs kids in the area and we live in a very rural area. When the street name was listed in the 911 call, everyone we knew showed up at the house to see if it was our daughter. Here’s the bad part, we only have a cellphone in our house. And it just happened to be on silent that morning. I woke up to find the school principal in my bedroom, waking me up to see where my daughter was. She was gone. And I didn’t even know it. I can’t tell you how hard it is to write that. We got in touch with the police to let me know that our daughter was missing. The state trooper was taking a statement from the woman who found her when they got my information. They showed up at my house, and I was interviewed for an hour before they would let me go get from the house. An hour. Finally they took me to her, where I found her sleeping as well, in the lady’s arms. She looked at me like I was scum. I thanked her and picked up my baby, where she woke up and said Hi Mommy, I want to go home. We arrived back at our house with the trooper to find CPS waiting for us. Where I was interviewed again while an another agent took care of child. I gave the trooper and CPS permission to search the home without a warrant. They took pictures of everything. Down to the dust on the mantle. 2 hours later without finding anything wrong with me and my home, they were gone. I didn’t sleep for 3 days straight after that. I was too scared. CPS advised us to install a different kind of alarm on the door, which we did. A week later CPS shows up unannounced with more questions. Apparently they’ve discovered I’m under the care of several doctors. I was diagnosed with Graves Disease in 2009 and had radiation in 2010. Are you abusing your meds, they asked. I have a thyroid disease, if I abuse it then I would die. I’m also on Anxiety meds. And depression meds. Are you abusing those? Does your medical condition prevent you from taking care of your kids? Can you get your meds so we can take pictures? Finally they said do you have any questions for us. Yes, are there resources out there to prevent this from happening again. *crickets* Do you know about Autism? *crickets* do you know how common this is? *crickets* do you know the statistics? *crickets* After I start rattling off the answers, they say we are learning about it now because of this case. They didn’t know the answer. The very same week this took place was the same week we lost 3 other children in this country who had Autism, wandered away and died. I was heart broken. This too could have been us. And the very people investigating us had no clue about Autism. Fast forward to today. I received a letter from the agent in charge that the case was being closed. And, I’m being charged with neglect. For the next 5 years I cannot work in a school, daycare, run a daycare, drive a school bus, or even volunteer at our kids schools. A background check will show my charges. I have 60 days to appeal it. Which I plan to do. But I don’t even know where to start this process? I could barely afford to get groceries this week because my husband who works for the Department of Defense, is furloughed. How can I afford an attorney? All these stories in the media never say what happens to us parents after something like this happens. Is this common? Is this standard operating procedures? I need help. I don’t know who to call. Where to start. I’m lost. Can anyone help me?
Margaret says:
June 13, 2013 at 5:55 am
My heart is breaking for you.
Autism Speaks is the best known name in autism to the uninitiated. They have an autism response team. They might be able to point you in the right direction.
June 13, 2013 at 12:37 am
I wish I could offer some concrete substantial help and that I could tell you where to turn. I can’t. I just wanted to let you know that I’m crying while reading your post and I’m in total admiration that you stood up to the people in your house and questioned them on why they didn’t know a damn thing about Autism. I am also stunned that this is how you’re being treated. I think you need to post what town and state you are in so that if anyone knows of any legal aid places in that area, they can point you in the right direction. I can’t imagine how you are feeling right now. My heart goes out to you.
Lisa says:
June 13, 2013 at 12:28 pm
Oh, honey, I am so sorry. What a nightmare. I don’t know where you live, but I live in Alabama. We have an agency that provides free legal support and representation of any family with disabilities, not limited to autism. I know other attorneys who provide free legal advice to parents dealing with situations like yours, because they have children on the spectrum, too. I have no idea what is available to you, but try a google search. You should have a chapter of the Autism Society of America in your state. They also have access to extensive resources (assuming you are in the United States). I know this is a horrible situation you are in. I know that ALL of us in the autism community understand. There is no way to predict what out babies will do. I stay at my ASD daughter’s side 24/7 right now. She is in a completely different situation from your daughter, but it is life and death. I live with fear and worry and regret and guilt. It is a horrible place to be. And, I do almost nothing to take care of the house. I would be horrified if someone took pictures in my house. I don’t have time for housework. I am too busy fighting for my daughter’s life. I hope you keep fighting. As hard as it is, this could be a breakthrough event for your area. People are ignorant. If people don’t live with autism, they just don’t understand. And they NEED to learn. You may need your community again in an emergency. I know you are scared, but turn that fear into your battle cry. Keep writing to us here. There are many who read, even if they don’t respond. You never know the resources you may find.
June 13, 2013 at 1:20 pm
Hello there,
Dealing with CPS can feel like you have the entire weight of the government against you,but this is an illusion. You have the opinions of a couple of overworked bureaucrats verses the reality of your life and love of your daughter.
CPS is most often filled with people who want to protect children at all costs. They have been given the authority to bypass the normal trial process in order to do this. This is a power that should only be used with great caution and wisdom that has been placed in the hands of overworked bureaucrats. This has often led to systematic abuse.
If I were you, I would insist on trial before a real judge and jury. First, this calls their bluff and puts it out of their judgement. There is a good chance that the charges will be dropped when they actually have to prove them. Be careful, they will try their hardest to get you to sign away your rights. You have the right to refuse to sign anything without the presence of a lawyer. They will try to get you to sign away the specific rights of a jury trial and a speedy trial. They will try to make it sound routine. Absolutely refuse these!
Another thing: If your husband is employed by the department of defense, you may be entitled to representation from the JAG. If this is not the case, by insisting on a jury trial, you are entitled to help from the public defender’s office. Also by insisting on a jury trial, the burden of proof is shifted from you to them. THEY have to PROVE that you were negligent. This is very different from them thinking that you were negligent, which is the caser now.
Third: Find someone who is calm and mature to help you put together you story of what happened and what your life is like with you daughter. Document what you have done to keep her from wandering. Have them help you put these things together so that you can present them in a calm and clear manner.
As I said, just by insisting on a jury trial which puts the burden of proof on them will most likely get them to drop everything. Use the system to your advantage.
Amber says:
June 14, 2013 at 12:04 am
Thank you to those who have commented so far with suggestions. I filed an official appeal today, and left a message with the Autism Response Team with my local chapter of Autism Speaks. I am a member with the Baltimore Chapter since I live in Maryland. Also just wanted to clear up any confusion, I’m not being charged with neglect in the criminal system. Just with CPS. It will show up in a background check though. The woman who runs the appeals told me that a hearing will probably be in about 3 weeks. They are not taking my children from me and have stated that several times. I’m hoping to get some research done on wandering, the statistics, frequency, etc since this will be my main focus of the appeal. Any suggestions would be great, I will keep updating!
June 13, 2013 at 7:11 pm
Today is one of those days I want off the roller coaster. My son just had a sensory meltdown and his dad got angry because his reaction was “not appropriate or helpful”.
My son isn’t “autistic enough” to qualify for help, or for his dad to acknowledge that he’s not just an overreacting child.
But when we have a moment like that where in two seconds he tips over into flapping and hitting his head and crying, I’m just so tired and lost and it breaks my heart.
akbutler says:
June 13, 2013 at 7:25 pm
June 13, 2013 at 7:28 pm
oh, honey. hugs.
June 14, 2013 at 7:05 pm
Need a place to start…….another mom and I are ready to tackle a private company that employs many thousands, and its long-standing decision that their benefits do not need to cover occupational therapy for neurological disorders. This is a very very large, very profitable family-oriented company. Where do we start with this? A letter to our division’s (4000+) HR dept is what we’ve been told so far, but it seems so insignificant. But I remember reading here that it takes us ordinary people to get things started and accomplished, so I’d love to hear any and all advice and success stories! Encouragement needed too. Thank you all!!!!
June 14, 2013 at 8:02 pm
I don’t know if it is a success story per se, but it was a brave move none the less. Have you seen the open letter Lou Melgarejo of Lou’s Land posted on his blog to his employer on this very topic? “An Open Letter to Comcast CEO Brian Roberts and NBCU CEO Steve Burke” might be a good place to start……
June 14, 2013 at 9:05 pm
Thanks! I am familiar with Lou, and like his work, but don’t follow him regularly. A similar line of business as mine (peer pressure?), so I will look it up!
June 15, 2013 at 5:41 pm
From a friend at the Shriver Center -/
I’ve got several success stories, and a template letter they can adapt. They can email our office at info@disabilityinfo.org and ask for the self-funded template letter.
Amber says:
June 17, 2013 at 7:27 pm
I just wanted to give an update. I filed the appeal with CPS and my hearing will be on July 8th at 2:00pm. I called the Baltimore Chapter of Autism Speaks, and was told that legal advice cannot be given. They directed me to some wandering tips on their page. I’ve asked close friends and family to write letters on our behalf. And staff members from the school will be going with me to the hearing. Having been an Autism Mommy for 9 years now, I’ve gotten used to challenges in our life. But, I never expected any of this to happen. I feel like I’m standing at the bottom of the mountain and wondering if I can get to the top. I wish I had the amazing ability to wear my superhero cape at the moment. It’s hiding in the closet.
June 17, 2013 at 9:42 pm
Amber, not sure if they can help since it’s you and not your child but maybe they can help in some way. I live down in AA county and I found them when researching placement options for my daughter who is entering middle school this fall. http://www.mdlclaw.org/. Good luck to you!!
Amber says:
June 17, 2013 at 11:59 pm
Thank you very much, I will look into that in the morning :). Take Care!
July 5, 2013 at 7:23 am
I was wondering if there were any Asperger’s moms with Autistic boys. Scooter is 6 and I’m heading into muddy waters. DOAM has been my saving grace for the past two years.. the people on here an extension of that. I would just like to connect to someone who has walked (is walking) that path. Thanks
January Vickers says:
July 14, 2013 at 10:36 am
I’m hoping Jess will see this and write/post/tweet anything about this. I know many of us are military families and tricare recently released a new policy scheduled to take effect on July 25th about how and who will receive ABA. The new policy is ridiculous and will cut therapy for many military children with autism. And of course tricare is not being very forthcoming about the issue. Many families are just now finding out or do not even know. The policy takes effect at the end of the month yet it was just released less than a month ago. They are requiring testing every 6 months and if children do not show improvement, they can be denied for future services. This testing is not designed for that purpose. Services may also be limited to 2 years now unless there is some sort of waiver – not listed is how many hoops you have to jump through to get this waiver. Other changes to be made include increases costs, who can provide therapy/testing, etc… We need help and we need someone with a big voice to help. In the meantime, here are a few links. Please read, help, comment, anything. This is the link from AMFAS assessing the new policy: http://amfas.org/aba-assessment-letter Here is a sample letter to send to your senator/reprasentative. So far, 2 member have congress have written a sharp letter asking for answers but its not enough: http://amfas.org/aba-sample-letter and finally here is a petition on change.org: https://www.change.org/petitions/tricare-stop-tricare-from-autism-therapy-cutbacks
July 14, 2013 at 10:44 am
Thank you, January. I did tweet the info as soon as I saw the disastrous changes. I’m happy to see there’s a petition I can share as well. This is absolutely atrocious. Our service members and their families deserve so much better.
January Vickers says:
July 15, 2013 at 9:30 am
Thank you thank you thank you! Any little bit helps. I think it’s just still so unknown. I heard through a friend and haven’t even received an official letter from tricare yet! I’m furious and stunned that they would release a policy and not let anyone know about it and it takes effect in just 1 month after released. I have also heard that ABA agencies are just barely finding out as well and are not getting much information from Tricare.
July 15, 2013 at 10:03 am
My 6yr son, dx’d PDD but more likely Asperger’s (yeah I know, doesn’t exist anymore, whatever). Anyway… he’s a mix of sensory seeking and avoiding. Lately he has started chewing on things and putting dangerous things that he could choke on in his mouth. I need to find him something he can use, both at school and at home, that will not call attention to the behavior and yet give him something safe to use in place of putting small rubber toys in his mouth.
July 15, 2013 at 10:07 am
Have you tried Chewy Tubes?
July 15, 2013 at 10:22 am
Thanks, Jess. That’s the kind of thing I’m looking for, but I’m wondering if he’s still be able to choke on those? Still… I guess it would be less likely than what he’s using now. He’s chewing mostly in the back of his mouth (and yes, we’ve been to the DDS). So I kind of need something he can get to the back and yet still not choke on. The pencil toppers might work too if they’re long enough?
July 15, 2013 at 11:51 am
these i think will serve that purpose well and are made to avoid choking. if you scroll to the bottom of th epage, there are different shapes and options.
July 15, 2013 at 1:54 pm
Thank you so much! I’ve ordered one of those and also one of these: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AF3D6G2/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1 though I do worry this one might be too small.
Thanks again, Jess!
Michelle says:
July 15, 2013 at 9:57 pm
Well, my daughter was diagnosed at 23 months. She is now 30 months old and my husband is struggling as much today as he was the day she was diagnosed. It doesn’t help that we have no support from his family. My mom, who would have been a big help, has stage 5 Alzheimer’s and had to move in with us about the same time my daughter was diagnosed. So, we are overwhelmed on several fronts. I struggle some days still but overall, I just see my beautiful girl and do my best to help her and love her unconditionally. I want so badly for him to have hope but he can’t seem to find it. He says it is because he is her dad and he is supposed to be able to make it better and he feels like he can’t. I’m not sure exactly what I’m asking but I guess I’d like to know if anyone else experienced this after dx and what if anything helped? I try to encourage him but he just gets upset and says that I am in denial about the struggles that she is facing and will continue to face.
July 16, 2013 at 7:58 am
Michelle, YOU ARE NOT ALONE. I hear this quandary far more than I wish. I’ve posted your comment on Diary’s FB page and will copy responses back here, but if you’re on FB, I hope you’ll come check out what people have to say. Digestion can take time, but it doesn’t mean that he won’t come around to a place of acceptance.
We must prepare for the future, but living in fear of it means missing out on living in and enjoying the now. xo
July 16, 2013 at 8:50 am
There are now 42 responses and counting on the FB page. Please let me know if you can see them!
Michelle says:
July 16, 2013 at 11:02 am
I can’t thank you enough for posting to Diary’s FB page. I am writing through tears as all these responses have been an answer to many prayers. I’ve been afraid of reaching out, feeling somehow ashamed of my inability to just keep it all together. This has shown me that I truly am not alone and that this community embraces everyone. Your vulnerability and honesty inspires me every day. Thank you to all Diary’s FB readers for taking the time to encourage and show love to me.
akbutler says:
July 16, 2013 at 10:39 am
You are definitely not alone. I’m sure others have said it on the FB page but there are many of us who get it. I know there are dads who read these posts who can answer this too, but sometimes dads get into fix it mode and when they can’t, it’s very hard to see anything past that. You have so much on your plate coming from both sides.
I know in our house it took time for my husband to see the future and it took him participating in therapy sessions and IEP meetings and teacher meetings to understand it all. Keep reaching out to find your village, either online or in person. It’s there.
You can do this. He can do this.
July 16, 2013 at 12:38 pm
It’s hard not to despair when you get a diagnosis. Your story is similar to mine in that I had a very difficult time with my daughter’s diagnosis. She was diagnosed with PDD-NOS when she was about 33 months old. We grieved and were so sad, but at the same time we went right into action: intensive speech therapy totaling 4x a day (private and school district), Floor Time therapy for the first year and a half. She’s 8.5 yo now. Presently she does ST 4x a week during school, 2x during the summer (private). She does OT, swimming, and gymnastics each 1x/wk. It’s a packed schedule, but she has benefited from it tremendously. I know not every can afford to do such intensive therapies that many times a week -financially and time wise it’s a HUGE commitment. But if you can secure any amount of services for your child it would be more beneficial.
When your child starts therapies you’ll see some progress and I think that might help your husband feel better about the diagnosis. I would also like to say that the benefits of getting professional help isn’t just for your child, but for yourself too. After the first year of my daughter’s diagnosis I finally let myself feel and I was not in a good place. I was seriously depressed and angry. I sought out a therapist for myself. For two years I went, and was able to figure out what and why I was so angry. It’s not just as simple as “I hurt because of my daughter’s diagnosis” it was deeper than that, I had fears that I tamped down, I felt rejected, etc. I worked through it all, and it was tough, but it was well worth it. I am in such a better place with her diagnosis and with myself now.
There’s so much more I can share with you but I don’t want to take up so much space here. Feel free to email me at artisgoodinyourlife (at) gmail (dot) com if you’d like.
July 16, 2013 at 8:22 am
Thank you so much for chronicaling your experience with your beautiful daughter. As a fairly young, single mom of a beautiful 14 month old its given me hope since I heard her early intervention team say the word “autism” the second time they visited. We are still in the very early stages of everything. I’m wondering if you can recommend any support groups online just to talk about all this? Any help would be greatly appreciated
Erin says:
July 18, 2013 at 10:47 pm
I’m not sure which are the “best” support groups for you, but I find a lot of comfort and information on facebook. I follow Jess’s Diary page, and the Thinking Person’s Guide to Autism, as well as some others including local groups from my area. Another resource I have found to be incredibly valuable is to seek out autistic adult’s pages, such as Karla’s ASD page, or ThAutcast (run by Landon Bryce). There are many resources out there, but take it in small bites, a little at a time. One resource will lead to another. The best thing I have found is just to be able to talk to other moms who are going through the same things, but it can take some time to find them. Your EI team may be able to recommend some support groups in your area, or maybe (technically they are not officially allowed) be able to arrange a playdate for you. It can’t hurt to ask.
July 16, 2013 at 8:41 am
I’m not sure if this is the place to post this, but I need some information. My 4 year old ds was dx with PDD-NOS June 2012. I have been lucky with the school system, finding outside OT and ST, and qualifying for supplemental insurance from the state. I live on Cape Cod MA. In May of 2013 after evaluation in Boston my son’s dx was changed to Disorder of Childhood, NOS – which basically means there is something there but we’re not sure what, The school system has been amazing in keeping services even though we have this vague dx.
My family’s major source of emotional support are my in-laws and they are moving to FL in the fall. My husband would like to follow them down, but how will the services in FL measure to the services we have here in MA. I’ve read some horror stories. I would love to follow my in laws but am unwilling to sacrifice my son’s education especially since his current dx is so vague.
Where can I find accurate information on schools in FL. What have your experiences been? TIA.
Erin says:
July 18, 2013 at 10:56 pm
I don’t live in Florida, but a good place to start would be with an Autism Speaks chapter (or other national organization with local chapters). If you can contact the local office, they may be able to provide you with contact information for providers in the area. You can usually get a good feel for things by talking directly with the providers. They may be able to recommend certain school districts over others as well. It is a big decision either way. Good luck.
July 17, 2013 at 3:56 pm
Jess, you have been a real inspiration for me. I’ve read almost your entire blog over the last couple of weeks. Your perspective as a mom and an advocate is SO helpful for me and I thank you for your honesty and eloquence.
I have a couple of “disclosure challenge” questions that I hope I can get help and/or input with.
1. Telling the rest of the family. MY immediate family knows (big sis’s son has Aspergers and is almost 30). My husband’s do not. Funky family dynamics are the problem. My sis-in-law (SIL) has 3 boys and all are special needs; 1 is in a group home and doing spectacularly, the other 2 are at home and are integrated in school. I know that if I share that my boy is also autistic, my Mom-in-law will get depressed cause ALL her grandkids are on the spectrum (I’m pretty sure her brother and her husband are undiagnosed). My SIL will feel competetitve or something otherwise crazy (she was like that BEFORE she had kids and hasn’t changed). I so want to share with my mom-in-law but the dysfunction potential freaks me out.
2. Disclosure: to my son, at school / daycamp. We’ve been super lucky that our son has been “lightly brushed” by Autism (PPD-NOS at age 4, PPCD as prep for kinder). He’s integrated in school and starts 1st grade this fall. He’s attending YMCA summer camp/daycare and is doing well. Academically he’s fine, but socially – SIGH. He DOES have playmates (YAY!), BUT there is that super-awkwardness with kids his own age. Your stories of support from Brooke’s classmates, etc. have given me courage. I plan on talking with my hubby about introducing our boy to his different way of thinking, and then to his class after school has started. Any help in how to go about this would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thank you again – so much – for sharing your story. I’m reading Loud Hands now, and am planning on going back to school to get a certificate, then Masters on Education Psych/Autism Intervention. I think being armed with the internal and external perspective will be a HUGE help there as well. HUGS!
July 27, 2013 at 2:51 pm
My son was diagnosed with ASD 7 months ago when he was 2 years old. We had our first IEP meeting in June, so as you can probably guess, I am quite new to this.
My husband and I made quite a fuss at the IEP meeting and the principal became involved. We were told that most of the parents at that school didn’t even read the IEP and just signed it. We made numerous changes to the initial (cookie cutter) IEP and had 3 IEP meetings before agreeing to an IEP that expires in October, at which time we will review again.
Here are my questions: How do I make sure that the teachers are doing what they say they will? Should I ask for a daily note from them? Is that a reasonable request? My son is non-verbal, so he will not be able to tell us about activities in school.
Thank you in advance for your help!
deceivinglynormal says:
July 30, 2013 at 4:29 pm
I didn’t even realize that this page was here before I spilled my guys on the “about” page. How did I miss this!? Yeesh.
I won’t repeat my question(s) but I will write my reply to what Jess so generously replied to me. Hopefully it will be enough without the back story:
Jess, thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to really think about and answer in length my question(s). It can be very tough trying to figure out how to parent properly, especially when you realize you were likely doing it all wrong for a very long time. I really want to parent my kids with as much understanding and patience as possible. I hate that those traits don’t come easily to me, but I suppose that is in part due to my own ASD traits. And if I am going to learn to accept and adore my daughter’s autism, then I had better figure out a way to accept and make positive my ASD traits.
Honestly, sometimes I just need to say what is actually happening in my life with my kids that the ‘World’ doesn’t get to see and that my NT friends with NT kids don’t and can’t “get”. I need to have a momfriend who not only “gets it” but also has a lot more experience with it than me to tell me her suggestions, or at the very least her experiences.
It matters to me very much that you care enough to try to answer this crazy thought rant I had. Lol.
I did not experience ASD from the beginning of my daughter’s life and learn to adapt to it and my own ASD because I had no idea what we were living and experiencing was ASD in both of us. I just thought she was “more” and she was “challenging” – even “difficult” and that I was just a big asshole and that I always had been just a big asshole.
Hindsight is twenty twenty, but it’s hard to teach an old dog new tricks and I have been parenting in a somewhat backwards way for about 8 years now trying to figure out why my first kid (NT) was so “good” and my second kid (AS) was “not”. Trying to figure out what I did wrong or if I had just been lucky the first time around.
I’m being brutally honest here – and I’ll admit that it is hard to see these words written down: “not good”, “what I did wrong”. Because I know my daughter is awesome. And unfortunately for me it took a diagnosis of her ASD for me to recognize that all the things I accepted as difficult and challenging were/are really neat and interesting and great.
It didn’t help that my NT friends would openly discuss my kid as a challenge or laugh half heartedly about being “stuck with her”. I was easily embarrassed and tried my hardest to change what they saw as bad behaviour in her instead of trying my hardest to have them understand it actually wasn’t/isn’t bad behaviour.
I am slowly training myself. And I will take your kind advice to heart. Thank you.
Prevention is better than the cure, and you’re right – when in meltdown phase – there ain’t no cure for that.
Signed:
Exhausted and grateful.
steveandemily says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:15 pm
We have an opportunity to participate in a study for an oxytocin nasal spray. It requires two blood draws and my six year old freaks out about shots/needles. I’m just wondering if the potential help from the spray is worth putting her through the blood draws.
Thanks.
September 2, 2013 at 7:10 pm
My name is Cheyenne and I’m a senior in high school. I may be in the wrong place for this, but I have a good feeling this is perfect! I’m in the process of writing a play about autism. Not a cheesy, after-school special kind of play, but one with a story line and developed plot.
The idea initially came to me in search of something that would have true-to-life meaning and impact on an audience. I accidentally stumbled upon this page and saw how countless people were supporting each other through this site and loved it instantly.
Currently, my play is focusing on a young boy who has autism. I’m writing situations of his actual life, then juxtaposing it with scenes that are in his mind; almost like he has a separate world that he’s thought up and becomes his safe reality. I’m showing his progression as a child to a teen and in his childhood, he fully believes he’s a superhero. This idea is just the framework that I’m sure will change, but I sure could use some help. I’m researching as much as I can about autism, but I don’t think I could get any better information than that of those who live it every day. What I’m looking for, is advice of all kinds. I’m looking for stories, testimonies, quotes, real, heartbreaking emotions, characteristics and mannerisms, and finally, stories of hope. Really, anything you could offer would be greatly appreciated and I’d love to collaborate and share the final product with you. I’m not sure how I’d like to integrate your responses, as that will depend on the kinds I get.
In the least, I’m looking for one word descriptions of autism or people you know that are autistic, (or you yourself). If you’re willing to let me use your name, (or nickname), and could comment a word, I love to use you in my play.
If you’ve read through all this, I love you for it. Thank you. Please please please help me write this very important play to show the world that autism isn’t debilitating, but a superpower to these kids.
September 6, 2013 at 8:53 am
Hi Jess, my son has pdd-nos, but very strong language and academics (so far). He’s “easy” – he doesn’t have meltdowns at home; hasn’t really had them at school. Hubby mostly sees him at home. I see him more in the world, playing with peers and such – so I see the “difference”. I know, as hubby says, we’re lucky because son is “minorly” affected. We had a conversation last night, where I told him I started blogging. I’ve been looking into going back to school in the field of Autism Intervention (at a school where they are more maximization focused).
Hubby wonders if my engagement with autism and getting into advocacy for him – because son is “easy” – is me “overly-mothering” him to compensate for an exceedingly selfish/underly mothering experience from my own mom (pop-psyche I like to snuggle with my 6 year old DS and I have stayed with him till he falls asleep (DS likes this) – I plan on “weaning” as we get through September, but this is a peeve for hubby. He also has the “I probably would have been put on the spectrum, it’s overdiagnosed, the machine of the health care world creates the umbrella and has to keep itself going” attitude – he’s cynical by nature, and may be partially right, but he’s also not engaged in the same way with Autism that I am. And once in a while son does something “off” that makes hubby go “that’s it, isn’t it”, but it’s pretty infrequent.
I’m kind of irked because of this conversation from yesterday. I don’t know how to clarify things for him. I don’t want to have to justify myself. Son IS easy, IS hardly symptomatic at home. I just feel trapped a bit by this. I don’t know if you have time to email me re. this, but if you can, or if anyone else has dealt with this – wotedge@gmail.com.
Thanks!
September 6, 2013 at 12:51 pm
Having a home environment that is friendly to autistic challenges can make a big difference in how easy or hard he is seen to be. You really can’t judge this until he is taken out of a friendly environment. I sat this as a middle aged man with Asperger’s and the father of two kids on the spectrum as well. While growing up, my home was a very easy environment because autistic traits run in both sides of my family. It wasn’t until I started spending time away from home that I started feeling like there was something wrong with me, It was similar with my children. They had autistic traits from birth, but I never felt like there was something problematic for them until they started spending time away from home.
September 6, 2013 at 4:45 pm
Thanks very much for that insight, John!
September 6, 2013 at 9:33 am
Hi there,
I truly hate to say this… and please disregard this response if it is not helpful… but while I was reading your post I thought: This is me. This is my story. This is so strange because I could have written this exact post. Six years ago.
My husband (at the time) thought I too was overly motherly, that I babied my son because I laid with him in bed at night until he fell asleep. (By the way, six years ago, my son was also six years old)… That he seemed “fine” and he had a “hard time” delineating where Asperger’s (my son’s dx) ended and being “spoiled and babied” began.
What hurtfully piercing, seemingly benign words.
Sometimes I feel like a fraud here because my son does seem neurotypical most times… except when he doesn’t… like at night – when he wanders the house full of anxiety because he can’t sleep – and I think back to when he was six years old and I used to lay next to him at night (the only time he would be physically close to me)… and I think of my husband saying I was “babying” him …
And yes, I too, “weaned” him off of that. And gave him independence and now, melatonin (which does help)…
And I tried to teach my husband about schedules and routine, and stims that are disguised as “neurotypical quirkiness” as opposed to outwardly autistic symptoms… And sometimes it helped… except when it didn’t. When “meltdowns” did occur – but not the metldowns you see in movies – no, in our world a meltdown came in the form of fierce stubborn disregard for “authority” in an absolute refusal to eat any new food, or go out of the house for anything other than school if it was planned two days in advance etc — and challenging his authority, was something my husband was not keen on. It definitely peeved him.
By the way, I live in a world where I am constantly trying to convince everyone around me that my son needs me and them in ways that are different than typical kids – including the school psychologists — he currently has no IEP because he is so “high functioning” they removed his asperger’s dx and replaced it with “learning disorder”. So the smartest 12 year old I know, the 12 year old who when friends come by to visit he casually asks them what they think about bombing Syria — if he were in public school, would be labeled with a learning disorder – f’ing absurd. So, thousands of dollars later, after having him privately assessed, I know what his NEEDS are regardless of a label and he goes to a small, private school and he is doing great there. But that required me to seriously come to terms with the fact that world was not seeing what my son needed. I had to trust the voice in my own heart saying these state funded “experts” are dead wrong…
and so is my “husband”.
To have that scowling doubt… in my own bedroom, in my own home… to have a disdainful eye cast upon me while I’m only doing all that I can for my dear son…
was so much more damaging than I could even comprehend at the time… I chalked it up to my husband wanting to make my son into a “man” and being a father figure that I THOUGHT he so desperately needed.
At the end of the day, all these years later, after our marriage fell apart for other reasons… I started to realize that all of that disdain and denial had so much more to do with his issues with himself than with “the system” or my son…
And by the way, those issues were: Gross selfishness, narcissism and obsession with my attention (that when being taken away at bedtime by snuggling with my son turned into a “peeve” for him).
I guess my point in writing this to you this morning is that I beg you to take a look at the bigger picture of who this man is and where these peeves are coming from before you begin to wean your dear little son off of anything.
Six years later, I would give anything in my power to go back in time and lay with him in bed one more time.
Now he’s 12. And his “quirkiness” brings upon a whole new world of challenges that I have no idea how to conquer…
But six… six years old… is a precious, precious time and NO ONE should make you feel bad about the way you spend time with your baby – neurotypical or not.
I send this to you with the best intentions…
In terms of writing a blog – there are so many of us out here, who only have our “toes in the shallow end of the pool” of autism — (have you read that blog post? Either Jess wrote it or maybe MomNOS wrote it? Please seek it out, reading it, seriously cleared the clouds away for me…)
I think a blog from that POV would be wonderful to read.
Best of luck to you,
Cheryl says:
September 6, 2013 at 9:43 am
“But six… six years old… is a precious, precious time and NO ONE should make you feel bad about the way you spend time with your baby – neurotypical or not.” Hey…Amanda. Word. That is all.
September 6, 2013 at 10:08 am
September 6, 2013 at 10:40 am
Thanks Amanda. Huges hugs to you for all you’ve gone through. I wrote a long “replay to all” response. I really appreciate your kind words! My blog is only a few days old, so I love new readers (I have at least 1 so far besides myself LOL). walkinontheedge.wordpress.com
PK says:
October 25, 2013 at 3:29 pm
Just a happy update – we found a good-night routine that works really well, and DS is falling asleep on his own!! Read, tickle, lights off/dreamlight on (he loves it Much snuggling, and a short song (same one, every time, 3-4 times, with snuggling. Then good night/see you in the morning. I guess we were both finally ready and I’m proud of both of us.
September 6, 2013 at 9:57 am
Bless you.. My story reads as both of yours.. The issues lie within the father yet make the path we try to travel that much more precarious. I left my marriage for the good reasons already listed and can give my son the freedom, space, place of no pressure to be his awesome 6 yr old as he discovers how the world works on his own terms. I am my son’s pit bull, his champion.. I hope that in the new relationship my ex now has with his son has provided him with the insight he was so badly lacking before. I think he is still too rigid and pushing the ‘making a man out of him’ agenda.. And I can only guide him from a distance but at least now he listens more than he ever did and it is better than it was.
September 6, 2013 at 10:09 am
Nicky, bless you for having the courage to walk away from something unhealthy. I just know how scary that is. More power to you.
September 6, 2013 at 10:38 am
September 6, 2013 at 10:00 am
I searched the blog post out for you. It was written by The Adventures of Boy Wonder, but it’s connected to another post written by Jess… Just a wonderful perspective that helped me so much, that I thought I’d share..
We swim in the deep end of the autism pool. Maybe not the deepest murkiest part but we are in pretty deep. Yes Boy Wonder is not very verbal. His social skills and play skills fairly non existent. He struggles to express his most basic wants and needs while we struggle to understand him.
But our struggles are just that. OUR struggles not your struggles. While your struggles are in the shallower end pool, they are no less challenging just different.
I’ve never once wished that Boy Wonder was less autistic, had HFA or Asperger’s. I’ve wished he didn’t have autism at all. I wish no parent ever had to hear,”Your child has autism.”
I empathize with your struggles and I celebrate your child’s victories. But never once have I thought that your child has it easier then mine. I just think their challenges are different.
I don’t want more company down in the deep end of the pool. It’s crowded enough down here.
Posted by Boy Wonder’s Mom at 8:02 AM
September 6, 2013 at 10:36 am
Thanks to you moms! I think hubby comes less from a place of “be a man” (although there is that cultural fear of mama’s boy I’m sure), and more of a kind of cluelessness, and a tendency to be more clinical/logical than emotional.
We DO have just a toe in the pool, at least currently. And hubby doesn’t SEE because he’s working/studying. He spends quality time with our son and they love each other tons. But dad doesn’t see him very often at the play place every week and how son doesn’t mesh with his peers, doesn’t “get” the rough play, etc. He just sees our sweet, thoughtful, articulate, well-behaved (usually) son. – Until he sees a co-worker talking to son in that “pleased to meet you” way and son’s eye contact SO OBVIOUSLY going AWAY from the person’s face (which he doesn’t usually do in an obvious way) that hubby says – is that a symptom? Or when son does something he’s not supposed to, gets a stern reprimand, and son gets SUPER sad/retreats away from us and kind of hides and hubby asks – is that normal? Incidents that are spaced so far apart that they disappear in dad’s memory, but I have them practically date stamped because in my mind I’m saying “SEE? There it is!”.
He sees the kind-of-damaging helicoptor mom thing in other parts of our family, and the more extreme autism manifestation in other parts of our family, and looks through that lense. He sees me through the lense of knowing my mother, who is a REAL piece of work in terms of selfishness, and knowing that I don’t want to be that so might be swinging too far the other way. And I might be, but I’m aware of it so hopefully not too far
So I’m going to cut hubby some slack. But I wonder how much of how well our son is doing is in part because of my “over-mommying”? I know my behavior won’t “fix” him (I love who he is), and it doesn’t change son’s brain. But if I am calm, if I understand and interpret the world for him to help him “get” how the world works, if my presence settles him – what if that is part of why he is “easy”? Take away that safe place and then what happens?
I want my kiddo to be independent, to fall asleep on his own, to be out of sleep pants this year, etc. I don’t want to be the crazy opposite of my mom. I also want hubby to SEE what is there. To see that support isn’t overprotecting or babying. Just because the support wasn’t there when you were a kid and you turned out fine, just because sometimes things are overdiagnosed, doesn’t mean our reality isn’t real.
And I wonder if a part of it is that if he sees the REAL, he’ll be in that place that dad’s find really hard where you want to fix the real and make things be all the way OK, and you can’t . Maybe that’s a place he’s afraid to be…
Lisa says:
September 6, 2013 at 12:05 pm
PK, I wanted to respond to this portion of your last comment.
“I wonder how much of how well our son is doing is in part because of my “over-mommying”? I know my behavior won’t “fix” him (I love who he is), and it doesn’t change son’s brain. But if I am calm, if I understand and interpret the world for him to help him “get” how the world works, if my presence settles him – what if that is part of why he is “easy”? Take away that safe place and then what happens?”
From the very beginning, my first child was different. I could never put my finger on it, but I knew. I poured all my effort into easing her way in the world. When she was only two months old, I remember a well-meaning SIL commenting that my life didnt have to end just because I had a baby. I ignored her, and kept following my instincts. My own mother told me to let her cry more, and that it was good for her newborn lungs. And I said that she did not understand how wildly out of control my girl could get….that I had to get her off the cliff as quickly as possible…if I did not, she would cry for the next three hours, until she lost her tiny voice. I hovered and protected and intervened. She was super smart, quick to learn, but terribly anxious. She was inventive and imaginative and creative. But different. She seemed at a loss socially and was emotionally immature and sensory-defensive. Even in infancy, she avoided physical affection. Even seeing pediatric neurologists, speech therapists, and pediatrician a regularly, not one person ever mentioned autism. We moved twice during her elementary years. She continued to be smart and well-behaved and socially-emotionally immature. She went under the radar until middle school. Her awkwardness stood out more and more as her peers became interested in boys, make-up, fashion, and the social structure. And like a smoldering volcano, her anxiety was building. I was still watching her and guarding her and intervening, but I somehow missed how severely depressed she was becoming. I think I was getting tired of always trying to make the world work for her. I suppose I thought that she would eventually outgrow her awkwardness and become a typical teen. I could not have been more wrong. It took a family trauma to send us to a therapist, seeking help for PTSD for all of us. This complete stranger spent a short time with my daughter and said, ” Have you ever heard of Asperger’s Syndrome?” I was dumbfounded. Suddenly, there IT was…the common denominator…the pathway to truly understanding and helping my daughter. She was fourteen. How on earth had we missed this? And, then, there was the domino effect of realizing that my husband was clearly on the spectrum, as well as, his father and my mother, and our youngest daughter, too. It was as if a fog had lifted off of our lives. The answers to a thousand questions were there for the taking. All of this to say, YES. Your style of parenting is very much helping your son thrive. When we listen to our gut and follow our instincts, we improve the lives of our children. I was never swayed by what others thought or said. And, I want you to stay vigilant. Our Aspie kids can do very well in the elementary years, but the transition to teenager is fraught with chanllenges. Physical body changes, hormone changes, social expectation changes, more pressure and independence at school …and that is when that underlying anxiety and depression can rear their ugly heads. It changed everything for my daughter. Public school became a place of torment. Eventually, her issues became life-threatening and she was hospitalized for a short time. But, she responded well to treatment and some new meds. AND, she no longer goes to public school. I will do whatever is necessary to keep my daughter well and to support her dreams. I truly do not care what anyone else thinks of our decisions. She is alive and healing. Her siblings have weathered the storm by her side. We are all stronger for what we have been through. It has been very, very difficult for my husband, even though he himself is in the spectrum. He just cannot understand the emotional aspects she deals with. But, he accepts her. He loves her. He is devoted to providing for her. Your husband may see things more clearly as your son grows. And you KEEP listening to your gut instincts. You may have to seek outside help at some point. Do not be ashamed. If it weren’t for an entire team of talented professionals, I would not have my dear daughter, who will celebrate her 16th birthday in a few days. Buy it took ME to put that team together. It took MY determination, MY desire for information, MY dedication to her well-being, and my willingness to coordinate the efforts of many people in many different places. It also took a huge amount of faith in God. She still struggles, and I watch her like a hawk. If I were to give you one piece of advice, start reading ahead about adolescent Aspies…so you will be more prepared than I was. And, tell your husband, I sleep with each of my Aspie daughters! I stay with whichever daughter is struggling the most. Sometimes, we all three have to join together. It is EXTREMELY common for ASD kids to have sleep issues…going to sleep, staying asleep, dealing with nightmares or insomnia. We all deal with it in Our own ways. At our house, we all sleep better if I am close by. So, sorry if this was overwhelming, but it just really important to tell you that you are in the right track and to keep listening to your instincts!
Jersey says:
September 6, 2013 at 2:18 pm
thanks for the love,
September 7, 2013 at 12:56 am
Jersey, you will never know how your post came to me on one of the darkest days, and how reading it, truly turned things around for me. So much so that I have never forgotten it! I am sorry I couldn’t remember it was you who had written it right off the bat. Thank you for taking the time to share it.
Lori (copied to here by Jess) says:
September 7, 2013 at 7:21 am
… I need help with school , nasty notes , phone calls , I E P s…
Autumn has just started Kindergarten she has Myotonic Muscular Distrophy , and autisum non-verbal…cant write doesnt follow rules the way school wants her to , at times she covers her ears and lets out a yell, she is on a feeding tube and has threapy for food issues and aid to help her at lunch , they get upset if she doesnt eat what I have sent..I have taught over and over how to do things and they call and complain about her. Please send help my way .
Erin says:
September 10, 2013 at 8:30 am
I’m not sure what I can do to help, but I’m here if you need to vent. Is your daughter in a public school? It sounds like she may be eligible for a lot more help than it sounds like she is getting… Maybe we can figure something out together. Hang in there.
Cheryl says:
September 7, 2013 at 5:24 pm
I’m at a family party as we speak. There are about 7 boys here around my son’s age, 9ish. They are outside playing football and my son is in here with the adults eating bread and butter and watching Max and Ruby. He’s happy as can be, greets all the boys as they walk by and let’s them know where the football game is. He takes another bite of bread and watches Ruby’s Surprise Party for the 100th time. Did I mention he’s happy? I’m trying to be ok with this. No one is commenting. Maybe they get it enough to not comment. Maybe the boys are at the age where they don’t give a shit and its not worth making fun of because there’s a game going on. Yes I did mention he’s happy and that I’m REALLY trying to be ok with this. I’m trying to follow the leader.
September 7, 2013 at 5:59 pm
He’s happy. Good job, Mama. Breathe. He’s happy.
Lisa says:
September 7, 2013 at 6:21 pm
Yep, I have been in this place many times. Our kids are fine, but our unmet expectations are crawling all over us. My oldest on the spectrum is almost sixteen and a girl. I took her to a football game last night, to watch her younger brother march in the band. I was surrounded by teenagers, even younger, elementary aged kids, engaging in full-on social behavior. What was my teen doing? She was drawing in her sketch pad, dragons and anime characters and totally oblivious to the game and the social dynamic. Remarkably, despite the heat and uncomfortable concrete bleachers, surrounded by people and Mosquitos, she never had any sensory complaints. She was in her own little bubble and quite content. There was a time that I would have thought SHE would have been in the band or running around with her peers at a football game. But, no, she is happily being homeschooled and does not care one bit about the social behavior of her peers. Like you, I try to follow her lead.
September 9, 2013 at 7:46 pm
I know I don’t know you – and I’m sure you’re busy, but I have a couple of questions, if you wouldn’t mind? I teach 5th/6th grade, and we have been having Honor Choir Auditions. I have had two children with autism audition and they both got perfect scores. Out of all 175 kids who tried out, only 7 achieved this. My question is, do you think I will offend their parents if I ask them if their child can handle the pressure of the Choir? It has two day a week rehearsals and we will have several performances, some of which are competitive. I don’t want these two boys to have a bad anxiety experience with Choir and then hate singing and everything related to it, but I also see their excellence and want to encourage it. I am new to the school and the school is new, and I don’t wan to offend or insult parents with my questions. Any thoughts as someone who has been navigating this path for a while?
Thanks so much for your time.
P.S. I have created a second choir, Glee Club, that has a lot less pressure with some performances but half the rehearsal time and none of the competition stress.
Lisa says:
September 9, 2013 at 9:19 pm
As a parent of two high-functioning autistic girls, I would love to have a teacher approach me and invite me to share my thoughts. I realize that not everyone is the same, though. My oldest was in middle school band, and as much as she loved playing, she did get really stressed with performances and the chaos in the daily rehearaals (and all the noise). We have a very competitive marching band, and that pressure for excellence and competition is fostered right away in middle school. I am not sure if she would have survived high school band. We will never know, because she had to start home schooling. It all became too much for her. But that is just MY daughter. I know that there are others in the band who are ASD. And they do fine, and they do NOT want to talk about it. I think it really depends on the student and the parents. I would talk to the principal or teachers or any special needs team members and get their input, too. They might tell you that the family is very approachable. Personally, if the students had the guts to try out, and if they performed so well in the audition, I think it is only fair to give them the same opportunity as anyone else. My husband and I are on the spectrum, and we both thrived in our high school music programs. Just my opinion!
Jodi says:
September 11, 2013 at 9:22 pm
hi there, so we’re having a bit of an issue and i would really appreciate any guidance. we have a boy who just turned 8 this week. he has asperger’s and is doing really well, most of the time. he has stopped having meltdowns almost completely and getting so, so good at expressing his needs before he gets overwhelmed. the problem we’ve been having lately is that when he does get overwhelmed while he’s stopped having a tantrum, he has started trying to hit and bite anyone that tries to get near him. we had a couple of incidents over the summer and now it’s happened at school. he didn’t bite his teacher but he tried to and he did hit her. we’re really worried about this not only because of the possibility of hurting others but also that he is such a loving, affectionate and non-aggressive kid, i’m worried about the issues this is going to create in school. i’m worried that people are going to judge him on these outbursts and not really get to see how great of a kid he is.
have any of you been here? do you have any thoughts on what we can do? it seems to be a gut reaction he has when he loses it and he’s not intentionally trying to hurt people- kind of fight or flight reaction. but i can’t figure out what triggers it.
i’m really at a loss here
September 12, 2013 at 8:01 am
i’m hoping that you get some good responses here, but no matter what please know that you are not alone. so many friends come to me to talk about this. it’s a huge issue for so many of our kids, but one that is very difficult to talk about publicly for a host of reasons.
we need to ensure that those who work with our kids understand that violent outbursts are a reaction to some kind of stimulus – internal or external, NOT a violent nature, and that our job is to help determine what that stimulus is in order to help to avoid it or mitigate its effects.
hugs to you and your kiddo.
Jodi says:
September 12, 2013 at 12:02 pm
thank you. i do need to hear that we’re not alone. it can be so hard when you see how awesome and amazing and brilliant your child is but the rest of the world only sees the odd tics and outbursts.
September 12, 2013 at 10:07 am
One thing that helped with my son was to always tell him what I wanted him to do rather that what I didn’t want him to do. My son was always exceptionally large and strong, so I was always reminding him to be gentle. If it is a task, I sometimes guided his hands through it so that he could feel the appropriate amount of force. I also stressed that his strength was to be used to protect. The last thing is if these outbursts seem to be truly random, you may need to check if they are a type of seizure. Seizures are a very common co-morbid for the spectrum and needs to be ruled out.
Jodi says:
September 12, 2013 at 12:06 pm
thank you John, for taking time to respond. What I’m finding to be hard is that he has never attempted to bite me and has only very rarely tried to hit me and when he did try that, it was a very halfhearted attempt (if that makes any sense). This seems to be the result of others not really knowing how to engage with him.
I do appreciate the concern for seizures but I don’t think that’s the case here. It is worth investigating though. thank you again
outrunning the storm says:
September 12, 2013 at 11:54 am
Jodi,
I have a seven year old son dx aspergers who has had issues around physical aggression on and off as far back as I can recall. While it is hard to know what is going on with your son not knowing you, him, or the situation better, I am happy to share what I have learned from our experiences. If you would like to talk further, I am sure Jess would be happy to forward my contact info to you.
1. Separate this action from your son. I know that seems obvious but it is one of the most important pieces of advice I can give you. When someone is harming you physically the feelings around it can get murky. This behavior is your son communicating something the best he can in the moment IT IS NOT WHO HE IS. Be sure everyone around him knows that. Be sure you always know that, because you will have to always be on his side when other’s won’t want to be. He is not a violent kid. He is not an aggressive kid. This is not just something autistic kids do. He is a child who is doing the best he can in that moment to communicate his needs.
2. In the moment. This is, in our experience, always a panic response. When it is happening, it is already too late to have a discussion about it. If he is lashing out when people get near then it sounds like he needs space. Find a way to give him space, quiet, whatever it may be until he feels calm again. Do not try to have logical discussions with him in the moment about how hurting people is not ok. If he is in panic (and it may or may not look like panic to you and I) but if he is in panic he can not hear or process what you are saying and it adds to the panic to have more words thrown at you. Find a way to give him the space he needs to calm down with no other agenda in that moment.
3. Educate yourself as much as you can. If you have not had the chance to read the words of autistic adults who describe what it feels like to be in these panic situations please take the time to do so. It has been imperative for me as I do not experience the world in the same way as my son and I am a better parent to him and advocate for him when I have a vision of what he may be experiencing. There is a good discussion going on around this issue currently here http://emmashopebook.com/2013/09/11/what-others-had-to-say-love-overwhelm-violence/ and here http://emmashopebook.com/2013/09/12/the-conversation-continues/.
4. Involve him in researching the cause. When the incident is over begin your search for reasons it happened. We are lucky that my son is very verbal and fairly in touch with his feelings. I can always ask him about it later. He does not like to talk about it. He is embarrassed about what happened. Part of teaching with him around this is that he has to be part of the solution. We discuss what happened without shaming him or telling him how bad it was. Believe me he knows. We ask him to identify what he believes happened and how he felt about it. It often is not the same story as the adults present would give. This is okay. It is his reality and our solutions to prevent this have to start with his reality. Telling him the way he experiences the situation was wrong does nothing to help him work through the feelings in the future and just adds to the failure and shame he already feels around it.
5. So what’s the cause? For my son it is usually either high anxiety, sensory issues, difficulty processing what is being asked/happening for executive function reasons, or sometimes a combination of all of these things. Sometimes this will look like a full panic meltdown with lashing out as one might expect, but sometimes (remember I said it may not look like panic to you and I) it can seem to come from no where to those around. A simple example is my son got in trouble once for spitting in a teacher’s face once. He explained later that her breath smelled really bad. He has a very sensitive sense of smell and smells I may not even notice will make him gag and throw up. The teacher in his face made him feel sick, he panicked. In the moment spitting in her face was the most efficient way to make the smell stop. It worked, she backed up. So, you are likely on to the right answer when you say he is in fight or flight. Explore. Ask him. Do not just let the school report a list of your son’s “bad behaviors” to you. The “behaviors” are nothing more than a sign something is wrong. Be sure they are telling you what happened before. If you are not happy with the detail they give you ask the school to do a Functional Behavioral Assessment. This is your right as a parent. If you do not like the one they do you have the right to request it be redone by someone of your choosing.
6. What can I do? First and foremost keep telling your boy how much you love him because I guarantee he feels terrible about himself. Next, one of the biggest requirements we have with our son at school is “No power struggles” This is a tuff one because it is a paradigm shift from the adult/child model we all follow of “do as I say because I said so”. But, we find that if it is time to go to gym class then my son really wants to go to gym because..well…..it’s time to go to gym class and that is what he does, it’s on the schedule. So if he balks at going, there is a reason. To cajole him into going anyway and get into a power struggle with him results in him feeling backed into a corner and panicking over being pushed into something he is not ready for. Instead he needs to be given the leeway to not go or go when he is ready. While this sounds to many like we are teaching him that he runs the show and his every whim will be indulged the truth is that he doesn’t take advantage of it. He will take a few minutes extra to gather himself and feel calm and then join the rest of the class in gym. He has never once used this as a way to do whatever he wants.
Big hugs to you, mama, I hope there is something here that can be of use to you.
Jodi says:
April 15, 2014 at 1:01 pm
so i just got off the phone with the school again today. out of the blue we had another outburst of violence. this is after months of wonderful reports. your advice is still good to hear and i’m reading it again and again and sharing it with my husband. i wish it was easier to get the school to be on board. i want to go back and see what happened to push him to the point of such a reaction and make them see that he was reacting to feeling completely out of control.
i’m finding that these moments are the hardest, when things have been amazing to then be smacked down. to be hit with worry and fear and your heart hurts because you know that this wasn’t all on him. you hurt because you weren’t there to mediate the situation and you know that this stressed him out and that he tried to do things to fix the situation but that they weren’t the “right” things and just landed him in bigger trouble. and i feel powerless. that no matter what i do, people are still going to push him beyond his limits (and not in a good way)
PK says:
September 16, 2013 at 4:49 pm
Does anyone have suggestions re. 1st grade and helping your spectrum kiddo to do the work? My boy will be 6-1/2 next month, is in an inclusive classroom. He has strong language/academic skills, but weaker social skills.
We’re having his 1st ARD of the year tomorrow and I had a chance to talk with his OT (she is at another school and won’t be there tomorrow – the rest of the team will). His big challenge right now is finishing his work in class, and checking out attention-wise. He CAN do the work (when he does it, he does it very well), but he just seems to drift away from it after starting it. (Example, writing a 3 word sentence. He needs direction to write the 2nd and 3rd word. He CAN do it, but he doesn’t.) He’s the last kid to move when it’s time for circle time, last kid to get stuff and do the next thing – he’s not cluing in to what the teacher is saying, and he’s doing things when he sees the class doing them.
He’s a sensory-SEEKER, and as far as we know he doesn’t have sensitivities (none obvious, anyway). Everyone seems to be onboard re. supporting my guy and finding his “sweet spot” re. how he learns, etc. But I really want to help as much as I can.
We’re not sure how much is behavioral vs. sensory – sometimes they get tangled up with each other. The OT and Teacher are working on a sensory diet for him (but have to balance filling sensory needs vs. accidentally rewarding something that’s behavioral and not sensory.
Part of the problem is I don’t see the behaviors at home – he’s home to play, etc. He does his homework with very little prodding. It’s on the computer so he can concentrate on it, and he enjoys it, not like paper/writing work in school. We did work on writing over the summer, just a few times each week. It wasn’t his favorite, but he did it, and he improved.
Home is just not like school, atmosphere wise. I KNOW it’s just 1st grade, but if I can help him understand the what, and the why and find the motivator to help get what he needs to get done happening at school, that would be great. Following directions and getting your work done is the cornerstone of school at this point, so I’m having my little mommy freak-out.
Thanks!
Erin says:
September 27, 2013 at 4:30 pm
I think we’re in a similar situation over here. My middle daughter is also in first grade, in a regular classroom. While she is very smart, keeping on task and following multistep directions are a real challenge. We have a TSS (a one-on-one aide) who goes to school with her to prompt her and help her follow along with the rest of the class. It works well for her. It keeps her in the class and gives her the assistance she needs. But she is tired by the end of the day. It seems she has considerably more difficulty at the end of the day, trying to settle down after lunch and recess. We have been discussing sensory breaks for her to help her organize herself before she has to settle back into the desk. One thing that has worked well in the past was a fidget belt I made her. It gave her the input she wanted on her hands without her having to jump up and flap in the middle of her spelling test. (Our team is unders strict instructions from me to not correct or redirect her stimming, but just supplying the fidget give her a different avenue to get that input without breaking the other kids’ concentration – win-win. ) and it does help her stay focused a bit.
Is there any chance that you would be able to get a one-on-one aide for your son? Even if just for a short time to help with the huge adjustment into first grade. It might help to get him into the habit of staying focused at school. It sounds like he is capable of doing the work if he can do it at home, he may just need a little more help at school to transfer the skill.
My daughter’s kindergarten teacher told me yesterday that this first month and a half is the hardest adjustment for all of the first graders (not just ours.) She told me because I was having my own little mommy freak out and actually debating home schooling her because it just seemed to be so hard for her! But honestly, if it’s hard for a “typical” first grader, it’s gotta be brutal for ours. See if you can secure a little extra help for him at school. Because learning to write is such a big part of first grade, I doubt they’d let him use a computer, but you could talk to your OT and see if it’s a possibility if it would help him….
I guess I don’t have much solid advice, except to say, “me too.” Hang in there. My nine year old has Aspergers. He did get hang of the school thing after some bumps in the road. It will get easier once he gets used to the expectations.
September 21, 2013 at 9:20 pm
Does anyone else feel like this policy change is going to be difficult for our kids on the spectrum? It is certainly going to impact our family and may limit our access all together.
Morgan says:
October 2, 2013 at 8:49 am
Hi everyone! I just saw this on The Daily Show and really really wanted to share it with as many people as I could. I may be late to this party, but I can’t wait to read this. My son is 8, and we are in a good place. But I don’t ever get complacent about anything. So continued education is very important to me. Have a great day!
PK says:
October 2, 2013 at 9:28 am
Has anyone found successful strategies to help an elementary schooler with perfectionism and handling expectations?
My 6 year old with PDD-NOS is doing really well in 1st grade, BUT he has high expectations re. his behavior and equates not making the best choices all the time with “being a bad kid” (his words) : ( He even said last night that he didn’t want to go to school – I guessed it was because he had a “yellow” day . His school has color charts for behavior and you move up/down colors – best is blue, next is yellow – so he did FINE, but it wasn’t BLUE, so he was down on himself.
We also had a meltdown at a birthday party because of a party game – pinata (see blog for full details). He believed that HE had to be the one to break it because that’s what you’re “supposed to do” for the game – in his words, “he didn’t do it, he wasn’t the strongest. He was SO SAD”.
He recovered pretty quickly and had a great rest of the party, but mom totally didn’t see this coming re. games, expectations, performance, etc. I’m thinking of creating some social stories re. this – “life” skills, attitudes – but would LOVE any other ideas that have worked for your perfectionist kiddos.
He does come by the self-criticism honestly, because mom and dad are also introspective and self-critical. Not in front of him, but personality-wise.
Lisa says:
October 2, 2013 at 2:48 pm
PK, I totally understand what you are describing. My husband and I have perfectionistic tendencies as well…but our youngest on the spectrum (she is 8 and a third grader) is very simar to how you described your son. When I read about issues with various children, I watch for someone, anyone, to mention this particular issue. It may not seem like a big deal, but it is a huge challenge for us. My daughter is also very sensitive to criticism, or even PERCEIVED criticism. Until this year, she had been able to maintain high grades without much effort. She is also ADHD and some OCD along with her ASD. Her biggest issue is usually lack of focus and the need to move, move, move…and talk. However, this Common Core business is kicking her booty. She is coming home with D’s and F’s. This is NOT helpful for a perfectionistic child. We have had more than one evening full of meltdowns and misery over homework and studying. I don’t know about your child, but ours has “verbal perfectionism.” If you repeat something she has said, it had better be verbatim. If I try to help her with her homework, and if I do not use the exact terminology of the teacher…not good. She has also has the expectation that everyone else remembers everything perfectly, the way that she does. When she has something to say, she wants/needs to say it immediately, and she cannot tolerate being told she had to wait. I know that this has gotten better over the last year. I will have to give some thought to some of the specifics we have tried to implement. I know that this year, they are finally doing social stories with her. I am not sure if they are helping, or if she is gaining skis on her own. I will think about this and get back to you.
October 2, 2013 at 3:08 pm
There is a page on FaceBook called the Autism Discussion Page that covered this very subject recently. You can find the page here. I find the information on this page extremely helpful.
The posts I am talking about are from Sept 22 and the 23rd
PK says:
October 4, 2013 at 9:18 am
Thank you – found it. That page is wonderful, isn’t it!
Jordan says:
October 4, 2013 at 8:12 am
I am not sure if this is ok to post here, and if not, feel free to remove it. But, I am a teacher for students with moderate to severe autism and am in a contest to win school supplies that they desperately need. I would greatly appreciate it if you could take a moment to click through the link, like Classroom Direct, and vote for my photo. Thank you so much!
Jordan says:
October 4, 2013 at 8:13 am
PK says:
October 4, 2013 at 9:31 am
This isn’t an emergency issue, but I’m feeling ambivalent about it and I’d love some input. First the question – How involved should I get with Autism Speaks (what are alternatives if not?)
Background: I came upon Autism Speaks in the last 2 years. I’ve not attended any walks yet. I did some volunteer work at their local office and the people there were great. I worked on a committee and same thing. I attended an award lunch and there was not a cure focus at all – more a “how does it come about” and “how can we help” from the people there. I haven’t run into the fight/cure, etc. rhetoric that I’ve heard about – it seems this attitude has shifted, and may have been in the past, at least at the levels I’ve interacted.
I know from reading several blogs that many autistics really aren’t fans. I’ve read Jess’s stance as well and it also makes sense to me. My son is “quirky”, but his health has not been impacted, he is able to communicate. I am not “cure” oriented, but am more neurodiversity/services to succeed/reach out to understand oriented.
I would really appreciate feedback, thoughts, etc. on this, as I want to support research and support systems for autistic individuals, families, etc.
October 4, 2013 at 9:47 am
PK, despite my differences with them, I also acknowledge that Autism Speaks does some wonderful work, both in research and in political advocacy. And I think that the more of us who eschew the disease / cure model of autism who continue to engage with them, the more truly representative of the community they will continue to become. For alternatives …
If you’re not familiar with ASAN (the autistic self-advocacy network), I highly recommend checking them out. They are extremely active in grass-roots advocacy and are eager to have allies supporting their efforts. In addition to the ASA (autism society of America) and the ARCs which now make a concerted effort to support our community, there are any number of local support / advocacy groups in different areas. Here in Boston we have the Flutie Fdn, which does wonderful work and supports community services, which are desperately needed, along with the Autism Alliance of MetroWest and AANE (the Asperger’s Assn of New England). I always suggest googling (your city) autism + support to see what comes up and taking it from there.
Hope that helps.
PK says:
October 4, 2013 at 10:14 am
It does, thanks! I clearly understood where you were coming from re. them. Not having done a walk, I hadn’t really come up against the disease/cure thing (Temple got me first LOL). I just want to support groups that fit the reality of my child/family and many of the autistics I’ve come across (thanks to your blog I’ve emailed ASAN locally but haven’t heard back – I think I need to find the “right” department there, unless you have thougths as to who or what area to connect with.
Thank you again for your blog, and for sharing your experiences. It really has helped me find a voice and look at the world in a different way. Things just “open up”, you know?
October 10, 2013 at 9:10 am
I am at a complete and utter loss as to how to handle my son’s school. He is in third grade, has Aspeger’s. Had a horrible year last year with bullying. We took many proactive approaches to try to help ensure this eyar would be better for him. But once again, they don’t get it. His main struggle is socially and this is the hardest for him at recess. We specificed in his IEP that he have an IPSP at recess with him and not a general lunch aide. He has a daily log, and instead of them recording their recess observations, they ask him, and write down what he says.. Horrifying. He suffers from Cyclical Vomiting most likely from migraines or an undiagnosed/specified seizure disorder. His neurologist believes stress is making this worse. I went so far as to last week I sent his Special Ed teacher a copy of wording from teh Asperger’s Assocation of New Englands Website, ways to help him at recess.
Again, nothing has changed. Last night my husband and myself composed a letter, which is below, that we sent to his Special Ed teacher, Classroom teacher, Principal and Guidance Counselor. No response yet. I feel like we are talking to people that just DO NOT get it. I am at a loss as to what to do next. We requested a meeting. But we have met many times before. Do we get an advocated, special ed attorney? Any support or guidance would be appreciated. We are feeling pretty low at the moment.
We are writing to express our disappointment in how recess with X is being handled. X’s log today stated that he played with different friends for both recesses. This was not the case. X spent the first recess chasing someone he considers a friend around who never responded to, or acknowledged him.
Anytime we gently try to approach x about how recess was today he has a completely uncharacteristic nuclear break down. We can assure you, as x’s parents, he is internalizing these feelings of rejection. What is the purpose of his daily log if we are not receiving accurate information?
This is not a healthy situation for him and X absolutely deserves better than this. The part that is the most upsetting to us, is that he still cannot identify social ques of when someone wants them to leave them alone. What if the child got frustrated by him. He continued to follow a child around who clearly wanted nothing to do with him. Where was his recess aide? Who was giving him the social prompt that he should try something else.
Last year we were adamant that he have a recess aide who would help facilitate recess activities. He needs someone to give him the social cues that he does not yet have. Everybody agreed at his last IEP meeting that this was a necessity. What exactly is his aide’s role at recess?
Is his daily log being written from her perspective or from what X is reporting back when asked? We are not helping him by not giving him the support he so greatly deserves at recess. I have heard several times that X has a dream aide. That’s great, but again, what is her role? What plan is in place for him at recess? We need a solid plan. We cannot let him try to figure it out day by day. X does NOT have the tools to do this. Although X does not show that he is upset at school, I can assure you he is internalizing this. It is not fair to him that this continue. X has reported back that his aide is sitting on a bench at recess. We were under the impression that the reason he had a special ed aide and not a regular recess aide was to help him facilitate recess activities. We are extremely frustrated that he is struggling at recess. As his parents, we hope you can understand our frustration and concern for X. We truly do not worry about him at school, except at recess.
We are respectfully requesting a meeting to discuss how we can make recess better for him.
October 10, 2013 at 11:35 am
It sounds like time for an advocate. An IEP is a legal document that they are legally bound to follow. If they are not following it, they can get in legal trouble. If they seem to have the idea that the IEP is inconvenient to follow, so they are not going to bother, they need a wake up call.
October 10, 2013 at 11:39 am
Thank you. It does seem like it is just inconveinent. We sent his special ed teacher information directly from the Asperger’s Assocation of New England’s website on how to help children at recess. It all just falls on deaf ears.
Thanks for your comment
PK says:
October 16, 2013 at 1:02 pm
Hello all – this isn’t for me, but for my nephew, age 30, PDD-NOS living at home. He was misdiagnosed back in the day, teased miserably, bullied, etc. as a kid (he lived in a small town that was the opposite of supportive), lazy school district (they’d rather pay insurance to protect against lawsuit for not providing services than actually provide the services). There’s just a mess of stuff around how he got where he is in his head today.
He wants to be independent, and is getting help from an adult autism assistive group in that direction. But he’s in denial about his autism. He’s “fine”, it’s “not a problem”, etc. As his aunt, and the mom of a 6.5 year old autistic child, I’m trying to be an “unobtrusive resource” – sharing info, talking about how things are different, etc., with his mom, and with him when it seems appropriate.
He attended some sort of autism support group a while back – not sure if it was families, parents, etc., but he told his mom that everyone there was “worse” than he was and he didn’t fit in. I would love to help him find his way, get comfortable with himself, find a place where he feels he fits. But he’s 1000 miles away, in a different place in his life, and partially in denial.
Has anyone dealt with something like this? Do you have any ideas on how to “help without helping”? Or do I just be present to listen whenever he’s ready?
October 18, 2013 at 9:11 am
I don’t know what would work best for him, but I can tell you what I’ve had to work on in order to “accept” the diagnosis. First: “do I just be present to listen whenever he’s ready?”….yes to this. You can certainly offer constructive feedback, but at the end of the day, just being receptive to his feelings and letting him know you acknowledge how he feels…that can be huge. Also, it will let him know that he can speak freely with you. It’s likely that he will just shut down around those who insist he accept ideas he’s not ready for.
I was diagnosed with Aspergers at the age of 30…this left me feeling extremely bitter, angry. When I researched the diagnosis online, I just heard how great it was…most of the stories were about math geniuses and savants. This only made me feel more bitter and alienated. The “positives” never clicked for me.
Ultimately what helped was viewing the diagnosis…not as a label I had to accept…but as a toolbox. I tended to view my social issues as problems to be solved…and once I began to see the spectrum terminology as “tools” I could use to solve those problems, I had an easier time embracing them. I didn’t like being told how to react, how to feel about being on the spectrum. I still don’t. I did like gaining the ability to more effectively comprehend the nature of my social deficits…and then developing coping strategies to manage them.
So, when you feel he is ready, you could suggest that he use the terminology and labels like tools in a tool box. If they don’t fit who he is, great…but they can still have use-value. He can just pick them up every now and then, use them, then put them away.
To put it differently: once he has social goals, he can just temporarily use diagnostic words as a way to achieve those goals. “I had a bad interaction, and it’s because autism/Aspergers prevented me from seeing this or that bit of social data. Now I know, I can try to pick up on it next time.”
Viewing the labels as tools 1. gives him more control over them and 2. gives him time to sit with the words, perhaps get used to them.
Again, this helped me, I can’t say for sure that it will help him. I just know I too struggled with accepting the diagnosis, and it’s never been easy for me to just readily embrace the concept of being part of a community. I get that he wants some distance, and that’s okay…hopefully in time he can find a relationship with these terms that will be more comfortable for him. Let me know if you have any other questions, good luck, this is such a tough spot and difficult to navigate, I know he’ll appeciate your concern and caution.
October 16, 2013 at 2:22 pm
Some people are more comfortable dealing with falling under Asperger’s rather than autism. I was undiagnosed as a child. Back then, the only people who got the autism label were institutionalized children. I found Asperger’s syndrome back before it was in the DSM and was comfortable with it. As more was learned, I could accept that Asperger’s and Autism were related, but would not apply it to myself. It took some effort but I have finally become comfortable with labeling myself as autistic. I know of others who will only admit to being part of the BAP (Broad Autistic Phenotype), which means that they will admit to having autistic traits and limitations, but not the “disorder.”
My advice would be to ask him where he feels like he fits in the community. Encourage him to look for people and groups online that feel comfortable to him. Many local groups tend to be very focused on a specific subset of the spectrum which does tend to make others feel left out. (I’m the token autistic adult in my group.)
Above all, be gentle with his reluctance. Offer support and resources and then let him pick his own path.
Katie says:
October 23, 2013 at 4:02 pm
I’m having a rougher time than usual with something. How do you reconcile being happy for someone else’s accomplishments while sad about your child’s lack of those same accomplishments? It is easy to view each child as an individual when not forced to see them around other children (play dates) or read about other children (family email updates, friends’ facebook posts, etc). However, when reading about a 15 month old doing things your 30 month old child has just mastered, is still working on, or has yet to master, it is really hard. I am happy for them and know by now, with my 3rd child, that each child develops at his own pace, but it is overshadowed by my feelings of longing for those same accomplishments for my boy; it’s hard to separate the two. I know everyone faces challenges and try to remind myself of that when I feel this way, but it can be really hard. I feel guilty for the feelings of jealousy, because I AM happy for them and their children but it’s hard to view their accomplishments through the same lens as I view my child’s accomplishments.
Erin says:
November 1, 2013 at 7:05 pm
I’m not sure that you can, or that you even have to. I have struggled with this, and still do. For a while I almost had to practice being happy for those other parents – little things, “liking” a picture on facebook (you know, where they can’t see my face as I force myself to hit the button). It does get easier with practice… But more important than being happy for them, is being happy for you. Being happy for the perfect little gift you have been given and how very unique this journey is. It takes time. It takes practice. But sometimes, withdrawing just a little from everyone else and putting a little more focus on all the little gifts that your child is giving you will help to get you through it. My daughter (age 4) can’t run, can’t walk very far, and can’t speak. But she has this amazing way of just being, just sitting and absorbing the “small” moments, like the leaves dancing in the wind. And she makes other people stop and see it too. Just by being. I don’t know any “typical” 4 year olds who can do that. So that helps enormously. Because it’s harder to be jealous when you recognize that you already have so many blessings. So their kid can run, but they’re missing out on something else. So yay for them, but double yay for us. Hugs.
PK says:
October 25, 2013 at 3:19 pm
Anyone have experience w/Interoceptive sense/pooping & peeing? I came across this information and my mommy radar started pinging, since my son has some minor issues re getting to the bathroom on time/ not knowing the difference between passing gas (a big one) and pooping (a little one). He actually potty trained pretty well, but it seems like he’s often “last minute”, or can’t tell when it’s a little poop vs. a big “gas”. And he stays dry at night maybe 50-75% of the time during the week. He’s 6.5 years old.
It isn’t as “bad” as having “real” accidents, but he’s always bummed out when it happens. Anything we can do to make him more comfortable is great. I was hoping we could get off the miralax, but if it helps him manage his bowels, I’ll stick with it.
I also don’t want to blame him for something he can’t control, but I don’t want to “let it slide” if he’s just doing the kid thing of ignoring his body because he’s enjoying what he’s doing/watching/playing. How the heck do you tell the difference?
I have e-mailed his OT and other members of his team at school to see what we can do. It’s not a problem at school, and only a minor problem at home, but I want to get on it ASAP so we can manage it before it becomes a larger issue. I also left a message with his pediatrician to see how familiar they are with this.
Any idea who I can talk to re. getting help with this? Has anyone had experience with this? Any experience helping your kiddo better regulated in this area?
PK says:
October 28, 2013 at 10:00 am
I apologize for asking semi-regular questions, but the parenting village here is great, and I appreciate your help. Sorry this is long.
What has been your experience with our kids on the spectrum and games/competition/school related competition-prize things? Here are two examples, and I would love any feedback you might have on this:
1) e-mail from teacher (they have rally’s sometimes and he does ok with them as he’s a sensory seeker). Her message – “The teachers had a contest and only one could win. The winning teacher got 24 pieces of candy for her class. Well, I didn’t win and it made Daniel very upset. He wanted that candy so bad. It all turned out okay because he won candy for his royal ticket that he got from doing IXL math. However, it won’t always be that way. So, let me know what you think. ”
2) We went to a birthday party and it was the first one with actual party games. One was the piñata. He knew the rules were, you stand in line, swing the stick and break the piñata and the candy comes out. I took for granted that he understood that everyone does that, you don’t know who will break it, and if you don’t break it, it’s no big deal. For him, the goal of the game was HIS responsibility. HE had to hit it, and break it, and if HE didn’t he was doing something wrong – in his own words, he “wasn’t strong enough” and “didn’t do it right”. He got SOOOO upset by this. And since I didn’t see it coming, I couldn’t explain it before hand. He bounced back, but I honestly think the competition thing doesn’t quite make sense or isn’t comfortable.
3) Here’s another example – he likes to play “CHASE”, better than “TAG”. This cracks me up a bit because to US, it’s the SAME game. But to him, it’s the chase that’s fun. The whole being “it” thing doesn’t have the same appeal as the fun of running, catching the person, and taking turns running/catching.
We do play boardgames sometimes, but we all get home late from school-aftercare/work during the week so not as often as I should. What can I do to help him understand games? To help him not feel like a failure when he doesn’t win? Is it possible to find a healthy level of competitiveness, or a comfortable level of non-competitiveness for kids on the spectrum? Especially for boys, where it seems that it’s “expected” to be competitive. I’m not going to push him to be what he’s not, but I want to give him as many tools as I can.
Cheryl says:
October 28, 2013 at 11:41 am
Ok PK…. My son’s experience has followed a similar trajectory. Poor sportsmanship pretty much all around, clearly sees winners and losers, but not all the grays in between, makes everything (everything!!) a competition, sees it as personal failure if he or his team or his class doesn’t win said insignificant prize, title, bragging rights. Yes, it has gotten better with maturity. He’s still only 9.5, so he’s still not that mature, but it has become less frequent, less pronounced, and shorter lived when he has these whateveryouwannacallems. I have stressed that say, in his class of 22 kids, one kid gets the highest grade or runs the fastest. That leaves 21 other kids who didn’t win (or LOST as he must say) or were not the fastest or whatever superlative fits. Introducing the shades of gray is important, but so is letting time pass and seeing some of those rough absolute edges soften. It’s hard to wait, for both of you. It continues to improve with some mild backslides here and there. Fwiw, most kids can be crappy sports, some just hide it better than others. Patience darling, constant reminders that not everyone wins (most ppl dont!), and removal from situations as deemed necessary (not always at all) where the proverbial sh!t can hit the fan. Not every moment has to be teachable.
Erin says:
November 1, 2013 at 6:06 pm
Hi all- I am looking for some connections in Massachusetts. My friend is trying to get a diagnosis for her son and apparently can’t even get an appointment until May. I live in PA, so I’m not too familiar with the system up there. In addition, her son has services through the school district with an IEP, but they are not following through, so I was hoping someone could recommend a good (preferably cheap) advocate to help her out in that area as well. So a good diagnostician (we can use psychologists here, I’m gathering that is not the case up there) and a good advocate preferably in Southeastern Ma. I would be very grateful for any leads. Thanks!!
You can email me if you don’t want to post names and numbers. (Just don’t laugh at the address, my hubby made it up. ;). )
Katie says:
November 4, 2013 at 8:50 am
Check out BehaviorBabe on Twitter and/or Facebook. She is an old friend of mine, a licensed BCBA, and is familiar with Massachusetts. She may be able to point you in the right direction. I hope this helps!
Erin says:
November 4, 2013 at 8:56 am
Thanks! I will go look her up right now.
Jaya says:
February 26, 2014 at 3:54 pm
Erin says:
February 26, 2014 at 7:08 pm
Thanks!
PK says:
November 4, 2013 at 11:36 am
Hi all! We live in Fort Worth, where 3/4 of the year it’s sunny and clear. Then fall hits and the weather changes dramatically – low pressure systems come in somewhat regularly. I’ve noticed that my 6.5 year old son’s concentration takes a dive, he’s cranky, antsy, etc., usually the day before the system arrives. I’ve noticed it before, but since the summer weather is here for SO long, I almost forgot about it.
Has anyone else run into this? Is there any way to manage it? I have a “hug t-shirt” that I had him wear today, and a kid strength asprin in case he has minor physical discomforts that he can’t pin down and describe to me.
November 4, 2013 at 12:05 pm
yup. changing barometric pressure wreaks havoc on our kids. in our experience, weighted blankets can help (weighted lap pads for school) as can extra excercise time to get the jigglies out. incidentally, time / seasonal changes are hard too – changing light, changing routines, more time inside etc … i’d love to hear other suggestions, particularly from those wo experience this themselves.
November 4, 2013 at 4:43 pm
He also may have allergies. Mold and pollen counts go through the roof at this time of year, which can leave you itchy, your head clouded, more difficult to breath, and other more common allergy problems. This was my nemesis as a kid back before they diagnosis 30 years ago.
PS (I’m in Abilene and my allergies went crazy a couple of weeks ago.)
November 5, 2013 at 4:19 pm
My almost 7 year old autistic son is going through what I think is regression with separation anxiety. I’m not sure as we’ve not been in this arena before, but what my gut is telling me. It’s breaking my heart to see what he’s going through. Any resources or insight you could share would be greatly appreciated. Thank you so much!
Lisa says:
November 5, 2013 at 7:17 pm
Can you give more specific examples of what circumstances are upsetting him? Going to school? And what is the behavior that seems like regression? And can you describe him a little?
Both of my girls, both on the spectrum, are highly verbal and initially were diagnosed as Aspergers. They are very intelligent, but are emotionally and socially challenged. They both have severe anxiety. They also had a hard time with separation at that age. Interestingly, they both said the same things. They not only missed me, they were worried about me. They each had a fear that something would happen to me while they were away. It was less about wanting to avoid school and more about worry. I actually have books about worry to use with young children, and I did a lot of reassuring that it was MY job to worry about them! That was a hard phase, but it did get better.
November 6, 2013 at 6:16 pm
Starting first grade 10 weeks ago put his world off-kilter. Anxiety sky rocketed, seen by lots more stimming, scripting, obsessing on things. Last week due to a gross oversight by the school he was left out of a behavior celebration that he’d been looking forward to for over a month & knew he’d earned enough tickets to participate. Him missing the celebration was the catalyst into regression, I believe. And the downward spiral of heavy sensory seeking, physical aggression instead of using words, sleep disturbances, picking at himself physically, hyper sensitive & just emotionally raw. He’s going to school for 2 hours a day & it’s taking everything he’s got to keep it together while there, then coming completely unglued the rest of the day. His diagnosis is autism, very high in some areas & significantly delayed with social/emotional.
November 5, 2013 at 10:54 pm
My daughter went into anxiety disorder at that age and refused to go to her class and had meltdowns every day in the office instead for over a month. Thinking back to my own childhood, that was the age that I gave up on people and relationships and became a loner. Lots of things happen as far as forming peer groups at that age rather than just one on one friendships that can make the entire social environment incomprehensible. My advice is that they may be old enough for starting to help with rule and consequence formation at that age. You will most likely be surprised at how hard on themselves they are if they are allowed to suggest rules, but if they have a hand in their formation, it just might give some stability to a world that has stopped making sense.
November 6, 2013 at 6:22 pm
My son is extremely rule oriented and definitely holds himself to a very high standard. The anxiety has been an ongoing challenge, but the separation part is new & related to the regression. We have not faced a regression until now, so are struggling to know how best to help him.
November 7, 2013 at 3:21 pm
Regression is a term thrown around that is misleading. The implication it that suddenly their condition is getting worse and they have lost the gains that they have made. With people on the spectrum, what looks like regression is often their attempt to deal with a new challenge. Because we think in different ways than the general population, we often have to use work arounds to do things that others do instinctively. These work arounds take time and effort. Because of this, when facing a new challenge that takes most or all of our concentration, we no longer have the available resources to keep up the work around as well. This appears as if we have “lost” skills or social abilities, when in fact we have put them on the back burner until we have the free resources to use them once again.
November 7, 2013 at 3:45 pm
I didn’t like referring to it as regression, but didn’t have the verbage. This challenge has been traumatic. The way you describe it fits, a work around. Can you recommend any resources that will help us (parents) support him through this? Thanks!
November 7, 2013 at 4:03 pm
Try talking to him about what is hard at school. Allow him to write or draw about it if he does not have the words or the memories are overwhelm him.
The really hard part at that age is that he may not have the self-awareness or vocabulary to explain what is going on with him. In any case, a really helpful thing for people on the spectrum that are being overwhelmed is the concept of a safe place. A safe place is a place that he can retreat to. For many on the spectrum this is a space without bright lights, loud sounds or people. This allows time to regroup and sort things out when they are overwhelmed. Having such a place to retreat to both at home and at school as well as a set of signals (both verbal and non-verbal) that the adults around him recognize that allow him to go to this place when he needs to.
Hope this is helpful.
November 19, 2013 at 9:13 am
John – thank you for the support. We decided to take son out of school. Homeschool seems like it will be a better fit for him at this time. He’s been home for a week and just starting to relax a bit.
November 6, 2013 at 9:43 am
Hello everyone! This is my first time posting to this community page, so here goes My 9 yr old son is on the spectrum and is mainstreamed. This year marked moving from elem. school to intermediate school. So, new school, new teachers, etc. And he does NOT handle change well. He has developed a giggling/laughing habit that is growing out of control. So bad that he couldn’t control it while taking a test and he received a “D” grade. The teacher and the autism teacher are asking me for suggestions for keeping it under control. Now, as a side note, I have had difficulty communicating with them this year and I do not feel that he is being supported the way he should. His IEP states that gets adult supervision thru out the day as needed, but he only has an aide with him in the morning (prior years he had an aide all day). I was told that they “are working on it” as far as providing an aide all day. In the meantime, I was wondering if any other parent(s) had a similar issue and how did you deal with it? I am now going to try to implement a reward system – not laughing out of turn in class for the entire day = 10 min. of time on the Wii after dinner. I’m at my wits end and completely frustrated at the lack of support the school is showing me and my son. IMO, I think he’s doing it as a stress reliever. I am also considering having an observer come into his class and observe him for the day. The teachers claim there is no pattern and they do not notice any triggers for the laughing. Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thank you!
November 6, 2013 at 10:35 am
Laughing can simply be a reaction to stress and not under conscious control. I often laugh when I am suddenly injured, which tends to confuse people. I also tend to laugh at odd times because I see something that reminds me of something that reminds me of something funny I saw. If I try to explain the chain of connections, I lose people quickly. If he says that he cannot stop laughing, there is a technique called paradoxical intention that can stop “the giggles.” What you do is try to laugh intentionally, and the unintentional laughter will stop.
November 6, 2013 at 10:43 am
thanks, John! I will look into that! At times all it takes is for his sister to say something and it will throw him into a fit of giggles and laughter. I struggle with telling him to not laugh – I don’t want to take the joy out of life
November 12, 2013 at 9:34 pm
I have a question pertaining to discipline of an autistic child. She is high functioning but has begun spitting on her floor. She does this when she is mad, especially at her mom. Her mother has tried everything the doctors have recommended but nothing works. She is also stealing, whatever she wants she takes…cellphones, shoes, many things are taken from other students. She is in middle school and has no friends because she is mean and steals. Her mother does not believe in corporal punishment. Any suggestions?
Margaret says:
November 17, 2013 at 9:08 am
Wow. I’m thinking you are a staff member? A family friend?
Jess constantly reminds us that “behavior is communication.” Has anyone done a behavioral assessment to try to determine the triggers/ rewards for her behavior? It sounds like you are looking at this solely as a discipline problem, rather than a symptom of something else. Any child who “has no friends because she is mean and steals” is not a happy child. My heart breaks for her and for her mother.
I’m not surprised that the mother does not believe in corporal punishment. Even if you believe in corporal punishment, I personally have never met a person on the autism spectrum who responded well to corporal punishment.
I hope someone can get to the root of this and help this young lady.
November 13, 2013 at 6:29 pm
Hello, I had a questions about IEPs. I have a three year old son who goes to preschool. The school district is currently in the process of evaluating him so he can get more classroom support (he tends to get distracted and not follow the group/needs reminders to do things, etc).
However, I am finding the IEP ridiculous. Here is a kid with tons of great skills and abilities (numbers, visual, spatial, memory, verbal)- and they want to make one of his IEP goals sitting still on the circle. They want to put a weighted blanket on him and give him a fidget. He is totally engaged during circle time, he just can’t sit perfectly still, and sometimes he jumps up and down at the end of a good song with excitement.
They also want to give him OT because they think he seems ‘clunky’ at times. Um….is that a thing?
I feel like his IEP is being designed to be easier on teachers. Who cares if he moves around on the circle? He protects his personal space so it isn’t like he bumps into people or touches them.
I’m already annoyed and this is his FIRST school IEP.
Anyone have any suggestions on how to deal with the school district? Isn’t there a more progressive approach to this? (He goes to private preschool that I chose because the class size is less than 10 kids and 3 teachers).
Thanks!
Margaret says:
November 17, 2013 at 8:49 am
As a mom of older kids, I understand your confusion with your first IEP. I had my first IEP 13 years ago, and they still are the worst parts of my year. A few things come to mind:
First, in order for your son to receive services/ classroom support, he needs to have goals. If he is advanced for his age educationally (which is sounds like he is), then the goals will have to be in the areas of communication, classroom behavior, fine/gross motor, etc.
If you are going to be in school, being able to stay in your seat is, for good or for bad, a worthwhile skill to learn. Weighted lap pads and fidgets are awesome accommodations which address some of the sensory needs that cause kids to need to move. These types of strategies can be very calming and some kids love them. The point is to treat his need to move as developmental/ natural and not disciplinary. As long as they don’t think that he is misbehaving when he moves around, I don’t see where trying some things to help him sit for longer periods of time would hurt.
Second, OT can be a very, very valuable service. Many of our kids have gross and fine motor delays or challenges. Getting OT early can help alleviate some of those challenges. The fact that they say he is “clunky” at times may mean that he doesn’t move through the classroom space or interact with pencils, scissors, etc. at the level of the other children. The school system is offering you a valuable and expensive therapy, which some people have to fight to get.
Third, IEPs are hard. In order to get services, we have to focus on disabilities and weaknesses. School systems can’t justify the money and staff on services if the child doesn’t have weaknesses. But the laundry list of what’s “wrong” can be hard to hear, especially when you know what a fantastic kid he is, and how many strengths he has. Make sure that the present level of performance states your child’s strengths as well. And you can start teacher conferences by asking about strengths first. I often start IEP meetings talking about how great my child is, and all the miracles she has accomplished. Then it is my job to point out all the places where she still needs help. This is especially true now that she is older and is an honor roll student.
The IEP goals are going to be based on challenges, not strengths. As long as the actual staff and administration of the school see the strengths, your son will do well.
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This is an example of an article written by Jim Feldman for a publication or newsletter. Jim is an author, keynote speaker and consultant who writes and speaks about Change Management, Customer Service and Innovative Problem Solving. Contact us about using Jim as an author, interview or speaker at 312-527-9111.
As we reach the end of the summer, most of us realize that we didn’t relax as much as we had planned. We did not enjoy the soft summer breeze, smell the flowers, or even walk along the beach or pathway to make new discoveries. We have less time to enjoy our life because we are living to work instead of working to live.
My newsletters give me a time to reflect on my life. At least twice a month, I look around and ask, What If? This has provided me with insights and direction that I had as a child. Kids have learned to handle change. They take it in stride. They enjoy it. They bend. They love variety. We need to act like children again and create a culture that knows how to learn.
I now think “inside the box” because that is where the “present” is found. I wander into stores I never visited; I sit on park benches and watch pigeons fighting over morsels of food. I look around and observe life and try to find how I can benefit from what I observe.
And most importantly, I watch how others interact. I see the massive mistakes that any child would avoid, but adults not only create but also embellish when challenged. We don’t have time to do it right, but always find time to do it over. We create budgets and processes and find excuses for why we don’t adhere to our own creations. Better Change.
Remember, culture can be very controlling. However, no matter how strong, culture cannot change without permission from the people. . .you shape it by how you behave. Every single thing you do serves as one more building block that makes up the personality – the culture – of your organization.
Problems occur when the world changes but the culture can’t, because the people in the organization won’t give it a chance. Successful people embrace change. Change relies on you to give it a new set of responses that holds more promises for the future. Better Change.
Every company has a brand image. It is the message that we receive when we purchase and use products and services. It is how we respond to the changing world and tell others of our experiences. What about your brand? Remember it is YOUR brand. It is how others think of you as well as your company. Don’t assume that the two are separate. They are unavoidably linked. Is it time to change your tune? Is it time to Strike Up Your Brand? Better Change.
Perhaps the world is changing?
After a grueling business trip from Chicago to New Orleans, New Orleans to Phoenix, Phoenix to Los Angeles, a drive to Pomona, and a red eye flight from Los Angeles to Chicago, I have some good news. . .the travel experience was refreshingly pleasant.
I used frequent miles to fly from Chicago to New Orleans on US Air. With all of my criticism of the big airlines, they are wonderful compared to US Air. Without going into the details, US Air’s level of service is so far below American Airlines I will stop complaining about AA, because at least they try. US Air simply was misinformed and at every contact provided an attitude of “it is not my problem,” no matter the question.
Upon comparison I must commend AA for their efforts. While I don’t agree with everything they do or the policies they have created, they do represent a Better Change.
On this trip I stayed in four hotels, flew on three airlines, and found six of the seven travel experiences conveying Better Change. Employees expressed concern and offered real time solutions.
The most amazing situation occurred when I discovered that my luggage was sent to Chicago when I was awaiting its arrival in LA. I spoke to the Red Carpet Club Concierge and she tracked down my bag. Her research confirmed that my luggage had been sent to Chicago instead of being off loaded for my stop in LA. She took time, called to confirm, and then printed out the response so I had a record of her discovery. Clearly she did everything she could to help locate my luggage.
(The bag, I found out, had been at Chicago’s O’Hare airport, unattended on the baggage area floor for over 12 hours. All of us who travel hear the plea from the loudspeaker, DO NOT LEAVE YOUR BAG UNATTENDED. . .IT WILL BE CONFISCATED. What happened to our TSA security? What about the local police?)
While I was relieved that the bag was found, it was severely damaged. It was held closed only by the Velcro straps that offered secondary closure. The frame was bent, the locks broken, one wheel torn from its riveted housing and the contents totally in disarray.
I took the crippled bag to the United Baggage Service Center. It was 12:15 a.m. and I fully expected to find no one there. To my surprise, two women greeted me and listened to my plight. They both pointed to the plaque on the wall that said, Loss of wheels was normal wear and tear. It went on to list all of the other reasons that United was not liable.
Here’s the amazing part. . .after I explained that I didn’t agree, without further discussion the two ladies from UNITED became Friendly. . .not in the Skies, but on the Ground. They asked me to wait and went through a secured door. Within a few minutes they emerged with a brand new bag. They offered me a choice of having my damaged bag repaired or take the new, unused, quality replacement.
How easy was that choice? How empowered were they to make a bad situation better? They took a frustrated, tired passenger and renewed my belief that customers like it best when you are an innovative provider of solutions. What did you do today to make your customers happy? Were you a solution instead of another problem?
In the past, change required a slower response time. Today, in a world of high velocity, change requires radical SHIFTS in behavior. Responses must be in real time. Specifically, we must think differently. We must reorder our priorities. We must face reality and do what works best. Better Change.
Two early morning agents were empowered to solve a problem and create a satisfied customer. The extra effort was appreciated and helped me to regain my belief that shifts do happen and all shifts are not bad. Let’s celebrate and Strike Up The Brand. . .friendly agents do exist.
As you head off for a long Labor Day weekend, take a few moments to plan how you will change your business relationship with your customers, employees and suppliers. Here are a few ideas that will help you Strike Up Your Brand.
Leaders must focus from tasks to processes. The old way of looking was narrow, looking at a department or function. Today we must view the process outcomes. We must know that a market exists for our product or service innovation.
Manage the shifts in your organization. Build an intelligent perspective or process that can be utilized and understood. Explain how jobs will change. Discuss the outcomes of change. Reward for achievement.
Without a creative direction, few organizations will survive in a changing environment. As managers, we must provide what the customer wants, not what the factory makes. We must serve the customer. Internal customers (employees and suppliers) are as important as the external one. Create processes that integrate the two.
The organization is only as effective as the processes. Poor direction causes poor performance. If you match a valuable performer with a poor policy, the policy will win. Make each person accountable for customer satisfaction. Make sure that everyone is committed. Better Change: Shift Commitment.
Successful entrepreneurial organizations DATE their customers. They DAZZLE them. They ANTICIPATE their needs. They TREAT their employees and suppliers as well as they treat their customers. They EDUCATE customers, employees and suppliers. Why? Because everyone needs their wisdom.
Customer service is not a department, it is an ATTITUDE. The actual needs of your customers, not just the needs you imagine they have, must influence everything your organization does. Focus everyone on exceeding customer expectations. Customers run the business. Stay connected to your customer.
We must create a safety zone for failure. A shift in learning usually means we learn through trial and error, which means being able to accept the fact that everything won’t work. A failure can often open the door to another idea that will be successful. We must allow for failure without penalty. If the penalty for failure is too high, no one will try anything new.
Ask associates how they would apply their skills if they were the owner, not the worker. People want to be measured. It is a basic human need. We want to be told how we are doing, to be reassured, especially during times of shift in any organization. Poor performers don’t like measurements. Perhaps that requires a shift in the people resources.
Bill Gates, in Business @The Speed of Thought, says, “A lousy process will consume ten times as many hours as the work itself requires. A good process will eliminate wasted time.”
Realize that some entrepreneurial concepts may not be accepted or appreciated all the time. Timing is everything. Be willing to shift your timetable. “Know when to hold them, know when to fold them, know when to walk away, and know when to run,” says Kenny Rogers’ The Gambler. Get rid of all those cards that prevent you from winning. We can see “losing hands” in the cards we hold. Replace them.
Shift Happens: Change keeps picking up speed. Before we can adjust to one change several others take place. We are all living in a constant period of transition, and the shelf life of your solutions keeps getting shorter. New problems require new solutions. If you fail to SHIFT with the SHIFTING conditions, you’ll be off the mark.
The best way to improve your business relationships is to partner in the expansion of people’s minds. Create education strategies and use the most powerful technologies available.
Can the opportunities to grow your business be any more exciting than this? Is it possible that the skies will become more friendly and airlines will truly understand why we fly? If there is a time for change. . .it is now.
Nissan has Shifted Gears. Toyota thinks its just “Good Business”. . .and Nike tells us to “Just do it.” Now it’s your turn to Strike Up The Brand of your own company. Better Change.
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The Innovative Practitioner who speaks with creative insights, practical experience, and big picture thinking.
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This issue’s seasonal reflection is about Black History Month. Emmet Murphy, OFM, a student of the civil rights movement, recently visited the International Civil Rights Center and Museum in Greensboro, N.C., and was inspired to compile his thoughts.
Many of us have lived through significant events in the history of civil rights — the assassination of Martin Luther King Jr., Vatican II and the civil rights movement.
I was always interested in the civil rights movement — for all people — not just our African-American brothers and sisters.
The renewal of the Order in the wake of the Second Vatican Council helped restore non-ordained Franciscan brothers to their rightful place in the Order of Lesser Brothers. When I entered the Order in the 1950s, I was uncomfortable with separate dining rooms for ordained and non-ordained friars, and brothers made to feel like second-class citizens. Thankfully, the Chapters of Renewal in the late 1960s ended the caste system within the Order.
At the time, I could identify with our black sisters and brothers who fought for their civil rights and were finally given their God-given and rightful place in society.
On Feb. 1 of this year, I visited the International Civil Rights Center and Museum, which is built on the location of what is considered the beginning of the civil rights movement. On that day in 1950, four African-American college students boldly sat at a whites-only counter in Woolworth’s and ordered coffee.
Truly, the God of surprises confounds the powerful and mighty and raises up the poor and the weak: an aging, portly pontiff who listened to the whisperings of the Holy Spirit and four terrified black college students who took a stand by taking a seat. We, too, can make a difference in society by working, ministering and praying to stand up to injustice.
Woolworth’s closed the store in January 1993 and sold the building to a local bank, which planned to demolish the building and use the empty lot for parking. A group of black businessmen persuaded the bank to sell the building to them so they could create a museum.
Today, you can tour the museum, witnessing civil rights history through the many photos and exhibits that sadly detail man’s inhumanity to man.
— Fr. Emmet Murphy, a native of Cambridge, Mass., lives at St. Francis of Assisi Friary in Raleigh, N.C., roughly 90 miles from Greensboro.
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Congratulations! You're going to rock this mom thing! Your body is creating another human being and that is mind blowing.
As a mother of three, I understand all the pains that come along with pregnancy! Nausea, back pain, trouble sleeping... hang in there!
Prenatal Massage Sessions are designed specifically to address the changes your body goes through during pregnancy. Each session is tailored to focus on the areas you need addressed. Side-lying positioning and the use of maternity pillows ensure comfort and relaxation. Prepare to go home feeling better!
$150
Completely customized massages designed by you & your therapist.
Relax into a full 60 to 90 minutes of
hands-on time.
You are never charged extra for advanced techniques like deep tissue or trigger point therapy.
Leave with helpful tips for at-home like stretches and exercises to keep up with your self-care until your next session.
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The Capri 22 is the largest sailboat that we offer for rental. It can comfortably seat up to 8 people in the cockpit, so you can bring the whole family or group of friends! Kick your feet up and enjoy the quiet and calm experience that a day of sailing on Mission Bay is famous for. There are few things to do in San Diego that are more relaxing than a sail on Mission Bay, and the Capri 22 is the perfect boat to take out on a summer afternoon. It is stable and easy to sail, making for a great day on the water for skippers of all experience levels. Enjoy a day on the water that you’ll never forget, and reserve your Capri 22 today!
Have a larger group that wants to get out on the water for a sail together? You might consider a charter on our luxury sailing yacht Malarky. Charters can be catered to your group, to offer anything from sunset cruises to whale watching to snorkeling to a relaxing sail with apps and drinks. And with a capacity of 12 people, it’s the premiere sailing yacht charter in San Diego for larger groups.
Your reservation start time will begin at the designated time that you chose. Please arrive 30 minutes early to complete Rental agreement and Safety and Boat checkouts. Due to high demand and time restraints please have your party here early and ready to begin your rental at the designated time.
Picture ID and credit card are required for all rentals.
Parking is always tight so please plan accordingly.
Do we need to make a reservation?
We recommend that everyone make a reservation for any activity to ensure that your rental is reserved. You can do that by clicking here
Do I need to know how to sail?
While we recommend you have a little bit of sailing experience, we do not require any kind of certification or experience.
How many people does it fit?
Depending on the size of the sailboat, they range from 4 to 8 people max.
Can we drink alcohol on the sailboat?
Yes, you can!
What if we get stuck?
Please give our office a call and we would be happy to assist you. If it is an emergency please call 911.
Is there a training that needs to take place?
If you have never sailed before, that’s okay! We have an instructional video that will make you confident in your ability so quickly learn how to sail.
What size sailboats do you have?
We have 3 different size monohulled sailboats ranging from 14’ to 22’. We also have 2 different size catamarans from 13’ to 18’
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Great team culture? Increased profit margin? Global expansion? A compelling vision? Are any of these the missing ingredient for significant leadership?
Reports don't look good for leaders worldwide. CNN released an article about CEOs who stepped down in 2019. CEO of Best Buy, Corie Barry (Best Buy CEO), was asked to step down due to an investigation into her conduct.
While having a great team culture, increased profit margin, or casting a compelling vision are each essential to leadership, there’s one necessary ingredient for significant leadership that must be a prerequisite.
Integrity.
The origin of integrity comes from the French word ‘integrite’, which means innocence and purity. Integrity also comes from the Latin that means wholeness or completeness. Only one Leader has been completely whole and pure (Follow the link here), but integrity is the necessary ingredient for significant leadership for three reasons.
Integrity is the timeless, necessary ingredient for leadership. We all have heard the nickname “Honest Abe” regarding our sixteenth President Abraham Lincoln. Why did he receive that nickname? One story has it that when “he was a young store clerk, whenever he shortchanged a customer - even by a few pennies, he would close up the store and walk to find the customer to return the change”. Would you go to such great lengths to protect your integrity? Your staff will appreciate your willingness to place their interests over your gain.
Integrity is what people need most in a leader. Sure, you may be able to deliver a compelling vision statement that transforms a company’s trajectory - but if you are stealing profits as your company increases revenue, your dishonesty will eventually be made known to the public and your staff. Your integrity may never make a viral YouTube video or receive thousands of social media shares, but integrity is what is needed most in leadership circles today.
Integrity is what will sustain your leadership tomorrow. Integrity and competence work together. Take time to develop your leadership skills, build a fantastic team around you, and even create an excellent team culture where your staff relishes their work experience. If you want to continue leading, develop your integrity by putting the needs of your staff and company above your own.
Do you know of a leader who had extraordinary integrity? Share about it below and share what lessons you learned from them.
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Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regard one another as more important than yourselves. -- Philippians 2:3
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Ezinne Nwankwo is a PhD student in the Department of Community Health Sciences in the Fielding School of Public Health at the University of California, Los Angeles. She is a part of the Health Policy Research Scholars Cohort 2018.
Before we begin, tell us a little bit about yourself and what your research interests are?
I was born and raised in Lagos, Nigeria, and lived there until my family moved to San Francisco, California in 1999. My upbringing in these two places shaped my beliefs about equity and social justice. I learned early on that structural forces influence people’s ability to access necessities—like food and shelter—and that though countries are economically and culturally different, the inequities that their citizens face are born of the same disregard for human dignity. My research interests center on the social determinants of migration and immigrant health, which includes access to social welfare and health programs to restrictive immigration policies that keep families apart.
Growing up, I often thought about what it meant to be influenced by two countries despite being primarily in one. I did not know that sociologists had already been writing about transnational ties—the connections immigrants maintain to their homelands. In some ways, this view relaxes the assumptions of assimilation and acculturation to include the possibility of a rich and full existence in two places. But this transnational orientation can have positive and negative consequences on immigrants, and I’m curious to learn the implications for health and well-being.
Tell us about a project you are currently working on that you are excited about?
I am very excited to spend some time this summer on a project that focuses on Caribbean migrants. I will explore existing immigrant health theories and test whether these frameworks hold for this immigrant population. Specifically, I will examine why these immigrants return to their country of origin and compare their physical and mental health with people who have never left the Caribbean. I am even more excited to focus my research on African and Black immigrants, a group that receives limited attention in immigrant health research.
For people unfamiliar with your research area, what is one piece of information you think is important for them to know?
I think it is essential for everyone to know that when we talk about immigrants, we are talking about people. How they arrived in the country should not take away from this basic fact. Still, in the current anti-immigrant climate, it bears mentioning.
Who is a researcher you admire and why?
It is difficult to name just one. I admire researchers for different reasons. Some I admire just for the depth of their inquiry and research, and others I admire because they tell the truth. I appreciate researchers that use the research methods that are prevalent in their field and at the same time recognize that these methods cannot fully account for the nuances of everyday life.
How has being an HPRS Scholar helped you during your time as a doctoral candidate?
The HPRS program has been a tremendous resource in my academic and professional development. Even with my public health background, I never envisioned that policy would take center stage in my work. The program has broadened my vision for what a career that bridges research, policy, and community advocacy might look like.
It has also been incredibly inspiring to meet other HPRS Scholars and people from RWJF’s leadership development programs. We all come together under the Culture of Health framework because we understand that complex social factors shape health. Although we may use different terms for similar things, we have the same overarching goal. This grounding pushes me to think holistically about my research and allows me to remain open to suggestions and alternative solutions to the issues that I encounter in my work.
Last but not least, my HPRS coach, Dr. Adeola Sonaike, has been an amazing resource, especially in keeping me accountable to my goals. I’m looking forward to maintaining our relationship even after I graduate.
In the RWJF HPRS program we have worked with you to help you think further about using your research to develop policy. If you could use your research to change any policy, what policy would it be?
Immigration policy in the U.S. is frequently described as a pendulum. It swings back and forth as the federal administration changes. These shifts mean that many immigrants live their lives surrounded by uncertainty. Their U.S. citizen family members are also deeply affected by this ambiguity, and the stress they face contributes to poor health outcomes. The U.S. needs comprehensive immigration reform. The current zero tolerance approach to immigration that has led to—the travel ban, mass deportation, and children being separated from their families—is not the way forward.
Ok, here’s a fun question to wrap things up. If you were stranded on a desert island, what three items would you want to have with you?
I would bring a solar-powered phone charger and a phone that’s loaded with audiobooks, podcasts, magazines, news articles, and the Wikipedia pages of African historical figures and events. I would also include a how-to collection on any topic. I’m open. Possibly something I can do on the desert: “How to survive while stranded on a desert island” seems appropriate. If there’s a food item that can last for a long time, I would also add that. If I can include my parents and siblings, I would bring them too. I think we have enough stories between the six of us to pass the time.
Thank you so much for your time!
The Program at a Glance
Who is Health Policy Research Scholars for?
Doctoral students from a variety of disciplines—such as urban planning, political science, economics, anthropology, education, social work, geography, and sociology—who are committed to using policy change to advance population health and health equity.
Applicants must be:
Full-time doctoral students who are starting the second year of their programs in fall 2023 and do not expect to graduate before spring/summer 2026.
Pursuing a research-focused discipline that can advance a Culture of Health.
Interested in health policy and interdisciplinary approaches.
What do scholars receive?
Annual award funding of up to $30,000 for up to four years or until they complete their doctoral program (whichever is sooner).
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Our take on benefits automation, wellness, compliance, cost containment, employee communications & engagement, company news and more.
Our take on benefits automation, wellness, compliance, cost containment, employee communications & engagement, company news and more.
by Jeff Griffin on Dec 14, 2018
Earlier this week, the IRS announced a reprieve to nonprofit organizations with regards to taxing fringe benefits. This comes as good news to those nonprofits concerned about the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017, which President Trump signed into law in December of last year.
Due to overwhelming pressure placed on top Republican leaders from nonprofit organizations, as well as opposition from the Senate, requests were made to the Treasury Department to delay the implementation of the tax until 2019.
While the reprieve is specific to the 2018 tax year; it will remain in place until such time as when Congress changes the law.
The reprieve offers a financial break to nonprofit organizations specific to calculating the cost of their qualified transportation and commuting benefits. This financial break also extends to penalties that would otherwise be assessed in the event of under-calculating these expenses.
What the Law Includes
The new law includes a provision that imposes a 21 percent tax rate on certain fringe benefits for employees of nonprofit organizations, effective January 1, 2018. These benefits, under Internal Revenue Code sections 132(f) include:
Qualified transportation and commuting
Transit passes
Transportation in a commuter highway transportation vehicle between the employee’s home and workplace paid by the employer
Qualified parking
Onsite athletic facility
According to estimates from the nonpartisan congressional Joint Committee on Taxation, the new law, specific to disallowing transportation deductions, will save some $17.7 billion over a ten-year period, though these figures include both nonprofits and for-profit organizations. Of course these figures will now have to be adjusted given this reprieve.
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“One of the most powerful novels I've yet read on the Vietnam War. As a veteran of that awful conflict, I was absolutely riveted by the tale of Augie and his buddies and every word rang true.”
West Virginia native and Vietnam War veteran John H. Brown delivers a moving novel in "Augie's War."
West Virginia native and Vietnam War veteran John H. Brown delivers a moving novel in "Augie's War." Protagonist Augustino Lee Cumpton is drafted into the U.S. Army and sent to Vietnam. Augie's memory of fun-lled family days back in West Virginia helps him cope with the tribulations of war and unscrupulous military personnel.
Brown's storytelling will engage you from beginning to end with amusing, gritty and candid dialogue. Various chapters transition from Vietnam to Augie's hometown without skipping a beat. Augie's memories of humorous and heartfelt family moments keeps the war at bay, at least temporarily: Aunt Lia, the "meatball queen," loves bawdy jokes; Uncles Giorgio and Dante, co-owners of the Chestnut Bakery, regale patrons and family with madcap stories..“They could always lift my spirits...,” says Augie.
With a cadre of convivial characters, you'll see why Augie's thoughts drift toward his family. This book also attests to thee spirit of brothers-in-arms and the ravages of war.
Brown's vivid writing allows you to witness gripping scenes detailing the carnage from explosions with images you won't forget. Although this novel is about the Vietnam War, it also conveys the message of how family, friends, and those who have your back can sustain a person through desperate times.
The National Italian American Foundation
Book review: 'Augie's War' a grim but awfully funny war novel
Like Joseph Heller in “Catch 22,” the classic novel about the deadly World War 11 air war, John Brown has given readers a novel that makes clear the insanity of war in all its grim and gritty horror. The casualty count in “Augie’s War” is high. Yet, at the same time, Brown’s novel, like Heller’s, includes a lineup of zany characters and a sequence of outlandish happenings sure to have readers chuckling, if not laughing out loud.
Read the full review at https://bit.ly/2KFCSm7
WV Book Team
John H Brown, author of Augie's War , talks bout Vietnam War and more!
W.Va. native pens novel telling story of growing up in Italian family, Vietnam war
Decades after coming home from Vietnam, a West Virginia native and WVU graduate used his experiences from childhood and service overseas to write a novel.
“I never expected this to be published,”said author John Brown. “It was a bucket list item. I was doing it for myself and family.”
“Augie’s War” follows Augie Cumpton from the fictional Jewel Town. Brown said the name is inspired by a song from the ‘40s or ‘50s which described Clarksburg as the Jewel of the Hills. Clarksburg’s Northview neighborhood, where the 73-year-old grew up, became Riverview.
Harrison native John Brown's novel 'a labor of love'
CHARLESTON — If the fictional city of Jeweltown and its suburbs bear more than a slight resemblance to the Clarksburg area in writer and columnist John Brown’s novel “Augie’s War,” there’s a reason for that.
And if the main character — Harrison County native Augie Compton — reminds anyone of Brown, well, there’s a reason for that, too.
“I thought I could write this book about Vietnam,” said Brown, who, like Augie, grew up in an Italian-American family in Harrison County. “But I know one of the ways I got through things over there was to think about home. I remember growing up working at my grandfather’s bakery.”
Read the full review at https://bit.ly/2KFCSm7
WVNews
Augie's War is a relatable read!
I throughly enjoyed this book. While fortunate not to be drafted into the War, I've wondered what life would have been like there. Mr. Brown answers this question for me. He provides serious yet humorous insight into Augie's day to day life making me grateful I didn't have to go. Jeweltown is much like my hometown. By the end of the book, I felt I knew Augies family and felt the relief that he felt from the danger, boredom, and drudgery of the War. A very interesting style of writing that pulls the reader into what must have been the only way to stay sane! Highly recommend the read!
A good yarn
Augie's War is comparable to A Rumor of War in the quality of the writing. Mr. Brown portrays military service mostly off the front lines that mixes boredom and terror. His description of life in a small north-central West Virginia town is spot on. A good yarn.
Review: Augie's War
Riveting book that switches back and forth between Augie's experience as a young soldier in Vietnam and his childhood upbringing in a small Italian immigrant community in WV. Brown has a remarkable ability to conjure vivid imagery of the devastatingly harsh and punishing time he spent in Vietnam while still injecting humor and levity into these passages. In contrast, the stories of a childhood spent enveloped in a large and warm Italian family, while equally vivid, are first and foremost hilarious. The cast of characters Augie reflects on are delightful oddballs and warm, colorful family members that provide reprieve from his present situation, one that is riddled with ethical dilemmas, incompetent leadership, and unbearable living conditions.
Augie's War" is another "Catch 22"!
John Brown's "Augie's War" is hilarious, poignant and always interesting. Brown's account of a young West Virginian's tour of Vietnam paints scenes that are real and riveting as he interchanges Augie's Vietnam experience with his halcyon boyhood. If you have read "Catch 22" and loved it, you will embrace this book. Augie's raucous Qui Dong, South Vietnam, his exotic R&R, and his encounters with martinets that rival those of Captain John Yossarian in Joseph Heller's masterpiece will make you smile.
Then, it will warm your heart as Brown superbly mixes Augie's wartime experience with remembrances of his large Italian family and their delightful attitude toward life, food and laughter. Augie retreats to those memories when the harsh realities of military life seem too hard to endure. The author's detail of military operations is impressive. His prose in describing the beauty of nature stateside, and that of those areas of Vietnam untouched by conflict, is stunning. It is somewhat hackneyed to say this would be a really great movie, but I think readers of "Augie's War" will agree—the Coen brothers will salivate if they get their hands on this one!!
I couldn't wait for Amazon to offer the book so I bought it directly from Black Rose Publishers. What a really cool read! I spent 5 straight years in Vietnam as one of those infamous civilian advsiors for MACV working on "pacification" which included duties in Operation Phoenix. So much of Mr. Brown's story rang true from the teeth gritting fear to some of the corruption within the ranks (especially those civilians who ran officers' clubs). But, it wasn't just about the reality of the war Brown brought out. The counterpoint about his life back home in an Italian immigrant community was really funny and at the same time touching. Well done, Mr. J.H. Brown. I'd like to meet you someday and reminisce.
First Time is the Charm!
A truly inspiring first novel from J.H.Brown. I agonized with Augie, wept for all the indignities, rejoiced in his upbringing and prayed for his safety. It brought the reality of the Vietnam War into close perspective with such descriptive writing and character development that I didn't want it to end. I hope Mr. Brown has some other novels in him....sign me up!
War is HELL! Home is HEAVEN!!
First of all compared to my draft and service (1968-1969) Augie had a far more difficult and dangerous tour (and I now realize how lucky I was)! John Brown writes with a fluid & passionate stream of pictures, thoughts, tastes, feelings, happenings and smells that kept me turning the pages. Just as amazing and difficult as the Vietnam Nam stories are, the Clarksburg family and tales of growing up are just as wonderful in their humor and caring. In someways there is a feeling of return to "Catch 22" with the military ways but the family tales make this a much more caring and home-cooked tale! Hats off to Mr. Brown!!
Animal House leaves campus and goes to War
My nose is always in a book. "Augie's War" is the very best book that I've read in a long time. The author's dialogue reminds me of Elmore Leonard's. His characters are fully developed with a back story for each one. Every single word of this yarn was believable.
This is a love story of the author's family and the place where he was raised. It's a story of the absurdities of all war and the Vietnam war in particular.
Brown makes it very clear who the most powerful people are in the U,S. Army. It isn't the Generals, the Captains or other officers in the chain of command. Company Clerks wield all the power of life and death, of happiness or misery.
This is a page turner of a first novel. I hope it's not Brown's last. The cultural references are numerous. From lighting farts, to flicking a Zippo lighter off and on, to Senior Wences on The Ed Sullivan Show the author connects with anyone who lived in the 60s.
"Camp followers" have been an important and ubiquitous part of wars since the dawn of time. "Augie's War" paints a new angle of this practice with Operation Thunderclap.
There has never been a better portrayal of the day to day business of making War. Read this book and you, like me, will look forward to seeing this story on the Big Screen someday.
Augie's War - I couldn't put it down
Augie's War - I couldn't put it down. The contrast between the idyllic life of a young man growing up in a large Italian family in small-town West Virginia and the reality and horrors of war were masterfully captured by author John H. Brown. I can't wait for the movie!
A rewarding military tale
Author and veteran John H. Brown does a fine job of mingling nostalgic anecdotes of Italian-American family life in a small town with the gritty and sometimes absurd and entertaining machinations of daily living as a Vietnam War soldier.
The protagonist’s family memories, his keen military observations and his examination of the puzzlement and cruelties of combat, makes this a rewarding addition to anyone’s military fiction reading list. As is often the case for someone who has been in the military, the best way to dull its daily absurdities is to retreat into the friendly confines of your own remembrance –– something that Brown’s character, Augie, demonstrates with descriptive skill and plenty of heart.
Whether he’s conveying the odorous glories of a basecamp latrine or depicting the bribery of an admin clerk in order to pull soft night guard duty, the author’s narrative is always spot-on. His charming vignettes and alternating memories of immigrant neighborhood life is a highlight of this book.
This is a believable story with starkly-drawn, memorable characters that amuses and informs the reader about some of life’s most important and enduring realities.
You don’t have to have been in the military to enjoy it, but if you have…then Augie’s War is rewarding on several levels. I recommend it highly.
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This article is from the Encyclopedia of North Carolina edited by William S. Powell. Copyright © 2006 by the University of North Carolina Press. Used by permission of the publisher. For personal use and not for further distribution. Please submit permission requests for other use directly to the publisher.
Crofter Immigration
by William S. Caudill, 2006
The failed immigration of tenant farmers, or crofters, from the Scottish Highlands to the Sandhills region of eastern North Carolina in 1884 is one of the most peculiar instances of European immigration in the state's history. Scottish Americans residing in the area of present-day Scotland, Richmond, Hoke, Moore, Robeson, and Cumberland Counties were inspired to organize a scheme to introduce up to 350 Scottish Highland crofters into the old Highland settlement in the early 1880s. They launched the scheme after hearing of the extreme oppression experienced by these small landholders at the hands of their landlords and factors in their homeland and the organized resistance and rent strikes that began on the Isle of Skye in 1882. Worldwide attention was drawn to that region by a small skirmish between tenants and police known as the Battle of the Braes, which served as the beginning of popular uprisings throughout the Highlands against oppressive land tenure policies. Several of the crofters prominently involved in this event were among the parties that settled for a short time in North Carolina.
The plan, organized by Highlander Margaret MacLeod and others in Scotland, aimed to remove groups of crofters from their holdings on the Isles of Skye and Lewis, as well as other regions of the Scottish Highlands, and relocate them to the established Highland settlement of North Carolina. North Carolina's Highland settlement was thought to be an ideal home for these immigrants as it was expected that the established Scottish American families would foster the successful assimilation of the newly arrived Highland crofters. Private funds were collected for the scheme on both sides of the Atlantic; the North Carolina Bureau of Immigration, under the leadership of John T. Patrick, and the Seaboard Air Line Railway also contributed substantially to the effort. Local efforts were steered by James L. Cooley of Wagram. Unknown to the immigrants, Lord MacDonald and other prominent Highland landlords secretly contributed to the efforts as a means of ridding themselves of some of the land reform agitators and superfluous tenants.
The first group of crofters, numbering 73, arrived in North Carolina via Norfolk in March 1884 and was transported to Laurinburg under the care of Cooley and D. P. McEachern. From there the crofters dispersed throughout the community, as arranged by their sponsors. A second group arrived in May, and its 65 members were transported to the vicinity of Cameron under the care of Cooley and Frank W. Clark of the Seaboard Railway. Additional small parties arrived in Richmond County throughout the spring. Newspaper accounts touted the success of the immigration and spoke of the possibility of additional large parties that would arrive in coming months.
Upon arrival, however, the immigrants found that the promises of free land and employment held forth by MacLeod and others were not true. By July some newspapers reported dissatisfaction and unemployment among the crofters. It became apparent that many of these immigrants lacked the skills necessary to integrate into agricultural pursuits immediately and that many of the families were further handicapped by the fact that they spoke only Gaelic. There is also evidence that the host families had taken advantage of the opportunity for an ethnically attractive labor force, and that their sponsorship of the crofters had not been entirely humanitarian. Two of the crofters returned to Scotland in early July and reported to newspapers that "where work was obtained the only wages given was the bare food, and the houses provided were the small one-roomed huts formerly occupied by slaves."
By the fall of 1884 most of the crofters had made efforts to return to Scotland or relocate to other areas in the United States. Most of the immigrants eventually did return to their homeland, feeling deceived by the organizers and dissatisfied with their experiences in North Carolina. Newspapers of the day show that the crofters themselves were forced to bear most of the blame for the failure of the plan, although the reputation of state immigration agent John T. Patrick was severely tarnished by his association with the affair. As a result, the state did not engage in any further recruitment schemes for foreign immigrants in the late nineteenth century.
Only a handful of crofters remained in North Carolina, most being young men employed as farm overseers or in similar pursuits. One of the most notable families that remained was that of Alexander MacRae. After failing at agricultural efforts in Moore and Robeson Counties, MacRae was employed by businessman Hugh MacRae of Wilmington, who sent him to present-day Avery County to serve as foreman in building the Yonahlossee Turnpike between the new resort village of Linville and the town of Blowing Rock. MacRae and his family operated a guest house for tourists on what is now known as MacRae Meadow near Linville. This site would later become the location of one of the world's largest Scottish gatherings-the Highland Games at Grandfather Mountain.
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If you are just beginning to play golf you might view the game as a sport or recreation. This is where most golfers start the game and sometimes leave it, unaffected by its allure. If you play golf long enough it can awaken something inside and you eventually realize that golf can be, and usually is, a spiritual experience. In March 1997 I encountered one of these spiritual experiences playing the greatest golf venue on the planet, Augusta National Golf Club, with the greatest ball-striker in the world, Moe Norman. That year, Dave Spencer held the head professional position at Augusta National. A long-time fan of Moe’s, Dave’s fondness for Moe grew out of his many visits to Augusta over the years as well as the legend Moe had become.
Todd Graves and Moe Norman
Todd Graves and Moe Norman
Dave offered Moe an open invitation to play at Augusta anytime he wished.
When asked if he would like to go back and play at Augusta, he accepted, in a way that only he could.
“Who wouldn’t?” Moe asked.
Every golfer has affection for Augusta National Golf Club. Constructed by Bobby Jones in 1934, the year of the Masters Tournament, Augusta is revered as golf’s “Mecca.” Originally built on the grounds of a nursery, each year the best players in the world gather at Augusta to compete in the Masters Tournament. Azaleas remain and decorate the landscape throughout the grounds making the tournament one of the most beautiful and memorable venues in the world of golf.
Jones, a National Amateur himself, promoted National Amateur Champions to play in the Masters Tournament.
Moe, twice the Canadian Amateur Champion, participated in the Masters in 1956 and 1957.
Like all players, Moe understood the eminence of Augusta. He kept his most prized possessions, his Masters’ pins, in the glove box of his Cadillac and in a moment’s notice would show them to anyone who was interested. One day, while in Moe’s car, I asked to see the pin.
“Ok, do you want to see a million dollars?” Moe asked.
“Sure,” I said.
Then, glowing with pride, Moe showed me the Masters towel which lay on the front seat of his car.
“Wouldn’t sell it for a million dollars,” Moe said.
I was determined to get Moe back to Augusta.
Playing Augusta National with Moe
Natural Golf’s previous owner Larry Olson and I were planning on traveling with Moe to the opening of a driving range in Tampa that year. We decided to make a three-day trip out of it, the first day playing at Augusta. The trip was one of many Moe Norman adventures of which I had the privilege of participating. I loved playing golf with Moe each time discovering a bit more about the man, his demeanor, and his character. He made the game seem so simple and I always learned more about golf and myself whenever I was with him. I found Moe to be not only talented but also generous and empathetic. I knew that playing Augusta with Moe would allow me to deepen my relationship with him and hear his story about the playing at the Masters. It is no surprise that around with Moe at golf’s Mecca would indeed be enlightening.
Many consider Moe to be “different.” He and I often talked about how his “differences” affected his success as a PGA Tour player. Moe mentioned his experience at Augusta in 1956 when, after 36 holes he received a lesson from Sam Snead. Moe hit so many balls that evening that his hands were raw the next day and he couldn’t hold the golf club. His compulsive act the night before forcing him to withdraw after nine holes in the third round.
Moe’s withdrawal from the golf world’s most prestigious tournament fueled the critics on the PGA Tour where he was often labeled “eccentric.” Our Augusta escapade began no differently.
Upon arrival to the parking lot at Augusta, we were greeted by caddies who warmly welcomed us and immediately informed us that cell phones were not allowed anywhere on the grounds. I began to grasp that I was in for a truly amazing experience. Anxious to get inside the clubhouse, I headed to the locker room to change my shirt. Moe changed his shirt beside the car, deciding that the parking lot was his place for a wardrobe change. The 40 years between his rounds at Augusta hadn’t had much influence on him.
Todd Graves and Moe Norman
Todd Graves and Moe Norman
With our shirts changed, we headed to the practice tee to warm up. I was anxious and interested to see Moe hit a few balls. I never grew tired of watching Moe hit balls.
Moe warmed up with a few wedges, striking a few to the 50-yard target. Then he moved to a few full wedge shots, then a 7 iron, 5 iron and then to his driver. Moe hit each one of them perfectly. It didn’t take long before Moe was ready for the first hole.
“Are you ready to go Moe?” I asked. “Par four, 435,” Moe said.
My caddy said “He’s right,” the first hole is a 435-yard par four.
“I never forget a hole, number two, 575 par five, three, 350 par four,” Moe said. “I just have to play it once.”
Moe was known for his vivid memory of golf courses, rounds, scores and anything else he was interested in. Like his memory, Moe’s memories were priceless. Can you imagine? The greatest ball-striker in the world was introducing me to one of the greatest golf courses in the world. When I think about it today, it still gives me chills.
The first hole at Augusta National is an uphill par four with a slight dog-leg to the right. A bunker protects the right side of the fairway. Moe hit first. The ball landed on the left side of the fairway equal yardage with the bunker. My shot landed in the middle of the fairway bounding right stopping just short. “Fairway slopes right, keep it left,” Moe said.
With the hole located on the back portion of the green, I hit a 7 iron for my approach. The ball bounced over the back of the green and down a severe slope resting 10 feet below the green surface leaving a difficult elevated chip. Moe struck his approach to the center of the green approximately 25 feet.
“Never past the hole at Augusta, never long on one,” Moe chirped.
Augusta National has always been known for its treacherously fast, hard and undulated greens. Ben Hogan took 40 putts during his round in 1952 the same year that hole 14 averaged 3.5 putts per player to get the ball into the hole once they got onto the green. Originally built with Bermuda grass greens, Augusta National was converted to bentgrass in 1980 but the hard fast greens Augusta was known for have remained.
Players in past Masters Tournaments have often complained about the difficulty of the greens at Augusta. One-year Tom Kite commented that balls landing on the greens were landing so hard that they weren’t leaving ball marks. “It left what looked more like a burn mark,” Kite commented. Many of the slopes on the greens are not visible to anyone watching television but the players on the course know that a shot below the hole is a safe bet at Augusta.
Number 9 is one of my favorite golf holes on the front nine. From your recliner, you can’t see the tremendous elevation of the approach shot from the fairway into the green. The flag was near the center of the green. There is so much altitude from the fairway that the bottom of the flagstick is invisible.
“Never hit it above the hole. Keep it short if you can. Use the slopes. Have them work for you not against you,” Moe said?
From the middle of the fairway about 150 yards hitting a 7 iron, Moe hit one of his best shots of the day. The ball approached the front of the green traveling low taking one bounce on the front of the green and then the second stopping just short of the hole five feet. My shot approached the green differently. Hitting a 9 iron sent my ball high into the air and it landed just about where Moe’s ball had stopped. Spinning, the ball reversed down the slope off of the front of the green.
“Too much spin, you lose control with too much spin,” Moe said. I realized that this was the reason for the lower than normal height of his shot into the green. His trajectory took the spinoff of the golf ball giving the ball a chance to bounce forward.
I was always learning from Moe.
Hole number 10 doglegs left and is a great hole for a right-handed golfer to draw the ball around the corner.
Moe said that this was one hole where a straight shot wasn’t the best choice. “Hit a draw on this hole, the fairway slopes left, you can get more roll,” Moe said.
Unfortunately, I hit a straight shot to the right side of the fairway leaving a longer than necessary approach to the green with an awkward carry over a bunker protecting the right side of the green. Moe turned the ball slightly right-to-left around the corner out- driving me by 20 yards leaving a much easier approach into the green.
Named by writer Herbert Warren Wind after the miraculous way Arnold Palmer played these holes to win his first major championship, an infamous part of Augusta National is the stretch of holes 11 through 13 which he gave the moniker Amen corner.
On hole 11, a 455-yard par four, Moe struck the best shot of the day hitting a 4 wood from the fairway to three feet from the hole, tapping in for birdie.
“Simple, so simple,” Moe said.
The size slope and shape of the green makes hole number 12, Golden Bell, one of the most difficult holes on tour. Moe and I both hit our shots to the back right side of the green. We then walked across Ben Hogan’s bridge.
“Oh what a feeling, what a feeling,” Moe said. Moe was in his element. He was enjoying himself.
Of all the rounds I played with Moe, he was particularly animated during this round. Moe was excited and complimentary as we completed Amen Corner and struck our shots off on the 14th tee.
“Best I’ve seen you hit the driver,” Moe said. “Thanks, Moe, what do you see different today?” I asked.
Moving his shoulders in and backward and forward motion. “You’re more like this today,” Moe said, demonstrating my swing motion. “You’re longer today, best I’ve seen.”
We finished the 14th hole and made our way to 15th, a reachable 500-yard par five. A good shot from the tee can carry far enough to strike the down-slope in the fairway allowing the ball to roll within mid-iron distance from the green. If the tee shot misses the down-slope, it can leave a long approach over Rae’s Creek. Many Masters Tournaments have been won and lost on number 15.
Moe and I both struck our tee shots missing the down-slope leaving 230 yards to the green. Known for its “upside-down” bowl shape and the false front sloping into the creek, some will choose to lay up from this position leaving a short wedge. That’s not why we came. We both struck 3 kinds of wood to the green, both balls finishing in Rae’s Creek.
Moe and I walked toward the green to drop another ball to strike an approach. Thinking it to be advantageous to drop as close to the green as possible, I continued to drop 50 yards from the green. As I dropped, I heard Moe strike his approach landing the ball 10 feet left of the hole. I looked back and noticed Moe approximately 100 yards behind me. I continued with my shot, attempting to hit a lob wedge. The ball rolled up the slope toward the flag. The ball stopped and then began rolling backward resting in Rae’s Creek. Taking another ball from my bag, I took another drop and struck another ball, once again rolling back into Rae’s Creek.
“Never drop there,” Moe said as he walked passed. “Never drop there.”
Moe knew the extreme difficulty of a wedge shot to the severely sloped green and had struck a 9 iron from 150 yards allowing him to have a full swing with better distance control.
Hole 15 ruined my chance to play well and so I realized that I was not playing Augusta for a low score that day but instead, feeling the spirits of the great players who had walked the grounds before me. I understood that playing at Augusta with Moe was about being in a special place with a very special person. Augusta National humbled me and at the same time lifted me to a new understanding of why I play golf.
As the sun was lowering on the final three holes, Moe and I walked together, mostly in silence, appreciating the richness of the green grass and the beauty of the trees. I couldn’t help but experience Augusta National as truly a sacred place.
From the drive down Magnolia Lane to the last putt on “Holly,” the final hole, Augusta had welcomed us with open Azaleas giving Moe and me an opportunity to commune together, learn more about each other, and revel in the spiritual nature of the game itself.
Posted by Todd Graves
Comments
April 6, 2017 at 1:00 am
That is why we play golf. Great story Todd!
Ben says:
April 6, 2017 at 1:16 am
What a thrill that had to be for you, Todd, to not only play at the most beautiful and famous golf course in the world but to also play with, witness, and learn from the best ball striker on those gorgeous grounds!
April 6, 2017 at 2:03 am
Wow what I rich story! It’s those type of memories that I play for. Thanks for sharing yours.
April 6, 2017 at 11:59 am
What a tremendous memory for you…to share with all of us! Thanks Todd.
Chris A says:
April 6, 2017 at 1:55 pm
Thanks so much for posting! I can’t help but wonder what was going through Moe’s mind those last few holes as you two walked in silence.
April 6, 2017 at 7:58 pm
Great article! What a day! Thanks for sharing!
May 30, 2017 at 4:49 am
Wow, what a wonderful experience. Your words captured the genius of Moe Norman. Thank you for sharing.
November 14, 2019 at 11:13 am
What score did Moe card that day?
Peter says:
November 15, 2020 at 3:13 pm
Every course offers us its “Master’s moments”, we only have to recognize them to appreciate this fundamental aspect of the game.
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A newborn cries on September 17, 2013 at the maternity of the Lens hospital, northern France. A study of crying mice could help explain some building blocks of human infant cries and adult speech.
When baby mice cry, they do it to a beat that is synchronized to the rise and fall of their own breath. It's a pattern that researchers say could help explain why human infants can cry at birth — and how they learn to speak.
Mice are born with a cluster of cells in the brainstem that appears to coordinate the rhythms of breathing and vocalizations, a team reports in the journal Neuron.
If similar cells exist in human newborns, they could serve as an important building block for speech: the ability to produce one or many syllables between each breath. The cells also could explain why so many human languages are spoken at roughly the same tempo.
"This suggests that there is a hardwired network of neurons that is fundamental to speech," says Dr. Kevin Yackle, the study's senior author and a researcher at the University of California, San Francisco.
Scientists who study human speech have spent decades debating how much of our ability is innate and how much is learned. The research adds to the evidence that human speech relies — at least in part — on biological "building blocks" that are present from birth, says David Poeppel, a professor of psychology and neural science at New York University who was not involved in the study.
But "there is just a big difference between a mouse brain and a human brain," Poeppel says. So the human version of this building block may not look the same.
The study emerged from research on the ultrasonic distress calls that a newborn mouse makes when it is separated from its mother.
"We call it cries because the ultimate purpose is to have the mom find them and take them back to the nest," Yackle says.
Analysis of the cries showed that they had similarities to the production of syllables in human speech.
"We saw that within a single breath there could be multiple cries, and when these occurred, they were recurring in a rhythm." Yackle says. "So then the question was, can we find the origin of this cry rhythm?"
The team began tracing the numerous signals that control the muscles involved in producing the cries. Then they began looking for places in the brain where there was an overlap between cells involved in vocalizing and cells involved in breathing.
"There really is only one area in the brainstem that has an overlap," Yackle says. "And so this is what really [brought] our attention to this node or cluster of cells."
To make sure they'd found the right cluster, the team removed these cells from some newborn mice. The animals continued to breathe normally. But they stopped producing cries, or made cries that had no rhythm.
In other mice, the team tried electrically stimulating the cluster of cells. The animals immediately began producing rhythmic cries.
A brain circuit that could help explain human speech
Yackle suspects that a similar cluster of cells exists in humans. That would explain why we are able to cry from birth, and why even our earliest cries are coordinated with breathing and contain the rhythm of adult speech.
The presence of cells that act as a sort of metronome for human speech would explain why "people say about three to six syllables per second, no matter what language you're speaking," Poeppel says.
The cells also could also provide some of the linguistic "LEGO blocks" we use to construct words and sentences, Poeppel says.
"Our words come out as a string of sound," he says. "But you have to break it up into little parts." The study may show how one of those parts — rhythmic syllables — is generated.
If that's the case, fluent speech would still require people to learn how to adjust or override the innate systems that control both breathing and the production of sounds, Poeppel says.
"You can inhale deeply and then say just 'bah,'" he says. "So that's one syllable in one breath. But you can also inhale and go 'bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah.'"
And, of course, speech also involves many other brain circuits and networks that are far more complicated, Poeppel says. These allow us to do things like adjust our inflection, access a huge vocabulary, and, ultimately, transform ideas into a stream of sounds that can be decoded by another human brain.
Jon Hamilton is a correspondent for NPR's Science Desk. Currently he focuses on neuroscience and health risks.
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UK cybersecurity company forges ahead to enhance leadership team and innovate in the face of mounting cyber threats
Edinburgh, UK (06.10.2022) – Adarma, the UK’s largest independent cyber threat management company, has today announced the expansion of its executive team to support the business at a time of rapid growth. The additions to the company include Niall O’Sullivan, Chief Finance and Operations Officer; Sarah Coleman, Chief People Officer; and Dan Baker, Chief Delivery Officer, all of whom bring valuable experience in driving business transformation.
The appointment of these three critical roles is indicative of the growth journey Adarma has been on to transform the shape of its business. While it continues to drive an aggressive innovation programme to remain at the forefront of the UK cybersecurity market, it also aims to ensure a sustainable and profitable growth trajectory, accelerated transformation of its people strategy and the seamless delivery of its services to ensure maximum value for its customers.
“At a time of global economic insecurity, we cannot take for granted Adarma’s position of growth. We are fortunate to have a talented team of professionals as well as investors, who believe in our company’s mission to help organisations build their cyber resilience,” said John Maynard, CEO of Adarma. “With an expanded and highly capable leadership team in place, I have no doubt we will see our growth continue exponentially; all whilst maintaining our supportive and inclusive culture.”
This week, Adarma revealed it was awarded a £2 million grant from Scotland’s national economic development agency, Scottish Enterprise. The funding is part of a wider investment strategy to support the company’s innovation roadmap and expand its range of cybersecurity offerings to bolster its customers’ cyber resilience. One outcome of this investment programme will be the creation of over 50 new cybersecurity roles, open to a diverse range of applicants. These recent appointments show Adarma’s commitment to executing on a strategy of ambitious innovation and growth.
“Adarma’s strong company values, its services and its people’s commitment to standing shoulder to shoulder with its customers, as well as its ambitious innovation strategy have all attracted me to this new role,” said Niall O’Sullivan, Chief Finance and Operations Officer at Adarma. “I have joined the company at a pivotal moment in its growth and transformation, and I am excited to be a part of the next phase of its journey.”
See below for more information on the newly appointed executives:
Niall O’Sullivan, Chief Finance and Operations Officer
O’Sullivan is a transformation leader experienced in executing large scale digital transformation programmes and cost optimisation strategies that deliver measurable, effective and sustainable long-term benefits for all stakeholders.
Prior to joining Adarma, O’Sullivan was the Chief Financial Officer of Datalex plc and had worked in senior finance roles for major global organisations such as Google, Vodafone, Pearson Oracle and Dell. While at Vodafone, he managed a team of over 2,500 people across 20 countries, establishing Vodafone’s first three Finance Shared Service Centres and implementing a company-wide ERP system.
Sarah Coleman, Chief People Officer
With over two decades of experience as a global HR leader and organisation change expert, Coleman specialises in helping organisations implement innovative new ways of working that support long-term culture change, improve employee satisfaction, facilitate change management and drive strategic growth.
Before joining Adarma, Coleman was Global People and Communications Director at WPP, where she was responsible for transforming the organisation’s IT people strategy and delivery model, which scaled the number of employees from 200 to 2,500. This included the transition of IT staff from WPP’s 1,500+ agencies into a centralised operating model.
Prior to her role at WPP, Coleman was Vice President of HR at ICF International, where she headed all aspects of people strategy and change for the European and Asian markets over a period of significant acquisitive and organic growth.
Dan Baker, Chief Delivery Officer
Baker has a diverse background as an Executive Information Security Professional, experienced in defining and delivering on large scale security and digital transformation programmes. He brings a proven record in building and managing high performance teams to deliver major organisation and security change within budget, agreed timescales and importantly, in line with business objectives.
Prior to joining Adarma, he held several senior security leadership roles at DXC Technology, Ladbrokes Coral Group and most recently, as Director of Cybersecurity at Deloitte.
Adarma is the UK’s largest independent cyber threat management company. We deliver trusted and transparent security solutions that protect organisations against an increasingly complex and harmful threat landscape. Founded and led by industry experts, we provide cybersecurity consulting, technology and managed security services tailored to your unique requirements. Day or night we stand by your side, helping detect and respond to threats, protecting the promise of cyber resilience and helping you to build a more sustainable digital future.
Together we’ve got this.
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Out with the old and in with the NEW! Celebrate the coming of SPRING at your favorite downtown shops. Keep your money local and
Out with the old and in with the NEW!
Celebrate the coming of SPRING at your favorite downtown shops.
Keep your money local and see why Chillicothe was voted as one of Ohio Magazine’s Best Hometowns in 2021!
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Below are several ways to give in addition to giving by check, credit card or cash. Please consider one or more of the options below:
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If you are considering making a gift to Pilgrim Baptist Church, we invite you to explore the following tax-advantaged opportunities:
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If you plan to take the standardized deduction when you file your taxes, consider the $300 above the line tax deduction that the CARES Act passed in March of last year, provided to individuals who support charitable organizations such as Pilgrim. The limit is $300 whether you file as an individual or married and file jointly.
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Thank you for support of Pilgrim and its ministries and be assured of our prayers for you and your family.
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Local News
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Learn this, how can you make your tea so delicious!
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After mastering some basic brewing techniques, many people will immediately slide into a boring stage. Because of the instability of the technique, the level of play is also unstable, and the tea is not good. The reason is the mentality.
When I have a tea with a friend, there are frequent misunderstandings in the brain, various troubles to face tomorrow, some to-do items on the agenda, family affairs, etc. At this time, I want to put tea. Soaking up, the more difficult the tea is, the more fresh it is, and the pleasure of tea brewing and the fun of tea with friends will soon be wiped out at this stage.
The restlessness is most likely to lead to such a situation, because the heart is full of anger, the attention can not be concentrated, tea is still the tea, but the taste of each brew is not the same; want to progress but can not find the direction; The tea is too much to drink and it is easy to cause the taste to passivate, so the mood is more depressed and irritated...
If you give up at this time, then your level will always stagnate at this stage; and to break through, there is only one, that is, perseverance.
It is not difficult to insist on it. First set a goal for yourself, arrange a fixed time every day, let go of everything, and calmly concentrate on completing the brewing of a tea. In the long run, you can gradually wash away the impetuousness of your heart and achieve peace of mind. In countless times of brewing and drinking, turn the focus from “subjective pursuit” to “natural acceptance”. Don’t be overly sensitive to the performance of “tea, tea, tea rhyme” in tea, slowly The mood is gradually calm, the technique is gradually released, the brewing level can be stabilized, and the fun of tea can return to you.
Another kind of mentality, the most likely to appear in the initial stage, is "the heart turns with the tea", all the tea-centered mentality: tea to buy the best, water to choose the best, the water heater should also use the most Ok, how expensive the tea set can be, how expensive it is to use it. Anyone who thinks about how to improve the brewing effect is willing to spend money to try it. Pursuit of perfection is a stage that many tea friends will experience. Although this perfectionism is worthy of recognition, but only pursues aesthetic needs and lacks the spirit of excellence, it will not push you to move on.
If one day, you find that the tea that has been brewed for a long time is not so difficult to drink with proper water, with a water heater that is readily available, and with ordinary tea sets, that means you are entering a brand new world. Because with the increase in the types of tea brewed, the experience of brewing and tasting has gradually merged into a memory in your mind, and you have begun to enter a stage of understanding the panoramic view of tea.
As the understanding of the characteristics of tea is gradually deepened, the brewing effort in your hands is also growing. You can become proficient in the face of different teas, and even the same kind of tea can interpret different styles. This marks that the impetuous gas in your heart has been washed away by tea, focusing on the brewing, knowing all the changes that the tea has made during the brewing process, and the brewing of each tea has reached the point of precise control. . After that, the communication between you and the tea begins to become smooth, and you can easily interpret any kind of tea in every brewing process. Tea will follow your wishes and perform. At this time, you can exhaust all kinds of possibilities of tea, and try different brewing styles without any fear.
At that time, the tea you brewed is not a bit stubborn and artificial, but naturally there is a feeling of touching people. The information about the nature contained in the tea is released from the tea soup. Through the entrance to the drink, the most authentic and comprehensive tea nature of any kind of tea is discovered in depth, and the vitality of nature is realized.
The peace of mind that is uncontested with the world can be suddenly opened up, so that you can make good tea!
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What is good tea? The tea farmers actually said this
The old white tea is alive and dead, it can make tea, but it can't be soaked for a long time. Are you right?
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Forwarding, Freight News, Logistics
Twill enters US market
[ March 15, 2018 // Chris ]
Digital freight forwarder Twill has now officially entered the US market, following its earlier announcement of an operation in Mexico. Twill uses Damco’s footprint across the globe.
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One last month in paradise before an 8,000-year journey. That’s what the Company had promised before whisking Alina Andra and her entire crew of 500 to tropical Tilulipu, where it had built a luxurious resort just for the occasion.
Only the rooms of the entire executive team now stand empty, and Alina’s crewmates turn to her to make sense of their predicament. So why have a handful of her more dubious colleagues decided that the mass disappearance is part of an outlandish plot? And why have they named Alina as a co-conspirator?
Now thrust into a less glamorous spotlight, Alina heads a search for the truth. But while the answer she discovers may explain the missing crew members, it may also put Earth’s first crewed extrasolar mission in jeopardy.
Alina left her hand on the door latch after Dom left, the metal cool in her palm. A breeze from the balcony stirred the leaden room air, and raised goosebumps along the back of her arms. She waited, picturing Dom shuffling down the hall, pausing for the elevator car, heading up to the fourth floor. Only when she was sure he was gone did she pull the door open.
Alina passed only one other person in the corridor. By now, most people would have turned in for the night. But others were keeping vigil, because they took the vacancy of the fifth floor as some sort of omen.
As she got off the elevator, the fifth floor corridor stretched before her, yawning and wan, its lighting dimmed to half brightness for the night hours. It yielded no answers, except a phrase playing on repeat at the back of her mind. Evidence of absence is not absence of evidence? Maybe she had it turned around.
Alina forced herself to proceed, poking her head into a few of the rooms. They were as she’d seen them earlier, with personal effects left behind, tidied up somewhat by housekeeping. Among the items she noticed brimmed hats and sunglasses. So the executives had not expected to venture outside, or had left in the night.
Or they were still somewhere on the premises.
Alina rubbed her neck, her muscles tight. She padded down the hall toward the far staircase, passing the rest of the doors by, when the faintest sniff caught her ear. It might have been her own feet scuffing the carpet. She stopped and tilted her head.
Something like whimper, to her left.
She crept toward the nearest room—507—and leaned forward, eyes shut, close enough to smell the wood of the door. Nothing at first, but then a long sliding sound, followed by clinks. It sounded like someone pulling out a drawer.
Gently, Alina twisted the door latch, half expecting it to be locked. The bolt receded, and she gave the door a push as she leaned into the room, prepared to announce herself before entering. She froze. At the opposite side of the room, someone was on their knees, their back to her. It was a woman, but beyond that, Alina couldn’t tell.
She was rooting around in the dresser.
The woman yelped as she jerked herself off-balance, and wound up in a pile on the floor before the dresser.
Alina let go of the door as she brought her arms to her chest.
“Mum?”
A familiar, incredulous voice—it was Ria staring up at her. One arm disappeared under her as she collected herself. Was she holding something?
“Ria? What the devil are you doing in here?”
Ria stood and brushing her hair behind an ear. “I might ask you the same thing. You scared the living shit out of me!”
“Well I certainly– What could you possibly be doing here at night?”
Her daughter wouldn’t meet her eyes, and continued to dust herself off. She wiped her cheek, leaving a wet streak behind. Had she been crying?
“Trying to understand why they’ve gone, I guess. It hit me when you made the announcement.” She shook her head. “Never mind, I’m tired.”
She made for the door, but Alina stopped her with a hand on her arm.
“Ria, I really want to understand. Can we just …” She looked around the room. A large table stood around the corner of the L-shaped room. Alina pulled the two closest chairs over. “Please,” she said.
“Mum, it’s late.”
“Just for a moment,” Alina said. If her daughter rejected her plea, she would have to throw herself in front of the door. Anyway, why should she have to beg for her daughter’s time? “It’s been ages since we talked, and I’m not counting last night.”
Ria sighed, her shoulders softening. She slumped into the nearest chair. “It’s hardly been ages.”
Alina sat across from her daughter, who was studying her hands. She saw a young child superimposed over the young woman Ria was, a manifestation that was more difficult to dismiss with each passing year. “So what’s happening here?”
Ria shook her head.
Alina peered into her eyes. “You said something hit you. What was it? A thought? Is it something related to the meeting tomorrow?”
Ria wiped at her cheek again. Alina fought to keep her arms in her lap.
“This is Philippe’s room,” said Ria.
Philippe? Ria had never mentioned him before, yet here she was. He must be one of Sem’s team. Whoever he was, his disappearance had caused her daughter great distress.
Alina disregarded the twinge of envy.
Ria took a breath, before continuing. “We’ve been talking regularly for some time. Since Pasadena, actually.”
“Oh?”
Ria gave her mother a look. “Talking, that’s all it was.”
Alina shook her head. “I didn’t …”
“He never talks about his work, not directly. But he’s one of the smartest people I know, Mum, seriously. We may be a select group here, but there are so many dim bulbs. Philippe is different, and I’m a good judge of character. I trust him. More importantly, I can talk to him, and he gets it.”
Alina felt like she was coming into a conversation somewhere in the middle. “Talk about what? Not about relationship stuff?”
Ria made a disgusted sound and folded her arms across her chest.
“So tell me,” Alina said.
“We talk about the mission. You know, the reason we’re here at all? Leaving the planet is the biggest thing we’ll ever do. I mean, not just in the sense of being a grand feat, but in terms of what it says about humanity. About stratification and privilege. What it says about us that some forge new territory while others … forage for survival.”
Where was this coming from? Humanity’s story hadn’t changed much since its earliest chapters, but something in Ria had.
Her daughter’s eyes unfocused. “You know, the popular songs that first incorporated samples of the Lyra Signal, they aren’t even popular anymore. The novelty of it—of a single burst of chatter from space—it’s gone. It’s commonplace. Most people don’t care. What use is a map to a new planet if most of Earth are too preoccupied with wars and water supplies?”
“Are you having second thoughts?” Alina asked. Was she complaining, or afraid?
Ria looked at her mother sharply. There was no fear there.
“I’m trying to tell you, this is what we talked about,” Ria said. “About how Pragma Art alone has the resources to build a ship using alien technology, because S.P. Sem herself is so single-minded. Probably because she’s mad. If the aliens won’t communicate with us again, we’ll go to them. And now we really are. We’ve chosen to leave home, every last one of us, and for whatever individual reasons.”
Alina didn’t want to say the wrong thing, but her mind was reeling. “Is this guilt?”
Ria stood up and went to the window as Alina watched.
“I’m not proud to say it,” she said quietly, “but I can’t wait to leave. It’s hard to wrap one’s mind around the implications. Hard enough when you’re part of a close-knit team, and harder still when thirty members of that team go missing.”
“Including your friend,” Alina added.
Ria turned, and sat back down across from her mother. It sounded like a crush, no matter Ria’s protestations. Maybe that’s not what she’d intended, but affinities blossomed of their own accord.
“He never mentioned anything to me about leaving Chakkaradar, if you were wondering.” She was small in her chair again.
“I can understand how you might feel disappointed,” Alina said, trying to sound helpful through the swirl of thoughts in her head. “But I honestly think it’s early to draw any conclusions from it. The exec team may have planned something that Philippe didn’t know about.” The image of a sunken boat came to mind, its dashed hull like a hazy mirage in the perilous deep. Alina masked her wince by rubbing her face. “Come to the meeting,” she said around her hands, before letting them fall to her lap. “It’s tomorrow morning at eight. Maybe there will be answers then.”
Ria sat back. “Oh, I don’t think so, Mum. That’s the last place I want to be.”
What did that mean?
Alina was afraid to push. “How about if I give you a recap after, then?” she offered. “Whenever. I’ll find you.”
Ria shrugged.
Exhausted, Alina closed her eyes, and massaged them gently. Maybe she would call for a search party after the meeting, to find her daughter.
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Published: September 2020
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A single vote saw proposals from the SNP opposition group on reinstatement of Principal Teacher posts fail at the special meeting of Moray Council on Thursday.
The move was defeated by 13 votes to 12 – with Labour councillors helping to defeat the move, insisting that while they retained a commitment to Principal Teachers they “wanted to do this right”.
SNP leader Pearl Paul proposed an amendment to the budget proposals by the administration that would have seen a return of Principal Teacher posts at primary schools with nurseries attached and those with over 150 pupils.
Following the meeting she said: “The SNP opposed the removal of Principal Teachers two years ago and the concerns that we raised at the time have been borne out.
“At this year’s budget we put forward a reasoned and evidenced argument on the reintroduction of these posts and the Council’s Tory Convener, Independents and Labour have failed the teachers test and chose to sit on their hands.
“What is very clear to the SNP Group is that leadership capacity in schools is compromised by the reduced support that Head Teachers have with no Principal Teachers to ease the pressure, in addition recruitment is not helped by a poor career structure in Moray.
“The Administration and the Opposition Labour Group had a clear opportunity and they passed it up.”
However, Moray Labour leader Councillor John Divers hit back, insisting that it was correct to seek an assessment of the impact of losing Principal Teachers.
He said: “Labour opposed removing Principal Teachers and Labour is in favour of them returning. That is why I asked for a review of school management last summer and then asked for an assessment of the impact of losing Principal Teachers months ago.
“All that was done without fanfare, as opposed to the Johnny-Come-Lately Grandstanding of the SNP and the Tories.
“The truth is, because we asked for this to be looked into, we will have a full-range of solutions in front of us very shortly.
“The SNP want a quick-fix, to turn the clock back on Principal Teachers to a situation that wasn’t fit for purpose. We want to wait and find a solution that is fit for purpose and have Principal Teachers playing a role again by the next academic year.”
Scottish Conservative councillors Douglas Ross and James Allan supported the SNP proposal. Councillor Ross said: “Today was a light touch budget and there is no doubt there will be tough decisions to be taken in the years ahead – but a critical issue we are facing today is a shortage of teachers.
“Our own officers have said that one of the barriers in attracting teachers to Moray and encouraging our own staff to go for promotion was the removal of principal teachers, so I was happy to second the motion supporting their reintroduction.
“It’s clear there is a need for principal teachers and I’m amazed that the Labour group on the council voted against reintroducing these posts.
“Having principal teachers back would not have solved all our problems in recruiting staff – but it would have shown that Moray Council was willing to try everything to deal with this crisis and our pupils and staff would have been better served.”
Budget 2015: ‘Light Touch’ now but pain just around the corner
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As a parent, it's hard to watch your kids struggle with anything, but watching them struggle to buy a house can be especially tough. We all want the best for our offspring, and owning a home is one of the best ways to build wealth -- so if kids are having trouble taking that step, it's normal to worry about how they'll manage when you're gone.
The good news is this: There's a lot you can do as a parent to help your kids get their feet on the property ladder. Follow this advice and you'll be able to both assist your children and ensure that your own financial future is secure.
"Because I want to help my child" is a great reason to do just about anything -- but a house is a huge financial investment and responsibility, so you need to dig a little bit deeper.
Ask yourself these questions about your child and their life circumstances, as well as your own financial circumstances:
How does my kid handle finances?
Is my kid in debt? If so, how much is that debt?
Does my kid know how to save money?
Is my kid living in a real estate market where prices are steadily increasing -- and if they don't get in the door now, they might be locked out for years?
Do I want to transfer my wealth to my kid now, when they arguably need it most, or would I rather wait? How would that decision affect my estate taxes and other financial considerations?
Is my kid attending a college where they'll stay for several years? (And would it make sense to buy a house there instead of help them pay rent?)
Can my kid already qualify for a mortgage? If so, would it make sense to help them qualify for a bigger one?
After you've taken time to answer these questions, you should have a better idea of exactly why you want to help your child buy a house. Whether you want to encourage financial responsibility or help your kid buy a bigger house than they could on their own, knowing why will help guide your decision-making during the process.
Manage your own credit first
It's admirable to want to help your kids -- but not at the expense of your own financial well-being. So before you make any tangible offers to help, make a full assessment of your income and expenditures, your savings and assets, and decide how much you can afford to give. Put a dollar amount on it, and don't be tempted to exceed what you've decided you can spend.
There are a lot of options for helping your adult kids buy that will directly involve your credit, too. For that reason, all of the advice that applies to buyers also applies to parents who want to help their kids buy -- whether you're buying a home to rent to your kid, or co-signing or co-borrowing the loan, you'll want to make sure your credit is in great condition. Don't open a lot of new lines of credit or make any big purchases on credit, and follow all the standard best practices, too, like paying your own bills on time.
And maybe after all this assessment you've come to the conclusion that you don't have a lot of financial help to give. That's OK! You should know by now that parenting is about much more than spending money, so think about other ways you might be able to help, from offering advice, to connecting your kid with a mortgage broker or real estate agent, to cleaning and repairing the home when it's time to move in.
Get your kid's credit in order
A credit score is really important when it comes to a mortgage loan -- it helps the lender figure out how reliable (or not) each borrower is, and it directly influences the interest rate on the loan, which adds up to tens of thousands of dollars over decades.
If your child doesn't know what their credit score, then help them find it, and then work with them to improve it. Maybe your kid has trouble paying all their bills on time, so help them make a budget or set up automatic payments. Settling debts like student loans or car loans can have a significant positive impact on credit score, so if you're in a financial position to clear a large debt for your kid, this might be a good time to do it.
Mortgage lenders are also going to look at your child's bank account statements, seeking red flags like frequent overdrafts. If your kid frequently overdraws accounts, then think about how you might help them balance their finances.
Savings now go a long way later
There are essentially two reasons why you might want to encourage your child to save as much as possible right now. One is obvious: Down payments on houses are expensive, especially if you want to avoid mortgage insurance and put down 20% or more on the home purchase. That 20% of a home's sales price adds up pretty quickly, and most kids probably don't have tens of thousands of dollars handy in their bank account.
Another reason to facilitate savings for your kids is, again, the fact that mortgage lenders are going to want to see bank statements, and it will help your kid's mortgage rate if the lender sees a decent savings account that grows over time instead of being wrung dry every month.
As a parent, there are tons of ways you can help your kids save money, including inviting them to come live at home with you again for a spell, which can decrease their rent payment significantly. If you go this route, then make sure that any agreements you make with your kids about rent and contribution to utilities or household chores are documented and signed.
But you don't have to invite your kids to live at home again; you also have the option of taking over some of their bills (cell phone, car insurance, utilities or others), dropping off groceries or meals, handing down a gently used appliance or car and buying yourself a new one -- there are tons of ways that parents can help subsidize a child's savings account.
Time to buy? Consider all options
Once your kid's credit is in decent order and he or she has a down payment secured, you might not feel like your work is done. Some parents like to chip in with the actual purchase of the home -- and if that's you, fantastic! Just make sure you know what all your options are before you decide on any given path.
An incredibly common way to help your adult kid buy a house is to give them money for a down payment. This is a significant upfront expense for buyers, who may need tens of thousands of dollars to avoid mortgage insurance, and oftentimes parents make that possible.
But backing up your kid's home purchase with a down payment is far from the only option open to parents. Some choose to buy the house themselves, either as an investment rental where the kid can stay for a few years before selling, or as a rent-to-own deal where the kid pays the parents back for the house over time. If you have the ability to pay cash for a house, this can be an especially good deal for both the child and the parent: You can set an interest rate that's lower than what the market's currently dictating (a win for your kid) and make all your money back plus a profit over time (a win for you).
Other parents might prefer co-borrowing or co-signing a mortgage loan. These can be good options for a kid who can already qualify for a mortgage -- often, they can increase their price range with a co-borrower or co-signer. Think about both; a co-signer doesn't accrue any equity in the home and is responsible for the balance of the loan of the borrower defaults, and a co-borrower does accrue equity in the home, but co-borrowing might have a bigger immediate impact on your credit.
Cover your bases
One thing never to forget about adult kids: They are adults, and adults are going to make their own decisions. And some of those decisions might have an impact on your real estate deal.
Decisions that impact your real estate deal go well beyond paint or landscaping preferences. If your child has a common-law relationship or decides to get married while they're living in a house that they're renting from you -- or a house that lists you as a co-borrower -- and things go sour, that partner could have a claim on your real estate, especially if the partner was paying rent or helping with the mortgage.
Make sure that whatever agreements you're making with your kids are thought through in their entirety, and do your best to consider any changes or contingencies that might change the agreement. Document them and incorporate them into any legal verbiage for your own protection -- and to protect your kids, too.
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The Construction Sector is one of the most dangerous industries in the UK. This article provides guidance about winter safety for construction sites, and whilst it’s primarily aimed at construction businesses may also be informative to other organisations who have employees working outside. Winter Safety for Construction Sites The HSE report that there were 40 […]
Health and Safety Law & Essential Guidance for Employers
There are two parts to Health and Safety Law – civil and criminal. They’re not the same. As an employer, you must protect your workers and others from getting hurt or ill through work. Failure to put effective safety procedures in place could result in the following action: A regulator such as the Health and […]
Changes to the HSE Fee For Intervention (FFI)
As of the 6th April 2019, the HSE has increased the hourly charge of Fee For Intervention from £129 per hour to £154 per hour – doesn’t sound that excessive, does it? It does when there are other considerations to take into account. How will the increase affect my business? It all depends on how […]
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In a small shtetl in Eastern Europe in the late Nineteenth century this poor Jew suddenly withdrew the few dollars that he had in the bank. The next day the bank went belly up and all the wealthy Jews in town lost all their money. They were amazed, how could this poor Jew who knew nothing about finances have known that the bank was about to go under, something that had eluded all the mavens? They approached the poor Jew and asked: Tell us how did you know? He replied: I truly know nothing about finances but Friday before Shabbos the owner of the bank and myself were in the bath house and I over heard him say while sighing like only a Jew knows how to sigh, that Moshiach better come quickly. I realized that if this financial bigwig feels the urgency for Moshiach then he must be suffering terribly at the Bank. So immediately after Shabbos I rushed to pull out the few dollars that I saved up at the Bank!
The truth is, however, that Moshiach has always warmed the Jewish heart and inspired the Jewish soul. The Jewish people know how to long, to dream and to yearn, knowing that the day will come when the dream will come true.
The Torah tells us today that the first one to storm heaven and earth to bring the dream of Moshiach to fruition was Moses. The name of this week’s Torah portion, Va’eschanan means to plead. The Midrash teaches us that in the Hebrew language there are ten expressions for prayers and supplications, and Moshe used all of them in his prayers to be allowed to enter into the promised land. The word Va’eschanan itself has the numerical value of 515 telling us the number of times Moshe prayed to G-d to have mercy upon him to allow him to enter into the land of Israel. Why was Moshe so insistent, because had he entered into Israel he would have ushered in the final redemption.
G-d had to order Moshe to literally stop praying in order that people shouldn’t say, “Look how unyielding is the master and how adamant is the student.”
Yet we find that twenty four centuries ago, the Rabbis of the Great Assembly instituted that we pray for the coming of Moshiach a minimum of eighteen times each and every day. Why, what right do we have to constantly petition and pester G-d with the same request, isn’t it disrespectful? Yet the Rabbis institutionalized that Jews should relentlessly pray and question G-d’s decision to delay Moshiach’s coming.
Rabbi Moses Maimonides at the end of his Magnum Opus (Laws of Kings Chapter 11, 12) makes it abundantly clear that Moshiach is not a supernatural, other worldly phenomenon, rather Moshiach represents a perfectly natural state of events. It is the exile which comprises an unnatural reality. Exile in the Torah is compared to a dream state when we take leave of our senses, take a vacation from reality and dream up illusions. Moshiach is compared to a great awakening when we return to our natural reality.
In a very real sense Moshiach is not a change rather a return to a natural state of being. It is the status quo which is unnatural, an aberration and it takes a tremendous amount of energy to maintain this distortion.
Imagine a world in which you weren’t even tempted to act self-destructively because you keenly felt the power and the depth of your desire to live and be healthy. Imagine a world in which you were tempted to strengthen your relationship with G-d and you were repulsed by anything that could cause a disconnection between you and G-d because you keenly felt the G-dliness that’s located at the center of your being. This is the world of Moshiach.
This is the world that every Jew believes in and yearns for with every fiber of his being and every bone in his body. It is this belief that has sustained the Jewish people throughout its long and bitter exile.
When you see a painting that’s crooked it bother’s your sense of esthetics and you straighten it out. There’s no way that you will make the painting even more crooked because the sense of what’s wrong carries with it inseparably a sense of what’s right. If you had no clear image of the way the painting should be, you would never have been troubled by a sense that something is out of place.
Why is it that the Jew suffers from the exile more then anyone else and why is it the Jew’s unique mission to bring Moshiach? Because every Jew has hard wired into their system a deeply ingrained vision of the way world could be, should be, and will inevitably become once again.
The Torah tells us how at the beginning of creation the entire world was in a pristine state, a veritable paradise. At Mt. Sinai for a brief moment the world once again returned to its natural state of perfection. Ever since Mt Sinai, the Jew has been charged with the Divine mission to restore himself and the entire world, through the study of Torah and the fulfillment of its Mitzvot, to its good and wholesome self.
Consequently, the Rabbis instituted that every Jew follow in the footsteps of Moshe and on a daily basis storm heaven and earth and relentlessly seek out, pray and work towards the redemption. Even one extra moment of exile is unbearable and intolerable for the Jew. We are not asking G-d for a miracle, on the contrary it takes a miracle to keep up the distortion of exile. We are asking G-d to restore us to our natural selves, to help us get in touch with our true nature which is buried and submerged deep down inside of us. We are praying to G-d that our core and essence that our pintele yid or the Moshiach inside of us should emerge and surface and that we should experience the great awakening of the imminent redemption. Now!
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Man, the weakest of creatures, is surrounded by forces of life and death far greater than himself. Confronted with the vastness of these universal forces, man might well try to ‘serve them’ in order to protect himself, and better his lot.The essence of life, however, is to recognize the Supreme Being who created the Universe and accept His laws with awe and love. We must remember that He is aware of all our deeds, rewarding goodness and punishing evil. We are dependent on Him, and to Him alone do we owe allegiance.
To imagine that there could be any other power that could protect us or provide for our needs perverts the purpose of life, and, as history has shown, potentially unleashes untold forces of evil in ourselves, and in the world.
When we feel disappointed with life, when things do not work out as they should, how easy it to point an accusing finger and blame…everyone…everything…even G-D. Loyalty and trust are crucial in life. To blame G-d, curse, or to curse others in His name, is an act of disloyalty – akin to treason. It is an act which undermines the basis of all order and stability, on which a just society must stand.
The record of man’s inhumanity to man begins with the story of Cain and Abel. Man is indeed his brother’s keeper. The prohibition against manslaughter comes to protect man from the bestial tendency which lies within him. Man the attacker, denies the sanctity of human life, and ultimately attacks G-d, who created us in His image.
Respect the Traditional Family
The Bible states, “It is not good for man to be alone,” so G-d made a helpmate for Adam and in marriage “He blessed them.” In a wholesome family, man’s creativity finds meaningful expression. Wholesome families are the cornerstone of healthy communities, nations, and societies. Nations which have condoned immorality have never lasted long. Sexual immorality is the sign of an inner decay which spawns a ruthless society, bringing confusion into G-d’s life plan.
Since our sustenance comes from G-d, we should seek to earn it honestly, with dignity, and not through false means. To violate the property of others, by robbing or cheating, is a fundamental attack on their humanity. This breeds anarchy, plunging mankind into the depths of selfishness and cruelty. It was for this sin, above all, that the Flood was brought upon the world.
G-d gives man “dominion over the fish of the sea, the fowl of the heaven, over cattle, and over all of the earth.” We are caretakers of G-d’s creation. Ultimately our responsibility extends beyond our family, even beyond society, to include the world of nature.
Eating meat so fresh that the animal is still alive, may be healthy, but it is cruel, even barbaric, displaying a decadent insensitivity to the pain of others. This law is the touchstone, if you will, that measures how well the other six laws are being observed. When man fulfills his potential, the whole of creation is nurtured and elevated to realize its goal. This transforms the world into a beautiful gem – a place where G-d can dwell.
Preserve Justice
A robust and healthy legal system, administering justice fairly, creates a society worthy of G-d’s blessings. Establishing a system of judges, courts, and officials to maintain and enforce the law is a far-reaching responsibility. This precept translates the ideals of our personal life into a formal order for society at large. It is the extension and guarantee of all the preceding laws.
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Our farm has been in the family since 1910. Our family has been the stewards of our land and our grass for over 100 years. Growing healthy food for families is our passion!
We want to share our passion with you.
Grass-finished beef has:
More conjugated linoleic acid, a type of fat that’s thought to reduce heart disease and cancer risks
More antioxidant vitamins, such as vitamin E
We believe that grass-finished beef is amazing food and an extraordinary tool that is the only solution for solving climate change and desertification. We have had scientists and filmmakers on our land looking, testing and exploring what we do.
We love healthy soils, healthy grass and grass finished beef.
This is a DEPOSIT for your order. After you place your order, we will weigh, package up all your cuts and add up the total cost. We will then deduct the deposit from the total cost and send you an invoice for the outstanding amount.
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So if you spend your time eating as much as I do, chances are you spend a lot of time in the kitchen. I think having a nice kitchen is important - it should be tidy and welcoming, and it should look nice so it makes you feel good, although admittedly sometimes all it takes is opening my fridge to make me feel happy.
Mr Nerd and I are going to be doing an inexpensive budget renovation to our kitchen in the next couple of months – woohoo! However, we won’t be doing a full kitchen renovation in The Crap Shack for at least a while longer. We would need to save up for it, and in the meantime we can happily live with our little old jarrah kitchen for now - although it lacks a dishwasher *screams*, is definitely not my dream kitchen, and doesn’t have the amount of benchtop space I would love (there is some sick part of me that doesn’t consider a meal a culinary success until I have dirtied every pot and pan in the house, which frustrates Mr Nerd no end, although he loves my cooking so really, he should really just be shush).
ABOVE: This is one of Yasmin's kitchen renovations, this one done to a home in Applecross. Black and white contrasting colours were used for a stylish modern look. Opting for no handles on the drawers give a more seamless feel.
But if renovating your kitchen is on the cards for you – then a) yay I am excited for you! and b) I have just the expert on the blog for you today! Yasmin Drake from Lead Design is an interior design expert – and one of her specialties is creating gorgeous, practical kitchens for renovations, new-builds and additions. Coming from an architecture background and a career that has taken her to work in Dubai before returning to Perth, Yasmin can design your dream kitchen and project manage the entire process.
Today she is my Guest Nerd and will tell you everything you need to know if you’re thinking about turning your dark poky kitchen into a light-filled haven with all the space in the world to play Masterchef. Over to Yasmin!
with Guest Nerd Yasmin Drake of Lead Design
ABOVE: Lead Design director Yasmin Drake.
The kitchen is the heart of the home and the space where most families gather. It is probably the room I get asked the most about when working on renovation projects. Its layout, functionality and style needs to be thoroughly considered as it can really add value to your home. Kitchens are usually renovated every 15 to 20 years, so getting it right is vital for its longevity. And there are a few important things to consider when tackling a kitchen renovation.
Start with establishing a budget. As a general rule the new kitchen should not cost more than 10% of the value of the home. One of the most common mistakes people make is either over capitalising or under capitalising. Do your homework, be realistic with figures and research before you begin.
2. Think: What DON'T You Like?
Once a budget is established, the planning can begin. As a designer I usually start by asking my clients what works with their current kitchen and what doesn’t. Have a look at the current layout and establish whether it works for your family and home or whether a new layout needs to be considered. Ask yourself where the doors and windows are located? Is it through a traffic area? Does enough natural light enter into the space?
I recently worked on the kitchen of a 1950s cottage in Lathlain. The old kitchen was dated and the pantry, being in a trafficable area, was problematic. You literally walked through the kitchen door straight into the pantry! A new layout was established, where the pantry was moved away from the circulation path and the kitchen was extended a little to take advantage of the unused space. The new layout meant it became more functional with better utilisation of space.
BEFORE: The old pantry was in a trafficable area which was problematic.
BEFORE: The dated kitchen had unused space which meant we could redesign the layout and take advantage of this extra space.
AFTER: The new layout for the kitchen meant better utilisation of space and increased functionality.
When it comes to designing the new layout, you need to have what is called a ‘work triangle’. This is generally between the preparation area (sink, bench space), the fridge/pantry and the cooker. The total distance of all three sides of the triangle should ideally be between 6 to 7 metres.
AFTER: We used white for the cabinets and the owners chose a large butler’s sink to tie in with the character of the cottage.
A common complaint I hear from my clients is regarding insufficient storage. Try and maximise your available space with a clever layout and think about adding extra overhead cupboards for more storage.
Something to consider early on in your new kitchen are the appliances. Establish what appliances you need, their size and energy rating. This will give you a starting point for the layout also. An important appliance in the kitchen is the rangehood. Rangehoods need flues and ducting. In older homes in particular, consideration needs to be taken with the placement of the rangehood. Is the flue through an external wall or the roof? Is the recycled air through the cabinets or the ceiling? If there is a suspended concrete slab above it may be necessary to incorporate a bulkhead to allow for ducting to run through. If the current layout of the kitchen is functional, then try and keep all the new appliances and sink in the same location. This will save you money on plumbing and electrical.
Considering the style and look of the kitchen is the fun part! Don’t always follow trends. Remember that the kitchen is usually here to stay for a long time so choosing a style, colour and overall look that will stand the test of time is really important. Colours and materials that are timeless will also appeal to a broader range of people should you go to sell the home in the future.
There are so many products out there and people can get confused with which materials to use. Sometimes it may come down to budget. Assess what your needs and wants are and what is really necessary. My advice would be to start with the benchtop. The benchtop is the most used part of any kitchen, so investing in good quality tops such as engineered stone is important. Another common mistake people make is that they have not done enough research into the maintenance of their chosen material. Although engineered stone is not porous, care still needs to be taken with heat. You cannot place a hot pot down directly onto the stone as it will crack. You will be surprised as to how many people do this, and believe me replacing a stone top is not cheap! If you are guilty of this then ask the supplier for a small off cut of the same material and place this near the stove. It will blend in with the bench top and if need be you may use this for hot plates and pots. Should it crack you can replace the off cut at no cost! Other materials to be mindful of are natural stones such as marble. Marble is porous which means it will stain easily and needs to be sealed every few months.
Be mindful of the overall style of the home and how the kitchen will flow from one room to the other. Ultimately choose a look or style that you are comfortable with and will compliment the rest of the interior of the home. If the rest of the home has been renovated into a more modern style, then do the same for the kitchen. If the home has a more traditional feel, then putting an ultra modern kitchen will make it look clumsy and inconsistent with the rest of the home. Think of the kitchen as just another room that should flow and blend in with the rest of the interior.
BEFORE - WEST PERTH APARTMENT REDESIGN: “This client wanted to maximise storage options so the kitchen layout was designed with this in mind,” says Yasmin. “We did a complete renovation and had a relatively small kitchen space to work with. We went for an industrial modern style as being in such close proximity to the city we felt this would complement the location and the client being a young professional. This project was lots of fun!'”
I would always recommend sticking to neutral tones for the cabinets and benchtops. Remember that the kitchen is usually here to stay for a long time and a colour that is trendy at the moment may not be so trendy in a year or two. Neutral doesn’t have to mean boring, think about contrast. You can still add your own personality to the kitchen with artwork, accessories and personal items. It is easier to change these things around from time to time then to change the cabinets if you change your mind later on. If quirky is your style then be creative with the splashback. Again it is easier to change just the splashback then changing the cabinets or bench tops.
As with any other room in the home, good lighting is vital. If there is not enough natural light, sufficient artificial lighting needs to be incorporated. In a kitchen that means there needs to be task lighting (generally above the sink and preparation areas) and general lighting in the room. Another common mistake people make is that the lighting is an afterthought and has not been factored into the budget. Discuss this early on with the electrician who is installing the appliances so that they may include lighting installation into their quote. This way you will save time as it will get done at the same time the kitchen is being installed. As a general rule there should be at least six sources of light in any given room, including the kitchen.
10. Seek advice.
My last bit of advice would be to engage a professional! Small mistakes may be very costly in the end so if you are not confident enough in doing the job yourself, then engaging a professional may save you a lot of time and money in the long term. At Lead Design we work closely with our clients to understand their vision and point things out that they may not have even thought about. We design and project management the entire process. By using our service, and as an independent professional designer, we will potentially save you thousands of dollars.
Stuck on your kitchen and wondering whether to renovate? Or is your kitchen fine – but something else in your house is bugging you? Or are you building a new home and would like some architectural design advice?
You can win a free one hour consultation with Yasmin of Lead Design valued at $120, where she will come out to your home and discuss and give expert design advice on anything you like, from styling your house to paint advice to redesigning your kitchen or bathroom. Or if you are building, you can pick Yasmin’s brain. Whatever your interior design dilemma she will help you come up with a solution.
All you have to do is leave a comment below telling me something you would LOVE to have in your dream kitchen. You can also earn an additional entry in the draw by liking Lead Design on Facebook here.
1. Winner must be living in the Perth metro area.
2. The consultation is valid for six months.
3. Entries close Wednesday February 26, 2014.
Yasmin is also offering House Nerd readers 20 percent off a kitchen design, where she works with the clients to redesign the new kitchen, provide CAD drawings of the design and project manage the installation - yup, and project managing isn't easy! Normally valued at $950, House Nerd readers can get this awesome service for $760. Just mention House Nerd when getting in touch. You can visit Leah Design on their website or email Yasmin at [email protected]
Good luck entering! My answer - my dream kitchen would have a dishwasher… yes we don’t have one… and I know, I don’t ask for much hey?! Maya x
Posted: Thursday, February 13, 2014 in Guest Nerd . Tagged: design , designer , kitchen , renovating , Yasmin Drake
I love receiving your comments!
Gill - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 8:48AM
I would love to have a Butler's Kitchen in my dream kitchen....I love how you can stash all your "messy" appliances and cooking paraphernalia from prying (judging?) eyes and have this beautiful, minimalist bench on which you can do a Nigella Lawson (without the cocaine, of course!!)
Linda Slater - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 8:54AM
Great article with excellent design information. Beautiful kitchens!
Lisa Hannaford - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 8:59AM
I'd die with happiness if I could get some amazing wall tile happening - my kitchen is badly in need of a makeover and it's on my to-do list this year. I dream of self closing draws and a larger island bench and a better pantry and oh my, I could go on for hours.
Annette - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 9:44AM
I would love a scullery wall behind sliding doors in my kitchen so I can still cook and prepare in the kitchen itself but hide the mess away when visitors arrive
Deborah - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 10:12AM
I would love a Wolf oven so I can cook a Thanksgiving turkey with all the trimming, but where can I cut corners to make a new kitchen affordable????
Nik - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 10:25AM
I would definately want a personal chef in my dream kitchen! : )
jasmin balfe - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 12:39PM
More Space! We are renovating and would love more space in our new kitchen!
Mel - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 2:01PM
We are renovating and my kitchen will move into an open plan area that is central to the other living areas and part of my outdoor / indoor theme. I seriously need some design ideas to ensure my new kitchen looks great and works well in this central position.
Emily - Friday, February 14, 2014 at 11:18PM
So many things for my dream kitchen but definitely a large walk in pantry or better yet a scullery!
Lady Susan - Saturday, February 15, 2014 at 1:52AM
I would love a dishwasher and a home for my Kitchenaid! We are planning to renovate the kitchen this year - so excited!
Andrew - Sunday, February 16, 2014 at 12:23PM
A double or extra wide oven so my wife can bake double the amount of delicious cookies she makes.
Kris - Sunday, February 16, 2014 at 12:40PM
A pantry is a non negotiable for me. I still feel like I'm living in my one bedroom London flat with its tiny kitchen!!!
Barbara - Sunday, February 16, 2014 at 1:16PM
We have a 1935 Federation style house with 3 metre ceilings throughout the house, including the kitchen. Love to retain the Federation theme in the kitchen with plenty of storage and modern appliances.
Mel - Monday, February 17, 2014 at 5:55PM
I'd like to have Chris Hemsworth in my dream kitchen. Oops, did I type that out loud? Hubby might not be happy with that so my second choice would be an ocean view in my kitchen. Yep, still dreaming!
Maya from House Nerd - Tuesday, February 18, 2014 at 2:48PM
I am LOVING reading all your comments everyone! Ocean views, personal chef, a scullery, Chris Hemsworth... not bad not bad. There's still time to enter with entries closing on Wed February 26th if you haven't entered yet :)
Lauren - Thursday, February 20, 2014 at 10:10AM
As I have a small kitchen with limited space, I would love a small nook with a retractible door of some sort, so that I can hide away the kettle and toaster! : )
Rebecca - Thursday, February 20, 2014 at 4:05PM
I would love to have extra bench space and storage through the creation of an island bench that can serve as a breakfast bar as well. Like having people chat to me while I'm cooking in the kitchen. :)
Jessie - Tuesday, February 25, 2014 at 9:10PM
I am so happy I got in just in time! We are about to settle on our first home but as it's a 70s design it needs a lot of work. This would be the perfect thing to kick start our renovation and design plans, so fingers crossed!
Blum Australia - Sunday, June 8, 2014 at 9:13PM
It is very important that you plan your kitchen designs before renovations.
Plumber Kingsford - Tuesday, October 7, 2014 at 8:25PM
"I would love a scullery wall behind sliding doors in my kitchen so I can still cook and prepare in the kitchen itself but hide the mess away when visitors arrive" me too.
Ashleigh - Wednesday, February 25, 2015 at 7:32PM
I'd love to see less pink laminate in my kitchen!
NathanDavidson - Tuesday, September 29, 2015 at 3:43PM
This article really was quite enlightening! This is the first I’m hearing about the triangle and I think it REALLY makes sense! After working out the 3 important prep areas, I guess the only thing left to do is make sure you have enough storage for all the pots and pans! Haha!
Danni Black - Friday, January 27, 2017 at 3:15AM
I really like your tip about thinking about what you don't like when it comes to renovating your kitchen. My husband and I have been thinking about talking with a few kitchen designers to help us with our project so we will be sure to keep these tips in mind. Hopefully, we can find something that will work out for us, thank you for sharing!
Taylor Bishop - Friday, June 30, 2017 at 9:17PM
Wow, it's interesting to think that I had never considered a work triangle, and how ideal it is to have in a kitchen. Having the sink, fridge/pantry, and cooker close together seems really efficient. Thanks for the advice!
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Picture this: Editor turned agent and author of The Forest for the Trees, Betsy Lerner staring out at a sea of writers. Positioned carefully in her hands she holds a telescope, causing her vision to focus right at the core, the muse-igniters of the writing soul. I’m there. No, not there. I’m on the other side of the ocean. Do you see me with the jeans and the wool sweater? I’m holding something too. It’s shaped like a telescope, but it’s not a telescope. As I squint my eye to peer inside my handheld device I see twirling colors, spinning pinwheels and shapes and sheer mystery. My kaleidoscope is aimed back at the agents/editors conversing on the other side. I don’t have a clear view of what their lives entail—yet. Yet.
But in Betsy’s book her description of why a writer writes hits upon a proverbial goldmine.
“As far as I can tell people write for exactly two reasons: 1) They are compelled to, and 2) they want to be loved.”
She goes on to write later in the chapter, “Writers want love, and they hope that through their work, they will be recognized as special. And that is why most writers are so crazy. When a writer gives his editor the pages of his manuscript, he is, in essence, handing over his heart on a plate. And until he gets a response, his entire sense of himself is in limbo. It’s like waiting for the results of a biopsy.”
We know how accurately Betsy described the two reasons. Here’s your chance. Give me two reasons why you write.
*photos by flickr
**Blogging friend, Katie Ganshert got the call from her "dream" agent! Praise God.
By Wendy Paine Miller - November 11, 2009
25 comments:
Eileen Astels Watson November 11, 2009 at 5:20 AM
Why I write? Because I'm compelled to now, though I wasn't always. And, to try and figure me out and grow me. I learn more and more about myself with every story I write, and I do try and fix myself too.
YAY for Katie. I'm so excited for her!!!
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Terri Tiffany November 11, 2009 at 5:32 AM
I write because of my love for writing--it makes me saner:) good therapy . . .and because I want to make a difference with my words. I love those pictures!
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Tamika: November 11, 2009 at 5:53 AM
Wonderful post Wendy! I almost bought this book last week, looks like I need to go ahead and make this purchase.
Two reasons...I believe God called me to write. I love writing, I feel complete.
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I write to minister to the hurting. I write because if I didn't, I think I would stop breathing.
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Janna Leadbetter November 11, 2009 at 6:33 AM
You know what? This fits me. I think those are my two reasons.
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Susan R. Mills November 11, 2009 at 7:03 AM
Yeah, that pretty much sums it up.
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Cassandra Frear November 11, 2009 at 7:20 AM
I do not write for either of these reasons. Here's why I write:
1. I love the written word. It is a gift of God. In creating writing, we reflect Him. We show that we are indeed made in His image. Writing is an act of worship, an offering back to the Maker of words and Creator of life and meaning.
2. I have been called to express truth, meaning, and beauty through the written word. Yes, doing what God has called me to do brings joy, but I would do it without that, because ultimately, He himself is my joy.
3. I write to manifest God's life to others -- to encourage, to instruct, to illuminate, to inspire, to comfort, to heal, to bind up the brokenhearted, to set free. I write to speak for others, to bring clarity and hope, to make a difference. For all these things, I hope and write.
I do not write out of some mysterious compelling, inner force. I do not write to be loved. On the contrary, I expect to feel discouraged, to feel that I don't want to do it on many days, and to experience some rejection and criticism for my work. I also understand and accept that everyone will not like my work. That doesn't mean that it isn't valid.
In short, I know that my strength and my heart may fail, but God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. He is my reward.
I love writing, because it is all these things to me.
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Wendy Paine Miller November 11, 2009 at 7:53 AM
I appreciate learning your reasons.
Cassandra, You make a beautiful point. I'm glad you wrote that in detail.
I know I could very much relate to Betsy's words. But for me, as for probably all of us there are far more than two reasons. On my website I wrote, "I write to understand who I am. I love to let go of who I am. I live to represent Him." For me, that about sums it up.
Hope the conversation continues and the reasons keep coming in...
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Ava Walker Jenkins November 11, 2009 at 8:13 AM
I would have to agree with the two reasons but I would add one other reason: "my mom is making me!" I mean "encouraging" me. :-) She is my biggest fan an mothers do have a way of guiding us to the path where we belong.
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Tana November 11, 2009 at 8:19 AM
God has put this burning desire in my heart. Most likely to teach me a lesson per usual. But also to bless me big time per usual ;)
And two? I love it.
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Rosslyn Elliott November 11, 2009 at 8:37 AM
I'll just give one.
"...Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or praiseworthy--think about such things."
Writing allows me to obey this instruction. I hope it will one day allow readers to do so.
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Keli Gwyn November 11, 2009 at 9:01 AM
Betsy's book sounds great. I'll have to check it out.
I write because I communicate best through the written word and because the act of writing brings me joy. Whether my creation is a note to my husband, a letter to a friend or a novel length story, I take great pleasure in putting words on paper or screen.
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Jessica Nelson November 11, 2009 at 10:20 AM
I write because I like to! But also because I want to make a career out of it. :-)
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Deborah Ann November 11, 2009 at 10:43 AM
Reason #1 God told me to
Reason #2 I need a way to give birth to the creativity within. I love being alone, but you put a pen in my hand and a piece of paper, and I'm talking to someone...yeah. I'm crazy!
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Danyelle L. November 11, 2009 at 12:04 PM
That was awesome, Wendy. Thanks for sharing. It makes sense why writing is such a personal, personal thing.
My two reasons: 1) To make the imaginary people happy. They can get pretty grumpy if they feel like I've been ignoring them for too long. 2) Because it helps me sort myself and my world out. Life is messy, and writing is one way for me to organize it. :D
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Joanne November 11, 2009 at 12:46 PM
I'm intrigued with the way words communicate. I love the whole process, finding the magic to build a story, sentiment, essence, with just the right words. Really I don't think there's anything else I'd choose to do.
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I write because it's my gift.
I write in gratitude the Person Who gave me this gift, and every other gift I have of any worth.
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Cindy R. Wilson November 11, 2009 at 2:01 PM
I write because I love it, because it feels natural to get stories out on paper and bring life to characters that would otherwise exist only in my mind or not at all. And it's so rewarding to use God's words to make an impact, to get out a message that might bring something profound to someone's life.
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Karen November 11, 2009 at 2:29 PM
ooo, good book. I'll put that on my list. Why write? I'm not sure, it's just there. Because I read, or want to share, or feel it's a way to minister? I just do, as the kids say, "just 'cus."
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Ellie Kings November 11, 2009 at 4:00 PM
I write because I recently discovered that here lies my heart... it is my passion!
The purpose for writing my first novel is simply for my very own healing. The story is my own. Every chapter will be a step closer to that healing. And once the book is finished, I'll close the book on all those hurts.
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Wendy Paine Miller November 11, 2009 at 4:35 PM
I'm going to write a group response tonight. Lots going on. Will share more tomorrow. I thank you for letting me on the inspiration for why you write. Ultimately I desire for my writing to be prompted from God and for it to glorify God. The novel I'm working on right now does not have the word God in it, but it does explore many spiritual themes. I'll tell you more about that someday soon.
Thanks for continuing to walk around in my thoughts. I enjoy the company. My characters do too. :D
I hope your night is different than any other and mostly due to the way you decide to think about things...
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Katie Ganshert November 11, 2009 at 5:09 PM
Whoa...those two reasons really hit home for me. As much as I'd love to say I only write because I'm comprelled to write (which I am), there is definitely a part of me that wants to be loved. Why is this, when I already know that I'm loved by God? Completely and wholey loved, more than I could imagine? Why do I still yearn for other people to love me too?
Can't wait to read your stuff, Wendy! Thanks for celebrating with me today. I just got The Forest Through the Trees in the mail from Amazon. Super excited to read it!
Also, the song that is playing right now is one of my FAVorites! We love the same music!
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Heather Sunseri November 11, 2009 at 6:40 PM
I write 1) to escape and 2) to create stories. I love it!
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Beth Mann November 11, 2009 at 7:13 PM
The first reason is definitely true, I feel like I HAVE to write. The second one, I'd never really given much though to, but it makes TOTAL sense. This book sounds so interesting...I think I'm going to check it out!
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As always, I appreciate your honesty.
I guess I sort of agree with Betsy -- just from years of watching and observing writers in a variety of settings. I was a news reporter for many years, and the drive was constantly there to land on Page One and to receive the accolades of readers and editors. I felt that desire, too.
And now, when I teach writing at the college level, I see this in most of my students.
I don't think it's entirely wrong. For God created in us the desire to be loved. But I think we have to constantly keep in mind our motivations. Are we writing for the approval of man, or to give glory to God?
Great, great post, Wendy.
You make me think. Keep at it, my friend. God has plans for you. I'm praising Him in advance for the ways He'll use your writing.
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| 11,821 |
Chelsea Women play their first away game of the new Barclays Women’s Super League season on Sunday against Brighton and Hove Albion, and the Blues hope to build on their triumph from last weekend. Here we have all the background information ahead of the 2pm kick-off…
Kick-off is 2pm.
The venue is the People's Pension Stadium, the home of Crawley Town FC.
The Blues kicked off the WSL campaign with a well-deserved victory against newly-promoted Tottenham Hotspur. The game finished 1-0 and was held at Stamford Bridge in front of a crowd that was five times more than our record home crowd. It was last season’s top goal scorer, Bethany England, who put us ahead inside five minutes. Her fine left-footed strike from 30 yards out flew into the top corner beyond former Blue, Becky Spencer.
Brighton and Hove Albion began their second season in the top flight with a goalless draw away to Bristol City. The Sussex side had a first-half penalty saved and although it is still early days, one point on the board for Brighton is a positive as they target finishing higher than their ninth-place finish last season.
This will be our fifth match against Brighton, with the Blues winning all four previous encounters. The last time we crossed paths was in December 2018 when we came away as 4-0 winners. The goals were late in the second half when Magdalena Eriksson flicked home her effort and Bethany England headed in the second soon after. Then Ji So-Yun, who had set up that goal, tidily finished an excellent move in the 77th minute to put us 3-0 up. England added a fourth in stoppage time with a clinical finish.
Three months prior to that we hosted the Seagulls at Kingsmeadow and recorded our maiden triumph of the WSL, courtesy of first-half goals from Fran Kirby and Erin Cuthbert. Kirby volleyed brilliantly on 32 minutes and almost immediately Cuthbert doubled the Blues’ lead with a sublime strike.
Our first competitive fixture of that season came against Brighton in the Continental Tyres League Cup and although we eventually ran out as winners, it required a defensive mistake for Drew Spence to open the scoring on the stroke of half-time. Our performance was more fluid after the break, with Kirby deservedly extending our advantage with a typical poacher's finish, but there was a nervy end when the visitors pulled a goal back late on through Aileen Whelan. However, England headed home with two minutes remaining to ensure we began the season with a victory.
In the 2017/18 season, before the Seagulls became a full-time outfit in the WSL, we travelled to meet them in the Continental Tyres Cup and once again it was the Blues who emerged victorious. Kirby volleyed us ahead after only 13 minutes and late goals from former Blue Crystal Dunn and Ji completed the scoring.
Those not travelling can keep up to date with how the match unfolds via our social media channels. There will be live text commentary on our Twitter page, regular updates on Facebook and for behind-the-scenes footage, make sure you check out our matchday Instagram Story. Simply search 'ChelseaFCW' on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram.
The match will also be shown on The FA Player, a new free live streaming platform, exclusively dedicated to women’s football.
Emma Hayes selected defender Magdalena Eriksson as Chelsea’s 2019/20 captain in place of the retired Karen Carney. Eriksson joined Chelsea in 2017 and has been a regular in the side - she started more matches than any other player in the 2018/19 season.
See the Blues in action at our KT1 home for the first time this season on Sunday 22 September in the Continental Tyres Cup against West Ham United.
Season tickets are still available for just £49 for the whole season. Junior fans (aged under 20) as well as senior fans (aged 65 or over) can enjoy the whole season for just £5!
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In my blog post of August 9, I commented on the Oprah incident in Zurich which has been dubbed Täschligate (handbag-gate) in Switzerland. While “Oprah-Gate” has long been dropped from short-lived news cycles around the world, the story continues to unfold in Switzerland. And here the story becomes interesting: how does a small country process the scolding and humiliation by the global media?
Here is a brief synopsis: Oprah entered an exclusive Zurich boutique, asked to see a very expensive handbag, but being turned down by the sales clerk with the remark that this item would be too expensive for her. This at least is Oprah’s version of the story. The story was picked up by news outlets around the world after Oprah’s high-profile interviews with Entertainment Tonight and with Larry King, and Oprah’s interpretation of this incident as racially motivated was uncritically accepted and disseminated. In my first blog post, I concurred that there was a racial component to the story, and in spite of some unresolved discrepancies I have not changed my mind.
There have been multiple responses in Switzerland, and the bulk of them focused on discrediting Oprah on some level and thus on putting her credibility in question. One commentator bluntly claimed that she couldn’t sing nor act and that her only true skill was self-presentation. The most common response is to frame Oprah as a petulant and narcissistic star who was irritated by the fact that she was not recognized in an upscale boutique–which is used to dealing with celebrities–and that her show does not have any traction in Switzerland.
First, there was a tearjerker of an interview in the Swiss tabloid Blick with the sales clerk–who was idendified as Adriana N.–with the title “I have not been able to sleep for days!” It is a full-blown victim narrative–“I feel like I am in the center of a hurricane.” Adriana remembers that Oprah entered the store accompanied by a man (Oprah claims to have gone shopping alone). In Adriana’s version of the story, she showed Oprah a handbag from the Jennifer Aniston line and explained that they existed in different sizes and materials. In Adriana’s account, Oprah eyed the expensive crocodile skin bag on top of the shelf: “I told her that this is the same bag like the one I was holding in my hand at the time. Only that that one was much more expensive. I would be happy to show her other bags.” The uncontested fact is that Adriana did not take down the expensive bag even though Oprah showed an interest in it and that Adriana tried to steer Oprah towards less expensive bags.
Trudie Götz, the owner of the boutique, in her own interview with Blick, admits that Adriana committed one mistake by not having taken the bag off the shelf and handed it to Oprah. When Adriana mentioned the price to Oprah, she felt bad about it, according to Götz. Why would you feel bad about stating a price in an upscale shop–unless of course you believed that the item was way out of the person’s price range. So Oprah’s reaction seems justified: she indeed was profiled by Adriana and considered not worthy of being shown this very expensive bag. Was racism a factor? Götz, flatly denied that, adding: “I am sorry, but perhaps she [Oprah] is a bit too sensitive in this regard.” Götz unwittingly points to the inverse as the real problem: if you are white, you don’t have to concern yourself with issues of race.
This is the mainstream interpretation of this event in Switzerland. Even the speedy apology to Oprah by Switzerland Tourism, Switzerland’s heavily subsidized tourism office, now is being criticized in Switzerland. Rino Büchel, a member of parliament representing the populist-right Swiss People’s Party (SVP), is demanding to know how this “bizarre apology” came about. Even Daniela Bär, the spokesperson for Switzerland Tourism who had tweeted the apology, is now backpedaling, stating that the apology was premature, too emotional and provided an unfortunate interpretation of the event. Büchel in the meantime increased the pressure by promising a parliamentary investigation of Switzerland Tourism’s original apology, stressing that too many outside of Switzerland were confounding Switzerland Tourism with the country itself and read this as a national admission of guilt. Unfortunately, the headline in Britain’s The Telegraph bears this out: “Switzerland apologises to Oprah Winfrey over handbag incident.” And Politico reported: “The Swiss government and the boutique apologized, trying to tamp down what had a become a worldwide story.”
One of the more bizarre commentaries by Martin Sturzenegger in the Zurich daily Tages-Anzeiger focuses on the object of desire: the handbag, made from crocodile skin and with a SFr. 35,000 ($38,000) price tag. For this handbag, the skins of three crocodiles were used who were raised under horrible conditions in a crocodile farm, as the linked PETA video narrated by actor Joaquin Phoenix graphically shows. Sturzenegger points out that PETA, the animal rights organization, named Oprah the person of the year in 2008 because she made her large audience aware of the systemic abuse of animals in industrial settings. Based on the handbag incident, Heinz Lienhard, the president of the Swiss animal rights organization, declared that Oprah was not a true protector of animals. So Sturzenegger’s take is that Oprah is a phony animal lover with a pathological desire for publicity. The problem with this argument: Oprah just wanted to see the bag; she never expressed the desire to buy it.
The most recent line of argumentation in the Tages_Anzeiger and in Blick is that Oprah created a big stir around this incident to promote the new movie “The Butler” in which she has a starring role. Granted, Oprah knows how to generate publicity and how to stage herself. But the article in Politico–on which this theory is based–more generally argues that “Oprah Winfrey is stepping back into politics,” mentioning her discussion of the Zurich incident as one example and only in passing.
All of these responses are typical for a small state that sees itself exposed to massive criticism from abroad. In moments like these, defending national interests trumps introspection and reasoned debate. Even Martine Brunschwig Graf, the president of the federal commission against racism (Eidgenössische Kommission gegen Rassismus), condemned the efforts by mostly foreign media outlets to turn an ego problem into a racism problem, as she put it.
But in the French-speaking part of Switzerland, the response seems to be more moderate. A piece in the Lausanne daily 24 heures, entitled “Oprah Winfrey finds Switzerland racist, and our black community does as well,” takes this opportunity to reflect on racism in Switzerland. Celeste Ugochukwu, the president of the Conseil de la Diaspora africaine de Suisse (CDAS), stated in the article that racial discrimination was common in Switzerland–but more so in the German-speaking part. André Loembe, vice president of a different immigrant organization, diagnosed a rising anti-Black attitude in Switzerland since the early 2000s. The federal commission against racism in a 2010 report confirmed a rise in anti-Black and anti-Muslim incidents. Loembe further expressed his view that Swiss anti-racism laws should be used to prosecute the sales clerk. If you are black in Switzerland, it is a lot easier to see the racial component of Oprah’s handbag incident.
Some progressive politicians take a more critical perspective as well. In an interview with the German news magazine FOCUS, the social democratic politician Andreas Gross recognized a “combination of an inflated self-importance of being Swiss (Selbstüberwertung des Schweizer-Seins) and a strange provincial attitude in contact with foreigners.” In his view, this paradox between competency in foreign trade and inability to deal with foreigners in their own country is poorly understood in Switzerland and not part of a critical self-examination.
The context of increasing hostility towards immigrants in Switzerland also is hard to overlook. Most notable are popular votes against the construction of new minarets in November 2009 and for tightening asylum laws in June 2013. In July, allegations of inhuman treatment of asylum seekers in some Swiss towns became public. In the affluent town of Bremgarten, for instance, asylum seekers have been banned from the public pool and from local sports facilities–this town of 6,500 people has created a total of 32 exclusion zones where asylum seekers are not allowed to go.
So the Oprah incident is just the tip of the iceberg. It reveals a country that feels pressured by immigration and that is deeply troubled by the rapid demographic transformation unleashed by immigration. It also reveals just how clumsy and insecure the Swiss debate about race is. Moreover, it reveals the typical collective small-state defensive reflexes against any perceived threat from the outside that render a national debate toxic. In a more recent interview, Oprah showed a surprising insight into this issue: “It’s not an indictment against the country or even that store. It was just one person who didn’t want to offer me the opportunity to see the bag. So no apologies necessary from the country of Switzerland. If somebody makes a mistake in the United States do we apologize in front of the whole country? No!” The Swiss would do well to take this to heart.
This entry was posted in Small States and tagged Daniela Bär, Heinz Lienhard, Martine Brunschwig Graf, Oprah, Oprah Winfrey, Rino Büchel, small state, Swiss, Switzerland, Switzerland Tourism, Täschligate, Trudie Götz on August 13, 2013 by Peter Hess.
Racist Attitudes in Switzerland? The Tales of two African-American Women
Oprah traveled to Zurich, Switzerland, recently to attend the wedding of Tina Turner who has lived in the tony Zurich suburb of Küsnacht since 1995. Earlier this year, Turner made the headlines for accepting Swiss citizenship while simultaneously renouncing her US citizenship, presumably for tax reasons. The US has the questionable distinction of being the only industrialized country that taxes its citizens who reside abroad. (One would wish that the US would apply similar standards to US corporations, but that is a different matter.) Taxes aside, Turner seems to be genuinely at ease in Switzerland: “I’m very happy in Switzerland and I feel at home here. […] I cannot imagine a better place to live,” Turner reportedly told the Swiss tabloid Blick.
Oprah, her wedding guest, had a different story to tell to Entertainment Tonight. Oprah apparently entered the exclusive boutique Trois Pommes (which Oprah refused to identify) in downtown Zurich by herself, without any of her handlers. She asked to see a handbag with a SFr. 35,000 ($38,000) price tag. According to Oprah, the sales person replied, “No, it’s too expensive!” When Oprah further insisted on seeing that bag, the woman at the store replied, “No, no, you don’t want to see that one, you want to see this one, because that one would cost too much and you would not be able to afford that.” The employee then proceeded to show Oprah other, less expensive handbags. After three unsuccessful attempts, Oprah apparently left the store without making a scene and without pulling “the black card,” as she put it.
Upscale shopping street in the historic heart of Zurich
In the interview, Oprah was clearly annoyed because her star power apparently has not reached tiny Switzerland yet: “I didn’t have my eyelashes on, but I was in full Oprah Winfrey gear. I had my little Donna Karan skirt and my little sandals. But obviously The Oprah Winfrey Show is not shown in Zurich. So this does not happen to me unless somebody obviously does not know it is me.”
It is unfortunate that this narcissistic display of injured vanity obfuscates the matter. It has allowed commentators in Switzerland to focus on the hissy fit by a narcissistic international entertainer–as a commentary entitled “Die verletzte Narzisstin” (the injured narcissist) in the respected Zurich daily Tages-Anzeiger did. This line of argumentation enables commentators to deny that there is any racism at issue in this scandal that now is referred to as “Täschligate” (handbag-gate) in Switzerland. As in the cases of the Nazi Gold and the bank secret, Switzerland again sees itself exposed to a barrage of international accusations, and the gut reaction is to circle the wagons–a posture that is common when small states see themselves exposed to massive criticism and pressure from abroad. And Oprah delivered all the arguments for this defensive posture.
This also is unfortunate because Oprah clearly has had a positive impact on young black women around the world. In a visit to South Africa some years ago, a group of young women from Limpopo province glowingly told us how Oprah is a role model for them who as a person of color and as a woman made it in a world dominated by white men.
But Oprah is right that this incident would not have happened if the sales clerk had recognized her as a celebrity. Which brings up the question why it did happen. Trudie Götz, the owner of the boutique, in an interview with the Swiss tabloid Blick framed this as a “misunderstanding” due to the imperfect command of English of her employee and claimed that her employee meant well, acted correctly and in no way displayed racial prejudices. She further stated that she sees no reason to fire her sales person. Ironically, Ms. Götz was an invited guest at the Turner wedding as well.
If the sales clerk acted correctly by not showing a handbag to a customer deemed undeserving, business policies and practices come into focus. It is obvious that the profiling of customers in this boutique is standard procedure and that sales people are trained to profile customers–a practice that was confirmed by other upscale Zurich retailers. But what are the criteria for this profile? Obviously, the perceived ability to pay is key, and race factors into that in a major way. Furthermore, the rabid denials of racism by so many Swiss commentators imply that race indeed is a major underlying issue. Switzerland just in recent years has been forced to deal with a multi-racial society. Switzerland still lacks any authoritative mainstream voices–like Oprah–who can talk about race from a minority viewpoint. As the clumsy and insensitive commentaries in the Swiss press indicate, the Swiss have a long way to go to develop an understanding of the subtle ways of racism in our globalized world.
In the meantime, Switzerland Tourism, Switzerland’s official tourism office, showed outrage over the scandal, apparently fearing damage to its brand. International tourism in Switzerland has been in decline over the past few years, and the perception is that this scandal is not helpful. Daniela Bär, the spokesperson for Switzerland Tourism, offered a speedy apology to Oprah, reducing the issue to a clumsy salesperson who acted inappropriately. This also seems to be the view of other retailers in Zurich–again denying any systemic issues this scandal seems to have revealed. It is evident that Switzerland Tourism and other commercial interests would like the world to see Switzerland through Tina Turner’s eyes rather than Oprah Winfrey’s.
Note: see my later post, published on August 13, 2013, entitled Oprah Creates a Stir: Switzerland’s Small-State Response
This entry was posted in Small States and tagged Daniela Bär, handbag, Oprah, Oprah Winfrey, race, racism, racist, Switzerland, Switzerland Tourism, Täschligate, Tina Turner, Trudie Götz, Zurich on August 9, 2013 by Peter Hess.
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Ominous storm reports continued coming over weather radar to the operational officers. Captain Calhoun issued orders to inspect and to secure everything, getting the ship into heavy weather readiness. We made all ammunition cabinets water tight, set depth chargers in safe position, secured life rafts, and put the motor whaleboat in ready position to use for survivors if needed. While we made these preparations, the waves became more and more treacherous. The ship began rolling violently from side to side. It was then that Captain Calhoun commanded that all crew not on duty, go below to living quarters, prepare to weather the storm, and “batten down all hatches.” With a feeling of impending doom, I followed the engine crew below to our quarters. Standing without holding on to something was impossible. We dodged flying objects as they flew from side to side crashing into bulkheads! We slammed into one another and smashed into the surrounding steel walls and machinery! Our commanding officer screamed at us to lash ourselves to our bunks or stanchions to prevent injuries. At that time we had no real idea how critical the storm had become—or that it was a “typhoon-class” storm, but panic began to set in. Men were praying already and praying loudly. We had no way of climbing up to look at the sky, but we didn’t need to. We knew instinctively what was happening, and it was happening quickly with the violent rolling of the ship. In minutes salt water covered the floor of our compartment. The generator suddenly failed. We lashed ourselves down in whatever way we could manage and became captives of the storm, unable to move. The engineers on duty in the engine room had absolutely no control of the ship. In naval terms, the ship was going into “irons.” In plain language, the ship’s crew had lost control, and the weather had taken over. The steering had to be tackled manually from the aft steering quarters where water was also rising quickly. The steering crew took turns pumping water out of the steering quarters in order to attempt to steer the ship by hand. The deafening roar of the wind along with the intense, unrelenting rolling of the ship worsened minute by minute. Helpless, we hung on to our leather straps and belts in the dark recesses of our iron ship in a huge ocean in the middle of a raging typhoon. Bound to my bunk with leather straps, I shut my eyes tightly to block out the storm raging around me and to ward off the panic I was feeling. I saw my mother in my mind’s eye. “Mom,” I called out to her. “Mom, help me!” No one could hear me call out. I hoped she could hear me.
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In 1943, Robert Loyd was a sixteen-year-old without a driver’s license or a car who had just moved to St. Louis from the countryside. The Uncle Sam Wants You! posters hanging in every public building enticed him to lie about his age and join the fight. After graduating from the program at Farragut Naval Training Station, he was assigned to overhauling the USS Dewey, a destroyer, in Bremerton, Washington. When the Dewey was deemed seaworthy, his group received orders to join the Third Fleet in the Pacific and arrived in Honolulu in October 1943. The next months were spent in and around Ulithi atoll in the Western Caroline Islands, protecting and escorting the fleet’s carriers, tankers, and cruisers. In December 1944, the Dewey weathered a powerful typhoon, her crew lashed to their bunks or to stanchions, as the ship was tossed by winds and rain and finally righted itself after an eighty-degree roll. After repairs, the ship rejoined the fleet in February 1945 and supported the invasion of Iwo Jima. The Dewey was decommissioned in October 1945, and the author returned to civilian life in May 1946.
About the Author
Robert J. Loyd is a first-time author at eighty-eight. His naval experiences are archived at the Admiral Nimitz Museum, Fredericksburg, Texas. In 2013 he participated with WWII veterans in an Honor Flight to Washington, DC. After eighty-seven years in St. Louis and his wife’s death, Mr. Loyd moved to a retirement community in Savannah, Georgia, near his son and daughter-in-law (his coauthor). Donna J. Loyd a retired high school teacher, taught English and directed a nationally-recognized writing program for teachers in Columbia, Missouri, As a writing consultant, she conducted workshops and seminars at state, national, and international conferences. After moving to Savannah, she taught creative writing at Savannah Christian Preparatory School and presently serves as associate director of the Coastal Savannah Writing Project.
This is a wonderful WWII memoir about a miracle that occurred to a U.S. Navy Pacific Destroyer. A fun and informative read of a real life sailor’s adventure during the war. Written by my father and wife. You will enjoying reading this inspirational memoir.
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Ray Hobson and Vernon Maxson were the leaders who made Perrydale Domestic Water Association a reality. They had the vision and drive to start and keep building until we had a real drinking water system.
Today PDWA has about 200 miles of pipe that covers from the southern border of Sheridan to the northern border of Dallas and east to Lincoln and just a bit west of Salt Creek Store on Highway 22.
PDWA has an average of 2 meters per mile compared to 200 or more meters per mile of pipeline that many cities have. PDWA covers about 145 square miles.
PDWA is a non-profit 501.c entity.
Ray had a history of excelling in what he attempted. He had many diverse careers in one lifetime. Those careers included helping to build Grand Coulee Dam, testing dairy cows, running his own dairy farm, developing a dairy program at Clatsop Community College and working at the Oregon State Department of Agriculture, where he became the Assistant Director of Agriculture.
In 1971 he became the driving force in developing a domestic water association to solve the shortage of good drinking water in the Perrydale area. Perrydale Domestic Water Association was born at the kitchen table of the Hobson residence. Ray along with his wife and partner Ellen, and a steering committee of other dedicated community members, worked long and hard to develop a well-managed and efficient water system. Ellen served as secretary at Perrydale Domestic Water Association until 2001. Ray devoted 39 years to Perrydale Domestic Water Association and to the development of quality drinking water for the future of not only the Perrydale Hills area, but for an expanded area covering several counties.
Ray was a devoted husband, father, grandfather and great grandfather. His family was very important to him. Ellen was his partner in life and work for 66 years. Ellen passed away in 2004.
Ray was loved, respected and an example to us all. Ray will be missed by many people.
Vernon was the man who people called when then needed help with water during the early years. As a farmer Vernon was in the area while during the early years of the 1970's Ray Hobson was still working in Salem at the Department of Agriculture during the day. The contribution to the community Vernon made was significant and appreciated by many whom had not had good water before PDWA was created by Vernon, Ray and many others. Today the Perrydale Hills area is a flourishing farm community that continues to work hard and focus on keeping the community strong.
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These photographs have been gathered by Sid Macken. If you have local historical images you think would add value, please email or call us.
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An email from a member who is wondering if there can be a role reversal within the difference aspects of the Higher Desire and Lower Desire framework. Specifically when it comes to confidence and the preconceived roles each gender plays in marriage.
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Speaker 1: You are listening to the regular version of Sexy Marriage Radio, smrnation.com.
Corey Allan: Welcome back to another episode of Sexy Marriage Radio. Where each and every week Pam and I get on the mic and talk to the nation, the entire nation.
Pam Allan: Wouldn't that be pretty sweet.
Corey Allan: It's kind of like Meet the Nation.
Corey Allan: Isn't there a show that... It's in Sunday mornings?
Pam Allan: Yeah, I don't think we want to be them. Yeah.
Corey Allan: You don't want to go to the political side of things.
Corey Allan: Agreed. Agreed, agreed.
Pam Allan: The sex topic is heated enough so-
Corey Allan: It's already happened in the political world way too much anyway.
Pam Allan: Yeah, we don't need that heat of politics.
Corey Allan: No, we don't. But this is Sexy Marriage Radio where each and every week we try to help out the nation and if you are listening to this episode you're part of the SMR nation and the way you can let us know what's going on in your world or questions that you may have. Let us know by calling us at 214-702-9565 as always the email out there is feedback@sexandmarriageradio.com, been around for over 10 years. That's still baffling to me, when I was sitting down for episode one and two and three which Gina and I recorded all at the same time. Who would've thought?
Pam Allan: It was pretty fun.
Corey Allan: Here's to decades more, right babe?
Pam Allan: Yeah, exactly.
Corey Allan: What we also ask of the nation is to help us spread the word. There's a couple different ways you can do this. If you listen via Apple Podcast or iTunes, jump on there, rate and review, leave a comment. Spotify you can rate the show. Android, Google Play whatever you can rate to show. Some of them will have possibilities of leaving comments. Audible, comment. Spread the word.
Pam Allan: Got it. Check.
Corey Allan: Are you doing that? Is that what you're saying, you're going to hop on and-
Corey Allan: Rate and review the show.
Pam Allan: Rate myself. All of them are from Pam A.
Corey Allan: Just to get out ahead of this thing while we're doing this show this week. This is the season of the year where I open up mastermind groups for husbands.
Corey Allan: So Man Of His Word Mastermind groups are going on ramping up to launch in mid August. So fellas if you are interested in taking a six month long journey with a bunch of other guys that have skin in the game to just be better men, husbands, fathers, friends. Send me an email corey@smrnation.com and let me know you're interested. I'll give you the next steps because there is a process to this. It's not just, "Hey I'm in. I'll pay the money and I'm in." No, there's some hoops you got to jump through.
Pam Allan: Your wife will thank you.
Corey Allan: Absolutely. Because the thing I still keep coming back to on this whole group... All the different groups we've been doing for over eight years now that I've been doing this. That I love it when a group gels to where the wife is saying, "Well what do your guys say about that? What do they think?" Because they know they've got some allies in their husband's corner and that's what this group is for is just, wrap up 2022 by making it a better you.
Corey Allan: Well coming up on today's regular free version of Sexy Marriage Radio, Pam and I are going to do a deep dive into the world of trust and trustworthiness and try to just look at it through a slightly different lens.
Corey Allan: Angles, and Pam's going to poke holes in it-
Corey Allan: See if it ruins my trust in her and coming up on the extended-
Pam Allan: Not going to happen but I will ask questions.
Corey Allan: Coming up on the extended content which is deeper, longer and no ads. You can subscribe @smrnation.com/smracademy. An email that's come in from a member of the academy who's curious about what happens when there's role reversals. There's some suggestions that we gave in the past about a husband that was lacking confidence and he's recognized his wife is incredibly successful. He's struggling and that really impacts his confidence.
Corey Allan: So what are some things you can do to help overall when there's a dichotomy going on of one person is rocking along differently than the other and it feels like it's a hierarchy?
Pam Allan: Okay, I've already got questions on that because that's a hierarchy, is it a role reversal?
Corey Allan: Well then we'll need to tune into the extended content today to find out more.
Pam Allan: Yes. I've got all kinds of questions already.
Corey Allan: All that's coming up on today's show.
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Corey Allan: I think there's a lot of information out there that people come into relationships thinking about the whole world of trust. Right? You would say you could easily see that trust is a primary thing needed in a marriage. Yes? Agreed?
Pam Allan: It would sure be helpful, yes.
Pam Allan: Any relationship I'm in that I want to be in long term ideally there's trust in it.
Corey Allan: Okay, which means what? Because I just want to start with just kind of a global... What do we bring in to this equation of a relationship when there's this inherent expectation of trust?
Pam Allan: Generically in any relationship I think if I'm in a marriage, a business relationship, something like that. That I'm going into some sort of union together. My initial response is reliability, right?
Pam Allan: I know that if they say that this is the role they're going to play that they're going to play it and ideally play it well.
Pam Allan: Okay. I'm not going to show up and X, Y, Z is not taken care of because they didn't do their part. So at a high level in my mind that's really what it is. Here's the part that I said I would play and I'm going to show up and do it.
Corey Allan: That's right in line so I did Webster's dictionary says, "Trust is the firm belief in the reliability, truth ability and strength of someone or something."
Corey Allan: Nailed it.
Pam Allan: I could work for Webster.
Corey Allan: Nailed it. Because I think there's an important component of this that when you think of the whole idea of trust it's a paramount thing I think most everybody has in mind that, yes I need to have some trust in my relationship. I need to have trust in that other person and I want to keep this in the context of a marital dynamic that I have a trust in another human being. So what areas do those play out in most do you think? Because the things that come to my mind are finances, intimacy, judgment, communication, time, parenting.
Pam Allan: Well, yeah. Those are the big ones I guess that I would think of as well but taking care of the house.
Corey Allan: Responsibilities.
Pam Allan: Kind of played in that.
Corey Allan: No, I think that fits because there is this element of we come into a relationship together and we're creating this story. Right? We start to think of this through the lens of, okay it was idealized at the beginning. Right? Think about it. When you meet and fall in love with somebody it produces some feelings in the both of you that then carry you forward to where I want to keep checking this thing out. I want to come back to this even more because of the way you make me feel, the way I make you feel.
Corey Allan: This dynamic starts to enhance us and so I think that's part of that whole idealized or idealistically distorted aspect that we bring into life when we're in the beginning of new love.
Corey Allan: Then as that goes on we start to get a better picture of who am I really in a relationship with.
Corey Allan: What are the characteristics of them? What are the things that make them, them? What are the things that I'm meeting of them that's like, that's a good match I could see... Because if you're early on in this relationship you see it as this thing could be great because it's going to be stable, we're going to have financial things taken care of. Because-
Pam Allan: Or we just have fun together, right? We just really enjoy being together.
Corey Allan: Sure. But then as things go on inevitably there's going to be a disappointment or in the sake of our conversation a broken trust.
Corey Allan: Because I want to at least at the outset put out there this idea of our trust often time is initially built on something ideal.
Pam Allan: My guess is though those things aren't discussed. That sounds like expectations.
Corey Allan: I think there's an undercurrent of that, absolutely.
Pam Allan: The way that you're setting it up, oh here's how this relationship is unfolding and when we're dating things are fabulous. Everything just kind of flows potentially and hey this is going to be good. In my mind I think you're going to be doing X, Y, Z, you're always going to initiate because you love it so much and then we get married and maybe you're getting upset that I'm not initiating-
Pam Allan: So maybe you stop initiating and I'm like wait a second that was my expectation of what you would do. Is that kind of where you're going with this?
Corey Allan: Somewhat. But I'm thinking this more in the terms of how often do we come into a relationship and it's built on something slightly precarious at best because it's idealized. It's distorted, it's euphoric and then when we start getting into it there's this joint expectation of it won't change, it won't shift. Even though logically speaking I think we all realize it will.
Corey Allan: Then when it does our emotion can jump in and I crumble, it's a catastrophe, it's a huge deal when maybe it's not. Because it's a better chance to actually reevaluate, reorganize around what really is. Because one of the things we've talked about on the show is this idea of trust. Anytime it comes up when I'm working with couples or a person and they say, "I need to be able to trust them." I always ask the question, "Trust to do what?" Because it's not just a blanket statement. If I just blindly throw out there, babe I need to be able to trust you I'm setting myself up to be hurt. If I'm thinking of the entirety of it. Because there will be things that will disappoint me or frustrate me or it is a broken agreement. Even if it's not a huge one it's just, you said you'd be home at 05:30 why are you walking in the door at 05:40?
Pam Allan: Well, and how many times in the scenarios you're talking about is broken trust from something that just wasn't even communicated, what the expectation was in the first place.
Pam Allan: When you use the word trust does it typically come up in your office in relation to a betrayal?
Corey Allan: That's most of the time because obviously when people are coming to see me there's usually something that has precipitated their reasoning of reaching out.
Pam Allan: Yeah, they're in crisis mode.
Corey Allan: Betrayals are a big part of that. Yeah, betrayals are a big part of why people will reach out for counseling.
Corey Allan: So there is this element of, my trust has been broken in them and I can understand that and that's why if you go back in the archives you can look up trust and hurt and realize there's a difference between it. Because rebuilding trust is different than dealing with the hurt, those are two separate things.
Corey Allan: So that needs to be addressed differently. But for the sake of our conversation I want to think of it through the lens of, trust to do what? Because I need to get more realistic or reasonable of what I'm expecting, what I'm looking for, what I'm wanting and then also what's even viable. If I'm married to somebody that travels all the time and I'm upset when they have to leave, is it viable that they could change that without huge consequences?
Corey Allan: Well probably not, not without a different kind of grief that could happen and struggle that could happen between us. So one of the things I came across not too long ago was this phrase of when I'm talking about trust in a relationship. A better path or a better thought process is to think of this in the terms of, "I need to learn how to regulate myself so I can determine my partner's trustworthiness."
Pam Allan: Okay, two big keys there. What does it mean to regulate myself? Then-
Corey Allan: That means-
Corey Allan: So that means I need to look at this through the lens of, how do I overreact to something that was an unmet expectation or an unspoken disappointment that happened or even just a broken trust. Right? Because look at the variations that can happen Pam, because the example that comes to my mind is a betrayal that's happened. So obviously one of the routes a lot of couples will go with a betrayed spouse they will go I need transparency to make sure everything's done. To make sure there's nothing else being hidden and to make sure you can earn back trust.
Corey Allan: So oftentimes the betrayer is usually on board with absolutely here's my phone. I want this relationship. I want my marriage.
Corey Allan: I'm turning towards it, I realize this was just a mess up but I want this. So a lot of times the best move for that is to, here you go access to everything. Which that's reasonable for the short term.
Corey Allan: It starts to become harmful in the long run, my opinion.
Corey Allan: Professionally speaking. But the struggle becomes if I come... Say it happened with us. I mean it did happen to us years and years ago, but let's say it was going on now. So I've given you transparency of everything and then you asked me one day so did you come straight home from work? Assuming I work not in the house. I'm like, yeah I did. But then the credit card bill comes through and you see I got gas on that day and you realized it was at the time I was on my way home from work so I didn't come straight home from work, I stopped to get gas. Was that a broken trust? Because those are the variations of life or things that we can't possibly control and when I get so caught up in I need every assurance of you. My trust is contingent on that. I'm going to be disappointed and frustrated and hurt at times rather than realizing how do I regulate myself to see it as okay, hold on. What was that that really happened? Rather than letting my emotions add fuel to the fire.
Pam Allan: So by regulate myself is that another way of saying I need to look at myself and determine if I'm overreacting or not.
Corey Allan: I need to self soothe. I need to calm down and ask some better questions of, wait why is it that happened that hurt me? Because what you can do is start to recognize then what are the actions the person I'm doing life with, what are they really telling me? What's really being said here?
Corey Allan: Because if there's something nefarious going on, my personal belief and professional belief is we're too stupid as humans to keep it hidden for long. So it will come out.
Corey Allan: But the other thing I can look at it as, okay everything we do tells a story. So how do I see the story cleaner to realize what level of trustworthiness are they showing here.
Pam Allan: So then moving onto that are they trustworthy?
Pam Allan: Where's that determination? That is me making a judgment call about you.
Pam Allan: Saying whether you are or you are not trustworthy.
Corey Allan: This is where we need to pivot the conversation to make it to where it's not a global level of trustworthiness but it's a situational level of trustworthiness.
Pam Allan: Yeah, it really sounds like that there's room for a lot of fire in there. Right? A lot of-
Pam Allan: Because I'm judging you.
Pam Allan: Which we do in a relationship.
Corey Allan: We all judge to varying degrees. We don't call it judgment typically but we are all making assessments of stuff.
Pam Allan: Yeah and some of that could be for self protection and can be valid for my own safety and security. So guide me through that, what that looks like if I'm to determine if you're trustworthy or not.
Corey Allan: Well then you look at it in the different aspects of what we talked about earlier. Finances, intimacy, communication, spirituality, time, roles. Are you trustworthy in you'll take over the house during tax season?
Pam Allan: So I can't-
Corey Allan: Reversing that.
Pam Allan: Yeah, so I can't define trustworthy with trustworthy.
Corey Allan: Do you follow through with what you say you're going to do in those areas? Do you take care of what your responsibility is? Or we have an agreement on how we're going to spend money and do I uphold my side of that equation? Or am I out frivolously taking care of other things with it and being flippant hoping it doesn't get seen? Or coming up with reasons why that was a justifiable worthless expense?
Corey Allan: That's not according to what we had agreed upon. That's not a trustworthy action.
Corey Allan: So it's recognizing the dynamic and how it plays out between us in the different aspects of us and what we create together.
Corey Allan: Because this is one of those things... Let's pick on our kids for a second.
Pam Allan: That'll be fun.
Corey Allan: That there's an element of there's aspects of their life according to what we want for them and what is their responsibility as high school students that they are trustworthy with the way they conduct themselves. They take care of their work at school, they keep up with what they need to. They keep up with their calendar of when things are scheduled and due and not and that's not what we do that's theirs and they've shown we handle that. We also have some expectations of, hey pick up after yourself in which they have shown they are not as trustworthy.
Pam Allan: True that.
Corey Allan: They have people that take care of that ie-
Corey Allan: You and I. But that's this element of when we can start to break it down I'm less likely to make the blanket, "I can't ever trust you to do anything. I can't ever count on you for anything." Because that's a statement when I'm off balance in reacting rather than, okay I can keep it on this specific area and there's more merit to it. There's more truth behind what I'm saying.
Pam Allan: Yeah, that's so hard though. Because even when you're in a rational mind and self soothing if I'm not trustworthy in one area. We talk about this all the time even the phrase, "How you do sex is how you do life and how you do life is how you do sex." Right? We've said you can interchange the word sex with how you do finances or how you do other things. Because there is a tendency to if I'm this way in one area maybe that's really just kind of who I am. So I get that I'm not always exactly that way in every segment of my life.
Pam Allan: But it's just normal as a spouse to carry over and make assumptions.
Corey Allan: Right. Well that's just where I'll take some specific data and make a blanket indictment.
Corey Allan: When I need to slow myself down to realize that's not for the benefit of either one of us to go that route. I end up setting each of us on the defensive or I set up as judge and jury or I set up as it's unrealistic or moral high ground. There's all these different things that ultimately will be the demise of the moment, minimum.
Corey Allan: So it's not that we always do this perfectly but when I can start to look at this as, okay what's the level of trustworthiness of the person I'm actually interacting with and then I can parse it out even further of what is it I'm really expecting. What is it I'm really looking for, what is my preference. Because some of the things that ding me with you are just you don't live according to my preference. Which okay, rationally speaking you probably shouldn't. But I need to realize, all right that's just where it is. Okay, I get that and the more I can... That's a regulating move of realizing okay. But in the whole of the story it's good, there's a lot of consistency. There's a lot of congruence with our words and so I think when you start to look at it on what do you do with this to up your level of trustworthiness in the people you live life with and are trying to be close to. Because that's our controlled in, is I want to try to live a trustworthy life.
Corey Allan: I think it's a good goal for all of us.
Corey Allan: That's that whole idea of my level of honesty with myself and with others. My level of consistency with myself and my others. Those are the things that start to create a reliable aspect of things.
Pam Allan: Right. You say that I could be consistent in everything but I could be a really terrible person. I'm just consistently terrible.
Corey Allan: Okay. But then if I look at it the way we're framing this conversation I can trust the fact that you're a terrible person.
Pam Allan: I can make some decisions based off of that.
Corey Allan: Absolutely. That's the shift of now I put the power squarely on my own shoulders to face what the reality is cleaner.
Corey Allan: That's really the whole point of this phrase of, "How do I regulate myself enough to determine my partner's trustworthiness so I can actually face what is." This is a phrase we've said just recently in the several shows is, "I need to deal with the spouse I have not the one I wish they were."
Corey Allan: So how do I face that? That's how I confront and earn more levels of depth and connection then ultimately probably trust.
Corey Allan: I'm curious Pam, how much of... So this show was different in the fact that we just took a topic, this felt like a blast from the past actually.
Corey Allan: Since that's-
Pam Allan: A few years ago.
Corey Allan: That used to be SMR that we would just have a topic, deep dive and let's go and it's funny because before we started recording you were like, "But this is listener driven radio, we're not doing an email for this episode?" Yes, we're still doing emails.
Pam Allan: I just asked the question.
Corey Allan: No, absolutely.
Pam Allan: I can ask the question.
Corey Allan: You absolutely can but you're trustworthy in that.
Pam Allan: There you go.
Corey Allan: I know that you will. But it's interesting because it's recognizing sometimes we can make things too simplified when they're more complicated, that's life.
Corey Allan: Sometimes what we also want to do is take the complicated and make it more simple.
Corey Allan: Trust is one of those things Pam.
Pam Allan: That you can go both ways on it.
Corey Allan: It's simple and it's complicated.
Corey Allan: Well this has been Sexy Marriage Radio. If we didn't live up to the levels of trustworthiness you were expecting with today's show, let us know 214-702-9565 or feedback at sexymarriageradio.com. See you next time.
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I use my innate gifts of psychic and numerology to do good so that all individuals can have a better life. Moreover if since all these years I succeeded in becoming a famous psychic in Los Angeles it is for the simple and good reason that I do not cheat what means that whatever it is I will tell you all the truth even if I know very well that this last one can hurt you on the spot. It is afterwards that you will understand that this is only for your own good.
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If I am so often solicited it is in very many cases to come to assistance to people who have problems of couple or sentimental life. Indeed, a lot of questions revolve around love, whether it is about finding the right person to have a love life or others such as for example about fidelity, etc.. But of course, I can also help you on various topics such as work, money, family and much more. It is important to know that in most cases and no matter what your problem is, it comes from something that is always present in your life without you even knowing it.
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Summer is great - long days, warm nights (if the Dutch weather holds up that is), sunny afternoons, and exciting holidays. But, there are some aspects of summer that many people would like to never experience again, including mosquitos. Getting bitten by mosquitoes is never pleasant. It can be really itchy, can sometimes even hurt, and it’s very difficult to resist the temptation to scratch.
So, wouldn’t summer be so much better if there were ways to avoid getting bitten by mosquitoes? Many solutions are obvious - insect repellent and door or window screens are great tricks to keep the mosquitoes away from you and out of your house - but are there other ways to avoid mosquitoes?
Let’s look at seven less well-known ways to prevent those pesky mosquito bites.
Apparently deep, dark colours, like black, deep blue, and red are more likely to attract mosquitos. The colours stand out, and so attract all kinds of bugs. But, wearing light-coloured clothing when you’re out and about could make a difference. Also, make sure to cover up! Try wearing thicker fabrics and looser fitting clothes, as it offers more protection than thin, tight-fitting clothing.
You can also buy repellant made with permethrin designed specifically for clothing or you can buy clothes pre-treated with the insecticide.
2. Stay indoors during sunrise and sunset
Sadly, mosquitoes can be flying around at any time of day. However, there are peak mosquito times. During dusk and dawn is when you’re most likely to come across the critters, so try to avoid being out during these times as much as possible.
3. Make yourself less appealing to mosquitoes
This one may sound a little funny, but there have been a number of studies to try and figure out why some people attract more mosquitoes than others. Scientists say keeping your body cool can have a big impact, as mosquitoes are attracted to pheromones released in your sweat, so staying hydrated could help. Also, while the initial instinct to cover up the scent of your sweat with scented products might seem logical, it can actually have the opposite effect and attract the bugs. Any scented perfume, lotion, or deodorant could potentially attract mosquitoes, so try to avoid them whenever possible.
Some studies have also shown that drinking beer can make you more appealing to mosquitoes, so choose your drink wisely!
4. Protect yourself with a breeze
One of the reasons mosquitoes go on the hunt at dusk and dawn is because typically the wind dies down as the sun rises and sets. Any wind makes it difficult for mosquitoes to fly, so if you pick a breezy spot when you’re next in the park or at the beach then that can help prevent getting bitten.
Alternatively, fans can also work pretty well, specifically if the flow of air is directed at the lower half of your body. Mosquitoes tend to fly very close to the ground in an attempt to avoid wind, so if the fan is facing downward it will deter them.
5. Stay away from standing water
Mosquitoes can easily breed in small containers of stagnant water, so can breed in your back garden without you even knowing it! If you have a full bucket or flower pot anywhere in or around your home, make sure to throw it out. Or, if your garden has a pond, add some mosquito-eating fish, like minnows or mosquito fish, or add a waterfall or fountain to keep the water moving.
Or, if you’re out in a park or visiting somewhere with a lot of stagnant water, try to stay as far away from it as possible.
Apparently, carbon dioxide (CO2) is what attracts mosquitoes to their food source, and when you’re heart rate is elevated you produce more CO2. Exercise, drinking alcohol, eating spicy food - all of these can all elevate your heart rate!
Instead, try to avoid anything that you know will speed up your metabolic rate and increase CO2 production. Or, if you’re going out and know your heart rate will rise, make sure to wear protective clothing or use insect repellent.
If your garden has become a bit of a mosquito hot-bed, it might be worth considering planting plants that repel mosquitoes. While it may not be very effective on its own, the plants could help discourage mosquitoes from hanging around your home.
Planting a lot of plants such as citronella, lavender, lemongrass, marigolds, and basil could have a real impact on your garden. Similarly, spreading coffee grounds and tea waste around your garden could limit the reproduction of mosquitoes in the area.
Do you have any handy tips to prevent getting bitten by mosquitoes? Share them in the comments below!
Author
Victoria grew up in Amsterdam, before moving to the UK to study English and Related Literature at the University of York and completing her NCTJ course at the Press Association...
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What's up
, lotion, or deodorant could potentially attract mosquitoes, so try not to avoid them. i thought this was supposed to be about avoiding them....still no proof reading at your site, huh? in any case, thanks for the article...
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My name is Jeff Koh and I am excited to start my year as a CARA Ambassador by sharing with you my race report on the January 26, 2019 10th Annual F^3 Lake Half Marathon & 5K presented by Physicians Immediate Care.
The end of the year is always a hard time for my fitness and training goals. I am coming down from training for a fall marathon (this year I ran through the national monuments in the Marine Corps Marathon). I’m juggling year-end deal closings with flying across the country to reunite with family over long, languid meals. And then there’s the prospect of training through the winter in Chicago: running in the dark on both ends of my workday, all that layering and laundry, ice on the lakefront trail.
Thankfully, Chicago is such an inspiring city filled with wonderful running and climbing communities. As part of my new year’s resolutions every year, I pick out the races I want to run and the mountains I want to climb. I travel for my spring and fall marathons (and volunteer at the one in Chicago in October). The rest of my race calendar is filled with classic Chicago road races (many of which are on the CARA Runners’ Choice Circuit: Bank of America Shamrock Shuffle 8K on March 24, Wintrust Lakefront 10 Miler on April 13, Soldier Field 10 Mile on May 25, BTN Big 10K). I race these every year with the goal of beating my time from the previous year.
To motivate myself to train through the winter, I signed up to be a pacer this year in CARA’s Winter Half Marathon Training Program, 12 weeks at 7:00 a.m. every Saturday at Waveland Park leading up to the F^3 Half Marathon. I have benefited from CARA’s training programs in the past, but I got really good at spotting puddles and ice patches and calling them out. My pace group offered great conversation, and their stamina pushed me to run faster and harder. (For those of you who are interested in running with a group, CARA Winter Marathon Training continues until late April (with speedwork offerings) and CARA Spring Half Marathon Training starts on February 25th).
The night before the F^3 Half Marathon, my friend Sarah texted me offering to bring over ski goggles. As a Chicago runner having trained through the winter, sometimes I try not to think too much about the weather too far in advance. The offer of ski goggles sparked a round of googling – hour-by-hour race day conditions, temperature, wind chill, precipitation – followed by looking up outfit recommendations. What to wear for 20 °F, 10°F, 0°F, and below. Trying not to be too cold at the start and yet not overly sweaty mid-race (which becomes clammy and frozen).
The race organizers had us gather at the United Club at Soldier Field, close to the start line. I showed up at 9:15 AM for the 10 AM race start, with plenty of time for gear check and warm up. I brought a duffel bag filled with all the layers I was going to wear, thinking I was crazy for wanting to run in 0°F weather. Seeing thousands of other Chicagoans just as crazy as me filled me with so much pride, and gave me so many new winter run outfit ideas. At the start line, announcer Dave Kappas (yes, the amazing baritone that kicks off so many Chicago races) told us jokes about how the cold would make us think twice before signing up for races late nights after several drinks. He also told us about the heat tents on the course, to stay safe and to turn around if we needed to.
The race itself was amazing – somehow the race organizers picked out a route on the lakefront that had enough slight uphills and downhills (in flat Chicago!) to keep things interesting. Aside from a short portion at the race turnaround, the route was well-salted and free of slush. The race volunteers braved the cold and kept the water and electrolyte drinks liquid enough to drink. There was a happening after party at Kroll’s, and it was great to see all the other runners let loose in race gear. With this being my very first long run of the year, I was able to keep pace for about ten miles before slowing down (I still beat my time from last year by over 10 minutes).
I am excited to start training for my 2019 mountains and races, and to see all of you out there on the trail. I will be wearing my personalized CARA ambassador singlet as much as I can, so please say hello if you see me out on the lakefront.
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The Chicago Area Runners Association, CARA, is a non-profit organization committed to serving and advocating for the local running community. We are Chicagoland’s running club, providing accessible opportunities for all runners to train, race, learn, be social and volunteer.
CARA, with over 10,000 members, is the nation’s third-largest running club, serving as the voice of local runners, as well as providing over 1,300 dates of programming and events per year.
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By pressing send inquiry, you agree that Spire Group and real estate professionals may contact you via phone/text about your inquiry, which may involve the use of automated means. You are not required to consent as a condition of purchasing any property, goods or services. Message/data rates may apply. You also agree to our Terms of Use. This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
Neighborhood
BF Homes Parañaque, officially Barangay BF Homes, is a gated community and administrative division in southern Metro Manila, the Philippines. It is one of the sixteen barangays that make up Parañaque and is the city's largest barangay and southernmost village. As a subdivision, the local term for a gated community, its territory includes portions of neighboring cities, Las Piñas and Muntinlupa. It was formerly known as Las Piñas-Parañaque BF Homes and was developed by Banco Filipino owner Tomas Aguirre in 1968. The development was part of the BF Homes project, alongside its sister branches in Quezon City, Caloocan, and Naga, and became fully operational by early 1970. Philippine media refer to it as "the biggest subdivision in Asia". The larger portion of the development in Parañaque
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So bring your instruments and your voices! The blackboard segment will be first in first served. There is a full bar and food is available at reasonable prices.
Click on the email address to contact the performer, click on their URL to go to their website.
Brief Blurb: "Gerry Miller began his love affair with the guitar at the age of 14, and it has been an on-again off-again relationship ever since. As a teenager he played bass in various pub/rock bands around his home town of Bundaberg, and it was during this time he developed an interest in acoustic guitar, particularly fingerpicking styles. His passion waned during the 1980s when he was bringing up a family but was rekindled when his son, Tim, took an interest. Gerry and Tim formed a duo and played pub gigs around the Bundaberg area. Now living in different cities the duo has taken a back seat but enjoys occasional reunions, performing under the name ‘DrMr’. Gerry spent 5 years in the UK on a working holiday and it was during that time that he started frequenting folk and acoustic clubs including the Marlow Bottom Acoustic Club and the cryptically named ‘Ghost of Mansfield Morris’. Returning to Brisbane in 2010 he continued playing at open mic nights and folk clubs. He likes to describe his repertoire as ‘contemporary’."
For those of you who don't know it the New Farm Bowls Club is on Brunswick St opposite New Farm Park. It has a great atmosphere, food, good parking, public transport, and a bar and a kitchen, open till 8.00pm. Click HERE to see what's coming up in the next few weeks.
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Scared phone supervisors have suspended the mobile phone number 0888-888-8888 after everyone doled out to it kicked the bucket over the most recent 10 years. The principal proprietor, Vladimir Grashnov the previous Chief of Bulgarian mobile phone organization Mobitel, which gave the number kicked the bucket of disease in 2001 matured only 48.
Regardless of a flawless business record, there were persevering gossipy tidbits that his malignancy had been brought about by a business rival utilizing radioactive harming. The reviled number by then passed to Bulgarian mafia director Konstantin Dimitrov. He was gunned down in 2003 by a lone expert assassin in the Netherlands during an excursion to survey his £500million drug-sneaking domain. Dimitrov, who kicked the container developed 31, had the versatile with him when he was shot while eating out with an awesome model.
Russian mafia managers desirous of his medication sneaking activity - were said to have been behind the murdering. The phone number at that point passed to slanted finance manager Konstantin Dishliev. He was gunned down external an Indian café in Bulgarias capital Sofia in 2005, in the wake of assuming control over the cursed line. Home specialist Dishliev had furtively been running a monstrous cocaine dealing activity before his death.
He passed on after £13 billion of the drug was caught by police on its way into the country from Colombia. From here on out, the number is seen to have been slow while police kept an open archive on Dishlievs killing and his pilfering ring.
By and by scaring telephone chiefs are said to have suspended the number, which from a worldwide line is 888 888 8888, for good. Visitors as of now get a recorded message saying the telephone is outside association incorporation. That is the story.
800-945-2000 could be hurting your credit. In the event that youre being spammed by them, it justifies understanding if you have an off-base, negative thing on your report (from 18009452000). Weve helped a considerable number of customers around the nation remove infractions from their credit reports. We can help you, also.
18009452000 could be a commitment arrangement office, creditor, or a financial association. Theyre likely on your credit report as a arrangements account. This regularly happens when you disregard to cover a tab. If a combination is on your credit report, its hurting your credit score. 1800-945-2000 may be a real association.
It is hard to say, which is the explanation hindering these numbers is normally a keen idea. They help individuals, like you, perceive, erroneous negative things from your credit report.
No doubt not! Most numbers, as 1800-945-2000, are harmless spam calls from various associations and creditors to get you to pay your conceivable commitment. The inspiring news? You dont have to! Especially on the off chance that youre certain you dont have momentous commitments. Its certainly a disturbing experience.
If you work with a specialist like Credit Significance to challenge their commitment, ensuring precision, advantageousness, and authenticity of their noteworthy, you may never have to oversee them until the afterlife. Call to sort out how we can help you with avoiding claims and being sued all things considered while fixing your credit.
Now and again, we propose conversing with a Credit Fix capable to explore your credit report. Its such a ton of less pressing factor, trouble, and time to permit specialists to perceive the reasons why youre being spam called by 1800-945-2000. On the off chance that youre looking for a genuine association to fabricate your credit score, we recommend Credit Splendor.
Set up a snappy, free meeting. Credit Brightness is a credit fix association that helps conventional Americans remove wrong, inadequate, odd, unapproved, or counterfeit negative things from their credit report. Their fundamental target is drawing in buyers with the opportunity and data to show up at their money related dreams in 2021 and the past.
PayPal is on the climb, and anyone can fall prey to these cheats. You ought to be careful while using progressed money or while using plastic money. It is reliably essential to keep on looking over your texts similar to the card clarifications. In case you have seen blame for the number 1402-935-7733 on your Mastercard or the spending report and in case you are endeavoring to find more about it, by then you are at the advantageous spot. We are here to help you with your requests for this trade. If you dont think about these two numbers, by then let us unveil to you that they are the customer care numbers for PayPal.
If you have any trade that is set up through PayPal, by then there are chances that the number will be showed up. Moreover, the trade depiction in like manner depends upon your Visa association or the underwriter. If any seller is using PayPal to manage trade on your card or in case you are using your card to make a portion through PayPal, by then the trade will be reflected by methods for this number and the expression PayPal. Overall, the area of the headquarters of PayPal is moreover associated with the depiction. If your charge card association shows the area of the seller, by then the attestation will show 2211 North First Street, San Jose, CA 95131. This is similarly the area of the headquarters. It doesnt have the area of the dealer, yet it is the area of PayPal. Thusly, dont get perplexed between the two trades.
You should have the alternative to address the request for yourself. Have a go at evaluating if you made any purchases with the portion merchant as PayPal. Did you pay any of the online vendors, or did you pay whatever other substance whose trade was set up through PayPal? In case you cant quickly see the trade, you should facilitate the receipt aggregate. Endeavor and audit if this whole was paid for any help or thing. Since the transporters name isnt recorded with the charge, you ought to depend upon your memory or the messages on your phone. When in doubt, 4029357733 PayPal trade is real. You would need to survey where you made this trade. Recall that PayPal is a financial intermediator that quantifies the trades.
These days, PayPal has also started recollecting the name of the vendor for the declaration. The name of the vendor causes you to quickly perceiving the trade. In a segment of the cases, the vendor name is truncated by banks, and this can get hard to appreciate. There are circumstances when the transporters name is the individual name, and this is especially clear if you have made a portion to any trained professional.
Because of abroad trades, the name can move dependent upon the merchant on the individual enrollment. If you have saved your Mastercard nuances on the PayPal account, by then there can in like manner be a circumstance where you tried making the trade with the PayPal account balance, anyway the trade has been set up through Mastercard considering the nonappearance of resources.
This is the standard association the Paypal applies to the sum of its portions. The clarification that this is huge is that since you see that number, or PayPal other than in the title of a charge doesnt actually infer that it is genuine. Right when a merchant sets up their portion taking care of they are given the option for what they should be set in the feature of the charge.
This is proposed to allow a seller to put something that will help you the buyer recall them so you wont chargeback the purchase. While this is okay for those sellers that are honest the ones that are not can endeavor to use this data to trick you into instinct it is a generous charge. Another thing to think about is that since you get a call from 1402-935-7733 doesnt actually infer that it is from PayPal customer uphold. Exactly when an association makes an outbound choice and they have an intricate phone system they truly can put whatever ANI they need as their visitor ID.
Again the assumptions were unadulterated in its beginning in that it was proposed to allow call centers managing different associations calls to set their visitor ID to the legitimate number for the business they were correct presently making the choice for. Regardless, again this licenses pranksters to have the alternative to "fake" their visitor ID with the objective that they can copy someone else. A wellbeing exertion that I by and large follow is that if I get a call from a dark number whether they are endeavoring to endorse a purchase or affirm a segment of my information, I for the most part uncover to them I will hit them up, and a while later I return to a number that is transparently recorded and have more conviction that I can trust. The primary deficiency in security whether it is in a home security structure, network security, or individual security is the human part.
For all the software engineer news you hear that makes it sound like these complex systems breaking into each other when in doubt the thing is insinuated as Social Planning where someone who is endeavoring to enter security uses an irreproachable observer to leave behind essential information which they would then have the option to use to break into the greater structure generally speaking.
With such a ton of being said one endeavor that I recommend everyone make is in information misrepresentation security. It is an apparent charge and for those of you who have encountered some kind of discount misrepresentation, you understand that it is amazingly significant. There are relatively few things that cause you to feel more mishandled than someone getting to your monetary adjusts, charge cards, and individual information. In a perfect world, you wont actually have to encounter the experience, anyway if you do, by then you need to guarantee you have someone experienced on your side to help you.
Phone Number Series: Tips on How to Find Someone Using His Phone Number
Phone Number Series is the third of a four part series on how to find anyone by phone number. In part one, I gave some tips on what you should do with the number after getting it from a harassing or questionable caller. In part two, I gave some suggestions on using the phone book for general searches. And in part three, I will discuss a specific method of finding someone by phone number. Lets begin.
If you dont know how to find someone by phone number, your first option should be to simply ask friends and family for assistance. Your best bet might be asking an old friend or relative, since at the end of the day, they probably have no idea who you are either. Chances are, they wont give you their number (for privacy reasons), but they could easily refer you to others that you can trust. My next option should be to look in the phone book. This way, you will know there is a person you can call back, should you need to.
If you have a land line, that is probably your best option for tracing the owner of a number. This is because land lines are registered and are easy to get information about. But even if your number is an unlisted, or private number, its still possible to find out the owners details by calling the phone company.
Reverse phone lookup services are also great for tracking down someone who has left you threatening calls or messages. You can easily track down someone by phone number by entering their cell phone or land line number into a service like this. They will give you a report about the owner of the number, and possibly more information about them. In my experience, the reports that these services give you are very accurate, and often have information such as neighbors, financial records, etc.
Another great option that I would recommend for tracking down someone is by using internet searches. There are many reverse search sites on the internet, and they are great for helping you to find someone. Many of them offer free services for searching. However, if you dont want to pay for a service such as this, there are a number of free services available, which you can try. Just type in the phone number series that you have, and see if anything comes up.
Now, the last option that I will mention in this Phone Number Series is to use a paid search. If you are going to be using a paid service, make sure that you choose the right site for your needs. Some sites are just out to scam you, so always check before paying. Also, always be cautious about giving out sensitive information, such as your Social Security or credit card number. If you feel uncomfortable with the searches that you are conducting, I would recommend looking for a paid service instead.
"How to locate someone by a phone number" is the name of a series of public phone number searches that I have put together. It was really the first one ever and today it remains the most popular. The original site is still up and running and continues to get high reviews from visitors to its site. With the popularity of the phone lookup, a new version of it has been created and is called "reverse phone search." This type of search is different from the regular search as it gives access to detailed reverse phone information of just about any number. If you have a phone number and want more information or know who the owner of the number is, this is your best bet.
I started doing public lookups on unknown numbers around 2 years ago. At that time I only had to pay a small one time fee and I got all the phone information I needed. Since that time there have been many other improvements to the site and I have made many improvements as well. What makes the reverse phone search series so great is its flexibility. You can search for phone numbers in any area of the world or just about any US city.
I started out just doing residential or business phone lookups. Now I also do cell phone lookup, business phone lookup, reverse phone lookups, and even unlisted phone number lookups. The good thing about having so many options available to me is that I can perform a search on almost any kind of phone number. There is no limit to what I can do. I love being able to search for phone numbers and learn valuable information about people.
One of the reasons I started doing public reverse phone lookups is so I would have some means of alerting the police if my daughter or son were behaving differently. My first experience with performing a public phone lookup was when my husband took my daughter to meet a boy we knew in the neighborhood. I didnt know what to expect but the next morning I found several pages of the Internet about a "kidnapping." Apparently someone had placed ads looking for a willing youngster to pose as a boyfriend for someone else. My daughter and I were the victims of this sick person. Thankfully, I learned enough about the Internet to report this person and her family to the proper authorities.
After my daughters ordeal, I realized that I needed to do something to help with the Internet problem. So I started to search the phone directory for a directory that offered reverse cell phone lookups. What I found was an excellent reverse telephone directory that contained information about nearly every type of phone number in the United States. I was able to locate listed, mobile, unlisted, and cell phone numbers.
This website has helped me a great deal as well as saving me a lot of time and aggravation. My daughter and I no longer have to worry about anyone taking advantage of us because we know who owns the number that appears on our caller ID. Now I can enjoy my daughters friendship over the Internet. She is more secure knowing that she can talk to me anytime by typing in her number. I am thankful that I discovered this amazing resource before my daughters ordeal. She might not realize how important a good directory is until she has the need to use it.
How I Discovered How to Stop Prank Calls With a Phone Number Series
The Phone Number Series is a newsletter designed to help you identify those pesky callers who seem to interrupt your day. I know what it is like to deal with those irritating callers on a daily basis. I get irritated and become agitated by them at times. Sometimes they can even make me ill at heart because of the way they talk to me. This is why I decided to create this article which will tell you about a powerful way to deal with those annoying callers.
The basic premise of the Phone Number Series is that you have the power to stop those annoying callers dead in their tracks. I did a lot of research into how other people dealt with such situations and wrote my own experiences in the book called Stop Those Annoying Calls. There are many resources available online, which may be able to give you information about how others dealt with similar situations. I also wrote an article about how to identify a business phone number online and how to use an online white pages directory to search for information about any phone number. You can get these free articles on my website.
In the Phone Number Series, I share some of my experiences about how I dealt with those annoying callers and also share some tools which I used to stop their calls instantly. If you are interested, I highly recommend this book. It is very helpful in stopping those annoying calls at the most affordable cost.
Phone number series is very useful because it contains three main parts. The first part is about how to identify a business phone number online. The second part provides you with important information which should help you stop prank calls. And finally, the last part explains how you can use an online white pages directory to find information about any number.
I am sure that after reading the entire series of articles, you will have a better understanding about the ways to deal with unwanted phone calls. In fact, the series has inspired many of my friends who had been troubled by pranksters. They are all enjoying the benefits of reading my articles now. Most of them wrote me back to tell me that they found the information very useful and insightful. They recommended the series to their friends as well.
If you want to know how I stopped prank calls, you can go to the link below and you will find out for yourself. You will also receive a free gift. Check it out! You wont be disappointed.
Phone scammers have occupied again. This time, theyre caricaturing Apple’s authentic assistance number 8006927753 to dupe dumbfounded iPhone owners into feeling that there was a data break. In any case, dont be deceived.
Its essentially one more mass robocall that is out to get you. Clearly, calling the gave phone number on the voice message will relate the loss to a fake Macintosh Support call center, where someone will endeavor to convince you to give out your own information, banking nuances, and even control your PC indirectly.
The intriguing thing about this joke is that, on occasion, it will show Apple’s authentic logo, address, and phone number on its contact information page. Why? Recall MobileMe, Apple’s old cloud changing organization, and iClouds model? Chances are, if you ever used MobileMe and were by then using an iPhone before 2011, you will have Apple’s contact card saved normally in your contact list.
This suggests that if you were an early iPhone adopter and you get a call that is parodying Apple’s maintain number 1800-692-7753, it will truly show Apple’s logo, address, and phone number as its contact information. Continue, check your iPhones contact list now and check whether you have Apple’s old MobileMe contact information. In case you do, you may have to delete it to thwart getting deceived by ridicule calls thusly.
Visitor ID or phone number ( 1800-692-7753) ridiculing is a creating mala die that is aggravating, anyway, it is in like manner comparably dangerous. With this arrangement, hoodlums are using VoIP and phone ridiculing programming to emulate a phone numbers visitor ID.
This suggests they could make any choice show up on your phone like it is coming from a characteristic individual, association, or affiliation. Without a doubt, these Visitor ID phone phishing stunts are getting so current and expertly dealt with that theyre deceiving even the most very much educated people around.
Secure yourself against phone phishing stunts (from 1800-692-7753):
This Apple phone phishing stunt may look convincing to specific people yet toward the days end, its basically one more customary phone satirizing stunt. To guarantee yourself against phone personifying brings when in doubt, here are a couple of recommendations:
Ø If you do need to contact Apple start the call yourself. In case you dont have the foggiest thought regarding its customer uphold number, look for it on the associations site itself.
Ø If you get an unconstrained phone call that shows to be from Apple and solicitations that you give out near and dear information, hang up or dismiss the call.
Ø Treat all unconstrained phone calls with doubt. Make an effort not to give any near and dear information.
Ø Go to Apple’s maintain a page for ways to deal with report the disparaged call and more tips to keep an essential separation from phishing stunts.
Ø Remember, Apple doesnt make unconstrained assistance phone choices. If you get an astounding call from someone who pronounces it to be from Apple, its most plausible a stunt.
This is just a single delineation of how deceives are getting even more inventive, which accordingly makes it less difficult to surrender to. Do whatever it takes not to envision that things ought to improve anytime sooner rather than later. To be sure, with tech persistently pushing things will most likely break down.
800-945-2000 could be an obligation assortment office, lender, or a monetary establishment. Theyre presumably on your acknowledge report as a assortments account. This typically happens when you neglect to cover a tab. If an assortment is on your credit report, its harming your FICO assessment (except if eliminated). 18009452000 might be a genuine organization. It is difficult to say, which is the reason impeding these numbers is generally a smart thought. They help people, similar to you, distinguish (and conceivably eliminate), incorrect adverse things from your credit report.
18009452000 this is a call place working for banks, generally for J.P. Morgan Chase Bank. They are calling to offer some support associated with your MasterCard. It appears to be that the number is abused for trick selling, know. Telephone number 8009452000 has a negative rating. 1545 clients appraised it as negative, 159 clients as sure, and 45 clients as unbiased. This telephone number is generally ordered as Telemarketer (multiple times), Financial administrations (multiple times), and Scam call (multiple times). These evaluations depend on reports of guests 18009452000.
If your card has been lost, taken, or harmed, call us at 1-800-945-2000. A client support expert will help you with supplanting your card. Free first class transporting for your substitution card to any U.S. road address is accessible at your solicitation.
Telephone number 13123867439 has a negative rating, and 498 clients appraised it as negative and single clients as nonpartisan. The approximated guest area is CHICAGO, COOK, Illinois which has the postal division of 60605. Its enlisted in AMERITECH ILLINOIS. This telephone number is generally sorted as Nuisance call (multiple times), Debt authority (different times), and Unsolicited call (multiple times).
Details about the number
(312) 386-7439 is a landline number situated in the US.
It is worked by MCI Metro, ATS, Inc.
Telephone numbers like 3123867439 are in any city/state in the United States. It is because of different telephone number compactness guidelines. The area recorded in our catalogs is real information from public sources, instead of a surmise at an area dependent on the territory code. Telephone number (312) 386-7439 can be accessible likewise in different arrangements. It is listed underneath:
Area code: 312
Telephone number 13123867439 can be dialed universally. Indeed, the telephone number ought to be as follows 1 312-386-7439
It is a Time Warner telephone number. This number has a place with Spectrum utilized to arrive at expected clients, present new items, and sell extra offers. This number has been portrayed by numerous remarks.
Telephone number 18008922253 has a positive rating. 881 clients evaluated it as sure, 416 clients as negative, and 205 clients as unbiased. This telephone number is ordered as Company (multiple times), Service, and Call Center (multiple times). These appraisals depend on reports of guests of this site and reports from clients of our insurance against undesirable Elective organization
The number can exist in these formats:
Time Warner (Spectrum) offers to uphold from its U.S. call focuses 24 hours out of each day, seven days out of every week. Hours: Mon-Fri 9 am-5 pm EST. The Best time to call: 9:05 am. This is Time Warners best telephone number, the continuous current lookout for hold, and apparatuses for avoiding directly through those telephone lines to get right to a Time Warner specialist. This telephone number is Time Warners Best Phone Number because 35,976 clients like you utilized this contact data throughout the most recent year and a half and gave us criticism. Basic issues tended to by the client care unit that answers calls to 18008922253 incorporate Lower my bill, Technical Support, Upgrade Account, Cancel Service, Account Access, and other client care issues. The Time Warner call focus that you call into has representatives from California, Texas, and is open Mon-Fri 9 am-5 pm EST as indicated by clients. Altogether, Time Warner has 10 telephone numbers. Its not in every case clear what is the most ideal approach to converse with Time Warner agents, so we began assembling this data worked from recommendations from the client local area. Kindly continue to share your encounters, so we can keep on improving this free asset.
I keep getting calls from this phone number. I suspect they are scammers.
Eric Ryan Meza - Maricopa County AZ December 24th 2014 Charges Filed - Prevent/Interfere Telephone Emergency December 24th 2014 Charges Filed - Theft/Control Property August 9th 2002 Charges Filed - Aggravated Assault August 9th 2002 Charges Filed - Aggravated Assault/Dismemberment
Keep getting silenced calls from this Number. very very annaoying.
Eric Ryan Meza - Maricopa County AZ December 24th 2014 Charges Filed - Prevent/Interfere Telephone Emergency December 24th 2014 Charges Filed - Theft/Control Property August 9th 2002 Charges Filed - Aggravated Assault August 9th 2002 Charges Filed - Aggravated Assault/Dismemberment
Eric Ryan Meza Newport Beach, CA was charged with one count of aggravated assault, a class six felony and a domestic violence offense. He was offered a plea agreement to be placed on intensive probation for three years beginning January 2, 2013, the terms of which included attending and paying for domestic violence offender treatment, attending anger control counseling, submitting to urinalysis testing, community restitution, and refraining from contact with the victim. Alcocer was advised of the range of possible sentences and the availability of probation. Alcocer accepted the plea agreement and plead guilty to the charge.
I had a text message from this man who said he was a private lender - I have been looking for a loan legitimately, so how he got my number is a mystery. I smelled a rat - sure enough, this 475 number was created this morning - a Google number or whatever. As well, he has a Linked profile and he gives a 151 -261-55554 (sic) on the site. I told him to get lost. . - by the way, that 151 number is listed here as well as UNSAFE - the man is a TOTAL scammer so BEWARE and DO NOT ENGAGE!
I am receiving disturbing calls from this number.
These guys just don't know when to quit! They are very active and await to hear from you! Bonus points to say your name is Vivian. Extra bonus points to play into the whole spiel until you get to the final boss : the "American Specialist" who just loves it when you call him out on his BS! 434-225-9975
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Great projects don’t happen by accident. Learn how to make your projects run better by planning better.
Whether you work on your own or have a team, learning to think about your project like a project manager will help you get more done with the time and resources you have.
If you hear “project management” and think “useless, bloated process,” this course is for you. We’ll discuss the goals behind the processes, so you can understand what tools and techniques will have value in your specific situation, and build a process that helps you succeed instead of hindering you.
This is a recorded online class.
In this course you’ll learn how to:
Build plans that help you manage change
Eisenhower famously said: “In preparing for battle I have always found that plans are useless, but planning is essential.” Effective project management isn’t about making a plan once and then sticking to it. Use your plans to respond more effectively to the inevitable changes that will occur.
Analyze dependencies to reduce waste and stress
One of the most powerful things project planning provides is a knowledge of how all the parts of your project depend on each other. Use this to make your projects more successful.
Think about risk to protect your project... and your team
Things go wrong, but some things are more likely to go wrong than others. Analyzing your risks from the very beginning can help you protect your project and your team when sh** happens.
Communication isn’t just about talking! Use all your available communication tools to get the right information to the right people when they need it.
Very few people get to focus exclusively on one thing these days. Luckily, there are tools available to help keep the competition for ourattention from causing paralysis.
Purchase this recorded class for just $75
Click the Buy Now button to go to GumRoad and purchase the seminar. You will download all of the files directly from GumRoad.
This is the recording of an online course consisting of two 1.5 hour sessions.
Testimonials from past students:
This was an excellent quick and dirty introduction to project management for those of us who don’t have the time or need to explore certification. The scope of the workshop was just right for getting started.
I thought the course was great… I started implementing the techniques you discussed within an hour of the end of the webinar.
A recent student
I was getting frustrated by project management tools, because I was trying to use them to juggle multiple projects. Now that I actually understand the difference between project management and program management I think I’ll be about to use them a lot more effectively.
Graduate student
I really liked the fact that it was a short overview about project managing, with just enough examples to see and compare methods, so I can pick which one seems best suited to my task.
Engineering professor
I am a consultant specializing in scientific data management and the effective management of people and projects. Prior to starting my own consultancy, I led teams and projects in the biotechnology industry for more than ten years. I am not a devotee of any particular project management process: I believe in understanding the fundamentals and tailoring the process to fit the team and the work. I have a Ph.D. in biochemistry from The Scripps Research Institute.
You can find out more about my approach to project management by reading the posts on this site and by reading the articles I’ve written for Chronicle Vitae. If you have any questions, you can email me at melanie@beyondmanaging.com.
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The 2022 Curb, which is available in four great colorways, offers the entry-level rider a bike that looks and feels like a pro model without the price tag. Featuring modern geometry and outfitted with components such as 8.75-inch Kink T875 bars, 3-piece tubular chromoly cranks, a raised Mission Control TL stem, soft Kink Paragon grips with push-in Kink Thrust bar ends, and 2.4-inch tires front and rear; the Curb is perfect for any rider looking for a solid first bike.
Kink Launch
The 2022 Launch continues the legacy of a truly remarkable bike. This bike is still one of the best value-priced models in the market, hands down, year after year. The Launch pairs its great color selection with even better components. The Launch is equipped with both a sealed integrated headset and sealed Mid bottom bracket, which drastically improves performance and virtually eliminates maintenance of these components. Combined with a parts package that includes Kink Stryker forks, Kink T875 8.75-inch bars, and Mission Triumph 3pc tubular chromoly cranks, this bike is a rookie's dream.
We The People Arcade
A bike with plenty of opportunity, the Arcade really showcases the endless detail and unrivaled quality that we put into our bikes. This super-dialed bicycle rolls on SALT's super-wide 36mm Valon rims with sealed hubs, carrying a full assortment of nylon hub guards that allow you to have a solid and dependable set of wheels under you at all times. Available in both a 20.5" and a longer 21" option, the Arcade will give senior riders the ability to ride one of the most popular bikes in our line.
We The People Audio 22"
The Audio is built around a larger 22" diameter wheel, providing a more stable ride without sacrificing the classic BMX look and feel. Perfect for the die-hard trail dogs or taller riders looking for a bike more fitting to their size without having to resort to a bike that simply isn't BMX. Using the full chromoly aftermarket spec frame, we designed a fork with an even sturdier and bombproof steer tube/crown area allowing you to push this thing as hard you can. We spent an incredibly long time dialing in the geometry on the Audio, as well as developing our own range of 22" specific parts like the Logic rim and Overbite tire. A bike that will surprise you with how well it rides, the Audio is leading the pack in the 22" revolution.
We The People Battleship
BATTLESHIP is a name synonymous with new-school street riding and ultimate strength and durability. Taking one of the most popular technical street frames on the market and adding a full aftermarket PRO parts package, the Battleship is the greatest street bike ever made. Now featuring the brand new 15mm-offset Battleship fork and a full ECLAT/We The People parts package, this is a bike that any of our team could ride straight out of the box with zero compromise. A full custom bike in every sense of the word, the Battleship carries a full Lifetime Guarantee on the frame and fork, giving you full confidence that you are riding a bike designed to ride at the highest level possible.
We The People CRS
One of the most anticipated bikes in BMX, the CRS is back for 2021 with even more bang for your buck. Now featuring a sealed front hub, this all-terrain slayer rolls smoother than ever. Packed full of aftermarket parts from ECLAT, including the Bios Pivotal seat and Pure seat clamp, the CRS looks and rides like a bike twice the price tag. The geometry has been tailored to allow for greater progression of the younger generation. The super-short 12.75" chainstays, 165mm cranks, and shorter 26mm fork give the CRS a snappy and agile ride that is perfect for learning and advancing. A bike truly built with vision, the CRS is unlike anything else.
We The People CRS FC
We took our CRS complete and gave it a new-school street injection in the form of a SALT PRO sealed freecoaster hub. Now with a sealed front hub and available in two color options, this entry-level freecoasting whip is ready for anything.
We The People Crysis
Built upon a frame of which most other aftermarket frames would be envious, the Crysis is wrapped in a generous helping of We The People parts, including the all-terrain 2.35" Overbite tires, Logic sprocket, and the Logic front load stem, new for 2021. The Crysis is available in 20.5" or 21" top tube sizes, both using our invest cast wishbone and taller 127mm head tube for a super clean and refined look.
We The People Envy
The ENVY is a chance for us to showcase how far BMX design has come and offer a glimpse into the direction it's heading. The launch of this particular model always sparks debate and attention unlike any other bike in our line up, and for good reason. The ENVY offers us the opportunity to hand-select only the crème de la crème from our product lines and carefully assemble them into one masterpiece of a bike. The 2021 ENVY proves that strength does not have to come with a weight disadvantage. Built using our super light ENVY XLT frame with the ECLAT Storm XLT fork, E440 rims, and ground-breaking Seismic hubs, the ENVY is the highest spec'd BMX bike of all time. Despite the low weight, the ENVY was designed for the most punishing street and park riders and handles the raw brutality of BMX riding, featuring a full LIFETIME GUARANTEE on the frame and fork, as always. - Includes lifetime guarantee on the frame & fork
We The People Justice
Based on the same bikes that We The People pro, Felix Prangenberg, rode last season, the Justice features revised geometry and a never before seen parts overhaul from We The People. Our new Activate tire, Paragon plastic guard sprocket, and Perfect grips make this new-school urban machine more stacked than ever before. Paired up with a shorter 22mm-offset fork and a full assortment of plastic hub guards, you'd be forgiven for thinking that you're riding a full custom build.
We The People Nova
Bringing We The People quality to a lower price point for 2021 is our entry-level shredding machine. The Nova features a super short 12.75" oval chainstay and responsive 26mm-offset fork, allowing it to not only feel just like the bikes our pro team ride, but also make it much easier to progress your riding even further.
We The People Reason
The Reason is draped in quality from head to toe. Featuring a full 4130 chromoly frame with a modern 76-degree headtube and super short 12.75" chainstay, the Reason now comes with shorter 160mm cranks and a steeper 15mm-offset fork, making it truly ride like the same bikes We The People PRO's Felix Prangenberg and Dan Kruk are riding right now. Featuring a SALT PRO freecoaster hub and the latest We The People aftermarket products, this street machine is a true weapon.
We The People Revolver
Taking our "do-it-all" aftermarket Revolver frame and draping it in some high-end components, we've managed to create an incredibly sophisticated and balanced bike for the kind of rider that appreciates the finer things in life. The longer 21" top tube and perfect all-round geometry make the Revolver perfectly comfortable on any terrain from the deep end of a bowl to the main line of your local trails or even the back streets of a big city. The harder 28-9 gearing gives this rig plenty of juice when the time for pedaling fast comes into play, and the full assortment of ECLAT Dura chromoly pegs and hub guards allow you to gun it down any rail in sight. Wrap it up with a lifetime-guaranteed ECLAT Storm fork and a Skipper Green paint finish, and the need to build a custom bike no longer exists.
We The People Trust
The Trust comes stacked to the brim with the latest We The People components, including the 2.35" Activate tires and Paragon plastic guard sprocket. Featuring an aftermarket Trippin/Cortex wheelset from ECLAT the Trust is a well-stacked assortment of components and BMX technologies.
We The People Trust FC
Taking the same incredible setup as the Trust, but with a full street upgrade, the Trust FC is a new machine for 2021. We injected Battleship-inspired geometry like the 12.75" chainstay and super steep 15mm-offset fork and added the most technical aftermarket parts from We The People and ECLAT. The latest Trust FC even features an Everlast-style 4-piece handlebar to give it a stylish and unique look that will really stand out in the streets.
We The People Versus
An unstoppable skatepark machine! The Versus features geometry borrowed from our Message aftermarket line, allowing it to shred transitions and skateparks unlike anything else. We added a sealed SALTPLUS Geo rotor setup with dual cables to give the Versus plenty of braking power and performance. Contra pedals, super lightweight Mirage tires, and a Unify combo seat from ECLAT help round out one of the most pro bikes in our 2021 line-up.
The Casino series is one of the top selling completes available today. Designed to ride like a Pro's bike on an amateur's budget. We make this bike in Taiwan to keep the quality high and selected a bunch of after-market Fiction parts so it will last.
The Casino XL has a little more cockpit space for taller or more experienced riders. The Casino series is one of the top selling completes available today. Designed to ride like a Pro's bike on an amateur's budget. We make this bike in Taiwan to keep the quality high and selected a bunch of after-market Fiction parts so it will last.
Formerly called the Casino XS, the Compact is meant for smaller riders who want the upgradeability of a 20" but the riding size of an 18" bike. Designed to ride like a Pro bike on an Am budget. We make this bike in Taiwan to keep the quality high. For 2020 we upgraded to the after-market Fiction Atlas tires.
Looking for a bike that looks and rides like a pro bike but won't break the bank? The 2021 Heist has you covered! In this model we introduce ChroMoly for higher strength, ano, and every bearing is sealed (-pedals). The Heist also comes equipped with a bunch of aftermarket parts.
The Max is an amazing big boy wheelie bike but where other brands fail and the Max rules is when you ride it like a real BMX bike! 100% ChroMoly, 100% sealed bearings & Mob cranks makes the Max a clear market leader.
The new upgraded Overlord now has a longer top tube, sealed integrated headset, sealed hubs, Mythos pedals, Sumo guard sprocket & two pegs - this package ready to hit the streets.
The cruiser that helped start the big bike craze! The Saint has a proven geometry, armored with 100% chromoly tubes in its frame, fork & bar, all sealed bearings & Mob cranks make this bike hard to beat!
The Sinner was the first brakeless free-coaster street complete ever made. The Sinner just keeps getting better and better. As always the Sinner has style that was raised in the streets and is ready to ride.
The Spade set the standard for 22" wheeled complete bikes. Perfect geometry that rides like a frame-up build but wont break the bank. Everything is ChroMoly and everything is sealed (-pedals). Slim seat and alloy throttle pedals make this the perfect build.
The Zeke is a great all around bike that can pull that mile long wheelie or three out of the bowl, and did we mention it looks cool? 100% ChroMoly, 100% sealed bearings (-pedals) & Mob cranks round out this iconic bike.
The Astron is our fully-fledged skatepark machine with a visual appearance that will leave the competition in envy. In addition to the lower standover and responsive park-inspired geometry, the Astron is kitted out with a Salt gyro setup and lighter Saltplus 2.30" Burn tires, making it the weapon of choice for the technical park rider who wants a bike with an unmatched parts list and a paint finish that can't be found anywhere else.
Back for 2021 is our Ceptor 26" cruiser. Taking our BMX heritage and applying it to a larger 26" wheel, we created the perfect bike to take you from A to B while allowing you to shred anything in your path on your way. The BMX-inspired 26-10 gearing is backed up by a Radio Pro cassette hub as well as sealed bearings throughout. The rubber is taken care of by Radio Helix 2.3" tires and the rest of the bike is laced together with a healthy dose of Saltplus goodies.
The Cobalt line combines proven geometry and dialed components, giving you the best start out of the gate during your first days racing. The Cobalt line took off so much that we decided to add a Pro size to the lineup, allowing more riders to enjoy one of the best entry-level race bikes on the market! Fresh out of the box with incredible new paint and graphics, you'll be able to spot a Cobalt on the track very easily. All Cobalt bikes now feature fully sealed front hubs and integrated headsets, making them simply unbeatable when comparing price to spec. The Cobalt is one seriously unstoppable machine.
The Darko is a solid spec'd, vibrant bike for the new-school street shredder. The frame comes with fully removable brake hardware and the bars use the flangeless Radio XL grips, giving the Darko a sleek and modern look. A fat combo seat and shorter 13.2" chainstays finish off this incredible bike built for the streets.
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My earlier post on Prediction Markets discussed why prediction markets for the water industry. They are the next frontier in water markets—information markets to improve planning and decision-making in the face of uncertainty about legislative and regulatory actions, political change, hydrology, project operations, litigation outcomes and water prices. Currently, discussions of the future are often little more than unsubstantiated opinion. The water industry can do better.
Prediction markets involve the trading of a contract tied to future outcomes. The market price is an estimate of the probability of the future outcome occurring. Prediction markets have predicted elections and policy outcomes in the public sector and sales forecasting, project completion dates, R&D success and other commercial questions in the private sector.
The University of Iowa has run prediction markets on Presidential elections since 1988. Academic studies have shown that the pricing from the Iowa Electronic Market is a superior predictor of election outcomes than polling. A review of how prices changed in the 2012 presidential election market illustrates how prices are informative about questions generally debated by dueling pundits during the election.
Two contracts traded on the Iowa Electronic Market. The Obama contact would pay $1 if President Obama secured more votes than Mitt Romney. If Mitt Romney secured more votes than President Obama, then the Obama contract would have paid nothing. Anyone could register on the Iowa Electronic Market and trade Obama contracts or Romney contracts (that would have paid $1 if Mitt Romney secured more votes than President Obama and zero if President Obama garnered more votes).
The prices set for these contracts during the campaign provided real-time estimates of the probability that the candidate named in the contract would receive the most votes in the 2012 election. Since the pricing in these markets changed over time, they give information on how the probability of success for a candidate varied over time.
What was the impact of the first presidential debate on expected outcome of the 2012 Presidential election? Did the price of the Obama contract increase or decline?
Answer: On the eve of the first Presidential Debate, the Obama contract sold at 77 cents and the Romney contract sold for 23 cents. After the debate, the price of the Obama contract steadily declined to 65 cents and the price of a Romney contract steadily increased to 35 cents by the eve of the Vice Presidential Debate. The prediction market said that Romney significantly improved his chances of winning by his performance at the first Presidential debate. Nonetheless, President Obama remained the front-runner.
What was the impact of the Vice Presidential Debate and the other Presidential Debates on the expected outcome of the 2012 Presidential election? Did the price of the Obama contract increase or decline?
Answer: Generally speaking, the price of Obama contracts continued to decline and the price of Romney contracts continue to rise through October 24, 2012 (five days before Superstorm Sandy hit the New Jersey shore), where the Obama contract fell to 61 cents and the Romney contract rose to 42 cents.
Thereafter, the trends reversed so that by the eve of the election, the price of the Obama contract rebounded to 79 cents and the price of the Romney contract plummeted to 22 cents. By Election Day, a Romney victory at a 22% probability was not likely.
The predictive superiority of market pricing reflects the operation of markets, where markets aggregate all information and analysis held by market participants. Individuals who believe current pricing overstates the probability of the traded outcome would trade against the contract. Individuals who believe current pricing understates the probability of the traded outcome would trade in support of the contract. The market interaction of this trading pushes prices to levels that reflect the diversity of participant’s beliefs. Academic research concludes that prediction markets harness the “Wisdom of Crowds” (the collective information of participants) and yield superior forecasts than expert opinion.
Prediction markets are a source of additional information considered in decision-making. Use this information in conjunction with information provided by other forecasts and expert opinion. Prediction markets provide quantitative assessments of issues often discussed with only qualitative assessments.
Prediction markets have grown substantially in recent years. Firms have established markets on sales forecasts, likelihood that product development will be successful, projects completion meeting deadlines, and other issues relevant to corporate planning. Firms using prediction markets include Google, Microsoft, General Electric, Proctor & Gamble, Mitre Corporation, Ford, Rand Corporation, hedge funds and investment banks. The U.S. government is also turning to prediction markets. The intelligence community has developed classified markets on national security issues involving the trading among 5,000 intelligence personnel.
Prediction markets have gone Hollywood. The investment banking and bond-trading firm Canter Fitzgerald has operated the Hollywood Stock Exchange (www.hsx.com) since 1996. Trading is open to the public who receive $2 million of Hollywood Dollars (fantasy currency). Markets estimate the gross proceeds of new releases, likelihood of new projects reaching commercial production, and many other issues related to entertainment management. Studios use pricing on the exchange as input into business decisions. Further, Canter Fitzgerald sells proprietary analysis of trading patterns to financial firms and studios, which combine the pricing information and analysis with other sources to decide which films to invest in, which to release, how much promotion money to invest in a new release, and which scripts to look at in the future.
How does one assess the accuracy of prediction markets? For example, suppose that a prediction market’s price settles at 60 cents before the resolution of the outcome (for example, the contract paying $1 if a bill becomes law trades at 60 cents the day before the Governor signs or vetoes the law). With an estimated probability of 60% becoming law, it is more likely than not that the bill becomes law. Does the governor signing the law confirm the prediction? Alternatively, does a gubernatorial veto invalidate the prediction? The answer is not necessarily. The validity of prediction markets cannot be determined by looking at one prediction. We need to look at the accuracy of markets over a larger number of circumstances.
In his book Oracles: How Prediction Markets Turn Employees into Visionaries, Donald N. Thompson discusses the predictive accuracy of prediction markets run by Inkling Markets, a Chicago-based company that has operated more than 7,000 prediction markets for companies and governments worldwide. As shown in the figure below, the closing prices predict the frequency of the traded events actually occurring. For example, when closing prices are 20 cents, 30 cents, 40 cents and so on, the frequency of the events occurring is 20 percent, 30 percent, 40 percent and so on. This prediction record confirms the power of prediction markets.
Chart provided by Adam Siegel, Founder and CEO of Inkling Markets
The Future: Why Not the Water Industry?
Innovation in computer software, market structures and hardware has increased technical capabilities to devise and operate prediction markets. Years of experience suggest that prediction markets designed and executed by best management practices will maximize the prospect that prediction markets generate useful information. Markets can be designed to answer many types of questions:
a yes or no question (will a bill pass),
question about a number (what will be the declared yield of a water project next year)
question about timing (when will a designated project milestone be met, if at all)
questions that have multiple outcomes (will a defined risk occur and, if so, what would be its impact)
As discussed in my earlier post in this series, these structures can accommodate the variety of questions about the future challenging planning and decision-making in the water industry. The technical capabilities are immense. The tools have almost unlimited application.
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This entry was posted in Prediction Markets, What They Are on March 27, 2013 by Rodney T. Smith.
Rodney T. Smith, Ph.D., President of Stratecon Inc.—an economics and strategic planning consulting firm—advises public and private sector water users on the acquisition, sale and leasing of water rights and water supplies in the western U.S. He is routinely involved in economic valuation of water rights, water investments, and negotiation of water acquisition and transportation agreements and has served as an expert witness in the economic valuation of groundwater resources, disputes over the economic interpretation of water contracts, economics of water conservation and water use practices, and the socio-economic impacts of land fallowing. For more information, see www.stratwater.com.
View all posts by Rodney T. Smith →
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Clark Kent takes off his glasses and suddenly he’s Superman. Jo Farmer leaves work and suddenly she’s a person experiencing mental illness. The facade is superficial but somehow works. For a long time, this was me. A mental health consumer who happened to...
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by JoFarmer | Sep 1, 2019 | All, My story
As the train doors close at Melbourne Central, a family push their way on. A single, solitary drip falls from the father. It isn’t raining; they aren’t carrying anything. Parliament station. Where did the drip come from? I stare at the drip trying to work...
The fat girl who cares about health
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I recently went to a public health conference. In addition to leaving with the world’s most ironic dose of gastro, I came away thinking about what it means to be a fat person working in a public health landscape focused on obesity prevention. An off-the-cuff...
Victorian Royal Commission into Mental Health
by JoFarmer | Jun 18, 2019 | All, My story, News, Sector insights
As one of their election commitments, the Andrews Government pledged to hold a Royal Commission into the Victorian Mental Health System. This is an incredible opportunity for those with a lived experience, often left out of the policymaking process, to shape the...
The process
by JoFarmer | May 19, 2019 | All, My story
I’ve lost a lot of weight recently. Almost 40kg this year. It’s one of the common side effects of having most of your stomach removed, and is, after all, the reason I did it. Actually, that’s not quite true. The main reason I chose to have a gastric...
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I’m a policymaker and evaluator focused on improving the health and wellbeing of all Australians, particularly those who experience mental illness and complex disadvantage.
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Many families have special traditions for the holiday season, with heart-warming tales that are lovingly passed on from one generation to the next.
This is not one of those tales. (Though it could be considered a humorous anecdote.)
It happened during a Christmas season in the late 1970’s. I don’t remember exactly when, but my brother was still in the first stages of elementary school, which suggests the period of 1976 to 1979. The scene was in my childhood home town of Homer, New York, during one of the heavier winter snowfalls, about a week before Christmas. My family used actual trees at Christmas well into the 1980’s, so each year we would find a suitable pine tree to fill our living room. After the holidays, the remains of the tree would be put along the side of the house where it served as a shelter for birds and other animals until it was broken down for compost in the spring.
We generally tried to acquire a tree one week before Christmas, so that it would still have most of its needles through January 5th (Epiphany, or Twelfth Night). One of our “go to” places for a Christmas tree was a place called Forest Fisheries in Homer. It was a local business that sold gear for hunting and fishing, as well as various other sports that were popular in the region. It’s still in business, and now sells boats and all-terrain vehicles in addition to hunting and fishing equipment. During the Christmas season they sold trees (and may still), mostly from local tree farms. White pine and blue spruce grow in great quantities in upstate New York, so they were always in good supply.
This particular year we had a unique problem: our car was in repair. My father had arranged a carpool to his office at SUNY with a co-worker, my brother and I could both walk or bike to school, and there were some small local grocery stores in Homer at the time. So basic needs were not a problem. But how were we going to get a Christmas tree to the house without a car?
I had a small, wooden sleigh. roughly five feet in length (think of Citizen Kane’s “Rosebud”). Forest Fisheries was only four blocks from our home, so that year we decided to use that sleigh to transport a tree back to the house. So, during the driving snow, the four of us dragged that sleigh over to the place, picked out a nice blue spruce, loaded it up, then dragged it home.
Many people saw this display: a family of four, with the family dog happily marching along side, bringing home a Christmas tree on a wooden sleigh. It probably looked like something from a Currier and Ives print. For a few years after that we had people complement us on our “lovely family tradition.”
The truth is we didn’t enjoy it at all! The tree refused to stay lashed to the sleigh, and had to be re-tied at least twice. My brother ended up riding on the sleigh with the tree, holding it by the trunk to keep it in place. Pine needles fell out of his hair for days afterward. A layer of ice had formed under the snow in the streets of Homer, which made the sleigh hard to control, and footing very difficult. I fell down at least four times. Over the course of the trip, the snowfall went from moderate to heavier-than-usual, even by Central New York standards. Our dog Sparky, who was generally loyal to a fault, got sick of the whole thing and eventually ran ahead home.
We never did that again. After the ordeal, my parents decided that if we were ever in a situation like this again, we would order an artificial tree from the Sear’s catalog, and just hope it arrived in time. As it turned out, we never again were without a functioning car at Christmas, and we didn’t switch to an artificial tree until I was in college.
But even so, for many years after that people would ask us about our perceived family tradition of bringing home a Christmas tree on a sleigh, and how we would disappoint them. I now wonder how many romantic notions we managed to shatter. I now find that when I look at a Currier and Ives painting on a holiday card, and I see people riding in horse-drawn sleighs and what not, I have to ask myself if the people in that scene were really enjoying themselves, or if they were longing to be indoors in front of a warm fire!
Are they really having fun, or just indulging the viewer?
Posted on December 24, 2017 December 24, 2017 Categories FamilyTags Currier & Ives (Firm), Forest Fisheries (Firm), Homer (N.Y. : Town)
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A few weeks back, I spoke to 5x entrepreneur and angel investor David Cancel for The Lean B2B Podcast. We talked about customer centricity, the commoditization of SaaS, growth, and various strategies to learn and iterate early business models.
You can watch the full interview below, or access it on iTunes or Spotify.
Etienne Garbugli: My guest today is David Cancel. David is the co-founder and CEO of Drift, the world’s first conversational marketing and sales platform. Before, David founded several technology companies, four of which Compete, Ghostery, Lookery, and Performable were acquired. Performable was acquired by HubSpot where he led product from scale up to IPO. David is also an investor and advisor in dozens of startups.
David Cancel: Thank you for having me. I’m excited to talk today.
Etienne Garbugli: Great. So maybe a bit of a question on a tangent. In a great interview that you gave to Patrick Campbell, you talked about the importance of focusing on a shift in behavior when starting a business, be it a buying process or messaging, what would you say was the starting point for Drift?
David Cancel: That’s a great question. It’s something I think a lot about now, but as like an early entrepreneur I never thought about enough. Right? One of my mistakes. So for us, the shift that we saw, we saw a couple of shifts. So, I’ll talk about the first two.
The most important one was that we saw us moving into the commodity phase of SaaS software.
And what I mean by that is that in any given category, now there’s hundreds, if not thousands of alternatives. And the rate at which those are being created, a new SaaS offerings is exploding, right? So accelerating. And what that means is it means on a macro sense that we’re moving from a world where us, the companies could control the sales process to all the power moving towards the end user, the buyer.
And so we saw like the rise of, you know, a buyer-centric world versus a company-centric world. And so we knew that we had to rethink everything there. And then when we saw another, another mega trend which was, messaging had finally hit a tipping point where we were all defaulting into messaging as the number one way we were communicating.
And because of that, we, yeah. Oh, we can finally use messaging for sales, not just support.
Etienne Garbugli: So, I went back in time to Web Archives, and I looked at early versions of the Drift messaging. So, how did you guys get from…
David Cancel: Oh my goodness. I’m nervous to hear that.
Etienne Garbugli: Well, how did you guys get from this initial vision to the first version that you guys launched in November, 2015, if I’m not mistaken.
David Cancel: Yeah, that’s exactly right. The short answer is that we iterated a ton with early customers, and Patrick Campbell was actually our first paying customer over at ProfitWell. And so we got a bunch of friends. Luckily, we had a bunch of friends that we did tap in companies and say, you know, work with us.
And we did something that I do often, which is to basically go off at the beginning of a product, find early customers. Most importantly, get them to pay me even before we’ve created anything. But the payment could be anything. It’s basically how much money they have in their pocket. I think, you know, people have paid us 20 bucks, five bucks, 10 bucks, whatever they have.
That’s an important step in it. And then we give them access to whatever the software becomes for life. You know, that’s the exchange. And then they help us build the product. It’s important to get some dollar amount from them, whatever. It doesn’t matter what the number is. Versus working with a beta partner and them never paying you, so they have to have that skin in the game. It’s super important. No matter how ridiculously small the amount is.
And so we started working with all of them that got us, and we iterated kind of in, some would call it stealth mode, but we weren’t really stealth. We just didn’t have any energy to actually publicize anything. And so we did that. And then we iterated, so the first version in November of 2015.
Etienne Garbugli: Okay. Okay. But there were products before, before that.
David Cancel: Oh yeah. So, yeah, that we killed, we killed that. We killed three different product versions. That were, you know, some that we spent a week on, some we spent a couple of months on, some we spent several months on, and we would just quickly kill them as we were testing with this initial set.
Etienne Garbugli: And what were the criteria that, that made you decide to kill those versions of the product? What made you decide that these were not that the right ones to build on?
David Cancel: Ah, that’s a good question because that’s one of the most difficult things to, to figure out as an entrepreneur because as entrepreneurs and product people and creators, we have a happy years, right?
We don’t want to kill our creations and our babies. And so we hear what we want to hear and for us is that we kept using this thing that I call the dollar test, which I kind of briefly described there with new people and trying to see if new people who would tell us who the, we would get feedback from new people, new customers.
Potential customers, I should say. And, we would always get them when they indicated interest to try to pay us. And we kept seeing that with various versions that basically people didn’t care enough to even part with 20 bucks that was in their wallet. And then we knew we were not onto something.
But you know, everyone is default to be nice and they’re willing to waste and an insane amount of time, you know, thousands of dollars of bare time. Uh, you know, meeting with you and giving you feedback, but they’re not willing to part with 20 bucks. There’s something there’s a psychological thing there that happens.
Etienne Garbugli: So in a way, the exchange of money was the acid test to figure out if these different products were cutting it for you.
David Cancel: Yeah. It’s remarkable because if you spend time creating things, it is remarkable how many strangers and friends will spend thousands, and thousands and thousands of dollars of their own time and energy just saying nice things to you and giving you feedback and trying to help because they’re genuinely trying to help and not offend you. Uh, but they, you know, they even know, they, they know that they’re not interested in the product, that they wouldn’t buy, that they wouldn’t use it.
And so we found accidentally this path to short cutting this, of just going straight towards, you know. Getting some dollar amount from them. And when I’ve described this to other entrepreneurs, and I’ve seen other entrepreneurs use this, they, they get too wound up on, well, I don’t want to give away too much value and I don’t want to give this.
And what about if it’s worth this much? And like they try to optimize too much on what the price is. And for us it’s just very simple. It’s any exchange. If they have $5 in their pocket, I will take the $5 and I will give them lifetime access to that software.
Etienne Garbugli: So you’re not looking at a certain threshold in terms of being able to figure out the business model at that stage.
David Cancel: Not at that stage. Later, we start to do that. We start to refine the pricing, but once we’ve hit a critical mass and critical masses, you know, different for everyone. For us, it’s defined by how big we think the market is. And some, you know, do we have hundreds, thousands of customers?
Again, it depends on your business, but once we feel like we have a critical mass of early evangelists.
Then, and only then do we start to price test, but we never go back and try to extract more money from those early customers or raise their prices. We always honor that forever. And, instead we only apply those price increases or changes to new customers.
Etienne Garbugli: Okay. At that stage and beyond, how did you go about identifying the gaps in your knowledge around the business or the product strategy?
Etienne Garbugli: Yeah. Like what you need to learn or what you need to get insights in.
David Cancel: Yeah. We set like very small increment. We have grandiose and insane, um, you know, high level visions of what we want to do. So big dreams. But then we set very small, almost laughable tactical goals.
And, we, we optimize for them to be super, super quick experiments. So we’ll always have a goal of all we’re trying to figure out this day or this week is like, how do we increase this amount of usage or people to get from A to B, or people to pay when they’re not paying, or for people to sign up.
You know, we always have like some goal, but it’s basically. All of those goals sum up to one thing in the early days at the beginning, which is how do we get, as Kevin Kelly would say, your first thousand true fans. How do we get a thousand people in the world to care about this? Even if they’re paying us nothing or very little depends on your product.
For us, it’s always they’re paying us something, but like it doesn’t matter what they’re paying us, but can we get a thousand people in the world to care about this thing? And what’s standing and today, what is the biggest blocker from getting those thousand people? We’ll work on that.
And then tomorrow we’ll work on the next thing on that list. And you know, so forth.
Etienne Garbugli: And that is a company-wide or is it specific to the product, particularly.
David Cancel: You know, in the early days it’s, uh, it’s company-wide because it’s, we’re all doing everything together, right? There’s no functional distinction really in early days, and then later once we’re like at our stage and we’re doing this kind of stuff, there is functional separation, but we’re all working on different parts of the same goal.
So we have the same shared high level goal as a company or as a team or as a sub-unit, and then we’re all divvying up what we can do to align to that goal. That’s our point of alignment.
Etienne Garbugli: Okay. Okay. You’ve been a really big proponent of customer centricity. You wrote about this, you wrote books, you read a lot of posts, which is great. Do you think it’s possible to get there without a customer centric approach?
David Cancel: Uh, Abs… 100%. It happens every single day. Most companies in the world are not customer centric. Um, and I think most successful companies that we would model today, or that we would look at today, are not consumer centric.
I think that is the very reason that we exist as Drift and why we started the company, which is like, I think those days are over because all markets. The, basically the, the Internet has done one thing right over time and it’s finally compounded to this point and we’re finally at the point where it removes all friction out of markets, right?
It just goes in every market you look at friction is being removed, whether it’s an offline market or online market because of the internet and penetration and things that we can do now. And when that happens. In every given market, what happens is you move from a sea of monopolies or, or, um, you know, uh, a set of monopolies in those markets, you know, to it being open to everyone being able to compete in that market at a global, in a global way.
And when that happens is, uh, you have mass commoditization that’s happening every market, whether it’s direct to consumer, whether it’s B2B, whether it doesn’t matter what you are doing there, there are still monopolies left, but most of them are being toppled. And when that happens, the power we believe moves from the company to the customer because now you have thousands of alternatives on how to spend your money.
Where before maybe you had one or two, uh, and in that world, this. Insane. Um, view on customer centricity that we have, I think will become the, the norm. And, you know, this will take decades to play out, but will become the norm and will be the only way that you go to market. Uh, this idea that you will create stuff in isolation and not care about, uh, how the customer experiences it, which is not just the product, but every touch point, you know, along the way from your marketing to your sales, to your support, to your in-person kind of events to everything that you do is a customer touch point. It will matter.
These are not new ideas I should say. You know, people like Forrester and many others have been talking about the rise of customer centricity, customer centric businesses and the customer experience for 20 years, at least now. But the point is, we were at the point in the market where it didn’t matter because we didn’t have the mass commoditization effect happen yet.
And so we still had monopolies in our market. So it didn’t matter for you to adopt customer experience, kind of focus. Well, we’re past that. We’re in a different market now, and everyone that you would talk to would agree that we’re in a world of commoditization now. And so like now you have to compete on experience.
Etienne Garbugli: Well, if you look at a lot of data points that the team at ProfitWell has shared, there’s still that gap between what people they do. Do you feel like, like right now it’s still a competitive advantage if you are in that mindset where you’re customer centric, and how long do you think that position will stand?
David Cancel: I think it depends on the market that you’re in. The easier it is to compete in those markets, like digital products, like SaaS and software, I think we probably have, you know, a. At most max of five-year kind of advantage right now for companies to get in and really compete on customer centricity and, and the customer experience that comes out of that.
Maybe less, probably two to five I would say. Right? That gap is closing quickly. But then, uh, your harder markets, your offline markets, your markets where it’s more of a physical change that you have to, uh, conduct and not just digital. There, I think you probably have a good 10 year run, 10 year kind of advantage that you can have if you compete this way.
Etienne Garbugli: Okay. Okay. And at this stage, how do your recommend founders prioritize features or functionally groups, when they’re expanding their product?
David Cancel: Yeah. To me, you know, it comes down to our approach, which is this, um, which is the approach that we stumbled upon, you know, over a decade ago and started to build, first it started out as, uh, an engineering and development methodology.
Then it turned into kind of a product and design. And engineering methodology. And now it’s expanded to a company-wide methodology around this building things around the customer. And so we look at how we prioritize features and do all of that kind of stuff that you mentioned, uh, by. From the customer themselves. Right?
And that does not mean, again, that the customer gives you a list of features and you implement those features because it is your job to interpret and understand the customer. They don’t know what’s possible. They don’t know how to express features. They don’t know how to do roadmaps. I don’t believe in public roadmaps. Um, first thing. So I’ve never done those. Um, or I try hard to avoid them.
Uh, it has to do with how do we continue to solve for the customer problem over our problem. And that is a deeply, um, that’s, that’s more of a psychological kind of hurdle that we have to get through because we all have egos.
Uh, no matter how humble you think you are, we, uh, we all have egos. And so our egos get in the way every single day in the way that we make decisions, uh, around our companies, but specifically around product. And, you know, why did we design something like this? Because we wanted to be cool.
We wanted it to be clever. We wanted it to be different. We wanted it to look like, uh, no one else. What does that mean? That means that most of our customers probably have no experience with that pattern or that design. And then we’ll just might just end up frustrating that customer because we put, we prioritize our own ego and our own satisfaction and pride over the customer.
So most of our work that we do in this, in this has less to do with listening to the exact words that the customer tells us. And it has to do more with setting up internal guard rails. We call them, and systems to try to express, stamp out and extinguish our pride and ego from our decision-making process.
And that’s why we look towards models like. Uh, whether it’s, uh, Warren Buffet and Charlie Munger, whether we look at Ray Dalio or whether we look at different people who make systematic-based decisions and how do they remove their own personal bias and their own personal egos out of that decision-making.
That’s where we spend all of our time thinking and looking at, which helps us then serve the customer.
Etienne Garbugli: Hmm. So that’s super interesting. So, can I ask like what are some of the process that you put in place to be able to really remove the ego from the decision-making?
David Cancel: Oh yeah. They’re, they’re, you know, painful.
I’d say them the most, uh, very painful even for, you know, all of us. That gets in the way, I think, um, forcing, creating guardrails about being intellectually honest around the metrics that we use, uh, the feedback that we get and, and therefore being able to push back on people when they’re presenting, when they’re making an argument for something, um, that is probably the most effective thing that we do, but also the hardest, because again, people do not want to tell other people bad news. They don’t want to seem offensive. They don’t want to seem mean. They don’t want to seem contrarian. So that kind of rigor, which we have to practice every day, that’s less around a form, less about a formula and more about a daily practice and ritual that we do and we hold ourselves accountable to, that’s the most effective.
On the most easy to replicate side of things. If you go to the other end of the spectrum, we do things like, uh, you know, how we prioritize, you know, the feedback that we do get from our customers. How do we, um, how do we convince. You know, a product team and engineering team, a marketing team to do something, we use the words of a customer always.
So we kind of, uh, put together feedback and ratings and reviews and comments, but we literally highlight the words of a customer. Right? Here’s feedback that we got from a customer, whether it was through chat or email, or they posted this on a third-party review site, or they did this on a call.
We constantly mine calls and videos and voice and all these kinds of different mediums to literally find the words of the customer and do that in mass. So at scale so that we can see the trends of what our customers are actually saying, which goes back to no surprise, conversational marketing and the stuff that we’re doing.
All of our customers are telling us. They have told us since the beginning of the time, the problem is that we did not, we did not have technologies and ways to actually capture and make sense of this information. Part of why we exist and what we’re doing is like, because now we can finally do that.
We can get in the middle of video voice calls, uh, obviously chats, obviously emails, and we could amass and start to make sense of what is the customer actually telling us versus what are we interpreting or what are we aggregating or what are we saying that they say no, literally, I want to see what they said.
And so that that is the most effective means that our, that we use in our team across product, sales, marketing, the executive team on how we make decisions. We actually amass the words of our customers. And then the sentiment that we see expressed because of that. We use something starting to rant on this for so long.
I could go on forever. So, you know, we used to use NPS, so Net Promoter Score, everyone listening to this probably knows what that is. We used to use then. And we use that in my last company, HubSpot as well. Uh, but the problem that we saw from that, from a product making decision, a standpoint was that it’s a very lagging indicator on the changes that you’re making today.
And the other problem that we saw with it is that the actual literal question, is not the question that people think it’s answering. So we, we kind of look at it, most of us and think like, Oh, this tells you how happy customers are, or like how much they love our product.
That’s not the question. The question is, how likely would you be to recommend this to a friend? And because that question is very different. Sometimes you get weird side effects, like you may be selling a product in a market like we were at HubSpot. We’re even at Drift where you may not know anybody else.
You may not be friends with anybody else who has your job. So you may score it low from a Net Promoter Score standpoint. Uh, even though you love the product, and we would see this happen where they would give a low score, but in the comments, they’d say, I love this product. I can’t live without it. This is the best thing ever. But yet they gave us a detractive score, and they’d say, the reason why, it’s like, Oh, I don’t know any other marketers I can recommend this to. Right?
So like very lagging and weird indicators. So instead of using NPS, we use another thing, which is called product-market fit score and, and you can, people can search for it.
And it’s, it was put together by, originally it was Sean Ellis, um, put this score together. And I had worked with him back in 2010, uh, and we used to work, use it a lot. And then, Rahul from a company called Superhuman. I’m an investor in Superhuman. He took it to the next level, and he use it as a systematic approach on different features.
And we use that internally. So we’ll ask our, our, our customers the product-market fit score’s question, which is simply, if we were to take this feature or this product away, you know, how, you know, how upset would you be? Would you be, you know, and there’s a range. There’s three different ways you’d be like, I’m not upset at all.
I’d be mildly upset. Well, I’d be devastated, and I’m paraphrasing, that’s not the exact words, but we use that every single day with different features and different things that we’re doing to get more of a real-time handle on how the things that we’re building are affecting our customers and whether they’re actually moving the needle for them or not.
So if you’re in product, if you’re listening, look up the product-market fit score. So PMF score, and look at how you could be using that as a more real-time measure versus a lagging indicator like NPS.
Etienne Garbugli: That’s very interesting. I spoke to Rahul, I think tree weeks ago and. Yeah, we talked about that specifically how they use that as a guidepost to always test against their progress, and I thought like your, what you were mentioning about money initially is kindof the same thinking a little bit where you have this exit criteria that helps you understand if you’re truly making progress.
David Cancel: Yeah. Every, all of these things are what, what’s, what’s interesting to me after all these companies on all these years that go by.
So is that how simple things are really how simple all of this stuff is like we already have the answers solid. I, I have this reoccurring, I don’t know if it’s a nightmare or dream, but I would this thought, I should say that, that my day, on my death bed, the thing that I will be thinking beyond all my family and experiences on this will be like that I always knew the answer, but it took me this long or answers, I should say this long too fricking to figure it out. Right, because the answers are pretty simple, but we overcomplicate everything.
And, uh, and so like, you know, guardrails and guard posts, guide posts like you just talked about, like that part of marketing score, we use the dollar test or whatever.
These are simple things that already exist. If you look at history and you look in other markets that are not your own markets, that people are doing very simple approaches. And common-sense approaches to doing all of this stuff, but we overcomplicate it because we always think everything’s different.
The world has changed. This is different. That’s different. It’s different. You know what? Humans have not evolved, so our decision-making processes are the same. Again, this is from a marketing and product standpoint and just management standpoint. Why I spend so much time rereading and rereading and reanalyzing.
All the different cognitive biases, all the books you can think about, human decision-making, all of those, you know, books that I’d never spend time thinking about in social psychology and triggers and how we make things. I spend all my time thinking about that because it is the human and it is the incentives and the systems and how we think that are always the same, that are never going to change.
Etienne Garbugli: Yeah. I think that’s one of the most powerful ideas in the book that David Gerhardt wrote and that I think you taught him and I was super interested in, in terms of how you guys are building marketing.
David Cancel: Just, it’s a very different approach. You starting, you invert, right, which is a Charlie Munger kind of concept that at least that he’s popularized and he didn’t invent, but like you always invert, you start from the other way around, which is like, you know, not start the traditional way that we think about marketing, but like let’s invert it and let’s start like how to make people, how do people make decisions based on the marketing that they see? Okay, let’s start with decision-making. How do people make decisions? And then we spent all of our time doing that and then finally focusing on copywriting and then finally focusing on marketing programs.
So it was like the other way around. And, and that leads to, I think, to better results if you can invert a problem.
Etienne Garbugli: But in that sense, if you guys started with money changing hands as the first guideposts initially, like how did that evolve afterwards? Did you guys set another benchmark or another way to track that progress?
David Cancel: Yeah, so yeah, we set a ton of them. We kept doing the dollar test, but in different ways. Right? We, we even do it today, you know, with new features or requests from new features, we try to associate monetary, uh, of monetary value or cost, I should say. To them when we talk to a customer of like, yeah, we could probably do that, or maybe we’ll do that, but it’ll probably cost this much. I’m like, would you pay this much? You know?
So we’re like, we are doing that from every conversation. What happens when you do that is most feature requests go away, miraculously, they disappear. And so it lightens your load of, and all the, the decisions that you need to make, if you start assigning value to them and you’re just being honest with them of like it is going to cost more and if you value it.
Uh, you know, you should be, you’re willing to pay for it. So, but people, again, that’s an uncomfortable conversation. We are trained, uh, society trains us not to have uncomfortable, to avoid uncomfortable conversations, I should say. And so like nobody wants to do those, but that’s the very simple, basic way that you can answer these things.
And so we, we would continue to do that test. Then we would, um, as we start to understand our buyers more, and you know, we start to develop personas and we start to like test those personas. We start to test different segments and market. We try to test different, go-to-market approaches. We’re always testing a new thing, but we’re refining who our audience is, who we speak to, what is the messages that resonate with them.
And we just keep getting more and more focused. And this, this is. This happens every single day, but it also happens at the macro sense of like every year I look at what we’re doing as a company and it becomes, you know, one end, the vision and the breadth becomes way bigger. But from a tactical standpoint, it becomes more and more laser-focused every year and a, and I’m finding joy in getting good at things that I’ve never been good at.
Um, I’m not good at them, but I’m trying to get good at them, which is like operational excellence and becoming more and more focused and all these kinds of things, which is as an early. Early stage entrepreneur, serial offender, you know, you’re good at like bouncing around and not staying focused.
Um, and, and so I’m learning new things, which keeps me interested.
Etienne Garbugli: Okay. You were talking about like simplification. It sounds more and more simple or you feel it gets it. It’s simpler than people make it out to be like, maybe if you put it all together, like if an entrepreneur were to start a new business tomorrow, how would you recommend they go about doing that?
David Cancel: Uh, so the, the first thing that I always talk to entrepreneurs about is that to get rid of their ideas to. And we do this as a kind of our mantra getting, uh, as every person gets onboarded and comes to work at Drift, we say the first thing that I talk about when I do onboarding on the first day is like, look, our mentality and our mantra is that all of our ideas here are wrong, right?
And so I would say this to entrepreneurs. All of your ideas are wrong, that should be a mantra. Your ideas are never right. Your goal is to use the scientific process, a.k.a. the feedback loop to work with your market as quickly as possible and have as many iterations of that feedback loop as you possibly can over a month, a week, a year, whatever your timeframe is.
That’s where you want to optimize for as the learning loop, and you need to figure out how wrong your idea is. Is it 5% wrong, right, or off, or is it 100% off? It’s somewhere in between that spectrum. No one has ever had an idea that is 100% on the money and never needs to change and is 100% right from the get-go.
That’s never happened. That is fiction. Right? And so this is what I tell entrepreneurs, this is what I tell everyone at Drift when they join. That is make-believe. The creation process always follows the same path. Whether it’s, doesn’t matter what end of the spectrum you’re at. If you’re a scientist, the scientific process follows the same path, right?
The feedback loop. If you’re an artist, which is the other end of the spectrum that follows the same process, it’s a game of iteration and exploration and you know, stumbling onto things. It’s never, no one ever writes the first paragraph, and that’s the best-selling book. They iterate, they edit.
They go over and over and over again. Same thing in science, but for some reason we as entrepreneurs and as business people have been taught that we’re going to come up with magic ideas in the shower and those shot, those shower ideas are going to be, you know, so solve the world. That’s never ever happened.
I’ve met tens of thousands of entrepreneurs in my career. That has never ever happened one time. So we have to, we have to dispel this, uh, Hollywood fiction. This make-believe fiction that that happens. So you as an entrepreneur, you have to, this has to be your mantra everyday. Our ideas are wrong, our ideas are wrong.
How do I validate? How do I test? How do I iterate? How do I get as many bites as the apple before I run out of money or resources to test these things? And then as I test them and as they, as I learn them. How do I instill this in the second person, third person, the fourth, the hundredth person that joined the company.
So we never lose this and we build a culture and uh, and, and, uh, a machine around this thing every day. That would be the most important thing that I would, I would tell an entrepreneur because most entrepreneurs are exactly like I was. Full of ego, full of pride, right? And, and you have to be in some ways to like persevere through all the pain that you have to get through.
And, uh, and because of that, they can’t listen. They cannot receive feedback. And because they can’t, and when you can’t receive feedback, what inevitably happens is that you fail at whatever you’re trying to do. So if you want to optimize for avoiding failure, you have to optimize for listening.
Etienne Garbugli: That’s really interesting. Thanks for taking the time to join for the podcast. Where can people go to learn more about your work here at Drift and your different investments?
David Cancel: Yeah. So, um, I’m davidcancel.com so like cancel a check and I’m dcancel on every possible social media thing and Drift.com, D-R-I-F-T.com and thank you for taking time with me and most importantly to listen to all the crazy rants that I have because I have no shortage of them.
Etienne Garbugli: No, that was fascinating. Thank you very much for sharing all your insights and I really appreciate it.
David Cancel: Thank you.
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Yesterday, while I was trying to write a blog post about the usual life in London… it happened. Scrolling facebook I saw the news. It was happening. After a few minutes, live transmission started to appear on my news feed. Later, I found that I …
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Posted on September 10, 2015 by Pawel Grabowski in Conversion Rate, Merchandising / Design with 1 Comment
Today’s customers spend more and more time researching products online.
ALlst year’s research by Hybris Software for instance found that 29% of Internet users spend up to half an hour selecting a product to purchase (source).
But why is it taking so long?
Because a lot of this time is now taken up by activities they didn’t engage in before. Like reading online reviews for instance. According to the same research, 82% of users consult opinions of others before purchasing products online.
In this post I’ll show you more reasons why you simply MUST include reviews on your product pages.
And why do I think retailers need convincing about this in the first place?
Some fear negative reviews. Others, not getting any at all.
But the truth is, not including the option for customers to leave feedback only hurts your conversions.
And there is plenty of data to prove it:
61% of customers read online reviews before making a purchase decision. (source)
88% of consumers trust online reviews as much as personal recommendations (source)
According to Econsultancy, site visitors who interact with both reviews and customer questions and answers are 105% more likely to purchase while visiting, and
According to Reevo, reviews help increase sales by up to 18% (source).
Why Are Reviews So Important to Customers?
For starters, they help them justify their own decisions.
I’m sure this has happened to you too.
Unsure which product model to pick, you went for one with the highest number of reviews.
Or when you were buying items you’ve never bought before, you looked at others to see which model others have purchased. And then opted for the same one.
Many people will even ask a fellow shopper for their opinion when shopping in physical store. I’ve done that many times.
This behavior is known as consensus. It was first described by Robert Cialdini in his seminal book, Influence. According to Cialdini:
“When we’re unsure about the correct way of behavior, we’ll look at the behavior of others for cues and signals as to what to do.”
That’s also why we choose a busy restaurant over an empty one, even if it means having to wait to be seated. The sheer volume suggesting previous usage is a good enough clue to confirm what we should do.
We also use them to verify the product’s quality.
In today’s markets filled with cheap and poor quality items, customers find it crucial to verify the product’s quality before buying.
Some scout online forums for opinions. Others ask about it on social media.
But most will simply read what other owners have to say about it in reviews.
Just take a look at the example below. If you were buying a turntable, this review would quickly indicate a design problem with this particular model.
We also do it to establish the site’s trustworthiness
According to iPerceptions, 63% of customers are more likely to make a purchase from a site which has user reviews (source). Why? Because the presence of reviews confirms the site’s trustworthiness.
In other words, by being transparent and allowing unedited customer feedback, the site sends a positive trust signal.
According to Reevo, displaying reviews can produce an 18% uplift in sales (source).
And a research by Zendesk discovered that 90% of respondents admitted that reading positive reviews influenced their buying decision.
Bazzar Voice also established what effect an increase from a number of reviews from one to 15 would have on the number of orders across various industries. Here’s the breakdown of their findings:
What factors influence the conversion power of reviews?
Displaying reviews on your product pages can truly help increase conversions. But as it turns out, it takes more than that for reviews to make an impact.
You need plenty of reviews.
I guess it’s actually quite obvious – the more reviews your product receives, the greater the chance that they will help in convincing someone to buy it.
And according to this research from Smart Insights, this influence on conversions grows with the number of reviews.
But how many reviews do you really need?
It’s actually hard to say. According to BrightLocal for instance, 85% of customers read up to 10 reviews before purchasing.
You also need negative reviews
Shocking, right?
But it’s true. Negative reviews can actually help you sell more.
According to Econsultancy for instance, the presence of negative reviews can help increase conversions up to 67%!
One reason for that is because customers trust reviews more when they see both positive and negative ones. When presented only with positive ones they suspect censorship or faked feedback.
Naturally your profile should include mainly positive reviews. However, those few negative ones might actually help you sell more.
Negative reviews also reaffirm the positive ones
I’m sure you’ve seen negative reviews which clearly suggested that the person simply didn’t understand the product. Or that the fault was clearly theirs. Or that they haven’t used the product as they should have.
And did you know that such reviews only help to reaffirm the product description and the positive reviews?
How? By showing you that there isn’t actually anything wrong with the product. It’s just other people don’t use it as intended.
So if you receive this type of a negative review, don’t hide it. Answer the person’s query and explain why the product didn’t work for them. And then let other visitors see it so that they can understand the real value of a product.
Given the abundance of choice on the market, customers seek reaffirming that a particular product is for them. Reviews, given their unbiased nature provide the best way for them to justify their decisions, confirm the product’s quality and see its real value.
Pawel Grabowski is a copywriter and content marketer obsessed with helping companies attract new customers, build engaged audience & drive more sales. And he’s pretty good at it. See for yourself at smashingcopy.com
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An update at long last. I've been busy working on a few projects lately, though I'm not able to show all of it at the moment. But here's a glimpse of what I've been up to.
Last weekend, VA had a 5 Year retrospective panel at ConVersion. That's right, August marks the 5 year anniversary of Vicious Ambitious. Exciting stuff!
There weren't a lot of people there sadly, but there was jokes, chocolate cake, videos and it's not everyday I get to wear red booty shorts while shaking my goodies to Eye of the Tiger. Anyways, this TronNick pic was for the free poster giveaway at the event. We still have a bunch left so we'll probably be giving them away at the next con in October.
After that we have two pics for the upcoming Alcohol Issue of Beatroute. It was fun to get to do something new for the Beatroute crew aside from a CD review and while I only sorta like the Horny Toad pic, I'm quite pleased with the Bouncer one. Plus, there's a chick in it that actually...gasp...looks like a woman! I've been working hard at improving my rendering of the female form and it is slowly but surely paying off.
In other news, I'm working on pages of my Rocket Juice story and will scan them very soon to give you a peek at the pencils before Ink Wizard CogNoman works them over. I was trying to do this comic very quick and simple, but the first page already has more background's than ever. I'm very excited to show it off, and will post some pages soon.
This morning, I also finished the first script for a secret project I'm working on which will see the light of day sometime in the winter, I'm hoping. It's going to be tons of fun and I'll keep updating as work progresses. It's not a comic, but it is about comics.
And I think that's it for now. I'm going to finish the layouts for Holiday Men very soon and am eager to start drawing in September. Realistically, I think we'll start up again in October.
Oh, you should check out Tropical Thunder too. It's hilarious! Oh, and read some books by Stephen King's boy, Joe Hill. Heart Shaped Box was freaking great! And his short stories are wonderful.
Posted by MR. NICK at 3:17 PM
2 comments:
That Bouncer reminds me of my buddy Ed. He was also my boss when I bounced at some clubs in Winnipeg. He was a Tank. Only 5'7, but I thnk we was 4 feet wide :D
Chicks are coming along great as well.
August 26, 2008 at 5:52 AM
MR. NICK said...
I was kinda worried my take on the bouncer was too stereotypical, but then I guess that stereotype exists for a reason:)
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When dealing with an extreme financial pinch, companies like Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL, will help you relieve the stress. Missouri Title Loans, Inc. is a direct lender that specializes in payday loans, installment loans, and title loans. They have offices in some US states. You can apply for Missouri Title Loans, Inc. offers and get instant approval.
Often, direct lenders will transfer the cash in under 24 hours, allowing the borrower to respond to the problem quickly. You can know about the status of your application just 15 minutes after sending the request.
You need to indicate some basic details, including proof of income and contact information, to get approved. Also, your credit score doesn’t have to be excellent to get the loan. Lending companies like Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL, want to know you can afford to repay the debt, so they focus on your source of income to calculate the amount you can receive.
Besides, you don’t need collateral for most deals, as they’re short-term and depend on your income. These products are designed to help you when you need money instantly.
What Is Missouri Title Loans, Inc., and Is It Legit?
Missouri Title Loans, Inc. is a company in the financial services sector that specializes in payday loans. It also offers other short-term loans, including title and installment ones. Missouri Title Loans, Inc. is a legit lending company with more than 2,000 stores across the United States.
Benefits of Using Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL
There are many reasons you want to use Missouri Title Loans, Inc. payday loans in East St Louis, IL. The company has the best solutions for people who need quick cash.
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Convenient Loan Process – Applying for a payday loan at Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL, is a straightforward process. You don’t need an appointment with a loan officer to get the money. Also, the provider does not demand extensive information that may require personal research. You only need to fill out a simple form that you can access online on the lender’s website.
Few Requirements – Unlike traditional credits, Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, Illinois, does not have a complicated procedure. Payday loans don’t require collateral, and in most cases, all you need is to prove you can afford to repay the debt by demonstrating proof of income. Other requirements include being 18 years or older, proof of citizenship, and an active checking account.
Services Offered
Title Loans
Services Offered
Personal Loans
Common Uses of Online Loans From Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, Illinois
There are many reasons you might borrow money from Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, Illinois. Depending on your needs, the organization can approve any amount, from $100 to $3500 or more. Here are the most common reasons people opt for short-term loans from direct lenders.
Loan Consolidation – For those with pending credit, applying for cash from Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL, could be the right solution to settle an expensive loan. If the lender can offer a cheaper rate, you can clear the old debt. Thus, you can breathe a sigh of relief.
Loan for Bills – In different situations, you might get caught by bills before receiving your paycheck. If the latter is a few weeks away, Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL, could help you alleviate the stress. You can expect the short-term loan to be approved within a few minutes, and the cash will be released to your account by the next day. This is an ideal option for people handling an emergency.
Medical Emergency – Illness hits when you least expect it. It’s something you might not predict, so if it happens and you don’t have enough cash in your bank account, you can rely on a quick, short-term cash advance to get the medical attention you need. Because Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL, approves these loans quickly, you can avoid extreme situations by getting the treatment.
Car Repair Expenses – Sometimes, you need to repair your car, and your paycheck is some weeks away. In this case, you can borrow the money to have the vehicle fixed and ready to get back on the road. Missouri Title Loans, Inc. cash advance in East St Louis, IL, will ensure your car does not sustain further damage.
Home Improvement – A home improvement project not only creates a space you want to live in but also boosts your home’s value. However, it can cost quite a lot, so if you need extra cash, borrowing from Missouri Title Loans, Inc. payday loan company in East St Louis, IL, will come in handy. The company can lend enough money to you to cover labor costs and other essentials.
What Are Missouri Title Loans, Inc. Payday Loans Rates & Fees in East St Louis, IL?
Missouri Title Loans, Inc. payday loan rates vary from state to state and depend on the terms of the deal. In some states, you can pay up to 530% APR. Payday loans are given for a short term, so the lender charges a high interest to shield themselves from the risk. On average, they charge 15% to 25% for payday loans. This means when you borrow $500, you should repay between $575 and $625. This amount could go higher if you fail to pay back as agreed.
How Much Can You Borrow From Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL?
The amount you could get approved for depends on different factors, including your income and the laws in your state determining the maximum amount lenders are allowed to give. Typically, lenders offer loans from $100 to $5,000. People earning a high income will qualify for a higher amount, as they are considered to have the ability to repay the debt comfortably. Use an online loan calculator to find Missouri Title Loans, Inc. fees and the amount you can get considering your income.
What Is the Maximum Loan Term You Can Get With Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL?
The maximum amount the provider will approve is mainly determined by the laws in your state. In some states, lending organizations cannot extend credit beyond a certain limit, so check what the law says about short-term loans before you contact Missouri Title Loans, Inc. payday loan in East St Louis, IL. Also, the amount of money you earn will also factor in when calculating the maximum sum you can get. If your income is consistent and sizable, you can receive enough money to address the financial needs you have.
What Do You Need to Qualify for Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL?
Missouri Title Loans, Inc. uses strict eligibility criteria to ensure only qualified people get cash. If you want a payday loan, you can submit your application online. The process does not require an excellent credit score. What the lender wants is proof of income to be sure you can afford to repay the debt. Some of the basic requirements you need to meet include:
Proof of Income – This document is essential as it helps the company know if you can afford the loan. They’ll use this information to calculate the maximum amount you can get.
Government-Issued ID – Important to prove citizenship and ensure you meet the minimum age requirements (must be at least 18).
Active Bank Account – The lender will send the money to your bank account, so it needs to be active to receive the funds.
Means of Contact – You need an email address or a phone number so that the company can reach you for updates.
Besides fulfilling these requirements, you need to be a resident in a state where the lender’s services are available. Also, the provider could ask for more information, like a check, before they approve your request.
How to Use the Services of Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL?
The application process for payday loans is simple. You just need to find Missouri Title Loans, Inc. locations in East St Louis, IL, or go online on their website to get started. Here’s the procedure:
First, fill out the loan request form you can find on the company’s website or physical location. Once you finish adding all the requested information, submit it.
Receive an Answer
The organization will return feedback in less than 20 minutes, informing you if your application is successful.
Next, you need to sign documents to confirm you read the loan terms and agree to them.
Receive Cash
You’ll get the money in your account within 24 hours.
What We Love About Missouri Title Loans, Inc. in East St Louis, IL
There are several reasons you should search for ‘Missouri Title Loans, Inc. near me in East St Louis, IL. The organization offers many physical locations across the US, making its services easily accessible. Also, you get fast approval, which allows you to respond to your problems in no time.
What Could Missouri Title Loans, Inc. Loans Do Better?
However, Missouri Title Loans, Inc. also has a few areas they can improve. Although the company is operational in many states, they’re not available in all of them. They need to expand their services to reach more people.
Missouri Title Loans, Inc. store locations in East St Louis, Illinois
Loved Martina she was wonderful and amazing I would definitely recommend her she was very professional and pleasant and funny
I think my costumer service rep. Catina was very nice to me & very professional. She smiled alot & showed me that people can still be both personal and professional while being respectful & positive!
Catina very helpful and Caring . Went the extra mile to help me out . I will definitely be back again . And send Bussiness her way .
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Reside in the US and have a valid ID
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Obtaining methods
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I submitted the online application in the morning, and my loan got approved within the evening. No other loan service has delivered such speedy cash ever!
I had a poor credit score and was not able to find a payday loan anywhere. But at FasterLoans, I got the money within one business day.
My loan application got approved by the team within 24 hours, and I borrowed from a genuine lender in the state.
My fiancée suggested that I apply for a cash advance from FasterLoans. I am glad to connect with them as they provided the best service in all terms.
They keep their customer’s needs before everything. Whenever I got stuck, the support team was there to help me tackle the situation.
There could be no better loan service company than FasterLoans. Here, you will get quick cash without any credit check.
The direct lenders of this firm are too generous. They support even those borrowers who have a poor credit score like mine.
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Congressional Summary:Adopts the definition of "hate crime" as set forth in the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994: a crime in which the defendant intentionally selects a victim, or in the case of a property crime, the property that is the object of the crime, because of the actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin, ethnicity, gender, disability, or sexual orientation of any person. Provides technical, forensic, prosecutorial, or other assistance in the criminal investigation or prosecution of hate crimes, including financial grant awards.
Proponent's argument to vote Yes:Rep. JOHN CONYERS (D, MI-14):This bill expands existing Federal hate crimes law to groups who are well-known targets for bias-based violence--they are sexual orientation, gender, gender identity, and disability. These crimes of violence are directed not just at those who are directly attacked; they are targeting the entire group with the threat of violence.
Opponent's argument to vote No:Rep. LAMAR SMITH (R, TX-21): Every year thousands of violent crimes are committed out of hate, but just as many violent crimes, if not more, are motivated by something other than hate--greed, jealousy, desperation or revenge, just to name a few. An individual's motivation for committing a violent crime is usually complex and often speculative. Every violent crime is deplorable, regardless of its motivation. That's why all violent crimes should be vigorously prosecuted. Unfortunately, this bill undermines one of the most basic principles of our criminal justice system--equal justice for all. Under this bill, justice will no longer be equal. Justice will now depend on the race, gender, sexual orientation, disability or other protected status of the victim. It will allow different penalties to be imposed for the same crime. This is the real injustice. Reference: Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Prevention Act; Bill HR.1913 ; vote number 2009-H223 on Apr 2, 2009
Voted NO on expanding services for offenders' re-entry into society.
H.R.1593: Second Chance Act of 2007: Community Safety Through Recidivism Prevention or the Second Chance Act (Motion to Suspend the Rules and Pass). To reauthorize the grant program for reentry of offenders into the community in the Omnibus Crime Control and Safe Streets Act of 1968, and to improve reentry planning and implementation.
Proponents support voting YES because:
Rep. CONYERS: Some 650,000 men and women are leaving the Federal and State prisons each year. While the vast majority of the prisoners are committed to abiding by the law and becoming productive members of society, they often encounter the same pressures & temptations that they faced before prison. More than two-thirds of them are arrested for new crimes within 3 years of their release. This exacts a terrible cost in financial terms as well as in human terms. The Second Chance Act will help provide these men and women with the training, counseling and other support needed to help them obtain & hold steady jobs; to kick their drug and alcohol habits; rebuild their families; and deal with the many other challenges that they face in their efforts to successfully rejoin society.
Opponents recommend voting NO because:
Rep. GOHMERT: The programs that are sought to be renewed are ones we don't have information on how successful they were. I can tell you from my days as a judge, there was some anecdotal evidence that it looked like faith-based programs did a better job of dramatically reducing recidivism. In addition:
There are some provisions that allow for too much administration. That is going to build a bigger bureaucracy.
Dismissing all charges if someone completes drug rehab under another provision I think is outrageous. You are going to remove the hammer that would allow you to keep people in line?
We also have a provision to teach inmates how they can go about getting the most welfare before they leave prison and go out on their own.
Voted NO on funding for alternative sentencing instead of more prisons.
Vote on an amendment that would reduce the funding for violent offender imprisonment by and truth-in-sentencing programs by $61 million. The measure would increase funding for Boys and Girls Clubs and drug courts by the same amount. Reference: Amendment sponsored by Scott, D-VA; Bill HR 4690 ; vote number 2000-317 on Jun 22, 2000
Voted YES on more prosecution and sentencing for juvenile crime.
Vote to pass a bill to appropriate $1.5 billion to all of the states that want to improve their juvenile justice operations. Among other provisions this bill includes funding for development, implementation, and administration of graduated sanctions for juvenile offenders, funds for building, expanding, or renovating juvenile corrections facilities, hiring juvenile judges, probation officers, and additional prosecutors for juvenile cases. Reference: Bill introduced by McCollum, R-FL; Bill HR 1501 ; vote number 1999-233 on Jun 17, 1999
Voted NO on maintaining right of habeas corpus in Death Penalty Appeals.
Vote on an amendment to delete provisions in the bill that would make it harder for prisoners who have been given the death penalty in state courts to appeal the decision on constitutional grounds in the federal courts ['Habeas Corpus']. Bill HR 2703 ; vote number 1996-64 on Mar 14, 1996
Voted YES on making federal death penalty appeals harder.
Vote on a bill to make it harder for prisoners who have been given the death penalty in state courts to appeal the decision on constitutional grounds in the federal courts. Bill HR 729 ; vote number 1995-109 on Feb 8, 1995
Voted NO on replacing death penalty with life imprisonment.
Amendment to replace death penalty crimes in the 1994 Omnibus Crime Bill with life imprisonment. Bill HR 4092 ; vote number 1994-107 on Apr 14, 1994
Rated 30% by CURE, indicating anti-rehabilitation crime votes.
McKeon scores 30% by CURE on rehabilitation issues
CURE (Citizens United for Rehabilitation of Errants) is a membership organization of families of prisoners, prisoners, former prisoners and other concerned citizens. CURE's two goals are
to use prisons only for those who have to be in them; and
for those who have to be in them, to provide them all the rehabilitative opportunities they need to turn their lives around.
Rated 62% by the NAPO, indicating a moderate stance on police issues.
McKeon scores 62% by the NAPO on crime & police issues
Ratings by the National Association of Police Organizations indicate support or opposition to issues of importance to police and crime. The organization's self-description: "The National Association of Police Organizations (NAPO) is a coalition of police units and associations from across the United States. NAPO was organized for the purpose of advancing the interests of America's law enforcement officers through legislative advocacy, political action, and education.
"Increasingly, the rights and interests of law enforcement officers have been the subject of legislative, executive, and judicial action in the nations capital. NAPO works to influence the course of national affairs where law enforcement interests are concerned. The following list includes examples of NAPOs accomplishments:
Enactment of the Fair Sentencing Act
Enactment of the National AMBER Alert Act
Enactment of the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act
Enactment of the Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act
Enactment of the Law Enforcement Officers' Safety Act (Right to Carry Legislation)
VoteMatch scoring for the NAPO ratings is as follows:
0%-50%: soft on crime and police issues;
50%-75%: mixed record on crime and police issues;
75%-100%: tough on crime and police issues.
Source: NAPO ratings on Congress and politicians 2014_NAPO on Dec 31, 2014
More prisons, more enforcement, effective death penalty.
McKeon signed the Contract with America:
[As part of the Contract with America, within 100 days we pledge to bring to the House Floor the following bill]:
An anti-crime package including stronger truth in sentencing, good faith exclusionary rule exemptions, effective death penalty provisions, and cuts in social spending from this summers crime bill to fund prison construction and additional law enforcement to keep people secure in their neighborhoods and kids safe in their schools.
Source: Contract with America 93-CWA4 on Sep 27, 1994
Prevent luxurious conditions in prisons.
McKeon co-sponsored preventing luxurious conditions in prisons
To amend the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994 to prevent luxurious conditions in prisons. The "No Frills Prison Act" requires each State, to be eligible for truth in sentencing incentive grants, to demonstrate that it:
provides living conditions and opportunities within its prisons that are not more luxurious than those that the average prisoner would have experienced if not incarcerated;
does not provide to any such prisoner specified benefits or privileges, including earned good time credits, less than 40 hours a week of work that either offsets or reduces the expenses of keeping the prisoner or provides resources toward restitution of victims, unmonitored phone calls (with exceptions), in-cell television viewing, possession of pornographic materials, instruction or training equipment for any martial art or bodybuilding or weightlifting equipment, or dress or hygiene other than as is uniform or standard in the prison; and
in the case of a prisoner serving a sentence for a crime of violence which resulted in serious bodily injury to another, does not provide housing other than in separate cell blocks intended for violent prisoners, less than nine hours a day of physical labor (with exceptions), any release from the prison for any purpose unless under physical or mechanical restraint and under constant supervision of at least one armed correctional officer, or any viewing of television. Source: No Frills Prison Act (H.R.663) 95-HR663 on Jan 24, 1995
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Recipe for Vegan Carrot Dogs in the crockpot
If you are looking for vegan jerky options you are in luck. Today, there are quite a few different kinds of vegan jerky to choose from. Here's a list of some of the vegan jerky options I've tried and my two cents regarding what I think of them. This doesn't mean you shouldn't give them all a try yourself, because everyone likes something different, but it gives you some ideas of what types of vegan jerky are out there. I have been vegetarian since 2007, and I still haven't tried all of the vegan jerky options out there. I'll add to this list as I try more of them.
This has to be one of the oldest varieties around. While there are quite a few new options available today, this one was ahead of the game. I remember buying this one 20 years ago! I don't see it as often in stores, but there is one near me that always carries it, plus you buy it online. We have always liked Stonewall's Jerquee. If you can find some to give it a try, I highly recommend it. I think it's pretty good stuff and I like that it was one of the first vegan jerky products around. It's made from soy and comes in a variety of flavors.
This vegan jerky is made from organic oyster mushrooms. It comes in a variety of flavors and it is honestly great! This is one of the best vegan jerky's that I've tasted. The whole family loves it. It's hard to keep a bag around, because we eat it so quickly once it's opened. This vegan jerky has a clean ingredient list, so you can feel pretty good snacking on it. You can order Shroom Snack Vegan Jerky online, or you may be able to find it in a store (I've never seen it in a store though).
This vegan jerky is usually easy to find. Many health food stores and places like Whole Foods Market tend to carry them, and you can easily find them online. Primal Strips are a vegan jerky that are made from wheat gluten, mushrooms, or soy, depending on the flavor variety. Their ingredients list is clean, so there's no unidentifiable items there. Primal Strips taste good, but the one problem I have with them is that you don't get much (maybe 2-3 bites) for around $1.40 each, because they are sold in single serving packages. That makes them pricy if you want to share them with the family. Now, here's my biggest issue with Primal Strips and it's something I wrote in my review of them back in 2009 - they are made in Taiwan! Yes, they are a product of Taiwan. I have an issue with that. These little snacks have traveled some 7,000 miles to make it to your store or home. I don't care for that, because of the carbon footprint. I think it's better to opt for a vegan jerky that is made in your home country.
This vegan jerky is made by the same company that makes Butler Soy Curls and taco crumbles. I first tried them in 2019 and I loved them. They really do have a great taste. They are made from soy and come in a bag big enough to share with others. However, I have since discovered that they contain an ingredient that I try to avoid - carrageenan. If you are not familiar with this ingredient, it's one that is believed to cause inflammation in the intestines, so it's not something that I want to eat. Silk used to put it in their plant based milk products, until Dr. Gregor schooled them on how unhealthy it is for the body, and then they removed it. If this vegan jerky didn't have carrageenan I'd be more comfortable recommending it to people, but there are numerous studies linking it to causing inflammation, so I steer clear of it.
This vegan jerky can often be found at health food stores and online. It's made from soy and comes in a variety of flavors. It's a bit pricy, but it does come in a bag big enough that you can share a little with the family. I like this vegan jerky. It has a good flavor and texture. If you are looking for a tasty jerky to take hiking or something you can't go wrong with this option. They are good, satisfying, and are likely to please everyone. The ingredient list is not bad, so that's a bonus, too. This is one of the better picks you can make in vegan jerky.
I like a lot of the products that Gardein makes, so when I saw they had a plant based jerky out I was intrigued. I figured I would like it and looked forward to trying it. Well, I tried it and what a disappointment it was. The flavor is really not all that good and the salt was through the roof. All I could taste was salt! Granted, how strongly you taste salt is genetic, so you may not taste it as strongly as I did. But for me it tasted like pure salt and was awful. My husband liked the texture, but thought the flavor was not up to par (he thought the salt level was okay). Neither one of my kids liked it. I had high hopes for their jerky, but I won't be buying it again. Their plant based jerky is made from soy and wheat gluten, and contains two forms of ingredients used in a MSG-fashion (celery powder and yeast extract), so the ingredients are not great and neither is the taste. You can find this one online if you want to give it a try.
Vegky is a vegan jerky made from shiitake mushrooms. It comes in various flavors and sells for around $5 per bag (at least where I bought it at a vegetarian festival). The vegan jerky has a good flavor and texture. The problem I have with it is that it's made in Taiwan. I really don't want my vegan jerky to travel 8,500 miles to reach me. That's just not sustainable or environmentally friendly. If you are in Taiwan then it's a good option.
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Barnabas Fund responds to the Archbishop of Canterbury’s recommendation to apply Islamic law in the UK →
Preparing for the underground church
Posted on 10 February 2008 by Peter
Sobering. Try to read it all if you have time….
Christian pastors must learn what an underground church looks like and what it does. I spoke with a bishop in Britain for an hour or so about underground church work. Finally, he said, “Excuse me, but you speak of my hobby; I am very interested in church architecture. Would you please tell me if the underground churches use Gothic styles in the building of churches?”
The Underground Church is comparatively unknown. We have it right next door, but we are not ready to join it and we are not trained for it. Every Christian pastor must know this because we might pass through tragic circumstances. Even if we do not pass through these tragic circumstances we have a duty to help and to instruct those who do pass through them.
In Muslim nations, in Red China and so on, many believers have become victims. Many have gone into prisons and many have died in prison. We cannot be proud of this. The better thing would have been to be well instructed on how to do underground work and not to be captured. I admire those who know how to work so well that they are not caught. We have to know the underground work.
Suffering cannot be avoided in the Underground Church, whatever measures are taken, but suffering should be reduced to the minimum.
What happens in a country when oppressive powers take over? In some countries the terror starts at once, as in Mozambique and Cambodia. In other places religious liberty follows as never before. And so it begins. Some regimes come to power without having real power. They do not have the people on their side. They have not necessarily organized their police and their staff of the army yet.
In Russia, the Communists gave immediately great liberty to the Protestants in order to destroy the Orthodox. When they had destroyed the Orthodox, the turn came for the Protestants. The initial situation does not last long. During that time they infiltrate the churches, putting their men in leadership. They find out the weaknesses of pastors. Some might be ambitious men; some might be entrapped with the love of money. Another might have a hidden sin somewhere, wherewith he may be blackmailed. They explain that they would make it known and thus put their men in leadership. Then, at a certain moment the great persecution begins. In Romania such a clamp-down happened in one day. All the Catholic bishops went to prison, along with innumerable priests, monks and nuns. Then many Protestant pastors of all denominations were arrested. Many died in prison.
“Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he has done to Thy saints at Jerusalem: But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way; for he is a chosen vessel unto Me, to bear My name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: For I will show him how great things he must suffer for My name’s sake “-(Acts 9:13, 15 and 16).
Jesus, our Lord, told Ananias: “Meet Saul of Tarsus. He will be My underground pastor, My underground worker.” That is what St. Paul was – a pastor of an Underground Church. Jesus started a crash course for this underground pastor. He started it with the words, “I will show (him) how great things he must suffer…”
Preparation for underground work begins by studying sufferology, martyrology. Later, we will look at the technical side of underground work, but first of all there must be a certain spiritual preparation for it.
In a free country, to be a member of a church, it is enough to believe and to be baptized. In the Church underground it is not enough to be a member in it. You can be baptized and you can believe, but you will not be a member of the Underground Church unless you know how to suffer.
You might have the mightiest faith in the world, but if you are not prepared to suffer, then when you are taken by the police, you will get two slaps and you will declare anything. So the preparation for suffering is one of the essentials of the preparation of underground work.
A Christian does not panic if he is put in prison. For the rank and file believer, prison is a new place to witness for Christ. For a pastor, prison is a new parish. It is a parish with no great income but with great opportunities for work. I speak a little of this in my book, With God In Solitary Confinement.
In other books I mention Morse code, which is also part of the training for the Underground Church. You know what this is – a code by which messages are conveyed. Through this code you can preach the Gospel to those who are to your right and left.
Free parishioners look at their watch; “Already he has preached for thirty minutes. Will he never finish?” When arrested, watches are taken away from you; you have the parishioners with you the whole week and can preach to them from morning to night! They have no choice. There have never been, in the history of the Romanian or the Russian Church, so many conversions brought about as there have been in prison. So do not fear prison. Look upon it as just a new assignment given by God.
Men can accept this. But what about the terrible tortures which are inflicted on prisoners? What will we do about these tortures? Will we be able to bear them? If I do not bear them, I put in prison another fifty or sixty men whom I know because that is what the oppressors wish from me, to betray those around me. Hence comes the great need for preparation for suffering, which must start now. It is too difficult to prepare yourself for it when you are already in prison.
TRUTH ABOUT THE TRUTH
How much each one of us can suffer depends on how much he is bound up with a cause, how dear this cause is to him, and how much it means for him.
In this respect we have had in Communist countries very big surprises. There have been gifted preachers and writers of Christian books who have become traitors. The composer of the best hymnal of Romania became the composer of the best communist hymnal of Romania. Everything depends on whether we have remained in the sphere of words or if we are merged with the divine realities.
God is the Truth. The Bible is the truth about the Truth. Theology is the truth about the truth about the Truth. A good sermon is the truth about the truth about the truth, about the Truth It is not the Truth. The Truth is God alone. Around this Truth there is a scaffolding of words, of theologies, and of exposition. None of these is of any help in times of suffering. It is only the Truth Himself Who is of help, and we have to penetrate through sermons, through theological books, through everything which is ‘words’ and be bound up with the reality of God Himself.
I have told in the West how Christians were tied to crosses for four days and four nights. The crosses were put on the floor and other prisoners were tortured and made to fulfill their bodily necessities upon the faces and the bodies of the crucified ones. I have since been asked: “Which Bible verse helped and strengthened you in those circumstances?” My answer is: “NO Bible verse was of any help.” It is sheer cant and religious hypocrisy to say, “This Bible verse strengthens me, or that Bible verse helps me.” Bible verses alone are not meant to help.
We knew Psalm 23 – “The Lord is my Shepherd; I shall not want… though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death….” When you pass through suffering you realize that it was never meant by God that Psalm 23 should strengthen you. It is the Lord who can strengthen you, not the Psalm which speaks of Him so doing. It is not enough to have the Psalm. You must have the One about whom the Psalm speaks. We also knew the verse: “My Grace is sufficient for thee.” But the verse is not sufficient. It is the Grace which is sufficient and not the verse.
Pastors and zealous witnesses who are handling the Word as a calling from God are in danger of giving holy words more value than they really have. Holy words are only the means to arrive at the reality expressed by them. If you are united with the Reality, the Lord Almighty, evil loses its power over you; it cannot break the Lord Almighty. If you only have the words of the Lord Almighty you can be very easily broken.
The preparation for underground work is deep spiritualization. As we peel an onion in preparation for its use, so God must “peel” from us what are mere words, sensations of our enjoyments in religion, in order to arrive at the reality of our faith. Jesus has told us “that whosoever will follow” Him will have to “take up their cross,” and He, Himself, showed how heavy this cross can be. We have to be prepared for this.
We have to make the preparation now before we are imprisoned. In prison you lose everything. You are undressed and given a prisoner’s suit. No more nice furniture, nice carpets or nice curtains. You do not have a wife or husband any more and you do not have your children. You do not have your library and you never see a flower. Nothing of what makes life pleasant remains. Nobody resists who has not renounced the pleasures of life beforehand.
I personally use an exercise. I live in the United States of America. Can you imagine what an American supermarket looks like? You find there many delicious things. I look at everything and say to myself, “I can go without this thing and that thing; this thing is very nice, but I can go without: this third thing I can go without, too.” I visited the whole supermarket and did not spend one dollar. I had the joy of seeing many beautiful things and the second joy to know that I can go without.
I am Jewish. In Hebrew, the language which Jesus Himself spoke and in which the first revelation has been given, the word “doubt” does not exist. To doubt is as wrong for a man as it would be for him to walk on four legs – he is not meant to walk on four legs. A man walks erect; he is not a beast. To doubt is subhuman.
To every one of us doubts come, but do not allow doubts about essential doctrines of the Bible such as the existence of God, the resurrection of Jesus Christ, or the existence of eternal life to make a nest in your mind. Every theological or philosophical doubt makes you a potential traitor. You can allow yourself doubts while you have a nice study and you prepare sermons, and you eat well – or you write a book. Then you can allow yourself all kinds of daring ideas and doubts. When you are tortured these doubts are changed into treason because you have to decide to live or die for this faith.
One of the most important things about the spiritual preparation of an underground worker is the solution of his doubts. In mathematics, if you do not find the solution you may have made a mistake somewhere, so you continue until you find out. Don’t live with doubts, but seek their solution.
Now to come to the very moment of torture. Torture is sometimes very painful. Sometimes it is a simple beating. We have all been spanked as children and beating is just another spanking. A simple beating is very easy to take. Jesus has said we should come to Him like children, which is rather like candidates for spanking!
However, with us, Communists did not stop at beatings – they used very refined tortures. Now torture, you must know, can work both ways. It can harden you and strengthen your decision not to tell the police anything. There are thieves who resist any torture and would not betray those with whom they have co-operated in theft. The more you beat them the more obstinate they become. Or, torture can just break your will.
Now I will tell you of one very interesting case which was published by the Czech Communist Press. Novotny, who was the predecessor of Dubcek and who was a Communist dictator, had arrested one of his intimate comrades, a Communist leader, a convinced atheist, and a member of the Central Committee of the Communist Party. (Not only Christians, Jews or patriots were in prison. One Communist arrested another and tortured him just as they would do anybody else.) They arrested this Communist leader and put him in a prison cell alone. Electromagnetic rays, which disturb the mind, passed through this cell. A loudspeaker repeated day and night: “Is your name Joseph or not Joseph?” (His name was not Joseph.)
They tried to drive him mad. Day and night. He felt that he would lose his mind. At a certain moment, he got an illumination. “I have now met unmitigated evil. If Communists torture a Christian, it is not absolutely evil because Communists believe that they will construct an earthly paradise. Christians hinder them, so it is right to torture Christians. But when a Communist tortures a Communist, it is torture for torture’s sake. There is absolutely no justification for it. But wait a little bit. Every coin has two sides, every electric cable has two poles. If there is an unmitigated evil, against whom does this unmitigated evil fight? There must be an unmitigated good. This is God, and against Him they fight.”
When he was called to the interrogator, he entered smiling into the room and told him that he could switch off the loudspeaker now because it had attained its result. “I have become a Christian.” The officer asked him, “How did it happen?” He told him the whole story. The officer said, “Wait a little bit.” He called a few of his comrades and said, “Please repeat the stop before my comrades.” He repeated the story, and the captain told the other police officer, “I told you that this method will not work. You have overdone it.”
The Devil is not all mighty and all wise like God. He makes mistakes. Evil torture is an excess which can be used very well spiritually.
Torture has a moment of explosion, and the torturer waits for this critical moment. Learn how to conquer doubt and to think thoroughly. There is always one moment of crisis when you are ready to write or pronounce the name of your accomplice in the underground work, or to say where the secret printing shop is, or something of that kind. You have been tortured so much nothing counts any more; the fact that I should not have pain also does not count. Draw this last conclusion at the stage at which you have arrived and you will see that you will overcome this one moment of crisis; it gives you an intense inner joy. You feel that Christ has been with you in that decisive moment. Jailers today are now trained and refined, aware that there is a moment of crisis. If they cannot get anything from you in that moment, then they abandon torturing: they know its continuation to be useless.
There are a few more points in connection with torture. It is very important to understand what Jesus said: “Take no thought for the morrow, for the morrow shall take thought for itself.” I have had fourteen years of prison. Brother Hrapov had twenty six, Wong MingDao had twenty-eight. It seems impossible to bear long years of prison. You are not asked to bear it all at once. Do not bear even one day at a time – bear an hour at a time. One hour of pain everybody can bear. We have had a terrible toothache, a car accident – passing, perhaps, through untold anguish. You are not meant to bear pain more than this one present minute.
What amplifies pain is the memory that I have been beaten and tortured so many times and that tomorrow they will take me again, and the day after tomorrow. Tomorrow, I might not be alive – or they might not be alive. Tomorrow, there can be an overthrow, as in Romania. Yesterday beating has passed: tomorrow’s torture has not come yet.
The Bible teaches some words very hard to take: “Whosoever does not hate father, mother, child, brother, sister – cannot be My disciple.” These words mean almost nothing in a free country.
You probably know from The Voice of the Martyrs literature that thousands of children had been taken away from their parents in the former Soviet Union because they were taught about Christ. You must love Christ more than your family. There you are before a court and the judge tells you that if you deny Christ you may keep your children. If not, this will be the last time you will see them. Your heart may break, but your answer should be, “I love God.”
Nadia Sloboda left her house for four years of prison. Her children were taken from her, but she left her house singing. The children, for whom the police waited with a truck to take them as she left, told their singing mother, “Don’t worry about us. Wherever they put us, we will not give up our faith.” They did not.
When Jesus was on the cross He not only suffered physically; He had His mother in front of Him, suffering. His mother had the Son suffering. They loved each other, but the glory of God was at stake and here any human sentiment must be secondary. Only if we take this attitude once and for all can we prepare for underground work.
Only Christ, the Great Sufferer, the Man of Sorrows, must live in us. There have been cases in Communist countries when Communist torturers threw away their rubber truncheons with which they beat a Christian and asked, “What is this halo which you have around your head? How is it that your face shines? I cannot beat you anymore.” It is said of Stephen in the Bible, that “his face shone.” We have known cases of Communist torturers who told the prisoner, “Shout loudly, cry loudly as if I would beat you so that my comrades will know that I torture you. But I cannot beat you.” Thus, you would shout without anything happening to you.
There are other cases when prisoners really are tortured, sometimes to death. You have to choose between dying with Christ and for Christ or becoming a traitor. What is the worth of continuing to live when you will be ashamed to look into the mirror, knowing that the mirror will show you the face of a traitor?
In the Underground Church, silence is one of the first rules. Every superfluous word you speak can put somebody in prison. A friend of mine, a great Christian composer, went to prison because Christians had the habit of saying, “How beautiful is this song composed by Brother _____.” They praised him, and for this he got fifteen years of prison. Sing the song, but do not mention the name of the one who has written it.
You cannot learn to be silent the very moment the country is taken over. You have to learn to be silent from the moment of your conversion.
The secretary to Solzhenitsyn was put under such pressure by the Communists (and she had been denounced by Solzhenitsyn’s wife) that she finished by hanging herself. If Solzhenitsyn had kept silent, this would not have happened.
Another question which is very important: I thank God for the years which I passed in Solitary confinement. I was, for three years, thirty feet beneath the earth. I never heard a word. I never spoke a word. There were no books. The outward voices ceased. The guards had felt soled shoes; you did not hear their approach. Then, with time, the inner voices ceased.
We were drugged, we were beaten. I forgot my whole theology. I forgot the whole Bible. One day I observed that I had forgotten the “Our Father.” I could not say it any more. I knew that it began with “Our Father…,” but I did not know the continuation. I just kept happy and said, “Our Father, I have forgotten the prayer, but you surely know it by heart. You hear it so many thousand times a day, so you assign an angel to say it for me, and I will just keep quiet.” For a time my prayers were, “Jesus, I love You.” And then after a little time again, “Jesus, I love You. Jesus, I love You.” Then it became too difficult even to say this because we were doped with drugs which would destroy our minds. We were very hungry. We had one slice of bread a week. There were the beatings, and the tortures, and the lack of light, and other things. It became impossible to concentrate my mind to even say so much as, “Jesus, I love You.” I abandoned it because I knew that it was necessary. The highest form of prayer which I know is the quiet beating of a heart which loves Him. Jesus should just hear “tick-a-tock, tick-a-tock”, and He would know that every heartbeat is for Him.
When I came out from solitary confinement and was with other prisoners and heard them speaking, I wondered why they spoke! So much of our speech is useless. Today men become acquainted with each other and one will say, “How do you do?” and the other answers, “How do you do?” What is the use of this? Then one will say, “Don’t you think that the weather is fine?” and the other thinks, and says, “Yes, I think it is fine.” Why do we have to speak on whether the weather is fine? We do not take earnestly the word of Jesus Who says that men will be judged not for every bad word, but for every useless one. So it is written in the Bible.
Useless talking in some countries means prison and death for your brother. A word of praise about your brother, if it is not necessary, may mean catastrophe. For example, somebody comes to visit you and you say, “Oh! I’m sorry you were not here before – brother W. has just left.” The visitor could be an informer of the secret police. Now she will know that bro-ther W. is in town! Keep your mouth shut. Learn to do it now.
You cannot do underground work without using stratagems. I know of one case which happened in Russia. The Communists suspected that the Christians were gathering somewhere and they surveyed a street. They knew that the meeting must be there somewhere. They saw a young boy going toward the house where they supposed the meeting would be. They stopped the boy and the police asked him, “Where are you going?” With a sad face, he said, “My oldest brother died, and now we gather the whole family to read his testament.” The police officer was so impressed that he patted the boy and said, “Just go.” The boy had not told a lie.
We are not obliged to tell an atheist tyrant the truth. We are not obliged to tell him what we are doing. It is indecent for his side to put questions to me, an impertinence.
One of the greatest methods is not only physical torture; it is brainwashing. We have to know how to resist brainwashing. Brainwashing exists in the free world, too. The press, radio and television brainwash us. There exists no motive in the world to drink Coca-Cola. You drink it because you are brainwashed. Water is surely better than Coca-Cola. But nobody advertises, “Drink water, drink water.” if water were advertised, we would drink water. Some have driven this technique of brainwashing to its extreme. The methods vary, but brainwashing in my Romanian prison consisted essentially of this: we had to sit seventeen hours on a form which gave no possibility to lean, and you were not allowed to close your eyes. For seventeen hours a day we had to hear, “Communism is good, Communism is good, Communism is good, etc.; Christianity is dead, Christianity is dead, Christianity is dead, etc.; Give up, give up, etc.” You were bored after one minute of this but you had to hear it the whole seventeen hours for weeks, months, years even, without any interruption.
I can assure you, it is not easy. It is one of the worst tortures. Much worse than physical torture. But Christ has foreseen all things because with Him there is no time. Future, past, present are one and the same: He knows all things from the beginning. Communists invented brainwashing too late! Christ had already invented the opposite to brainwashing – heart washing. He has said: “Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.”
Stephen, the first martyr for Christ, had around him hundreds with big stones in their hands to throw at him. He said: “I see.” And the wife of Stephen probably thought he saw the danger he was in and would run away. But he said: “I see JESUS standing at the right hand of God.” Perhaps she said (it is not recorded), “Don’t you see all the mob around you ready to throw stones at you?” “Oh yes! I see some little ants there below not worth mentioning. I look to JESUS.” He did not look to those who wished to kill him. Blessed are the pure in heart.
I had passed through brainwashing for over two years. Now the Communists would have said that my brain was still dirty. In the same rhythm in which they said, “Christianity is dead,” I and others repeated to ourselves: “Christ also has been dead, Christ also has been dead.” But we knew He rose from the dead. We remembered that we lived in the communion of saints.
One of the greatest problems for an underground fighter is to know how to fill up his solitude. We had absolutely no books. Not only no Bible, but no books, no scrap of paper, and no pencil. We never heard a noise, and there was absolutely nothing to distract our attention. You looked at the walls, that was all. Now normally a mind under such circumstances becomes mad.
I can tell you from my own experience how I avoided becoming mad, but this again has to be prepared by a life of spiritual exercise beforehand. How much can you be alone without the Bible? How much can you bear to be with yourself without switching on the radio, or a record player, etc.?
I, and many other prisoners, did it like this. We never slept during the night. We slept during the day. The whole night we were awake. You know that a Psalm says, “…bless you the Lord,… which by night stand in the house of the Lord.” One prayer at night is worth ten prayers during the day.
All great sins and crimes are committed during the night. The great robberies, drunkenness, reveling, adultery – this whole life of sin is a night life. During the day everyone has to work in a factory, college, or somewhere. The demonic forces are forces of the night, and therefore, it is so important to oppose them during the night.
In solitary confinement we awoke when the other prisoners went to bed. We filled our time with a program which was so heavy, we could not fulfill it. We started with a prayer, a prayer in which we traveled through the whole world. We prayed for each country, for where we knew the names of towns and men, and we prayed for great preachers. It took a good hour or two to come back. We prayed for pilots, and for those on the sea, and for those who were in prisons.
After having traveled through the whole world, I read the Bible from memory. To memorize the Bible is very important for an underground worker.
Just to make us laugh also a little bit, I will tell you one thing which happened. Once while I lay on the few planks which were my bed, I read from memory the Sermon on the Mount, according to Luke. I arrived at the part where it is said, “When you are persecuted… for the Son of man’s sake, rejoice you, in that day and leap for joy….” You will remember that it is written like this. I said, “How could I commit such a sin of neglect? Christ has said that we have to do two different things. One to rejoice, I have done. The second, to ‘leap for joy,’ I have not done.” So I jumped. I came down from my bed and I began to jump around.
In prison, the door of a cell has a peep hole through which the warden looks into the cell. He happened to look in while I jumped around. So he believed that I had become mad. They had an order to behave very well with madmen so that their shouting and banging on the wall should not disturb the order of the prison. The guard immediately entered, quieted me down and said, “You will be released; you can see everything will be all right. Just remain quiet. I will bring you something.” He brought me a big loaf of bread. Our portion was one slice of bread a week, and now I had a whole loaf, plus cheese. It was white. Never just eat cheese; first of all admire its whiteness. It is beautiful to look upon. He brought me also sugar. He spoke a few nice words again and locked the door and left.
I said, “I will eat these things after having finished my chapter from St. Luke.” I lay down again and tried to remember where I had left off. “Yes, at ‘when you are persecuted for My Name’s sake, rejoice… and leap for joy because great is your reward.” I looked at the loaf of bread and the cheese. Really, the reward was great!
So the next task is to think of the Bible and to meditate upon it. Every night, I composed a sermon beginning with “Dear brethren, and sisters” and finishing with “Amen.” After I composed it, I delivered it. I put them afterwards in very short rhymes so that I could remember them. My books, With God In Solitary Confinement and If Prison Walls Could Speak, contain some of these sermons. I have memorized three hundred and fifty of them.
Out of bread I made chessmen, some of them whitened with a little bit of chalk and the others gray. I played chess with myself. Never believe that Bob Fisher is the greatest chess master of the world. He won the last match with Spassky. He won eight games and lost two. I, in three years, never lost a game; I always won either with white or gray!
Never allow your mind to become distressed because then the Communists have you entirely in their hands. Your mind must be continually exercised. It must be alert, it must think. It must, everyone according to his abilities, compose different things, etc.
I have told you all these things because they belong to the secrets of the underground worker when he suffers. May God bless you.
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64 Responses to Preparing for the underground church
10 February 2008 at 01:23
I certainly admire Wurmbrand and gave away 5 or 6 copies of his Marx and Satan, for all the good it did! However, I think it is too soon to talk of an underground church and with all the modern technology that “they” have I find it hard to imagine. Far better to keep sending literature into the prisons and to maintain our own libraries. We should also know something about the Talmud so as to help us understand what Jesus was getting at when he went on about the traditions of men. While no expert on the Talmud the doctrine of everyone being forgiven, for example, is Talmudic, while the doctrine of only some being forgiven is Christian . At the very least we have to sharpen up our wits to protect us from all the twits in Christendom – hey! I’ve got rhythm.
Dan says:
11 February 2008 at 09:12
This very tough stuff. After reading this, I feel like a wimp. I’ve been preaching through the Gospel of Mark. Jesus, clearly, was preparing His followers for such times. Whether or not it will get this bad in the west remains to be seen. What I do see coming are gradual and incremental limitations on public Christian expression. In some ways this is worse than outright persecution. We become so comfortable inour cultures that we are not even aware that we betray Christ. With physical persecutiion the reality is stark.
timbob says:
11 February 2008 at 14:45
Greetings. I’m only a third of the way through this, but three things struck me thus far. First, the initial liberties given when a tyrranical government comes to power for the purpose of uncovering weeaknesses in the church. For a long time, I’ve been certain that the internet is being monitored for this very purpose. We place our thoughts and everything else out here in cyberspace while the NSA and whoever else is compiling a database. I truly wonder if the time is ripe for departing this arena. (For me it is near; although I’m not sure as to “how near”)
Second, the phrase “Everything depends on whether we have remained in the sphere of words or if we are merged with the divine realities.” This should cause us all to examine where we are at the moment and ask the Lord to reveal any trouble spots.
Third, the phrase “Nobody resists who has not renounced the pleasures of life beforehand.” Amen. Loving this world will cause people to make really bad decisions. Loving not this world is not only liberating, it is a matter of life or death concerning the fabric of the everlasting.
I’ll have to finish reading this when time permits. I’ll probably make copies for those in my vicinity who profess to be born again but are oblivious to the lateness of the hour. Thanks for posting this.
11 February 2008 at 16:16
Timebob, Of course NSA monitors the internet just as they monitor the mail and your telephone calls. There is the famous picture of Cromwell’s ironsides questioning a young boy in regards to his father’s whereabouts and during WW 2 the posters “Walls have ears” and “Loose lips sink ships” suggest that nothing has changed. I call myself white rabbit because I am usually white with fright and always ready to run!
How do you think that God puts your name in his Book of life unless he is constantly monitoring you and of course Lucifer has his agents – the spirit ones, not the NSA ones – watching you too.
Just remember James 4:7 “Resist the devil and he will flee from thee.”
Peter says:
12 February 2008 at 08:56
Hello white rabbit- whilst I don’t think we are yet at the point of an underground church, I think it’s good to consider what it may entail, even if it is something way beyond our experience.
Dan – me too, this is something entirely beyond my expereince and I find myself wondering how I would do. Not well, I suspect, however He who is in me is greater than he who is in the world. I agree with you, that I see a gradual encroaching and a chilling of Christian expression – we are already seeing that North of the border. Of course, an economic collapse may well pave the way to an acceleration of repression into outright persecution.
Timbob – you’re welcome. I know it is a long read, but I thought it good to post in entirity.
Shirley says:
14 February 2008 at 16:27
I can think of nothing to say. Can fathom nothing. Is it truly possible I will one day face such challenge? How weak I am, I who am thought to be a mother in Zion. I am startled.
PMB says:
13 April 2015 at 09:43
One day during Lent several years ago i stopped to make a visit in my Church while it was empty and no services going on. While kneeling and looking at Christ on the Crucifix I wondered, fearfully, “Could I follow Christ ANYWHERE–even to the cross?” And while I was feeling that, oh NO, I could never do that, a voice said to me: “Whatever is My will for you to do, I will give you the graces you need to do it.” I am not a person who usually receives messages that way, and those words were certainly not my words–but I believe that even when I forget them for a time, God has infinite ways to remind me during times when I most need them.
Peter says:
13 April 2015 at 19:54
The way things are going, it seems to me that we may need to take heed of this in our lifetimes. God will give us the grace, as you say, because we could never do this in our own strength.
Peter says:
15 February 2008 at 16:23
There is nothing to say, I understand completely. I am completely unequal to that challenge. All I can plead is Christ.
Sasha says:
16 February 2008 at 21:28
Truly horrific, although it’s considerably brightened and balanced by Wurmbrandt’s humour (e.g., the tale about the Czech Communist who converted to Christianity precisely thanks to his being tortured the way he was!). Still, I fully realise how HOPELESSLY INADEQUATE I am as a human being to begin with; let alone at the prospect of facing anything like the kind of ordeal described here!! Dear Lord, if possible, please grant me the mercy of dying before having to undergo something like that for the weakness of this would-be servant of yours is all too obvious (though Thy Will be nevertheless done…).
19 February 2008 at 10:42
Now is the time to do this work. Many are unfortunately still grappling for advantage, still fighting the war of words with Satan’s workers. Of course we want to bring even the most evil infilled persons to Christ, but if we heed the times we should be realizing that a difficult time for Christians is coming upon the West, and we must begin preparing for that.
Some of the comments speak to martyrdom, but the article speaks to preparing and hence lessening the suffering. I am reminded of the Mennonite record of the Reformation, The Martyrs’ Mirror, which was written and illustrated in the 1500s. The Mennonites didn’t stand around making themselves targets. They ran away from their pursuers! They met in secret and did all things religious in secret. They did no harm, but they weren’t sitting ducks, either.
So, let us prepare. Let us, for example, begin to think about how people of faith and conscience will be able to work should we refuse to be part of a nationalized health insurance system. If we refuse to cooperate with the “individual mandate” to take part in financing abortion, ‘sex changes’, stem cell work, mental health directives, etc., at least one US national candidate (and many state democratic legislatures) has already threatened to garnish wages, penalize tax refunds, and sign people up involuntarily using the tax roles. If we need to live outside of the tax system, how we will be able to buy and to sell? These are suddenly pressing questions.
Peter says:
21 February 2008 at 13:49
Preperation is the key, much of which will be spiritual in nature IMHO
24 March 2008 at 02:01
thank you, brother
Peter says:
25 March 2008 at 12:57
Todd says:
13 June 2008 at 22:48
There were many years in Europe and parts of the USA where one had to belong to a church (sometimes a particular church) or suffer greatly. That is a bigger fear of mine and a far more likely scenario considering the dominance of Christianity in the USA and the rise of the radical right. No one likes any repression by any power, but I my biggest fear at least in the USA, is a reemergence of a theocracy.
5 October 2008 at 04:39
Thank you so much for posting this. I found it through a link from Timbob’s site, and I am just so grateful to read it. Thank you.
Peter says:
7 October 2008 at 12:13
Glad I could help!
7 November 2008 at 22:02
WOW! This is really great stuff. I didn’t realize there were other people out there thinking about these things. I’ve been planning for years a world wide underground church. A place where any Believe is welcome. I’ve had these thoughts running through my mind of a community of believers who will help prepare the world for the coming of Christ.
Most of the time in my encounters with other Christians (and I’m not talking about the Sunday drivers) I’ve found them to have a certain desire to help the people of our time. But I have a different Idea. I want to help those who will be left behind. Some of the people replying to this article are saying they believe we aren’t ready for an underground church, but I must respectfully disagree. We are all in the final days, and each of us will experience our own judgment. What most don’t realize is that death is our judgement, and all of us must die. So whether it’s the return of Christ in the rapture or our own death, it is still the return of Christ.
If we slack off from our duties as Christians because of an idea that we aren’t ready for an underground church, then we have all failed. We must do our part as Christians, and by constructing the underground church, we lay a foundation for those who remain after the rapture, and leave behind a church where they can safely study without fear of persecution from the Anti-Christ.
I am working on this as much as I can, but I need help. I can’t do it on my own. If you are interested, then please register on my website and I will contact you via the email you add in registration. You can find the website online at “http://www.undergroundchurch.info”.
Peter says:
15 November 2008 at 16:50
Looks good Solidvision, I see the site is still under construction. I do not think we will be ready from an ‘underground church’ until we have to be ready for it – until we have no other choice. IMHO, I’m not convinced there will be a rapture as distinct from the return of Christ, so it could well be us that will be worshipping underground!
Jeremiah says:
29 October 2009 at 13:37
REVIVAL IN IRAN! Although their church is underground, God is adding to it with a rapid pace. Iranians have been opening up to the Gospel and a quiet revival is spreading in the nation. All across Iran a revival is taking over a nation yoked with a deep spiritual emptiness and hunger.
Iranian church leaders believe that millions can be added to the church in the next few years — such is the spiritual hunger in Iran.
Go check out a website called REVIVAL IN IRAN to find out more what is happening.
eric says:
21 February 2010 at 16:30
One of the greatest problems for an underground fighter is to know how to fill up his solitude. We had absolutely no books. Not only no Bible, but no books, no scrap of paper, and no pencil. We never heard a noise, and there was absolutely nothing to distract our attention. You looked at the walls, that was all. Now normally a mind under such circumstances becomes mad.
I can tell you from my own experience how I avoided becoming mad, but this again has to be prepared by a life of spiritual exercise beforehand. How much can you be alone without the Bible? How much can you bear to be with yourself without switching on the radio, or a record player, etc.?
I, and many other prisoners, did it like this. We never slept during the night. We slept during the day. The whole night we were awake. You know that a Psalm says, “…bless you the Lord,… which by night stand in the house of the Lord.” One prayer at night is worth ten prayers during the day.
All great sins and crimes are committed during the night. The great robberies, drunkenness, reveling, adultery – this whole life of sin is a night life. During the day everyone has to work in a factory, college, or somewhere. The demonic forces are forces of the night, and therefore, it is so important to oppose them during the night.
In solitary confinement we awoke when the other prisoners went to bed. We filled our time with a program which was so heavy, we could not fulfill it. We started with a prayer, a prayer in which we traveled through the whole world. We prayed for each country, for where we knew the names of towns and men, and we prayed for great preachers. It took a good hour or two to come back. We prayed for pilots, and for those on the sea, and for those who were in prisons.
After having traveled through the whole world, I read the Bible from memory. To memorize the Bible is very important for an underground worker.
[quote] I agree with the standing in prayer at night thing I am normally not a sound sleeper it’s because of not enough hormones in my body that trigger the mind to reset to sleep, and I think that God is using this to prepare me for prayer at night since a prayer at night is worth a thousand prayers during the day.
Peter says:
22 February 2010 at 20:43
Thanks Eric, a thought provoking comment!
8 September 2010 at 10:47
i just scanned thro. am short of words..
christine farlow says:
27 September 2010 at 01:41
i know what the plans are and its meant in good faith there will be one who eill decieve and control much confusion will come but stay strong and the path is to not only have world peace but to make the peace that began so long ago i cant say to much but all has shown to me and i was confused and mixed and im still asking ehy me but i have the burdenen to bare im tired and the believe i know im not going to give may i serve in the nsme of lord i am a sinner as i am not perfect
5 December 2011 at 19:01
I really want to know why so many Christians and Jews think they are exempt from evil times.
I dont get it.
Cindy says:
20 November 2012 at 09:45
Peter says:
5 December 2011 at 21:49
The Gospel of Prosperity, I guess. Bad things only happen to other people, elsewhere.
6 December 2011 at 07:02
I am dumbfounded by the people above who seem oblivious to the fact that there has ALWAYS been an underground church SOMEWHERE in the world. No, it may not have come to that in the United States yet… but we need to remember and pray for the believers in countries where they are not free to worship God. In 2008 when some of these were written, many people did not believe the things that are currently happening would come to pass… but they are. Freedom is being restricted like a drawstring which is ever so slowly being tightened. Because the restriction is subtle, most people do not recognize it for what it is. Furthermore, there is a huge problem within the body of believers that “watered down” or “lukewarm” faith is being propagated at an alarming rate. People with watered down or lukewarm faith will NOT be able to withstand the pressures of torture or brainwashing. They WILL renounce their beliefs in order to avoid further suffering… and the advice given in this article is worth more than 1000 other things we could read. I am glad I read this, and hope that I never have to see the day when we must all put into practice the information it has imparted. But we can be certain that day is coming, and if not us – then our children will be the ones suffering for their faith. God help us all. One last thing: to the person above who suggested Christianity teaches only some are forgiven: John 3:16 states that God is not willing that ANY of us should perish. He wants us ALL to have eternal life with Him. The only requirement He has is that we BELIEVE.
Peter says:
11 December 2011 at 21:11
We are very soft I think – even those of us who recognise the reality. Pray for God’s mercy to not test us beyond what we are able to handle – with His grace though, that may be rather a lot more than we think we can handle!
Cindy says:
20 November 2012 at 09:49
3 April 2012 at 01:49
Dear Lydia, in regards to your quote from the book of John. I would like to address the useage of the term “willing” he uses there. There are four types of “will” that are attributed to God. First is His Providential/Decreed = His Sovereign Will. Second is the Revealed/Moral will = The Scriptures. Then there is His Preceptive Will = Revealed based upon His Law. Last is His Dispositional Will = will of desire or emotion. The Dispositional Will is what the Lord our God Jesus Christ is expressing by that statement, and is different from His Sovereign Decretory Will. I hope you see the truth in this understanding! God bless[:
16 August 2012 at 18:35
the image of Christ i am, if my body were to perrish i would see the holes in His hands, and the hole in His side, where His blood shed fell on me, He gave me (His) love, this alone conquers all, even death.. (His love) alone gives you the will to die for Him, and the courage to suffer for Him. Words cannot express His love so there is nothing else i can say, just believe. Is He in you?
Peter says:
19 August 2012 at 15:28
I in Him and He in me. Without that, there is no salvation. I am not my own, but bought with a price. Therefore, let His thoughts be my thoughts, His ways my ways, His love my love.
16 August 2012 at 18:54
the weakness of God is stronger than men, foolishness of God is wiser than men… one time i prayed “thank you Lord for your weakness that i might be strong”, .. then i realized WE WERE HIS WEAKNESS! HIS WEAKNESS WAS HIS LOVE FOR US!!!! HE COULD NOT, NOT LOVE!!!! GOD (IS) LOVE, He sent Himself to die for us!!
14 November 2012 at 08:38
Please pray for me. I was born-again 40 years ago and ministered in the body of Christ as well as to the unbeliever at any and all opportunity that opened to me. However, 6 years ago, I started into a trial that would last 5 years and I felt I would surely not be able to escape the pit I found myself in. I found myself questioning the love and purpose of a God who would allow such suffering in the world –
especially to the innocent children and those helpless to end their suffering. Although, I kept giving myself the answers I had been taught (Man;s gift of freewill.) My daughter fell prey to the feminist movement and constantly challenged me as to how I could love a God who allowed women to be abused all through time. I had experienced a divorce years earlier and was raising four children on my own…which clarifies a lot I am sure. I N E V E R would have believed that this could have happened to me, that my faith and foundation would be shaken so severely…Jesus was my life, joy, and strength up until that time, my children were raised in church and were in church services and activies through their school years up to early college. I had never had any doubts before this time and I could still feel the experience of my glorious salvation from when I was 21 years of age…I am 61. I felt so abandoned, it was an unbelievable dark time. This is only a portion of my experience …my children went into dark depression and two of them were hospitalized – attempted suicide, and the other two were in intense counseling. I have never written this down before, but the information on this site has touched me so deeply. I am now on my way to spiritual recovery and three of my children as well – one of my son’s has been born again and is a great inspiration and comfort to me, and prays for our family.relentlessly. I know the Lord is laying me a new foundation, something must have gone wrong for me to have crumbled after so many years of dedication to the Lord. So… I will be praying to be able to withstand the lies of the enemy and that my family will continue to grow in the
truth of God’s word so that we will never be crushed again. Also, so that we can be a help to those in need as the pressures of the end times unfold here in the west. I will pray for you Please, pray that my daughter will be saved from new age lies, and come to know the love of Jesus. In Christ
Peter says:
19 November 2012 at 22:12
Thanks for your comment, and for sharing what you went through. Sometimes, something doesn’t go wrong for you to experience hard times. I know, I’ve been there. Look at Job, he didn’t exactly get an easy ride. But look up, because you did not curse God and die. For whatever reason, sometimes the Lord leads us through these dark valleys, possibly to learn something we would never learn any other way. I’ll pray for you and your daughter.
20 November 2012 at 06:21
Thank you for caring. It means so much to read your encouraging words today.May God bless you.
Peter says:
20 November 2012 at 21:50
And also with you, and yours.
Cindy says:
20 November 2012 at 09:23
I am completely stunned @ this presentation of truth and thankful to our great God that the Author was brought through!! I cannot begin to imagine this terror and horror! I am offended if my grown Son doesn’t approve of something I may express from the Bible; I would be completely UNPREPARED for ANY suffering such as spoken here. I am so grateful to the Lord for salvation but must take time to memorize God’s word and just be grateful to be alive as the good ole USA is coming to be less and less free. God bless the Author.
Cindy says:
20 November 2012 at 09:56
By the way Peter; God bless you for posting this as well.
Peter says:
20 November 2012 at 21:51
PostTribNetwork says:
20 November 2012 at 11:06
I seen many problems with this article. I totally disagree with him telling Christians they don’t need the Word of God during persecution. There is no way that John the Baptist, disciples, Stephen or Paul could of went through the torture, prisons and even death without the Word of God. This is what they laid down their lives for because they believed in the promises of God. This is why I stay away from men made teachings. You know what would get us through the tribulation? Is the willingness to lay down our lives for Christ because we believe in the promises of God when Jesus comes he will raise us from the dead. This is the time to preach the gospel, share and open our mouths boldly as we ought to speak. Persecution, suffering, and death is not something we need to fear because the grave is the place God has chosen to hid us until his wrath be past then he will raise us from the dead.
Peter says:
20 November 2012 at 22:02
The way I look at it – we should walk a mile in Richard’s shoes before being able to comment on his experience. I took it that he was stripped to the very basics, starved, beaten, drugged, etc. And only then did he understand that God was all sufficient – when He was all that Richard had. Everything else taken away.
But, I do not read that he was saying you do not need the word of God. In fact, he says the opposite, and that you should memorise the whole book (who would do that, nowadays?!) What he says, though, is that the word of God is not God. A Bible verse does not save you. The God who authored the verse, does.
I believe we should use the freedoms we have now, to proclaim the Gospel. For the times will come when we cannot proclaim openly any more, but must go underground.
jim says:
17 December 2012 at 20:20
I do believe the Lord is calling us to prepare, it is time to study, to meditate, to pray and to hold fast our faith in the Lord Jesus. I read “Tortured for Christ” some thirty years ago and it never left me. Reading this now, I know it is time to prepare.
Peter says:
17 December 2012 at 20:59
Hello Jim. I agree, we do need to prepare, so much of the Church is asleep. If we do not stand in Him, we do not stand at all.
jim says:
15 January 2013 at 07:29
Peter, would you care to give me your opinion on another subject, this is the first time I have ever blogged, I think that is what it is called, anyway: I am interested in a smaller home church and I was wondering why so many are thinking bigger, bigger, bigger?
very concerned,
17 December 2012 at 23:16
Daniel Here from http://www.nohatenowarjustlove.org and 9 others “.” and 2 to come wwww.5goldenrings.us & .biz Making 12, Contact me to make this become Great! “Lets take Hate and mold it into Good”
The knowledge is within Us.. We Just have to “Tap” into into it to Change our World and Make Our Human Race a Great Force Once Again!
Peter says:
23 December 2012 at 19:12
As for me I will preach Christ. He is the Way, the Truth and the Life. No-one is good but God alone.
Peter says:
19 January 2013 at 20:10
Sorry, I could not reply to your post directly for some reason.
I don’t have a very strong opinion on the size of church, though I do prefer smaller churches. Once any chuch gets above 250 members, it seems to me that it would be a good opportunity to begin a church plant.
A churh that gets into the thousands seems to me to lose the cohesiveness and family nature that a smaller church can obtain. Not to say that it’s always wrong, but there seems a danger it can be like going to the theatre, rather than to church. All IMHO!
28 August 2013 at 13:53
Very important article. We have released a free ebook on the same subject which we believe is very needful for the times we are living in North America specifically: http://gospelfellowships.net/principles-book/
Pingback: Exploding Eggs and Fresh Manna | Grain of Wheat
26 November 2017 at 10:22
I have been very moved this morning by reading this testimony. I have incorporated a few parts into a blog article I have just written (called Exploding Eggs and Fresh Manna) and included a link back here so those who wish can come to read the full article you have posted. Hope that is OK.
I have read 2 of R Wurmbrand’s books previously and they are deeply moving.
Pingback: Posts for this time | The Age To Come
22 October 2021 at 07:26
I learned only a few minutes ago at another site that Richard Wurmbrand had written an article titled “Preparing for the Underground Church.”
Your site seems to provide a better format so I decided to jump in here.
What are your current thoughts in view of what has transpired the last few months?
Peter says:
25 October 2021 at 20:57
I think we should take the admonition seriously. In so many ways we are soft, not ready. I’ve written before – it’s the twilight of the current age, and we bask in its fading gleams. Much that can be shaken, soon will be. We’re too enmeshed in the relative ease of the current world, and its distractions. Too easily conformed. I believe the Lord desires us to be sober, alert and ready. Now, that’s always the case…always….but it has a special urgency now. We need to be ready for the two sides of the same coin – persecution and revival. And it so often seems to me we are ready for neither. It’s time to seriously consider, count the cost of following Christ, before it becomes time to pay that cost in full. Blessings,
25 October 2021 at 22:01
You say it very well; I cannot agree more.
I personally knew Richard, his wife, Sabina, and some other members of the family.
Peter says:
25 October 2021 at 23:06
Thanks i7sharp, blessing on you and yours too!
Richard was a giant in the faith – it is hard to contemplate what he went through, and imagine having to go through something that may be in many ways worse. At times like that I can only plead my Strong Tower, His strength in the midst of my weakness. Christ alone….
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A few years ago, I used to play this game called “Civilization.” It was actually called Sid Meier’s Civilization, and I’m aware that it still exists and is undoubtedly better than ever. But I don’t know much about it now. I used to play it a decade or so ago, maybe more. The point was then — as I’m sure it is now — to build the greatest civilization in the world. You would do this by building the greatest army, by building the wonders of the world, by filling your civilization with great things like libraries and colleges and aqueducts and, many years later, airports and baseball stadiums.
In any case, back then Sid Meier’s Civilization used to have a cheat mode. In cheat mode, you could advance much, much faster than any other civilization. It was quite comical, really. You would be sending in fighter jets against tribes with clubs. You would be working with nuclear energy when other civilizations were still discovering iron.
It feels like the Houston Astros at the moment are playing baseball on cheat mode.
I realize that can be read a few different ways; I mean it in the best possible one.
I mean that, at the moment, everything the Astros have been plotting for the last few years, every single plan, every single move, all of it is working. The Astros at the moment, have scored the most runs in the American League (by far) and have given up the fewest runs in the American League. They have a double play combination for the ages with Altuve and Correa, they have a multi-faceted offense that somehow hits with power without striking out much (more on this in a minute). They have a dominant top of the rotation with Dallas Keuchel pitching as well as he did in his Cy Young year and young Lance McCullers baffling hitters. And their bullpen, led by super weapon Chris Devenski, is overwhelming.
A few years ago, when Theo Epstein was first talking about how to make the Cubs winners, he kept going back to a singular philosophy: You need to control the strike zone both on offense and on defense. He thought of the strike zone the way football coaches think about the line of scrimmage.
Well, look at Houston. The Astros pitching staff has struck out 537 batters, most in the league. They are striking out 10 batters per nine innings AS A TEAM, and that’s just insane. Other teams, like the Royals a couple of years ago and the Cubs last year, really focused their run-stopping energies on great defense. The Astros play good defense, particularly in the outfield and, bizarrely, in the pitcher spot (Astros pitchers have saved 11 runs by John Dewan’s fascinating system, by far the most in the league). But really, they’re stuffing offenses by simply not letting enough balls get into play.
And then that offense, like I just mentioned, they’re crushing baseballs (they lead the league in slugging percentage) AND they’re not striking out much. The Astros strike out 18 percent of the time, which would have been a lot 20 years ago but in today’s game it is the second-best percentage in the league.
You could see the Astros building toward this over the last few years. They were smart enough to take George Springer with the 11th pick in the 2011 draft, lucky enough to have the No. 1 overall pick when Carlos Correa came out, smart enough to grab Lance McCullers that same year, and resilient enough to overcome their disastrous choice of Mark Appel with the first pick in 2013 when Kris Bryant was just waiting for them.*
*Ugh, think of this team with Kris Bryant.
They were aggressive in getting helpful veterans like Brian McCann, Carlos Beltran and Josh Reddick. They were smart about seeing upcoming trends. It’s a long season, and things can change very quickly. But right now the Astros are playing .700 ball, and for the moment it does feel like they’re using battleships against every other teams’ canoes.
OK, we here at the JPT don’t mean to keep picking on Kyle Schwarber … but at this point, honestly, it is entirely unclear what the Chicago Cubs are doing with him. Wednesday night, the Cubs lost again to San Diego, their sixth straight loss, and this time they got plenty of pitching. Jake Arrieta had one of his better starts this season, allowing just one run in six innings. Reliever Koji Uehara allowed one run in the ninth, the key being Frenchy Cordero’s triple.
And that was enough for the Padres. The Cubs only scored one run — and it was as flimsy a run as you can score. It came when Anthony Rizzo was hit by a pitch, followed by a stolen base, followed by a tag-up on a long fly ball, followed by the saddest little infield hit by Javy Baez, one he hit so poorly that he literally fell down as he was trying to get out of the box.
That was the Cubs’ entire offense.
And Kyle Schwarber, in the No. 2 spot, went 0-for-4 again. He’s now hitting .165 this season.
We talk all the time here about taking the long view, not letting small sample sizes alter your thinking, and that’s all well and good but at some point the Cubs are going to have to do something to shake things up a bit. Through 52 games, they have scored exactly as many runs as they have allowed, they are a couple of game under .500, they have scored a grand total of nine runs in their six games on the West Coast.
Schwarber’s postseason heroics and compelling personality make him an important part of the Cubs overall persona You can see Cubs manger Joe Maddon telling himself again and again, “He’s hitting the ball hard!” And "He’ll break out of this and start hitting any time now!” Maddon doesn’t just keep playing Schwarber, he keeps hitting him at the top of the lineup no matter how many 0-for-4s he rings up.
And it misses a basic point: Kyle Schwarber is not some in-his-prime superstar who you know will work through this slump because he’s always done it before. Schwarber is a 24-year-old prospect who is essentially a rookie this year. He has just 484 regular season plate appearances in the big leagues — about half of them this year — and he’s hitting .209 in his career and has struck out more than once per game. He’s a former catcher who is trying to play the outfield with only marginal success. He may come across as ultra-confident, but we’re now at the point where you have wonder what’s really ticking inside. He is still a kid.
The best example I can think of: In 2007, third baseman Alex Gordon was called up to the Kansas City Royals — he was, by most viewpoints, the best prospect in baseball. He was hitting .172 through the Royals first 52 games that year, but the Royals stuck with him, in part because he like Schwarber still exuded confidence and (perhaps more) because they stunk anyway and they didn’t really have anyone to replace him. He did improve. He hit .284/.328/.477 the rest of the season, and the Royals believed they did the right thing. But after another so-so year and some injuries, the Royals eventually had to send Gordon down to the minors, to learn a new position, to regain his confidence and rebuild his swing.
It was only after he came back that Gordon started to live up to his potential, not as a power-hitting third baseman but as a Gold Glove left-fielder who did all the little things well.
Last year, it seemed like everything the Cubs tried worked perfectly. When things went bad — Schwarber got hurt, Jason Heyward had a season-long slump, the bullpen hit a few bumps — the Cubs would do something, and it worked like magic. Well it’s a new year. Maddon's handling of Schwarber might yet turn out to be more Cubs genius. But it isn’t looking especially bright at the moment.
Mr. Met has four fingers, like most cartoon characters do. Over the weekend, Homer Simpson was inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame, and in his acceptance speech, he pointed out that he deserved it because, “I’m fatter than Babe Ruth, balder than Ty Cobb and have one more finger than Mordecai ‘Three Finger’ Brown."
Mr. Met flashed one of those four fingers on Wednesday in a clear attempt to make that most obscene of finger gestures, and the Internet went nuts as did the New York tabloids, as you might expect:
It is times like this when you have to wonder:
Can a four-fingered Mr. Met even flip the bird?
And: If the answer is yes, why did it take so long?
And: Will as many people care when Albert Pujols’ hits his 600th home run?
And: Since the answer to that question is obviously “No,” what does it say about us as a society?
And: How would we explain to this story to a visitor from outer space? “No, see the guy with the big baseball head is a lovable mascot of a baseball team and in our world we have this gesture that, well, maybe let’s start again."
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Our experts are experts in their field and can assist you in getting the task accomplished efficiently and efficiently. Our snow removal team can take on almost any task. From huge commercial properties, to homes that are more conservative, we do it all. We are Ladonia's most trusted snow removal company and will be your winter experts. Our reasonable rates and extensive line of equipment types ensure that you're getting an excellent job done every time you call.
Ladonia Snow Removal Company provides residential, commercial, and industrial snow plowing. Our experienced team is prompt with their service, provides high-quality work, is friendly, and ready to assist with any questions you may have. Our aim is to create the most attractive lawn for our clients.
We provide snow plowing as well as snow removal services. This includes snow plowing parking lot clearing, snow plowing and driveway snow clearing as well as salting. We are proud of our work and in your property, so you can never be disappointed when you hire Ladonia Snow Removal Company.
If you contract with us for regular service we will monitor the weather and come to your property to take away the snow without the need to call us every time. We will often are working to clear snow, with the assurance that you and your clients are able to reach us.
If you're stuck in a hefty amount of snowfall, trust the skilled professionals at Ladonia Snow Removal Company to provide snow removal services and Ice management services that allow secure daily operations, reducing possible property damage, and also ensuring your personal safety. We're a Ladonia-based company, specializing in snow and ice management, snow plowing, salt application, as well as winter snow removal in Ladonia, AL and all surrounding neighborhoods.
Ladonia Snow Removal Company is a family-owned business with more than 40 years of experience. our entire team is educated in the best and most efficient practices. Every technician is licensed and fully insured. We also provide all of our customers complimentary consultations to determine your specific requirements as well as emergency response services. Book your consultation for a free one today by complete our online contact form or calling us at 888-635-1076 Consult a professional
Ladonia Snow Removal Company is a firm who will create an arrangement to support of your snow and ice throughout the vital months or weeks of the year. Our team will visit your residence or business site to ensure that there is an efficient and high-quality snow removal to ensure snow plowing and simple access. This is essential for residential and commercial properties. You must ensure that your customers and workers have safe passage.
It is essential to have an ice and snow management strategy for your residential or commercial property. Having one improves the safety of your sidewalks and driveways. Also, it helps you to comply with the laws regarding snow removal to prevent any accidents. Ladonia Snow Removal Company offers comprehensive snow and ice management services for homes, retail and industrial establishments, multi-family homes as well as municipal buildings and campuses in Ladonia, Alabama. We can provide a greater description of our services:
Snow Removal - getting rid of the snow that has fallen on your lawn or driveway can consume a lot of energy and time. Our snow removal team from Ladonia, AL will do all the work. Our team will swiftly remove your driveway or front door quickly and efficiently, so that you can get your business or car open within a matter of minutes.
Snow Roof Removal - Snow accumulation on your roof may cause it to fall particularly if you live in an older home or building. Employ our experts on snow roofing to stop this. They will remove ice from your roof according to the latest safety regulations.
You are accountable for clearing walkways leading to your business or your home. Employ our walkway clearing service to ensure the safety of your guests and customers. Our sidewalk clearing services employ modern equipment and supplies to keep your sidewalks free from frozen ice.
Deicing Services – If you have a driveway that sees many cars and pedestrians during winter, it's important to de-ice it in order to prevent accidents. We employ effective, but safe chemical to get rid of ice quickly and stop their accumulation.
Rock Salt Application – Mixing salt with water is an excellent method to remove ice from your walkway or. We employ equipment to spread the salt around your property quickly and efficiently so you can open up your driveways and walkways as soon as possible.
Driveway Clearingat least 24% of weather-related car accidents happen on snowy and slippery roads. Our driveway clearing services will ensure that your driveway remains safe from any accidents. Our equipment is heavy-duty and can remove your concrete of any ice or snow.
Emergency Snow Removal Didn't you remember to make a snow management plan? Our emergency snow removal service will clear your driveway within a matter of minutes. Our snow removal services are backed by experienced operators and top of the-line snowplows.
While it's true that homeowners can do their own snow removal within Ladonia, AL, a particularly snowy winter is never a pleasant experience especially when you're in charge of cleaning all of it up before you leave for work in the morning. There's no need to fret about shoveling snow if hire the local Ladonia snow removal professionals. Our snow removal specialists will clean your home in the most efficient manner and dependability from your driveway all the way to your roof to your walkways and landscaping. For more information, call at 888-635-1076 to get a no-cost estimate and consultation with local specialists.
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In the times we live in, technology has made incredible advances compared to any time in the past. This evolution redefines human life in almost every aspect. In fact, this evolution is a continuous process, and thus human life on earth is constantly improving day by day. One of the newest inclusions in this aspect is cryptocurrencies.
Cryptocurrency is nothing but a digital currency that is designed to require security and anonymity in online money transactions. It uses cryptographic encryption both to generate currency and to verify transactions. New coins are created through a process called digging, while transactions are recorded in a public ledger called the Transaction Block Chain.
The evolution of cryptocurrency is mainly attributed to the virtual world of the network and involves the procedure of transforming readable information into code that is almost impenetrable. This makes it easier to track purchases and transfers involving currency. Cryptography, after its introduction during World War II for secure communication, has evolved into this digital age, mingling with mathematical theories and computer science. Thus, it is now used to provide not only communication and information, but also for money transfers in the virtual network.
How to use cryptocurrency
It is very easy for ordinary people to use this digital currency. Just follow the steps below:
You need a digital wallet (obviously to store the currency)
Use the wallet to create unique public addresses (this allows you to receive the currency)
Use public addresses to transfer funds to or from your wallet
A cryptocurrency wallet is nothing but a software program that can store both private and public keys. In addition, it can also interact with various blockchains so that users can send and receive digital currency, as well as monitor their balance.
Unlike conventional wallets, which we carry in our pockets, digital wallets do not store currency. In fact, the concept of the blockchain is so intelligently mixed with cryptocurrency that currencies are never stored in a certain place. Nor do they exist anywhere in hard money or physical form. The blockchain only stores records of your transactions and nothing else.
Suppose a friend sends you some digital currency, say in the form of bitcoin. What this friend is doing is transferring ownership of the coins to the address of your wallet. Now, when you want to use this money, you unlock the fund.
To unlock the fund, you need to match the private key in your wallet with the public address to which the coins are assigned. Only when these private and public addresses match will your account be credited and the balance in your wallet swell. At the same time, the balance of the sender of the digital currency will decrease. In digital currency transactions, the actual exchange of physical coins never takes place.
Understanding the address of cryptocurrency
By nature, this is a public address with a unique string of characters. This allows a user or digital wallet owner to receive cryptocurrency from others. Each public address that is generated has a matching private address. This automatic match proves or establishes ownership of a public address. As a more practical analogy, you might consider a public cryptocurrency address as your email address to which others can send emails. Emails are the currency that people send you.
Understanding the latest version of the technology in the form of cryptocurrency is not difficult. One needs a little interest and spending time online to clarify the basics.
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Many parents opt to send their kids to daycare to watch after their kids when they're at work all day. But, drop off and pick up can be a hassle for parents.
In many cases, these parents are just starting or finishing their workday. That means they still might need to check emails or take phone calls while picking their kids up from daycare.
Sometimes, parents are doing three things at once.
Answering work emails, making sure our kids aren't bleeding, figuring out what to make for dinner — parents are the kings and queens of multitasking.
Daycare workers are constantly telling parents to stay off their phones during pick-up.
Sometimes, it's hard to get all the kids ready to go when parents are on their phones and not paying attention to their kids.
So much so, that one daycare decided to post a sign on their window for parents to see.
The sign says:
"You are picking up your child! GET OFF YORU PHONE!!! Your child is happy to see you! Are you happy to see your child?? We have seen children trying to hand their parents their work they completed and the parent is on the phone. We have head a child say, "Mommy, mommy, mommy..." and the parent is paying more attention to their phone than their own child. It is appalling. Get off your phone!!"
While the idea behind the sign is understandable, there is some anger behind it.
Sometimes, making a moment or two for your child is important. But, often times, parents could be on the phone for business or an emergency.
After the photo was posted on Facebook, many people were divided.
Some were in complete support of it. One parent wrote:
"I think this is fantastic, and banning phones when picking up your child is great but the way this is worded is awful it's like they are actually talking down to you! Thankfully my child is in a school where the teacher&parent relationship is just as good as the teacher&child so we all speak to each other with respect!"
Others say all they see are parents on their phones.
"Its so disgusting... I pick up my grandson one day a week from school and 90% of the parents/grandparents are on their phone..." another Facebook user said.
Some think phones should be banned completely.
"Phones shouldn't be allowed in nurseries/schools due to safeguarding, so staff should be telling parents [they] are not allowed to use their phone," said one Facebook comment.
Others pointed out that phone calls are sometimes for work or other business.
"Yeah... except when that call is work. And your family relies on your income. And I get off before 5 to pick up my kid, on the understanding that I have to still be available if needed. My point is - we judge too much. I HATE phones. But how do you pretend to know what is actually important versus just your assumption? My husband also has some serious health issues. Should I not answer his calls or texts when I'm at the daycare just so YOU (the person I PAY to care for my child) think I'm paying enough attention to him? Frankly, I'd find another daycare. And before you start - our family bans phones when we're together. And I frickin' can't wait to see my kid. But who am I to judge someone else?" said one Facebook user.
Some said the daycare has no right to say anything.
"What a load of bollocks - no nursery can tell any parent what to do and what is ok we pay their wages and pay for our child if we wanna ignore them and our own child what the hell does it have to do with anyone else ? Get a life you bunch of cranks (I leave my phone in the car when I pick my kids up) but that's my choice and not because I think they have the right to tell me to nor anyone else," another user said.
One parent said the point is: enough with the shaming.
"More parent shaming!!! Get stuffed with all your damn parent shaming, it is getting out of hand now! (not saying I do this cause I don't) heck I'm at work so can't even get to the school gate to pick my child up, I have to rely on family and friends till I get home from work. You don't know anyone's situation so do not judge!!!!!" one user commented.
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A man ponders the options at a Dollar Store in Alhambra, California. Shoppers continue to face high prices on everyday goods. Inflation is the top voter concern in the midterm elections.
Follow live updates and results from Election Day 2022 here.
Like a movie monster from the 1970s, inflation is back and drawing crowds at a polling station near you.
Rising prices are the number one concern for voters in this year's midterm elections, outpacing abortion, crime and other hot-button issues.
More than one in three voters cited inflation as their most pressing priority, according to the latest NPR/PBS Newshour/Marist poll. "Preserving democracy" was a distant second. Republicans were seen as better than Democrats at tackling inflation by a wide margin.
The election comes as consumer prices are climbing at near the fastest pace in four decades. Annual inflation in September was 8.2%. That's down only slightly from the 9% rate in June, which was the highest since 1981.
The consumer price index for October is set to be released on Thursday.
The surge in prices has fueled anxiety among Americans, who are paying more for gasoline, groceries and other necessities.
Inflation was not on the radar two years ago
Inflation was of little concern when President Biden first took office. Although the pandemic had triggered isolated price increases for things like lumber — the overall cost of living was climbing at less than 2% per year.
The incoming administration was more concerned about jobs — fearing a repeat of the sluggish recovery that followed the global financial crisis. The unemployment rate in January of last year was 6.4% — down from nearly 15% in the early months of the pandemic. But with COVID-19 cases climbing, the economy had lost 115,000 jobs the month before Biden was sworn in.
Congressional Democrats quickly passed a $1.9 trillion economic relief bill, which included direct payments of $1400 to most adults, along with expanded unemployment benefits and a new child tax credit.
As economic stimulus, it was a success. Employers have added more than 10 million jobs since Biden took office. But Republicans blame the aggressive relief bill — which passed with no GOP support — for fueling runaway prices.
"Inflation is caused because of reckless Democrat spending," Sen. Rick Scott, R-Fla., told NPR's Morning Edition last week.
Inflation is a global problem
Other factors have undoubtedly contributed to high inflation, including the lingering effects of the pandemic and Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Inflation has been even higher in the Eurozone and the United Kingdom than in the U.S., largely as a result of soaring energy costs tied to the Ukraine war.
But some prominent Democrats acknowledge that last year's relief package played a role in overheating the economy and pushing prices higher.
"Now the bathtub is overflowing," said former Treasury Secretary Larry Summers, who had cautioned his fellow Democrats about just such an outcome. "And it's much easier to stop a bathtub from overflowing than it is to get the water back."
For much of last year, the Federal Reserve believed that prices would cool off on their own, once supply chain snarls caused by the pandemic came untangled. But inflation proved to be higher and more stubborn than the central bank expected. This spring, the Fed began raising interest rates in an effort to tamp down demand and bring prices under control.
Since March, the Fed has raised its benchmark rate six times, driving up borrowing costs for anyone trying to buy a house or a car or carrying a balance on a credit card. Fed chairman Jerome Powell warned last week that rates will likely have to go even higher than expected next year, although the increases may come in smaller increments.
The Fed's crackdown, along with similar moves by other central banks, have raised the risk of a global economic slowdown.
A GOP advantage
Nearly half the voters surveyed in the NPR poll say Republicans would do a better job of controlling inflation, compared to just 27% who think Democrats would be more effective. While Republicans have capitalized on voters' frustration over rising prices, they've offered few concrete prescriptions for bringing inflation down.
Asked about the GOP strategy on Morning Edition, Sen. Scott suggested spending cuts and increased domestic energy production.
"Step one, we've got to do in government what families do. You live within your means," said Scott, who chairs the Republican Senate Campaign Committee. "On top of that, we've got to figure out how to produce energy in this country safely."
Gasoline prices are a particularly potent symbol of inflation, and President Biden's approval rating seems to fall whenever pump prices jump.
The average price of gasoline nationwide hit a record high of $5.01 a gallon in June, when sanctions against Russia sent world crude oil prices soaring. Gas prices have since declined to about $3.80, according to AAA.
Scott Horsley is NPR's Chief Economics Correspondent. He reports on ups and downs in the national economy as well as fault lines between booming and busting communities.
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Interview with Executive Vice President Terashi (4) "In 2050 it won't be about BEVs or FCEVs, but about Toyota"
TECHNOLOGY Talk between Shigeki Terashi and Naoto Ikeda
Interview with Executive Vice President Terashi (4) "In 2050 it won't be about BEVs or FCEVs, but about Toyota"
Toyota goes to the moon: What is Toyota's strategy for electrification? -
Interview between Naoto Ikeda (Motor Journalist) and Shigeki Terashi (Part Three)
Toyota currently has only 11-12 percent of the world market share
We will have to think about liquid hydrogen in the near future
There is no point in putting BEVs and FCEVs on opposite axes
An interview with Executive Vice President Terashi by motor journalist Naoto Ikeda was published on March 16th and 17th on “THE PAGE”, a news site operated by Yahoo’s subsidiary Wordleaf Corporation that highlights noteworthy trends and social problems in the world and explains them clearly. Based on the length of the content, TOYOTA TIMES serialized the content of this interview over five episodes with the cooperation of “THE PAGE” and Mr. Ikeda.
Toyota will embark on a project exploring the moon. Borrowing from the words of President Akio Toyoda, Executive Vice President Shigeki Terashi has stated that the challenge is to combine “the virtual with reality” and bring the technology on earth to the moon. In this, the forth episode of a five-part series, motor journalist Naoto Ikeda and Executive Vice President Shigeki Terashi discuss how Toyota is often criticized for being lead-footed when it comes to battery electric vehicles (BEVs), and how the top management of Toyota’s Technical Center thinks about and plans its future strategy to meet the global trend of vehicle electrification.
FCEV truck made for demonstration purposes at the request of the Port of Los Angeles in response to issues concerning the operation ratio versus charging as experienced with conventional BEVs
In the future, 30 years from now, the energy infrastructure will gradually change. In compliance with the Paris Agreement, Japan aims to reduce greenhouse gas emissions by 80 percent by 2050. How will Toyota face this challenge?
If society needs to reduce CO2 emissions to one-fifth of current levels, then, naturally, internal combustion engines cannot survive. Or rather, economic activity will have to be considerably reduced in society as a whole. Be that as it may, even if this effort was limited to vehicles, it would be a very important part of realizing a hydrogen society.
Currently, Toyota has only one type of FC (Fuel Cell) stack, which is installed in the Mirai. But the application range of FCEVs is expanding, such as for forklifts, which are suitable for indoor work because they do not emit exhaust gas, and the SORA, a large bus designed for public transportation equipped with two stacks. How will the FCEV evolve?
Toyota currently has only 11-12 percent of the world market share
The FC stack is the silver metal block in the center of the vehicle. The two yellow cylinders are high-pressure hydrogen tanks.
Up until now the current HEV (Hybrid Electric Vehicle) has been practical, but I heard that only PHEVs (Plug-In Hybrid Electric Vehicles) will be able to clear future regulatory standards. Then again, there is talk of BEVs (Battery Electric Vehicles) and FCEVs (Fuel Cell Electric Vehicles) joining the ranks of mainstream passenger cars. We will talk more about commercial vehicles later, but let’s talk a little bit about what we need to do right now to get to that point, and the unique benefits of the FCEV.
Up until now, we have talked about BEVs and FCEVs as if they were the same, but I actually think that in terms of the technological innovation of the FCEV, it would take an enormous amount of time to make an even more compact stack (the heart where the electricity is generated) at a low price. Therefore, I think that BEVs will lead the way and spread further faster, and FCEVs will follow accordingly. If the FCEV stack and tank can be made to be more compact, the BEV battery load will be reduced. That way, we will be able to switch BEVs to FCEVs.
So, you mean that it’s not about conversion (retrofitting) from BEV to FCEV, but about being able to create FCEVs as a variation of the car model?
That’s right. We're currently working on the second generation FCEV that will come out next year or so, but we're simultaneously developing the third generation as well. As for the third generation FCEV tanks and stacks, we are saying that we will determine the size after carefully looking at the BEV packages of other companies.
As you mentioned previously, that means as a system supplier.
Right. For example, if a company with BEV technology says “We want to sell FCEVs that align with the energy characteristics of this area,” then I think we would be able to reduce the amount of batteries to make them cheaper, load them with FC stacks and tanks, and make it possible to switch from BEV to FCEV while the motor stays as is. However, in order to do that, stacks and tanks would need to fit various-sized vehicles from a variety of companies.
What is your target size for the stack when comparing it to the currently available stack?
I’m hoping that we can make it to be about 60 percent of the current stack's size. To load in small vehicles, big vehicles and vehicles somewhere in the middle, we only need to adjust the number of cells in the stack, just as you would adjust the number of batteries in a BEV.
So, you hope to make a stack that is able to be combined based on vehicle size? A variable stack of sorts?
The FC stack and tank on the trolley are noticeably large compared to the size of the vehicle
Basically. For example, in the case of trucks and buses, two stacks need to be loaded, and if you have an FC system that can accommodate different sizes, it will be possible to handle various case scenarios. For example, depending on the area, let’s say a town has a lot of hydrogen, and eventually plans to create a town with a hydrogen infrastructure. In that case, during the transition period in which FC systems are not cheap enough or compact enough, BEV trucks and buses can be used. When the time is right, since trucks and buses are easy to retrofit, FC stacks and tanks can be installed, and the motor can be diverted to accept the new source of energy, so FCEVs can be made immediately. Therefore, creating a “full coverage electrification coalition” doesn’t mean developing various systems individually. The fundamentals of the electrified portion of the base are the same.
In other words, there are various areas and various needs, so it's about making solid fundamentals as a system to meet any need.
Yes, that’s right. So, for example, if we put a stack on a hybrid engine, and then put the tank somewhere, we can make an FCEV that is exactly the same as the hybrid configuration. Therefore, we need technology that makes the system compact, while allowing for cost reduction. It is all about making the system as affordable as possible.
As it stands, tanks seem to be very expensive. What is the stack-to-price ratio?
Stacks are more expensive because they use platinum. We have to use technology that further reduces the use of catalysts and precious metals.
Cost reduction is important to promote widespread use, and the use of rare materials does not allow for creating a large amount. How are you planning to solve this? What about the labor-intensive tanks?
Right now, we need to load a lot of a high-pressure tanks.
Aren’t you using carbon now? And still working very hard to manufacture it, winding it by hand?
Yes, we use carbon. We make the tanks by winding carbon on a resin capsule.
We will have to think about liquid hydrogen in the near future
“If you reduce the battery load of a BEV and install an FC stack, you can change a BEV to an FCEV,” says Executive Vice President TerashiPhoto by Koji Shiwa
Making them by hand takes a lot of time and effort, which is why the cost doesn’t come down. Also, I know that because it is large and the shape must be cylindrical to withstand high pressure, that has been a problem.
Right. That’s why we will have to think about liquid hydrogen in the near future. I think we will have to consider the hydrogen itself, including how it is placed, among a number of other things.
I heard that Chiyoda Corporation said it is possible to mix it with toluene to make 1/500 the volume of gas at room temperature and pressure. And since it’s toluene, the gasoline infrastructure can be used as is. Both toluene and gasoline are legally classified as Hazardous Materials Class 4.1: Flammable Solids. That would make things very interesting, because then it would be possible to pump hydrogen just like pumping gas at a gas station today.
In addition to that, we need to develop hydrogen technology itself. In this case, if Toyota were to go it alone, it is already in the category of energy policy. The question is how to make and how to use hydrogen energy? This is no longer a matter that one company should work on and decide alone; rather, it is best left to teams made up of members from the public and private sectors.
In short, the genre has become so broad, it is no longer reasonable for Toyota to handle everything.
It is exactly the same as the Lunar Rover. If you think about going into space and using a vehicle, I think every technology is an unknown question mark at this time. While I do think that Toyota has a role to play in sharing its vision with everyone, I don’t think Toyota needs to come up with all the solutions.
Nowadays, when people talk about the environment, what often comes up is “Tank to Pipe,” meaning from the point where fuel is put in to where the exhaust gas comes out, and “Well to Wheel,” meaning from the point the oil is drilled to the spinning tires. There are many more ways of thinking, including beyond that scope, but for now, these two views are to some extent backed by the figures. FCEVs are definitely zero emission from the perspective of Tank to Pipe, but in terms of Well to Wheel, the situation changes depending on how the hydrogen is produced. If it comes from oil, that’s definitely not a zero-emission source. What are your thoughts on how to produce hydrogen at this time?
There is a debate about how to go from initially creating the energy to using it to run a vehicle, and I think it makes sense to have such a discussion. However, ultimately it comes down to what kind of energy plan a given region or country will go with in the near future. Therefore, taking a cross section to see how much CO2 is currently emitted in hydrogen production is certainly worthwhile, but we need to explore future changes in how to make hydrogen with less CO2.
Sometimes within Well to Wheel the order changes a bit, so even if the amount of CO2 emitted at an earlier stage is higher, it doesn’t mean it is untenable overall. If you look ahead to the landing point of the final energy plan, and think about what kind of technological development is needed to realize that, various options become visible.
There is no point in putting BEVs and FCEVs on opposite axes
Hama Wing is a wind farm installed in Yokohama’s bay area. It produces hydrogen by electrolysis using electricity generated by wind power. When there’s no wind, electrolysis can continue using a used Prius battery as a backup. Hydrogen can be viewed as a form of storage and transport for electricity.
Therefore, if there are various electrification technologies, you are saying that the greater the corresponding range, the greater the degree of freedom in infrastructure energy design. For example, Toyota is now testing the “Hama Wing” in Yokohama and Kawasaki. The wind doesn’t blow only when it’s convenient. It may blow when it’s not needed. That being the case, the electricity generated is stored in a used Prius battery to produce hydrogen while keeping the power stable. That way, even when the wind blows at a time when power demand is low, such as at night, it can be stored as hydrogen. It is one way of storing energy by replacing it with hydrogen; just like storing electricity in a battery. Am I right?
Yes. Therefore, as I mentioned earlier, if you think of BEVs and FCEVs as being on opposing axes, it becomes a matter of which one is better or worse, but fundamentally, it is a matter of storing energy in battery or hydrogen form. Therefore, I think some energy storage options are better than others depending on how the energy is used at the tail end.
You are absolutely right. And there is talk that commercial vehicles are probably the most suitable for hydrogen right now. In that case, unlike passenger cars, hydrogen stations would not be required everywhere one went, and all the more so for long-distance trucks, whose starts and stops are predetermined. Once the infrastructure is in place, there will be no problems. With such large vehicles, it is preferable for drivers to take shifts while the vehicle itself keeps going for 24 hours. It follows that a long charging time, as is the case with BEVs, would not be desirable. If a hydrogen refill took only five minutes, drivers could hop in and out and quickly be on their way. How is commercial vehicle development proceeding?
The original reason for making the Mirai FCEV was to meet the US ZEV regulations (see the additional explanation below). We started with the idea of building a passenger car. One future development, as you mentioned, will be commercial vehicles. Commercial vehicles don’t have users on a large scale. Rather, we usually get requests on the order of “Could you build us an FCEV garbage truck?” Quiet operation is an attractive feature if you often work late at night or early in the morning. Also, if you need to keep working for 24 hours, FCEVs are far better than diesel vehicles, whose loud noise disturbs the neighborhood during night road construction. That's why we have so many scale ideas and requests for using FCEVs.
If you make a passenger car like the Mirai and try to sell a lot of them, the conversation immediately turns to infrastructure maintenance, which is a very difficult subject. Thus, in the end we think that it’s best to have a combination of passenger and commercial vehicles. In the case of commercial vehicles, buses and taxies, the taxi business will continue to go well as long as there are a fair number of LPG (Liquefied Petroleum Gas) stands. I think things are easier with the vehicles that to some extent have a predetermined route.
If the travel distance is short and you don’t drive at night, BEVs should be fine, but as I said earlier, if you want to use the vehicle for 24 hours, FCEVs are the better choice. The same holds true for commercial vehicles. Rather than arguing about FCEVs vs. BEVs, I think it is a matter of which best serves the desired end.
That's why it's always possible to prepare a full line of products to be able to choose the one that best suits your needs.
The “SORA” FCEV motorcoach bus (Photo by Toyota)
Sure. Changing the subject slightly, what I am most interested in now is, of course, FCEVs and BEVs, but aside from that, have you noticed how many disasters have occurred in Japan lately, like the blackout in Hokkaido just the other day? When power outages occur, it's important to have a sense of security and to know that electricity and the lights will be available at night. The plug-in hybrid Prius (in Japan and Europe, Prius PHV, in the US, Prius Prime) is good for home use, but it can't provide ample electricity. If you think about the lighting and air conditioning needed for evacuees at an evacuation center, small vehicles would be useless, whereas something the size of a bus would serve very well. We have started launching a vehicle called the “SORA,” an FCEV motorcoach bus, but it would be a bit difficult for the average person to actually purchase one.
Buses usually cost 100 million yen (roughly USD$1 million) and upwards.
It will eventually become cheaper, but it’s around that much right now.
A standard bus costs about 20 million yen (roughly USD$200,000).
Let's say we make FCEVs or BEVs about the size of a Coaster microbus, even if subsidies were maintained forever, or even if everyone finds that these electrified vehicles could be deployed as countermeasures in a disaster, there would still be places where it would be painfully difficult to steadily increase the numbers. For example, let’s say a vehicle the size of an FCEV Coaster is normally used to carry customers or employees. When a disaster occurs, the vehicle could be rushed to where it was needed to supply needed power. Another example might be keeping a convenience store open (during a disaster) with an FCEV parked next to it. I think it would be nice to have an FCEV that is the size of a Coaster to prepare for when the need arises.
In that case, it would most likely be necessary to design a grid to locate power source vehicles around the whole country. You would have to work closely with local governments and the country to make detailed designs.
That’s true. When we have talked about this with local governments, they have said that it is quite impossible to purchase a SORA FC bus, but they would buy one if it were more like a Coaster. Many companies say the same. Toyota dealers also say that they should own at least one, and we should all use them when trouble arises.
Given such a positive trend, I see that the goal of Toyota’s electrification program is to be able to deliver the best solution for the region in order to contribute to society while considering environmental issues.
In the final installment of this long interview, Toyota claims the FCEV goes even further, with an ability to purify the air by extracting pollutants like the way an air purifier functions. We will hear about “minus emissions” in Toyota’s words next time.
Regulations on automobile exhaust gas originating in California, according to which makers whose volume exceeds a certain number of vehicles must sell a certain percentage of vehicles that meet the state's ZEV regulations. Failing to do so entails paying a large fine or buying a surplus (credit) from a maker who has met the requirements of the regulations.
Since 2018, ZEV regulations have become even more stringent, and the number of states that have adopted them has increased, causing this to become an urgent issue for North American-based makers.
The list below is the roadmap for regulations up to 2025*. The percentage indicates the total ratio of environmentally friendly vehicles to the total number of vehicles sold by the maker. In parentheses the values for ZEVs (Zero Emission Vehicles) are on the left, and the values for PHEVs (plug-in hybrids) are on the right. For example, in 2020, 9.5 percent of all cars sold must be fuel efficient vehicles. Ideally all should be ZEVs, but PHEVs can account for up to 3.5 percent. However, the amount exceeding 3.5 percent will not be counted.
20197.04.03.0
202112.08.04.0
202214.510.04.5
202317.012.05.0
202419.514.05.5
202522.016.06.0
*List current as of publishing date
Ikeda was born in Kanagawa in 1965. He joined the Neko Planning Division (now Neko Publishing) in 1988, where he was in charge of Car Magazine, Auto Maintenance, and AUTOCAR JAPAN. After leaving the company in 2006, he became editor-in-chief of the business news site “PRONWEB Watch.” Following his departure in 2008, he established the “Granite” editing production company, and currently writes articles on automaker strategies, market structures, as well as the history of mechanics and technology. He authored the book “Spirit of the Roadster: Lightweight Sports Born in Hiroshima” (President Inc.)
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The writer and director Michael Almereyda is making some of the most thoughtful and inventive biographical dramas of any filmmaker working today.
He's fascinated by the lives of scientists and intellectuals, but rather than merely rattling off their accomplishments, he uses the medium of cinema itself to explore how their minds actually worked. A few years ago he directed Experimenter, a portrait of the controversial researcher Stanley Milgram that played its own sly psychological games with the audience.
Almereyda's new film, Tesla, is a quieter, moodier affair than Experimenter, but it has the same invigorating playfulness. It unfolds as a series of funny-sad vignettes from the life of Nikola Tesla, the Serbian-American inventor who has often been relegated to a historical footnote — as the younger, hipper rival to Thomas Edison. But Tesla, played here by a superb Ethan Hawke, looms ever larger these days in the public imagination. He's been a character in novels, video games and quite a few movies, like The Current War and The Prestige , in which he was played by none other than David Bowie.
Tesladoesn't follow the usual cradle-to-the-grave biopic trajectory. There are oddball comic asides, like the scene where Tesla and Edison attack each other with ice-cream cones; needless-to-say, the movie tells us, that didn't really happen. Sometimes a narrator interrupts the action to run Google searches on the characters, a nifty little fact-checking device that also underscores the story's relevance. It connects Tesla, a pioneer in the field of wireless communications, directly to the internet technology we use today.
Aside from the occasional leaps forward and backward, the movie is told in mostly chronological order. It begins in the 1880s, not long after Tesla, who was born in what is now Croatia, has emigrated to New York City. There, he gets a job working for Edison, played with snappish wit and a rich vein of melancholy by Kyle MacLachlan.
Tesla is developing a new project, a motor that uses alternating current — a more efficient system of harnessing electrical power than Edison's direct-current method. Edison feels threatened and refuses to support Tesla's work, as the younger man bitterly notes in a letter to a friend.
Edison is just one of many powerful older men with whom Tesla will cross paths over the course of his tumultuous career. Jim Gaffigan gives an enjoyably big-hearted performance as the engineer and entrepreneur George Westinghouse, who funds the Tesla motor and makes it a force to be reckoned with.
Later, Tesla finds a chillier patron in the banker J.P. Morgan, who gives him the modern-day equivalent of $4 million to build a wireless communications system, only to balk when the project leads Tesla into ever more bizarre realms of study. At one point, Tesla comes to believe he might be receiving secret transmissions from Mars.
Hawke, who starred in Almereyda's offbeat Shakespeare adaptations Hamletand Cymbeline, gives a beautifully internalized performance as Tesla. He nails the essence of a deep thinker who likes his solitude and who's more comfortable at home with his notebooks than he is out and about in society.
The movie does hand a prominent role to Anne Morgan, J.P. Morgan's daughter, memorably played by Eve Hewson. She becomes a close friend of Tesla's as well as a kind of stand-in for the audience. Through her tender yet sharply perceptive gaze, we come to appreciate this man's genius, but we also register the pride and short-sightedness that will again and again prove to be his undoing.
Teslahas been a long time in the making. Almereyda wrote the script decades earlier, but it languished for years until the financing at last came together. Watching the finished movie, I couldn't help but feel that Almereyda empathizes instinctively with Tesla. Not because the director sees himself as some sort of fellow visionary, but because he knows that in science as well as in filmmaking, bold thinkers often run afoul of naysaying benefactors.
Teslais a deeply unconventional movie, but never in a self-congratulatory way. The gifted cinematographer Sean Price Williams gives the interiors a rich amber glow, cast initially by candles and later by electric bulbs: A world that might have seemed stiff and static is instead wildly in flux. The movie is a hypnotic experience. You might be thrown by some of the weirder touches, like the wildly anachronistic scene in which Tesla stands in front of a microphone and sings a 1985 British pop hit, but I loved its crazy daring. It reminds us what a modern creature Tesla was, a figure from the past who never stopped pointing the way to the future.
Justin Chang is a film critic for the Los Angeles Times and NPR's Fresh Air, and a regular contributor to KPCC's FilmWeek. He previously served as chief film critic and editor of film reviews for Variety.
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When you need a masonry contractor in Leisure Knoll NJ, look for someone with experience working on projects similar to yours. Researching concrete contractors near me and getting price quotes will ensure there are no regrets! The process begins by figuring out what type of work needs to be done (ie: installing a new patio). Then, make a list of all potential vendors that are able to provide services that match your requirements. Contact them individually and inquire about pricing before deciding to whom to award the contract. This will help you get the best job at a competitive price and ensure you have appropriate expertise on board. If it’s not clear what needs to happen, then consulting with a professional will help provide accurate estimates for all aspects of work needed so they can be planned out accordingly. If there are unanswered questions about how best to approach certain tasks at hand, having an expert weigh prevails before making decisions because this person knows their stuff and knows exactly which resources would go most smoothly along those lines! After you select the Leisure Knoll NJ concrete contractor you are comfortable with, request the details of the agreement in writing. Confirm that this document includes the details of the work to be completed, costs, and expected timeline to completion.
We proudly service Ocean County NJ and all of its cities including: Ridgeway, Lakehurst, Cedar Glen West, Pine Lake Park, Pleasant Plains, Pine Ridge at Crestwood, Oak Ridge, Woodmere, Maple Shade, Holiday City South
Masonry is the perfect material for adding character and longevity to any Leisure Knoll home or business. It’s made from natural, durable materials like concrete, stone, or brick that don’t fade easily over time whereas wood will weather quickly in rainstorms making it prone to mold due to lack of moisture absorption. Wood also requires more maintenance as you will likely need to paint, stain or seal it every few seasons. Masonry is one of the most popular construction techniques because it provides benefits that can’t be found with other methods. These include being more reliable and providing an appealing finish thanks to its smooth texture, unlike anything else! The first time a job is done right can make all the difference between an easy and enjoyable experience, versus one that’s stressful. Find a masonry contractor in Leisure Knoll NJ who specializes in doing this type of work so they are able to provide their expertise with materials as well as getting it completed correctly from start to finish avoiding any future problems down the line.
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Masonic Designs offers a wide range of services in masonry, concrete, stone, and brick. Our team of expert masonry contractors has the skills to complete any job from walls and walkways to veneers and stairs. We take pride in every job we do, no matter how big or small it is.
Concrete is a great material to use in your home or business because it’s affordable, durable–and customizable! It also offers many years of experience working on projects just like yours; which means you can count on us for quality results. Don’t hesitate: give the experts at Masonic Designs Concrete Contractors (around town) a call today so start enjoying living comfortably without worrying about other potential problems/repairs down this line too. Our team will turn any vision into reality. Concrete has the ability to be versatile and durable, making it an excellent choice for any type of project you may need. We have a wide variety of services that can help with your needs; we specialize in concrete work from driveways all the way up patios! Our high-quality materials ensure years upon decades worth of happiness by giving us one call today!” Masonic Designs is offering a special deal for anyone who needs new concrete work done. Receive free design consultation and installation with any job online thanks in large part due to the company’s amazing offer! Fill out their form today so they contact you shortly – it’ll be worth your time since these guys provide high-quality products at affordable prices (and without sacrificing depth or craftsmanship).
Masonic Designs is the best place for Leisure Knoll NJ residents to find a wide range of stone options that can be used in any project or style! If you’re looking into adding some curb appeal, our stones may just do it. With veneers, we give off fooled-looking looks with authentic touches thanks to leeway: replacing natural materials like Flagstone before installing them on your property so they last longer than expected–and at no extra charge!! Contact us today for a FREE design consultation and quote!
Get a FREE Quote Today. Plus, 20% off When you fill out our form.
The experts at Masonic Designs want to make sure that you get the most for your next concrete project. Get free design consultation, quote, and an instant 20% OFF of your project, simply by filling out the form. Stop waiting and get started now!
What is the cost of Concrete Leisure Knoll NJ
Concrete prices vary depending on the size and type of project, as well as where it’s located. For example, A 20’x30’ room can cost anywhere from $1-$3 per square foot; however, if you need to use larger quantities for an event or building process that would require 150 yards (or more), then this same amount will be priced at about 2 cents each! The reason is due in large part because the many factors involved like how busy our industry is during the summer months which drives up costs across the board – not just with the concrete itself but also things like labor rates too. With our design team’s guidance, future contractors will know exactly how to prepare your yard for construction without sacrificing its aesthetics. The exterior of a home is one place where you can really make an impression and we’re going above and beyond by making sure that all efforts go seamlessly together so customers always know what they’re getting into before installation begins – no surprises!
Our team at Masonic Designs is dedicated to providing our customers with high-quality, custom pavers for any budget! We offer beautiful designs that are sure to make their property stand out and last long into the future. We understand that every customer is different, which is why we offer a wide variety of paver installation services. From driveways and sidewalks to patios and pool decks, we can do it all. We also offer stonework for those looking to add a touch of luxury to their home. No matter what type of project you’re working on, we can help. We use only the highest quality pavers for our projects, which are designed to last a lifetime. We also offer a variety of colors and styles to choose from, so you can find the perfect match for your home. Contact us today to learn more about our paver installation services!
There’s a timeless quality to a brick that will never go out of style. With its earthy tones and natural appeal, it can be used in all sorts of settings from conversions of old cottage backdrops to new construction projects where you want an authentic look without sacrificing comfort or modernity. No matter what your vision is, our team of skilled masons at Masonic Designs can make it a reality. Bricks have been used in construction for centuries, and there’s a reason why they’re still such a popular choice today. They’re durable, easy to maintain, and offer a classic look that can be customized to suit your needs. If you’re looking for a brick mason in Leisure Knoll NJ, look no further than Elite Landscaping. We offer a wide range of services, from brick paving and walkways to fireplaces and outdoor kitchens. We also offer stonework for those looking to add a touch of luxury to their home.
The term “hardscaping is used to describe contractors who design and install brick, stone, and concrete to create various things around your home or business. Some of these creations include steps, walls, home veneers, patios, walkways, and chimneys. Essentially, anything that is not part of your home’s landscaping would be considered hardscaping. There are many benefits to hardscaping. It can add value to your home, it is low maintenance, and it can be customized to suit your needs. Hardscaping is also a great way to add curb appeal to your home. If you’re looking for a hardscaping contractor in [ location] NJ, look no further than Masonic Designs. We offer a wide range of services, from brick paving and walkways to fireplaces and outdoor kitchens. We also offer stonework for those looking to add a touch of luxury to their home. Contact us today to learn more about our services!
Why Us?
We know you deserve only the best when it comes to your concrete needs. So, if there is anything from small repairs such as fixing up an old patio with new pavers* or repairing cracks in driveways; all of which will be done quickly without sacrificing quality workmanship so that they’re left satisfied every step along this process! When hiring Masonic Designs (or getting a quote) rest assured knowing we’ll deliver outstanding service guaranteeing satisfaction. With over 10 years in the business, our team has the experience and knowledge to handle any project you may have. We understand that every customer is different, which is why we offer a wide variety of services. From driveways and sidewalks to patios and pool decks, we can do it all. We also offer stonework When you need a reliable company to help with any project, it’s important that they have not only knowledge but also experience. We are locally owned and operated which means their investment in Leisure Knoll NJ community will be felt long after your job is done!
There is no better place to find a project leader than here at our company. Our leaders have years of experience in their respective industries and will make sure that your renovation or building project goes off without any hitches!
We’re so confident in our work that we offer an unconditional guarantee on all projects done by us. If you aren’t satisfied, let us know and we’ll make it right! Yes, we’ll return until you are totally satisfied; GUARANTEED!
The most important thing in life is to live every day like it’s your last. And with the level of service at our company, you can be sure that we will do everything possible for an experience worth remembering!
Fill out our form now for your FREE on-site consultation, quote, and instantly receive 20% OFF your new project! That’s a lot of value for just filling out a form. Get started now and don’t wait any longer!
Masonic Designs has been providing outstanding masonry services to homes, offices, and businesses in Leisure Knoll and throughout New Jersey for years. We have completed hundreds of projects all across the state while providing our clients with quality service on every job! You can count on us when you need high-end design solutions including steps & patios; driveways or walkways—even brick pavers if that’s what you’re looking for (and at an unbeatable price). Our team of experienced professionals works with you from start to finish to ensure that your project is completed exactly to your specifications. We provide a free consultation so that we can better understand what you’re looking for and develop a plan that meets your needs, timeline, and budget. You can count on us for all of your concrete needs!
Frequently Asked Questions
Does hardscaping add value to my home?
Yes! Homeowners should invest in upgrading their backyards and outdoor spaces because it can help them get more out of living at home. According to RealEstate, for every dollar spent on improving a backyard or patio area, homeowners could see up 60 cents returned as well as an increase of 14%. This means that if you have $500K worth of property where this would apply -you’re looking at nearly 75 grand!
Is stone better than brick?
Stone is a more durable, long-lasting material than brick. It may be priced similarly to its counterpart and can even potentially have lower repair costs if manufactured stones are used in construction instead of natural ones!
How much does stone veneer cost per square foot?
Stone veneer siding is a popular choice for those who want to add curb appeal and improve the visual appeal of their home. Stone varies in price depending on size, but an average-sized 1,500 sq ft house could be installed with stone ranging between $8500 – $16125.
How many bricks do I need for 500 square feet?
Around 2250 bricks should cover it!
How long does concrete last?
The average life span of any concrete structure is 75-100 years, but it’s only 50–60 for an apartment and 40 for a house.
What is the cost of bricks?
The cost of bricks varies depending on the type of brick, the size, and the quantity you need. Generally, bricks cost between $0.50 and $2.00 each.
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Service Area
Masonic Designs is proud to service Lakewood NJ, all of Ocean County, as well as, all of the neighboring cities. We offer FREE on-site consultations in these areas and will provide you with an estimate for your project.
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"...addicted...to the ministry of the saints.…For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the Body of Christ."
“…we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved…”
MAY 2018
Grace and peace to all who love the Lord Jesus Christ in sincerity and in truth, and who believe and rejoice in His name according to the Scriptures. We trust you are well, and that you continue to believe, judge by, and have great joy in, God’s one and only Gospel which alone contains His Testimony that must be believed in, of the Person and Work of His dear Son, the Lord Jesus Christ.
The following is from my book, ‘Election Is Just Not Fair!’:
The whole of christendom virtually chants, as if it were some mystical mantra: ‘Salvation is by grace, salvation is by grace,’ and yet they do not understand what they are saying when they utter the word grace. Grace is something which cannot be merited and therefore to say that after a man chooses God, the Lord then responds by granting His grace, is ludicrous. Grace is not motivated by a deed of man but by the mercy of God. Grace and mercy, by definition, are things given in light of there being no redeeming feature of, or act by, man which could justify him. If salvation is given freely and solely by the unmerited grace of God—not according to ANYTHING man has done but according to God’s purpose and will—then what the free willer is believing in, whether he knows it or not, is a salvation not based on grace but on works, something given as a deserved wage which the man has earned the right to have and which demands that God supply. If you do something that makes another respond in a certain way, then you are the one who has prompted that person’s action. It has not come by an independent act of volition on their part but as a response to what you have done. Your act has brought on, or caused, an effect. If the free willer is right, it is no longer the Person and Work of Christ, the imputation of His Righteousness and the non-imputation of sin, that demands man’s salvation but something which man has done. Paul the apostle asks,"...who maketh thee to differ from another? And what hast thou that thou didst not receive? Now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?" (1 Cor. 4:7). "Had not God interfered and made a difference, all would have remained alike under sin. The race (of man) would have together rejected His mercy; and it is only by His distinguishing love that any are brought to believe and be saved." When a person says ‘I chose God’, they are glorying, boasting, in themselves. They are saying it is they themselves, by their choice of Him, that has made them to differ from the one who has not made such a decision. It is not free grace, but free will that is gloried in and seen as that which has made the difference. NOT EVEN THE ATTRIBUTING OF THIS FREE-WILL DECISION TO GOD’S ENABLING GRACE CAN REDEEM THIS FALSE DOCTRINE. No, my friend, it is God Who makes the difference between saved and lost and not man. GRACE IS GOD, NOT YOU! All that a saved man has he readily, joyfully, admits he has received from God as a gift and not something he went out and chose or earned.
The following is an excerpt taken from my book ‘How Many Gospels’:
In Galatians 1 the apostle Paul did not speak about a man’s ‘good intentions’ when he warned about those who brought with them another gospel. He did not exclude or exonerate people from being among the accursed if it was discerned that they ‘meant well’, as is the intention, no doubt, of most religious teachers when expounding their beliefs. Meaning well is fine. No one is doubting the person’s intention when they unknowingly bring another gospel, but it is what they are saying about God that is the issue. A person may well have good intentions and mean well when they give directions to someone who has lost their way, but if those directions are wrong, then no amount of good intentions is going to get the person to whom they were given to their intended destination! Its just going to confuse them even more. So too, a false gospel, no matter how much it may be accompanied by the good intentions of a well meaning person, has never and will never get anyone to heaven. Paul couldn’t care less what a man’s motive was in preaching the true Gospel (Phil. 1:18), but it mattered a great deal when they came preaching a different gospel. What do they say His Gospel is? Who do they say Christ is? What do they say Christ did? Do they agree with God? If they do, it will be evidenced by their speaking the same Gospel HE teaches. Does their gospel differ in any way with God’s? If so, they reveal themselves as accursed people, not saved people who have a few errors, but ACCURSED PEOPLE BECAUSE OF THEIR ERROR! People are so often prone to legitimizing that which a person says because of their manner and presentation. No less so in matters spiritual. People give legitimacy to a gospel taught them simply because those who bring it are learned people or respected and recognized ‘ministers’. Because they are such ‘nice’ people. For many, the fact that a man is an ‘ordained minister’ is seen as proof that he has passed through some rigorous series of tests concerning his character, and that he is now somehow beyond repute, and that he was able to retain an accepted level of that which he was taught over several years. All this combines to assure people that we can, and should, trust such men implicitly. Remember the old adage, Don’t judge a book by its cover! Someone might say, ‘But they are such lovely people, such God-fearing people.’ Yes, but which god are they fearing? If it is not the true God’s Gospel they believe, then it is not the true God they are fearing. Paul spoke not of a man’s reputation or eloquence of speech as being the reliable and verifiable factors we were to look out for before deciding whether or not he was of God and his message true. Not at all. Do not allow yourselves to be moved simply because a preacher sounds good, is easy to listen to and speaks with high reverence and whose voice echoes with authority or who exudes confidence that what he is saying is true. Do not merely believe what a man is saying because of how convinced he seems to be that what he is saying is the truth. The only thing Paul pointed out, the only thing he drew attention to, was the one reliable and verifiable factor to determine whether or not a man was sent from God and preaching the Gospel of God, and that was whether his gospel was the exact same Gospel that Paul had preached to them. The man could be the most respected religious leader on earth, he could be the one who had the greatest reputation, he could be the one who was loved and trusted by all, he could even be a trusted family member such as your father, husband or brother. He could be an extremely and impressively learned man familiar with all the great doctrines, with an extensive knowledge of the history of Israel and of the Old Testament, able to locate any town on any Bible map in an instant, able to recite verbatim any verse of Scripture, renowned for being a fervent and ardent man of prayer, a man who has given up the world and all its pleasures, a man who tirelessly preaches against sin and who encourages holy living. A man who has been able to write great volumes of teaching concerning God and the holy life. Even a man who is now dead, which for many is some unwritten and automatic stamp of approval on just about everything he ever taught. All of this counted for nothing in the mind of Paul the apostle if the man preached any gospel other than the one Paul preached! Is this arrogance on Paul’s part? Is this the most flagrant display of religious pride ever seen? Had Paul been driven mad by power? NOTHING OF THE KIND!! What mattered to Paul was, ‘Is what they are teaching the Gospel of God or the words of men?’ It is wisdom that is in evidence here; wisdom that comes directly from God, which deals in black and white terms, and which is resident in every person who believes in the Gospel of Christ, in turn evidencing that they have the mind of Christ.
To be asked the ‘hard’ questions, should not be something which the Christian is to avoid. When one is asked a hard question it should be considered a gift, because it gives one the opportunity to teach the Word of God and defend His doctrines
The following is an excerpt from my book ‘Who Hath Believed Our Report?’:
If, out of all the various ‘christian’ denominations, there was only one that did not preach the Gospel, would it be my fault? Could my Gospel, and the consequences of not believing it, be rightly attacked if there was only one mainstream religious denomination that did not believe it? Would it be the Gospel's fault that this organization did not teach it? Of course not. Would there be something wrong in the Gospel I teach, or in the plain and obvious ramifications of it, if just two of these long established groups failed to teach it? Of course not. What if there were only three that did not believe it? Would this be the evidence that would prove my Gospel to be wrong? If not, how many groups would it take, who did not believe this Gospel, before it could rightly be said that this Gospel is not God’s Gospel?? Would five prove us wrong? No? How about ten, or twenty? When could we draw the line between what is truth and what is error? How many denominations would it take, who believed the same thing, to prove wrong what one group taught that differed from the majority? What absolutely ludicrous thinking! So are we to believe that simply because there are many organizations which disagree with our Gospel, that this logically proves that what we are saying is wrong? Of course not. No rational person would be a party to such thinking. Does it mean there is something wrong with the Gospel if ten organizations claiming to be Christian do not preach it? Of course not. Nor does it prove a single thing about this Gospel if NO professing christian organization preaches it or ever has preached it! To say that it does would be to assume that all these organizations had the truth. You would be surprised just how many people believe something to be the truth simply because there are ten or so organizations which believe the same thing and had preached it for a considerable number of years. You would not believe a man’s message as true simply because he has been preaching it for 30 years or more, would you? Then why automatically and unquestioningly believe a denomination’s teachings because it has promoted them for the past five hundred years! Since when did the truth of God begin to be rightly discerned by how many people believe it or how long a thing had been taught, and where in the Scriptures for that matter would you find support for this mindset? Where is this imaginary line drawn that instantaneously and automatically proves something as true because a certain number of people believe it? Is something true if one thousand people believe it? How about a few thousand? Or what about one hundred thousand? How about five hundred thousand? Surely it would be safe to believe something is of God if one million people believed it. If so, let us then join the Mormons for they number well over one million. But then how could we be sure they had the truth when the followers of the Roman Catholic Church number over one billion? If one million people believed something to be true, would it cease to be truth if only nine hundred and ninety-nine thousand nine hundred and ninety nine believed it? I believe by now the reader can see for himself how silly such thinking is. Are the Mormons right in what they believe because they number around 5 million people. Does it mean that what they believe is wrong merely because the Roman Catholic Church has over one billion adherents? Of course not. Then why judge my Gospel by this rule? Would a truth cease to be truth, or cease to be considered as truth by God, if no one believed it? Of course not. Then where does anyone get the temerity to say that because only a few people believe a thing to be true and the majority does not, it couldn’t possibly be the truth! What absolute and utter arrogance! What bullyish thinking. The fact that a few people believe something can never be used as proof that what these people believe is the truth. Nor is this the type of evidence that could be used to discount the possibility that what they believe is the truth. The Gospel is the Gospel whether there be one person who believes it, or ten thousand, or no one else in this universe. I, for one, will, by the grace of God, never be moved from His Gospel for it is the truth and there is no other. Just as the apostle Peter said to His Lord, "...to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life" (Jn. 6:68), I will not be shaken from the truth that there is no salvation but only damnation for those who believe any other gospel, which contain words of eternal damnation. (continued on page 4).
This is the attitude Paul the apostle had in the first century and this is the attitude I have in the twenty-first century. The fact that the majority of religious people in the world believe false gospels just goes to show the deceitfulness and wickedness of the heart of man (see Jer. 17:11), how influential false gospels are and how attractive they are to those of a carnal mind, who have not the mind of Christ, nor the love of His truth. The well of false christianity runs deep and there has never been a shortage of those willing to drink from it. That the majority does not believe the Gospel is no license for anyone to go about treating those who do believe it as people who have something wrong with them. Democracy certainly gives a voice to the people and always allows the majority to triumph, but this can never guarantee that what the majority sees as right is right. It certainly gets its way but its way is not always right. That the majority does not believe the true Gospel, let alone the fact it pays no attention to the consequences of not believing it, proves one thing: none of these groups who deny the Gospel outright, or who deny it by rejecting its ramifications, were ever Christian to begin with. If they were, how could they, and why would they possibly entertain the notion, let alone promote the idea, that those who do not believe the Gospel—who do not believe what God has said about how He saves—but who come ‘close enough’ to believing it, will be as saved as those who do. To properly understand and believe what the Gospel is all about is to recognize its doctrines as the power of God to save, and to know enough of what its doctrines teach to reject everything else that presents itself as the Gospel; to know that there can be no salvation for anyone whose faith is in any gospel other than God’s Gospel!!! Belief in a false god will not save anyone; belief in a false christ will not save anyone; belief in a false spirit will not save anyone. So how can anyone believe, and what could they possibly base their belief on, that one can be saved believing a false gospel, something which God has not declared to be His, and still be saved? Especially in light of the fact that false christs, false spirits and false gospels are all connected with the beguiling Serpent, and that none of these have anything to do with the truth (see 2 Cor. 11:3,4). This would present us with the following scenario: God saves by His Gospel and He also saves by the gospels Satan promotes to deceive people and keep them from believing the true Gospel!
The Bible teaches that in order for a man to believe the true Gospel He must be blessed of God; he must be born again—born of God (see Matt. 16:17; John 3:3,5; 6:44,45), for the Gospel is God’s, and He reveals It to whomsoever He wills. Salvation is not, and never has been, the result, or product of a man’s will or works, but wholly of God’s mercy and grace. God says: "...I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but OF GOD that sheweth mercy" (Rom. 9:15,16 cf. Ex. 33:19).
As always, I look forward to hearing from you all, and pray that the gracious and loving Father, Who alone is Holy and Just, will continue to bless all His elect through His Mercy and Truth, and that you will continue to be edified and instructed by items available through this ministry. For God’s enemies, only one thing awaits: “Clouds and darkness are round about Him: righteousness and judgement are the habitation of His Throne. A fire goeth before Him, and burneth up His enemies round about” (Psa. 97:2,3). Our prayer to God for ourselves and for all His people is: “Order my steps in Thy Word: and let not any iniquity have dominion over me” (Psa. 119:133). “Let all those that seek Thee rejoice and be glad in Thee: and let such as love Thy salvation say continually, Let God be MAGNIFIED” (Psa. 70:4). Thank you again for your prayers and support. “And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the Word of His Grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified” (Acts 20:32).
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The recent decision by the Rabbinical Council of America to prohibit the ordination and hiring of female rabbis upset Rana Bickel, a teen Rising Voices fellow at the Jewish Women’s Archive.
November 11, 2015
Do you want me to leave?
Do you want 17-year-old girls who care about Judaism to leave Orthodoxy? Do you want them to leave Judaism altogether? Because that is what is going to happen if you don’t give us a seat at your table.
I am a 17-year-old girl who wants to get ordained at Yeshivat Maharat because I want to become a Jewish leader. I daven three times a day, go to shul every Shabbat, keep Kashrut vigorously and I want to devote my life to the Orthodox Jewish community.
How do you propose I do that if not through ordination?
I want to respect your organization. I want to respect the unity within Orthodoxy that you try to create. But I cannot respect you, because you refuse to respect me. Your recent policy prohibiting the ordination of women and the hiring of ordained women was incredibly upsetting to me. It was voted on by men with far more Torah and world experience than I have. But these men have no idea what it is like to be a 17-year-old girl in the Orthodox community and refuse to create a space for me.
The reason I am still here is because of the women who are becoming leaders in this community. Yeshivat Maharat, the first place in the world to ordain Orthodox women as official clergy, gives me hope for the future of the Orthodox community. If not for them, there would not be an outlet for female voices in the Orthodox world. It’s really hard to be part of a religion that can be seen as sexist at times. But you don’t need to perpetuate that. Without a voice catering to women, I would feel lost in a religion that is so dominated by men. The ordination of women is changing the face of Orthodox Judaism in an incredibly exciting way. I know four other girls my age who want to get ordained. That is a significant number and it’s only going to grow. I am inspired and a better person and Jew because of the women I know who are studying at Yeshivat Maharat. Seeing them learning, davening and interacting with the world inspires me and their devotion to Judaism should be acknowledged.
On your website you say that your organization “has been in the forefront of many issues, movements, ideas and initiatives intended to enhance the status and impact of the many facets of Torah on Jewish life in its interactions with the world around it.” I would argue that the acceptance of women’s ordination is needed to enhance the impact of Torah on the world. Even though women can be leaders in their professional lives, when one looks at the Orthodox Jewish leaders of today, women are strikingly absent. At least half of Orthodoxy’s members are women and women need to have a real role in public Jewish life. The Yoatzot Halacha and YU GPATS (Graduate Program for Women in Advanced Talmudic Study) program are amazing. But if you accept the fact that women can learn the same material as men and on the same level as men, then why can’t we have the title?
When someone says the word rabbi to me, I picture a man in a beard. But that shouldn’t be an accurate representation of leadership in the Orthodox world. Growing up the only Jewish leaders I knew, in my Modern Orthodox school and Shul, were men. I was never particularly interested in talking to them, but maybe that would have been different if some were women. Only when I was introduced to feminism did I start to question that. I had never considered spending my life doing “Jewish things” before I met a Maharat. I would love it if the little girls in my community grow up seeing women as Jewish leaders in Shul. I want to change the implications of the title rabbi. I want anyone to be able to be a rabbi, regardless of gender.
I will not leave this life because of you, and the reason I’m staying is because places like Yeshivat Maharat exist. It’s because incredible women who have been learning Torah their whole lives are finally being recognized. And I want to help create a Jewish future where 17-year-old Orthodox girls can become rabbis.
This article originally appeared at forward.com on Nov. 4, 2015 and is reproduced with permission.
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About Jewish Women's Archive
The Jewish Women's Archive's Rising Voices Fellowship is a 10-month program for female-identified teens in high-school who have a passion for writing, a demonstrated concern for current and historic events, and a strong interest in Judaism, gender and social justice. The Jewish Women's Archive is a national non?profit devoted to documenting Jewish women’s stories, elevating their voices, and inspiring them to be agents of change. Founded in 1995, JWA is the world’s largest source of material about and voices of Jewish women.
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The master says: "Write! Wether it's a letter, a diary or just some notes as you speak on the telephone - but write! In writing, we come closer to God and to others. If you want to understand your role in the world better, write. Try to put your soul in writing, even if no one reads your writing - or worse, even if someone reads winds up reading what you did not want to be read. The simple fact of writing helps us to organize our thoughts and see more clearly what is in our surroundings. A paper and pen perform miracles - they alleviate pain, make dreams come true and summon lost hope. The word has power."
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Just recently I saw a post on LinkedIn about a guy who was diagnosed with cancer and he just received one of the worst feedback a doctor can give you. It's untreatable and he has approximately one yea
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Of course anyone who reads my blog expected I'd have something to say about Maglev once it was made public. I've previously performed what I thought was a fair analysis of the various Ruby implementations, and Maglev was mostly a sidebar. With their coming out at RailsConf, they're now fair game for some level of analysis.
Avi Bryant and Bob Walker talked about Maglev, a new Ruby VM based on Gemstone's Smalltalk VM, at RailsConf this weekend. And there's been an explosion of coverage about it.
First off, they demonstrated its distributed object database automatically synchronizing globally-reachable state across multiple VMs. It's an amazing new idea that the world has never really seen...
except that it isn't. This is based on existing OODB technology that Gemstone and others have been promoting for better than a decade. It's cool stuff, no doubt, but it's been available in Gemstone's Smalltalk product and in their Java product for years, and hasn't seen widespread adoption. Maybe it's on the rise, I really don't know. It's certainly cool, but it's certainly not new.
The duo eventually moved on to show off some performance numbers. And please pardon me if I don't have these numbers exactly right. They showed our old friend fib running something like 15x faster. Method dispatch something like 30x faster. While loops 100x faster. Amazing results.
Except that these are results reported entirely in a vacuum. Whether this is fib following the "rules" of Ruby is entirely an open question. Whether this is method dispatch adhering to Ruby's call logic is entirely an open question. Whether this is a while loop using all method calls for its condition and increment steps is an open quesetion. Because the Maglev guys haven't started running Ruby tests yet. Is it Ruby?
I don't want to come off as too defensive here, and I don't want to appear as though I'm taking shots at another implementation. I've certainly launched my share of controversial commentary at Rubinius and IronRuby over the past few months, and while some of it may perhaps have slipped over the edge of polite commentary, I always thought I was being at least honest.
But there's an entirely new situation with Maglev. Maglev has begun to publish glowing performance numbers well in advance of actually running anything at all. They haven't started running the RubySpecs and have no compatibility story today. You can't actually get Maglev yet and run anything on it. It's worse than Vaporware, it's Presentationware. Go to Gemstone's site and download Maglev (you can't). Pull the source (you can't). Build it yourself and investigate what it does (you can't). You start to understand what I mean. And this is what the "Ruby media" is calling the most disruptive new Ruby technology. Dudes, come on. Were you born yesterday?
It's time for a confession. I've been too hard on IronRuby and Rubinius. Both teams are working really hard on their respective implementations, and both teams have really tried to stay true to Ruby ideals in everything they do. Guess what...IronRuby runs Rails. Rubinius runs Rails. And if they're not production ready now, they will be soon. And that's a good thing for Ruby. Sure, I still believe both teams may have made unreasonable claims about what they'd be able to accomplish in a given period of time, but we've all made those claims. If they haven't delivered on all milestones, they've delivered on most of the important ones. And it's those milestones I think deserve some credit now.
My sin is pride. I'm proud of what we've accomplished with JRuby. And when new implementers come along saying they're going to do it in half the time, I feel like it belittles the effort we've put in. IronRuby has done it. Rubinius has done it. And while I've occasionally lashed out at them as a result, I've always been right there trying to help them...answering questions, contributing specs, suggesting strategies and even committing code. In the end it's the cockiness...the attitude...the belief that "I know better than you do" that irritates me, and I'm too sensitive to it. Color me human. But it's time for me and others to understand another side of IronRuby and Rubinius in light of this new contender.
Rubinius and IronRuby teams have always considered compatibility as the primary goal. If you can't run Ruby apps, you're not Ruby, right? And so every step of the way, as they published performance results AND compatibility metrics, they've always been honest about the future.
IronRuby has managed to get great performance on several benchmarks by leveraging the DLR and the excellent language implementation folks on the DLR and IronPython teams at Microsoft. So if nothing else, they've proven many of the "fast-bootstrapping" claims they've made about the DLR. And they've always been balanced in reporting results...John Lam has shown a couple slow benchmarks along with fast benchmarks at every talk, not to mention showing spec results with pass/fail rates clearly spelled out. That honesty has not gone unnoticed, and it shows a realism and humility that will ensure IronRuby's future; a realism that will ensure Ruby users who really want or need a .NET implementation will receive an excellent one.
Rubinius has taken an entirely new approach to implementing Ruby by attempting to write as much as possible in Ruby itself. Maybe they have a lot of C/C++ code right now, but it's not that big a deal...and I was perhaps too pedantic to focus on this ratio in previous posts. What's important is that Rubinius has always tried to be an entirely open, community-driven project. Their successes and failures are immediately accessible to anyone who wants to pull the source; and anyone who wants to pull the source can probably become a Rubinius contributor within a short amount of time. They've had performance ups and downs, but again they've been honest about both the good and the bad. And like IronRuby, if they haven't trumpeted the bad side of things, it's because they're already proving that the Ruby-in-Ruby approach absolutely can work. The bad side will lessen over time until it completely disappears.
Then there's Maglev. Like the other impls, I'm excited that there's a new possibility for Ruby to succeed. A high performance, "scalable" Ruby implementation is certainly what this community needs. But unlike most of the other implementations, it seems like Maglev is pushing performance numbers without compatibility metrics; marketing before reality. Am I far off here?
Let's take a step back. Maglev will probably be amazing. It will probably be fast, maybe on some order approaching the numbers they've reported. Maybe this will happen some day along with support for existing Ruby code. And hell, maybe I'll use it too...I want to be able to write applications in Ruby and have insane performance so I can just write code the way I want to write code. So do you.
But we're talking theory here. So let's do an experiment using JRuby briefly.
Maglev published fib numbers as being around 15x MRI performance. That's very impressive. So let's check MRI perf on my machine (keeping in mind, as I've stated previously, that fib is far from indicative of any real-world performance):
Now let's try stock JRuby, with full compatibility:
Not bad, but certainly not up to Maglev speeds, right? Well...perhaps. JRuby, like IronRuby and Rubinius, has always focused first on compatibility. This means we're bending over backwards to make normal Ruby code run. So in many cases, we're doing more work than we need to, because compatibility has always been the primary goal. IronRuby and Rubinius will report the same process. Make it work, then make it fast. And both IronRuby and Rubinius are now starting to run Rails, so I think we've proven at least three times that this is the right approach.
But let's say we could tweak JRuby to run with some "future" optimizations, optimizations that might not be quite "Ruby" but which would still successfully run these benchmarks.
First, we'll turn off first-class frame object allocation/initialization, since it's not needed here:
Now we'll turn off thread checkpointing needed to implement operations like Thread#kill and Thread#raise, as well as turning off artificial line-position updates:
Now we'll add in some fast integer operations like Ruby 1.9 includes, where Fixnum#+, -, etc are specially-handled by the compiler. And we'll simultaneously omit some last framing overhead that's still around to handle backtrace information:
So just by tweaking a few things we've gained another 3x performance over MRI. Are we having fun yet? Should we extrapolate to optimizations X, Y, Z that bring JRuby performance another half-dozen times faster than MRI? If we can run the benchmarks, it shouldn't matter that we can't run Ruby code, right?
The truth is that not all of these optimizations are kosher right now. Removing the ability to override Fixnum#+ certainly makes it easier to optimize addition, but it's not in the spirit of Ruby. Removing frames may be legal in some cases (like this one) but it's not legal in all cases. And of course I've blogged about how Thread#kill and Thread#raise are broken, but we have to support them anyway. On and on we can go through lots of optimizations you might make in the first 100 days of your implementation, only to back out later when you realize you're actually breaking features people depend on.
This all adds up to a very different picture of Ruby implementation. Rather than wishing for a rose-colored world where anyone with a new VM can swoop in and post magic performance numbers, perhaps we as Ruby community members should be focusing on whether this is going to help us actually run today's apps any better; whether these results are repeatable in ways that actually help us get shit done. Perhaps we should be focusing on the compatibility story over bleeding-edge early performance numbers; focusing on tangible steps toward the future rather than the "furs and gold rings" that David warned about in his keynote. Maybe we should think more about the effect that broadcasting vaporware performance numbers will have on the community, rather than rushing to be the first to republish the latest numbers on the latest slides. Maybe it's worth taking all this microbenchmark nonsense with a grain of salt and trying it out ourselves (if, of course, that's even possible) before serving as the mouthpiece for others' commercial ventures.
Am I wrong? Am I being unfair? Am I taking an unreasonable shot at Maglev?
Posted by headius at 2:44 AM
Mike McKinney June 1, 2008 at 6:01 AM
Wasn't there... mostly agree with the Doc, but can see the frustration Charles has. Personally it's just a little buzz to spice things up, when Monday rolls around we'll all be going back to our Ruby impls with no sign of MagLev.
At any rate, it's been MONEY WELL SPENT for Gemstone!!! I had never heard of them until MagLev!
One more thing: isn't it funny how a community that says things like "it's fast enough" would be soo interested in an implementation focused on performance? :)
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whoisjake June 1, 2008 at 6:29 AM
I want to point out that at RailsConf 2007... Avi got on stage and talked about how the Smalltalk VM was what Ruby in the future would look like...
And he challenged everyone to plop Ruby on top of the Smalltalk VM... And now he says he's done it (or doing it).
Avi is a smart man... Charles, you're very intelligent as well... Why not give the guy the benefit of the doubt.
I like your honesty... it makes me feel better about what you and Sun are trying to do. Keep it up.
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Mario June 1, 2008 at 6:37 AM
Ruby on the JVM is appealing because of what that opens up in a deployment scenario that needs other "on-JVM" resources. The same is true for Ruby on the DLR: easy interoperability with other resources in the same environment. As a developer comfortable with Ruby, I love that Ruby can be a "glue" language because the need for something like that comes up often. The work that you and Tom and all the other JRuby developers do is so important to the big picture for the language. If the work that Gemstone is doing with MagLev materializes into a tool that has appeal for certain deployment scenarios, then all the better for software developers like me who need powerful tools and deployment options to provide value to our own customers.
The world is vast, and the world of problems that can be solved with software needs lots of options.
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Anonymous June 1, 2008 at 8:50 AM
No attempt to cheap-shot on Avi, but ... isn't he a smalltalk guy that dislikes Ruby?
Personally I rather look at Rubinius community than to rely on anyone that spends more time in C and Smalltalk than in Ruby.
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Hervé June 1, 2008 at 8:56 AM
What I don't like very much with MagLev (I was not at RailsConf, but I visited their web site), is the fact that they say "We’re working on a new Ruby VM which is built for scale and performance from the ground up, with some features we guarantee will blow your mind. Come see how far we’ve gotten", and they show absolutely NOTHING on their website, except "leave your email address". It sounds only marketing to me. I don't like to see people who say "I've done this, it's awesome", and not show anything. Come to this, I also could prepare a few slides and say that I've designed the ultimate Ruby VM. But of course I have done nothing. As long as they continue to show nothing to us, I would consider MagLev as having done nothing.
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Phil June 1, 2008 at 9:45 AM
Excellent post, Charles. It really disturbs me how many Rubyists are just wowed by the glitz and don't stop to think about the deeper issues at play here. Do you really want to get stuck another vendor lock-in situation?
Even if you were to go with the Microsoft solution (who have in the past been the vendor-lock-in king) you still have an option to deploy on free software with the Mono stack. But with Gemstone, you're out of luck. And we know how well the proprietary implementation route worked out for Smalltalk in the long run. =\
It's really time for Rubyists to consider what they stand for as hackers and what they'll put up with as a community. Are you really so willing to give up the ability to dive into the source of your implementation to fix bugs or add features? Many of us have been there, and it's so antithetical to what being a hacker is all about... This whole situation makes me very nervous. I don't want to have to choose between performance and freedom, but if it comes down to it I know which one I'll pick.
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Wilson Bilkovich June 1, 2008 at 10:05 AM
Maybe this is my Rubinius bias showing, but I think this is the best post about implementations you have made.
Well done, and thank for the praise. I'll try to be less hard on JRuby in the future myself.
I guess you guys aren't killer robots from the future. :)
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Mr. Neighborly June 1, 2008 at 10:40 AM
Did JRuby run Rails after 3 months?
Did IronRuby?
Sheesh, man, I'd almost guarantee that you guys were in the same shape after 3 months. To be honest, when you have to reassure your readers that you're not being defensive, you might want to go back and make sure that you have the right perspective on the issue. I'm glad JRuby is around along with all the others, but there's plenty of room for other VM's (even those that might be better than yours).
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Anonymous June 1, 2008 at 12:44 PM
I think the tone of this post speaks for itself.
You have a history of writing posts that are generally negative towards any Ruby implementation other than JRuby. So did you come off as defensive? Yes, very much so.
It's almost like you need to have a bad guy, for reasons that escape me. No one ever seems to measure up to the JRuby greatness. First it was time to rip on Rubinius and call for the "Ruby in Ruby" meme to die. Now that we have a new bad guy, Maglev, suddenly Rubinius is making great strides, so what if they're using a little C/C++, etc.
It sounds to me like you're worried that Maglev, when it's finished, might turn out to be such a phenomenal implementation of Ruby that no one will have a need for JRuby. Or maybe you're just jealous that Maglev can already do things JRuby can't. Maybe you can't believe that anyone doing honest work could make the kind of progress they've made in 3 months. So, whatever they have must be "Presentationware", because JRuby wasn't this far along in 3 months. If they've made this kind of progress, and we didn't, that might mean that *gasp* they're smarter than us! I'm grasping at straws here because I honestly can't figure out why your posts about Ruby implementations other than JRuby need to be so negative.
What's wrong with focusing on the positive? Maglev is ultimately good for the Ruby community. In the words of DHH, wipe the wah-wah tears off your chin.
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Caleb Land June 1, 2008 at 12:56 PM
Anonymous: He never denied that MagLev is positive for Ruby. He simply said that there's going to be a lot of hype around it, and that we shouldn't necessarily believe the benchmarks shown.
I don't care if they have worked on it for 3 days, you shouldn't claim such performance improvements if your implementation doesn't actually run Ruby code.
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Evan Light June 1, 2008 at 1:19 PM
I walked in toward the end of the Maglev presentation. However, based on what I heard, I walked out of that talk somewhat.... unsettled.
I believe that my sense was a result of the relative haughtiness that Bob Walker portrayed when speaking on if/when Gemstone would open source Maglev ( to paraphrase from memory, "in a world full of possibilities, it's a possibility" and "software is an ongoing process so we don't know yet" respectively).
Now knowing that they're not running Ruby specs, I generally agree with you, headius. Also considering that there is no concrete information out there about Maglev makes their abrupt presentation of performance statistics spurious.
Why did Gemstone jump the gun and present Maglev at RailsConf? I don't get it. It seems premature.
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jgehtland June 1, 2008 at 2:34 PM
anonymous -- no, Avi is an old Ruby hacker who grudgingly went to SmallTalk. He's a polyglot and a good guy. He might not be a perfect ambassador to bring to RailsConf, but he should get more credit than you appear to give him.
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Notheory June 1, 2008 at 2:37 PM
I take Charles's primary point to be about Science! (capital S) He's not trying to tear down MagLev, particularly he's trying to build up Openness and Transparency. And his primary point is that Presentationware is the antithesis of Openness and Transparency, because opens not just room for differences of opinion, but complete and utter lack of certainty regarding how the presentationware relates to open baselines. In order to compete fairly, they should be playing by the same rules used by everyone else (Publishing how they're doing in the rubyspecs would be a great start).
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rasputnik June 1, 2008 at 2:57 PM
I may be missing something, but couldn't you do everything Gemstone does with Terracotta and JRuby?
A quick google shows a lot of people already have this working.
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Mark Lee Smith June 1, 2008 at 3:17 PM
Since you have no idea how Maglev works, isn't this wild speculation? Is it really impossible to have such good performance & run standard Ruby code? I've seen no evidence that Maglev doesn't run standard Ruby code. Time will tell.
is it possible that you're lashing out at this project because you couldn't make JRuby run standard Ruby code and have similar performance? That would fit with your anecdotes about bashing other implementations.
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David Pollak June 1, 2008 at 3:28 PM
After reading Avi and Charles' posts... well...
I agree with Charles about the open and visible comments.
I agree that Avi is a wicked smart guy and good at pulling rabbits out of hats.
I agree that building a compatible Ruby is harder than it looks. I know Avi has done a fair amount of Ruby, but I'm not sure he has the why/Charles level of intimacy with the Ruby runtime.
The object paging model that Avi describes is like what Terracotta does on the JVM... so creating a similar demo for JRuby would take a half a day... it's not magic.
Plus, I'm not keen on the Lisp/Smalltalk "we're not dead yet" vendors who have proprietary stuff. Yeah, people are in business to make money, but there are plenty of folks who have demonstrated how you can make money in open source-land.
So... Charles, you are one of the best diplomats I've met in this industry... you might occasionally lash out, but in my opinion, you're entitled given your amazing contribution and your general calmness.
Thanks,
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Phil June 1, 2008 at 3:50 PM
> Did JRuby run Rails after 3 months?
> Did IronRuby?
@mrneighborly: The huge difference here is that we've always been able to see for ourselves exactly how compliant every other Ruby implementation ever begun has run.
If Sun or MS had come out saying, "Hey, we've got this awesome fast ruby impl." but didn't show us the source, you can bet they'd face a lot more hostility than Maglev has brought on themselves.
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If you need an open source, battle-tested distributed object database in a Ruby-like language today, you could consider using the ZODB in Python. It's been around for around 10 years too.
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Warren Konkel June 1, 2008 at 5:47 PM
Although this was a somewhat fair analysis of MagLev, it's missing the point. The shared global object space was the paradigm shifting part of the presentation, not the performance benchmarks. The real buzz these days seems to be around cloud computing, object databases and map reduce. Although MagLev/Gemstone is a really cool implementation of accessing an underlying object data store, it is really just one of the first implementations of what will probably become a common computing paradigm in the years to come.
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Sandro Magi June 1, 2008 at 8:19 PM
Just a thought, but it seems to me that many of those optimizations can be done by a compiler with sufficient information about the expression context. Perhaps MagLev actually performs such optimizations, and so constructing all the extra info is simply optimized away when it's not actually used.
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Anonymous June 1, 2008 at 8:28 PM
I would expect a Smalltalk implementation to beat the others. Smalltalk companies have years of optimizing a dynamic language very similar to Ruby. You do amazing work, but I would expect at some point they will have better performance than the current JRuby on the current JVM.
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aemadrid June 1, 2008 at 9:49 PM
I'm not interested as much in te performance, for me even MRI is _fast_enough_, but in the replicated OODB. So far none of the big players have take an interest in Ruby really so it would be really nice if that were really true. And no, I don't mind if it is closed source but it works as long as it is affordable. I'm willing to give them some time as long and hope it really works. I won't hold my breath but will (im)patiently wait for it.
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Stephan.Schmidt June 2, 2008 at 7:31 AM
The "dynamic-optimized VM" is not a silver bullet.
"Smalltalk/Ruby can be faster on a native VM because the VM pritimives align better with the operations that a dynamically typed object language needs."
I don't know but Ruby/DLR isn't 15 faster than JRuby.
And with the Smalltalk VM 5x slower than the Java VM, it would need to be 45x faster than Java for Ruby to be 15x faster than JRuby. And Ruby on .NET surely isn't 45x faster.
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Bogus Person June 2, 2008 at 7:34 AM
Hey Charlie -- I'm even more skeptical than you are! As the corollary to Murphy's Law goes, "Nature always sides with the hidden flaw." I see lots of hidden flaws in Maglev.
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StCredZero June 2, 2008 at 7:59 AM
Last time I looked at JRuby, it was a "paraphrase" of the Matz VM but in Java, not C. You won't get the full potential of the speed of the JVM until you compile Ruby down to Java bytecodes. But running that way would lose some of the dynamic capability of Ruby. If they are compiling Ruby to Gemstone Smalltalk bytecodes, then they will have the full potential of that VM. And since Smalltalk is very dynamic, they will retain the full dynamic capabilities of the language.
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Ted Korolchuk June 2, 2008 at 10:32 AM
You aren't being unfair at all- you and Sho are both 100% correct. People like wearing rose-colored glasses, and for some reason I think the rails community is more guilty of that than most others.
For now it's just marketing and hype, in the end they may well come up with something great (I hope they do) but, for now, it's just presentationware. For people to be fawning over it and freaking out at this stage is silly.
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Sandro Magi June 2, 2008 at 11:33 AM
What does the DLR have to do with anything? It's pretty much just a runtime code gen library. The .NET CLR has many of the same limitations as the JVM here, where a hosted language is limited to using memory-safe constructs which the host VM understands. This is too restrictive to obtain optimal performance for a language too dissimilar to the host language, as it requires embedding primitives as host language constructs, forcing superfluous allocations and indirections. A well-designed native VM will always perform better than a well-designed hosted VM, unless the hosted VM is assembly (ala proof-carrying code).
The only "advantage" the CLR may have is its support for value types, which can reduce GC pressure if you can somehow take advantage of the stack allocation.
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JeanHuguesRobert June 3, 2008 at 11:36 AM
To understand the kind of speed that Gemstone can achieve one has to imagine a JVM optimized to run Ruby instead of running Java.
This is different from a Ruby implementation running on top of a JVM optimized to run Java.
The later case has some impedance mismatch that hurts speed.
Look backward at the progress of the JVM in terms of speed, including JIT and other recent advanced optimizations. They are impressive. Gemstone are almost at the same level. But for Ruby code instead of for Java code.
Now that the JVM source code is open source, I wonder why the JRuby team does not look at it and see how to optimize things for Ruby? Or do they?
That there is more distance between Java and Ruby than between Smalltalk and Ruby is a clear sign that Gemstone claims are probably valid.
I wonder why this did not happened years before, it was so obvious to me that Ruby had all that Smalltalk was missing to become a commercial success...
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rue June 3, 2008 at 3:21 PM
I think "presentationware" is a bit harsh. Avi and gang seem to be doing pretty well, and we have also had some discussions on #rubinius that indicate they have some degree of real infrastructure backing the fib.
I am personally concerned about the non-openness aspect of it, partial as it may be. I would certainly expect a substantial amount of giving back to the Ruby world or risking a blowback.
The one bit most interesting to me is what you seem to dismiss as an OODB. While certainly true that it has not made much of an impact thus far, you must also remember that Ruby and Rails have popularised, re-popularised or simply dusted off technologies that were not being adopted on their merits before. So perhaps this will be another one of those generational changes where the already existing technology meets the critical mass of developers ready to embrace it.
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Leonardo Bighi June 4, 2008 at 1:47 PM
For god's sake, stop whining!
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rasputnik June 7, 2008 at 6:14 AM
@anonymous re: 'unlimited object space' - that's exactly what terracotta does, except it's open source and has been going for years.
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Anonymous June 16, 2008 at 7:24 AM
I recall seeing benchmarks for rubinius and jruby before they were able to run rails. So a little of this may be the pot calling the kettle black? I do ahgree that benchmarks at this stage are irrelevant for maglev, and would be more meaningful if they could show rails running. so i throw out all the sillyness with the performance claims. My takeaway is the seamles sintegration of distributed cache and object store. I see maglev as upping the ante for rails VM's. Afterall if jruby or rubinius had a built in distributed object store, would the maglev announcement have made any splash whatsoever?
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Sergio Oliveira Jr. October 28, 2009 at 2:06 PM
I had a chance to exchange some emails with Charles. He intrigued me. Why? Because he was calm, patient and humble. I was asking pretty basic questions and the guy who did JRuby from scratch was answering me like he was really interested in them.
Some suggestions for Charles: It is not a sin to be pride. You should not be humble. There is a very big difference between being humble and being arrogant. I believe you can be not-humble and not-arrogant at the same time.
JRuby is faster than Python, Jython, Rubinius, etc. It only loses for C, Java and PyPy/Psyco.
So you should be very proud of what you did. Let the competition come, the talk, the criticism, etc. This is like gravity, you cannot fight with this. Use it in your favor.
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