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Don't do Treebeard dirty like that.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard"
] |
>
When Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that."
] |
>
The thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction"
] |
>
The decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles."
] |
>
Unless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send"
] |
>
That’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are
Other European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…
Then the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…
This may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay."
] |
>
If he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck"
] |
>
they should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense."
] |
>
While Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas"
] |
>
I'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns."
] |
>
His statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time"
] |
>
Britain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass."
] |
>
I think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered."
] |
>
This sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first."
] |
>
Yeah. No.
For one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts.
Two, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.
Most of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s."
] |
>
Note I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics."
] |
>
Bulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.
Slovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts."
] |
>
It’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine."
] |
>
Lol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia."
] |
>
Go ahead and complain about the "pressure"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his "pressure".
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging."
] |
>
And he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\"."
] |
>
Come on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine.
Slava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards"
] |
>
Putin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛"
] |
>
Yes
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads."
] |
>
It’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.
Who even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes"
] |
>
Germany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change."
] |
>
Omg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it."
] |
>
Scholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible"
] |
>
Yeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...
What a fucking asshole!
And it's almost a year.
Germany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.
Do they care about anything than their cozy life and money?
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick."
] |
>
germany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?"
] |
>
Hahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but "rushing" will not be one of them.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself."
] |
>
Sure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them."
] |
>
This is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily."
] |
>
I don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned."
] |
>
I wonder how much money he gets from russia
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit."
] |
>
German politics are so god damn cringey.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia"
] |
>
Something smells.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey."
] |
>
sorry, I haven't taken a bath yet
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells."
] |
>
Scholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists.
Get your head out of your ass
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet"
] |
>
People are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass"
] |
>
There is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole"
] |
>
Thanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?"
] |
>
True we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question."
] |
>
Germany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s"
] |
>
Protest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself."
] |
>
Ah yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.
There are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉"
] |
>
Scholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book"
] |
>
Could be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the "bigger weapon" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German"
] |
>
The question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.
Good opportunity to turn that around here.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them."
] |
>
The German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here."
] |
>
He works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example."
] |
>
What a dick
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush"
] |
>
Scholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick"
] |
>
Sargent Scholz?
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing."
] |
>
This is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?"
] |
>
Not like there’s a war or anything going on
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke."
] |
>
What an asshat
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on"
] |
>
It's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.
We already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat"
] |
>
As always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit."
] |
>
Time for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price."
] |
>
No bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin."
] |
>
Not all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep"
] |
>
Also T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war."
] |
>
Yeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech."
] |
>
Why is Germany sucking so hard rn?
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil."
] |
>
History will be unkind to Germany
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?"
] |
>
He's aiding Putin ..
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany"
] |
>
German Military Support Services Provided:
4 mine clearance tanks
4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices
95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)
168 field heaters (previously: 148)
20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets
15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2
13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks
7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks
143 pickup
216 power generators
35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system
26 Recon Drones
36 ambulances
36,400 blankets
12 heavy-duty articulated trucks
55 anti-drone sensors and jammers
30 drone detection sensors
6 forklifts
Missile IRIS-T SLM
60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher
18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition
50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles
3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER
10 surface drones
14,000 sleeping bags
Mi-24 spare parts
MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition
Spare parts heavy machine gun M2
30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles
20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices
17 heavy and medium bridge systems
5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition
14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)
Air Defense System Iris-T SLM
200 tents
116,000 cold weather jackets
80,000 thermal pants
240,000 winter hats
100,000 first aid kits
405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)
30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition
67 refrigerators for medical supplies
Artillery detection radar COBRA
4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition
54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)
53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition
20 laser target illuminators
3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips
14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)
500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles
2,700 STRELA flying fists
22 million rounds of handgun ammunition
50 bunker fists
100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts
100,000 hand grenades
5,300 explosive charges
100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators
350,000 detonators
10 anti-drone cannons
100 auto injectors
28,000 combat helmets
15 pallets of clothing
280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)
6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal
125 binoculars
1,200 hospital beds
18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights
protective clothing, surgical masks
600 shooting glasses
1 radio frequency system
3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment
1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)
353 Night Vision Goggles
12 electronic anti-drone devices
165 binoculars
Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)
38 laser rangefinders
Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)
10 tons of AdBlue
500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control
MiG-29 spare parts
30 armored vehicles
7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns
6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination
10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)
7 jammers
8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices
4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices
1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*
German Military support services in preparation/implementation:
40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)
Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles
100,000 first aid kits
114 reconnaissance drones
17 field heaters
26 swap body systems 15t
2 pickup
18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155
90 drone detection sensors
2 hangar tents
7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system
7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD
7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks
6 mobile and protected demining devices
Missile for Iris-T SLM
38 mine clearance tanks
3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices
5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)
405 border guard vehicles
1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm
156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher
5 Badger Tank Engineers
3 heavy and medium bridge systems
16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)
78 heavy-duty articulated trucks
3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM
12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers
Field hospital (role 2)
20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices
14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers
2 tractors and 4 trailers
10 protected vehicles
vehicle decontamination point
5,032 anti-tank handguns
200 trucks commercial vehicles
13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin .."
] |
>
You’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER"
] |
>
I keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil"
] |
>
While i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.
Germany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall."
] |
>
Germany is a complete joke.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine."
] |
>
Fuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.
It boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries.
Fuck these "good for nothing freeloaders". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke."
] |
>
Yeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany"
] |
>
What exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money."
] |
>
Same people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?"
] |
>
This is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time.
My country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War."
] |
>
don't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!"
] |
>
Closet communist. Or closet Putin worshiper.
Convince me otherwise.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help."
] |
>
Yes worshipping putin by:
Supplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.
Moreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.
Like i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise."
] |
>
I agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard "state of the art". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year."
] |
>
Germany is the joke of EU not the face of it
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[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend."
] |
>
God forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it"
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>
Germany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.
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[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!"
] |
>
Reminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war."
] |
>
His cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say "fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign".
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later."
] |
>
I‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\"."
] |
>
Does he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely."
] |
>
Hesitance costs lives.
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[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table."
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Every minute you take is an innocent person dead.
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[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives."
] |
>
What a shame..
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead."
] |
>
The question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?
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[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame.."
] |
>
Hmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future?
I am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US.
For example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…
Also, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?"
] |
>
He’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany."
] |
>
Scholz doesn’t give a fuck about Ukraine, and he ties to Russia anyways
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.",
">\n\nHe’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz"
] |
>
Shut up Kraut and just do it. You're only prolonging it.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.",
">\n\nHe’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz",
">\n\nScholz doesn’t give a fuck about Ukraine, and he ties to Russia anyways"
] |
>
Ukraine shouldn’t be given a gosh damn thing… you can’t defend yourself, welp I guess it just sucks to suck then doesn’t it
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.",
">\n\nHe’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz",
">\n\nScholz doesn’t give a fuck about Ukraine, and he ties to Russia anyways",
">\n\nShut up Kraut and just do it. You're only prolonging it."
] |
>
Awesome time to invade your home, take your shit and do horrible things to you.
You deserve it because cowards are scared of us and you dont deserve anyone helping you.
Your logic is bullshit.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.",
">\n\nHe’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz",
">\n\nScholz doesn’t give a fuck about Ukraine, and he ties to Russia anyways",
">\n\nShut up Kraut and just do it. You're only prolonging it.",
">\n\nUkraine shouldn’t be given a gosh damn thing… you can’t defend yourself, welp I guess it just sucks to suck then doesn’t it"
] |
>
Germany is so thoroughly capitalist that they have to do a cost-benefit analysis for helping to save Ukraine, and the calculations are so complicated that it will take a while for them to come up with a final estimate.
Someone will press the subtract key instead of the add.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.",
">\n\nHe’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz",
">\n\nScholz doesn’t give a fuck about Ukraine, and he ties to Russia anyways",
">\n\nShut up Kraut and just do it. You're only prolonging it.",
">\n\nUkraine shouldn’t be given a gosh damn thing… you can’t defend yourself, welp I guess it just sucks to suck then doesn’t it",
">\n\nAwesome time to invade your home, take your shit and do horrible things to you.\nYou deserve it because cowards are scared of us and you dont deserve anyone helping you.\nYour logic is bullshit."
] |
>
It's not about Germans having not enough tanks. They need to give permission for others to give German tanks to Ukraine.
Scholz complains and meantime Ukrainians are dying.
|
[
"\"Rush\". It's been a year.",
">\n\nI'm a German and my strong gut instincts tell me that these are only stalling tactic and Scholz ultimately will say 'No'. Maybe Scholz tries to stall the process only until our new secretary of defense has taken his oath and afterwards Scholz will blame him for saying 'No'. Or maybe he thinks the war will stop soon or any other nonsense, I don't know. I really hate this rat on the throne!",
">\n\nGerman here too, with some insight (know people who work at the Bundeswehr).\nHe won't say no, he is stalling for time. Because there are not enough tanks in working order to give and/or working infrastructure to maintain them.\nRheinmetall already accelerated their process to get Leopards in working order, and can only deliver 15! in the third quarter of this year.\nThe most likely scenario is that some Leopards that are currently in maintenance (about 30) for Slovakia/Czech Republic are going to Ukraine.\nThe Bundeswehr really does not have many Tanks, something around 260, and not even half of them are in working order.\nI hope that makes it clear why Scholz is stalling for time. The tanks have to be repaired/build first.",
">\n\nReally interesting, thank you! But why isn't he just telling this to media? Germany really made it public that the Bundeswehr isn't in their best state right now, so why is he stalling without telling the reason for it?",
">\n\nThere recently has been a scandal where a lot of new Puma tanks were unusable at a training exercise. This guy wants to avoid the question of \"Where are those 100 billion bucks huh?\"",
">\n\nSounds like Germany is suffering really badly on the military front. That isn't good. \nI wish France would step up more in this case. Leclerc tanks are also quite capable.",
">\n\nHas been for a loooooooong time. Only now is there an effort being made to fix it, however effective that may be is still very open to discussion.\nFor example, we did boost 100 billion for the Army. But we've had very high spending compared to europe before. And the army was still shit.\nWhat is important is how the money is used. And well, for the past year we had some Grandma with 0 military know how, who just wanted the pension and famously did not give a fuck, as minister of defense. So that cash is most likely gone already.",
">\n\nAmerican here, are you talking about Ursula or Christine? Follow German politics rather closely but I'll admit to not following the Bundeswehr as much as I should have. It always seemed like a fantastic force that was undersupplied and underfunded, but that's just an outsiders perspective and, frankly, y'all do y'all. Y'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.",
">\n\nChristine. It has been a few years since Ursula.\nIt isn't even underfunded that much. The bureaucracy inside is just sooo fucking massive that changes are extremely hard to make, and most of the money gets spent in super ineffective ways & just disappears without much of an impact.\n\nY'all have built a democracy that's 10x better than what we have, like even y'all's voting system is far better.\n\nWell agreed on that. The dysfunction of your election system is incredible.",
">\n\nAh gotcha ty. Fair enough on the spending. The one advantage America has is that we can just shove so much money into our military that even though it’s bloated and a lot disappears… something still gets done.\nWe just don’t have good healthcare, charging networks, environmental protections, worker protections or… anything lol.",
">\n\nWhat does he think will happen? Honestly, if he says no we need to know the actual things he thinks will happen. Not just, “it will escalate with Russia.”\nRussia isn’t touching Germany and Russia can’t possibly escalate in Ukraine without WMDs, which are suicide and would not be used because Putin likes life and his cronies like money.",
">\n\nThats not the point\nHes just a politician, he doesnt care about murder or nazis\nHe just wants money\nHe does the least so russia doesnt get angry because he thinks then he can still make business with russia",
">\n\nIt’s kind of puzzling though. Let’s say it’s 2025 and Russia has been out of Ukraine for a year. Does Germany really want to get back in bed with Putin?",
">\n\nIn 2014 there already was an invasion of Ukraine and everyone still got back to bed with Putin after that. Politicians will do anything because of money.",
">\n\nHe sucks. I was mildly positive toward him when he took over after Angela, but he’s been a huge disappointment. Baebock ought to be Chancellor, she has more balls.",
">\n\nIn a way, yes, she says more balls-y things. But then, she's also not in power.\nRemember how she was initially defending Julian Assange and even called Merkel's goverment cowards and now she remains silent or dodges questions when asked to comment on it.",
">\n\nI don't understand why Scholz is so reluctant to supply tanks to Ukraine. His dragging feet will impact any Ukraine offensive to kick Russia out of country.\nHe stated on article he won't be rushed into decision but all it does is to make Germany look bad to the rest of NATO countries wanting quicker response.",
">\n\nDid any other nato country supply them with tanks ?",
">\n\nPlenty of tanks were supplied, from the new toys, only the UK did it.",
">\n\nI looked up the Challenger 2s, what we call \"new\" stuff was actually designed 40 years ago lol. I'd assume they are still pretty effective but it took me by surprise that they were designed in 1986-1993.",
">\n\nThat's actually pretty common in military equipment. Most big stuff takes years and years to design and build, have several upgrades throughout their lifecycle, and so are designed to be operated for 50 years, sometimes more.",
">\n\nThe M1 Abrams is like on their 7th or 8th refresh at this point lol.",
">\n\nCertainly no pressure on the Ukrainian side, take your time!",
">\n\nChancellor Treebeard",
">\n\nDon't do Treebeard dirty like that.",
">\n\nWhen Treebeard saw the extent of the problem he rallied his people to stand against it even though it likely meant their extinction",
">\n\nThe thing is this decision needs to be made now. There are going to be major offensives in late March/early April when the weather clears and Ukraine needs that time to train on any potential new tanks. A decision in a few weeks could already be too late to use the tanks in some very important battles.",
">\n\nThe decision has likely already been made to send them. Knowing this government they are probably waiting until they have any leopards to even send",
">\n\nUnless Bundeswehr is in even worse shape than they officially say, there is really no reason for the delay.",
">\n\nThat’s exactly it. German defense is in much worse shape than they say they are\nOther European nations have Leopard tanks as well, but I watched a debate on France 24 English where they were saying only 30% are operational…\nThen the other countries that have them haven’t even asked for export licenses yet…\nThis may change the tide of the war. Ukraine is asking for a lot, when Europe doesn’t have the capacity to produce as much as they would like to give to Ukraine in the short amount of time that they need it. This is depleting their own stockpiles as well, which is making their own defense postures look awful. They also know a Republican may take the White House in 2024, which could result in American support to be cut… leaving Ukraine stuck like Chuck",
">\n\nIf he does say no to OTHER countries sending Leo2s... the backlash is going to be intense.",
">\n\nthey should never buy german tanks again, if you can't use those tanks without germany saying 'yes' then you are fucked, and if you live in Eastern Europe you are even more fucked because germany love to suck russian gas",
">\n\nWhile Scholz fiddles, Ukraine burns.",
">\n\nI'm so sorry Scholz, the last thing Ukranians dying in this war want to do is rush you or make you uncomfortable in any way, please take your time",
">\n\nHis statement is so out of touch with reality, he sits in his warm home while hundreds die every single time the sun goes down. Just think, hundreds of people every single day, their only life, gone for good, and he is upset about being pressured? He needs to touch fucking grass.",
">\n\nBritain already made the escalation with the first shipment of tanks. Get off your ass, it's already covered.",
">\n\nI think they already moved the goalposts by saying they are waiting for the US to send tanks first.",
">\n\nThis sort of approach is likely why Poland may actually win big in the coming decades when it comes to tank exports. Since in addition to buying K2s, they are getting the technical package to build them, we might start seeing most of Europe rearm itself not with a next generation of Leopards but with Polish built K2 or K3s.",
">\n\nYeah. No.\nFor one, the K2 uses several german-made or designed parts. \nTwo, the K2 is ultimately the same generation of tank as the Leopard. A later part of it, but ultimately the same.\nMost of Europe already has Leopards. If they want more tanks, they'll just order additional ones. And if they want to replace them entirely, they'll go with something from the next-gen, and the only ones currently working on that are KMW/Nexter and General Dynamics.",
">\n\nNote I included the next generation tank being planned, the K3. And countries in the east like Romania, Bulgaria, the Balkans can't exactly afford the western premium, especially not for tanks. So the cheaper good enough tank designed to work with the latest technologies to replace Soviet tanks may be quite attractive, especially if they also get the chance to build some of the parts.",
">\n\nBulgaria and romania are both in talks to acquire Leopard 2s already tho.\nSlovakia & the Czechs already definitely will too, altho they get them for free in exchange for material supplied to Ukraine.",
">\n\nIt’s okay Scholz, take your time. Ukraine is sooo sorry that they’re inconveniencing you so much. We know you’d prefer that Ukraine just surrendered so that you can go back to appeasing russia.",
">\n\nLol Scholz must be burning through shoes with all this feet dragging.",
">\n\nGo ahead and complain about the \"pressure\"...meanwhile cities in Ukraine continue to get leveled and you get to go home at night, drink a beer, swallow some Cialis and sink your dink into some poor mistress. Poor poor Scholz and his \"pressure\".",
">\n\nAnd he is saying that standing there with a coffee and a bun in his hand smiling impish and making jokes afterwards",
">\n\nCome on Scholz 🇩🇪. Stop rounding around in circles with your tail between your legs! Pull the trigger, make a positive decision for Ukraine. \nSlava Ukraini 💙 💛 💙 💛",
">\n\nPutin still has a hold on Scholz's anal beads.",
">\n\nYes",
">\n\nIt’s troubling that Germany only has 350 tanks… they had roughly 4,000 during the Cold War, they built around 25,000 during World War 2. Russia meanwhile still has around 10,000 tanks in reserve. Not all of those are modern but still…. 350 tanks isn’t enough to stop a full scale invasion by Russia.\nWho even knows what Russias actually capability is in a total war. They are woefully underperforming in the first year of the Ukraine war but tides can change.",
">\n\nGermany would not stand alone in all out war because of NATO. Even if german soil was attacked the german defenders would only make up a fraction of the whole force defending it.",
">\n\nOmg, just send more tanks and as fast as possible",
">\n\nScholz wants to be seen to be doing something but not enough to undermine the Russian offensive. He's a reprehensible prick.",
">\n\nYeah, let more people be raped, maimed, tortured and killed, as there's no rush...\nWhat a fucking asshole!\nAnd it's almost a year.\nGermany has been extremele disappointing last year and now it's again and it even arrests climate activists.\nDo they care about anything than their cozy life and money?",
">\n\ngermany has shown time and again its unwillingness and inability to serve anyone but itself.",
">\n\nHahaha at this point people would blame him for many things, but \"rushing\" will not be one of them.",
">\n\nSure, no pressure, Russia’s just bombing kids on the daily.",
">\n\nThis is a 4 day old article from before Lambrecht resigned.",
">\n\nI don’t understand why Germany keeps getting bashed online. It is the third largest contributor of aid (fourth of you count the EU) and tanks aren’t being delivered because they aren’t all in working condition and just throwing tanks somewhere without any equipment isn’t gonna do shit.",
">\n\nI wonder how much money he gets from russia",
">\n\nGerman politics are so god damn cringey.",
">\n\nSomething smells.",
">\n\nsorry, I haven't taken a bath yet",
">\n\n\nScholz complains about 'pressure' ~~to supply tanks to Ukraine, says he won't rush with decisions.~~ while Ukrainian civilians die at the hands of murderous Russian terrorists. \n\nGet your head out of your ass",
">\n\nPeople are dying you fucking dumb selfish asshole",
">\n\nThere is no repair base for Abrams tanks in Europe. Leopards 1/2 is the only option for consistent supplies. Sholz is ridiculous. Maybe it's time to cut Gazprom from SWIFT?",
">\n\nThanks for giving the why in why all this focus was on Germany. That was going to be my question.",
">\n\nTrue we have all the time in the world! Its not like there are literally thousands of innocent lives at stake... /s",
">\n\nGermany is hardly an 'ally' even to itself.",
">\n\nProtest where he eats, works, sleeps, etc. Make it as close to hell as the Ukrainians are dealing with, without violence. Air raid horns would do wonders😉",
">\n\nAh yes. More pointless hate towards Germany. Gotta love brainrot comments.\nThere are plenty of reasons why this has not happened yet. Go read a fucking book",
">\n\nScholz is such an embarrassment. I’m ashamed to be German",
">\n\nCould be a dark secret with him and russia. He says proud that we're on the third place with aid for Ukraine. But that's nothing you can be proud of if there are still people dying because you take your time with your decisions. PzH 2000 compare to Puma is the \"bigger weapon\" so sending Pumas doesn't change anything, we won't get sucked deeper in this war for it. it just helps Ukraine to get rid of these animals. Actually we're already so deep in it, that we should do anything we can to help Ukraine and let Russia bleed. People loosing their companys that they build over years. The hole world is bleeding by the Russian agression. It's time to fight back strong and fast, even if this just means to handle out material and Ukraine fights back. Give them everything they want and need and even more to get rid of these animals. I'm also ok if we give them that much that the hole world get rid of them.",
">\n\nThe question is... will Germany ever make a good decision when it comes to War? The last 100 years says no.\nGood opportunity to turn that around here.",
">\n\nThe German and French position before and during the Iraq invasion in 2003 still looks pretty great to me to give one example.",
">\n\nHe works for Putin, or I don’t know how to comment this rush. Rush, Carl. A year in war and he says about rush",
">\n\nWhat a dick",
">\n\nScholz asks why do they even need then? He sees nothing. He knows nothing.",
">\n\nSargent Scholz?",
">\n\nThis is growing just pathetic. Just give them fucking tanks already. What a fucking joke.",
">\n\nNot like there’s a war or anything going on",
">\n\nWhat an asshat",
">\n\nIt's so fucking appalling how many people are falling for this Russian propaganda just because Germany doesn't want to send tanks it doesn't have. Nevermind the gigantic amount of weaponry Germany ALREADY sent to Ukraine but noooo better blame your allies and cause discord just like the Russians want us to.\nWe already partially lost the UK with Brexit, almost lost France with Le Pen, and now you guys are still falling for this shit.",
">\n\nAs always, scholz holding everything up while Ukrainians pay the price.",
">\n\nTime for US to simply send Abramses, despite their alleged fuel consumption issues. Germany is willing to be friends with Putin.",
">\n\nNo bro they run on jet engines and would cost way too much to upkeep",
">\n\nNot all turbine engines are jet engines. And not, not so much, compared to losing the war.",
">\n\nAlso T-80s use gas turbines, so it's not like Ukrainians are completely unfamiliar with the tech.",
">\n\nYeah maybe russia sells oil over kasachstan to germany, maybe germany too scary to lost russian oil.",
">\n\nWhy is Germany sucking so hard rn?",
">\n\nHistory will be unkind to Germany",
">\n\nHe's aiding Putin ..",
">\n\nGerman Military Support Services Provided:\n4 mine clearance tanks\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 95 border guard vehicles (previously: 85)\n 168 field heaters (previously: 148)\n 20 rocket launchers 70mm on pick-up trucks with rockets\n 15 Armored Recovery Vehicles 2\n 13 M1070 Oshkosh heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 143 pickup\n 216 power generators\n 35 trucks 8x8 with swap body system\n 26 Recon Drones\n 36 ambulances\n 36,400 blankets\n 12 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 55 anti-drone sensors and jammers\n 30 drone detection sensors\n 6 forklifts\n Missile IRIS-T SLM\n 60,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 18,500 rounds of 155mm artillery ammunition\n 50 Dingo All-Protection Transport Vehicles\n 3 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER\n 10 surface drones\n 14,000 sleeping bags\n Mi-24 spare parts\n MARS II multiple rocket launcher ammunition\n Spare parts heavy machine gun M2\n 30 MG3 for armored recovery vehicles\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 17 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 5 MARS II multiple rocket launchers with ammunition\n 14 Panzerhaubitzen 2000 (joint project with the Netherlands)\n Air Defense System Iris-T SLM\n 200 tents\n 116,000 cold weather jackets\n 80,000 thermal pants\n 240,000 winter hats\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 405,000 rations one-person packs (EPa)\n 30 GEPARD anti-aircraft tanks including around 6,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 67 refrigerators for medical supplies\n Artillery detection radar COBRA\n 4,000 shots of anti-aircraft tank practice ammunition\n 54 M113 armored personnel carriers with armament (systems from Denmark, conversion financed by Germany)\n 53,000 rounds of anti-aircraft ammunition\n 20 laser target illuminators\n 3,000 Panzerfaust 3 cartridges plus 900 grips\n 14,900 anti-tank mines (of which 9,300 from an upgrade initiative)\n 500 STINGER anti-aircraft missiles\n 2,700 STRELA flying fists\n 22 million rounds of handgun ammunition\n 50 bunker fists\n 100 MG3 machine guns with 500 spare barrels and bolts\n 100,000 hand grenades\n 5,300 explosive charges\n 100,000 meters of detonating cord and 100,000 detonators\n 350,000 detonators\n 10 anti-drone cannons\n 100 auto injectors\n 28,000 combat helmets\n 15 pallets of clothing\n 280 motor vehicles (trucks, minibuses, SUVs)\n 6 pallets of material for explosive ordnance disposal\n 125 binoculars\n 1,200 hospital beds\n 18 pallets of medical supplies, 60 surgical lights\n protective clothing, surgical masks\n 600 shooting glasses\n 1 radio frequency system\n 3,000 field telephones with 5,000 reels of field cord and carrying equipment\n 1 field hospital (joint project with Estonia)\n 353 Night Vision Goggles\n 12 electronic anti-drone devices\n 165 binoculars\n Medical supplies (including rucksacks, first-aid kits)\n 38 laser rangefinders\n Fuel diesel and petrol (current delivery)\n 10 tons of AdBlue\n 500 pieces wound dressings for bleeding control\n MiG-29 spare parts\n 30 armored vehicles\n 7,944 RGW 90 Matador anti-tank handguns\n 6 truck vehicle decontamination point HEP 70 including material for decontamination\n 10 vehicles HMMWV (8x ground radar carrier, 2x jammer/drone carrier)\n 7 jammers\n 8 mobile ground radars and thermal imaging devices\n 4 mobile and protected mine clearance devices\n 1 high-frequency device incl. equipment*\nGerman Military support services in preparation/implementation:\n40 MARDER armored personnel carriers with ammunition (from Bundeswehr and industrial stocks)\n Air defense system PATRIOT with missiles\n 100,000 first aid kits\n 114 reconnaissance drones\n 17 field heaters\n 26 swap body systems 15t\n 2 pickup\n 18 wheeled howitzers RCH 155\n 90 drone detection sensors\n 2 hangar tents\n 7 trucks 8x6 with swappable loading system\n 7 anti-aircraft tanks GEPARD\n 7 remote-controlled tracked vehicles for support tasks\n 6 mobile and protected demining devices\n Missile for Iris-T SLM\n 38 mine clearance tanks\n 3 mobile, remote-controlled and protected demining devices\n 5 mobile reconnaissance systems (on vehicles)\n 405 border guard vehicles\n 1,100 rounds of artillery ammunition 155 mm\n 156,000 rounds of ammunition 40mm grenade launcher\n 5 Badger Tank Engineers\n 3 heavy and medium bridge systems\n 16 Zuzana 2 self-propelled howitzers (joint project with Denmark and Norway)\n 78 heavy-duty articulated trucks\n 3 air defense systems IRIS-T SLM\n 12 frequency scanners/frequency jammers\n Field hospital (role 2)\n 20 bandwidth upgrades for electronic anti-drone devices\n 14 tractor units and 14 semi-trailers\n 2 tractors and 4 trailers\n 10 protected vehicles\n vehicle decontamination point\n 5,032 anti-tank handguns\n 200 trucks commercial vehicles\n 13 armored bridge-laying vehicles BIBER",
">\n\nYou’re missing the billions of $ given to Putin for his gas/oil",
">\n\nI keep realizing the German governments seem to be really pro-Russia overall.",
">\n\nWhile i find Scholtz his restraint annoying and i get the frustration calling the German government Pro-Russian is fucking ridiculous.\nGermany is supplying PzH2000, RCH155, Gepard, IRIST, Marder (took a fucking while tho) and countless other systems and vehicles. Moreover it has sent and contracted vehicles to other nations as replacements for soviet compatible vehicles which were sent to Ukraine.",
">\n\nGermany is a complete joke.",
">\n\nFuck Scholz and all the other Russiaphiles, cowards, appeasers, and corrupt leaders in the EU.\nIt boggles the mind how the US is more invested in defending Europe from Russia than many Western European countries. \nFuck these \"good for nothing freeloaders\". Ukraine deserves to be in NATO more than Germany",
">\n\nYeah one thing the US has going for it with Ukraine is that the american political class doesn't have deep russian business ties. A few do, but it's not the norm. But in europe basically every right wing politician is connected to russia somehow, and almost all the business elite are all tangled up with russian trade and money.",
">\n\nWhat exactly is preventing Germany from saying yes?",
">\n\nSame people complaining about this are the people who berated France in 2003 for not supporting the Iraq War.",
">\n\nThis is fucking dumb, put yourself in a war and then take your merry fucking time. \nMy country Canada will beat Germany to it, we're about to send them with zero fucks given because why not!",
">\n\ndon't do it at all. Ukraine needs to make concessions, tanks will not help.",
">\n\nCloset communist. Or closet Putin worshiper. \nConvince me otherwise.",
">\n\nYes worshipping putin by:\nSupplying Ukraine with state of the art air defense systems like IRIS-T and Gepard. State of the art artillery in the form PzH2000 RCH155. Armored recovery vehicles used to capture and repair tanks. 40 Marder Infantry Fighting vehicles. Among countless other systems.\nMoreover, Germany supplies other armies with material and vehicles to compensate for those armies sending ex-soviet stocks of ammo and vehicles directly compatible with Ukranian logistics.\nLike i am as annoyed by the Scholtz's tiptoeing as you are but statements like yours are stupid and help nobody. Germany while late to the party has been one of the biggest supporters of Ukraine over the last half year.",
">\n\nI agree with your point, but you can't call the gepard \"state of the art\". It's highly effective against Iranian drones, very efficient cost to kill and it's logistics support is simple and straight forward but it's old tech. Nothing against what is doing over there, it's been a godsend.",
">\n\nGermany is the joke of EU not the face of it",
">\n\nGod forbid Germany would rush…. Almost 12 month into it, but hey take your time! I read a book recently about Second World War, a town in Germany next to concentration camp where millions came too and nobody ever left, gas chambers burning 24/7 with ash of human burned bodies falling on their heads. When the war ended and liberation army forced Germans to come and see it, they all said they didn’t know…… Sholtz and German people, YOU KNOW NOW!!!",
">\n\nGermany and France should be ashamed of how they have responded to this war.",
">\n\nReminds me of the Ents in Lord of the Rings, hopefully they see the light sooner rather than later.",
">\n\nHis cabinet ministers just need to take him aside and say \"fuckface, approve the tanks or watch us all resign\".",
">\n\nI‘m sure this tremendous pressure he is forced to endure nearly equates to all the pain and suffering in Ukraine. Poor, poor politician, truely.",
">\n\nDoes he not understand that the longer he continues to delay innocent people are dying every day? Russia has a prisoner army that is taking heavy losses and it’s the winter. Ukraine could use these tanks (and others) in a spring offensive and hope that this forces Russias hand to the negotiating table.",
">\n\nHesitance costs lives.",
">\n\nEvery minute you take is an innocent person dead.",
">\n\nWhat a shame..",
">\n\nThe question is : is Schulz still in this world or is he a Poetin puppet ?",
">\n\nHmm. Who wants to wager what the market for German arms will look like in the future? \nI am aware that the US has restrictions on some of the equipment it provides but I wonder if this whole “you can’t offload the equipment you purchased lock, stock and barrel unless we say so… even if we otherwise agree on everything about the conflict” is the same with the US. \nFor example, could Poland theoretically transfer its new K2 and M1 tanks to Ukraine? Or would they need to wait for whomever inhabits the Oval Office to give the ok? I have no idea…\nAlso, why would Germany care? They are polish tanks that Poland wants to provide. Not Germany.",
">\n\nHe’s waiting for Russia to finish the job! They (Germany) are responsible for what Russia is today! They enabled Putin over the years and Ukraine is the result… well done Mr Scholz",
">\n\nScholz doesn’t give a fuck about Ukraine, and he ties to Russia anyways",
">\n\nShut up Kraut and just do it. You're only prolonging it.",
">\n\nUkraine shouldn’t be given a gosh damn thing… you can’t defend yourself, welp I guess it just sucks to suck then doesn’t it",
">\n\nAwesome time to invade your home, take your shit and do horrible things to you.\nYou deserve it because cowards are scared of us and you dont deserve anyone helping you.\nYour logic is bullshit.",
">\n\nGermany is so thoroughly capitalist that they have to do a cost-benefit analysis for helping to save Ukraine, and the calculations are so complicated that it will take a while for them to come up with a final estimate.\nSomeone will press the subtract key instead of the add."
] |
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